@@Chic01taliano The difference is that private insurance costs about 10 times as much as social health insurance (because 'profit'). Plus, because of the massive clout from being effectively one huge customer the publicly funded version gets much better prices off pharm-tech. It's a no-brainer really. Here in the UK it's funded through direct taxation where quite honestly, the small cost is lost in the noise. (The same taxation also funds state pensions for all as well as other services such as fire, police and government generally).
How can you argue against healthcare? How can you argue against a society, where people are supporting each other? This seems to be some doctrinated egoism.
@@sttonep242 I think one of the biggest issues people have is that they disagree with the exact ways in which public money is spent. There is a great deal of waste that occurs in the UK’s National Health Service, not to mention that some healthcare services that should really be private expenses end up coming out of the public purse. I am not one of those people who believe that the NHS’s inefficiency means it should be torn down wholesale, but those are some of the reasons people who dislike the NHS use.
As someone who lives in a country with free healthcare, since we pay through our taxes, this topic absolutely disgusts me. To think someone can even suggest not having a system like that. It's no wonder America has such shitty living conditions.
Amen. Our totally disjointed hod podge of a healthcare system is a national disgrace. Beyond the over half a million Americans every year that have to declare bankruptcy due to medical bills, she all of the people that die or become disabled because they have no medical care at all, we have far worse health outcomes than other developed countries. a much higher rate of infant and maternal mortality, and lower life expectations. It's ridiculous that the wealthiest country in the world is failing it's citizens so badly.
Robbie is so fortunate to find himself in a 1st world country, intelligent enough, raised by the right parents, doing a job that pays enough to afford health and car insurance. For anyone less fortunate "to bad so sad". I'm sure Robbie (like most libertarians) thinks he has earned everything he has, he probably thinks luck, or circumstances not of his choosing has nothing to do with his socioeconomic status.
No they “earned it” by being born. Just like people born into poverty “earned” their lack of food, and opportunity for advancement. Also guys like him are very insecure and if you mention that healthcare shouldn’t be a luxury, he will take that as a personal attack. In fact that’s why healthcare is so expensive in this country. Guys like the caller will say “we’ve got the best healthcare in the world! Rich foreigners come here to get plastic surgery”. I can’t honestly pretend to have a conversation whose view on societal health is “most expensive = most bestest” and “what about the ER? It doesn’t cost anything”. Which as anyone whose lived in a working class society knows isn’t true. People just don’t pay when they’re billed. The can’t afford to pay for thousands of dollars to get a limb set into a cast. So they just let it go to collections which means taxpayers foot the Bill, but private collections make a profit off of your suffering. Which I’ve been told is a good thing and, me and all the dumb Southerners who work for a living are just too dumb to understand how it’s a good thing to be indebted against you will. But now these are same spoiled brats that think Twitter should be a government utility. Not because it does anything of value, but because they like to hurl insults, and attack random people, and sometimes kids for their own entertainment. So the government is going to stop them from being blocked when they hurl racial insults at the families of murder victims. That’s what “free speech” means to the children who inhabit this country.
He was born in a first world country because you can tell by his accent. Why the hell did he leave the first world for the shithole country he now lives in?
You can't help but feel sorry for these people living in a third world banana republic with a propaganda machine that constantly tells them how superior and privileged they are.
Well it’s not actually free, it’s free at the point of use. Quite why Americans are so willing to pay 50% more for healthcare on the ‘principle’ that preventing poor people from access is somehow worth paying more for.
@@loki6626 because we ARE a superpower, or at least think we are. Dump all the money into a wartime military sense the start of the cold war and never back off. Get the mindset that our might makes us right and there can't be a better way cuz we are number 1. When you spend so long believing your own propaganda it makes people deathly afraid of any change.
@@loki6626 would rather have a parliamentary system. As it is now 30% of the people hold over 50% of the voting power. We really need to just do away with our Senate and completely overhaul the Supreme Court. Probably do away with the presidency as well. Enlightened founding fathers my ass!
@@MrStalingonzalez Well...I don't know what your definition of stupidity is but not understanding the basic of sharing is as stupid as they come, to me.
Hey Rob, remember the last time when you paid the police to protect just you ? Yeah, if it were like you said I would have said "good luck getting the police to save you from crime.".
The more selfish he appears, the better chance of someone or more people turning to atheism. Think of the listeners still battling deconversion or teetering on the fence regarding non-belief who after hearing him start thinking, "F religion!!!" lol
Robbie is way beyond that. Even the most selfish person can still recognize that what benefits the group will benefit him too, eventually. He's a "I got mind and f$%$ you" kind of person. This kind of people are the most likely to die first in a group.
The same people who loathe their taxes being spent on services for other people never seem to mention the fire department, police, military etc. Weird....
Not sure about that. Even if we know there's a minority of assholes that wouldn't want to pay it still think its way of funding it is immoral. "Don't want to pay? You don't get that service." is more moral than "Don't want to pay? I'm sorry but that's not an option." The latter sounds more like the mafia...
@John Wood socialised means forcing which is not moral in my books. People shouldn't be assholes but we shouldn't use force against someone just for being selfish.
Yyyyup. If rights were inherent and unalienable, then why did it need to be written down? Why was there a war to enstate these rights? Why are their other places on earth where people dont have these rights? Why would need a government to protect these rights?
If he wants to pay for his own health will he pay for his own firefighters who come to save him from his burning house, or police to save him from the murder, or army to protect his health from an attack? This guy must be loaded.
Succesful people like to marry other succesful people and leave their inheritances to their children. This one of the main reasons why everywhere in history when an unrestrained free-market has appeared, it has lead to aristocratic feudalism in a few generations. The only difference is that nowdays the ones at the top are called CEOs, board-members, investors etc. instead of counts, dukes, barons etc. Current US healthcare-system seems like the private fire-departments of old. If you have seen Gangs of New York, you know the scene
Hold on a second. CEOs from big companies are in a position of power because they earned it with their competence or great ideas. Barons and dukes inherited the title regardless of their actual capabilitiy. I'm not saying the Zuckerberg's son will be a third class citizen, but if he doesn't show competence in his work he won't be rewarded. Dukes and barons were there for their loyalty to the king, not for competence.
@@divxxx Inheritance is more broad term than just "after death". Getting to IVY-league school is mostly based on money. And while those schools do employ best staff, other benefits are the connections you make with other future-bigwigs and of course the doors that open when you have that school in your CV. Rich parents also allow their children to for example take unpaid-internships in good companies which is not possible for students who need pay the rent themselves. I agree that my metaphor is not completely perfect, but the ancestors of Barons and Dukes were self-made men and some lines just went to become Kings while subjugating others and demanding loyalty. Kind of how mergers happen nowdays. Except without swords.
@@ilesalmo7724 I agree with you that rich people have advantages in terms of social connections that most people don't have. Moreover they can afford formative experiences that most people can't. That's why I firmly believe that taxation should be progressive and that inheritance should be taxed. At the end of the day, however, we can't complain if some people just happen to be born in rich environment... There are also disadvantages at being rich, for example you are not ready to be poor in case it happens to you. Have you ever seen rich people lose all their wealth? They are desperate. I'm happy to have lived in a medium-poor family, so I have learned all the values of sparing money and not wasting anything. I'm from Italy, my situation might be different from the US, however growing up with certain wealth-related values helped.
@@divxxx you don't know that many CEOs. A lot get so far in companies, sometimes through intelligence or hard work or connections. After that, a lot jump around from company to company. I've seen some right shrubs who simply can't hack it.
What's repeatedly overlooked with socialised health care is that fewer man hours are lost to illness, maximising productivity. There is also the fact that if people have ready access to health care, they won't wait as long before seeking treatment, therefore won't get as ill, costing less for treatment, and minimising lost productivity again
It’s pretty frustrating, as an Australian, to listen to an Australian complaining about ‘socialised healthcare’, given how excellent Medicare is in Australia.*. I, for one, would not want an American healthcare system in any way, shape or form in Australia. *I understand mileage may vary. I’m just talking in general.
@@thatguyrich9822 You’re right. That’s why I love living in a country with less people equals less crazy people as well. Everything safe and sound here.
@@WDRhine Thanks for helping me out W.D. So, my insurance company has not had to pay out any of those claims for me. So where's the money I've put in for all my premiums? Can I get that money back?
@@tugboat2030 Your premiums pay for the contractural obligation of the insurer to pay specific claims during the period of your coverage, not for the payments themselves. If you had paid $500 in premiums but filed a valid claim for $10,000 the insurance company wouldn't get to demand more money from you. I suspect your sarcasm isn't working.
@@WDRhine Well, I haven't had a claim of $10,000 so let's use another name, say Robby. If Robby pays a total of $500 in premiums but gets a payout of $10,000, where did the $9,500 extra dollars come from?
THE BOOK OF RICKY. (part 1.) One night after a big bang, I realised my true calling after the words, “Oh god” were uttered to me several times. I decided I was ready to invent the world. This all happened on a cold and dark night 14 billion years ago. Known as a notorious procrastinator, I spent 9 1/2 billion years practising cosmic basketball with the stars and planets. It was time I decided, to invent something. I couldn’t do this in the dark, so I invented some light using huge candles. Having seen the light, I thought making a sky would be a cool idea, (don’t ask me what all those planets were in, we don’t want to spoil the story.) as well as an atmosphere full of wild weather formations like cyclones and tornadoes etc. I had some plasticine left over from making all the planets, so I decided to create Earth. It was a huge task especially inventing fault lines and tectonic plates to cause earthquakes and tsunamis in order to minimise the population of the future. I needed to get a bit of a tan, (don’t ask me where from please) so I laid around for about 3 1/2 billion years before deciding it was time to make some living things. So a billion years ago I made a comb jelly, and half a billion years later I made some pond scum, like moss on a rock. (Oh no, not the moist rock) anyway a few cells tried to eat each other, but spewed each other out causing plants and animals to come into being. I made sea animals and trilo bites otherwise known as sweet candy for the dinosaurs to eat, the creatures I invented 65 million years ago. Having noticed that a couple of female dinosaurs were smitten with each other, I decided to call that species the licolotopus. Unfortunately one of my comets fell from the sky and wiped out all my lovely dinosaurs. 5 million years later my ocean dinosaurs became extinct. Not willing to give up I created giant penguins the size of humans which I hadn’t invented yet. Then there were giant Sloths, Sharks, and dragonflies with 3 feet wing spans. (To be continued, unlike the other guy I got fatigued halfway through all this.)
@@yabutmaybenot.6433 . I was actually on a railway station and there was a bunch of schoolgirls about 12 years old. I overheard one of them say, “What do you call a lesbian dinosaur?” A licolotopus.
Exactly, and you don't even have to leave society. If someone doesn't want to be part of the group they can just leave and go live on the streets or whatever. People who live on the streets don't have to pay taxes.
@@bloosart Only if that land is some how owned by the government. We had an aunt in Colombia Mississippi who lived off grid and didn’t pay taxes. She lived the way her parents and grandparents did. My family property was acquired before there was much of a state government, and used to just be swamp land. It wasn’t until 2018 we were forced to hook in to the city’s water and power system.
He wants the benefits of the group but doesn't want to pay for it. He's too stupid to even understand that. Some one smart please help U.S educational system 'cause god aint's doing shit.
One of the silliest ideas that has taken root in recent years is the assertion that private industry is necessarily more efficient than government. I've worked in both the public and private sectors and the key factor that determines the level of bureaucracy and inefficiency is the size of the organisation, not which sector it happens to operate under.
A few years back. Congress had to pass a law limiting American health insurance companies to "only" take 20% of premiums for overhead. On the other hand, Medicare operates on a 2% overhead rate, even though they have to promptly process millions of claims every single month. . Starting with Republican President George W. Bush, Medicare has been partially privatized, moving towards the Republican dream of fully privatizing the whole system, to benefit their campaign donors. The privatization, Medicare Advantage, is draining hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars into the pockets of private insurance companies. It's called "Medicare" Advantage, but it is actually private insurance that is being funded by our Medicare taxes, and it costs US citizens far more per capita than regular Medicare does.
Prehistoric cave paintings depict the communal hunt, which does suggest they had civil society without Abrahamic religion. The morality in religion was most likely taken from this rather than the other way round. Religious text often have a wild mash of amorality, morality and immortality by modern standards so can’t be considered a reliable reference for morality.
The idea that anyone gets their moral compass from a book that glorifies pregnant women being murdered and young girls being sold as property is asinine.
"Natural law is not a feature superimposed by some agency on an otherwise "chaotic" world; there is no possibility of such chaos". -Leonard Peikoff-Objectivist
The end of this guys rants about the necessity of roads reminds me of something that occurred in a parking lot between me and another guy. I’m about to turn in to a space in the front row and a guy tries to wave me off then moves. I pull in and he’s standing next to the back of my truck. When I get out I said “can I help you?” And he responded that he wanted to make sure I didn’t hit his car “because it cost half a million dollars”. I looked at the guy and said if it cost so much then he should have his own roads and parking lots built so he doesn’t have to share the roads with the rest of us. I walked to the front door, turned around and he was driving away. I’ll bet he was trying to awe me by telling me how much money it cost. Backfired on him.
In Portugal we have a system of "socialist" healthcare were at the minimum you pay 11% for social security. This pays for your retirement and the healthcare that you need. For example, if I have a health problem I only have to pay 5€ for a consultation. We all pay so that the poorest can have access to the same healthcare as a richer person. In Portugal there's not a free healthcare system, but you pay according to your income. And I think that's fair. If you're a minor your healthcare is free, just today I went to the hospital because of my daughter and I payed nothing for the consultation with the doctor. Why should someone be bankrupt because of an health issue? While there's people like this caller in the world there will always be inequality between the poorest and the richest.
Matt says the 9 to 1 example is hyperbolic, we have a real example in The James Town Colony of a failed experiment that Matt favors. They had to change to a work or fail system in order to succeed.
What about the fact that the minimum wage is ⅓ of the cost of living? Who benefit from that? If you're on an island and you hire people to do work for you. Should they not also be paid a reasonable liveable wages?
There’s no “society” to guys like these. There’s just him, anything done that doesn’t benefit him is wrong. He even said it’s an attack on him to use his tax dollars for something he doesn’t like. Well just pretend they’re using someone else’s taxes. I don’t want a single cent of my tax dollars going towards war, or political salaries. Therefore both of those things are an attack against me. I love that these are the same guys that claim to be the “moral majority” and act like they give a shit about the country.
oh and I agree that the community provides the rights to the community as a whole, to all persons in the community regardless of race, religion, sexual preference or lack of belief in any religion at all.
7:57 Robby is confusing here the _needs_ of the many outweigh the few with simply the "wants" of the many. Just because a group wants something doesn't mean this should override an individual's freedoms. However a collection and shared inventory of needs is ultimately vital, for the long-term survival of a society. Whether that is between 10 people or 10 billion.
Ah, he's fallen for the lie that private enterprise is always better and every example he gave proves him wrong. The US healthcare system is demonstrably worse than other countries and it is specifically because of the private nature of the US healthcare system. FedEx and UPS are more expensive and don't cover the entire country. In fact, they both use the USPS to deliver the last mile for remote locations that they don't consider profitable. Indeed, he doesn't understand how health insurance works. Hint: Not everybody needs car insurance because not everybody has a car. Everybody, however, has health.
These people do not see the failures of this system? How about the fact that when those who have the most are threatened to lose it all based upon their mishandling of it, and those who have the least are bailing them out? Meanwhile when they are on top again they claim they've worked so hard to get there and you should too 🤔
The caller sounds like an Austrian who is old enough to have inevitably benefitted from universal health care many times in his life. The odd thing about Australia is it is conservative christian politicians who implemented the largest middle class welfare in Aussie history and it is conservatives who rake in the welfare and make the most of universal health care.
It always seems to surprise me--and I really don't know why--that people try to give private insurance and free market health care as the reason for better health care in general. It that is a faulty equivalence. Most research is done outside of private practice where most, or least some, of the funding is through government grants. Private practice only implements the knowledge gained through research. Most private practitioners are not supposed to use private patients as lab rats. Now a rich country would be expected to have some of the best health care available because they put a lot of tax dollars into funding research that then makes it's way into the medical practice. Also, America allows outsiders to access our systems, whereas not all other countries do.
I disagree with taxes being misused. We all should. Our Government just sent our biggest bombers back to Afghanistan on our dime. And not a peep from the mainstream.
Listening to a selfish greedy person argue on behave of their own selfishness and greed is really gross . He would willingly let other people suffer or die . Rather then pay the taxes that would save the many people that can't afford care . The same people that help him live such a charmed life . Like waitress lawn care works garbage men and laborers etc..... . Without the people who don't have access to health care in our society he couldn't live in his own selfish luxury .
If only the ACA actually was a single payer socialized program instead of the convoluted nonsense giveaway to the private healthcare insurers that it was.
I live in the UK. Our NHS is available to all regardless of their actual financial contribution to it through taxes. "Free at the point of need". It's not perfect but it works and has done fairly well for 73 years. I have benefited many times, sometimes at great cost, and don't have to live in constant fear as to whether or not I am able to pay for healthcare up front. Does this inevitably result in a socialist government? No! The caller who sounded Australian should have presented a more intelligent argument.
I so wish we had a system like that here. I put off random numbness in my arm for weeks because of the cost of seeing a doctor (ended up being a pinched nerve, nothing major). But I also have really bad knee and hip problems, that I know are going to cost thousands of dollars out of pocket, even with insurance, I have to put those off. And unfortunately this also will lead to longer recovery time when it does get to the point where I have to see a doctor on them.
Every now and then, when watching a very old call like this one, I'd like to know what became of the caller. This one didn't even seem stupid (just wrong), so there may be hope he changed his worldview, even though his cocksure attitude would speak against such a secular miracle. If he changed his views, I just do hope it hasn't been because of a personal tragedy that could have been relieved by public health care...
You dont pay you dont benefit from that. I agree that people that dont want to pay common healthcare to dont pay but not benefit from that. Dont wanna pay for keep the roads well, you cannot benefit from that road unless you pay and much more to use that road. All the same for all.
Sorry about Robbi. Love from Australia. We have arseholes too. Also sorry for the Aussies who do not feel compelled to apologise for Robbi. As I said, we have arseholes too... "Assholes". Whatever. 😆
Looking at this from 2021. We have to have one payer medical plan. We need the government to take the reins of the USPS. The pandemic is opening many people's eyes that pulling together is way better.
What a rude guy. He knows so much and claims that his view is correct even if the hosts say they disagree. He dont know how a system works. How govt works.
this is a stupid argument, even the richest people in the world do not own a hospital just for themselves. Healthcare is a community effort whether it be by insurance or as other countries have by a small tax on income. Robby doesnt come to you to pay for the roads he drives on or the public transport he takes. Governments have a social contract with the people.
It’s not “your” money unless you grow it, produce it, and sell it completely off the grid in the wilderness without benefit of police or fire department. Otherwise it’s up to the society to decide how much of it is yours (taxes). You use the infrastructure that we all pay for. The profit is not all yours.
How does anyone want to protect their rights to property from being forcibly being taken when they’ve forcibly taken the property of the indigenous population. Seems as thought it was okay to do to others, but don’t you dare do it to me, that’s unfair! 😭
Robby is talking bullshit. The health system in the USA is disgusting, inefficient. The UK NHS is excellent and anyone who knows both the US and UK system would select the NHS or any European model over the US system. He is too stupid to realise that "property" especially personal property is a group agreed concept and not a right. If the group wishes to not acknowledge that you are the owner of your property then that can be removed easily. (Note what happened to the native Americans and their rights to property). He also does not understand the concept of money either. It is promise to exchange your work for someone else's. If those others do not wish to perform that exchange your money has no value.,
For me to get on board with a taxpayer funded healthcare system, they're going to have to pass tax reform so that people who spend their money on harmful things like cigarettes, alcohol, junk food, etc bear a tax burden equal to their burden on the healthcare system.
I’m a smoker, a drinker and a junk food eater and I guarantee I could work circles around you. I work harder in a week than most people do in a year. All of my grandparents lived to be 80. I have one grandpa left and he’s 89. All of them were drinkers and smokers. I wouldn’t ask people to pay more for health care simply because I won the genetic lottery.
" What is the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US ? " Failure to plan ahead.....one of the major aspects of which is YOUR OWN health insurance. Matt didn't lose "all" his gullibility when he dumped the religious myth. This clip is the best, in a while, illustration that even "smart" folks can abandon all logic when their agenda is attacked.
And if private health insurance is too expensive for a person to afford in a particular situation what then? For people who's employer's don't provide that?
@@majoroz4876 oh work harder? It's just that easy yea? Well shit you're a fucking genius why doesn't everyone just do that. Single parents raising kids? Fuck it just flip your life around and get a better job. Recovering addicts trying to better themselves? Fuck it just work harder. Your viewpoint is stupid and selfish af. You ignore any possible context of why someone may not be able to just increase their income as easily as you're making it seem. All for what? Because you're against a few dollars more of tax that can legitimately help people in tough spots. Fuck outta here my guy
There is not 1 single atheist volunteer group or organisation that is established to support the community in this secular western country. Not 1. The only atheist organisations they have here are meet up hook up drink up drug up or indoctrinate into atheism, organisations. None that actually assist the community in any way shape or form. On the other hand we have many many religious organisations specifically designed to help the community and it comes with many volunteers. Atheists only know how to benifits from the religious. But being the ungrateful people atheists are, they deny the fact that all the benifits can mean from religion and religion alone.
I have a question. if a person believes in no God, and a person that does, regardless of a particular religion in question. for the atheist in this particular paragraph, to realise an intelligent designer has to be true, due to significant evidence based on common sense views, and evidence provided by people like Dr Steven Meyer for e.g, then even though the question is: of which came first, the chicken or the egg? something created from nothing. I am reluctant to reveal this right now at this particular time. what is the views of the atheist regarding my comments here. thank you kind regards Alexander
I'm guessing - hoping? - that English isn't your first language. Regardless, I have no idea what your question is. There isn't even a sentence that ends with a question mark. Could you try to simply ask your question? I'll try to simply answer it.
Many of the legal framework in western law is based upon Christian concepts. We shouldn’t be so quick as to disregard this. Religious rules evolved over thousands of years to help ensure the survival of the species.
Suppose you're right. You're not, but let's suppose. Where did all the similar laws come from prior to Christianity in the "West" and everywhere else in the world that had not been exposed to Christianity? Seems to me like the "Christian concepts" aren't a necessary condition. Whew we haven't even gotten to the possibility that those "Christian concepts" were likely just adopted INTO Christianity by the people already practicing those concepts.
