Losing Faith as a BYU Professor | Louisa Killian Pt. 2 | Ep. 1699

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Louisa Killian is back to talk about what happened after losing her job at BYU, and what resources helped her heal and grow. What have been her victories and challenges in rebuilding her life? How did her family react to her loss of faith? What role does art and creativity play in healing? How does Louisa navigate her marriage, parenting, self-care, and spirituality?
www.louisakillian.com
Chapters:
00:00:00 Intro & recap
00:03:00 What were the most difficult parts of the transition?
00:07:30 Grief and Loss
00:17:15 Learning to stand up for self in relationships
00:20:50 Victories & challenges in rebuilding
00:25:00 Family reaction to leaving Church
00:28:40 Reshaping identity around work
00:33:15 New approach to decision-making & self-worth
00:38:20 Helpful resources during and after a faith crisis
00:50:30 The value of self-care, reading, concerts, art, creativity
00:54:00 On education and empathy
00:58:00 Religion-related resources
01:02:00 Life now, in the present moment.
01:07:50 Christian identity
01:08:45 Mental health after Mormonism
01:09:30 Parenting after Mormonism
01:10:00 Community
01:12:00 Spirituality and Curiosity
01:13:15 Dealing with death
01:17:00 Before you apply to go to or work for BYU
Episode Show Notes: mormonstories.org/podcast/byu...
Pt 1: Losing Faith as a BYU Professor: Louisa Killian
• BYU Professor Loses He...
Patrick Mason’s Episodes:
• Becoming a Faithful Mo...
_________________________
ABOUT US:
Mormon Stories Podcast is the longest-running and most successful podcast in Mormonism - hosted by Dr. John Dehlin. At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. We also occasionally interview scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals. Our overall mission is to: 1) Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology, 2) Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis, and 3) Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions.
Mormon Stories Podcast is a product of the Open Stories Foundation - a 501c3 non-profit dedicated to supporting Mormons in religious transition.
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Опубликовано:

22 июл 2024

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Комментарии : 76

@briancurry6008 Год назад

I am a former Christian pastor (not Brian- I'm his wife) who has been out of the church for the better part of the past 20 years. Watching Louisa's story has been super helpful to me - seeing the patterns on abuse and trauma without the trappings of the actual memories of my experiences really helped me to identify much of what I've been through and has given me some hope. I appreciate John and Margie's sensitivity in these interviews but tonight it's been Louisa's insights and wisdom that has been especially helpful. Thank you.

@ks4893-m8v Год назад

I'm so glad I listened to Louisa's story before my deconstruction! My husband is employed by the church and I'm not sure I would have had the foresight to be cautious about sharing the things I've learned while he's still working for them...

@TheForestCrone Год назад

Louisa, should you happen to read this, have you thought of offering a healing through dance kind of class or group? Your ability to use movement and breath as almost a yogic way of healing is astounding and inspiring. I've had to heal from my Mormon experience, parental experience and extreme pain due to chronic illness, and have healed/am healing through yoga, breath work and, most importantly, release. As I listen to you, it occurs to me that mimicking the psychological steps of healing through body movements is really a thing. Your journey puts you in this unique position to teach such a thing and I'd sign up. Thank you for baring your soul here, it's definitely inspired me to go back to those basic yoga movements that helped me through so, so much as I healed from physical and psychological deficits. And who knows, they could be one and the same, no? But your focus on YOU being your own north star is so key in leaving a religion. Trusting your own intuition and allowing yourself to just BE are integral in healing and moving forward. My spouse and I also navigated toward Eastern philosophies. A book that really helped us focus was The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle. Good luck in your travels!

@Earthpsalm Год назад

I second this! I would love to support a project like this, and I know it would fill a need I've recently recognized.

@Sarah-sc9ev Год назад

Louisa! Let’s do this together!!!

@miltonperry9135 Год назад

I loved this interview! I am not LDS, yet I so clearly identified with Louisa on several fronts. I spent the majority of my life in very conservative evangelical churches, and spent 35 years in a deeply emotionally abusive marriage. I remember trying to save the marriage by going with my ex wife to counseling. Despite him hearing about all of her abuse, all that "Christian" counselor could do was chastise me for thinking about leaving. Then I spoke with a pastor who did the exact same thing. When I finally walked away, it was the first time in those 35 years that I felt free to live my life on my terms.

@melissadavenport5176 4 месяца назад

I’m really happy that somebody wrote this comment about seeing parallels in other kinds of organized religion. I grew up in the southern Baptist Church, and as I got older, I also started to deconstruct and kind of realize that that wasn’t really what I believed. I didn’t believe that my uncles were going to go to hell because they were gay, or that a loving God would send you to hell simply because you didn’t know which religion to follow above all the noise. Conversion and judgment are also really big things in the southern Baptist Church, and it always made me feel weird that the Bible would say not to judge, but the congregates were very judgmental. Out of sheer politeness, I’ve started going back to church just to kinda make my in-laws feel better, although I don’t believe it, and it’s funny how many things you realize being out of it and going back to church or hearing peoples experiences. I remember that my mom started going through a divorce with my dad because of something very not right that he did and I remember even though we weren’t even a part of the church at the time she would go to pastors and would just be reminded of all of the reasons why getting a divorce from him was wrong. I remember abuse, getting covered up by the church.

@CB-jg6xg Год назад

“Joy reminds us why we want to live… it should be a priority” 💕💕

@jeangreenwood6299 Год назад

I relate so much: Abusive marriage, mormon experience and the walking away from mormonism.

@Heidi_Huntley Год назад

Such a good episode. When Louisa mentioned- dance/movement. Completely agree. Running/exercise has helped in my exit from a super strict church.

@lindiemoon Год назад

What a thoughtful, full- and warm-hearted woman. I love how much of a deep thinker she is and how in touch with her internal self and experience she is. And she’s a fantastic orator too! Thanks for sharing your story.

@mostlyvoid.partiallystars Год назад

Where Louisa says she feels peaceful, it’s very visible on her. You can tell she’s just so whole in herself now. I find that beautiful.

@mostlyvoid.partiallystars Год назад

Also I find it hella impressive how you honor science and education simultaneously with your love for and talent for arts; We should be friends haha. I mean I’m not an artist but I would have a blast dancing freestyle for my morning wake up. And I paint watercolors for fun, not for the end result :) but my education and my career are in engineering so sometimes I wonder if those topics are almost dichotomous? But they aren’t, I’m now just a pigment nerd, and I found it fascinating how you described learning to physically shift your weight 🤓

@susanmoran692 Год назад

Louisa’s story part one and 2 were amazing. Louisa thank you so much for sharing your story!! Thank you Mormon Stories for having her.

@yoodeet6338 Год назад

I like Louisa's heart-warming smile.

@carlafinn8810 Год назад

Louisa is a deep thinker, very present and articulate. I usually flit from one video to another, this had me riveted from beginning to end. I think she might be an author, she has a great mind and a authentic voice.

@weeza8739 Год назад

Thank you! Once upon a time I aspired to be an author, but switched to dance :)

@butterflygirl2285 9 месяцев назад

You are so articulate. That is a very good idea that you become an author. Your story is so important and inspirational.

@RichardMumford1 Год назад

The reconstruction is so important, 10 year journey for me and now accelerated with these stories. I am truly a better person, more 'righteous' and MUCH happier post mormon.

@mimibatman2787 Год назад

I would love to take a dance class with her! It's so obvious that she's a gifted teacher.

@tawnyachristensen7310 Год назад

Such wisdom from such a young woman. Its so hard for those who truly value truth to stay when the Church has been so dishonest .

@dduncan3613 Год назад

I left the church many years ago after I realized all the hypocrisy, abuse, misogyny, etc I was raised with was not for me. I’m 73 now and am so glad I left and did not raise my 4 kids in that mess. I joined the Unity church where everyone is accepted.

@lisamcdonald2877 Год назад

Unity is far more positive and kind than most religions. I couldn't accept that all evil acts are the result of "misunderstanding", not deliberate choice. Sadly, some people enjoy their mean attitude and acts.

@elizabethwoodyard8241 Год назад

I've never had anything to do with BYU, but I have a lot in common with Louisa and it's helped my journey hearing her story. 💜

@altavanderwesthuizen1472 Год назад

Margi you are like a breath of fresh air!! Always touching the heart and sole. The place where detail does not matter... We are all indoctrinated into religion! John this is my NO.1 podcast. Thank you. Love from Cape Town x

@ssrose18 Год назад

Thank you for sharing. As someone who is reevaluating my marriage in the Temple when I was 19yo. I appreciate you sharing and being vulnerable with us.

@cherylduncan5158 Год назад

I wish that I would have had Margi as my best friend when I was going through my faith crisis❤

@emmaociee Год назад

Wow! I have so appreciated this interview with Louisa. Even though my story is different, I'm also a dancer. Hearing her talk about dance was so beautiful. I'm recovering from anorexia and also grieving the recent, sudden death of my dad. At first, my instinct was to give up dance - but instead, it has pushed me into accepting the unknown, the present moment, and also my intuition. It has also forced me to take up space. Thank you, John and Margi for this interview! And thank you Louisa💛

@mattjohansson8931 Год назад

Mate that was awesome. Dance as a spiritual expression is such a powerful part of being a human. I had to sit down and talk about this with the wifey after listening to this. This is one of my favourite Mormon stories episodes. Dance has always been an important part of our relationship, and walking away from Mormonism is still, and will always be there. Thank you 😊

@mlisify Год назад

I can identify with this story in many ways. Trauma from a marriage and trauma from a non-denominational Christian megachurch. Wasted years. Thank God I pulled through and did not end up agnostic. One of the sad parts to this story is that she ends up indifferent toward her faith. I truly believe she has a heart after God though and she will find Him. Similar thoughts in my crisis was why are non-Christian men so much more sincere than the ones who claim to be Christian. I am happily living life post PTSD, thanks to a wonderful Jewish therapist who knew church history and could explain why these Jesus movement churches cropped up in the 60s and 70s. Never thought I would return to the church of my youth, but it is where I feel most at home. Currently reading Catechism in a Year with Father Mike Schmidt. Louisa's story is not over yet. I loved the comment about "releasing the muscles for movement." Kind of like surrendering. Keep seeking and you will find Him.

@lc5666 Год назад

I wonder if you know how insulting your comment is to people who believe in a higher power but are willing to admit they don't know what it is exactly (i.e. agnostics). It's not the tragedy you are projecting it to be.

@tammyjohnson6241 Год назад

Thank you for sharing this. I am a never-mormon. But I have listened to so many of these podcasts and they speak to me as an abuse survivor. These two episodes in particular are helpful. Thank you.

@bengtbergman4539 Год назад

From human doing to human benig. So wonderful to hear. All good luck to Louis Killian ! ( from Swedish lisener) Thanks to you all

@terryhuggins8414 Год назад

Wonderful! Thank you.....these interviews/stories are so good for the soul.

@kathleencurtis4493 Год назад

12 thumbs up kids! Thanks Margie...John ...especially Louisa..When the student is ready..the TEACHER appears!Many Blessings thru the Great Creator!

@SR-bw3sc Год назад

Kudos!❤️Freedom!💖Live authentically. 💕💖🌟💕💖🌟

@Cymraesarall Год назад

I found the discussion about dance being a way to feel and be really interesting and very moving. And I’m no dancer. My body is a little bit broken and I’m very cerebral. But even I might be able to feel through my body. I would love to see Louisa dance/teach.

@petercharron3268 3 месяца назад

“Rules of the game”. What a fascinating quote. Seems the Mormon faith with all its rules, formulas, constraints, practices and constructs creates a mindset in its followers their is the deterministic best approach. But maybe real life is more vague and chaotic and there are not simply rules.

@JennLove Год назад

So excited for this! Excellent interview.

@elsiecreek3040 Год назад

I’m yelling through my phone (lovingly!). Maybe it comes up later or maybe you truly don’t see it- from what you describe, your first husband seems to clearly meet the dsm criteria for npd. Not the buzzword kind, the clinical abusive kind. It’s so difficult (and really not helpful anyway), to get a diagnosis because therapists miss it quite often. It’s so helpful for validation and the lightbulb understanding though! That said, please excuse if I’m off base, but my experience and gut are telling me otherwise! Right down to the (C)ptsd you mentioned as I’m typing this. Sending love and healing. ❤

@rachelhansen2417 4 месяца назад

On afterlife: I actually found that for me, trying to believe in the concept led me to feel so much more anxious because I didn’t have a way of proving whether or not I would see a loved one. If I do see them again, I’ll be pleasantly surprised, but I need the closure that comes from an answer. For me, that answer is that it is a final ending.

@patricianoel7782 Год назад

Just a note: I recommend “ American Fraud, One Lawyer’s Case Against Mormonism “ by Kay Burningham I think John and Margi recommended it a few months ago. Thanks dear woman, for your authentic message today. ❤

@patricianoel7782 Год назад

@@holidayrap thanks 🙏 I’ve read it, studied and taught it for 60 years as a member. For the past 14 months I’ve read facts about the Church. I’ve decided to be basic Christian and simply to follow the teachings of Christ, knowing my life is secure in the atonement.

@butterflygirl2285 9 месяцев назад

I loved the intelligent dialogue between Margi and Louisa. They are two very intelligence women.

@christopherbroaddrick7198 10 дней назад

Read the Psalms. Especially Psalms 31. The first episode was really good. The second episode should be called margi shares her observations.

@rogerbarry9615 Год назад

I find Louisa amazing and like many of Mormon background, durable and resilient. It's like there's part of the pioneer spirit that resides in her heart. If only there truly was a Jesus loving not hell threatening church where we just let it be

@myviewmjs3632 10 месяцев назад

I am so happy I realized the hypocrisy of the church and the power trip it was on at the age of 18 when I walked away, 1968, thereby avoiding the kind of emotional and intellectual entanglements this woman has had to deal with.I have had several crises in my life but I am happy I have not had the additional pressure of “the church” adding to my / our problems.

@marilynadams349 3 месяца назад

Raised before common hot tub sells. So the old time deep footed tubs were good. Supervised kids in a deeper bath was often fun.

@cherylparksbelles6766 Год назад

I can just be a person. I can love everybody. Bingo!

@marilynadams349 3 месяца назад

Yes, we concerved water : as our town/ cities had to build new water towers. Bath in 2 inches of water, side soap wash cloth. Metal cups to wash hair first? Pour methods

@jeangreenwood6299 Год назад

That part of losing my dad at age 6 who was not a mormon and my mom reveiling her mormon faith and her not accepting my rejection of the faith

@andyprompt Год назад

I feel so sorry for this woman...It seems like she feels she has taken her power back by feeling that she is responsible for where she is now. Only so much.

@Lizicles1 Год назад

I hope she finds EMDR and can fully process all of that

@paulam408 Год назад

Enjoyed your story. Years ago, I was told that there was an ideal BMI for weight if you were a student. Was that true?

@pamelanowell1 3 месяца назад

Sometimes, if we don't get the answer we want from God we think He hasn’t answered. We have to get to know our God. Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing, but the glory of kings is to search out a thing.

@17...20 Год назад

@Mormon Stories - will you bring these Thrive Stories w/ Margie back? Am I missing where they've been moved to?

@bodytrainer1crane730 Год назад

Hey!!!! I am a bath person too!!!!!! 😃😃😃😃

@evelyntaylor742 Год назад

Would have preferred a deeper focus on her faith journey away from The Church's truth claims. However, realize maybe there wasn't really more to that portion of the story. Enjoyed it otherwise!

@hlnbee Год назад

I love the concept of reincarnation.

@pollywinkle2451 Год назад

78 I’m 78 and I have been in the church all my life. I’ve always been taught that every human has a spirit of God in them , if you wish, a conscience. The feeling of being a good person, helping others, etc. but I believe the spirit of the Holy Ghost is a much stronger gift and does more for us. We’re told Life is that we might have joy. I used to ask myself. Where was the joy when I was so busy ? I’ve had five children, all by my choice and spacing, and not because the church said to. I have many friends who have been happy and guiltless with two or with 10. The church has been trying to teach us to have joy, calm down enjoy the moments. I’ve always been a reader and curious and have, always taken my time to enjoy reading and learning , taking classes. The church teaches us to be involved in our communities, which I have done, increase our knowledge. I just don’t understand , I guess, why do you think you only have these things outside of the church? I’m so happy you now have such great marriage. My husbands name is Joe also. I’ve been widowed for 8 years now and am happy and doing great.

@toynatty Год назад

You will only understand when you find something that you have always questioned in your mind and find out the reality of it, the truth, turns your beliefs on its head.

@letahamilton Год назад

It’s more about the church not being true. The foundation of the church is not true.

@toynatty Год назад

You can be happy in the church. But you’re not happy in the church when you find out it’s NOT TRUE!!

@andreapaul2818 Год назад

You can have all those things with or without the church, you can be a great human being with or without the church, I believe YOU make that choice for yourself

@weeza8739 Год назад

That's so wonderful for you! I'm so glad you feel empowered in your life choices. I did not feel this way in my life, but that doesn't mean that both our experiences can't be true. Thanks for sharing. - Louisa

@susanmikan8447 Год назад

Louisa, excepting the gospel of Jesus, means you accept that his life is given for your sins, and that when he died on the cross, he died for all our sins. The way we know that we will go to heaven is if we accept Jesus as our savior, repent from our old ways, and believe by faith that he has taken our place on that cross. He died on the cross and rose again, so that we could worship him as he is beside the father. If you accept Jesus Christ as your savior, the Bible says that you will be saved. That means that you be with Jesus when your physical body dies. Our spirit will go to be with Jesus. That is how you would know. Studying the Bible is the best way to have a relationship with God. He does speak. And he loves you. You are a strong and wonderful person. Please look into an evangelical church that believes totally in the word of God without anyone adding their own book to it, or their own words to it. God will have a relationship with you. That’s what it’s all of that.!

@cherylcoolidge8249 Год назад

There is a God. You don't have to be mormon for God to exist. Could you open your own dance studio? Thanks for your sharing.

@blainefarnsworth5569 4 месяца назад

God is not the religion of man. God is Deity, The Creator. He don't need a man representing Him or setting bars of excellence to reach for. God is not a church denomination. God does have bodies or groups of believers in Him. God loves us. God sent His Son Jesus to redeem us back to Himself through our faith in Christ Jesus. Jesus paid in full the cost for our Salvation. We must believe in His sacrifice for our sins. That's our work: Believe in God's grace on us.

@jeffreyturner4252 Год назад

Why not interview those who have gone through incredible trials and haven’t lost their faith

@weeza8739 Год назад

Good point. I think there are definitely some Mormon Stories interviews that do this (Patrick Mason, Jana Reiss, Richard Bushman, Rod Meldrum, Shawn McCraney) But one of the main goals of Mormon Stories is to support people in faith crisis and the purpose of Thrive stories is to help those who have left religion to thrive!

@mellisagreen7801 4 месяца назад

I don't believe familial relations should be based on persons sharing the same religious beliefs, doctrine etc.

@chriscampbell-7155 Год назад

Dear Louisa, be encouraged that only one person has power/authority over a person’s eternal salvation-the Lord Jesus Christ alone, not a bishop: “ For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus” (1 Timothy 2:5).

@Novahere Год назад

I am sorry for you. I’m not judging you but just feel you don’t know your Heavenly Father. You were always loved by Heavenly Father. Best wishes to you and I hope you receive all the blessings you need.

@mellisagreen7801 4 месяца назад

The church judges and punishes people harshly, more so than the world yet they criticize the world as being a horrible place. Such irony.