Real Madrid just released a video of their retractable grass turf. It’s pretty incredible. Another thing I think is interesting is that the London NFL games are played in Tottenham’s stadium and they play on artificial grass but the soccer team plays on grass. they don’t like American football to be played on their grass because American football tears up the grass more.
@@Rockhound6165the retractable grass field in Santiago Bernabéu Stadium is very different from the one in State Farm Stadium. It’s a marvel of engineering
They do that for NFL games and also MLB games I believe at the behest of the soccer clubs. The concern I believe is two-fold: I believe FIFA and UEFA frown on NFL-field markers being visible on the field for soccer matches (even if that makes it easier for more casual fans to see where the ball is on the field) and NFL football (and MLB) games could damage the pitch and the last thing the NFL and MLB needs is their wrecking the pitch and then a key star in the Premier League (or equivalent) goes down with a serious injury because of poor playing conditions caused by such games being played on the pitch.
@@LuxInvidiousyup, it is. Though I believe spurs also have the same or very similar tray system which drops the field into the parking lot so they can off it optimal hydration and light support. Regardless of who was first to market with this system, it is impressive.
In Stockholm Sweden the friends arena is an soccer stadium with a small retractable roof but it's not letting in enough natural sunlight so they use artificial lights and it works fine the pitch is very good
Ya, it was the same system that they used in Houston. The grass was on pallets that fit together like a giant puzzle. There's a college team that plays in that stadium too, but they would play on an artificial surface. So they would wheel the grass trays outside, and the artificial ones inside for the college team, and then vice versa for the Texans. However, the players complained about the seams between the trays, saying they were stepping awkwardly on them, and getting hurt. So the Texans scrapped it, and went to a straight field turf system.
The problem with the area around MetLife is the ground is on swamp land. They tried going from AstroTurf to natural grass at Giants Stadium in the early 2000s but the surface turned muddy and very clay like whenever it rained and they had to switch to Field Turf for the rest of the stadium’s life.
The 2000 NFC championship game the grass was dead, the 2002 AFC Wildcard game huge chunks of the grass were coming up left and right and players kept tripping and falling it was bad.
If the field turned muddy that easily it's an issue with the design itself. Professional stadiums with natural turf have almost nothing in common with your lawn. So the soil type around the stadiums doesn't matter. You only have a few inches of carefully designed topsoil sitting on top of rock with a drainage system underneath. These fields can take on a ton of rain and still be playable.
It should be noted that UNLV and other college football games played in Allegiant Stadium actually play on artificial turf and not the grass surface the Raiders play on.
You did a good job on this video explaining everything as someone who is in the sports field management industry. Just so you know, there is no synthetic turf that is safer than natural grass.
Michigan stadium tried natural turf it didn't work, it was like playing on a pasture. The grass just wouldn't take hold. The field is actually about ten feet below the water table. So they have pumps running 24/7 to keep it from flooding.
The main issue the teams have with grass vs turf is using the stadium for other events. One Taylor Swift concert and the grass is all but destroyed. You cannot support a billion dollar stadium with 9 regular season home games a year, you need other events. The only decent answer to this is the Allegiant/State Farm method or the Real Madrid method. You can retrofit almost any stadium with the Madrid model but it would be astronomically expensive.
@@mtoohill stadiums located up north can't grow grass in the fall and winter because of the climate. That frozen grass/mud is worse than synthetic turf. Best case you get what the Titans just installed in Nissan stadium.
@@Hashim305 I promise you the climates is just as bad in Europe during the same period of time and have no issues growing grass The USA isnt the only country with cold weather swirling wind and snow
You should read up on the lights that get rolled onto the field by many European teams for their stadiums and I also know it's used in Monterrey's new stadium too. I know Real Madrid used to use a system called RHENAC CLS LIGHTING. Given the value of NFL teams buying these systems would not be too much of an issue but installing the grass itself would be a big expense up front.
Houston’s NRG Stadium originally had natural grass, on the piecemeal model(I believe they laid the grass out on the parking lot). But I believe they replaced it with turf due to safety concerns; players would get caught on the edge of a tray.
It did they would truck in the field every game week and construct it but the issue was the pieces didnt line up 100% so there was open seams and other pitfalls
I think MetLife stadium has a terrible history with players getting injured. The 49ers lost 3 or 4 guys to torn ACLs on it a few years ago. Just put a grass surface in that stadium for crying out loud!
In Europe a lot of stadiums have hybrid pitches or have „orange light“ in the night, so the grass can grow good. The real madrid way isn‘t the standard at all
Liverpool F.C.'s home stadium Anfield doesn't have a retractable field but what they do is have a rolling lighting system that is as bright as the Sun so the pitch doesn't die during the Premier League season which goes through the Winter. And being in Northern England, Liverpool and it's 2 Premier League stadiums, Anfield and Everton F.C.'s Goodison Park, get very little natural sunlight due to the Sun's angle.
Aaron Rodgers would've still torn his achillies even if it had been grass. JK Dobbins of the Ravens tore his ACL and the Ravens play on natural grass... Football is a physical sport, players are going to get hurt regardless of the type of field they're playing on.
You can no longer tackle the opponent….player safety. You can no longer practice sufficiently to ensure high level play…..player safety. Playing on natural grass…..we were not really serious about player safety.
This whole turf thing is because Aaron Rodgers got injured Monday night. If this happened to him or Tom Brady on turf this whole debate would be going on.
the reason the superdome is the only stadium in the nfl that doesn’t let in natural light and will never install a window or renovate the roof to do so is because it needs to withstand hurricane force winds. doesn’t make sense to design a giant hole for water to seep into if the glass or the cutout in the roof is compromised. also it looks dope as fuck in person when they turn the lights off. it creates an atmosphere unlike any other in the nfl.
I live in Arkansas, artificial turf is popular with our high schools. My alumni bulit their football stadium on campus nearly 20 years ago, it has had artificial turf on since the day it was built.
If this injury happened to any other player besides Rogers, would this discussion be happening now? I doubt it. Remember all the talk was about Rogers to the Jets in the off-season, to the biggest market in the NFL.
This conversation has been happening for decades remember when turf was carpet and concrete, remember when field turf came around the nationwide conversation was are these rubber pellets safe
Players are gonna have to be willing to lose game checks to get grass in all the stadiums. I don't think they are ready to make that sacrifice yet. Going on strike and saying "we're not playing on this stuff" is the only way they switch to all grass.
@@darealdirtykay8030 Do you think the owners are just gonna give the players what they want without getting anything in return??? The owners aren't backed into a corner to do anything about this.
This is a debate that's as old as the hills. When the first rudimentary Astroturf was invented, it was installed in the Astrodome. Then, synthetic turf has evolved into the grasslike surfaces that are commonly used today. The new stuff (Field Turf) was supposed to be as safe as natural grass. Goddell's idea of mandating natural grass throughout the NFL is simply an unworkable option for many of the teams. Especially, for those who play in domed stadiums.
7:31 the moment I heard you reference the possibility of putting something UNDER THE STADIUM in the city of NEW ORLEANS... I said... Imma have to stop you right there
Even if you don't get injured on turf, it still is much more abrasive and wears down on your joints and knees, it shortens your career the more you play on turf and all socccer players know this.
Easy and fair way of doing this is to say all new stadiums need grass and stadiums with turf are grandfathered for x amount of years (say 20 years). This will eliminate it down to close to 3/4 of the stadiums in a few years with grass with new stadiums and those who want to change. And those without grass, might have a harder time getting free agents so there might be incentive by owners to get it done over time.
They have tried real grass in the Superdome for a preseason game against the Green Bay Packers the natural grass cost 30,000 in 1999 and to have it installed was 150,000 the Superdome was the FIRST dome stadium to host an NFL game on natural grass. We’re talking over $330,000 per game in today’s economy if the Superdome had to install natural grass like back in 1999 at around 2,310,000 and that’s just seven home games not including the playoffs, or if hosting another Super Bowl, honestly, there is no room to even roll out a field in its entirety like seen with other modern stadiums now maybe with a 10 panel rolling platform, approach its possible that it could be done just have to move the field goal post first 😂 highly doubtful, but possible to have natural grass in the Superdome
The problem with Met-Life stadium with turf… 2 tenants.. and they get a bunch of rain.. if that was grass.. it would get tore up badly… Sadly, when it comes to natural vs turf… the raw numbers are not much different when it comes to injuries.. once you remove the injuries where they would have probably been hurt either way… I’ve seen guys get hurt on both.. all it takes is one spike lose it’s grip and you can tear an ACL/MCL really easy (hell, seen it in baseball on natural turf).. The real problem is.. some guys like it.. some don’t… I can tell you that I was a kicker.. I loved the turf… I know many love the turf.. the newest stuff is actually quite a bit different.. some just grew up on grass and they can’t stand change… just like the grousing about the change to DST every spring and fall… I live in AZ. where they stay in MST year round… oh they say it was so the sun set earlier.. BS.. it’s so they don’t have to change… the reality… I just swear at the voters that voted it in every morning when the sun wakes me up at 5:15 am in the summer… it sucks.not to mention.. sunset at 8pm.. yeah, in the summer it’s often 110 and above.. so the sunset time is not so bad… but 5am sunrise… I can do without. It just comes down to … people hate change… todays artificial turf is nothing like what was in the astrodome…. That was basically carpet on a parking lot.
Weirdly enough, for the bulk of the year US Bank Stadium receives a generous amount of natural sunlight throughout the year that only during football season would it need artificial lighting and irrigation to sustain a real grass field. The superdome, Mercedes in Atlanta and Lucas Oil however are completely screwed on this front.
The Nflpa will have to renegotiate the CBA if they want this to happen. I could also see where you place it as a new construction or upgrade priority, but not actually force the owners to try to retrofit. Places such as SoFi will have to switch to grass anyway, at least temporarily, for the World Cup, but they will also be reaping the rewards of off-season attendance.
The problem with the Superdome is that New Orleans is a good amount below sea level, and they couldn't put the grass underground, and there's not really any space to put it outside.
The Texans originally had a field that was natural grass on pallets that were removed to get natural sunlight but players were getting injured on the seams between the pallets.
I use to deliver things to the Superdome in New Orleans. That feild is the hardest thing ive ever been on. Just Walking the length of the feild would make my ankles and feet hurt for days! Its crazy. Idk how they can play on it
a grass field at metlife will be destroyed by thanksgiving, 2 teams sometimes twice in one week. my concern is a place like at&t stadium where they have 4 diffrent fields, 1 nfl, 1 college, 1 high school, 1 soccer. thats why we don't notice diffrent hashmarks. i feel it's really going to screw up the whole multi use stadium where you will have a beyonce concert on friday, then a nfl game on sunday, then an auto week car show during the next week.
It’s not the team that screw up the field. It’s all the other events truckpulls monster trucks motocross concerts. They cover the field up with a plastic like material that compresses everything the field was brand new in May and then they had a whole summer of different events it got completely destroyed. The problem is it’s all about making money for the stadiums.
They just use the Cowboys field for HS games at AT&T. All they have to do is put the hashmarks on the field and use a wider cross bar. Even though HS here in TX play NCAA rules, I can only remember once when they used that college field to play HS games on and I think that was b/c they were playing the BIG XII champ game there the next day.
It's not just the immediate injuries, it's the long term damage. I played on turf and I can honestly say, "it's hard as hell". It's like playing on asphalt, there is no give. So the constant connecting with the ground may have lasting affects on the body.
0:36 don’t know where you heard that but Messi said he will play no matter if its turf or real grass. It was Zlatan Ibrahimovic that said something about that
@@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1I think Henry and Ibra were persuaded to play on Portland’s turf. Of note, though: story is that Portland diverted a turf purchase to a Southern Oregon high school and may well go to grass.
Giants Stadium had grass for a while in the early 2000s (in addition to temporary grass for the 1994 World Cup and 1999 Women’s World Cup). They used a removable tray system and everybody hated the surface so they switched to field turf. I’m guessing MetLife stuck with field turf because of that experience. But there has to be a way they can do it better all these years later.
@@night_wolf6621Not in that case. The field got badly torn up to the point it was worse than artificial turf. Some stadiums simply put are not built to handle natural grass and never were. They would likely need two grass fields that could be rotated in and out of greenhouses for it to work (which they probably could do since the old grandstand of The Meadowlands Racetrack that was near Met Life's entrance was torn down).
Do what Green Bay does. Late in the season the sun is so low, more than half of the field gets no natural light. So they just wheel in a lighting system, similar to a sprinkler system on a farm, and it covers half the field. And during the week, they use it 24/7, rotating it back and forth once a day or so. It's relatively not that expensive.
Fact - Survey studies show natural grass has just as many injuries as turf. Fact - There is no point in overspending for natural grass if it's not made to last - Otherwise the owners will look like an Ass.
To clarify, Univ of Phoenix stadium does have roll out field but Reliant (now NRG) had natural grass that was moved out on giant pallets to a parking lot on East side of stadium. The problem with their original grass was the joints caused a lot of major problems with injuries which is why Houston went with the Hellas turf.
World Cup 94 - this problem was solved. Games were held inside the Pontiac Silverdome… on grass… and they had lights on wheels, looking almost like a farm irrigation system. Drainage is likely a bigger concern. The Superdome also had grass for the preseason in the late 90s. They rolled it up after every game and took it out of the city for light. As for soccer, it also has a huge impact on how the game is played, not just concerning injuries. Take a soccer ball and bounce it on concrete, you can pretty much use it as a basketball. Take that same ball and bounce it on grass, the amount of force you need to put into it for the same hop greatly increases. Turf is closer to concrete than grass in that bounce. And the crowns of the field are often much higher so the ball rolls towards the sidelines more since water needs to run off, not get absorbed.
For the life of me i CAN NOT understand why these NFL and big time collage football programs can't maintain natural grass fields? These programs have so much money, and access to the most cutting edge technology in 2023, but instead we are seeing more and more teams switching from grass to synthetic turf?? Some of The examples that come to mind are the Houston Texans, the Carolina Panthers, Tennessee Titans, and Notre Dame football. These organizations have so much money why aren't they playing on natural grass?!
It's more than just Turf Fields. It's also things like Strength & Conditioning Programs & Coaches. Look at the Ravens who have suffered strings of injuries for years now despite having one of the nicest Natural Grass Fields in the League. On top of that the NFL needs to rethink, and restructure how they do things like Training Camp, and the Pre-Season to do a better job of ramping players up for actual Live Games. Even with all of these things we will never eliminate injuries in Football completely because it is a fast paced full contact sport. These changes along with Natural Grass Fields would go a long way though in hopefully reducing the number of atleast early season injuries we see every year.
Remember the concrete with green carpet from the 70's? Owners want what is the cheapest and can save them a dollar. We really needed a study to say grass is safer?
I think what gets lost in the argument is "what surface is actually causing the injuries?". What I mean is, just because an injury occurred on grass, did playing on grass actually cause the injury, or did the injury just occur while playing on grass. What some medical experts are saying, is that the players are playing on grass and artificial surfaces all year. The damage is being done on the artificial surfaces, but then by chance, the injury is occurring on the grass surface. So in other words, if the player was playing on grass surfaces all year, they would be doing far less damage to their lower bodies, and so it would be far less likely that an injury would occur. And I think one of the reasons the owners aren't as concerned about injuries, is because the vast majority of NFL contracts aren't guaranteed. So if a player gets hurt, the owner isn't on the hook for their salary. And in terms of cost, installing a grass surface is far less expensive than installing an artificial surface. It's just that artificial surfaces don't have to be replaced as often as grass, and therefore a lot of the cost of artificial is deferred. However, it's a mistake to think that only grass requires a grounds crew for maintenance. Both surfaces require maintenance, and therefore a grounds crew. It's just that the maintenance is different, and less time consuming for artificial than for grass.
I wonder if they could just use mirrors to get natural light the shaded areas. Most of the retractable roof stadiums have no shortage of sunlight. Just spread it out some. It would be easier than rolling out the entire field. And turf is faster. It is notably faster. And players do like it, until it hurts them.
There’s no crying in football. No way in hell the field in NY is more dangerous than that crap they play on in Chicago or Pittsburgh. As for FIFA, these jackwagons are collapsing on the field in tears when someone bumps into them.
I'd like to know what they expect us to do here in Indianapolis. Yes, we can open our roof when the weather is nice, but the fact is, Lucas Oil Stadium is not just a football stadium. It's used as convention space and for other events like the Final Four. It's attached to the Indiana Convention Center. There is a surface parking lot just to the south of the stadium, so the only possible way to have a grass field would be to make it retractable and dig out the parking lot so it's on the same level as the field (which is currently below grade). LOS is a downtown stadium. What could they do in Detroit or Minnesota? I know Ford Field is now 20+ years old, but do you honestly expect the Detroit Lions to build an outdoor stadium just so they can play on grass? I remember they had to take the grass out in New England because it didn't grow properly and just became a muddy mess. You simply can't have natural grass fields everywhere.
Lucas Oil also is one of the biggest hosts of drum corps and marching band related events in the US. I know it’s not their primary function but it is still something they actively designed the stadium for. Marching arts in general tend to prefer astroturf since they have a LOT of equipment that will destroy the fields (especially drum corps groups), such as props, field lining tarps, front ensemble equipment, sound systems with usually around 4-8 speakers, 1-2 mixer carts, 1-2 decent sized portable generators, and sideline microphones and all the equipment to transport this stuff rapidly). And there before we consider people actually marching on the grass as well.
They don't have to move the grass to the lights, they can move the lights to the grass. They just need a retractable lighting gantry that can be deployed when the field isn't used.
In any of the closed stadiums like the Vikings US bank, grow lighting could be probably added but how are they going to water and more importantly have proper draining in a stadium that wasn't built for grass? They're not going to do a MAJOR remodel on a billion dollar stadium that's only 6 years old!
Can you see Met life going to grass, two teams playing on it in December Not to mention the Army games on Saturday when they play. It would be worse than the turf. Only way the Jets get grass is if they build their own building with a retractable roof and slide out tray.
Ford Field in Detroit has their actual playing surface 50+ feet underground. The main concourse is street level. It’s in a downtown area, there is no where to roll in and out a natural grass field. There is nowhere to go further underground being so close to the Detroit River. So the Lions (the city and state residents) through taxes because we all know billions hate spending their own money) would have to build a whole new stadium.
Unless New Orleans puts in natural grass with a irrigation system and while no games are being played keep a red light on the field. Won’t be no need to transfer the grass piece by piece to another area with the red light just my opinion
I am not so sure that modern turf is significantly worse from an injury standpoint. I have read the studies and they are mixed. There's no doubt that turf today is infinitely better than in the old days when it was carpet laid over concrete, but it appears they still have work to do in order to get it as safe as grass. The main issue is artificial has no "give" when you dig your cleats into it. Natural grass will peel away in chunks and relieve stress on joints/ligaments. I have read that the turf companies are now experimenting with ways of making their turf "give" like natural grass. Not sure how, but maybe it's possible.
Honestly how could they force implement something like this with the hige costs that would be involved? Us fans would be the ones to pay, not the NFLPA, not the NFL, not the owners. Also some stadiums may not have capability to have something like this very easily.
Sorry, but you make me laugh. NFL ownership is basically a license to print money, and at some point, you’ll realize that ticket prices are totally unmoored from operating costs.
@@PCSPounder Guess you do not understand that when tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars are being spent that money is made up somewhere. Guess where it comes from. It comes from ticket price increase, food and drink price increases, Additional cost to broadcast since the NFL is going to be having to pitch in, and plenty other methods that mean they get their money back and then some. Also how many individuals get hurt installing mew fields that will require being taken out of indoor stadiums. Is that alone worth the cost of such a slight if any decrease in injury.
@@PCSPounderI don't think many fans really give two shits what they play on. They care about ticket prices. They have been playing on turf for decades. People get injured, thats the nature of football. Unless you want to lock the players in a padded room, you aren't going to avoid injuries.
@@PCSPounderyour argument doesn't make sense either, if the nfl is "a license to make money" there will ALWAYS be people willing to play the sport. You ask 99 percent of people and they would say the
MetLife Stadium is used twice as much as any other stadium with the exception of Scofi Stadium. So it is not realistic because the natural grass would get destroyed twice as fast.
It's funny that the Carolina Panthers owner put down the "field turf" for the soccer team but the biggest name in all of soccer will not play the Inter Miami away game there because of the turf.
I think Lucas Oil Stadium is the safest place to play football. The other stadiums except for probably Lambeau Field gets criticized for their playing surface
You simply cannot do natural grass at Lucas Oil Stadium do to the fact that it is not used for just football. It's hosting All-Star Saturday night festivities for the NBA this year, it host the final four, it's hosting the US Swim Trails this year as well. Yes even though we have a retractable roof but that roof isn't opened as much as you would think. It would cost more for use to install natural grass because not only would we have to put grass in we would also have to buy the red lights to help it grow in the winter. Unless the NFLPA is going to pay to install natural grass and for the red lights needed for the growth of the grass then fine but we already know they aren't going to do that. Plus we are already replacing the turf after the current 23-24 season
