On behalf of the community could you ask KS if they can create a how-to tutorial video for the community how to change the tire and/or tube? I'm thinking by doing that they are forced to face and solve the same problems that you are seeing and we might end up with a nice tutorial video as well. 😁
Do high quality screws not exist in all of China? How can they not spend an extra $5 for high quality screws on the entire wheel when the product sells for $3,200? Every single PEV I own has garbage screws and it makes working on these things such a pain (all 10 of my PEVs are from China).
Cable connectors and cable management looks really clean and professional. Sad about the screws, tensile and threadlock. But that's something easy fixed on later models. I was very disappointed to not see a quick motor disconnect ability to change tire,motor, bearings easily. s18 still holds the record in my opinion for easiest motor and tire change of any EUC.
They need to be quality socket cap screws if they are going to locktite them so you can crack them loose, and always hand crack them loose but. Those button head screws are a big no no and will make the motor/rim a 1000 dollar throw away item. Not acceptable for 3200 bucks. The only places those smaller button head screws should be used is where the space dosen't allow for it or where you don't locktite it. It can't have a throw away motor or bearings that can't be replaced. Great video, this is the stuff that needs explored, just as important as the ride.
Great video, the whole wheel is created in CAD, every screw has a depth, torque reqirement, and load, this would also indicate the correct loctite to use, the correct type of screw would also be presented. The four screws around the hollow bore are likely secured with red loctite, this loctite can only be removed with heat, given this possibility the required amount of heat may radiate to the rubber gasket and possibly cause a breach this is something I could see as a oversight but not the screws. Using the frame of the s20 as a heat sink is great engineering and means over heating is highly unlikely. Finally a lack of stainless screws is just odd, KingSong know the wheels will be subject to moisture. A Rolls Royce is only as prestigous its Relays.
@@eucupgrades that sucks. I usually find a large tip setting iron for 700 C does the trick. Is it possible to spray break cleaner and have it ingress into the bolts?
I wouldn't use heat on the bearing area. Countersunk hex head bolts are the worst to remove because of the tapered countersink. Your best 1st attempt is a crisp bit (quality sharp shoulders, snug fit) and just enough impact (either pneumatic or electric) to snap it free. Manual hand rotation is usually going to make the situation worse. If that doesn't yield good result on 1st attempt, I immediately just drill them out. You'll need quality drill bits and extractor bits to make the task smooth. Drilling with quality bits is reasonably quick and will heat the thread lock enough to release the bolt using an extractor bit, if not then you need to bump up the bit size just enough to penetrate the depth of the head until it pops off, the chamfered head is mostly the cause of being jammed and not so much the thread lock. I've been in many battles with these types of bolts made from both high quality military grade and cheap imports, they are always a challenge regardless of the quality. It is always easier drilling out the cheaper import stuff though. Good luck, hope this might help in the future.
@@EUCArmy if they're using something equivalent to loctite red, then you probably shouldn't: (copied from Loctite's website) The process of knowing how to remove red threadlocker is a little different than for other threadlockers. The key is to apply localized heat greater than 250°C (550° F). Then, once the threaded assembly is hot, the bolt can be unthreaded. Without applying heat to the assembly, some bolts threaded into tapped holes risk breaking. I'd recommend building a small inductor coil then using a long bit or old screwdriver shank stuck into the screw. Heat just the screw directly by putting the induction coil around the bit and socketing it into the screw until it is at working temperature (I use cheap thermocouples/reader, cost like 15 USD for a 4 input reader w/ k type TC) then use your regular driver to free it from whatever threadlocking they might be using. It should heat from the head/core of the screw outwards, so the heat bleedover is minimal and once any part of the threadlocker reaches working temperature the rest of it won't hold well and it's likely you won't even need to go all the way to 250°C, just far enough to weaken it sufficiently.
Thank you very much Kevin! This is exactly what we need to see. I’m sure I’ll be replacing all the screws in my S20 when it arrives, with high quality stainless steel. Even if they do upgrade the screws at the factory. I’d guess they still won’t be the best quality. We need a list of the size/quantity of screws that need upgrading.
Thank you, super informative and critical. As a trades guy I can certainly feel your irritation and disappointment. Standard disassembly should be tough but not destructive or impossible - and you showed us the latter here. Full sympathies. This is still fledgling tech, lots to learn. But thinking that you would ride, in this case, a wheel that was NOT going to fall or rattle apart is also a mixed blessing. This video is a fair recording for customer and manufacturer, and I'm glad to see it. Thanks
Thank you for this video! The screws need to be secure enough to not lossen but easy enough to unscrew for inspection and repair! That seems like a huge problem to use cheaper screws, but in the end, it screws the consumer.
Small allen/hex not very strong. Torx can handle way more torque and then you bend your bit before you round the srew with a good hard screw like the 10.9. Second the loctide is too strong and completely soaking them also make it much harder to take out. While a little drop will keep them from vibrating lose. Also a weaker loctide can be used. So you can remove them.
Congratulations Kevin, you try very hard 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻. Hopefully manufacturers will understand one day (maybe) we have to service the wheels sometimes. Hopefully you are well equipped with lots of tools but sometimes it’s not enough 😬.
Hi from Will and Mr Data :):] X mecanic. Heat surround then turn upside down and freeze ice screws. Keep ice off surround. Hit with hammer. Hit allen key in screw with hammer while turning. Be cautious because heat is gonna damage cable and rubber bearing seal. I wish you nice success. Be well.
wow great content, such an expensive investment and yet having screw problem. I suppose the engineer should take lesson on screw selection for the start.
Informative video, the best tool to remove those screws is a set of stud extractors, you will never get them out without ruining the heads any way... too much heat will only damage the bearing seals and bearings... Stud extractors will get item out even if you snap the head of the screws.... 😼
Those screws should be easy to get out. Because of the large diameter of the head itself, you can use a dot punch (a big heavy one) to make a small pocket near the edge of the head... a couple of good strikes to make a decent divot, then angle the dot punch in the direction of un-screwing. If you haven't got a big center punch, you can drill a small hole near the outer edge of the head so you can get the corner of a decent size cold chisel into the hole and tap the chisel to unscrew the bolt. Once started, you can use a super fine angle grinder (4") disk to cut a slot for a large flat screw driver. You could also use a Dremel with a small cutting disk to make the slot. Shame on Kingsong using such weak screws? Maybe they need to charge us more to use decent hardware. I would prefer steel screws than stainless... stainless can be brittle... but decent quality steel please. Great video! (make sure you are using metric alen keys... not imperial by accident (I have been guilty of that on occasion haha))
It seems they did a good job on sealing the bearing with a rubber. They should still throw a marine grease for the extra water protection. The rim seems solid unlike the Sherman's garbage rim. Eventually, we will find out how good it is.
Hi from Will and Mr Data :):] I can see the 3d print comunity is going love this. Options like rather than apply velcro back on pads is print ajustable to those screws. Anyway id better watch more than a minute before posting up the place. I wish you nice success. Be well.
the screws are certainly not top but using red threadlocker is pretty dumbed since we will have to replace the tire some day🤦🏻 they should reprimend the clown that does that in the factory probably the brother of the one that design the short trolley handle🤨 good job Kevin keep them coming.
So was the broken rubber piece making that noise or do you still think it’s coming from inside the motor and why do you think that rubber piece broke? Is there an easier method to get to the tire, I.e., was it necessary to take it completely apart like you did? Thanks for doing these videos they help a lot!
To have that hanger rely solely on screw force to work is a horrible design. The axle and hanger need a mechanical interface to transfer torque, with screws to stop the sole unrestrained axis. Make the axle tube the thickness of the hanger plate wider on each side, cut it into 4 tabs, mill the counterpart tab holes in the hanger plate. Now the screws only need the bare minimum loctite to stop them backing out (but better screws are still good). As for removing the wheel from the main EUC body looks like.... remove motor wires from controller (might be doable without removing controller first) > remove pedal hangers ( ? and the battery lower end caps)> remove a section of the suspension (shock and main pivot bolts, or the motor hanger to suspension link etc, be safe for preload pressures) > slide motor section out the bottom.
My god what a pain in the ass for a simple tire swap or punchure repair.... These companies need to quit focusing on speed and power (their already plenty fast and powerful enough) and put their energy into creating a quick release system to make a tire swap a simple 10min job!
Power and speed got nothing to do with this. It has been 2 years since we reached 50 mph. S20 only does 45 mph max. They just don't focus on the basics and create a standard for it.
@@theanimalplanet7031 I didn't say the two were connected, I'm speaking in general terms that a simple tire change on our wheels are a pain in the ass which ever euc you own, also 45mph is plenty fast enough... We basically in motorcycle speed territory right now which is ridiculous for a one wheel device with zero redundancy!
@@noelleonard2498 I meant to say they should have a standard for the screws. Speed got nothing to do with the basics for having a solid screws for repairs/tire change. Stating the speed was referring to @davewood1982 saying companies are focusing on speed and power.
The S20 is the flagship model of the Kingsong. So the quality of the screws must not low quality like this. At the high torque contact points they should be stainless steel screws.
@@frankc.3232 There are some steel fasteners (grade5, grade8, alloy steel) have higher strength than stainless steel fasteners. But if you are mentioning the "normal" steel fasteners they most are grade 2 which lower strength than stainless steel. From this video, I'm not sure the grade of the screws are but they seems not suitable for the application especially the screws at the center motor hub. I guess the screw socket depth can not be much depth as normal screws are due to the limitation of the flat head screw type but engineers who desing this can reduce risk of screw head sliping (due to high torque apply) by select the torx/torx plus socket type instead of the hex socket type. Anyhow, the S20, Almost other parts are designed very well and impressively.
I am not as mechanic so I may not understand everything to do with pulling this wheel apart. - why was the battery casing taken apart from the top - why were the pedals taken off If this was to show the complete disassembly of the wheel then I understand but if it was to take the tire out, was it necessary. I ask this because the KS assembly video gave some idea of how the wheel was put together and it did not look like how you pulled it apart. Maybe we just have to wait for KS to provide mechanical advice videos to show us possible short cuts to a tire change. I hope they take your advise about the screws. I had this issue with my S18 and I am sure everyone else has had issue with wood screw in plastic😂
@@eucupgrades looks like youve exhausted all avenues. Just going to have to drill the heads as the rim/motor looks like it's a throw away at this point. As you couldn't even get your first bolt out. Wrong bolts and way too much locktite, shame on king song.
That is what i do to make sure the wheel can be easily service and safe to ride. Also to see the good and bad of the design. This wheel are getting faster now and speed comes with more risk so safety riding, testing them are very important to me. This wheels are quite expensive nowadays and you expect them to be better build and better quality.
@@eucupgrades great in doing so. I hope you will admit the actual low range of this wheel as well. The only 30 mile actual range seems to be the elephant in the room with this wheel
I'm waiting for my S20 (end of April) but after this video, i WILL NOT go for it anymore! What a bad choice of screws !!! The engineer in charge of this part should be fired on the spot! Kingsong should be mentioning RIGHT NOW on their site that THEY WILL change all the screws for stainless ones and put 1/4 of the lock-tight shown. If so i will reconsider. So disappointing...
Module design supposed to make it easy to take things out. This should be an easy fix for King Song only if there is enough clearance between the new stronger screw head and the enclosure frame. Hopefully they can fix this as soon as possible. It is a very cheap but important fix.
@@noelleonard2498 the nuts sealant became harder over a few days. Same as water damage which could take days, or weeks, or even months for things to go bad. But I got your points, they should take it apart for testing units, which they should have plenty around, even for the ones that got abused I would assume. So maybe an oversights that might have caused them delay and they close an eye on it. If that is the case, then it is bad for end users. Just a theory.
Using an (impact drill )is the reason you're stripping the heads out on them cheep screws and way to much loctite . You're not taking lug nuts off a car 🤣
Yea, probably a 3/8 drive alan bit tapped with a hammer first would have cracked loose a few more. But those button head screws would be better off with no locktite.
@@alexvetrov97 would have been better to use a regular allen wrench for the first crack. Seems all these guys ever have as those long bits on a drill driver and those junk chromed t-handles. The fact that not one of those screw heads sheared off but instead stripped up tells me its a combo of the wrong tools and too much locktite. Last resort for that situation would be an impact with the correct bit. Not saying that would guarantee full success on all of them but at least he would have had a fighting chance against all thag locktite and those button head screw heads.
@@noelleonard2498 might the battery housings take a bit of er, a battering from impact wrenches and hammers? It certainly looked like there was far too much of the wrong strength thread locking compound applied to poor quality button head screws on the battery casings, the four large central screws didn’t even budge, which seems to suggest that as Kevin stated, the bearing surfaces of the (too small, too soft) hexagonal recesses (I hesitate to call them Allen heads, they don’t look up to the standard) appeared to rather give way and become rounded than yield. Poor assembly choice, design and torque settings of overly glued-in Chineseum quality screws, spoiling the ship to save a ha’penny’s worth of tar.
@@freeforester1717 yeah, I'm going to have to see a lot of improvements before I go through with one of these in May. It would be different if the production models were never meant to be disassembled, but it seems like they want him to dissemble it so they can see what happened and seemed to have no idea that every screw is drenched in Loctite. Designed by Engineers but assembled by idiots obviously, no way I'm paying 3200 bucks to not be able to disassemble my wheel without destroying it
