Model X vs e-tron 1000 km challenge part 2 

Its all about charging times. Thats why that shitty charging speed he was getting with the X makes the difference between being barely ahead of the E-Tron in this Video to being way ahead of it if it would‘ve worked yesterday

@@IxLuckyxI You're right. Had it not been for the pin problem and the hot dog and the rain and the traffic and if we had already a sufficient number of ionity chargers and the Tesla hadn't lied about the distance and the test was actually 2000 km instead of 1000, the E-tron would have won big. Seriously now. You're just nitpicking. Pretty soon you fans will be just like Apple fans, all proud that your computer can boot 2 secs faster (Which sometimes isn't even true) and it only cost you 800 Eur more. Please be happy EVs are progressing. And no, I don't really care for dieselgates and conspiracy theories/aliens. So please keep them for yourself.

@@ricardoaguiar8841 Well to be fair... time is only one dimension, cost is another. Model X charging at Supercharger Network is free, while E-Tron being quite inefficient + high charge cost is actually more expensive than gas in the US. That's why I haven't bought one yet... it's a bit frustrating really, E-Tron is a good car.

@@kevinmsft Economically, in many regions EVs only makes sense if you can charge most of your usage at home. I think you can't trust Tesla on any of their claims regarding supercharging costs for the future.

👍

If not more important.

If you have to pay 0,8€ per kWh then it makes quite some difference in your pocket.

Yes, but for me is also important how comfortable I can drive over long distances. A point Audi wins clearly. @kreandi: if you can buy such cars the charging costs may not so important.

500km challenge with Renault Zoe, VW iD3, Honda E next year 😃👌

colla 555 500 in not enough, 1000 is more interesting and comparable with the other cars he has already tested

@@colla555 ID.3 with the biggest battery should be able to drive 500 km without charging.

@@colla555 Don't forget the Polestar 2 and XC40 electric !

@@mgammeren I was focusing more on smaller cars

@@rogerstarkey5390 Yes it was a nice try from Bjørn to let us see it can match the model X ;)

@@rogerstarkey5390 Troll

@@rogerstarkey5390 🐟

I can tell you, I've never taken so many long distance road trips with my family before we got our model X. The car is so fun to drive, and its so comfortable that we love taking road trips now. First year of ownership and we put 21,000 miles on the car and everything (except for a door ding :( sadly) is in as good of shape as when we got the car! The only 2 things I wish were different as of right now...more superchargers in more remote places (doesn't even need to be full on gen 2 or 3 chargers...gen 1 70kw chargers would work just fine for the more remote places or in-between places so you can actually go to more off the beaten path places) And the 2nd thing we wish we sprung for the longer range (we got the p90d which is really fun for speed, but not so great for long distance at 180 miles from 100% to 5% at best *rated 240 miles)

The only tesla argument is "but 0-60!!!". Drive train, built quality, service is on the side of the proper OEM.

Actually, you have already saved about 1 hour by not needing to fill up with petrol 😁 (about 18 times * 5 minutes =90min, excluding detour time for a cheap gas station. 90-25=65 min). An hour you would have spend standing in gas fumes 😝

EU is paying for HPC all over EU now by sponsoring companies like eon and ionity. Check the videos where Bjørn drives an EQC from norway to frankfurt and back. No issues. In the US you have electrify america rolling into high gear.

Agreed, current Audi drivers of ice vehicles don't care if the car gets 15 or 20mpg. They care about luxury

The Model X is not any cheaper.

If you can afford either Model X or eTron, a 200-400 euros in electricity savings a year is nothing (also, based on highway speed efficiency difference, which would be lower at 80km/h and city roads, which would be more appropriate in Norway and for some other drivers). They already save massively over petrol prices anyway.

I did some calculations(i may be a little off but pretty accurate based on this clips). For Audi it took 30min for 10-90% charge and that was enough for 200km. Tesla 10-65% in 30min enough for 200km! Sa basically when you calculate range + efficiency they actually charge the same speed! But with Model x when you start the trip with 100% you will reach 400km before first stop so...clearly a winner!

@@rogerstarkey5390 Thanks for your reply, but I am still strugling with the reason why this pin in the shaft did not go away when Bjørn tried to plug-in.

MrPikkoz The fast charging network grows quickly, so it only gets better for the e-Tron.

MrPikkoz if you look at the plugshare website and filter everything out except CCS, you will see Europe is littered with chargers. A Europe trip would not be a problem.

@@ableacWhat i'm trying to say is that you may be able to do a trip around europe with any EV (even with a 1st gen leaf) , but that having a long range EV that is also very efficient it helps a lot when you arrive at destination where the closest DC charger may be 30-50 km away ,yes the EV chargers are always expanding but in a lot of parts of europe the majority of DC chargers is still stuck at 50kw . There are many parts of europe in between DC charger that half of the AC charging point may be in use, out of service or you have to be the guest of that hotel or dine in that restaurant to use it. When drive to italy to visit some relatives , they lives in a medium sized city, in the north, the closest DC charger is 50minutes away (round trip) and the closest AC charger, 11kw it's like 2 km away , (granny cable not much an option as in italy standard households are capped at 3kw) , or in the alps towards there is a very nice town with only one AC charger in the very city centre and in the family hotel we usually stay don't have any EV chargers) and the closest DC charger is toward the valley 2-3 towns away. Driving around europe with an e-tron is more than doable but for me the ev that gives you the most flexibility, options with the least downtime ( while having a decent space for two adults + 2 teenagers and decent space for luggage) is the TM3 .

Probably better than Tesla... Better cooling and bigger buffer.

The E-tron is built to last, read this article : jalopnik.com/why-no-one-is-beating-teslas-range-1837952903

@@eddgrs9193 Reading Jalopnik is producing crap info the same like Reuters. Audi has no idea how it will last as they had no real wolrd data, they are getting them now or actualy not them. They just had to fight etron inefficiency somehow. Audis field of expertise is not battery field and wont be for long time...

If you fast charge your Tesla battery all the time, you will ruin it as well

@@rogerstarkey5390 That's a lot of bullshit. Just saying.

Don't be. Audi designed the e-Tron to consistently charge fast. And to say that e-Tron relies on the Ionity chargers is stupid. Tesla relies on their Supercharger network so its the same thing. Despite the range factor the e-Tron is a great EV.

@@marcusbiller867 Oh come on. How long did Tesla took to build that supercharger network you can use now? it wasn't done in a year or 3. It took them longer! And yes Tesla can use both, so what? Do you think every manufacturer must install a 2000+ charging network exclusively for their own cars? That is stupid and not future. Ionity does build quite fast but as Tesla they have issues with politics and massive paper work to build a charger. It takes a lot of time. And besides you would only use it on longer trips most people don't ever exceed the range on a EV. And from research most weekend trips are within 300km from home statistics. Don't sort to call people stupid when they actually have a point wether you see it or not.

@@maeguk1 You have indeed to look at where you live etc before you make a choice. Tesla might be the best choice for you. But for me in Belgium/the Netherlands it doesn't matter which you take because charging infra is quite good. Belgium is even behind on The Netherlands on highway fast chargers but they will get there, hopefully. But it's a tiny country. Germany is also well doable.

@@marcusbiller867 I never said the there isn't room for improvement. There is. However the runs most people here do in holiday to the south France, Spain, Italy can be done. And majority don't do that in one day. Mostly they drive around 800-1000km a day and do the last stage next day. So you can do those trips already. I know some building sites need to go faster and there is a lot of work to be done. But Tesla did take it's time too and it is crucial to look at that too to see how they did things before you accuse others for not doing anything. Building a charging network takes time and money. And it make sense to first take care of the big western and Central European highways that see the most traffic in summer.

@@marcusbiller867 How many people will do that? You are hopping goals here. You can easily go to Spain or Italy in a day with Tesla and a EQC/-E-tron and also the upcoming ID3 etc. I can go to Schotland from here without a problem with a Tesla but also with a Kona or etc or whatever. That's is around the same 900 km. Yes there might be regions where chargers are less common and Tesla has them. They should have according to how many years they already are building the network. However they also started in Western Europe on the main roads and gone from that. I can travel to many of my holiday countries with ease. just as many of my fellow countrymen.

250kWh charging is supported by V3 Superchargers, 150kWh charging can be supported by V2 Superchargers (V2s share power between A and B stalls, V3s don't share) while I think most are probably still doing 120kWh, but I think can be updated to 150kWh from cars with newer firmware pushing the updates to them. There's also a smaller looking "Urban Supercharger" that can typically be seen at malls that peak at 72kWh and those don't share power between stalls.

@@joshiepooh Reminder: kW not kWh, you are talking about effect, not about capacity :)

If it’s not an Audi Exclusive color - it should be Taifun grey plus black optics. Have to agree that this is one of the best looking e-tron specs around

On public roads you can't control the testing environment so you just have to see that is perspective. You can easily drive 1000km in a e-tron on a day if you want to. That's the point to see here.

@@mgammeren But then we wouldn't know who won. 😂

million mile batteries coming soon

@@Vivra_Verra____ This new type of battery is probably in Beta test (field test) over a year (Tesla applied for the patent last year patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=US251449154&tab=PCTDESCRIPTION). So it's highly possible the 500-mile range battery is the one that can also extend the life of future Tesla vehicles over 1 million mile. It seems the researchers at Dalhousie University in Canada were able to overcome the trade-off between energy density and battery lifetime. Here the catch, if you read the research paper (jes.ecsdl.org/content/166/13/A3031.full), you would notice that the optimal operating and storage temperature range is between 20 and 40 C degree. The state of charge also has a great impact to the life of battery at 55 C (jes.ecsdl.org/content/166/13/A3031/F13.expansion.html). So to achieve one million mile life, the battery must be operate and stored under optimal conditions like the current 300K-500K mile life batteries. The big improvement is car owners won't have to worry about degradation because of charging over 90% when the temperature is between 20C to 40C. Big Kudos to those researchers.

@@rogerstarkey5390 I'm all for ev's from the beginning. But I see so many hating on anything that isn't Tesla. Tesla is not cheap to buy and we need those more affordable cars. meanwhile we have to look at how we travel. Does a Twingo sized car have a range of 300km and 150kWh charging and full self driving capabilities? No it doesn't because in Europe that is at least 10 years in the future. But those cars are used as seconds cars and thus don't drive far.

@@rogerstarkey5390 Surely you must work at Tesla. Been reading the comments and they are full of you. Always bashing, always negative, always aggressive. And you still have the nerve to come here and say that you are just defending yourself from 10 years of abuse? Do us a favour. Sod off. People like you make me embarrassed of being a fan of electrics.

@@rogerstarkey5390 You're a sad little twat. What else is there to be said? Have a great day

...as long as there's enough Ionity/HPC on the road.

Bjørn Nyland & nafnaf0 - And especially if Bjørn insists on using the slower & more problematic Ionity Chargers instead of the more reliable & faster for Teslas, Tesla Superchargers. 😱🤦🏼‍♂️

Incorrect. E-tron also displays gross draw. No EV can measure heat loss in the battery.

​@@bjornnyland No, no. I'm not referring to internal heat loss. I'm saying that the e-Tron is displaying the net power to the battery (before internal losses). The charger is displaying ~144 kW while the e-Tron was displaying ~141 kW (with coolant system active). I've always known that to mean that the charger is delivering 144 kW to the e-Tron, ~3 kW is being drawn by the systems (battery conditioning), and ~141 kW is going to the battery. Yes, there's still probably close to 1 kW in thermal losses inside the battery, but that is a separate issue. The difference between the display on the charger and the display in the car is due to energy usage from internal systems. That is in contrast to what I experienced in a Tesla on an "Urban" Supercharger. The car displayed 72-73 kW (the max the charger could provide) the entire time. It was nearly a 100 F day, and turning the air conditioning on in the car had no affect on the displayed power.

@@newscoulomb3705 When I charge my MX on the ionity display usually peaks at over 140kW but the internal display in the car peaks at 138 kW so it should be the same.

@@yvindVagenJgtnes I'm sure there's some variance (I see that, too), but it's usually less than 1%. The way to confirm what is being displayed in the car is to toggle climate control on and off while it's charging.

@@newscoulomb3705 I always turn off HVAC when testing charging. As I wrote in another comment I have actually only needed to supercharge for about 25 minutes total to reach my destination in 9000 km of diving so most of my fastcharging has been for tests/fun only ;) With HVAC on the in car display is about 1 kW lower.

Bjørn did not use the pre heat, he thinks it will not matter

Well, maybe you never had to cope with charging on an unreliable network like the french Corridoor, the motorway network of Izivia (EdF). My Ioniq and I twice COAO (Cried Our A.. Off) 😂

Agreed , the TM3 it's the best solution for long trips/holidays as its lessdependant by the availability and the type of the chargers. I've driven to sardinia quite big island that can take hours of driving the few highest 22kw chargers are in luxury hotels with very few public 3-7kw , the small resort i used had a granny cable 2-3kw

@@MrPikkoz TM3 best solution for long trips?! Only if you sit in the front seat and bring hand luggage. That backseat is a joke.

@@AndreDargan stop trolling the rear seats aren't bad until you cram 3 adults and the overall usable boot space its one of the best of category ,better than the ipace.

@@MrPikkoz The problem is that you sit too low and the knees will end up to high. No support under your thighs. Absolutely not comfortable on a long journey.

@@AndreDargan just bring 1 pillow. what will you do in ID3 without glass roof or Polestar. bring a Saw?

I can provide my own reasons for choosing the MX (used in the challenge) over the E-tron which was 2nd on my list when buying it. The MX has much more space, the falcon wings are actually very practical when putting kids inn and out of the car, I can fit more people in total (7) and it has much further range so my need for supercharging is very low on the drives I do which usually max out at around 440 km (drammen - flekkefjord). Also the infotainment system and software update, auto pilot etc were a huge factor since I'm a nerd. The e-tron is not a bad car but to me it feels a bit stuck in the past in the infotainment area and the range without charging was too low. Also it has button overload inside. But the e-tron _was_ my 2nd on the list so I'm not bashing it. For customers with other requirements / preferences the e-tron, EQC, M3, S or i-pace would be better. This is what is great about this whole thing, EVs are going mainstream and there are options for every preferences. Ultimately it's a personal choice. In the past you almost had to go tesla to get these types of performances. Not so anymore :)

Range test is different than 1000km challenge. 1000km challenge is try to get to 1000km as fast as possible with charging times, but you have to balance charge times with speed, since higher speeds equals higher consumption per km

I think I saw the 140 with the X too.

Because on this car odometer is off almost 10kmh at that speed! He needs to drive 130kmh and thats 120 gps! 140kmh was 130 gps which is fine for 1.000km and legal ;)

so buy one! :) also, the audi is a bit cheaper (~84kE vs 94kE for mX in the netherlands)

Incorrect. I don't have to "learn" how to do it. I have used the Ionity chargers a bit more than you, I think... As I mentioned in the video, it was a hiccup. And other people with e-tron also had the same issue with the pin. By the way, charging power is measured in kW, not kWh ;)

@@bjornnyland I have charged on Ionity about 25 times whitout problems. However i have helped other Etron owners with charging. They had pluged in the cable to early or not hard enough, and had tryed again to early (less than 3 minutes). Max charging speed at 77%=153 kW and 152kW at 79%

Incorrect. Watch the Model X video again.

It's not really 100%, the net (usable) capacity is 83,6 kWh whereas the total capacity is 95 kWh and there is a "buffer" at the top as well as at the bottom, so it's closer to 90-95% at max charge. Plus the Audi has a very aggressive battery cooling system.

That was the reason I think Bjørn should have used Tesla Superchargers on the Tesla - The “Handshakes” are faster & simpler & the charging speeds are higher for longer. 10 minutes less per charge would add up over 4 or 5 charges. ITC, the Tesla would’ve required 40+ minutes less to do the 1000 km than it did.

Robert Smith yes, tests with „cheaper“ cars, not with „rich guy cars“, just the every day commuters.. 2nd gen

Incorrect

And next year the ID3, 208,E-corsa, Polestar 2, XC40 etc.. Bjørn is going to live in cars

If you like phantom braking @Tesla for comfort... sure.

Foren siker yes pain in the backside at the minute

Yes "when" it comes. And it is a expensive car more expensive than the Taycan. In the meantime you can enjoy the cars that are out now that are already capable of doing long distance trips and 100% of daily commute. Even the Honda-E would be enough to do commute.

Are you under the impression it won’t come out??? Also, it is more expensive than SOME versions of the Taycan.....shows you how silly the Taycan really is. Don’t worry, I plan on getting the Model Y

@@daguzify It will come out eventually, Elon time as we know it. Taycan is priced like their Panamera which is it based on I guess? So I wasn't surprised by the costs of it. It's a stunning looking car. But for me A Zoe/ID3/208/Kona etc is more in my price league.

Incorrect. Watch both videos again. Slowly. I adjusted both cars for disadvantages.

In another e-tron review by another Auto Journalist, he had mentioned that some owners had reported charging issues with the connector. There is a proper way to avoid this. I saw one video that showed when it comes to connecting the charger.in the port, there is a button you have to push first to disengage the connector. You must wait a second or two for the connector to release, and then you can pull it away. This may take some getting used to. What is worrisome is what happened with the pin getting stuck and how to fix that if you are on long road trip. Also, there is the other port on the other side of the car. That might have worked.

Etron buffers around 15% of its battery for longevity, so if anything etron should do better than the model x

It still charges way faster than the tesla does, or are the batteries in the audi that good? Teslas can easily get 700.000 km from their batteries

@@jerryhou9085 The buffer aside, if you charge a battery too quickly it will degrade its longevity. That's why elon doesn't increase the charging speed, cuz its just not good for the battery. If he wanted he could build a one time use battery that charged almost inatantly.

I`m thinking that myself. No way that audi, merc or any europe company have better battery then panasonic/tesla!(at least for now!) Battery that can take more c rating that is... Maybe they have better cooling solution but still... its not that hard to install better fan or improve cooling! Something is fishy...

@@parkyounggyu44 Yeah, I would really like to know which batteries Audi is using and what is factory recommended c rating!

I corrected the clock of course.

Bjørn Nyland 👍 But really strange that the E-tron clock would need manuall correction.

My calculations were correct.

@@bjornnyland Ok, 1% error is not bad though :) (can be accounted on wheel size differnce between all suported rim/tire sizes) Non the less, Tesla, has to put more effort to refresh Model X in the next year...

Watch the video. Too long for me to explain here.

@@bjornnyland Well I did watch the video. I must have missed the explanation

@@Deddily There are differences in trip meter readings between the two cars and the Google Maps range for the trip. The Tesla claimed to get to 1000 kilometres before it really did and the Audi seems to have driven 1000 kilometres when the trip meter said 990 kilometres if we go with the ranges Google claim they have been driven.

@@justjc51 Thanks for taking the time to explain that :)

with model x its best between 10-50/60% and thats what Bjørn did most of the time...

He didnt charge X beyond 70% as far as i can recollect.

@@rogerstarkey5390 So please tell me the cost of charging for the two vehicles doing this trip. Considering that Bjørn clearly stated that at least one of the Audi charges were free I would think it pushes the cost factor in the Audis favour.

Google: "ionity charging cost" "Tesla supercharging cost"

Most buy model 3 now instead of S or X. In addition the S and X are several years old (there are _a lot_ of them around here in Norway) while the e-tron is new.

I bought the e-tron and I’m from Norway. The only thing I can say is the I like the car exterior and especially the interior better. In addition it seems much better build. Other than that I would love to have the efficiency of the Tesla and a lot of the tech and update features of Tesla. It will probably be like that going forward that people value different things and will choose based on their preferences. In that sense we all win with more competition as I think Bjørn is trying to say.