I wanted to react to this and dive deeper into what Jon is saying here. This is reflected throughout the industry and there are FEW artists/producers/etc that are in the industry and actually happy and thriving. Its sad that such a talented artist disappears for 6 years because of this. This happens more than we think. This means all of those artists that "Fell Off" might actually not be falling off! They are just stuck in bad deals and can't release more music without losing money or something similar.
This is the reality of the industry. Now all of us need to learn what we can in every area like you said Kyle and start skill stacking as much as possible! I push every one of my artists to stay independent, don’t sign deals.
That's the thing, even when writing the thing of saying people saying your name, but what happens and what's it do to you when you're still a no name?, there's nothing left to do, then what the hell do you do, just move on and look crazy telling people you have written something.
Hell yeah most people are still working bullshit jobs and can't even get time or help to work on music, and that doesn't help either not knowing enough about the terminology or the technical language or layout of music, I write and I know what sounds good.
Shout out producers with dying fires and 1000's of crazy beats that will never see the light of day because we had to get real jobs and just make beats now as a hobby.
I share beats all the time created by others I made a channel just to share the beats people make or they're taking the time to show people how to construct them so they get credit and are recognized for the work they do. Their job and skillet is underrated.
Personally I just make beats for myself these days, I'll only upload a handful. Working a normal job then coming home to work on music into the wee hours, just to get f*cked? Nah I'm good, it takes away the fun and the reason you started making music in the first place. Honestly it's just in God's name at this point. Who knows, maybe we'll make it at 40 lol. If not, who cares?
@@kidzni disagree, if you are “Legally Smart”. You can figure out a deal that says You’ll have to pay me x amount of money to make music every year for the next 5 years, and if it goes well, you could renew the contract type shit. You just gotta know who you dealing with. You dont recite poetry to someone who is not a poet.
I didn’t think John’s interview could become more valuable and you made this more valuable . Thanks for everything Kyle . Great music and great knowledge
please keep this video up forever.. this is sad and really eye opening and needs to be up to watch to raise awareness of how this stuff actually goes. realizing what the mainstream industry actually is, may change so many mindsets towards it.
It’s crazy to think one of my favorite artists and one so damn influential, whose sound literally blew my mind the first time I heard it and influenced YEARS of my life (and tons of other artists) is getting chewed up like this. He’s big but he should be HUGE, labels should be kissing his feet lol.
That's why I'm gonna solely make it by myself and be not expecting help from anyone. If other people can make it, then I can make it. Wish y'all all the best, all love♥️
I worked in a massive $20m studio for a while, which meant I worked pretty close with all the big labels, and always told every artist who was independent and talking like they want to sign to not ever sign to a label. I unfortunately witnessed a handful of artists who were on a fast rise get their careers wiped away just before they were really famous enough to support the growth without the resources of a label. All for one petty reason or another. You can't quit on the label, but they can drop you like nothing, and whatever that "sign on bonus" was, they're still going to be making you pay back
Well no, few comments on this bro, an “advance” can be “recouped” but it cannot be “repoed” a label can & will make back the money from your advance until you make money BUT they can never take back the physical money they “give” you, that’s why it’s always told “Negotiate for as big as an advance as you can” if you buy a house, a car, they cannot call the bank & get that repossessed, those are now yours, the label can never touch them! Few months ago I spoke with a band, who never really did anything after signing, but they still live in the houses their advance paid for
Secondly, here’s the problem! Statistically there have been more successful signed artists in the last month alone, then successful independent artists in the last 50 years, THAT’S CRAZY!!!! I get saying “Don’t sign to a label” but the thing is, realistically you have a BETTER chance of making it after getting signed, then making it independently (and that’s backed by statistics) it’s a shot in the dark both ways BUT your chances percentage wise are SO MUCH better taking your shot with a label! Your advice should’ve been “Be financially smart with your advance” at least 50% should be put back into your music & or invested into businesses, stakes, stocks, stuff that’ll make your advance back in double so you can then invest even more into your music The problem isn’t necessarily “the labels” the problem is the artists not being financially literate with “what” the labels give them! I know artists that are sleeping in motels in tours, I know artists that are bunking in the tour van, I also know artists that want a 5 star penthouse for the night Who’s getting the best bang for their buck in the long run?
Moral of the story, making it in music is a shot in the dark, percentage wise you have a better chance of making it signed, then you do independent & that’s just how it is! Play your cards how you want, but if there’s an 80% chance I’ll land on black, versus a 0.7% chance I’ll land on red, you better bet I’m betting black!! You feel me? Look, here’s the thing! Nobody is “truly” 100% independent, I’ve actually never heard of an artist who is, wether your signed or not, you still may have publishing deals, marketing deals, album deals, single deals that workaround labels even if your not on an artist contract, & I’ll let you in on a secret 99% of “independent” artists (I say that loosely cause of what I just mentioned) who are successful, are successful because they gained notoriety, finances, & education on the industry WHILE they were signed before their contract ended You have a much better chance being successful independently after you’ve already been signed & your contract is up, then being successful independently without ever working with a label
this is a trap so many artists fall into. these companies and managers take advantage of naivete and artists current situations to lock them into some shit theyll never profit from 99% of the time. glad ur showing more in depth what these deals mean as some people still dont know how they REALLY work
As much as social media has it's cons, it's finally given artists a chance to succeed without labels. I'm grateful that I live in this era and that I'm able to do what I do without the need for record deal and seeing this and Jons interview has already backed up how I feel about this industry.
@bontempo1271 stream royalties, subscriptions, ad breaks, brand deals to name a few. I agree though, the amount of views and streams you have to get to earn anything even slightly worthwhile is still a lot, but if a label is only giving you roughly 7 points, then the amount you need becomes insane.
@@openboundariesofficial so yea, it's not really succeeding, it's scraping what you can in alternative ways, ways that the majority will not succeed with. It's so disgusting whats going on and somehow artists must unite to circumvent the industry machine, which is really just 4 big labels and the non-proftiable streaming platforms
@bontempo1271 yeah I feel artists and creatives have had to scrape by for way too long. And I'd rather not have to sit and promote some random phone game I dont like or play just to earn some money 🤦♂️
Watched the Jon interview earlier today - was pumped to hear your input. This, for me… was probably one of the best videos I’ve watched of yours. Sincere and conversational. You’re growing man… it’s special to see you develop musically and professionally. I really appreciate your contributions to the music production space. 👊🏽 You’re a gift Kyle. God bless you.
Kyle, you oughtta have Lecrae on a podcast. He owns reach records and has been a steady artist for 20 years. I think he has some good insight on these subjects
I remember watching a video of Russ and he was talking about getting a loan from the bank and using that for an album etc is what he tends to do and gave his reasons for it. It was a very interesting point he was making because a “deal” from the label is just fronting you money to pay back, and the banks you can get a better interest loan along with owning your music. His point definitely makes sense if your someone who has at least a little fan base. But it makes me think now doing something like taking a loan from the bank and then tapping into Direct To Consumer can pay that loan off faster than it would going thru the label. Shits very interesting and the industry is a wicked game.
In my opinion you’re better off getting a loan to start a business away from music. Music you are never in control of anything. It’s up to the mass people to decide if f they like it then labels are not the move. Start a legit business then do music for fun and if something happens it does but have a soild foundation
I heard one of the creators of spawn in an interview said that if something didn’t feel right he would ask, “if you were me and you were offered this deal would you take it”? And if they even had a moment of hesitation he would decline immediately.
This is exactly why we created our private community for musicians! To show them the real contracts, have entertainment lawyers teach them, have platinum producers mentor them and to protect each other from the side of the industry that just wants to use and abuse artists.
The more artists become aware of the corruption in the industry, the more they will stay independent. And the more successful independent artists there are, the less assets labels will have. You said in the video that there has to be some sort of solution but I think this IS the solution. Spreading awareness of the corruption. Labels need artists to be successful. But it's been proven that artists don't need labels.
here’s the problem! Statistically there have been more successful signed artists in the last month alone, then successful independent artists in the last 50 years, THAT’S CRAZY!!!! I get saying “Don’t sign to a label” but the thing is, realistically you have a BETTER chance of making it after getting signed, then making it independently (and that’s backed by statistics) it’s a shot in the dark both ways BUT your chances percentage wise are SO MUCH better taking your shot with a label! Your advice should’ve been “Be financially smart with your advance” at least 50% should be put back into your music & or invested into businesses, stakes, stocks, stuff that’ll make your advance back in double so you can then invest even more into your music The problem isn’t necessarily “the labels” the problem is the artists not being financially literate with “what” the labels give them! I know artists that are sleeping in motels in tours, I know artists that are bunking in the tour van, I also know artists that want a 5 star penthouse for the night Who’s getting the best bang for their buck in the long run?
This is one of the reasons i decided to go solo as a music producer work with few artists but mostly work on my craft on spotify beats remixes covers till i got used to work alone than work with artists as an independent music producer
25, married, 3 kids. Been producing electronic music for 15 years, the past 5, I’ve taken it more seriously and started releasing my music through DistroKid. I’ve only made $75 over those 5 years and most of that money has been from me streaming my own music. I do it for the love of the craft. I dream that this thing can be my living, but i have no intentions on being with a label unless if it looks crystal clear and fair in every right, which will never happen unless if the big 4 get their shit together.
I’m so glad you skipped all jankos butted in religious crap, like this is what I was hoping the interview would be and was so excited it was 2 whole hours long but then literally like an hour of it was janko vaguely repsonding then preaching for a few minutes, i was generally skipping past any time he spoke by the time I was halfway through it
I actually wrote a whole research paper in college dealing with the topic of labor exploitation in entertainment and creative industries. You're trapped in an endless loop of, "I'm going to take this bad deal because it's going to further my career." And the culture around these industries is designed that way. They give you the tiniest amount and gaslight you into thinking that "this is what it takes to make it." and "I should be so grateful to have this gig." It's top tier endgame capitalism tbh. It's like this in every industry and line of work except with the music industry it's capitalism on steroids.
Getting in a position where you CAN say no implies you have to sacrifice and progress less as an artist having to make money on the side to pursue music. Sad indeed
Maybe I’m missing something but why sign to a label in 2024 or beyond? They’ll promote your music for you? With social media and streaming platforms I don’t think I would ever want to sign to a label and give up the control over my art.
It’s harder to get exposure by self releases nowadays if you don’t already have a somewhat stable fanbase, especially with a lot of artists around the world it’s pretty hard to stand out
There are a few reasons you would sign to a label, fronted capital is one, notoriety/“official-ness” is another. There’s a kid that him, I, and another kid were the biggest highschool rappers when we were in highschool. This guy got signed by a label when the whole “unique rapper” trend was going on with the labels and he is Asian. He instantly had industry connections at his finger tips, he got to go to top tier professional studios essentially for free, they fronted him like 50k or something like that and suddenly he’s not just “dude making tracks in his basement” now he’s a local legend who is a professional so when he comes to town people are bidding for his performance instead of him doing pay for play or free shows. THESE DAYS (unless you’re lucky like that) you’re better to stay independent and work a deal with a distributor or work up your own distribution. That’s because these days you have to ALREADY be “trendy” enough to have enough inflow to even get their attention that you might as well ride that on your own unless you just hate doing everything and want it all outsourced and you don’t want to find all the people to outsource the different jobs to.
Capital upfront to know you can “survive” off just music is one. Another is that labels have doors that can get opened alot quicker than doing it yourself if even possible by yourself really. I can see some reasons that are beneficial but at the end of the day… Creating that leverage is what will get the best deal from labels and that’s where it seems to be the best. Just my opinion
This has been common knowledge since TLC. If you sign a deal you shouldn’t expect anything other than an opportunity. It’s up to you to figure out how to capitalize and turn it into other areas of revenue.
As a rapper and singer, I have always felt producers are getting screwed. A lot of times they carry the team. Engineers as well. Shoutout to producers and engineers for all the hard work and dedication. Y'all are under appreciated but I hope that can change. It starts with conversations like these. As Jon says, "the starving artist dies hungry." Get your money and don't underestimate your worth!
Absolutely incredible! I started watching Kyle Beats like 5-6 years ago or longer when i was first learning how to produce on FL Studio. And Jon Bellion has been an inspirational artist that I've looked up to for awhile but i never knew that Kyle was inspired by him as well! That's so awesome!!! 😎
THANK YOU For reacting to videos like this. Do it more. Way more. I have a feeling a lot of legitimate artists have "fallen off" like Jon Bellion ~ for good reason. WE ~ THE ~ PEOPLE Need to get behind independent artists, and the community needs to give them tools the thrive. It's happening with comedians right now, why not also music talent?
It's really not that complicated... there are soooo many great artists and producers out there. If somebody is willing to work for those 3 points, they will get the job. Hit songs and big artists come and go all the time.
Corporate interests really took advantage of the industry at a perfect time. It has forever been "but a dream" to create music for a living, and until the internet came around, it was impossible to put laws and/or unions in place that protected the creatives, due to the scarcity/aspirational nature of being an industry musician. Actors were able to make slightly more progress with organizations such as Sag-Aftra, but I would attribute that to there being more working actors than there are working musicians. These companies have since grown so big that they buy/bully their way into advantageous positions, be it "standard splits", algorithm favorability with third-party platforms, or the entirety of their record deal structures that are designed to have total control over the artist. What we need (and this applies to many non-creative industries as well) is reform, and with the ambiguity of music creation in today's age, definitions, terms, and revised industry standards in regards to crediting one another is an absolute must. Additionally, there needs to be legislation in place that sets limitations on the abuse of leverage, specifically in reference to label/artist contracts. Contracts and splits that are commonly deemed "predatory" towards artists and writers are SO bad that we have been duped into thinking that "good" or "standard" contracts are any better. They are not. I am thankful that people like Kyle and JB are speaking up and educating, because the only way you can tell if something is sh*t is by knowing what sh*t looks like beforehand, or by tasting it for yourself.
Him being done and just trusting and receiving the blessings is the ultimate outcome for him. Wish it was like that for everyone, but most people won't be so "lucky". Good for him sharing everything.
I'm making a serious stab at rising up in the music world.... but it's so hard to connect with people making music that are serious about it and treat it as a business. It seems too many of the "music art" spaces are just hobbysts who feel like thinking of money is antithetical to doing art.....
As a producer/artist doing everything for free right now, investing money with no returns, I feel this. This early I just gotta capitalize on my passion and keep going I guess
Jon is insanely talented. Whenever I come across a (the making of) video, regardless of me seeing them so many times, will sit down and watch it all the way through. Dude is beyond musically gifted.
I think it’s crazy how labels try to convince you that they can get you out there and get people to listen to you, just for you to end up paying for the marketing and ending up with the same amount of an audience as you started
You put out a royalty free sample pack, then when a song using one of those samples went platinum you went after the producer for some royalties, you sir are the dark side of the industry too
Love this exposure of the industry forreal so shout outs to Kyle, Jon and everyone else involved bc it's up to us to redefine the business side of all of this
Exact reasons I left DJing and music career in the dust in 2010 and went ghost prodocuing for half a decade without putting on my name even. At least for the music I did and got paid for was mine, and due to sell it completely to the artists - i was able to bump the numbers reasonably. I stopped doing it since i become a father because it was not as stable as i wanted - but at least i was not robbed and scammed.
Could you react to the Ren and Kujobeats beef? First the clip Ren does about what happened and then the Kujo Beat Down song and Sick Boi. I feel like you may havesome good insight for the whole situation.
there may be a way to help change this but would take quite the collaboration? But I do have some expertise if it's something you would be interested in discussing Kyle! Peace bro, keep up the good work!
As an artist and the owner of my own label, I give my artist 100% of their earnings. I give them receipts, and we go over numbers and everything together to help them figure out how to better their streams and increase their profits and popularity.
Maaan it’s crazy this past year everyone been talking about the music industry being dirty but the only person I know who talk about it was Tech n9ne on how dirty this industry is. How he as been shunned from the industry because he is an independent pioneer.
It's crazy how there aren't baseline laws for profit sharing in the US. This is the reason people who actually do the work get screwed in every single industry by mfs who don't work.
I have been doing music for a while now, taught myself how to do everything from mixing and mastering to writing lyrics, to singing and filming videos and editing. I cannot get the views, or the attention, i have studied how to marketing and youtube and everything. Idk what I am doing wrong and why I cannot get even 1k views on a song. Im told my stuff is really good, but its not going anywhere, and its getting really hard to keep going. I just want to be heard and work with others and create but, im not getting my chance, and its really starting to discourage me. Its like im banned from even getting a start and idk what I am doing wrong.
The real issue is that there is heavy money involved. Because of that money you producers give up your leverage because you won't start a union, with actual teeth. You can't fault a label because the people making them their money are too isolationist to unionize and actually have leverage when you go to the table
Havent watched this full video yet but I just thought about Jon Bellion a few weeks ago, wondering what he's up to, if he still makin music etc. Used to watch all his bts videos in the studio, such an inspirational guy with deep passion for his craft. So this will be interesting
I don't know why people don't speak out about music business, while the young producers needs guidance. Everyone keeps on saying make good beats until you get placement or upload on beatstars
If you are in the position to be able to book a big tour, just hire some people to plan it for you. It no different to what the labels do, you just have to find someone good enough to get you the best spots at the most money.
I don't understand the part at 15:30 to 16:00, like the math, it feels like we skipped a bit. Basically you get a 5k advance + 5% of the song's royalties, so why isn't it simply recouping the 5k+ i assume interest, and then you're making profit? like i just don't understand why it suddenly jumped at 15:40 to that number of streams in order to recoup the 5k... a small video to explain how the record deals math usually works and generally things to look out for would be appreciated bigtime!
Sign a deal ➡️ label gives you the resources to become mega famous but you earn pennies ➡️ when you’re out the deal you’re less relevant but all your money is yours but never have the same buzz as when you started Don’t sign the deal ➡️ you’re a starving artist who owns 100% of your music but you now have to work 100x as hard as someone signed because you don’t have a label backing you with resources ➡️ run the risk of never blowing up
Love your reaction! The world needs to hear and see these stories more!!! The life of celebrities aren’t won’t it seems! Ultimately, we must find our security in Christ! I also have getting into writing music and trying to produce! Would you be willing to collaborate?
