Pakistani MiG-19 Shoots Down One Wanted Target (And One Unwanted), Indo Pak War 1971 

That's really awesome, fellow Aaron

Thanks for sharing personal experience

Thanks for sharing your view.

Bro. Pakistan is not India. To understand their action you need to read Quran.

@@sachinm7091😂 yeah ok 👌🏻

​@@showtime112Actually 3rd December 1971..PAF launch Airstrike against Indian Airbases.. After that time IAF strike back

Thank you for bringing your personal experience!

Yes, a classic case of over eagerness. In DCS it is even easier to confuse aircraft because you can only identify them visually at tock throwing range 😁

IFF has been existing since WW 2… For instance, Spitfire and Me-109s were equipped with an IFF.

@@julosx That 's true, but during the Vietnam war we asked to the pilot a visual confirmation before shooting and the ratio kill of the missiles was a disaster. It's the reason why the Navy invited TOP GUN on 1969. The BVR started really on The first Gulf war on 1991 with the F-15C and the E-3 AWACS and with Sparrow who worked very well.

@@julosxIFF in 109s? 🤔 i highly doubt that.

Sounds confusing 😁

The USSR had copied the sidewinder aam & used in their aircraft. Before that all Soviet origin aircraft were heavily relied on machine guns. So it was not surprising that Pakistani Air force had success to fit the sidewinder to Chinese J-6 aka MiG-19 copy's hardpoint.

PAF engineers had made more then 40 improvement's in F6 to make it serve 40 years as they were built as disposable only for less then 200 hrs flying time

I remember something about it. Clashes between Pakistani Air Force on one side and Soviets with their Afghan allies on the other side are mostly waiting for me to cover. I'm waiting for any news on the possible Afghanistan map (which can be emulated with other maps). But also Su-22 and MiG-23 which participated in those incidents.

It's quite hard to even imagine.

Things are a bit different in our culture. Sure, there may be some form of guilt. But our military, and definitely Wg Cmdr Hashmi (He was a DEEPLY religious man), utilise religion to process a lot of battlefield trauma. So we never really saw him delibitated by this incident. Could be due to 2 reasons; 1- It actually was friendly ground fire, 2- Friendly fire by genuine mistake does not condemn a person to spiritual punishment as a person is not held accountable for mistakes, and the person killed is considered to have the same status as someone who was killed by the enemy while fighting. So this kind of plays part in the psychie of the military in Pakistan. Tho ofc, I'm sure he must have thought about it sometime or the other. Source: 2 geberations of close familial relation with Wg Cmdr's family. He was my maternal grandfather's best friend since childhood. Closer than brothers for all their lives.

Thanks, it's very nice to hear things like this!

It does seem so. But then again, R-3S is a direct copy of AIM-9B.

Actually Chuck Yeager integrated onto the Mig-19 back in the 60's, he helped develop PAF in it's early days

Most probably Chinese could have done for them

PAF made many modifications to Mig-19s including replacing Chinese ejection seats with Martin Baker seats, incorporating AIM 9B Sidewinders, adding a conformal fuel tank called ‘gandola’ to enhance range and upgraded many other avionics too including RWR and IFF. These Migs in PAF were rechristened as F-6s and became effective close air support and point defence fighter aircrafts well into the 90s.

Would be a cool video

We will have an Air Force and later also a Navy Phantom in DCS. I might cover that story someday.

@@showtime112 I saw a lot of F4s when I was a kid. My dad also helped to develop the weapons system of the F14 Tomcat.

@@certinstructorron4050 bro that is so cool..W dad

@@makfrags14 There's always been friendly fire events in battle. I figure my dad saw and did a lot of things in the Navy. When I joined the Army. He had a talk with me about things I would see. I remember collecting 20 millimeters fired bullets when I was a kid too from the hanger where they sighted the weapons in at.

Very simple. Pakistan had many AIM-9Bs in stock and they adapted their MiG-19s (F-6) to carry them. Since the Soviet R-3S normally carried by early Soviet fighters was a direct copy of the AIM-9B, it probably wasn't too hard to do.

Thanks for the comment and offer to help. You can contact me at showtime112b@gmail.com for details. I do hope to cover a lot more of Indo-Pak wars. For now, I am quite limited by the lack of assets in DCS. Especially for the Indian side.

Thanks! I didn't know much about the 19 before DCS but with this module, I started liking it.

I only started to do that recently but it seems to work just fine. Thanks for the feedback!

It's always a pleasure to read your comments! As for the work, this one was on the simpler side because I've flown the MiG-19 quite a lot so I didn't have to learn anything new. Also, it didn't require complex tricks to make the AI do something it is not inclined to do 😁

Thanks, I appreciate the feedback!

Thanks! It seems that he was high on adrenaline after the first shot and that made him careless.

@@showtime112 good point but IFF check or knowing where your wingman is, is important.

Thanks for the comment. I don't think that it's so bad when a young, hot-headed pilot makes a mistake. He apparently accepted it since he is ready to talk about it.

There are more such cases, I think Iraqis purchases some from Jordan maybe for their MIGs. Russian early missiles were just Sidewinder copies.

School is overrated 😁

Puno hvala na komentaru i željama. Pozdrav Makedoniji!

Hello! I mostly come up with ideas going through books, documentaries, podcasts or websites. Some are suggested by viewers. If you have ideas, you can leave them in the comments, you can join the Discord server or send an e-mail (showtime112b@gmail.com). Interesting story that can be done with DCS or IL-2 will be considered.

Thanks for the feedback and more info. That reminded me that I should really try to do something from the 1948 Arab-Israeli War someday.

@@showtime112 I know it's someones another video, but it was back in somewhen 2005. It's more of a cinematic, one of the first videos of IL2 Sturmovik what I have ever seen. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-cfExeLT-j18.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-JQiZUNyHgAQ.html

Many mistakes were made by both countries i.e. India and Pakistan in 1971, however, India made less mistakes and well strategy lead them to Victory.

Thank you for the positive feedbck!

One of the Murphy's Laws 😁

It could be an important factor, sure.

😁 Very funny.

Could be.

Glad to hear you liked it!

That's probably the mot requested topic. We don't have Hunters in DCS so I have to wait until they develop it. Or maybe use War Thunder or something.

@@showtime112 bro you must made video on MM Alam.his total confirmed kills are seven,due to professional jealousy he given credit of three bcoz other two wreckage not found.they don't bother to check the mighty Chenab river over that dog fight happened.I can help you regarding the video if you wish so .best wshs

Thanks for commenting!

The USAF shot down American blackhawks after the war ended in Iraq

@@Dog.soldier1950 true, in the Kurdish areas, 1990s with Kurdish fighters on board mistake for an Iraqi Hinds.

I find these friendly fire incidents quite interesting. Accounts often show clearly how much confusion is really going on in wars.

@@showtime112 the danger of the battlefield blue and blue is common sometimes deliberate.

Thanks for contributing info!

Thanks! Another version will probably not be developed. Too many variations to cover them all. Approximation will be the only way in most cases.

Hvala na komentaru! Zanimljivo kako mi je baš danas neki lik napisao da sam totalno pristran 😁 Lijepo da su ti iskustva s putovanja pozitivna. Mislim da ljudi osjete tvoj stav pa onda sukladno tome i reagiraju. Slažem se u tome s putovanjima. Ja sam recimo nakon nekoliko poslovnih putovanja u Kinu vrlo značano promijenio dojam o toj zemlji na pozitivnije.

@@showtime112 zaista jesi objektivan, taj covek je lud ukoliko je rekao da si pristrasan i subjektivan.... Na primer, sve sto je bilo 1999 te, je bilo onako kako su ti kazao, takodje i u Bosni.... Svaka cast😇😇😇✅✅✅✅

Hahaha no, it's really not that simple

this conflict was not over kashmir , it was over bangladesh , Pak army was commiting war crimes on begali people (people of bangladesh as of now) and because of that , several refugees started to flood indian borders , at that time , india had a lot of internal issues and was struggling to deal with them and was in no state to help them but india did what they could , they started funding a bengalii freedom organization called mukti bahini whose primary goal was to liberate west pakistan from opperesive rule of pak army, and when ISI (pak's intelligence agency) got this information , the situation between india and pak got heated even more , india was trying its best to avoid any direct conflict with pakistan because at that time pakistan was in a much better position , but soon the war became inevitable , at that time indian army had a great general , his name was Sam manekshaw who was a ww2 veteran himself and was a mastermind , he planed the whole conflict and during this conflict , unlike 1965 , indian airforce's performace was quite good and pakistan suffered a lot of defeats and because of that the morale of pak went realy down and they asked western powers for direct intervention , which the US agreed on and sent its best fighting force , the 7th fleet alongside with other nato ships and because of that , india asked for soviet helped on which soviet also agreed , the nato wasnt expecting much of a resistance because at that time indian navy was of no match to nato but they didnt expected soviets to be there , when they enterted the indian ocean , the soviet warships warned the nato forces to retreat otherwise there will be a full scale war and this deterrent worked , noato pulled out and retreated , and after this was , pak's defeat was also inevitable and then pak surrendered and a new country the bangladesh was formed. i tried to as much unbaised as possible , i am sorry if i triggered someone. thanks for reading.

Francis Ebbecke - the horrendous spelling errors display the fact that you know little about India, Pakistan, Kashmir or the Nehru clan. It is better not to comment on some topics when you have such little comprehension of the subject. No offence meant.

@@Deadpool-rw1pk in east pakistan there was an insurgency lead by Hindu residents , guided by Indian intelligence, when authorities were gaining control of the situation , Indians openly intruded into east Pakistan, foolishly west Pakistan retaliated in the west , not realizing it was a trap planned by Indians years earlier....also India signed a defense pact with USSR receiving AWACS, SU 7 and other latest weapons...whereas Pakistan was under embargo from USA. It must be appreciated that the Pakistan army, about 42000 in numbers in east Pakistan was fighting with mostly WW 2 weapons, 8000 were killed and 32000 were taken prisoner of war.

@@696pk thanks for adding further more details. I kept it short and sweet.

Thanks for the positive feedback! I'm glad you like the videos.

@@showtime112 welcome sir.

Bez brige, novi sadržaj se kreira punom parom :)

Well, I don't own the rights to the music but perhaps some kind of a playlist could be made. There might be something to it.

Bangladesh, simply

Yes, there seem to be some interesting stories. I haven't really found good and detailed sources. But admittedly, I didn't dig too much.

@@showtime112 Try the following, though this is about one person only: kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.com/2008/11/sword-for-hussein.html?m=1

Ya still israel won

Thanks for the info. I have to say that I've heard both variants, that it was license built and that it was just copied.

I think that's how it was on this type. Not sur why.

Some early Soviet jets had their artificial horizon inverted but I can’t remember the reason why.

@@sargesacker2599 Thanks for confirming. I don't think the developer of this module made such a mistake without correcting it for years.

I appreciate it, thanks!

I don't think he needed to account for anything. It became obvious that he shot down his wingman and there was no attempt to cover it.

The 90,000 number indians keep throwing around is factually incorrect, in 1971 total Pakistan military strength was no more than 40,000 approx this including Army, Navy , Airforce and Police. When the war ended Every person of West Pakistan Origin was counted as POW,. So the 90K number included civilians , admin staff govt employees, postal workers, factory foremen etc. of West Pakistan origin.

@@foxtrotwhiskey874 Check RU-vid and Google

@@jaybnglr1948 thats your source? LOL write a paper in exam and when you have to cite the sources you will write "Check youtube and google? " you will get an F! that is if you have ever went to a half decent school or college. If 1.4 Billion ppl lie about something, that does not make it true. Its still a Lie.

@@jaybnglr1948 Watch interview of your own military officer General Jaccab on utube who also participated in 71 war. He clearly stated that only 26000 Pakistan army soldiers surrendered at Dhaka.

Sounds like a story with good potential. I'll write it down on my list.

Correction: the aircraft flown by LT Motiur Rahman was Lockheed T-33 shooting star a trainer aircraft. Also very grateful tor your reply. Best wishes

Thanks one more time. Fratricide is very hard on those who made a mistake but the final result is still death.

Pakistani accounts can be usually hard to interpret, follow or sometimes even believe. They have the habit of changing their story multiple times, whereas India usually sticks to one story. During the Afghan war, the EXACT situation occurred, except this time the pilots were in F-16s instead of MiG-19s. Pakistan claimed that to be friendly fire, while Russia said it was shot down by MiG-23s, although I'm sure the USA would have helped Pakistan to cover up given how embarrassing that would've been. Also, the Gnat and F-16 never flew on the same period. The F-16 came decades after India retired their Gnats. And apart from the event in 2019, no F-16 has been involved in a dogfight with India, because they have a binding contract with the USAF to never use them offensively against India. Although in 2019 they went ahead anyway because they would have had no advantage otherwise. They are lucky they got early experience by training with the USAF and leaders like Chuck Yeager actively helping them, because they definitely would have been in a MUCH worse situation than they already are in.

india shot down its own helicopter in 2019 and it took them 2 years to admit it that it was not a technical fault but their own missile hit. so indians should be the last people on earth to lecture others on honesty. indians are more brainwashed now then the russians during the soviet times.

Abhinandan is a great case study of how a nation gives honor to a loser just to protect the pride of the nation. The poor chap couldn't fire a single missile. Pakistan recovered all four Russian missiles from the debris of his jet. He in fact had no idea what hit him. But the Indian government awarded him with a medal of bravery. The greatest cover-up of all this event was the death of Squadron Leader Rakesh Pandey who was flying the Su30 MKI that India lost on the same day. The jet fell into the Himalayan mountain ranges. Rakesh Pandey bailed out of the aircraft but got severely injured. He passed away two days later in a hospital. Indian government covered up the fatality by stating his death in a road accident at Pulwama and declaring him to be part of a non-fighting branch of IAF. A time will come when the truth will emerge and the downing of the second aircraft will be confirmed.

@@naherf385 Pakistani air force is a great case study of how a nation can have no self respect and dignity lmao. Pakistan has to use all the rat tactics they can to gain an advantage. Its clearly written in that Pakistan cannot use F-16s in an offensive role against India. I mean, they made this deal with former sugar daddy Uncle Sam after bending over all those years. Still you had to. IAFs biggest mistake was thinking PAF would honour that agreement. I mean, even the Nazis played by some rules. But I guess after 4 humiliating losses, one MiG-21 lost to an F-16 can be a huge achievement, especially to a country like Pakistan which has lost 1/8th of its F-16 fleet to crashes and one to an embarrassing friendly fire over Afghanistan. Its honestly so sad to see PAF being one of the few nations which doesn't go to any international exercises held in America in their American made plane, while India goes there in Russian and Soviet aircraft. It shows who the world respects. Because unlike the donkeys running the PAF, who were to scared to engage Indian Mirage 2000 and Mig-29s in Kargil because they didn't have BVR back then, India has their self respect and dignity. They don't just defend themselves only when they have an advantage. And they're not scared like the Pakistanis, who leave their militants to die just because India had a small advantage lmao. Keep gassing yourself up with a Soviet era fighter kill, given the fact that your country is drowning, literally and economically, you need that little hope that you might have achieved something🤡🤡

That is too fantastic to believe .Fighter Pilots are well trained on their types of aircraft, the ejection handle is a lifeline but the last thing a fighter pilot would ever pull, be it from any country. Therefore this is nonsense.

Not exactly. They have F-16s and JF-17s as the most modern fighters but they are 'half a generation' behind.

@@showtime112 Pakistan have now J 10CE which is 4.5 gen equipping with AESA Radar Pl 15 and Pl 10 missiles. 12 delivered the Total order is 36 to counter 36 Rafale on the eastern border.

@@shoaib2185 do you have defence for Brahmos?

Glad you liked it!

PAF started using American insignia badges since 2002

Well, maybe Indians and Pakistanis should learn how to address their past in a new way and maybe these videos help with their relationship. They can hardly make it worse 😁

Ova verzija mislim da ga nije imala. Doduše, na ovoj visini bi ionako bio beskorisan. Hvala na još jednom komentaru!

Thanks for the suggestion. The biggest issue is lack of assets in DCS, especially for the Indian side. We might have a Hunter someday but it's not confirmed yet.

@@showtime112 i think he used gnat, but u can get a plane which looks similar and code name it gnat for now.

@@darkassassin4166 Currently, no available aircraft looks like Gnat but there's this Swedish trainer jet which could be released soon. It resembles Gnat a bit.

@@showtime112 ye ig u could use that with indian markings or sumn, also where u from if i may ask

He didn't shoot down any according to neutral sources,but on of the PAF jets was damaged,a truly heroic feat.

Can you recommend any good sources on that?

Ground radar did guide them well but the situation has changed. Hamshi wrongly assumed his wingman was behind based on his radio reply.

Oh, I love these comments 😁 Generally, no. But Pakistan had large stocks of AIM-9B. So, when they bought MiG-19s from China, they adopted them to carry the AIM-9B. Since the Soviet R-3S which the MiGs normally carried was a direct copy of AIM-0B, it probably wasn't too hard to do.

@@showtime112 well they did get a bunch of J-6s from China but they also did get a handful of Mig-19s from Albania or some other country I remember. However I don't know if they actually did implement Sidewinders on those

@@F22raptor46 According to Kaiser Tufail, they clearly did.

@@showtime112 I see

@@F22raptor46 i think yu should look at PAF project rose,, in which they transformed the older mirage 5 and 3 in to 4 gen by integrating new radar's integrate a nozzle for air fulling make some solid change's in the fuselage for integrating Chinese missiles as well as the local made missles

Everybody wants that one but we don't have all the necessary assets in DCS for this. Maybe someday.

Very simple. They normally carried R-3S missile which is a direct copy of early Sidewinders. Pakistanis had plenty of Sidewinders in stock so they adapted their MiGs to carry them. Did I mention Russians copied the Sidewinder? 😁

Su-7 doesn't have internal chaff/flare dispensers and he may have never noticed the F-6 behind him .

You assume a lot. F-6 didn't have a radar so, no radar warnings and the only way for the Su-7 pilot to spot an enemy behind him would be visually. Even if we suppose he did see the Pakistani fighter, maneuvering wouldn't have been the best choice. Su-7 is not a fighter, it's in an unfavorable position and it can't win any dogfight. It can just loose speed and get within range of enemy's guns. Staying low and fast was the best choice. Sidewinder B had a very short range with flight time of just a few seconds. To react, the Su-7 pilot would have to spot the launch to have time to react. And you can't really keep your head turned back all the time when flying low and fast or the ground is more likely to kill you than the enemy. And I'm pretty sure Su-7 didn't have any chaff or flare dispensers at the time. So, pretty lame arguments on your side.

@@showtime112 you are not supposed to single out any one comment & reply like Illiad & Odyssey. If you can't bear anyone's comments, please close the comments section. Far as your reply is concerned, in this video itself, you have stated that India & Pakistan have mixed opinions. The Su-7s were highly unreliable & lacked any sort of alarm systems but it's also true that many IAF Su-7s made out in one piece, even after getting hit by missiles. I also don't mean to say that this one could have survived but since it's a contested view, one can't rest entirely on what is shown in the video. Whatever I've posted only pertains to the uncertainty & nothing else. If you can't handle anyone's views, it's your problem. Don't let someone's views bog you down or make you stop doing the noble task that you are doing.

@@Kay-51995 Indian side hasn't agreed to this as they say it got hit by ground fire. Did you know that Su-7 had a very robust airframe & many survived missiles too...

@@Koo_pootra The plane was down in Pakistan area. So Pakstan was the one who saw real scenario.

I know that some people insist that Shenyang J-6 (or F-6) has nothing to do with MiGs but I'm not one of them.

@@showtime112 Wait isn't Sheyang J-6 is based on Mig21?. I merely asked because I didn't read anywhere anything about Pakistan ever acquiring about Mig 19s. I am simply confused

@@asmitasinha6547 J-6 (or F-6 for export markets) was based on MiG-19. In fact, it was an almost unmodified copy. J-7 was based on early models of MiG-21. I usually call these Chinese versions MiG-19s because that's what they essentially are.

@@showtime112 Oh my mistake them😅. Anyway great video 😁

A typical biased Indian comment.

@@naherf385 can you say something like this never happened?

​@@naherf385 yeah, we can count on Pakistanis to give away an ubaised commentary, right mate?? 😂

Typical CHANKIA Indian mentality.

🖖. Baš me zanima znaš li što ovo znači...... 😉

Not possible with the current configuration. But you can become a Patreon supporter or donate to the channel so we can upgrade sooner.

Love the Su-7

It had limitations but it could still be used effectively in that era.

Yes. They had plenty in stock and R-3S which MiG-19 (and their Chinese versions) carried was a direct copy of AIM-9B Sidewinder. So, it probably wasn't too complicated.

It was done in 1969.

Don't you think that the right kind would have been chosen had it been available?

Hey, I'm not a shrink but it is pretty obvious that you have some issues. Who ever said they were Russian? Where exactly did you hear this? Let me guess, you just read the title. Video clearly says those fighters were purchased from China and they are in fact Chinese copies of MiG-19s with F6 Chinese export designation. Most people still call them MiG-19s because that's what they are. Now, my suggestion is that you attend whatever problems you have because they might get worse.

There's the email showtime112b@gmail.com. There's also Facebook and Instagram on the channel page.