Hi Justin, Love your show, especially when you have thoughtful, smart people like Alex on. I find his Real authentic searching and questioning, so much more convincing than your other guest. Not that I didnt find his comments interesting, I did, just not convincing in any way. I grew up in US as an evangelical, but I never did have an experience where I would consider that God revealed himself to me. I was saved as a young boy, but I didnt really ever have a experience so many talk about. It was more peer pressure now looking back on it and I did walk the walk as your guest suggested, for over 20 yrs but was never moved and finally I realized this wasnt for me. Thanks again for providing great content on your show. Mark
Of course this is the case, the whole concept of what life means is encased in the attribute of communication. So many words point to the greater truth of life. As in we can take like for granted, or we can recognise life is being granted to us. One meaning of tge word granted recognises truth the other denies the truth. When we recognise we are being granted or sponsored, we also see our re-sponse matters. Our ability to respond to being alive the right way. To be grateful for being alive. There are so many logical connections with words in every language that point to this higher spiritual connection to life, I know of many of these and happy to share.
It seems strange that there was no mention of the most important aspect: God's Word, his personal self-disclosure, rather merely personal experience and philosophy, which can be idols that God hates and rejects and so may thus refuse to play the game and show Himself on that basis, hence his so-called "hiddenness." The great Carl F. H. Henry's monumental six volume "God, Revelation and Authority" massively addresses this but in view of today's grossly illiterate incompetence few could even begin to deal with it, compared to which God's Word Himself is far easier to manage.
Theophilus of Antioch says "If you say 'show me your God' I would reply 'show me yourself and I will show you my God. Show then that the eyes of your soul are capable of seeing and the ears of your heart are able to hear."
I found it interesting that Alex compared finding God analogous to discovering his dad existed. Yes you can look at the 'scientific' arguments for him having a dad, and conclude one must exist. Or he could write a note or appear in person and say 'hey Im here'. For me, I became intellectually convinced that the resurrection of Jesus actually happened. But that still wasnt enough. It was only after I had an 'emotional' experience whereby I believe God was telling me everything Id read about Jesus over the previous few weeks was indeed true, that I committed. So I pray Father that Alex would indeed find you as you show yourself to him, as his Father.
Could it be that what you describe as an emotional experience, was actually a spiritual experience of receiving personal revelation from God on the truth about Jesus, therefore gaining insight and conviction?
Seemed like the original debate got sidetracked. This follow up discussion though really drilled into the bedrock of the hiddenness of God dilemma. Wish it was longer than 19 minutes.
ok, now what remains for me is a big "so what". Mostly I find myself thinking of Pascal. If I just half heartedly believe there's a God, is that enough for eternal bliss? What if I choose the wrong God, but pour my entire being into devoting my life to this, Heaven awaits?
What ever else God is, if He exists, He will likely be fair. Don’t worry about heaven or hell. Be true to ur conscience. When ur backs against the wall, when there is no where to turn, then turn to Him. And see what happens! The world has nothing to offer there except to take ones own life-that goes against our natural instincts.
I am a science person and do believe sincerely that God exist !! With respect to Alex I must say that it dont make a shred of difference what Alex thinks. If Alex wants to be a skeptic then that's his choice ! its very arrogant for someone to say that ""God doesn't exist"" !!
Is it also very arrogant to say that all the other Gods that have had sincere believers don’t exist? Or that faeries don’t exist? Surely the Christian God, if he existed, could not be the author of the confusion that exists about him. Most of what is known about him is not known with any real clarity. Sincere Christians have always had hugely different ideas about Him and how he expects believers to behave. The book he has provided looks very much like an imperfect product of human beings. Surely the Christian God could do a better job of making it clear who he is and what he wants. Christianity, when carefully examined, isn’t greatly more feasible than many other religions. That kind of hidden-ness is a serious argument against the Christian God’s existence. Belief without good evidence is the recipe for deception.
@@dmere123ify Hi David, you’ve raised some great questions, and rightly called into question the validity of the Christian religion over other religions, especially religions that have “sincere believers”. What if we were to start from scratch, by ruling out all religions, since they are all man-made and therefore imperfect. Then we can consider who is man, and what are we on about, and who is God, and what’s He on about, without any religion getting in the way. What would you say about that approach?
@@zhengfuukusheng9238 Atheism often occurs when a person is not properly disciplined as a child. He grows up believing he is his parents' and then God's equal resulting in a complete lack of proportion and perspective.
“Let alone the Judeo-Christian god”- that’s the rub! Christianity gets away with so much because his name is “God.” This muddied the conversation so much. I’m completely agnostic and open to the possibility of some deity out there. But to J-C god, I’m an assertive atheist. Christianity needs to stop riding on the coattails of an equivocation.
It has been shown that Paul was most likely a literary character, and as for Augustine was nobody cares any more that he was one of the biggest, if not THE biggest, sycophant(s) of the 4th/ 5th cent A veritable brown-noser, to an imaginary deity
No foto, no video....no proof. Beware snakeoil salespeople saying "see it really happened, although we can't prove it. You must buy it" Hahahaha Dismissed
Isn't being "moved" by an argument just a spidey sense about the legitimacy of the argument? The ontological argument, for example, screams bootstrapping trickery to me however smart the analysis. Similar things apply to other reasoned arguments.
The point being that the legitimacy of the argument stands or falls not on the logic itself but the legitimacy of the premises which are far more slippery.
@@gilesbbb I used that word because of my feeling that there is a sort of in-between state where one can find an argument to be compelling, yet that doesnt necessarily "truly" change their mind lol
in almost 20 years of being on line i have quietly listened to atheists who have become theists, theists who have become atheists, Christians who have converted to Islam & Muslims who have converted to Christianity, Jews who have become Christian & Christians who have embraced Judaism. i have listened to angry folk who imagine an angry god, intolerant folk who imagine an intolerant god, cruel folk who imagine a cruel god and loving folk who imagine a loving god - almost as if their God was just a reflection of themselves ..... and some good people who envisage no god at all. So tell me....what does this suggest to you? It’s suggests to me that the God who doesn’t exist conquers all in the end. So perhaps we should allow Theo to wallow in it’s hollow victory for a while, for such a victory is, after all, no victory at all.
Good post. My view is that humankind is spiritually evolving and that the Infinite Intelligence (God) will reveal him/her self only in the way that we can accept and integrate into our learning. That's why their is such difference. We don't see God as he is, but as we are in our journey at that time. Atheism is just as relevant as religion. How many Atheists are ex-religious people? Quite alot. They are moving beyond infantile conceptions. So the situation is dynamic. Humility is the most important virtue to cultivate in relation to this situation. I know how many times have I thought I now have the "absolute truth"....only to discover oh, I was wrong. I was an evangelical so know this well. Religion wants to box up God and have a formula that anyone can follow. Life is not like this. No one knows it all!
I think as Lucas pointed out, Alex’s journey maybe fruitful in ways that will only be known when the author walks on stage. It may also be that Alex’s sincere search is clearly noted by the Father and he is crediting him that. If He had made himself more real, then his reward is diminished. As Jesus said to Thomas, “blessed are those who have not seen and yet believed.” If there is a real God, His actions would be such that Alex will come out the best he could when its all said and done. And even if I wanted God not to exist, God will still make it so that I come out best as I could so that my punishment is the least. Anyway, too many conjectures, but... why He chooses to reveal himself to Paul and few others and not me, I do not know yet. But, if He is real, I think His plans for me are the best outcome I could have, despite my wretchedness. As CS Lewis states, when the author walks on the stage, every knee will bow, but that will not be the time for choosing; rather, that is the time we find which side we have chosen. Forgive the ramblings
Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:3 (KJV) "The word goes far beyond simple poverty. It described one forced to beg for the essentials of life. Jesus used this succinct statement to paint a picture of human spiritual destitution, and this is your situation whether you realize it or not. The one who does realize he or she is spiritually destitute before the Lord and approaches Him on the basis of the beggars seeking alms, will have inner contentedness, a rare commodity in these days." Ken Axelson "Thought For January 20th
Just 01.30 into the discussion I switched off. "The loving 'god' which Christianity describes". . Haven't these people read the Bible? Old Testament.... wars, murders, famines, pestilences, slavery, mass extinctions all 'caused'' or approved of by Yhwh. New Testament.....four separate accounts of a brutal human sacrifice and a prophesied future of fire, judgement, hell and death
If you can't believe in God it's not God's fault. It's absurd to put God and man in the same context and reveals a complete lack of imagination and perspective. "St. Augustine said that all of us, made from nothing, tend toward nothing. We can see this in our frailty and sin and mortality. St. Paul said, “What do you have that you did not receive? And if you received it, why do you boast as if it were not a gift?” To believe in God is to know these truths. To live them out is to live in the attitude of humility. Thomas Aquinas said humilitas veritas, meaning humility is truth. It is living out the deepest truth of things: God is God and we are not. Now, all of this sounds very clear when it’s stated in this abstract manner, but man is it hard to live out! In our fallen world, we forget so readily that we are creatures. We start to assume that we are gods, the center of the universe. The ego becomes a massive monkey on our backs, and it has to be fed and pampered constantly. What a liberation it is to let go of the ego! Do you see why humility is not a degradation, but an elevation?" Bishop Robert Barron ? "Daily Gospel Reflection (08/20/2022)"
I want to look at this a little bit again. "St. Augustine said that all of us, made from nothing, tend toward nothing. We can see this in our frailty and sin and mortality. St. Paul said, “What do you have that you did not receive? And if you received it, why do you boast as if it were not a gift?” All right. We are whatever God gave to us, if God is really there--and I tend to think He is in some sense, whether He perfectly matches what I believe or not. But assuming that God gives us everything, including our circumstances, our knowledge, our personalities, our likes and dislikes, strengths and weaknesses, and every single moment of our lives... and He has a plan for everything, every moment, every action, knows what it will be before it happens, and has everything planned out ultimately for a particular end... Plus no human being has a complete understanding, no one really knows what is good or evil in anything approaching a complete sense, and even the greatest saint has to struggle with sin nature and vastly imperfect understanding of even the most basic things in comparison to God... Given that we don't really even understand what we are doing or why, that it's difficult or impossible even to understand our own motivations... How is all of this our fault? To me, it seems like if there is any responsibility in this situation, it has to rest solely with God. God understands it all. God planned it all. To the extent that we have anything good or bad in us, it is primarily not some choice of our own, but a result of our situation and the things given us. I did not choose my good points or my bad points, nor do I understand them, nor did I plan for them, nor did I know where they were going. God chose them and understands them, and understands all of that stuff. How is it that I am more responsible and therefore damnable than the One who planned it all out in the first place?
If the Christian worldview was true that this creator exists and created you for a purpose of which you are guilty for ignoring and/or disobeying, what do you think would be reasonable for your creator to require of you? I'm not suggesting by implication that it should be complex philosophical argumentation, but just legitimately curious what requirements you think wouldn't be "insane" on that worldview?
@@minor00 I don’t think an infinite creator would care about humans. If there is a god it could have zero to do with the Bible or Jesus. The Christian god sounds like an insecure individual that demands admiration from its creation. But if a deity existed and created a purpose then each individual would be aware of this purpose and it wouldn’t be some subjective idea. I don’t think there is an actual purpose for human/sentient existence.
@@minor00 It would be objectively clear that this creator existed, and whatever intent/purpose it created us with we’d be aware of it. It wouldn’t be so challenging to seek purpose we’d know it objectively.
@@kennyehm2004 Sorry for the delay as I was out of town this weekend! But thanks for sharing your thoughts Kenny. I agree that if God exists, it's possible it has nothing to do with the bible or Jesus - although I see no reason why revealing yourself through the bible or Jesus would be odd. It would seem odd to me though that God would create so complex, vast, and diverse of a universe but not have any interest in it at all.
@@minor00 Hope you enjoyed yourself! It just doesn’t appear that there’s a creator involved in its creation. Like I think the laws that govern the universe I think refute the idea of a creator, whereas the theist believes that’s somewhat of a fine tuning argument. I think the theist making this move is unaware of how it’s limiting the source of infinity. One would think that these laws governing the universe could bend whenever god felt they needed to be modified for whatever reason without it impacting its favorite specie negatively. Like natural disasters would seem unnecessary. I think the Bible would have also been a far more incredible collection of text inspired by the source of infinity as well. Let’s get beyond that. The idea of a creator I think we would deviate is attributing this creator to the doctrine of the Bible. I’ll try to find some common ground. If one wants to say god is the thing that created the universe I don’t think people would object to that. We’d probably say sure, okay.
One of the greatest battles facing the Church today is overcoming the myth that belief in God is at odds with the discoveries of modern science. This perception runs counter to the experience of the Catholic tradition, which seeks to highlight the beautiful harmony between faith and science. Word on Fire is proud to present a new five-episode film series at the intersection of faith and science that was produced through a generous grant from the John Templeton Foundation.
Seems alot of philosophising, natural theologizing, intellectualising, psychologising etc etc leading to intellectual confusion because unless the Word of God infuses these discussions that leads to personal intimacy and relationship with God, we could just be going around in circles and only satisfying intellectual appetite and curiosity that is short lived
Do people have the right to what the prophets do not have the right ?Why didn't the prophets demand to see God and have more privileges Since they are closer to God in the matter of revelation?
This is unclear. Judeo-Christian god gave all kinds of demonstrations of his presence- water saturated offerings catching flame, golden fleeces, talking donkey, burning and talking bushes, showing his very self (even if he did have to hide his face). Perhaps you don’t know about these, or maybe I just misunderstand your comment.
@@BigIdeaSeeker Every God incarnates and is determined within a specific framework, place and time that is incompatible with the greatness of this universe.
@Valpurgis Glory be to the one who knows the absolute truths, he sees the atom as he sees the galaxy, his knowledge does not decrease in the darkness and does not increase in the light, so God forgive what your knowledge can of our sins
(i wrote this out in another comment to another video with the same guy first but just finished watching this one and it applies here too) I believe in God. I think certain interpretations of christianity are the best explanation of this "God". That said, there is NOTHING IN OUR UNIVERSE that points to a specific God, so "the problem of divine hiddenness" thing is a lot worse than most atheists make it out to be imo. Idk why this atheist guy in this video allows the focus of the conversation to stay on "moral arguments" because the bottomline is this: "most" Christian's interpretation of the bible is that the most important thing to believe in, in order to "be saved by Christ" is the belief in certain claims about "history and science", right? its not about "morality" at the core of it, right? like "morality" isn't the bottomline for most christians (including catholics), right? otherwise wouldn't their views on morality be synonymous with each others?? like all the same? but Christian morality seems to be anything but synonymous, right? So why focus on that in the first place? Here is the point tho, if we look at "the problem of divine hiddenness" in a purely "scientific and historical" view as it is in most Christian's perspective, which most Christians ARE in agreement on, then the "problem of divine hiddenness" gets much worst. Like we know the way our universe works. We know stuff about our universe thru "empirical evidence". Empirical evidence is how we divide "true" and "false" in what we KNOW about the universe we live in, right? So we know that if the God that created OUR universe and he wanted us to know who he is, he would tell us through empirical evidence, right? WHY ISN'T IT THAT SIMPLE? The "problem of divine hiddenness" isn't hidden morality, ITS FUCKING HIDDEN SCIENCE AND HISTORY!!!!!!!! THERE IS NOTHING IN THE UNIVERSE THAT POINTS TO THE BIBLE AS THE WORD OF GOD! why isn't THAT the focus of atheists????????? as a CHRISTIAN "skeptic" i can't agree with either side. evidence for God is to strong and the evidence for specific religion is too weak imo. at least right now. Right now i wonder if atheists are wrong about God. and I wonder if most christians are wrong about what it means to follow Jesus in the first place... Like what if the only point Jesus was tryna make was about morality in the first place? what if Jesus's point was the divinity of morality? but all the christians think its about science and history? and they just have the wrong interpretations of the bible? and what if it turns out that people like this atheist dude Alex is right? and it is all about matching your seemingly subjective view of morality up with God's objective morality? like what if it was about morality the whole time? and morality is God? doesn't the gospel of 1st John seem to point to that? is the belief in Jesus really all just about "science and history"? I want to debate Christians and Atheists
Christianity is not about science. It's not about the natural world. It's about the supernatural world. "Super", "Above", "Greater" How do Christians think it's about science and history?
God bless you all. I'm a Muslim but I study the Bible in order to know how Christians think and believe. I came across this video and I noticed that most of the comments are from people who love God and want to win the afterlife. That's why I want to leave this message here. We, Muslims, aren't very different from you. I want to tell you some facts about Islam that you probably have never heard of: The word 'Muslim' literally means 'submitted to God'. It's not a name, it's rather a description. The word 'Allah' literally means 'God' with a capital G. It simply refers to God, the One and Only. Actually Arab Christians use the same word to describe God. The word 'Islam' literally means the one religion that God sent all prophets preaching to. It doesn't mean the religion of Muhammad, but the religion of all prophets, from Adam to Muhammad, including Abraham, Moses, Jesus and a lot of prophets that were not mentioned by name in the Scriptures. The Quran is the same word of God since it was revealed more than 1400 years ago till this day and to the end of this world, this is historically and traditionally proved and you can search this. Word by word, letter by letter, sound by sound. We believe in Jesus, we believe that he was the Messiah, we believe that he was miraculously born from the virgin Mary without a father, we believe that he was a prophet, actually a major prophet, sent to the Children of Israel and he was rejected and prosecuted by them, we believe that God saved him from being killed by them and raised him to heaven. We also believe that he will come back in the end of times to judge people, especially Christians. We believe that when he comes back he will come to a big cross and break it, he will demand Christians to worship God alone, not Jesus or the trinity, or to be fought against. We believe that on the Day of Judgment, God will talk to Jesus in front of Christians and ask him, 'Have you told people to worship you or your mother?' and Jesus will reply, 'I told them only what You ordered me to say, that's to worship God alone, and I witnessed them when I was among them'. We don't deify any human at all, neither Jesus nor Muhammad. We believe that prophets are humans who were given the message of God by the Holy Spirit, which is an archangel, Gabriel, and some of them were aided by miracles. We believe in the Torah which was given to Moses and the Gospel which was given to Jesus, those are different to today's Old and New Testament, but they share some of the essence, mainly the worship of God alone and observing the Commandments, something which Christians actually don't do, while we do. There are several prophecies about Muhammad and his nation in the Old Testament, and more clearly there's Jesus's statement in John about the coming 'Paraclete' which was given several names in the several versions available, but I like the 'Paraclete'because it's the closest to the Greek one. Jesus stated clearly that the paraclete is a prophet that will come after him and will judge the nations and will fight against the disbelievers and that the islands will follow him. All this matches exactly how Muhammad was. The Quran and authentic Hadiths 'Sayings of Muhammad' contain too many prophecies about the future and especially the end of time, which I believe is imminent by the way, that a lot of them have already happened, and others are to happen. We believe that people of Scripture who know about Muhammad should follow him or they are deemed to hellfire because they actually refused what is stated in their own Scriptures. However, even if they did, Muslims must treat them with kindness and justice. Finally, we believe that people of the Scriptures who believe in Muhammad and follow him will have their reward in the afterlife doubled because they made more effort in searching for the truth than those who encountered Islam in their own environment. I sincerely invite you all to read the Bible and read the Quran and think about your future in an objective and unbiased way. I won't benefit anything from you if you become a Muslim. I won't be harmed if you don't. It's all about you and your situation in the afterlife. God bless you all.
@@colinblackie9654 Yes, not only I do believe it was corrupted. Biblical scholars themselves believe it was. Have you read "Introduction to the Bible" by Catherine Heyes? or "The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture" by Bart Ehrman ?
@@MShreefUK well here’s a thought for you why does the Quran tell me a Christian to judge the Quran by the bible, so it is obvious that your prophet believed we had the original teachings 500 years after the life of Jesus. Are you also aware that your Quran is not so perfectly preserved as you are led to believe the Caliph Uthman I believe gathered a great many unauthorised copies of the Quran and had them burned. It is well to attested to in your hadiths. A great many of your own Islamic scholars know about the many holes in the perfectly preserved narrative And if the bible is truly corrupted it would hardly contain prophecy of Mohammad not only in the Old Testament but in the New Testament as you so boldly claim.
@@colinblackie9654 No, friend, you misunderstand the Quran. The Quran talks about the original Torah and the Gospel of Jesus, not about the Bible. These scriptures were lost and some of the contents were kept by some scholars at that time, both Jews and Christians, mixed with a lot of man-made stories and misquotations. Actually, they knew this and a lot of them believed Muhammad and followed him because they already knew that the "Prophet" was about to come. The Prophet between brackets is the Prophet in John 1 and in Deuteronomy 18 In conclusion, the Bible contains some of the wisdom that was in the lost Torah and some of the wisdom in the lost Gospel. However, it also contains a lot of difference from the original. For historical evidence, you can refer to the earlier-mentioned books. God bless you, friend 🙂
@@MShreefUK I would urge you to listen to Bart Ehrmans comments concerning the flawed logic Muslims such as yourself use to claim that Muhammad is promised in the bible even he admits that the supposed corruption is in actual fact very minor many textual variations. May I also remind you that your prophet said if he was lying then God would strike him down by severing his Aorta and he died saying it felt like his aorta had been severed. And by the way I have read the Quran as I have my own copy of it, it is very clear about telling me that I should judge the Quran by the bible since Muhammad was very sure we had access to the original teachings, 1500 years ago. And I’m not surprised a few Jews and Christian’s converted to Islam I might too if someone held a sword to my throat.
If a loving and relationship seeking God exists, then nonresistant nonbelievers would not exist. Nonresistant nonbelievers like myself do exist. Therefore a loving and relationship seeking God does not exist.
@@colinloechel8378 it’s not about what he should be doing, it’s that people like me would not exist. I have dedicated my life to the pursuit of God and have nevertheless become a nonbeliever.
The bible suggests that there is an onus on us to recognise Christ from what is written about what he said and did. (See for example John 1:11,12 also John:5:39,40 plus Matthew 11:4-6 and John 10:27,28)
@@DIBBY40 Because it's not just a book. It's The Bible, The Word of God. You can dismiss it at your loss. If you're wise you will learn about it from what great men have written about it. Then you will read it and study it and decide whether it's worth believing. But maybe first you should do some soul searching and take a good honest look in your heart and see whether you like what you see. If you like what you see I suggest you haven't looked very hard. Somewhere you have been greatly misled, by possibly the failed education system, or your friends, or the current culture. Perhaps you weren't disciplined properly as a child.
@@DIBBY40 When I first started to read the bible I was fascinated by the character of Jesus Christ that comes through. He was not like some super hero we read of in man made fiction, but rather had a ring of truth and authenticity that seemed to perfectly merge the vulnerability of our humanity with the perfection of divinity in a way I could discern was not manufactured or contrived. It was like I could see myself in him but also knew that I fell far short and was not worthy to be compared with him. His very virtue was the secret of how God's power could be chanelled through him and I felt called to follow in his footsteps. It presented a very different alternative to self improvement since it was not about gaining personal power to achieve things through human effort, but rather dying to my own ambitions and giving God control instead. Being a conquering King is man's idea of glory, but becoming a suffering servant to save humanity from self destruction was God's idea...
“This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; But their heart is far from me.” Matthew 15:8 KJV “But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart.” 1 Samuel 16:7 KJV “For there is no faithfulness in their mouth; Their inward part is very wickedness; Their throat is an open sepulchre; They flatter with their tongue. Destroy thou them, O God; let them fall by their own counsels; Cast them out in the multitude of their transgressions; for they have rebelled against thee. But let all those that put their trust in thee rejoice: Let them ever shout for joy, because thou defendest them: let them also that love thy name be joyful in thee. For thou, LORD, wilt bless the righteous; With favour wilt thou compass him as with a shield.” Psalm 5:9-12 KJV
If anyone thinks the Bible is the "word of God", they need to read the below article from a critical Biblical scholar and spend some time reading the other articles on his website. "So for example, when we read carefully what Yahweh says in the book of Leviticus, namely that the Aaronids (the sons of Aaron only), are high priests contrary to the Levites, that they alone are Yahweh’s mediators and the Levites are reduced to mere ministers of the Aaronids, that only through sacrifice can one atone for sins and not confession as preached by the Levites, or more precisely the Levite’s Yahweh, etc., *it can be no coincidence that in these laws and commandments,* ***which are placed on the mouth of Yahweh,*** *that Yahweh himself is presented advocating and legitimating the very views and beliefs of the specific priestly guild writing the text, and, contrary to the views and beliefs of their rivals, the Levites and the Levite’s Yahweh!* We will examine this more closely when we get to the contradictions in these books. But in short, this was the function of ancient literature, and we are allowing these ancient texts to speak for themselves. *In this particular case, the Levites and Aaronids wrote specific texts that each advocated their religious beliefs, views, and their position as high priests* ***by writing these sentiments directly into the mouth of their god!*** But just studying the Bible alone, scientifically, affords us the occasion *to see that many of these so-called words of Yahweh are* ***actually the very words of the texts’ authors.*** When we see numerous texts employing this ancient literary technique, and moreover, ***presenting Yahweh as the spokesperson for their own views and agenda,*** *and* ***contrary*** *to Yahweh’s other words in other texts written by other authors employing the same technique,* how can one conclude otherwise. In other words, when in the composite text that we now call the Bible we find: Yahweh declaring that only Aaronids can officiate as his priests and Yahweh declaring that all Levites can officiate as high priest; Yahweh declaring that sin is atoned through confession and Yahweh declaring that sin is only expiated through the sacrificial cult, no exceptions; Yahweh declaring that he gave laws and commandments at Sinai and Yahweh declaring that he only gave the Ten Commandments at Sinai; Yahweh commanding to exterminate all the Canaanites without pity and Yahweh declaring to tolerate them and live in their midst; Yahweh declaring that the wilderness generation were disloyal and rebellious and Yahweh declaring that they were a paradigm of loyalty and faith; Yahweh declaring that he may be offered sacrifices at any altar and Yahweh declaring that there is only one altar where sacrifices are to be offered up; Yahweh declaring that the people saw him at Sinai and Yahweh declaring that they only heard his voice; Yahweh declaring that circumcision is an eternal covenant and keeping the land depends on observing this very commandment and Yahweh declaring the Mosaic laws as the covenant and keeping the land is dependent on keeping these laws; Yahweh declaring that he dwells in the midst of the people and Yahweh declaring that he only resides in heaven; Yahweh commanding Passover to be celebrated by all at Jerusalem and Yahweh commanding it to be celebrated at each person’s home; Yahweh commanding that animals for consumption must be ritually sacrificed and Yahweh commanding that they don’t have to be sacrificed ritually, etc. ***one must conclude that Yahweh is being used by these authors, each with their own contrary views and beliefs as a spokesperson for each of these authors’ agendas.*** These are all the personal, and competing, views, theological beliefs, and religious systems of our biblical authors. And this is only the tip of the iceberg." *"Studying the Bible"* - Dr Steven DiMattei *"Contradictions in the Bible | Identified verse by verse and explained using the most up-to-date scholarly information about the Bible, its texts, and the men who wrote them"* -- by Dr. Steven DiMattei
Atheism often occurs when a person is not properly disciplined as a child. He grows up believing he is his parents' and then God's equal resulting in a complete lack of proportion and perspective.
What a stupid comment. It would appear the more “disciplined” a Christian home is the more likely the children will deconvert to atheism. In fact, it’s perfectly correlated with intelligence as well.
_Atheism often occurs when a person is not properly disciplined as a child_ ....and yet, secular societies outscore religious ones in every single measure of wellbeing. In all surveys, time and time again, overwhelmingly. Crime, longevity, health, public services, corruption, educational attainment, wealth, happiness.....the lot. Interesting
The fact that you're posting this comment in almost every comment thread in this video tells a lot about your childhood. Were you abused by an atheist priest when you were a child? You look like you're about 80 years old in your videos - aren't you too old to spout provocative nonsense like this?
The hiddenness of God is a topic we have covered in the past and we will return to it. The topic of suffering too covers this too. If you want a popular level book written by a theologian I would check out this www.amazon.co.uk/Where-God-Suffering-Questioning-Faith/dp/1784982768
@@saraedric6850 c'mon Dude... you're not! once I was making enough profit from her services I started referring her to my siblings and family relations... You know how well good news travel Huh
If anyone thinks the Bible is the "word of God", they need to read the below article from a critical Biblical scholar and spend some time reading the other articles on his website. "So for example, when we read carefully what Yahweh says in the book of Leviticus, namely that the Aaronids (the sons of Aaron only), are high priests contrary to the Levites, that they alone are Yahweh’s mediators and the Levites are reduced to mere ministers of the Aaronids, that only through sacrifice can one atone for sins and not confession as preached by the Levites, or more precisely the Levite’s Yahweh, etc., *it can be no coincidence that in these laws and commandments,* ***which are placed on the mouth of Yahweh,*** *that Yahweh himself is presented advocating and legitimating the very views and beliefs of the specific priestly guild writing the text, and, contrary to the views and beliefs of their rivals, the Levites and the Levite’s Yahweh!* We will examine this more closely when we get to the contradictions in these books. But in short, this was the function of ancient literature, and we are allowing these ancient texts to speak for themselves. *In this particular case, the Levites and Aaronids wrote specific texts that each advocated their religious beliefs, views, and their position as high priests* ***by writing these sentiments directly into the mouth of their god!*** But just studying the Bible alone, scientifically, affords us the occasion *to see that many of these so-called words of Yahweh are* ***actually the very words of the texts’ authors.*** When we see numerous texts employing this ancient literary technique, and moreover, ***presenting Yahweh as the spokesperson for their own views and agenda,*** *and* ***contrary*** *to Yahweh’s other words in other texts written by other authors employing the same technique,* how can one conclude otherwise. In other words, when in the composite text that we now call the Bible we find: Yahweh declaring that only Aaronids can officiate as his priests and Yahweh declaring that all Levites can officiate as high priest; Yahweh declaring that sin is atoned through confession and Yahweh declaring that sin is only expiated through the sacrificial cult, no exceptions; Yahweh declaring that he gave laws and commandments at Sinai and Yahweh declaring that he only gave the Ten Commandments at Sinai; Yahweh commanding to exterminate all the Canaanites without pity and Yahweh declaring to tolerate them and live in their midst; Yahweh declaring that the wilderness generation were disloyal and rebellious and Yahweh declaring that they were a paradigm of loyalty and faith; Yahweh declaring that he may be offered sacrifices at any altar and Yahweh declaring that there is only one altar where sacrifices are to be offered up; Yahweh declaring that the people saw him at Sinai and Yahweh declaring that they only heard his voice; Yahweh declaring that circumcision is an eternal covenant and keeping the land depends on observing this very commandment and Yahweh declaring the Mosaic laws as the covenant and keeping the land is dependent on keeping these laws; Yahweh declaring that he dwells in the midst of the people and Yahweh declaring that he only resides in heaven; Yahweh commanding Passover to be celebrated by all at Jerusalem and Yahweh commanding it to be celebrated at each person’s home; Yahweh commanding that animals for consumption must be ritually sacrificed and Yahweh commanding that they don’t have to be sacrificed ritually, etc. ***one must conclude that Yahweh is being used by these authors, each with their own contrary views and beliefs as a spokesperson for each of these authors’ agendas.*** These are all the personal, and competing, views, theological beliefs, and religious systems of our biblical authors. And this is only the tip of the iceberg." *"Studying the Bible"* - Dr Steven DiMattei *"Contradictions in the Bible | Identified verse by verse and explained using the most up-to-date scholarly information about the Bible, its texts, and the men who wrote them"* -- by Dr. Steven DiMattei
Concerning the alleged hiddenness of Father Jehovah, Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit All Three in One and One and the Same Who Are the One and Only True Living God: I highly recommend an essay that CS Lewis wrote back in the 1960s called, "Finding Shakespeare," in which Lewis described God as like an author. To paraphrase Lewis, trying to find God in our world would be like Hamlet or Macbeth trying to find Shakespeare in their own world. In a sense Shakespeare is everywhere in such a world but is also nowhere, for Shakespeare is outside of that world, in much the same way that God is everywhere and nowhere in our world. Only when the author writes himself into the play can the world get to know the author of their reality, which is a point that JRR Tolkien said in his essay "On Fairy Stories," pointing out that Christianity was not just one more myth but was the reality in which all the myths were pointing to. It's kind of interesting that the very discussions or debates we have today have already been discussed or debated decades before. Jesus Christ Almighty God bless you all 😊
