Men and women DON'T NEED each other anymore: the consequences of replacing necessity with desire 

For perhaps the first time in a very long time, we have arrived at the point where men and women don't need each other anymore. For society to function, women need lots of men around, but a given woman doesn't need her own man. For civilization to continue, men need lots of women around, but a given man doesn't need his own woman. In this episode, I discuss some of the consequences of replacing necessity with desire. Social Media Facebook: facebook.com/profile.php?id=100090053889622 LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/orion-taraban-070b45168/ Instagram: instagram.com/psyc.hacks Twitter: twitter.com/oriontaraban Website: oriontarabanpsyd.com Orion's Theme: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-WrXBzQ2HDEQ.html Thinking of going to grad school? Check out STELLAR, my top-rated GRE self-study program based on the world's only empirically-validated test prep system. Use the code "PSYCH" for 10% off all membership plans: stellargre.com. Become a Stellar affiliate and earn a 10% commission for every membership purchased by a new student you conduct into the program: stellargre.tapfiliate.com. GRE Bites: www.youtube.com/@grebites4993 Become a Psychonaut and join PsycHack's member community: ru-vid.com/show-UCSduXBjCHkLoo_y9ss2xzXwjoin Book a paid consultation: oriontarabanpsyd.com/consultations Sponsor an episode: oriontarabanpsyd.com/sponsor-an-episode Sound mixing/editing by: valntinomusic.com Presented by Orion Taraban, Psy.D. PsycHacks provides viewers with a brief, thought-provoking video several days a week on a variety of psychological topics, inspired by his clinical practice. The intention is for the core idea contained within each video to inspire viewers to see something about themselves or their world in a slightly different light. The ultimate mission of the channel is to reduce the amount of unnecessary suffering in the world. #psychology #men #women

I dated a girl with two kids whose fathers had left. Taught them their letters, took them to the park, spent time playing imaginative games. Clothed them, paid most the bills. Still wasn't enough. She never appreciated it. Now I'm single and happier than ever!

I've been saying this for years. When your marriage is necessary for your survival it's really easy to overlook your spouse's shortcomings. When your marriage is a luxury, it's hard to put up with anything less than perfection.

I knew this was coming. There’s no way to present the truth and escape the label “misogynist” 🤷🏼‍♀️

Honestly this is the same for friendships. That's why loyalty is so difficult to find these days. People simply don't need to rely on each other anymore. We aren't in a tribe or out hunting for our survival..... Relying on each other to live. People come into your life when you have something they can benefit from and quickly leave when you don't.

Being a misogynist these days simply means you're logical, have self respect, clear boundries, and won't put up with misadrist bs.

It’s amazing that we really don’t want each other all that much. Without need relationships are falling apart.

Someone calling you misogynistic is utterly ridiculous

You'll always be labelled as a misogynist any time you speak up for men in any way. Even if what you say is true, spoken In a polite tone, and doesn't put women down. It will always be interpreted as bitter hate speech.

The most intriguing conversation I’ve heard in years! 47 years old, never married, no children. Entirely agree with the “illusion” of optionality. Amazing insights.

"The truth won't change just because you are offended'

I’m an older guy. When I hear young a women or man say they don’t need each other it greatly saddens me. Of course we don’t financially need each other. But on a human level, the relationship between a man & women can be one of the most beautiful things in life. We all need each other. Don’t buy the BS from heartless, power seeking people. They are empty shells.

I discovered this channel yesterday and I'm devouring all of its content. I'm an "ugly duckling", so I didn't have much "practical" experience with men, as I ended up focusing my life on other things. In no way did I consider you a misogynist. Some women simply refuse to accept the reality of the facts. Men and Women are different and I personally find that fascinating. I don't want another woman. I appreciate masculine men and I realized that I need to improve my communication with men and take my share of the responsibility. I hope one day to come back here to share your advices worked and that I found a decent guy to make him happy. P.S. Sorry for my English. It's not my mother tongue.

Doc, I’ve also noticed a decline in men’s overall motivation to aspire for bigger things in life or gain resources. In my opinion, this may be due to the fact that the average man is becoming mostly obsolete, so most are rationalizing that they don’t have to go far and beyond anymore to be able to provide for a family. I think we largely underestimate how motivational women can be in men’s drive for success. This makes a lot of sense from an evolutionary perspective, the more needed men feel in their respective societies, the more they’re willing to dispose themselves for the greater good. Our current society has largely removed those incentives for men, it’s as if they’re completely dropping out of society and it’s sad to witness. I don’t see any solution for this problem en masse. Technology and our modern day societies have largely replaced men, and now they’re even more expandable.

One of the conclusions we can draw from this is that feminism would go extinct if we ran out of electricity for more than 24 hours. The closer we are to raw survival, the faster men and women reassume their assigned gender roles. As a Brazilian who spent some years in rural Brazil and then moved to a big city in the US, I can see how such a large social gap between both places affects intersexual dynamics. No wonder that the Passport Bros movement is becoming a thing. However, many of those guys are delusional. Why? They tend to pedestalize foreign women, portraying them as an "ideal of femininity," but, in the end, they're all women. They're all hypergamists. Women in those unfortunate places tend to be more feminine because there's a need implied to that behavior. Give these foreign women a green card and an address in Chicago, NY, or the Bay Area, and, assuming they can function as average citizens, voilá: they'll act like your regular American woman sooner or later.

One thing I see quite regularly when shopping are examples of the older couple where the woman is obviously the boss and the man just a helper. Neither looks particularly happy or content, maybe they are still together from habit, financial reasons or some other practical reason. But observing them makes me glad I'm not in such a situation.

I think what the manosphere (at least the positive bits of it) are helping men do are: - Helping men set themselves as their own mental point of origin - Growing men's awareness to help themselves identify what is in their best self-interest

I'VE BEEN SAYING THIS FOR YEARS Finally someone else says it.

It's definitely going to be interesting to see what people choose to do when survival doesn't monopolize your life anymore.

I am 47 years old married for 22 years. It is thanks to your videos that I manage to understand myself and my spouse! you make me laugh every time because you are precise, fair and say the things that need to be said. well done !

It’s the beginning of the end people. Brace for impact. As a man focus only on getting better and then choose only from the cream of the crop. Protect yourselves.

That bit about potential being "nothing" really resonated with me in a sobering way. That was what I loved about being so young- the seemingly infinite possibilities for life and all the time in the world to do it all. Unfortunately, 20 years has a way of slipping by a little faster than anticipated. Suddenly it's halftime and I'm down by two scores. Choose your sacrifice, gentlemen. Or it will be chosen for you.

As a woman I feel no shame in saying I need men! I need my husband and all the other hard working men who build and make society run. Men and women aren't and never will be equal we are complimentary and offer a balance of femininity and masculinity, like yin and yang. Without men all women would be screwed!!!

I'm attracted to women enjoy sex but I don't need them because it just feels like its another job that makes my life more complicated

I've been married a long time. Without marriage we would have been impoverished. It's nice to think that people can now be financially independent as individuals, and that they no longer need to be in relationships for economic reasons.

I met a crazy woman on a dating app, which is most women on dating apps, who took issue with something I said. I explained that I didn't intend it that way. Her response was literally that my intention didn't matter. These broads have been poisoned by feminism. They've created a paradise where they're always the victim and men are always guilty, regardless of intention. No point in trying to reason with crazy.

What women have become and offer as a mate, is increasingly undesired. What society now offers women is increasingly replacing what men provided as a mate. Add to this the dangers men could face when interacting with women. And the list goes on. It's down hill for traditional relationships.

The truth hurts sometimes. Sometimes, the truth is unfavorable to women, but sometimes, it's unfavorable to men. That's just life. I'm glad that we're finally getting to the point where people can actually be honest with one another, regardless of whether or not it hurts someone's feelings.

"Men and Women don't need each other anymore" Tell that to the two aging single boomer women in my family. Works out well until you're pushing 60. Then it begins to show. And it's not pretty.

I found this video to be a necessary "back to basics" reset pep talk. A succinct, powerful and timely message. It's exactly what I needed to hear to put perspective and clarity on my own life situation. Thank you.

Your content is not misogynistic. Women aren't used to criticism, especially from men. They rarely get objectivity either. They are used to being pedestalized by men and championed by other women. Hence they often label anything contrary as misogynistic. Often agrily.

I came to this same very conclusion. My father/grandfather didn't know how to fold their clothes, or do laundry, or cook scrambled eggs or anything, or take out the trash lol my grandmother did everything, my mother does EVERYTHING. It hit me when I realized that I've far surpassed the men in my family in being independent and if that's the case, the question needs to be raised.

We now know for sure that women where not loving their husband the same way men love their wife. As soon as they saw they could be in high status and leadership position, the divorce debacle started. It is proof it was just an association by necessity, not for true love for men.

I've been saying this for a while, that need and want are two very different things. As society changes and morphs with the evolving culture, so do intersexual dynamics. Love this video and your explanation. You're the only psychologist I've found who talks about these things and relates it all back to mental health and how to cope or even thrive in these conditions. I'd like to integrate these insights in my own practice eventually too.

"Trading infinite potential for a given actual." Yes! So well put.

First…. All laws where men are forced to give woman money for any reason need to end…. All of them… then I’d agree men aren’t needed.

Personally I believe that when women decided to "not need men," their hope was to ultimately force men to have to do better to attract & retain women. However this actually forced men to become proficient in the tasks that we once depended on women to do for us. Now I believe that this has brought us back to the drawing board, so to speak. Because men no longer need women, because we now truly take care of ourselves for maybe the first time in history, men once again require women to do the tasks that they rebeled against back in the 60's. It's actually kinda funny if you think about it.

Dude finally you put all the pieces together of all of the things that have been troubling me all year. I love the feeling of being needed because desire seems so fickle but I need to let go of that if I'm to ever have a good relationship again

Dating is very expensive. Marriage is ridiculously expensive. Divorce will bankrupt you 😂. And men will have to bear the greatest percentage of these costs. For men, the wisest choice will be to stay single.

"Absolute Potential" and "Absolute Gain". That is spot on! I have have seen it many times to the detriment of all involved. Excellent video.

Modern women will always NEED men to act in slavish kinds of ways, as utilities to do the tasks and heavy lifting that they've never had any intention of doing. Men will eventually realise that they absolutely do not 'need' women for anything, their goals, inspirations, loves and deep passions can come from within...unlike the other who is never satisfied or truly content. Oh and doc, women will call you 'misogynist' for as much as raising an eyebrow in disagreement!...pay them no mind.🌿

Women don't know what they want. This is why trying to become what they want is a loosing proposition.

We have arrived at an age where one can say "no relationship is better than an even potentially bad relationship." As mentioned in this video, people can survive and even thrive without a sexual/romantic relationship. And since one has to settle and cater to the needs and desires of their partner, If another person doesn't show signs that a relationship with them is going to help us achieve a goal (like having children) or signs that being with them is somehow going to improve both involved parties lives, at least by a small bit, then the optimal thing to do is to not even bother trying to form a relationship. Why attempt something that is probably going to be more trouble than it's worth, when the need doesn't exist? And in the case of marriage and procreation, the trouble can become HUGE and the legal and psychological (maybe even physical) implications might scar the involved people for the rest of their lives. Why even attempt something like this when there is no urgency or big profit to be gained in exchange for the trouble?

Men make and maintain everything women have that enables them to not need men.

Correct. Social media has created a delusion of infinite optionality. Beautifully said.

I believe it's Erich Fromm who claimed that there are two kinds of love: 1/ "I love you because I need you," which he labelled as "immature love"; 2/ "I need you because I love you," which he labelled as "mature love". I believe it's a chance - for both men and women - to now have the option to choose which type of love they need or desire at a particular moment in their life.

This video explains why terms like "hoeflation" are popping up.... people are maximizing their wants in the pursuit of relationship since needs are less urgent. Orion Taraban has a cool Sci-Fi ring to it. An intergalactic doctor who appears when a neutron star formed, helping to reconnect the fragmented souls in the astral plane.

A given woman doesn't need her own man; a given man doesn't need his own woman. But isn't it interesting how many of us still want one? "Need" is a word that can mean many things to different people.

I am a single female from Japan, and somehow I totally agreed with him. That's the reason it makes hard that having partners for everybody nowdays.

Honestly, if it wasn't for sex I'd have no reason to deal with a woman at all. 🤷

Facts! I am experiencing exactly this right now. Staying in good physical condition has been an absolute game changer.

I remember sitting at a coffee shop with a friend describing this very theory about 10 years ago.. I was married at the time but really only staying because of our shared mortgage.. i didn't need her for anything, and she didn't need me either it was just financially cost effective to stay.

#13 Law of Power: When Asking for Help, Appeal to People’s Self-Interest, Never to their Mercy or Gratitude This goes for relationships as well. Need is a powerful bind made of steel, want is a single thread of silk.

That was a really great video, I really appreciate your willingness to be brave and say things others won't say.

Man, you are a goldmine for framework.

Thank you for the balanced and informative content 👍

I think we are headed towards bleak times. I don't think that need will be completely replaced by desire. Especially when women and men are artificially sedated with social media/dating apps and p0rn respectively. It's easier to live in an illusion more than ever.

I don't need anyone else to make me happy. I just want to have adventure

@Psyhacks The problem here is confounding the perception/realization of need vs actual need. Most women do need men, they just dont know it because the Government enforces a massive redistribution raquet and culture has rewritten history to make women feel entitled about it. But the fact is that women as a group are not net tax payers and have never ever have been. They literally cannot afford to support themselves as a group. If that is not "need" then I don't know what is.

Thank you for your insightful videos on modern intersexual interactions. I appreciate your non-biased, drama-free takes on the subject. We need more of this as opposed to hubris and drama-filled content the likes of Rollo, Whatever, Donovan, etc.

I observed this phenomena of men and women not needing each other like before. I thought this is in the nature of arranged marriages because often people get married without understanding their needs, preferences, likes and dislikes. By the time they realise what they really want, it is too late. Because of societal pressure, somehow they stick together though they don’t necessarily like each other’s company anymore. It is a bit comforting to hear your analysis of the situation.

Women have never actually liked having men around. It was only driven by need As a man I like a woman around but I get the impression . that the complaints about untidiness,boisterous-behaviour, lack of obsessive emotional introspection mean that they really don’t like us. Men are generally delighted when a woman enters the group especially if she’s good looking. Contrast that with a group of women who at best give tight smiles to a male “ interloper”.

This dynamic is fascinating to watch unfold. I'm just old enough to remember the old ways, but young enough to compete in the ways. The invention of the internet was the tipping point. There is no going back now.

This has been one of your best episodes yet, its like over time you are narrowing down what everyone thinks and feels in this day and age. I too will be interested to see where this next chapter of dating will take us

We're hung up on arguing about survival. Wasting time arguing who has which value takes away from living a life worth living. Stay away from people too angry to be around and let them stu in their unhappiness

The headline and content of the video got it right. Relationships are based on need, and there is no need for a relationship other than this instinctual reproductive desire that gnaws at those who desire a relationship but don't have one. People coming together these days literally have little to nothing to offer to each other. And we see highly dysfunctional relationships as a result. Even if they do have something to offer, they have no idea how to go about it in a productive way. However, I think the old cliche` of: "May you live in uninteresting times." is very spot on. I'm not particularly thrilled in these unpreceded situations showing up in modern society.

Infinite potential is infinite nothing...this sentence is worth its weight in gold.

This is the result of modern feminism. This is a step back, not forward. Also men have always needed to understand women to give what they want. Women simply have to exist and be attractive physically to get men interested. The game was never fair.

If they don't need men, next time they need something done, call around and find a woman to do it. Like, next time you need a mechanic or a plumber or something like that try to find a woman to do it... I'll wait... my point is that women still need men for survival, they just don't notice those men because they are seen as low status, taken for granted and subconsciously seen as expendable.

Well that was very concise and to the point. No fillers, artificial colors or flavors in this video.

dude, bars on bars 🙌 you have become BY FAR my favorite channel in this space. Appreciate you brother 🙏

I think you hit the nail on the head. It’s good to have more than just one option. But having an almost infinite number of options (as many modern women do because of dating apps, Facebook, Instagram, etc) makes it much more difficult to settle on one person and not feel like there could be a better option out there once the initial excitement wears off.

I love the modern world! As a woman I wouldn't want to be forced to be with a man even if I didn't like or want him to live. Who would want to live with that ? And I think in the past women needed men more then the other way around relationship-wise. Now women are on a more even playing field in that.

The blessing here is that we can choose who we are with..... we can be with others because we really want to spend time with them.... it hasn't happened to this extent before in history. It's a huge responsibility to choose well, and a huge freedom. Double edged sword. Great discussion. Surrendering our infinite options for something we actually want.

Thank you, doctor. Your content is thoughtful, well meaning and very interesting. Wishing you continued success.

This is solid. Needing a woman is a turn off, or at least, a negative energy. The positive is Eros or desire. I heard this from a therapist trying to advise a married couple struggling with connection. I thought about the power of this advise, and came to the conclusion that I can not divorce these energies. If I don’t need her then I’ll desire from afar.

It's not just sexual relationships - People like to go on about how much they value community whilst simultaneously wanting the government to do ever more for them. They don't realise that communities exist out of necessity too - If the government satisfies all needs there will be no community. This is why people pine for the communities of their youth when everyone was poorer.

I think we need each other more than we want to acknowledge.

I agree. My life is an example of the statement. The genders don’t need each other anymore.

Quickly becoming my favorite channel. I’m sure you’ll reach 1M subs soon with quality videos like this.

I noticed this growing up, and formed one of those new strategies myself. It's interesting seeing it play out. Your point about subsistence-level living necessitating gender roles while later abundance providing more flexibility is so true.

This was a good analysis. It already mentions it, though not stressed out, that it's not that we don't want a partner, it's that we're mutually not willing to make the exagerated number of concessions we both increasingly demand.

I have been saying for years that the word "misogyny" may be in need of a new definition....of course, it has been applied to so many things in the past 30 years that it may no longer actually have one. 😁 Some excellent points here - and I'm very curious to see where things head from here....especially if financial conditions continue to worsen.

"Infinite potential" is nothing, a dead end. Thank you.

Very astute observations. Thanks. I recently concluded we won’t have old-fashion, early-1900s-type lifelong marriages unless society becomes difficult and impoverished enough to compel couples to marry early and stay married. But who wants that kind of misery and justification for marriage?

I have come to the conclusion that the only thing I really want from a woman is a 'Plus 1) woman for engagements (social events). It is definitely not something I could have seen develop over the years BUT after considerable thought on this and some stark honesty, this is where I am.

If there is no want, why are so many people bitching about being lonely?

This dude just flawlessly does his videos in one take 🤯

I am a 37-year-old woman, a lawyer by profession, I have two children and I completely agree with what you say. thanks to you, I understood the dynamics of a relationship much better and even applied some advice. the fact that we have the possibility to choose what kind of man we want with us and what kind of relationship I think is a huge benefit for both women and men. the fact that we can always choose something else (being in a relationship is an option, not a need) has considerably improved the lives of both women and men

Technology, credit cards, restaurants/fast food, pornography, social programs have all made relationships more obsolete. However even the ones you see today are usually resource motivated on the womans part. Our grandparents generation weren't more moral or loving, it was simply necessity as you mentioned. Human nature doesn't change, only the times do. However once men no longer have the incentive to provide for a family, society will erode. Men as a whole will not take the risky high paying jobs as much, nor attend colleges or trade schools. There's no point really if you don't have to provide for a family, as men in general are totally fine with sparse furnishings, basic clothes, small dwellings and an older reliable vehicle. The effects of this societal shift will really be seen in 25 to 50 years, perhaps less. When infrastructures began to collapse, fewer homes are built, less airline pilots, oil workers, construction, plumbers, doctors, etc.

Exactly right. I have witnessed this need thing my whole life. Lucky for me I have been married 48 years to Mrs. Right.

Congratulations for 200K subscribers!!!

Your point is true in the short run. Women seems not to need men anymore on the surface. But civilization does not run by itself. All the basics things for survival that we all give for granted need the daily work of men. Water supply, power supply, plumbing, transportation, ... all the unseen pillars which sustain civilization itself are carried on the back of men. What is the motivation behind all this hard and unrecognized work? family, children, wife. A man does not need much to get by. The ambition for more comes from a single basic motivator. Reproduction. As the nuclear family is destroyed so is the social contract which serves as the basic motivator for young man to sacrifice themselves for society. A civilization is build by men for women and children. The collapse of western civilization seems inevitable.

We need both men and women; what we don’t necessarily need are romantic relationships. My ex met his wife 2 months into our separation; I have been single for 20 years and have decided I love my peace and contentment without a romantic relationship. I have plenty of people in my life.

This is the situation in Japan and has been for many years. It is becoming more common in Europe as well.

Good to hear your POV. When I consume this topic, specifically for the black community, it usually has a negative/blaming tone. I love your timeline comparison. If I was my ancestors, I’d be in the hut caring for the home and children. Now, leaving the house everyday to work feels like it goes against the fabric of who I really am as a woman.

The last part about 'potential' being nothing and the notion of infinite potential being an illusion was super real

The ominous implication is drastically decreased fertility that will culminate in a population collapse that will threaten civilization

Should be entertaining to watch Western civilization unravel and the very people who helped to orchestrate it call for help when the wolves are at the door.

Women decided they didn't need men, men went their own way, women most affected.