Renault Zoe 6 Month Ownership Experience 

Thanks, I'm glad you found it useful. I do think the Zoe is a good buy secondhand at the moment - at least in the UK. In case it helps, the following are thoughts on buying secondhand on the UK market, which is where I have the experience. If you can afford it I would look for a ZE50 because it has a nicer cabin and is a bit quieter, as well. It also has the biggest battery/best range, if that is of interest. DC rapid charging is only available on the ZE50, and even then was optional on everything but the very newest of cars - I don't think it became standard until mid to late 2022. I think a car with rapid charging is likely to hold its resale value better than a car without, so I would also recommend considering that, even if you don't intend to rapid charge yourself. Renault seemed to have increased the whole car warranty to 5 years for the 2020 models and newer, so if you can reach that far then that might be nice to have. I think it was 3 years on older cars, so they will all have expired. However, the battery and drivetrain warranties still remain on some older cars; that is mostly 7 or 8 years I think. It is, of course, sensible to double check warranties for any specific car of interest. If you were to look for an older car then be aware that quite a lot of the older cars are battery lease, not battery owned. That may give you peace of mind as it's a perpetual battery warranty, but it's an additional monthly expense. Horses for courses. Originally it was cheaper to buy a car with a leased battery, but it doesn't seem to make all that much difference on the secondhand market at the moment. Battery owned were called 'i' models for a lot of the life of the Zoe. In the older cars, those with a model name beginning Q have the original motor, which makes the car capable of charging at 43kW AC. Those without Q designations can charge at a maximum of 22kW AC. In my experience, 43kW chargepoints are not all that common. As Modern Heroes said in his recent video, the new charge point legislation that is in consultation at the moment may impact the availability of rapid AC chargers. Indeed, I think this could affect the ones already installed, not just the installation of new ones. If anything 8kW or above are required to be retrofitted with card payment terminals - as seems to be the requirement in the current draft - I wonder if there is a reasonable chance that some chargepoint operators will just remove them rather than retrofit them; a retrofit might not be cost effective, at least on some models. I'll have a bit more detail on buying the Zoe secondhand in a future video, but that might still be 3 or 4 weeks away.

@@theelectrictransition Thanks for the great reply. It will probably be an older Zoe for use as a 2nd car.

5 m/kwh is fantastic! I'm slightly jealous. I tend to do a fair amount of high-speed driving, just because of the nature of my usage of the car, so hopefully that's the difference. I don't tend to do much city driving. Thanks for the information 👍

@@theelectrictransition I always drive with Eco mode on and not being in a hurry whilst driving might make the difference. I´m 60 now and my speedy ages are decades ago. 😁😇

Yes, it is interesting how even the humble Zoe - one of the more cost-effective EVs - can offer quite good performance. It's no Tesla or Rimac, but it's got a quick pick up when needed

I'm glad to hear that the videos are proving useful to you. Yes, the 22kW charging is a nice little trick that the ZOE brings to the party. It is pretty rare to get AC charging speeds this high, and is somewhat a legacy of the early cars only offering AC charging. The idea of using the motor as the inductor in the charging circuit was such a clever idea. Bravo Renault! I have started using 22kW AC charging on motorway stops if I only need a little top up, because of it being quite a bit cheaper, yet still fast enough in some circumstances.

Thanks. That's great news! I hope you both enjoy yours as much as I do mine.

No problem

Thanks very much, your feedback is most appreciated

Thank you 😊

Thanks. Yes, Zoe represent good, honest motoring, especially on the secondhand market at the moment. Well worth considering IMO

Thank you 😊

Yes, a good point, having real buttons is definitely a plus. There does seem to be at risk that we will no longer have that option in the future.

Thank you, I'm glad you think it's useful. But don't worry, I won't be put off by a little trollery! Nice to have you join me, it's much appreciated

Oh thanks, that's good to know. I'm not sure exactly what speed I was doing at the time, I might have been just below that threshold I suppose.

I agree that it is not intended for you to be hands-off and that you need to keep watching the road. However, the function you describe sounds like LDW - Lane Departure Warning, not LKA - Lane Keep Assist. The Zoe offers both. LDW is a warning device only, and LKA is supposed to actively steer to keep you in the lane lines on a well marked straight road, while you hold the wheel in case you need to take over at a moment's notice. However, LKA just isn't very good on the Zoe. It over-corrects every time it intervenes, making it ping-pong.

@@theelectrictransition The Lane Keep Assist works just fine with some rather huge limitations. It does not work in wintertime for two different reasons. Firstly, the front camera fogs up and does not clear up until 10 to 30 min of driving (and during that time the automatic headlight high/low beam does not work either). Secondly, it does not handle wide lanes, in those cases, it starts to behave like a drunk driver until you must take over or leave the road... On narrow roads it works so much better, but never trust it as it is basically unsafe. This behavior exists in all three settings of the lane keep assist. I assume that wide lanes do not exist in southern parts of France where the firmware was developed. The speed sign "recorder" can not handle high-placed speed signs (same camera). Also, it stores the position of the speed sign. If the road has a seasonal speed limit it will take at least 20 passes until it recognizes the new seasonal speed (I have not noted the exact number but it is ridiculous)...

Thanks! Yes, in my case, it certainly seems to be a bug - I think it's a problem with the map data. It seems to happen repeatedly in the same place. I'm glad you pressed on and got the car anyway. Enjoy.

It's a shame that your wife cannot get into her ideal driving position, but I suppose some subset of people were bound to suffer as a result of the lack of seat height adjustment. I am very glad to hear you are happy with the switch, however.

Yes, I agree. There are a lot of reasons to consider electric cars a step forward. How much quieter - calmer, as you say - the driving experience is can only really be appreciated once people have tried one. I'm glad you are enjoying your Zoe as much as I am.

I'm glad you are enjoying the Zoe. Your running costs are a bit higher than I would have expected, although I haven't calculated it myself. Have you got a time of use tariff to get cheaper overnight charging? I agree, the parcel shelf isn't the best quality, but I have been assuming that a lot of cars have moved towards something cheap like that.

@@theelectrictransition I'm still on a fixed deal for electricity so haven't switched to a timed tariff yet, when it runs out in October I'll change it (currently a standing charge of 21p/day and 23p/unit so I'd lose out if I changed early due to other electricity use). I've now resorted to keeping the parcel shelf in my shed ;) it's less stressful

Ah yes, I understand the problem of balancing the price of overnight electricity with that during the rest of the day. I didn't have a fixed price tariff so I had to ride out the high prices for a year, but the good news is that they have started to come down again now. I've just switched to Octopus Intelligent, on which the daytime rate is at the price cap, so that there is no penalty for the cheap electricity periods. I think they were forced to do that because of the Ovo Energy tariff - Charge Anytime - that first achieved the same feat.

Trick with the parcel shelf is to rotate one end towards the backseats before trying to pull it out.

Yes, I know what you mean about the cabin layout. I don't switch eco on and off all that much, so I haven't suffered from that one so far in this car - but I can imagine that being a problem. The eco button was by the gear selector on the earlier cars - but I didn't find that made it easy to find in the few hours I had to try one out, when I was getting a feel for of the features. It was easy to confuse it for the cruise control, which was also down by the gear selector - and definitely didn't seem like the best place. Manufacturers don't seem to like putting little shelves in the dash any more. I'm not sure if that is because it's more expensive to do so; it seems hard to believe that the dashboard has no free space behind it. Blimey, that braking issue sounds odd, I don't like the sound of that!

Thanks very much for your comment. I can't provide evidence for electricity prices decreasing yet, as it hasn't happened. However, what is fact is that wind and solar are now MUCH cheaper electricity generation sources than fossil fuels; they fell below fossil fuels for the first time about a year before the start of the war in Ukraine and are expected to remain that way. As we use more renewables we will also need more storage and that makes it less cheap, but that too should come down in price as uptake ramps. I provide a more detailed explanation on my reasoning in the second half of the video on running costs; here's a link: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-UI5ftaFibSU.html

Hmm, good question. Not a car I know well, I have to admit. I thought that the range of the Corsa was lower than the Zoe, by about 50 miles. However, ev-database.org seems to suggest that the Corsa is, in fact, slightly more efficient, so there might not be much in it. There also seems to be a new version with a slightly bigger battery, so that might help as well. Corsa is on a shared platform, if I remember, rather than a dedicated EV platform, and that can result in a few more compromises in interior space. However, it's a newer car and so probably won't suffer from the compromise in the rear seats we had in the Zoe, so they might be quite similar. Based on list prices, the Corsa is a bit more expensive, so that may be relevant. I'm not sure what deals are available on each, though. When I bought the Corsa was also more expensive secondhand, but I don't know about the current market. I'd say it's definitely worth a look. Maybe test drive both and see how you think they stack up. I'd love to hear how you get on.

I suppose this video by carwow was one of the things that made me think the range difference was bigger than ev-database suggests ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-wd2ArceiJd0.html

La Corsa e est davantage récente mais il est important de savoir quel quantité d'énergie conserve la batterie et sa vitesse de charge tout comme la consommation de la voiture.

Oh dear, that's a sad journey. I can imagine how hard things were back when you started though - range was very limited and the network very unreliable from what I understand, which would certainly both lead to a lot of charger anxiety. The range I have means that long journeys are easy, and the networks are still improving. The network is expanding really quickly at the moment, so we should be in a better and better position as time goes on. I do still have a petrol smart ForTwo, but I only use it for filming now, when I am doing comparison videos.

I don't know if it is possible to charge an EV without an EVSE - EV Supply Equipment. Even if it is, it isn't safe. An EVSE is a box that controls the supply of electricity to the car, which includes a circuit that implements the safety protocol. The simple handshake ensures the car is happy to accept charge. On a ZOE, that includes an earth check about which the ZOE is very particular. EVSEs are available with a CEE plug I think; here is one, for example (but I have no idea if it's any good) www.amazon.co.uk/Portable-Charging-Adjustable-Funtion-Waterproof-7-2KW-32A-Single-phase-Blue-CEE/dp/B0BQYDSJLZ This is a 32A plug, I think. If you need a 16A, then this is not for you. Like I say, I'm not recommending this unit because I know nothing about it. This is not something I have needed to do. Hopefully, this at least helps you identify what to research.

Use the force, Luke ...

Thank you 😊

I pay about £275 for my insurance, in one annual payment (therefore no interest payments are involved) I haven't had mine serviced yet. I think it's about £120/year on a service plan - so £360 for 3 years.

I do some cost comparisons in my first video, comparing it with my ICE smart ForTwo. Consider watching that for more on the running costs

That's an interesting point. I don't think I have seen it do that - but yes, it's certainly another potential source of incorrect information. Mostly it has been signs on side roads that have caught it out - plus the problem with the national speed limit sign that is only used in the UK.

Yes, absolutely. And so far, I've not found out how much the subscription is. I'm hoping not to feel used and abused by Renault - but I know that's a possibility.

The spike was caused by an increase in natural gas prices. That is a somewhat temporary market condition. Furthermore, as we bring ever more renewables online, the periods in which gas is the dominating price setter start to reduce. Next, because the price is actually dropping. The following is UK pricing. The cap was 34p at its peak, but dropped to 30p in July, and is dropping again to 27.35p in October. Finally, there are talks about changing the way the energy markets operate. At the moment, the bidding system determines the price every generator gets paid, which is often set by the gas generators. In the future, they want to exclude gas from the bid price to make it fairer to the end user. Renewables are really cheap, but we are paying a fortune for them because of the spike in wholesale gas prices. This last one isn't definite, but there seems to be a fairly good chance of it happening, as I understand it

Yes, it's an interesting point. There are a few differences I will cover, but it is an intruiging point. The Zoe would still have a couple of years of manufacturer warranty, as well as being a newer car. The latter might mean less rust, suspension, brake and tyre wear and so on. However, I don't know that the Leaf suffers rust or suspension issues particularly, so I'm not sure if those matter. The Zoe would have a bit more power; it looks like the Leaf might have been limited to 80Kw peak power, whereas the Zoe was 90, 110 or 135. The Leaf is a bit bigger, but not by much. For me, that's a disadvantage - but for others might be a huge advantage. Charging remains a bit of a limitation in the Leaf, however. The lack of thermal management is not ideal, and by the look of it, AC charging was limited to 3.3Kw by default. Furthermore, the DC rapid charging uses ChaDeMo - that is fairly well served at the moment, but is nonstandard, so would be a bit of a concern for me, in the long run. What would be interesting is the residual values; what would each be worth in a couple of years? I'm not sure.

@@theelectrictransition Noise levels, comfort? Is it big differences? Yes, the bigger car is better in my case.

Hmm, interesting. I've never heard anyone be concerned about that. I've not had a problem, despite a little soft-roading to get to a few filming locations. Do you know anyone who has suffered a problem?

@@theelectrictransition It is great you don't have problems. I might be wrong but it seems to me that Zoe ground clearance is lower than C3 or Sandero.

Yes, could be. I haven't tried to measure it. If I ground it I'll let you know!

Indeed!

Oh, that's strange. I'm 6'2", and I feel like there is plenty enough space for me - ample. There must be a difference in our leg to back length ratios. I'm sorry to hear you didn't like it. The good news is that there are plenty of other options - its just that they might not be quite such a bargain.

My original plan was to get a Kia Soul EV. That has plenty of headroom and height adjustment on the driver's seat. I wonder if that might suit you better?

@@theelectrictransition Ty fot the answer. I want a Tesla, but I can't afford it, I'm waiting for riches.

Yes, that's absolutely true. As ever though, there's more to the story than meets the eye. The car was rated as 5 stars in 2013, and explaining the new result warrants a video of its own.

Ha, yes, could be!

Thanks for the interaction. Every little helps. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

thedriven.io/2023/05/16/petrol-and-diesel-cars-20-times-more-likely-to-catch-fire-than-evs/

An interesting viewpoint. I suppose time will tell; I wonder if people will call being caught on the fossil fuel treadmill a con once they have escaped its grip

@@theelectrictransition I rest my face !!! 🤣

Your support is touching