Load development by group consensus Part 1 Powder Charges 

Well, before all the Hornady podcasts, I would have said that you should go for 53.6 as it has the best ES / SD. Traditionally you get the powder burning as consistently as possible and then tune precision with OAL and barrel tuner. Post the Hornady podcasts, I'd say that 3 rounds is impossible to pick any "best" from.

This test is a fun idea. Personally, I would start at 54.5 based on the given data. I am even more interested in how you are going to return those "borrowed" 190 Bergers to your friend though after shooting them. That would save me a lot of money if I learn that trick! 😀

I’d explore between 54.4 and 54.6. I bet 54.5 would be a great place ;)

Based on OCW, I like 54.6 the best. 54.4, 54.6 and 54.8 all centered in roughly the same area. I thought the velocity was interesting, and while there was a flatter spot at the lower charges, I didn't feel like there was sufficient data to make any strong conclusions. All of the groups where 2 shots were very close, and the 3rd was significantly different lead me to believe that the velocity correlation isn't very strong. Thank you for doing this test. This is how I do load development, 3 shot groups, with OCW and velocity recording simultaneously, and looking at both for patterns to help me pick the right load. I do load a 4th or 5th cartridge for each load, just to provide a little verification at the end if the patterns were looking good, or if I botch it, but I usually don't shoot them as part of the groups. Its great to watch a better marksman trying my own methods out.

I'd say your best load will be one of three - 53.5, 53.6 or 53.7. Most loads produced a "2 together and spit one" group indicating less than optimal combustion (except for 53.6-54.0). In that 53.6-54.0 range, ES/SD indicated 53.5 to 53.7 will probably be best.

54.6, POI same above and below. Nice clover shape, chart flat spot and low ES/SD.

Ok so this isn't patreon... based on the numbers I would look at & around 53.6gr for a load charge. Lowest ES and SD also running around 2850fps... should be close to an OBT velocity node there. This is going to be so much fun thanks for sharing the adventure

I'll play along on the RU-vid side. My pick is 54.6. as many others have pointed out it looks to be the most stable through the POI looking glass of OCW.

What a great idea man good job!!!

Looking at 53.4gr it has a +17fps, The next load increase .2gr has a very small increase in fps but the best ES / SD. Now go to your 54.8 has a +22 fps with a decent ES /SD. If it were me and if safe I would see if an increase to 54.9 would result in similar fps and decrease ES / SD. Sticking with what is shown 53.4 is what I would go with, but I would graph 53.3gr and 53.5gr. to verify.

54.5. I like 53.6 but the data surrounding it is noisy. Maybe it's a nice, maybe luck, maybe it's a really unstable node, but it's at best touchy.

I’m guessing to keep the narc at bay I guess you kept the little things that go into your reloading a rifle round a secret family recipe step right John I hope.

54.7 grains (whats the current temp?) the other holes (lower grains) doesnt look like the bullet has stabilized completely

I would use 54.5 gr. And start adjusting seating depth

Ty that's awsome

Id say shoot more between 53.6 to 53.8. With 5 shots per powder charge.

53.6

53.8gr

53.0 grains

53.5 and play with seating

Primers?

I like the minimum SD of 2.5 fps ... 53.6 grains. I'd load '+ & -' 1 grain around that. Problems with the front rest rules out the groupings that I consider important also.

53.6

This experiment is a great idea 😃 I´d go with the 53.6 load based on ES and SD. Would like to see how this load can be refined.

Assuming that no scope adjustments were made during the test, I would choose 54.6 based off of similar point of impact from the charge above and below it.

Somewhere between 54.4 and 54.6. It flat lines there and the numbers are pretty even. Seating depth from there. 53.4 to 53.6 is not bad either but the numbers change alot more.

Looks like you got a carbon ring! 😂😂 53.6 and get an EC Tuner. hah

54.5 gr.

I wish you could reshoot the test with the gear working right, but if I combine the graph and groups like I do in my development, I would go with 54.5

Target points of impact aside, my vote is to jump in at 53.6. Looks like a possible speed node to me.

I'd reload between 54.3 and 54.7 in .1g increments and evaluate them again.

54.5/6. Do seating depth and then test a 10th or two either side.

if .2 of a grain changes your group size, you need a different powder, or work on your gun

I think 54.4 has similar results on either side, has a little bit of cushion on + or -. Not sure what seat depth you started at but I would be starting .015 off the lands per results I have had with berger.

Well, I know this has already been decided (because I watched the seating depth video first), but I think I would have gone 53.4 I was torn between 53.0, 53.4, and 53.8, but 53.4 seems like a good compromise. I have a hard time not sticking with 53.

54.4. 54.6 looks good in a group but the jump in velocity at 54.8 doesn't leave enough cushion if conditions change and the velocity increases.

53,6 low sd 53,7 or 53,8 is the set

Based on that I would go with 54.4gr. I glad you said you had front rest issues while showing the target because without that info I would have said to try another powder.

54.4 since you have 2 other loads in the same range that is almost producing the same ES and SD. The 53.6 looks to be a anomaly in terms of the data.

Thank you for the information. BUT how I know what size should I use for seating deep = 0.0020" from the land? or that point doesn't matter for the load development, please somebody explain that point. thank you.

Hands down 54.5, you can't deny that plateau.

53.6

53.6

53.6

54.4(54.5)looks the most forgiving. This is awesome btw and I'm excited!

Personally I don't like to chase my tail on ES and SD until I see whats going on with the target. It looks to me that 53 grains and 53.8 are both nodes that can be played with if you going to try working with seating depth. Or some do skip finding a seating depth challenge and just go straight to the tune. I'm not sure what caliber/cartridge you are using and are you running a load at least 99% capacity?

I think you need to watch a couple of the Hornady podcasts John. Start with 054 "Ammunition Demystified" where they speak with Jeff Siewert. Then there's 050, "Your groups are too small", then there is 052, "Your groups are still too small". The cat's out of the bag now. It's a thing already.

Id pick a speed you like lower end of the spectrum and go with it. This test unfortunately give no meaningful data on the loads tested. I’m guessing given enough testing they will all shoot about the same.

I’d do 3 groups at 54.5 grains and I’d make one group at the same seating depth and one group +.003” and one group -.003” from the original seating depth.

Where can I find, or can you recommend, a starting load for N-555 in a 7 PRC?

54.5 is where I would settle at, then some gross seating depth ( .010” increments + and - ) 5 more loads, ensuring the front rest was no longer a variable

Looks like 54.5 for me. Little plateau there with decent SD and EX. Don't care about groups at this stage.

I'd go with 54.6 myself - I place stock in reading the groups and POI shifts, which is a part of the OCW doctrine/methodology. Since we're shooting mid-range, that's certainly acceptable, and we can probably get away with not knowing the velocity up until you've done your load development, zero'ed at 100, and have to dial out to 600. (We'll find out for sure, though!) I think it's great that you did both the groups, and the velocity data - more data is always better! When I look at the graph, though, I see the ES's and SD's as indicative to one-another; it looks like our SD's are generally below 10, and our ES is about ~15-ish. All of these number would be really great for off-the-shelf ammo! I think someone trying to discern a velocity node within this set of data isn't seeing the forest for the trees; from 52.8 to 54.6 (almost two grains of powder) you only increase about 60 FPS. Now, I have to admit I am partly speaking from a place of ignorance because I am not the most familiar with the powder, or that cartridge, but to me it seems like you're *in* the velocity node.

I'd go with 53.8. Group is great and velocity variation didn't affect group. I say this even if I realize that at longer ranges, the velocity has a much bigger effect.

54.5gr is probably what id try. cheers John!

Im voting for 54.5, looks like it will have room for error both ways. Also what was the temp when you shot these? 54.5 could give you better temp stability as well if developed in the avg temp you general compete at

From 54.4 to 54.8 to my mind (consistent point of impact). Since it's a group test dont look at the graph.

Great Idea, see real numbers, groups and data. I pick 53.6, low es and sd respectable speed, could be refined in the process.

I vote 53.6. Great idea for a video series.

53.6

I feel less bad about my work / loading bench being cluttered and a bit of a mess.

53gr. Due to the low differance in speed of 53.2gr and 52.8gr. Also i think the group shape of 53gr can easily be "tuned" with seeting depth.

im loading 53.6 and 54.6 and shooting both for groups and speeds

This is genius idea for a series

I would probably try 54.5 Grains purely on velocity

54.5gr. Flat spot and poi doesnt shift between charges.

54.5 grains is where I would start.

53.6 because of consistency. I rarely chase velocity.

54.45 would be my pick can the trickler make it happen?

With equipment issues I would start all over with no issues with the equipment.

I believe I would try the 54.5 and then play with the bullet sitting to start with

53.6 looks like the winner. ES=5 SD=2.5. I'd like to see 53.5 test.

54.5 - split that node in half - the lower nodes are too slow for the cartridge.

52.8 -53.2 for traveling across country

I would re-shoot as nothing looked promising to me.

53.6 looks like the most stable by graph

Thought that beard was coming off? Lol

54.5 is what I would load.. classic ocw identified node

This is awesome! I think this will help tons of people on finding a load. Appreciate your dedication and help!

John, where can i purchase targets like this ?

I'm not a speed freak... I'd go with

@F-Class John What was the wind like for this data? I know it's just 100 yards, but you mentioned forgetting something about your rest. I really like 53.6 with it's low ES & SD, but would like to play with 54.5 & 54.7 to see where it's data lands. Surely, one can make up for vertical, if all play out as planned. Are you going to finalize the test at 1000 yards? Or keep it at 100 yards?

Gotta go with the lowest es/sd, then tune from there

54.5 grains. ...in the middle of the node.

From a GROUP and SD/ES standpoint, I like a 54.3gr load because on either side of that (54.2 and 54.4) you should have a "average" SD of ~6.5 and ES of ~12, which gives you a good cushion on over/under powder drops. Second, those groups each have touching holes. You might also consider the 53.7 gr load because of the hole placement, BUT, the average would provide a wider variance on either side of it. Just my .02 and GREAT IDEA ON THESE VIDEOS!

Need to know the neck tension and the primer

54.7 is your huckleberry/

On the low end 53.5 and on the high end 54.5.

54.4 to 54.6

Get the front rest issue fixed and repeat.

What software did you use for the graph?

First choice 54.5 second choice 53.5

54.5

53.8 looks like a winner to me.

53 .8 is what I would start with

Hi John. May I ask for the rifle's parameters? Barrel length Twist Case volume Bullet length Caliber (you may have mentioned it) Powder I follow the exact same process. Very lucky to date to achieve good results.

I would stick with the lower node at 2820ish, one thing I do know about the 190's is they do not like speed. They also are not pointed correctly and have a variable bto because of it. But I got sucked into buying a bunch, so still trying to make them work. The faster nodes exaggerate the bullet inconsistencies, ie major flyers. They are a frustrating bullet, they will seem to be grouping ok, then wack, they don't.

Acoordingly to what I (me personally) see on the TARGET and what the data shows me I like 53 and 53.8. Of the two I will stick with 53.8 Yes I like single digit SD's and liked when they reflect that on THE TARGET 😉. Thanks John.

54.5 in that nice flat spot

54.1 For starting you’ll need to come back to a fine powder after seating, tuner, primer and primer seating for your fine powder test +/- .1 grain 10 rnds. The V looks stable at 54.1