Jehovah's Witness "Christ's Presence" Exposed 

We all just live the same lives don't we lol 🤣🤣 I be doin the same lol

Just as teaching Jesus is God, immortality of the soul, once saved always saved, Christmas, Easter are not in the scriptures also the watchtower 1914 teaching is unscriptural. Daniel 4:22 Proverbs 30:6

@@bretherenlee1404 And you, as the new religious leader, will soon reveal the true Gospel and the true Jesus to humanity? Do you see yourself as the real faithful slave God recently chose?

@@MR-gx3gc I amas Luke 17:10 says.

@@bretherenlee1404 Why did I know you would be here? Oh yeah, the place you stay under the bridge was empty.

@@richb.48 well that hurt

YOU ARE confused between Jesus' coming and his presence. The time of separation as goats and sheep will be in the future still. Jesus' PRESENCE is different, and noted it like the DAYS of Noah, so it spans a period of time and not just ONE DAY. the PRESENCE of Jesus was not from the first century as it is close to the COMING of Jesus, just like the coming of the flood. Noah built the ark for a number of years and that is close and before the day of the flood

Ya! As Mr.DC3.1914 (or whatever he goes by in the next 10 minutes) says, "YOU ARE confused," Jesus came in 1874 and started ruling in 1878 as the Watchtower confirmed in the 1920's. As the Watchtower said in 1922, “WE HAVE no doubt whatever in regard to the chronology relating to the dates of 1874, 1914, 1918, and 1925.”[1] The Watchtower had "no doubt whatever" that Jesus returned in 1874, so anyone who disagrees with the Watchtower is obviously wrong. [1] Watchtower 1922 May 15 p.147

@@BasicBiblicalTruth WHAT is the CONTEXT which you antiJWs always reject. We are talking of the word PAROUSIA and you CHANGED the topic to different topics such as chronology

I didn't change the topic. Jesus claimed he would ALWAYS be with his people (Mat 28:18)-that's an invisible presence. JW's claim that Jesus' invisible presence began in 1874 and Jesus started ruling in 1878, contrary to what the Bible says.

@@BasicBiblicalTruth Mat 28 is DIFFERENT. Jesus was always with us. Mat 24 talks of A FUTURE PRESENCE , so that's why it uses FUTURE TENSE - WILL BE - Matthew 24:39 and they took no note until the Flood came and swept them all away, so the presence of the Son of man WILL BE. Also it was likened to the DAYS OF NOAH, DAYs - plural, and very close to that, the flood happened. Why , has the END HAPPENED already if Jesus was talking of his PAROUSIA in the first century?

The term parousia was used in ancient times to refer to the visit of a ruler or a king to his subjects. A visit generally begins with arrival and then extends over a definite or indefinite period of time. The starting point of the parousia is therefore the event of arrival. Your organization has recognized this fact itself as can be seen from the statements in the following publication. Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. II, presence, page 677, ============================================ Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 1, pp. 208, 209) states: “PAROUSIA . . . denotes b o t h a n a r r i v a l a n d a c o n s e q u e n t p r e s e nc e with. For instance, in a papyrus letter [written in Greek] a lady speaks of the necessity of her parousia in a place in order to attend to matters relating to her property there. . . . When used of the return of Christ, a t t h e R a p t u r e o f t h e C h u r c h , it signifies, n o t m e r e l y H i s m o m e n t a r y c om i n g for His saints, b u t H i s p r e s e n c e w i t h t h e m f r o m t h a t m o m e n t until His revelation and manifestation to the world.” Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon (revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, p. 1343) shows that pa·rou·siʹa is used at times in s e c u l a r G r e e k literature to refer to the “ v i s i t o f a r o y a l o r o f f i c i a l p e r s o n a g e .” Secular Greek writings are, of course, helpful in determining the sense of this Greek term. However, even more effective is the u s e g i v e n t h e w o r d i n t h e B i b l e i t s e l f . At Philippians 2:12, for example, P a u l s p e a k s of the Philippian Christians as obeying “not during my presence [pa·rou·siʹai] only, but now much more readily during my absence [a·pou·siʹai].” So, too, at 2 Corinthians 10:10, 11, after referring to those who said that “his letters are weighty and forceful, but his presence [pa·rou·siʹa] in person is weak and his speech contemptible,” Paul adds, “Let such a man take this into account, that what we are in our word by letters when absent [a·ponʹtes], such we shall also be in action when present [pa·ronʹtes].” (Compare also Php 1:24-27.) Thus, the c o n t r a s t i s b e t w e e n p r e s e n c e a n d a b s e n c e , not between an arrival (or coming) and departure. In view of this, J. B. Rotherham’s Emphasised Bible states in its appendix (p. 271): “In this edition the word parousia is uniformly rendered ‘presence’ (‘coming,’ as a representative of this word, being set aside). . . . T h e s e n s e o f ‘ p r e s e n c e ’ i s s o p l a i n l y [ s h o w n ] b y t h e c o n t r a s t w i t h ‘ a b s e n c e ’ . . . that the question naturally arises,​-Why not always so render it?” =========================================================================== Consequently, this publication also confirms that Paul chose the term parousia to express the personal and visible presence of a person. The term "parousia" is therefore to be understood in strict demarcation from the personal absence of a person. In addition, the term "rapture of the church" is also used in this publication, although Jehovah's Witnesses avoid this term in their literature and in personal conversations, especially since they generally strive to negate the event of the "rapture." Questions to the Bible scholar ========================= 1.) Is the act of the rapture of the members of the body of Christ foretold in the New Testament and if so, when this event will take place? 2.) Has the event of arrival already taken place or is it still pending?

How can you presume to declare Jesus’ personal predictions irrelevant? Jesus Christ predicted that his parousia or return would manifest itself in a scenario that would be visually noticeable to all people on earth. This personal message of Jesus is formulated in a way that is generally understandable and therefore requires no further interpretation. How can you claim to recognize Jesus Christ as your Lord and Master if you deny him the ability to put his biblical predictions into action? Matthew 24,29-30 (N W T Study Edition) 29 Then t h e s i g n o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l a p p e a r i n h e a v e n , and a l l t h e t r i b e s o f t h e e a r t h w i l l b e a t t h e m s e l v e s in grief, ================================= a n d t h e y w i l l s e e t h e S o n o f m a n c o m i n g o n t h e c l o u d s o f h e a v e n ================================================== w i t h p o w e r a n d g r e a t g l o r y .* Later in his famous end-times speech, Jesus compared his return to the day when Noah entered the ark and the flood devastated the earth. An event that affected every person on earth equally, not just Noah and his family members. Significantly, Jesus used the terms “parousia” and “coming” interchangeably in his speech. Furthermore, Jesus emphasized that this event would occur unforeseen throughout human history. This statement implies that the mathematical calculation of this date is impossible and illegitimate even for the true followers of Christ. Matthew 24,38-42 ( N W T Study Edition) 38 For as they were in those d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , e a t i n g a n d d r i n k i n g , m e n m a r r y i n g a n d w o m e n b e i n g g i v e n i n m a r r i a g e, u n t i l t h e d a y t h a t N o a h e n t e r e d i n t o t h e a r k, ======================================================= 39 and they took no note u n t i l t h e F l o o d ca m e and swept them all away, ======================== s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) ============================================================================= Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Jesus predicted that the day of his return would coincide with the event described at Matthew 24:41-42, in which a group of the people living on earth would be “taken along” . Therefore, you must be able to provide solid evidence as to how this specific prediction of Jesus was fulfilled in the year, 1914. Matthew 24,39-41 (N W T Study Edition s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) =============================================================================

Matthew 24: 38 For as they were in those days before the Flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until 👉🏻the day👈🏻 (singular) that Noah entered into the ark, 39 and they took no note until the Flood came and swept them all away, 👉🏻so 👈🏻the presence of the Son of man will be.

@@Elroi3310 those days before the Flood,, DAYS, plural. And of course, there is THE DAY - singular, when Noah ENTERED Into the ark, that is ENTERING the ark. the point is there is the DAYS before the FLOOD, which corresponds to the PRESENCE and there is the DAY when they entered into the ark, and that corresponds to the DAY when Jesus comes to JUDGE during Armageddon

@@Mr.DC3.1914 to your untanable comment: t h o s e d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , , D A Y S , p l ur a l. And of course, there is THE DAY - singular, when Noah ENTERED Into the ark, that is ENTERING the ark. the point is there is the DAYS before the FLOOD, which corresponds to the PRESENCE and there is the DAY when they entered into the ark, and that corresponds to the DAY when Jesus comes to JUDGE during Armageddon ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In the time before the flood, people married, ate, drank, married, built and planted. Are these conditions only characteristic of the period after 1914 and not also of the time before? Later in his famous end-times speech, Jesus compared h i s r e t u r n t o t h e d a y when Noah entered the ark and the flood devastated the earth. An event that affected every person on earth equally, not just Noah and his family members. Significantly, Jesus used the terms “parousia” and “coming” interchangeably in his speech. Furthermore, Jesus emphasized that this event would occur unforeseen throughout human history. This statement implies that the mathematical calculation of this date is impossible and illegitimate even for the true followers of Christ. Matthew 24,38-42 ( N W T Study Edition) 38 For as they were in those d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , ====================================== e a t i n g a n d d r i n k i n g , m e n m a r r y i n g a n d w o m e n b e i n g g i v e n i n m a r r i a g e, ======================================================================================== u n t i l t h e d a y t h a t N o a h e n t e r e d i n t o t h e a r k, ======================================================= 39 and they took no note u n t i l t h e F l o o d ca m e and swept them all away, ======================== s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) ============================================================================= Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Jesus predicted that the day of his return would coincide with the event described at Matthew 24:41-42, in which a group of the people living on earth would be “taken along” . Therefore, you must be able to provide solid evidence as to how this specific prediction of Jesus was fulfilled in the year, 1914. Matthew 24,39-41 (N W T Study Edition s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. ======================== 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. ================== 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) =============================================================================

@@Mr.DC3.1914 so Jesus comes back at Armageddon and he did came back in 1914 , how many times did Jesus said he would come back ? Their is only 1 parousia , that’s the event after the great tribulation Matthew 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 👉🏻30 Then the sign of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief, and they will see the Son of man coming👈🏻 on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

What do you mean by presence?

@@LightoverDarkMinistry : The term PRESENCE means someone has come and is present. The famous singer has come to town even though I am not able to see him. How do I know? By the signs. The sound of cheers, clapping and such. Jesus gave a composite sign to indicate his PRESENCE. What need is there for signs, if a person can be actually SEEN?

@@tongakhan230 You just mirrored what Christ warned about. “He’s here, but you just can’t see him” so the Bible says I shouldn’t believe that claim, so why should I believe you?

@@tongakhan230 The term parousia was used in ancient times to refer to the visit of a ruler or a king to his subjects. A visit generally begins with arrival and then extends over a definite or indefinite period of time. The starting point of the parousia is therefore the event of arrival. Your organization has recognized this fact itself as can be seen from the statements in the following publication. Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. II, presence, page 677, ============================================ Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 1, pp. 208, 209) states: “PAROUSIA . . . denotes b o t h a n a r r i v a l a n d a c o n s e q u e n t p r e s e nc e with. For instance, in a papyrus letter [written in Greek] a lady speaks of the necessity of her parousia in a place in order to attend to matters relating to her property there. . . . When used of the return of Christ, a t t h e R a p t u r e o f t h e C h u r c h , it signifies, n o t m e r e l y H i s m o m e n t a r y c om i n g for His saints, b u t H i s p r e s e n c e w i t h t h e m f r o m t h a t m o m e n t until His revelation and manifestation to the world.” Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon (revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, p. 1343) shows that pa·rou·siʹa is used at times in s e c u l a r G r e e k literature to refer to the “ v i s i t o f a r o y a l o r o f f i c i a l p e r s o n a g e .” Secular Greek writings are, of course, helpful in determining the sense of this Greek term. However, even more effective is the u s e g i v e n t h e w o r d i n t h e B i b l e i t s e l f . At Philippians 2:12, for example, P a u l s p e a k s of the Philippian Christians as obeying “not during my presence [pa·rou·siʹai] only, but now much more readily during my absence [a·pou·siʹai].” So, too, at 2 Corinthians 10:10, 11, after referring to those who said that “his letters are weighty and forceful, but his presence [pa·rou·siʹa] in person is weak and his speech contemptible,” Paul adds, “Let such a man take this into account, that what we are in our word by letters when absent [a·ponʹtes], such we shall also be in action when present [pa·ronʹtes].” (Compare also Php 1:24-27.) Thus, the c o n t r a s t i s b e t w e e n p r e s e n c e a n d a b s e n c e , not between an arrival (or coming) and departure. In view of this, J. B. Rotherham’s Emphasised Bible states in its appendix (p. 271): “In this edition the word parousia is uniformly rendered ‘presence’ (‘coming,’ as a representative of this word, being set aside). . . . T h e s e n s e o f ‘ p r e s e n c e ’ i s s o p l a i n l y [ s h o w n ] b y t h e c o n t r a s t w i t h ‘ a b s e n c e ’ . . . that the question naturally arises,​-Why not always so render it?” =========================================================================== Consequently, this publication also confirms that Paul chose the term parousia to express the personal and visible presence of a person. The term "parousia" is therefore to be understood in strict demarcation from the personal absence of a person. In addition, the term "rapture of the church" is also used in this publication, although Jehovah's Witnesses avoid this term in their literature and in personal conversations, especially since they generally strive to negate the event of the "rapture." Questions to the Bible scholar ========================= 1.) Is the act of the rapture of the members of the body of Christ foretold in the New Testament and if so, when this event will take place? 2.) Has the event of arrival already taken place or is it still pending?

@@LightoverDarkMinistry : Christ warned about people who would claim that Jesus would come literally. That is why he said, not to believe them. Please read what he said which I quoted. What happens IF Jesus does come literally? How would anyone know? Because Jesus said do not believe such a person who claims such. Presence means: a person or thing that exists or is present in a place but is NOT SEEN. plural noun: presences "the monks became aware of a strange presence"

New Song?! Oh I can't wait.

It sounds *awful. FTFY

@@OhioPimo-fc1mw Yes..."It's Christmas Jim, but not as we know it"...🤣

Aren't the people who pierced Jesus all dead? How will they see him?

@@jimjuri6490 Exactly. And what about the blind? Most of them have eyes. Even if they don't work. 😂

@@mattgardiner614 So you're saying the Bible is wrong, then, Matt? You realize you're not refuting a person -- you're taking exception to scripture. Kind of a dangerous hobby.

@@evanwindom And another thing. Jesus said quite plainly: "..the world will see me no more.." (John 14:19) and no one has. Not even Paul during his 'road to Damascus' moment.

@@mattgardiner614 So you're saying that the Bible contradicts itself? Or maybe John disagrees with Jesus? You're right, and they're both wrong?

@LorieFossa_CZT Yes! But don't just watch the videos. Pull out the Bible and read these Scriptures in their contexts. You don't want to know it because 'DH said it and he bases his stuff on the Bible.' You want to know it because YOU studied God's word and found it to be true! God bless you, and I'm so glad you were able to escape the so-called "truth" and find the actual Truth (God's Word/Son.)

@@S.Her. Absolutely @S.Her. 💞 I always have my Bible in hand and looking and researching! I am astounded how different it is reading a Bible that is not the NWT. I was just amazed though, sometimes I miss the obvious because being drilled as a child on these scriptures, my mind doesn't always catch the very subtle important differences. It's like have spiritual dyslexia. I am so dedicated to my daily research and scripture study. And DH has helped, he is one of several that have had a great impact on my realizing how important The Holy Spirit is to pray for and help discern what is true. Believe me, I will not just believe anything anyone says ever again. I am so so grateful and have finally found so much joy and peace just knowing that I have been Born Again and I pray never to be deceived again. Thank you for your words. It is important to look up everything. You should see my notes. I have been writing and writing to retain the correct scripture reading in my head. Thank you. 💞🙏

@@LorieFossa WHO IS OVER ALL? Ephesians 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. GOD and FATHER is OVER/ABOVE ALL and that "All" includes the SON so they are NOT EQUAL THE BIBLE teaches that Jesus was MADE As Lord and Christ and as Son (ACTS 2:36, Prov 8, HEB 1:5), CREATED/PRODUCED/INSTALLED (Prov 8) , COME INTO BEING/MADE (Mat 21:42 - egeneto) and GIVEN LIFE by the Father - John 5:26 and it uses TODAY (Heb 1:5), and uses future tenses and is a prophecy in Isa 9:6 (Isa 9:6, - WILL BE) . If you are called MADE AND CREATED AND GIVEN LIFE, and NEVER CALLED in the BIBLE as Creator or Maker , then you are A CREATION. ALL FROM THE BIBLE From the Lord was this (this is referring to the chief cornerstone who is Jesus) , the word WAS is egeneto (made or came into being) - Matthew 21:42 and the exact Greek word used in John 1:3 - MADE, egeneto (came into being) - JESUS WAS MADE/CAME INTO BEING FROM THE FATHER , yes, Jesus was MADE/CREATED!, See also Acts 2:36, Heb 1:5, 1 john 5 Isa 9:6 the word Prince in the Prince of Peace means PATRON ANGEL also Leader. WHO IS the ONE LEADER that we have? Jesus. Now, that same exact Hebrew word was used for Daniel 12:1 which is used for Michael the Archangel. So are you saying there are MANY LEADERS now?

PAROUSIA means PRESENCE and it is like the DAYS OF NOAH. notice DAYS -plural. Don't confuse between PRESENCE of the Lord, and his COMING-erkhomai to JUDGE which is still in the FUTURE

@@Mr.DC3.1914 to your more than disturbing commentary: PAROUSIA means PRESENCE and it is like the DAYS OF NOAH. notice DAYS -plural. Don't confuse between PRESENCE of the Lord, and his COMING-erkhomai to JUDGE which is still in the FUTURE ------------------------------ Your explanations are incompatible with the prediction of Jesus in his discourse on the Last Days. First, Jesus warned against false prophets because he foresaw that preachers would appear in his name who would spread the message that his parousia had already run its course. Second, in his discourse, Jesus foretold the characteristics you mentioned (wars, earthquakes, pestilences, food shortages, famines, economic crises) in relation to the time before the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple. Third, Jesus primarily and explicitly associated the "end" in which the events he described were to culminate with Judea, i.e., Jerusalem and its inhabitants at that time. Inference ========== If the events you describe were decisive for the beginning of the parousia, than the parousia must have begun as early as the 1st century. Matthew 24,4-15 ( N W T Study Edition) 4 In answer Jesus said to them: “ L o o k o u t t h a t n o b o d y mi s l e a d s y o u , ========================================================== 5 for m a n y w i l l c o m e o n t h e b a s i s o f m y n a m e , saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. ========================================================= 6 You are going to hear o f w a r s a n d r e p o r t s o f w a rs . See that y o u a r e n o t a l a r m e d , for these things must take place, b u t t h e e n d i s n o t y e t. ============================================ 7 “For n a t i o n w i l l r i s e a g a i n s t n a t i o n and k i n g d o m a g a i n s t k i n g d o m , and there will be f o o d s h o r t a g e s and e a r t h q u a k e s in o n e p l a c e a f t e r a n o t h e r 8 All these things are a beginning of pangs of distress. 9 “Then people w i l l h an d y o u o v e r t o t r i b u l a t i o n and will k i l l y o u, and y o u wi l l b e h a t e d b y a l l t h e n a t i o n s o n a c c o u n t o f m y n a m e . 10 Then, too, many will be stumbled and will betray one another and will hate one another. 11 M a n y f a l s e p r o p h e t s w i l l a r i s e a n d m i s l e a d m a n y ; ====================================================================== 12 and because of the increasing of lawlessness, the love of the greater number will grow cold. 13 But the one who has endured to the end will be saved. 14 And t h i s g o o d n e w s o f t h e K i n g d o m w i l l b e p r e a c h e d in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations, a n d t h e n t h e e n d w i l l c o m e . ==================================== 15 “Therefore, w h e n y o u c a t c h si g h t o f t h e d i s g u s t i n g t h i n g that causes desolation, as spoken about b y D a n i e l t h e p r o p h e t , standing in a h o l y p l a c e (let the reader use discernment), 16 then let t h o s e i n J u · d e ʹ a b e g i n f l e e i n g t o t h e m o u n t a i n s . ==================================================================

See the prophecy at 2 Timothy 4:3,4. It is about these videos which tell people what they like to hear.

Actually, It's the other way round. Those who claim to be Christians and not DOING GOD'S WILL, have a bleak future. (Matthew 7:23) And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’ Logically, only one united group can be doing God's Will. Any guess?

@@tongakhan230 How is your notion that only one group can be united logical? How do you support your assertion that being in a group even matters? Have you not read what Jesus said? You keep pushing this idea of groups and organizations, but have never provided evidence to support your claims.

@@evanwindom :(John 13:35) By this all will know that YOU are my disciples-if YOU have love among yourselves.” (Matthew 24:9) “Then people will hand YOU over to tribulation and will kill YOU, and YOU will be hated by all the nations on account of my name. Please explain who this YOU Jesus refers to? Please no 'Everyone except JWs' theory.

@@tongakhan230 to your more than disturbing comment: (John 13:35) By this all will know that YOU are my disciples-if YOU have love among yourselves.” (Matthew 24:9) “Then people will hand YOU over to tribulation and will kill YOU, and YOU will be hated by all the nations on account of my name. Please explain who this YOU Jesus refers to? Please no 'Everyone except JWs' theory. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ It is forgivable to be in a state of ignorance, but it is unforgivable to deny objective, verifiable facts. Jesus Christ left the following assurance to all his true followers shortly before his ascension. Matthew 28,20 ( N W T Study Edition) 20 teaching them to observe a l l t h e t h i n g s I h a v e commanded you. And look! I a m w i t h y o u a l l t h e d a y s u n t i l the conclusion of the system of things.” This assurance does not refer to an organization, but to the individual members of the body of Christ, which together constitute the Bride of Christ. Jesus Christ Himself declared that this EKKLESIA, i.e., the individual members of His body on this earth, will continue uninterruptedly until His return. Matthew 16,17-18 ( N W T Study Edition) 18 In response Jesus said to him: “Happy you are, Simon son of Joʹnah, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father in the heavens did. 18 Also, I say to you: You are Peter, and on this rock I w i l l b u i l d m y c o n g r e g a t i o n (note : Greek: E K K L E S I A and NOT Organization ) , a n d t h e g a t e s o f t h e G r a v e w i l l n o t o v e r p o w e r i t Jehovah's Witnesses claim to have restored the commandments and rules of early Christianity. A Christian is characterized by trusting the prophecies and messages of Jesus Christ rather than the contrary teachings of modern religious leaders (John 10:27-28). With this in mind, you need to be able to answer the following questions: Questions to the Bible scholar ========================= 1.) What earthly organization did the first Christians, such as Peter, Paul, and John and Timothy establish in the first century? Or what organization did the first-century Christians belong to? 2.) Are you really convinced that Jesus kept the promise he made to us two thousand years ago? 3.) By what works of charity has the Watchtower Society distinguished itself as the only true guardian of pure doctrine in recent decades?

@@tongakhan230 Tonga, did you just quote a verse that Jesus spoke about being hated by all hte nations for "WHO"S NAME"? Jesus said we would be hated by all nations for Jesus' name, not Jehovah's. It is the name of Jesus that nations, rulers and authorities have a problem with. People in ALL walks of life will be asked to NOT speak the name of Jesus, just like those people did in the Book of Acts. Whose name was it they were being asked to STOP speaking? Oh, Jesus. Try reading 2 Corinthians 5. All of it. Not just verse 20. And you are one of Jesus' Witnesses? Oh, sorry, you are a Jehovah's Witness. We, Ture Christians, are Ambassadors for Christ.

I sort of get what you're saying but I disagree. In Revelation 21-22 it is clear that it will be God and the Lamb. 1 Timothy 6:16 King James Version 16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. (Who only hath immortality = Lord Jesus) (He is dwelling is the light. No man can approach that light. No man has seen that light nor can see it). = God the Father. The apostles and others did see the Lord Jesus Christ after his resurrection. That part in 1 Timothy 6:16 is not speaking of the Lord Jesus. John 6:46 King James Version 46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

When 1 Timothy 6:16 was written, only Jesus had been given immortality by God. By now those chosen ones who have died and been resurrected to be with Jesus ALSO would have got this SAME immortality. Philippians 3:20....., the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who will transform our humble body TO BE LIKE HIS GLORIOUS BODY by his great power that enables him to subject all things to himself. If Jesus is God, wouldn't all these chosen one also end up as God?

Wow, they say that? Do they also say that the resurrection has happened?

@@tina-xu7nf lol it funny when you read that parable it's clear the slave was chosen before the departure

It's upon his return that he see if the slave obey or disobeyed it's funny 🤣

See video @14.12. "Seeing is visual. End of story". Really? What did Job say at Job 42.5? Literal seeing God with his physical eyes? No. Hence the video makes a false claim.

PAROUSIA means PRESENCE and it is like the DAYS OF NOAH. notice DAYS -plural. Don't confuse between PRESENCE of the Lord, and his COMING-erkhomai to JUDGE which is still in the FUTURE

@@Mr.DC3.1914 Jesus was PRESENT once he ascended to heaven and sat on the throne. Not some future time he would invisibly "come" and restore truth. That is no where in scripture.

@@Mr.DC3.1914to your commentary: PAROUSIA means PRESENCE and it is like the DAYS OF NOAH. notice DAYS -plural. Don't confuse between PRESENCE of the Lord, and his COMING-erkhomai to JUDGE which is still in the FUTURE --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As is well known, the topic of "parousia of Christ" is discussed and dealt with in this video-contribution. I hope that you will not negate this fact. In this respect, it would be very gratifying if we could devote ourselves to the actual task together. I urge you to immediately put aside the publications of the Watchtower Society and henceforth deal with the incontrovertible statements in the Bible itself. If you take one final look at your organization's Book of Insights, you will notice that the Watchtower Society, in its article on the Parousia Christi, quotes scholars who directly link the event of Christ's Parousia to the act of the rapture of Christ's bride. The Watchtower Society is therefore well aware that the doctrine of the Rapture is not fictitious, but is based on the teachings that the apostles publicly preached in the name of Jesus and immortalized in their writings. Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. II, presence, page 677, ============================================ Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 1, pp. 208, 209) states: “PAROUSIA . . . denotes b o t h a n a r r i v a l a n d a c o n s e q u e n t p r e s e nc e with. For instance, in a papyrus letter [written in Greek] a lady speaks of the necessity of her parousia in a place in order to attend to matters relating to her property there. . . . When used of the return of Christ, a t t h e R a p t u r e o f t h e C h u r c h , it signifies, n o t m e r e l y H i s m o m e n t a r y c om i n g for His saints, b u t H i s p r e s e n c e w i t h t h e m f r o m t h a t m o m e n t until His revelation and manifestation to the world.” Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon (revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, p. 1343) shows that pa·rou·siʹa is used at times in s e c u l a r G r e e k literature to refer to the “ v i s i t o f a r o y a l o r o f f i c i a l p e r s o n a g e .” Secular Greek writings are, of course, helpful in determining the sense of this Greek term. However, even more effective is the u s e g i v e n t h e w o r d i n t h e B i b l e i t s e l f . At Philippians 2:12, for example, P a u l s p e a k s of the Philippian Christians as obeying “not during my presence [pa·rou·siʹai] only, but now much more readily during my absence [a·pou·siʹai].” So, too, at 2 Corinthians 10:10, 11, after referring to those who said that “his letters are weighty and forceful, but his presence [pa·rou·siʹa] in person is weak and his speech contemptible,” Paul adds, “Let such a man take this into account, that what we are in our word by letters when absent [a·ponʹtes], such we shall also be in action when present [pa·ronʹtes].” (Compare also Php 1:24-27.) Thus, the c o n t r a s t i s b e t w e e n p r e s e n c e a n d a b s e n c e , not between an arrival (or coming) and departure. In view of this, J. B. Rotherham’s Emphasised Bible states in its appendix (p. 271): “In this edition the word parousia is uniformly rendered ‘presence’ (‘coming,’ as a representative of this word, being set aside). . . . T h e s e n s e o f ‘ p r e s e n c e ’ i s s o p l a i n l y [ s h o w n ] b y t h e c o n t r a s t w i t h ‘ a b s e n c e ’ . . . that the question naturally arises,​-Why not always so render it?” =========================================================================== With this in mind, I would like to refer you to the following message of the Apostle Paul in his first letter to the Thessalonians. 1 Thessalonians 4,15-18 ( N W T Study Edition) 15 For this is what w e t e l l y o u b y J e h o v a h ’s w o r d , that we the living who survive t o t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e L o r d ======================================================= will in no way precede those who have fallen asleep in death; 16 because t h e L o r d h i m s e l f w i l l d e s c e n d f r o m h e a v e n ================================================== with a commanding call, with an archangel’ voice and with God’s trumpet, and t h o s e w h o a r e d e a d i n u n i o n w i t h C h r i s t wi l l r i s e f i r s t 17 Afterward w e t h e l i v i n g w h o a r e s u r v i v i n g ===================================== w i l l , t o g e t h e r w i t h t h e m , b e c a u g h t a w a y i n c l o u d s =============================================================== t o m e e t t h e L o r d i n t h e a i r ; ================================== a n d t h u s w e w i l l a l w a y s b e w i t h t h e L o r d. =================================================== 18 So keep c o m f o r t i n g o n e a n o t h e r w i t h t h e s e w o r d s. Questions to the Bible scholar ========================= 1.) Did the apostle Paul declare in his above letter that in Parosua Christi, the majority of Christ's followers will not participate in the act of the rapture? 2.) When will the act of rapture to heaven take place? Will the Rapture take place at a specific time or over an extended period of more than 100 years? 3.) Will the rest of the people on this earth who do not belong to this group perceive this procedure of rapture of the members of the body of Christ or not? And now to the all-important question 4.) Why did the apostle Paul, in his second letter to the Thessalonians, exhort his brethren not to follow anyone who claims that the parousia, or "the day of the Lord," has already begun? (2. Thessalonians 2,1-3).

@@MR-gx3gc The Apostles asked - “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”., Notice WILL BE, that is FUTURE TENSE., and that is not just in the first century. Why, you think the CONCLUSION of these system of things already started in Jesus' time?

When Jesus went back to heaven, God asked him to wait to be appointed King. Psalms 110:1. Luke 19:12 So he said: “A man of noble birth traveled to a distant land to secure kingly power for himself and to return. A distant land means a long time later.

Well said. Your faith will help you overcome and shed the indoctrination 🙏

WHO IS OVER ALL? Ephesians 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. GOD and FATHER is OVER/ABOVE ALL and that "All" includes the SON so they are NOT EQUAL THE BIBLE teaches that Jesus was MADE As Lord and Christ and as Son (ACTS 2:36, Prov 8, HEB 1:5), CREATED/PRODUCED/INSTALLED (Prov 8) , COME INTO BEING/MADE (Mat 21:42 - egeneto) and GIVEN LIFE by the Father - John 5:26 and it uses TODAY (Heb 1:5), and uses future tenses and is a prophecy in Isa 9:6 (Isa 9:6, - WILL BE) . If you are called MADE AND CREATED AND GIVEN LIFE, and NEVER CALLED in the BIBLE as Creator or Maker , then you are A CREATION. ALL FROM THE BIBLE From the Lord was this (this is referring to the chief cornerstone who is Jesus) , the word WAS is egeneto (made or came into being) - Matthew 21:42 and the exact Greek word used in John 1:3 - MADE, egeneto (came into being) - JESUS WAS MADE/CAME INTO BEING FROM THE FATHER , yes, Jesus was MADE/CREATED!, See also Acts 2:36, Heb 1:5, 1 john 5 Isa 9:6 the word Prince in the Prince of Peace means PATRON ANGEL also Leader. WHO IS the ONE LEADER that we have? Jesus. Now, that same exact Hebrew word was used for Daniel 12:1 which is used for Michael the Archangel. So are you saying there are MANY LEADERS now?

@@Mr.DC3.1914 I do not know what your implying. I did not say there are many leaders. The Governing Body has replaced Christ and have claimed they are a channel to God and required for salvation. So, I guess if your a JW, yes you have many leaders and follow men.

@@Cfalconeri the gb NEVER teach that they ARE LEADERS. so pls stop twisting

@@Cfalconeri the ANGELS were used by GOD as Heb 2:2 mentions , so do the ANGELS replaced GOD themselves?

(1 Thessalonians 4:17) Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them, be caught away in clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we will always be with the Lord. This is where the few chosen who are still alive on earth are transformed into spirit beings to be with Jesus. Jesus has only a second coming. The above happens before the world is cleaned: (Psalm 37:9-11) For evil men will be done away with, But those hoping in Jehovah will possess the earth. 10 Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more; You will look at where they were, And they will not be there. 11 But the meek will possess the earth, And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.

The signs he provides them precede his arrival. "...these things must take place, but the end is not yet." When he arrives, there will be no question.

Yep.

@@OhioPimo-fc1mw Ding! Exactly.

A day begins with some event. Jesus' coming in Kingdom power begins that day. Many things happen DURING that day. Revelations 1:10 By inspiration I came to be in the Lord’s day, Jesus' presence will span a long time.

@@jimjuri6490 to your comment: A day begins with some event. Jesus' coming in Kingdom power begins that day. Many things happen DURING that day. Revelations 1:10 By inspiration I came to be in the Lord’s day, ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Your explanations are untenable, because John did not choose the term "Day of the Lord ("Kyrios")" at this point, but his adjectival derivation "the Lord's day". In addition, there is the following elementary fact, which you have studiously concealed in your commentary. Jesus instructed John to write down the visions for the 7 churches, which, as is well known, already existed at that time. Revelation 1,10-11 ( N W T Study Edition) 10 By inspiration I came to be in t h e L o r d ’ s d a y (note: greek: κυριακῇ (kyriakē)), and I heard behind me a strong voice like that of a trumpet, 11 saying: “What you see, w r i t e i n a s c r o l l and s e n d i t t o t h e s e v e n c o n g r e g a t i o n s : in Ephʹe·sus, in Smyrʹna, in Perʹga·mum, ============================================= in Thyatira, in Sarʹdis, in Philadelphia, and in Laodicea.” Revelation 1,19 +20 ( N W T Study Edition) 19 So write down t h e t h i n g s y o u s a w , (note: chapter 1) ============================ a n d t h e t h i n g s t h a t a r e , ( note: chapters 2 and 3) ================================ a nd t h e t h i n g s t h a t w i l l t a k e p l a c e a f t e r t h e s e . 20 As for the sacred secret of the s e v e n s t a r s t h a t y o u s a w in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands: The seven stars mean the angels of t h e s e v e n c o n g r e g a t i o n s , and the seven lampstands mean the s e v e n c o n g r e g a t i o n s . This specific designation was used among Christians at the time as a synonym for the "day of the resurrection of Jesus". So this term, means no more or less than that John received these visions on a Sunday at the end of the first century. (see Bible Hub). Biblehub ========== 2960 kyriakós (an adjective, derived from 2962 /kýrios, "lord") - properly, pertaining (belonging) to the Lord (kyrios). 2960 (kyriakós) is used of the Lord's Supper (i.e. "communion," the Lord's table) and "the Lord's day" (Sunday) as the appointed day for rest and worship. See 1 Cor 11:20; Rev 1:10. ================================================ If John had had the same event in mind as you did when he used the term "Lord's Day," this logic implies , that this event must have begun as early as the end of the first century and not only in 1914. Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Have you realized that your reference to John 1:10 refutes your own theory?

@@MR-gx3gc YOU ARE confused between Jesus' coming and his presence. The time of separation as goats and sheep will be in the future still. Jesus' PRESENCE is different, and noted it like the DAYS of Noah, so it spans a period of time and not just ONE DAY. the PRESENCE of Jesus was not from the first century as it is close to the COMING of Jesus, just like the coming of the flood. Noah built the ark for a number of years and that is close and before the day of the flood

Paul clearly stated that the apostasy was raising its head then and there even with the Apostles alive. 2 Thess 2:7 True, the mystery of this lawlessness IS ALREADY AT WORK, but only until the one who is right now acting as a restraint is out of the way. Those acting as a restraint were the apostles). Once they died, Satan took over. That is how we got the trinity and other unbiblical teachings. Jesus' presence will expose these falsehoods. Verse 8.....whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his PRESENCE. Every eye will see Jesus cannot be literal, can it. JWs make Jesus' PRESENCE known worldwide. See the prophecy at Matthew 24:14 being fulfilled by JWs.

@@tongakhan230 So you're a j-dub?

@@tongakhan230 "Every eye will see Jesus cannot be literal, can it?" Why Not? "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in 'the whole world' as a testimony to 'all' nations" Matthew 24:14 This can't be literal either, can it?

@@rustyshadow7 : JWs going house to house proclaiming Jesus' return in fulfillment of Matthew 24:14 is literal. According to Jesus, most in the world will take no notice. Matthew 24:39. Rev 1:7 Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him. Yes, Those who pierced Jesus are dead. Thus seeing must be an understanding and not a literal seeing. Which will be impossible.

​@@tongakhan230 So every person gets the gospel means every person gets the gospel, but every person will see Christ coming does not mean every person will see Christ coming? This is typical cult mentality. Matthew 24:37-39 Clearly, Jesus is saying that the wicked will not be aware (or even care) about the coming judgement "just as in the days of Noah" but they most definitely saw when the day of judgement came. Likewise, when the day of the Lord Jesus Christ comes, Paul says this concerning the wicked "3 While they are saying, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction will come upon them like labor pains upon a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. 1 Thessalonians 5:3 But concerning the righteous Paul says; 4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness, so that the day would overtake you like a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:4 So the wicked will not be aware when the Day of the Lord Jesus is near but the righteous WILL, and when He comes EVERY EYE WILL SEE HIM, in fact, they will say "to the mountains and the rocks, 'Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”' Revelation 6:16-17 Jesus said to those who pierced Him “I AM; and YOU shall SEE the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of power, and COMING with the clouds of heaven.” Mark 14:62 Jesus also says "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on ME, the one they have pierced..." Zechariah 12:10 So both Old and New Testaments say that when Christ COMES He WILL be VISIBLE for ALL TO SEE. The WT cult says "not so." I'll trust THE BIBLE thank you.

Yes, Christ is the only King, the only "Potentate" in the Kingdom of God. He is King of kings and Lord of lords.

You copy and pasted your entire comment. It came from questions from readers , who we all know is written to attempt to explain away known discrepancies in teachings. So now could you explain how the use of.... are anything but lies by omission? Also please copy and paste for all of us how and why wt assumed the role of the man with the inkhorn. And went out in the world marking people as goats if they didn't eat a wt magazine. Tell us how and by who's authority they assumed to be Jesus himself?

Do you ever have an original thought, or do you just like to cut and paste the same crap that is in your WT magazine?

@@richb.48 of course I have my own thoughts. Of course I do my own research. This video has a problem with what the “Watchtower” posted on their sight. He abhors the “…” and thinks the “Watchtower” is being deceitful. I simply should that the “Watchtower” has dealt with the scripture and explained it according to the context. In this later article, they didn’t need to restate something that has been established . if you curious, do more research and find out why they interpret a scripture different from how you interpret.

@@jwjim I know why they interpret differently than I do; because they ARE being deceitful. There is no way around it. The WT in notorious for using (...) and "...", without references for the source of who or what they are quoting. NO page numbers or anything. If you were a truth seeker, you'd know better, but you are not interested in the Truth, just the organization of men.

Nope.

@@mattgardiner614 Can you read?

@@mattgardiner614 ....Matthew 24:27 King James Version 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. What do you hear after you see lightning?

@@mattgardiner614 .....Thessalonians 4:16-17 King James Version 16 For the Lord (Jesus) himself shall descend from heaven with a SHOUT, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

@@mattgardiner614 to your more than disturbing comment: nope How can you presume to declare Jesus’ personal predictions irrelevant? Jesus Christ predicted that his parousia or return would manifest itself in a scenario that would be visually noticeable to all people on earth. This personal message of Jesus is formulated in a way that is generally understandable and therefore requires no further interpretation. How can you claim to recognize Jesus Christ as your Lord and Master if you deny him the ability to put his biblical predictions into action? Matthew 24,29-30 (N W T Study Edition) 29 Then t h e s i g n o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l a p p e a r i n h e a v e n , and a l l t h e t r i b e s o f t h e e a r t h w i l l b e a t t h e m s e l v e s in grief, ================================= a n d t h e y w i l l s e e t h e S o n o f m a n c o m i n g o n t h e c l o u d s o f h e a v e n ================================================== w i t h p o w e r a n d g r e a t g l o r y .* Later in his famous end-times speech, Jesus compared his return to the day when Noah entered the ark and the flood devastated the earth. An event that affected every person on earth equally, not just Noah and his family members. Significantly, Jesus used the terms “parousia” and “coming” interchangeably in his speech. Furthermore, Jesus emphasized that this event would occur unforeseen throughout human history. This statement implies that the mathematical calculation of this date is impossible and illegitimate even for the true followers of Christ. Matthew 24,38-42 ( N W T Study Edition) 38 For as they were in those d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , e a t i n g a n d d r i n k i n g , m e n m a r r y i n g a n d w o m e n b e i n g g i v e n i n m a r r i a g e, u n t i l t h e d a y t h a t N o a h e n t e r e d i n t o t h e a r k, ======================================================= 39 and they took no note u n t i l t h e F l o o d ca m e and swept them all away, ======================== s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) ============================================================================= Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Jesus predicted that the day of his return would coincide with the event described at Matthew 24:41-42, in which a group of the people living on earth would be “taken along” . Therefore, you must be able to provide solid evidence as to how this specific prediction of Jesus was fulfilled in the year, 1914. Matthew 24,39-41 (N W T Study Edition s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) =============================================================================

​​​@@davidagnew8792Paul also says(1 Tim.6.16), about this "Potentate", as the one who is "the one alone having immortality". If this means God(the Father) then Jesus is not immortal? But he is. -Hebrews 7.15, 16. Or, if this immortal Potentate(Ruler), *in contrast to all human ones*, who are all mortal, then it must be the Lord Jesus Christ who is this "Potentate"? Compare 1 Tim. 6.15 with Revelation 17.14; 19.16.

​​​​​@@davidagnew8792Another thing I saw omitted from the video at around 4.56 where Hebrew 10.12, 13 is quoted, rather too quickly I felt, where it also says, but the speaker does not say out loud himself: "But this man offered one sacrifice for sins for all time and sat down at the right hand of God, *from then on waiting until* his enemies should be placed as a stool for his feet." Here we read of a period of time were Jesus would "wait" at God's right hand until his enemies were made a footstool for him. This is from Psalm 110.1 where we can read: "The utterance of Jehovah[YHWH] to my Lord is: “Sit at my right hand *Until* I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.” Seems to me this "Lord" has to *wait* at God's right hand *until* what we read in vv.2ff is to begin.v

My goodness, JWs are the most biblically illiterate people on the planet. In Job 42:5, hearing and seeing is an idiomatic expression distinguishing between a distant and personal experience. The queen of Sheba heard of Solomon's words and wisdom but when she came and heard him for herself, she "saw" his words and wisdom for herself. Do we have the same type of idiom in relation to Jesus' return? No. It's called reading the Bible in context, something JWs don't know how to do.

And I encourage all here to read what *Vine's Complete Expository Dictionary, Old and NT Words* says under it's entry "Coming (noun)" which agrees with the meaning the NWT gives for PAROUSIA. In part it says "[PAROUSIA] denotes *both* an "arrival" *and* a consequent "presence with." Check it out. Also in an appendix to the NWT1984 Reference edition we can read: Liddell and Scott’s A Greek-English Lexicon (LS), p. 1343, gives as the first definition of pa·rou·siʹa the English word presence. Likewise TDNT, Vol. V, p. 859, states under the subheading “The General Meaning”: “παρουσία [pa·rou·siʹa] denotes esp[ecially] active presence.”The word pa·rou·siʹa, “presence,” is different from the Greek word eʹleu·sis, “coming,” which occurs once in the Greek text, in Ac 7:52, as e·leuʹse·os (Lat., ad·venʹtu). The words pa·rou·siʹa and eʹleu·sis are not used interchangeably. TDNT, Vol. V, p. 865, noted that “the terms [paʹrei·mi and pa·rou·siʹa] are never used for the coming of Christ in the flesh, and παρουσία never has the sense of return. The idea of more than one parousia is first found only in the later Church [not before Justine, second century C.E.] . . . A basic prerequisite for understanding the world of thought of primitive Christianity is that we should fully free ourselves from this notion [of more than one parousia].” Concerning the meaning of this word, Israel P. Warren, D.D., wrote in his work The Parousia, Portland, Maine (1879), pp. 12-15: “We often speak of the ‘second advent,’ the ‘second coming,’ etc., but the Scriptures never speak of a ‘second Parousia.’ Whatever was to be its nature, it was something peculiar, having never occurred before, and being never to occur again. It was to be a presence differing from and superior to all other manifestations of himself to men, so that its designation should properly stand by itself, without any qualifying epithet other than the article,-THE PRESENCE.“From this view of the word it is evident, I think, that neither the English word ‘coming’ nor the Latin ‘advent’ is the best representative of the original. They do not conform to its etymology; they do not correspond to the idea of the verb from which it is derived; nor could they appropriately be substituted for the more exact word, ‘presence,’ in the cases where the translators used the latter. Nor is the radical [root] idea of them the same. ‘Coming’ and ‘advent’ give most prominently the conception of an approach to us, motion toward us; ‘parousia’ that of being with us, without reference to how it began. The force of the former ends with the arrival; that of the latter begins with it. Those are words of motion; this of rest. The space of time covered by the action of the former is limited, it may be momentary; that of the latter unlimited . . . .“Had our translators done with this technical word ‘parousia’ as they did with ‘baptisma,’-transferring it unchanged,-or if translated using its exact etymological equivalent, presence, and had it been well understood, as it then would have been, that there is no such thing as a ‘second Presence,’ I believe that the entire doctrine would have been different from what it now is. The phrases, ‘second advent,’ and ‘second coming,’ would never have been heard of. The church would have been taught to speak of THE PRESENCE OF THE LORD, as that from which its hopes were to be realized, whether in the near future or at the remotest period,-that under which the world was to be made new, a resurrection both spiritual and corporeal should be attained, and justice and everlasting awards administered.”Also, Bauer, p. 630, states that pa·rou·siʹa “became the official term for a visit of a person of high rank, esp[ecially] of kings and emperors visiting a province.” In Mt 24:3, as well as in other texts such as 1Th 3:13 and 2Th 2:1, the word pa·rou·siʹa refers to the royal presence of Jesus Christ since his enthronement as King in the last days of this system of things. - NWT Ref.edition 1984 appendix 5.b. Please consider its' quoted non-WT sources and what *they* say.

Also check out Vine's Expository Dictionary under "Coming(noun)" which agrees that PAROUSIA denotes both an arrival *and* a consequent "presence with."

It's actually quite remarkable in how many videos DM refuses to give his opinion, or comes right out and says he doesn't know, but he just knows JW's are wrong. I see something of the politician in him. My hunch is that avoids giving his opinions sometimes because he KNOWS that there are those on his side who think differently and wouldn't be able to resist the urge to say so in a comment. He wants to maintain the 'United Christendom' facade. (Another frequent commentator has used the term 'Historical Christianity' a lot lately). Someone who comments a lot on here by the name of 'Brethrenlee' is not a Brother, but agrees with us more often than not. I think some who haven't read his comments carefully probably assume he is a Witness. So he's often attacked. Which, - even if there weren't other examples of non-witnesses disagreeing on here - would of itself be proof that the idea they want to propagate, that Christendom is 'One' is delusional. It never ceases to amaze (or amuse) me that they think everyone buys it.

@@mattgardiner614 to your comment ============== Someone who comments a lot on here by the name of 'Brethrenlee' is not a Brother, but agrees with us more often than not. I think some who haven't read his comments carefully probably assume he is a Witness. ------------------------ You should be aware that BrethrenLee runs his own RU-vid channel, which criticizes Jehovah's Witnesses' teachings about the invisible presence of Christ since 1914 and the practice of shunning former members. I advise you to confront him with the question of whether he himself was once a member of the Watchtower Society. In the interest of trustworthy reporting, you should conduct thorough research on the topic in question.

@@mattgardiner614 to your comment ================= It's actually quite remarkable in how many videos DM refuses to give his opinion, or comes right out and says he doesn't know, but he just knows JW's are wrong. ------------ You told me some time ago that you are the father of three children, whose upbringing, as I recall, you are still responsible for. I ask you to imagine that one of your children, as part of an unbiased continuing education, watched this video dealing with the specific topic of the Parousia or Second Coming of Christ. In addition, we assume that after studying the relevant Bible passages independently, your child will ask you the following questions over dinner. Questions from one of your childrens =============================== 1.) According to the following scripture, why did Jesus specifically warn his true followers against preachers who would spread the message in his name before his actual return that his return had already occurred? 2). Is it conceivable that when Jesus predicted his parousia, he had in mind a continuation of the phase of his invisible presence that began with his ascension two thousand years ago? Matthew 24,23-27 ( N W T Study Edition) 23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look! Here is the Christ, or, ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false Christs and f a l s e p r o p h e t s will arise and w i l l p e r f o r m g r e a t s i g n s and wonders so ============================================================= as t o m i s l e a d , i f p o s s i b l e , e v e n t h e c h o s e n o n e s 25 Look! I have f o r e w a r n e d you. 26 Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; ‘Look! He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 F o r j u s t a s t h e l i g h t n i n g c o m e s ou t o f t h e e a s t a n d s h i n e s o v e r t o t h e w e s t, ============================================================================================ s o t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "P a r o u s i a" ) o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ====================================================================== Luke 17,22-24 (N W T Study Edition) 22 Then he said to the disciples: “ D a y s w i l l c o m e w h e n y ou w i l l d e s i r e t o s e e o n e o f t h e d a y s of the Son of man, b u t y o u w i l l n o t s e e i t. 23 And people w i l l s a y t o y o u , ‘See there!’ or, ‘See here!’ D o n o t g o o u t o r c h a s e a f t e r t h e m . 24 F o r j u s t a s l i g h t n i n g f l a s h e s f r o m o n e p a r t o f h e a v e n t o a n o t h e r p a r t o f ============================================================================================= h e a v e n, s o t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e i n h is d a y =============================================.

​@@mattgardiner614I hope that as a responsible father you will not withhold the answers to the following legitimate questions from your child. Questions from one of your childrens =============================== 1.) According to the following scripture, why did Jesus specifically warn his true followers against preachers who would spread the message in his name before his actual return that his return had already occurred? 2). Is it conceivable that when Jesus predicted his parousia, he had in mind a continuation of the phase of his invisible presence that began with his ascension two thousand years ago? Matthew 24,23-27 ( N W T Study Edition) 23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look! Here is the Christ, or, ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false Christs and f a l s e p r o p h e t s will arise and w i l l p e r f o r m g r e a t s i g n s and wonders so ============================================================= as t o m i s l e a d , i f p o s s i b l e , e v e n t h e c h o s e n o n e s 25 Look! I have f o r e w a r n e d you. 26 Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; ‘Look! He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 F o r j u s t a s t h e l i g h t n i n g c o m e s ou t o f t h e e a s t a n d s h i n e s o v e r t o t h e w e s t, ============================================================================================ s o t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "P a r o u s i a" ) o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ====================================================================== Luke 17,22-24 (N W T Study Edition) 22 Then he said to the disciples: “ D a y s w i l l c o m e w h e n y ou w i l l d e s i r e t o s e e o n e o f t h e d a y s of the Son of man, b u t y o u w i l l n o t s e e i t. 23 And people w i l l s a y t o y o u , ‘See there!’ or, ‘See here!’ D o n o t g o o u t o r c h a s e a f t e r t h e m . 24 F o r j u s t a s l i g h t n i n g f l a s h e s f r o m o n e p a r t o f h e a v e n t o a n o t h e r p a r t o f ============================================================================================= h e a v e n, s o t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e i n h is d a y =============================================.

@@MR-gx3gc Thanks for the comment. I see that my comment is no longer here. I would be very interested to know if DM has given anybody else the authority to moderate this channel, and if anyone else has the ability to delete comments. I comment on a variety of channels about a variety of subjects - Christianity, History, Sport, Cryptozoology, Computer Games, Music, etc., - and it has never happened before. Even on the religious channels. Here, I would guess it's one out of every three of my comments disappears within 24 hours. Some people have said it's RU-vid themselves, but the frequency and the fact I don't have this happen on other channels is very suspicious. Anyway, I am aware that Brethrenlee runs his own channel. Never been there, but I've read other people in this comments section make reference to it. It takes nothing away from my point. Which was that Christendom is NOT united. Never has been since the death of the last Apostle. (2 Thessalonians 2:3, 6,7) But the picture being painted here is that there are (What you perceive to be) Christians and there are JW's. Many of the anti-witnesses on here act as if, if they say something often enough, it somehow makes it true. (Or, if they say it often enough, folks will believe it) Another example is when people on here say that Jehovah's Organization is hemorrhaging numbers. The owner said it again in his little comment about the new convention song. How can I view this as anything but a blatant lie? The figures are made public every single year. You can go to the JW site directly or get there via google and see all the statistics for yourselves. And yet he, and others, keep saying it. And others, apparently, take his word for it without checking for themselves.

True! If Jesus was coming literally, what need would there be to give signs to herald his presence? Matthew 24:33 Likewise also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near at the doors.

The Bible said Jesus not no other man 1 Corinthians 3:11 no other foundation than Jesus Christ

@@DetraMaloney correct . But the Watchtower organization will tell you different.

@@Terrylb285 oh I know lol 🤣 but no other foundation will anyone find but Christ. But they believe otherwise

@@DetraMaloney Those who desire life in the new order must come into a right relationship with the organization. WT 11/15/1981 page 16-17. Come to Jehovahs organization for salvation,page 21

@@Terrylb285 where is the scripture not the watchtower saying

How?

I hope you will one day realize that The Truth is a person and not a organization or a right set of doctrines. Knowing the truth is knowing the person of Jesus Christ , do you know him personally or do you just know stuff about him. I know I never realized that when I was a jw for 10 years . Watchtower never encouraged me a personal relationship with Jesus. Eternal life is knowing God the father AND Jesus Christ john 17.3

@@Elroi3310 TRUTH in the BIble is JESUS And GOD's Word, the BIble, is also called TRUTH in the BIble. Salvation we OWE FROM GOD AND THE LAMB, that's two persons and your religion REJECTED JEHOVAH OUR FATHER AS SALVATION, and rejecting JEHOVAH is the works of an ANTICHRIST

@@Mr.DC3.1914 John 5:39 “You are searching the Scriptures because you think that you will have everlasting life by means of them; and these are the very ones that bear witness about me. 40 And yet you do not want to come to me so that you may have life.

@@Mr.DC3.1914 Jesus is over ALL, Jesus CREATED EVERYTHING. Jesus is God. Jesus is NOT a GoD.

@@Elroi3310 apply that to yourself as you paganized Jesus

I did notice that 😂

A question please. How will the over 16 billion eyes literally SEE Jesus, a single individual? Any idea? Here is Jesus clearly stating that humans will never see him again. John 14:19 In a little while the world will SEE ME NO MORE,

@@tongakhan230 Yes, I have the answer. You cherry picked the ehll out of a single verse, out of context. Revelation 1:7 wipes your presupposition right away. Scritpure interprets scripture. So what Jessu was saying was that the world of that day would see HIm no more, AS HE IS. Revelation 1:7 says even those who pierced Him will see HIm, and ALL the trives of the earth will wail. That doesn't sound so good for the "tribes of the world". Phill 2 tells us that EVERY knee will bow, and then it takes any doubt away when Paul says it is of those in heaven, those on earth, and those UNDER The earth, and EVERY tongue will confess Jesus to be Lord. By the way, this scriptures quotes Isaiah 45:223 and applies it to Jesus, which again, makes Him God. There is much more I can bring up, but I know you are just a troll, so just go, nobddy really cares what you say.I'm sure you'll just come back with some obscure retort or you'll pull another useless, cherry picket scripture out of your JW briefcase. The Lord rebuke you Satan.

@@tongakhan230 Internet. Global news. A cosmic event that is displayed. Don’t limit the unlimited God

@@tongakhan230 I encourage you to take the trouble to familiarize yourselves thoroughly with the Apostle Peter's message about the Parousia of Christ. Jesus explained to his disciples before his execution that after his resurrection he would appear only to them, but no longer to the world at that time. At the same time, Jesus foretold that one day he would unite all his followers with him. (John 14:2-3) In his famous end-time discourse, Jesus foresaw that after his ascension, false prophets would appear again and again, publicly spreading the message in his name that his parousia had already secretly run its course. (Luke 17:22-24, Matthew 24:23-27) Jesus has stigmatized the propagandists of this message as "false prophets. At the same time, Jesus emphasized that his parousia will manifest itself in a scenario that will be perceptible to all people on earth, as well as a tremendous natural spectacle that will not remain hidden from anyone. (Matthew 24:27, Luke 17:22) Significantly, in his second epistle, the Apostle Peter immortalized an identical message about the circumstances and characteristics of Christ's parousia. Questions to the Bible scholar ========================== 1.) According to verse 4 of the letter, when did the end times begin? Was the Apostle Peter's message intended for confreres who were already living on this earth at that time? Or should this message be kept under lock and key until the beginning of the 20th century? 2.) Furthermore, Peter emphasizes that with parousia the process of transience and mortality will cease. The scoffers, on the other hand, argue that even the parousia will not lead to an end to this process. Did the process of mortality stop in 1914? 3.) Peter compares the circumstances of the beginning of the parousia to the flood of Noah's day. Like Jesus in his discourse on the Last Days, Peter emphasizes that the parousia will bring about a fundamental turning point in human history, which will manifest itself in an upheaval of all the elements known to us. Did this turning point in human history, as described by the apostle Peter in his second letter, occur in 1914? 2. Peter 3,1-13 ( N W T Study Edition) 1 Beloved ones, this is now the second letter I am writing you in which, as in my first one, I am stirring up your clear thinking faculties by way of a reminder, 2 that y o u s h o u ld r e m e m b e r the sayings previously spoken* by the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles. 3 First of all know this, t h a t i n t h e l a s t d a y s r i d i c u l e r s w i l l c o m e w i t h t h e i r =========================== r i d i c u l e , p r o c e e d i n g a c c o r d i n g t o t h e i r o w n d e s i r e s 4 and saying: “ W h e r e i s t h i s p r o m i s e d p r e s e n c e (note: " P a r o u s i a ") o f h i s ? ===================================================================== W h y , f r o m t h e d a y o u r f o r e f a t h e r s f e l l a s l e e p i n d e a t h , =================================================================== a l l t h i n g s a r e c o n t i n u i n g e x a c t l y a s ============================================== t h e y w e r e f r o m c r e a t i o n ’ s b e g i n n i n g .” ============================================= 5 For they deliberately ignore this fact, that long ago there were heavens and an earth standing firmly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God;e 6 and that by those means the world of that time suffered destruction when it was flooded with water. 7 But by the same word t h e h e a v e n s a n d t h e e a r t h =================================== t h a t n o w e x i s t ====================== a r e r e s e r v e d f o r f i r e ============================== and are being kept until the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly people. 8 However, do not let this escape your notice, beloved ones, that one day is with Jehovah* as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day. 9 Jehovah* is not slow concerning his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with you because he does not desire anyone to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance. 10 B u t J e h o v a h ’ s * (note : " K y r i o s") d a y w i l l c o m e a s a t h i e f =========================================================================== i n w h i c h t h e h e a v e n s w i l l p a s s a w a y w i t h a r o a r , * =============================================================== b u t t h e e l e m e n t s b e i n g i n t e n s e l y h o t w i l l b e d i s s o l v e d , ====================================================================== a n d e a r t h a n d t h e w o r k s i n i t w i l l b e e x p o s e d . 11 Since all these things are to be dissolved in this way, consider what sort of people you ought to be in holy acts of conduct and deeds of godly devotion, 12 as you await and keep close in mind* t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "Parousia") o f t h e d a y o f J e h o v a h ,* (note ": K y r i o s " ) ============================================================================ t h r o u g h w h i c h t h e h e a v e n s w i l l b e d e s t r o y e d i n f l a m e s ====================================================================== a n d t h e e l e m e n t s w i l l m e l t i n t h e i n t e n s e h e a t ! ================================================================ 13 But there are n e w h e a v e n s a n d a n e w e a r t h that we are awaiting according to his promise,q and in these righteousness is to dwell.r

You know what, I think the coming of Christ comes with weather, because clouds and weather go hand in hand, therefor Jesus comes in a hurricane. Now tell me why I’m wrong.

​@@MR-gx3gcDid Jesus foretell that his parousia would be proclaimed by human preachers? Yes. Would his parousia be perceptible to all people? No. You correctly associate Jesus' command to make disciples after his ascension to heaven and that his disciples would receive the Spirit of the truth. It is this Spirit of the truth which is the mark they receive upon their foreheads from the man dressed in linen (Ezekiel 9:4), who is also the same "angel ascending from the east, who had the seal of the living God" (Rev 7:2,3). Ephesians 1:13 (NET): "when you believed in Christ - you were marked with the seal of the promised Holy Spirit." It is this holy spirit which touches the lips of the disciples and empowers them to proclaim the eternal gospel to every nation (Rev 14:6; Isaiah 6;7,8; Jeremiah 1:9,10; Acts 2:4, 4:31; Rev 14:6; Matthew 24:14). So receiving the mark on their foreheads (Ezek 9:4; Rev 7:3) means proclaiming God's judgments to the nations. Those human preachers who are entrusted with the Spirit of the truth must carry out their obligation to proclaim the parousia to every nation. "Every eye will see him" (Rev 1:7) means people from every nation gathered to Christ. "Everyone whose name shall be found written in the book" (Daniel 12:1). Romans 15:21: "Those who were not told about him will see, and those who have not heard will understand." Psalm 22:27 (NET): "Let all the people of the earth acknowledge the LORD." Romans 11:26: "And so all Israel will be saved." "Every eye" means everyone whose name is written in the book (Daniel 12:1), who will see and understand (Rom 15:21), acknowledge the LORD (Psa 22:27), and are all Israel that will be saved (Rom 11:26). You mistakenly believe that when Christ comes (erchomai), you will be raptured. But you must acknowledge that Christ comes in your heart: Luke 12:36: "so that when Christ comes (erchomai), and knocks they can immediately open the door for him." Rev 3:20: "I am standing at the door and knocking. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door I will come into his home..." The anointed proclaim that Christ has come spiritually. Christ's coming is a heart condition of true believers, not a visual manifestation to everyone. Isaiah 52:8-15 (ESV): "The voice of your watchmen - they lift up their voice; for eye to eye they see the return of the LORD to Zion. Behold, my servant shall be exalted...so shall he sprinkle many nations, for that which has not been told them they shall see...and understand." "Every eye will see" means every last eye of the remnant of the anointed 144,000 watchmen of the Watchtower will understand.

@@davidagnew8792 Your explanations reveal in a frightening way that you are deliberately obscuring the true meaning of the biblical messages or that you have memorized them from your organization's literature as a docile student. However, I would like to appeal to you to take a serious look at the question of what benefits you expect from this method of acquiring knowledge and, above all, of imparting knowledge to your fellow human beings. With this in mind, we will now dedicate ourselves together to the examination of the theses that you put forward in your last commentary. your remark ========== The anointed proclaim that Christ has come spiritually. Christ's coming is a heart condition of true believers, not a visual manifestation to everyone. Isaiah 52:8-15 (ESV): "The voice of your watchmen - they lift up their voice; for eye to eye they see the return of the LORD to Zion. Behold, my servant shall be exalted...so shall he sprinkle many nations, for that which has not been told them they shall see...and understand." The Watchtower Society interprets the number 144,000 literally, although it results from a combination of numbers (12 x 12,000), while the origin of this group is interpreted allegorically despite its literal definition ("from all the tribes of the sons of Israel"). "Every eye will see" means every last eye of the remnant of t h e a n o i n t e d 1 4 4 , 0 0 0 w a t c h m e n o f t h e W a t c h t o w e r will understand. ========================================= If the number 144,000 is to be understood literally, as you claim, then conversely the origin of this group must also be interpreted literally. As far as I know, your organization teaches that the members of the Governing Body belong to this group of 144,000. Revelation 7,4-8 ( N W T Study Edition) 4 And I heard the number of those who were sealed, 1 4 4 , 0 0 0 , s e a l e d o u t o f e v e r y t r i b e o f t h e s o n s o f I s r a e l: ==================================================================== 5 O u t o f the tribe of J u d a h 1 2 , 0 0 0 s e a l e d ; o u t of the tribe of R e u ʹ b e n 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; o u t of the tribe of G a d 1 2 , 0 0 0; 6 o u t of the tribe of A s h ʹ e r 1 2 , 0 0 0; o u t of the tribe of N a p h ʹ t a · l i 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; o u t of the tribe of M a n a s ʹs e h e 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; 7 o u t of the tribe of S i m ʹ e ·o n 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; o u t of the tribe of L e ʹ v i 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; o u t of the tribe of I s ʹ s a · c h a r 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; 8 o u t of the tribe of Z e b ʹ u · l u n 1 2 , 0 0 0 ; o u t of the tribe of J o s e p h 1 2 , 00 0 ; o u t of the tribe of B e n j a m i n 1 2 , 0 0 0 s e a l e d . Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Can the members of the Governing Body legitimize or derive their ethnic origin from these literal 12 tribes of the sons of Israel?

@@davidagnew8792 to your comment ============== Y o u m i s t a k e n l y b e l i e v e that when Christ comes (erchomai), y o u w i l l b e r a p t u r e d . But you must acknowledge that Christ comes in your heart: Luke 12:36: "so that when Christ comes (erchomai), and knocks they can immediately open the door for him." Rev 3:20: "I am standing at the door and knocking. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door I will come into his home..." The anointed proclaim that Christ has come spiritually. Christ's coming is a heart condition of true believers, not a visual manifestation to everyone. ============================== I urge you to immediately put aside the publications of the Watchtower Society and henceforth deal with the incontrovertible statements in the Bible itself. If you take one final look at your organization's Book of Insights, you will notice that the Watchtower Society, in its article on the Parousia Christi, quotes scholars who directly link the event of Christ's Parousia to the act of the rapture of Christ's bride. The Watchtower Society is therefore well aware that the doctrine of the Rapture is not fictitious, but is based on the teachings that the apostles publicly preached in the name of Jesus and immortalized in their writings. Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. II, presence, page 677, ============================================ Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 1, pp. 208, 209) states: “PAROUSIA . . . denotes b o t h a n a r r i v a l a n d a c o n s e q u e n t p r e s e nc e with. For instance, in a papyrus letter [written in Greek] a lady speaks of the necessity of her parousia in a place in order to attend to matters relating to her property there. . . . When used of the return of Christ, a t t h e R a p t u r e o f t h e C h u r c h , it signifies, n o t m e r e l y H i s m o m e n t a r y c om i n g for His saints, b u t H i s p r e s e n c e w i t h t h e m f r o m t h a t m o m e n t until His revelation and manifestation to the world.” Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon (revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, p. 1343) shows that pa·rou·siʹa is used at times in s e c u l a r G r e e k literature to refer to the “ v i s i t o f a r o y a l o r o f f i c i a l p e r s o n a g e .” Secular Greek writings are, of course, helpful in determining the sense of this Greek term. However, even more effective is the u s e g i v e n t h e w o r d i n t h e B i b l e i t s e l f . At Philippians 2:12, for example, P a u l s p e a k s of the Philippian Christians as obeying “not during my presence [pa·rou·siʹai] only, but now much more readily during my absence [a·pou·siʹai].” So, too, at 2 Corinthians 10:10, 11, after referring to those who said that “his letters are weighty and forceful, but his presence [pa·rou·siʹa] in person is weak and his speech contemptible,” Paul adds, “Let such a man take this into account, that what we are in our word by letters when absent [a·ponʹtes], such we shall also be in action when present [pa·ronʹtes].” (Compare also Php 1:24-27.) Thus, the c o n t r a s t i s b e t w e e n p r e s e n c e a n d a b s e n c e , not between an arrival (or coming) and departure. In view of this, J. B. Rotherham’s Emphasised Bible states in its appendix (p. 271): “In this edition the word parousia is uniformly rendered ‘presence’ (‘coming,’ as a representative of this word, being set aside). . . . T h e s e n s e o f ‘ p r e s e n c e ’ i s s o p l a i n l y [ s h o w n ] b y t h e c o n t r a s t w i t h ‘ a b s e n c e ’ . . . that the question naturally arises,​-Why not always so render it?” =========================================================================== With this in mind, I would like to refer you to the following message of the Apostle Paul in his first letter to the Thessalonians. 1 Thessalonians 4,15-18 ( N W T Study Edition) 15 For this is what w e t e l l y o u b y J e h o v a h ’s w o r d , that we the living who survive t o t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e L o r d ======================================================= will in no way precede those who have fallen asleep in death; 16 because t h e L o r d h i m s e l f w i l l d e s c e n d f r o m h e a v e n ================================================== with a commanding call, with an archangel’ voice and with God’s trumpet, and t h o s e w h o a r e d e a d i n u n i o n w i t h C h r i s t wi l l r i s e f i r s t 17 Afterward w e t h e l i v i n g w h o a r e s u r v i v i n g ===================================== w i l l , t o g e t h e r w i t h t h e m , b e c a u g h t a w a y i n c l o u d s =============================================================== t o m e e t t h e L o r d i n t h e a i r ; ================================== a n d t h u s w e w i l l a l w a y s b e w i t h t h e L o r d. =================================================== 18 So keep c o m f o r t i n g o n e a n o t h e r w i t h t h e s e w o r d s. Questions to the Bible scholar ========================= 1.) Did the apostle Paul declare in his above letter that in Parosua Christi, the majority of Christ's followers will not participate in the act of the rapture? 2.) When will the act of rapture to heaven take place? Will the Rapture take place at a specific time or over an extended period of more than 100 years? 3.) Will the rest of the people on this earth who do not belong to this group perceive this procedure of rapture of the members of the body of Christ or not? And now to the all-important question 4.) Why did the apostle Paul, in his second letter to the Thessalonians, exhort his brethren not to follow anyone who claims that the parousia, or "the day of the Lord," has already begun? (2. Thessalonians 2,1-3).

@@davidagnew8792 For your sake, I would like to simplify my question as follows. Paul explains in his letter that Jesus at his parousia will descend from heaven to unite the survivors, that is, the Christians who will still be living on earth at that time, with him through the act of rapture. In your favorite version of the Bible, the phrase "be caught away in clouds" was chosen for this procedure. 1 Thessalonians 4,15-18 ( N W T Study Edition) 15 For this is what w e t e l l y o u b y J e h o v a h ’s w o r d , that we the living who survive t o t h e p r e s e n c e (note: "P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e L o r d ======================================================= will in no way precede those who have fallen asleep in death; 16 because t h e L o r d h i m s e l f w i l l d e s c e n d f r o m h e a v e n ================================================== with a commanding call, with an archangel’ voice and with God’s trumpet, and t h o s e w h o a r e d e a d i n u n i o n w i t h C h r i s t wi l l r i s e f i r s t 17 Afterward w e t h e l i v i n g w h o a r e s u r v i v i n g ===================================== w i l l , t o g e t h e r w i t h t h e m , b e c a u g h t a w a y i n c l o u d s =============================================================== t o m e e t t h e L o r d i n t h e a i r ; ================================== a n d t h u s w e w i l l a l w a y s b e w i t h t h e L o r d. =================================================== 18 So keep c o m f o r t i n g o n e a n o t h e r w i t h t h e s e w o r d s. Questions to the Bible scholar ========================== 1.) When will this event of the Rapture of the Survivors take place? 2.) How do you think this procedure of "be caught away in clouds" pepredicted by Paul will be implemented concretely or practically? 3.) Will this event be perceptible to the other people who do not belong to this group? Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. II, presence, page 677, ============================================ Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 1, pp. 208, 209) states: “PAROUSIA . . . denotes b o t h a n a r r i v a l a n d a c o n s e q u e n t p r e s e nc e with. For instance, in a papyrus letter [written in Greek] a lady speaks of the necessity of her parousia in a place in order to attend to matters relating to her property there. . . . When used of the return of Christ, a t t h e R a p t u r e o f t h e C h u r c h , it signifies, n o t =============================================== m e r e l y H i s m o m e n t a r y c om i n g for His saints, b u t H i s p r e s e n c e w i t h t h e m f r o m t h a t m o m e n t until His revelation and manifestation to the world.” Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon (revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, p. 1343) shows that pa·rou·siʹa is used at times in s e c u l a r G r e e k literature to refer to the “ v i s i t o f a r o y a l o r o f f i c i a l p e r s o n a g e .” Secular Greek writings are, of course, helpful in determining the sense of this Greek term. However, even more effective is the u s e g i v e n t h e w o r d i n t h e B i b l e i t s e l f . At Philippians 2:12, for example, P a u l s p e a k s of the Philippian Christians as obeying “not during my presence [pa·rou·siʹai] only, but now much more readily during my absence [a·pou·siʹai].” So, too, at 2 Corinthians 10:10, 11, after referring to those who said that “his letters are weighty and forceful, but his presence [pa·rou·siʹa] in person is weak and his speech contemptible,” Paul adds, “Let such a man take this into account, that what we are in our word by letters when absent [a·ponʹtes], such we shall also be in action when present [pa·ronʹtes].” (Compare also Php 1:24-27.) Thus, the c o n t r a s t i s b e t w e e n p r e s e n c e a n d a b s e n c e , not between an arrival (or coming) and departure. In view of this, J. B. Rotherham’s Emphasised Bible states in its appendix (p. 271): “In this edition the word parousia is uniformly rendered ‘presence’ (‘coming,’ as a representative of this word, being set aside). . . . T h e s e n s e o f ‘ p r e s e n c e ’ i s s o p l a i n l y [ s h o w n ] b y t h e c o n t r a s t w i t h ‘ a b s e n c e ’ . . . that the question naturally arises,​-Why not always so render it?” ===========================================================================

That's not what it says. It says prince and savior, chief archangel. I suggest looking it up in the Greek.

If course nothing like that can be found in scripture. "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." Heb.13:8 This leaves little time left over to go masquerading around as Michael. Christ promised the Holy Spirit, not Michael.

Exactly, prince and savior,but he is not the punisher, theres no other God apart from Jehovah, He wound, and he heals, he will put to death and will make alive, these what Jesus whispered to his apostles, Matthew, 10:26-28 /Acts 5:28-32,

True, Jesus promised to them that his father will send his Holy spirit, which is Gods active power, not a one person, it was given to his twelve apostles, and to those who also obey Jehovah, the apostles witnessed these matters, Acts, 5:32,

@@renatovasquez6041 Gods active power is His Word. It is by His Word that all things were created, it is by the power of His Word that all things are held together, and it is through the power of His word that accomplishes His will. When the Father wants something done, accomplished, activated, He sends His Word. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father and the Son, sent to the followers of Christ with signs, wonders and miracles. The Holy Spirit indwells all followers of Christ, and it is by His Spirit we cry "Abba." All in Christ are anointed of and by Him, and all in Christ have the Holy Spirit.

Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven - Acts 1:11

@@dirkfirkle73 : How was Jesus taken up? Let's read. Acts 1:9 After he had said these things, while they were looking on, he was lifted up and A CLOUD CAUGHT HIM FROM THEIR SIGHT. What happened? Jesus disappeared because of a cloud. How will Jesus come in the 'same manner'? (verse 11). Matthew 24:30 Then THE SIGN of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief, and they will SEE the Son of man COMING ON THE CLOUDS of heaven with power and great glory. If Jesus is on a cloud how can anyone see him? What happens to a plane when it goes above a cloud? Coming on clouds denotes INVISIBILITY. Jesus' return is invisible and can be seen because of the SIGNS. Anyone literally coming can be seen. What sign would be necessary? When someone important arrives in town, but we are at home, we know that he has arrived because of the SIGNS. Sounds of firecrackers, shouting, horns blasting, etc. Jesus will never be literally seen again by humans (1 Timothy 6:16).

I don't think preaching false doctrines counts, Jim.

​@@jimjuri6490the Bible does not say his coming will be invisible it says it will be visible that every eye will see he coming . What you said is what the governing body says not God.

The ones shutting up the kingdom in heaven is the governing body they are the ones who are saying only 144,000 go to heaven

I urge you to take careful note of Jesus' concrete statements. Above all, Jesus also emphasized that his parousia would occur unforeseen, even for his true followers. Consequently, Jesus declared that the mathematical calculability of this event was impossible or inadmissible. So, since its inception, the Watchtower Society has blatantly violated this commandment of Jesus For this reason, none of the many predictions of your organization have come true. Matthew 24,38-42 ( N W T Study Edition) 38 For as they were in those d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , e a t i n g a n d d r i n k i n g , m e n m a r r y i n g a n d w o m e n b e i n g g i v e n i n m a r r i a g e, u n t i l t h e d a y t h a t N o a h e n t e r e d i n t o t h e a r k, ======================================================= 39 and they took no note u n t i l t h e F l o o d ca m e and swept them all away, ======================== s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. =================================================================== 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) =============================================================================

to your confusing comment YOU ARE confused between Jesus' coming and his presence. The time of separation as goats and sheep will be in the future still. Jesus' PRESENCE is different, and noted it like the DAYS of Noah, so it spans a period of time and not just ONE DAY. the PRESENCE of Jesus was not from the first century as it is close to the COMING of Jesus, just like the coming of the flood. Noah built the ark for a number of years and that is close and before the day of the flood ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Unfortunately, you are distorting the facts. It was not I, but Jesus who left the following prophecy to all his true followers. In this respect, your accusation of confusion is not directed against me, but against Jesus Christ himself. Jesus Christ himself, in his famous speech, mentioned the two terms "parousia" and "coming" in the same breath. In this context, Jesus emphasized that at the beginning of his parousia, or on the day of his return, the following prophecy will be fulfilled. This prediction corresponds to that of the apostle Paul in his first letter to the Thessalonians. (1 Thessalonians 4:14-18). Question to the Bible scholar ======================== Jesus predicted that the day of his return would coincide with the event described at Matthew 24:40-41, in which a group of the people living on earth would be “taken along” . Therefore, you must be able to provide solid evidence as to how this specific prediction of Jesus was fulfilled in the year, 1914. Matthew 24,38-42 ( N W T Study Edition) 38 For as they were in those d a y s b e f o r e t h e F l o o d , e a t i n g a n d d r i n k i n g , m e n m a r r y i n g a n d w o m e n b e i n g g i v e n i n m a r r i a g e, u n t i l t h e d a y t h a t N o a h e n t e r e d i n t o t h e a r k, ======================================================= 39 and they took no note u n t i l t h e F l o o d ca m e and swept them all away, ======================== s o t h e p r e s e n c e ("P a r o u s i a ") o f t h e S o n o f m a n w i l l b e . ==================================================================== 40 T h e n t w o m e n will be in the field; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. =================================================================== 41 T w o w o m en will be grinding at the hand mill; o n e w i l l b e t a k e n a l o n g and the other abandoned. 42 Keep watch, therefore, because y o u d o n o t k n o w o n w h a t d a y y o u r L o r d i s c o m i n g . (" e r c h o m a i " ) =============================================================================

@@MR-gx3gc the SEPARATION of the sheep and GOAT is during Jesus' COMING TO JUDGE, and that is still IN THE FUTURE. again you are MIXING THINGS UP, and you are so confused you have to LIE

@@Mr.DC3.1914 to your comment the SEPARATION of the sheep and GOAT is during Jesus' COMING TO JUDGE, and that is still IN THE FUTURE. again you are MIXING THINGS UP, and you are so confused you have to LIE ------------------------------------------------------- You are content to express your personal views, while I take the trouble to present to you the unequivocal statements of Jesus Christ on the basis of your own version of the Bible. What statement of Jesus confirms the theory you have presented? I would ask you to share with me the relevant scriptures.

Is God the Father Lord?

You are much confused. The God found in scripture is a Godhead. The name of the Godhead is YHWH. Father. Son. Holy Spirit. These are YHWH, the Godhead. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father and the Son.

@@mattmurdock2868 The Holy Spirit comes from the Father. I don't know what you mean by "these are YHWH." Yahweh refers to the Father, who is the one true God in whom all things come forth from (1 Corinthians 8:6). The Holy Spirit is a spiritual being that is sent by the Father in Jesus' name. Even the Holy Spirit himself must search the deep things of God (1 Corinthians 2:10); therefore it is _impossible_ for the Holy Spirit itself to be God, just like it is _impossible_ for the Son to be God as well. There is only one God, the Father; and one Lord Jesus Christ. I am not at all confused; I know the truth of his word.

@@Shawn-q3x YHWH is the name of the Godhead. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father and the Son. Yes, sent by the Father. The God found in scripture is a Godhead. Father is YHWH. Son is YHWH. Spirit is YHWH.

@@mattmurdock2868 Speak clearly. Are you saying all three are God? If so, then you are in danger of hellfire.