I like his approach and much of this seems true. However, it seems like he presents only a fraction of the tools we need to find truth. His principles, although important, will only help one deal with paradox and then stay in any given religion. The principles aren’t equipped to identify if you should stay. They won’t expose a false religion, only confirm where you are. So, if I was a Scientologist or JW, I could claim these same principles and deal with paradox and stay. I wouldn’t be equipped with the tools to find out that where I’m standing is or may be wrong. Truth will include paradox. Fair enough. But so will falsehoods. So, once I’m okay with paradox, I still need to know if the church is true. Do prophets deserve my trust? Does it represent God’s will? Is God’s authority present here? I’m still left with the hard stuff.
This may sound really crazy but as a physical therapist it reminds me of the relationship between strength and weakness. Some people think it's just a matter of strengthening one area as opposed to another but the problem is that we may develop an imbalance. Strong muscles can also be too inflexible and really flexible areas can often be too weak. Finding the balance and training both sides in opposite ways at the same time is what creates equilibrium in a muscle system. Thank you for teaching me in the ways you have today.
Wish you were in Idaho I can’t get doctors and PT to Focus on my Psoas muscle all they want to do is focus on a old back injury and I’ve been suffering now for five years.
What a good comparison!!! Very insightful! If we all knew how to treat physical issues with the training you have had, I can imagine how those applications could be utilized for faith issues.
I cannot get enough of your explanation on proving contraries. It will forever be a grounding and foundational truth in my testimony of Jesus Christ and his gospel as taught in the Book of Mormon AND The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Thanks again as always, Jared for your time and effort and your firm testimony of Christ and His gospel. Would it later be said that you were saved to be born in a time such as this that your light would shine so brightly that others would see and follow it to the Light which is in Christ? You are doing such a great work brother!
At 1:27 talking about light/dark...I think the issue "unbelievers" are having is that the issues have been ignored, hidden, lied about and then when people have questioned, they have been shamed for doing so. I sit with people in my clinical work who have experienced deep spiritual abuse due to so many of our dysfunctional cultural practices and evolving doctrines. Let's stop having vague feel-good talks and instead acknowledge directly what's being wrestled with. That will go farther to regain trust of our membership than what is currently happening.
Arianna, THANK YOU!! I am one of those members who spent half my life serving the church and being a true believer. Then I noticed a few contradictions between what past prophets said was doctrine and what the current prophet was saying/doing. I brought it up with my bishop and stake president, who both acted like there was no contradiction and gave me vapid and unsatisfying counsel, such as "you should pray and fast about it" and I would respond with, "we have a living prophet today who has changed the churches position from what past prophets have said is doctrine, why can't he just explain the change and why the change? Why is the church pretending like they haven't changed their position on what was once doctrine??". So I wrote a letter to the Brethren and asked my stake president to forward it to them. Eventually I get a response back that was supposedly from the church Correlation department. There the response attempted to re-interpret President Kimball's words and past statements that I cited in my letter. I knew they were making up "what Kimball meant" in their response because I had studied every word kimball said on the subject and what they were asserting is NOT nor was it EVER Kimball's position. To say the least, knowing when you are being lied to changes your perspective and how you view the church. I then looked into the church history and learned that "lying for the lord" was a common theme and whitewashing historical events to make the church look better was also a regular thing. Once you learn the church leaders have little integrity, it is hard to give them credibility.
@@nickdipaolofan5948 I'm so sorry this happened for you, but please know that this is a HUGELY growing issue that is being covered up and ignored. People are leaving in droves. There is a serious lack of accountability, gas lighting, and flat out lying, like you said. I have read so many biographies over the years of various LDS leaders, prophets, BYU professors, etc that have left me devastated by what goes on in making "doctrinal" decisions. I call BS. Being on this journey of waking up is hard. Please know that you're not alone even though it can feel that way, especially when those you trust can't support you.
@@ariannarees6216 Thank you. Yes I think that a lot of people like me are realizing that the church has been dishonest with us and that the church was not acting in good faith when teaching us the history. Like you stated in your original comment, it is adding salt to the wound when you ask church leaders about it and all you get is gaslighting and then punishment if you don't accept the lies you are told. At the time the response came to my letter, I was the Gospel Doctrine Teacher. I expressed that the response was not being honest and I thought it was insulting that they were trying to be so deceptive. Almost immediately they released me from my calling and LIED about why they were releasing me al of a sudden.......It is amazing how fast they will turn on you if you don't tow the line. I am still active until my wife is ready to leave but I am open about my skepticism of the church claims.
There is no substance to this. You can even answer the questions. Typical of all apologists. Talk and talk about nothing and never actually answer anything
What an incredible talk. Thank you so much Brother Halverson for your years of study and dedication. I truly believe your long career to understand the gospel so deeply was necessary for the Lord to communicate through you a complicated but true subject. I'm very disappointed there isn't a book on the topic of proving contraries as explained by you. I hope you are able to find the means to provide such a book.
40 years ago I broke my soul and brain ALONE trying to figure this out as a new (from Protestant) convert. I'm crying hearing 40 years later someone succinctly explaining what my new convert "all or nothing" brain couldn't understand. I can do both NOW and spend my time helping others. Thanks, sir.
I have been working hand in hand with my Bishop and EQ President to open up a space in our ward to have these types of conversations. On Sunday we “stress tested” our quorum, based on Elder Renlund’s talk. It was hard… VERY hard. But in our stake our motto is “we can do hard things”, so we’re okay with that. A member of my quorum sent me this video today… I feel grateful to know that other groups of Saints are open to having the hard conversations, too. God bless you all as we try to navigate these perilous times as individuals AND congregations.
Thank you to all who made the viewing of the wonderful devotional possible. From a little group in the South West of Western Australia where we are just a handful and never have the opportunity to hear such wonderful discussions. So grateful for Bro Halverson and his Unshaken series. Love it all
Brother Halverson, Can't thank you enough for your wonderful insights and ability to clarify complex topics. As always, your testimony, your love, your encouragement, and your knowledge all shine through. Thanks for ALL you do to help the rest of us. And I pray that God will bless you and your family with the things they most need and that you will feel His blessings raining down on you. We sure appreciate your many sacrifices you make to help others. Your videos and priceless.
Brother Halverson, please create a lesson on this material...proving contraries...all 3 hours of it. This information is so needed and critical to help people understand what's going on when they or others are struggling with their faith. This is such good information!!! Thank you for putting into words and concepts the faith crises dilemma and the solution to balance those issues. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! You are an amazing thinker and sharer and I really don't think you are as insensitive as you portray yourself to be. If you were, you wouldn't care about helping people through their problems. Who do ya think your foolin? 😲🤔😁 Hope you're feeling better now. You were a little under the weather a couple of days ago and I hope that's behind you now. Looking forward to your next Unshaken Saints lesson next week! Take care and be blessed!!! 😘
This whole concept is eye, brain and heart opening…how do I learn to become a unicyclist on a tight rope now🤷🏾♀️I love Brother Halverson’s talks❤️for so many reasons.
Do members have to call it "The One TRUE Church". Wouldn't it be more accurate to call it "The Kingdom of God on Earth"? The reason I say that is because when members look into the history of the church and find controversial problems they don't point to just the person but it gets tied to the Church that no longer makes the church true in their eyes. Absolute TRUTH doesn't change, but yet the church changes all the time. Sure it is leading us to the Absolute TRUTH but it still runs this line of being more subjective until we get there. The truth claim is just becoming a problem because no one really knows what that means. However to testify that our religious society is "the Kingdom of God on Earth" is a more powerful statement, it's scripture based, and it is more forgiving of infallible members and leaders within the church without really taking away from our understanding of it's priesthood authority. Just a suggestion based on my observations.
He didn't answer any specific questions. He wouldn't even read them out loud. He only read the question about ex mrmon stats out loud but wouldn't even touch the tough questions. Why?
Sadly that’s where some of our members are today, having lost the excitement for the basics of the gospel now find themselves needing to be talked of the spiritual ledge. Thx a loving Father in Heaven for blessing use with people like this Brother to reason with those on the ledge. The gospel is simply beautiful. Simplicity in life insures a happy life!!! I had a gentleman ask me what’s different about your church then all other churches. I said knowing God loves ALL of His children and is a fair and just Father, has provided a means of salvation for ALL of His children through the sacred work of PROXY. I reminded him that proxy means to stand in for another, and that Christ performed the greatest act of proxy through His sacred and loving Atoning sacrifice. So a loving Father has made provisions to save ALL of His children if they so choose. The scripture says Except a man be born of the water and of the spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of Heaven. So for ALL who didn’t get the chance to be baptized while on the earth, God was thinking of you when He arranged for proxy work to be done on your behalf in Temples that now are filling the earth. Also your freedom to choose is never taken from you. This work is of God and the return of His precious Son I look forward to soon.
The Holy Book of God will keep your faith in tack. The Bible has the authority, the Author is God. Behind every word the Holy Spirit is. The bible can transform your life. The gift of faith must be our strength in God, and you can get that faith through His book. The LDS religion is not the true church, not when you do not teach the word of God that is in the bible, Romans 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God.
Dear Brother Halverson (and those who shared this talk,) Thank you for this comprehensive, compelling treatment of contraries! Though I have never heard the phenomenon of the paradoxical nature of truth regrouped in this way....it is an illuminating and useful tool for understanding (AND explaining) so much that defies simplistic dissection. Thank you!!! In general, I spend relatively little time on the internet but am grateful for the investment of heart, mind and time Brother Halverson has made to articulate the MOST important ideas and that he has, through the internet, made it available to all of us.
I’m so glad I found you on RU-vid. You are a great speaker and Teacher. How you do your sessions is amazing. Your talk at Highland Utah is stake Moved me to tears. What hit me the most was when you talked about the suicide. I have bipolar disorder. My parents had a real hard time when I was growing up. My family and I definitely had very Bad issues. Thank you for bringing out the subject of PTSD. They did the best they can. When looking back I really feel so guilty putting them through what I did. Thankfully I had many positive people and professional help to get me out of self-hate and my deep guilt thinking I messed up my family When I was in turmoil with my family I went and stayed with a Mormon family who took me in. When I was there we had come follow me every night. We were doing Doctrine and covenants and Joseph Smith. I fell in love with Joseph Smith and The Book of Mormon after those family nights. Then I had to leave them. They hook me up with Missionaries. I went to a Christian school. I was in kindergarten through elementary. So when I was in K and first grade I had seminary five days a week. I love the Scriptures. I grew up with stories from the old and New Testament. I was so enthralled with the stories in the Bible. It stays with to this day. . I love Come Follow me lessons. I was baptized when I was 17 and went to church, went to seminary and young youth activities. I was active around three or four years and I was having issues with Being a gay LGBTQIA+ in church. That’s when I fell from the church. People like you who are so uplifting and positive are very special and full of love. With God’s love. He introduced me to many special uplifting people who took me out of despair and made me a positive person today. You are added to that list. That should be in my prayers of thankfulness. Thank you for bringing that up. It took me 11/12 years being away from my family and meeting so many positive people in my life. Who took me out of the deepest well of self despair. Made me feel proud of myself and help my self-esteem. so happy to say that I do have a better outlook in life right now. The church is helping me a lot. I’ve been going back to Church for four years now. I’m trying to catch up with my scriptures. With my LD it is very hard for me to comprehend Written Scriptures. Your unshaken videos I do understand because you teach in a way that I can learn. Which is a very good quality in a teacher. So I am in Wisconsin now. I moved to Southern California. I lived all over orange county to Long Beach California.I wish I was there now. So I can go to your classes and meet you in the face to face I like how you put stuff in perspective and using issues with contrary components Many appreciation of you.
It sounds like your journey has been quite an adventure! I salute you for your courage to do what it takes to come to Christ. You are definitely swimming upstream with everything going on in the world these days!
Wow, thanks so much for sharing!! What an inspiring story that you have lived! My sister is bi-polar and we struggled growing up, but I love her dearly! She has left the church, BUT she has come closer to Christ recently and I’m hopeful she will put aside whatever it was that put a bad taste in her mouth about the church. The church isn’t perfect because people aren’t perfect, but the gospel of Christ is perfect and I do believe He guides this church of imperfect people. 🥰
Faith vs knowledge. You know how to present those contraries beautifully! So grateful for all I have learned from you over the years. Also grateful that the best kept secret in the church is now accessible to everyone! A member of my relief society presidency suggested that we watch this devotional for our activity next month. I got to brag that I’ve had the privilege of being taught by you in person. Keep up the good work!
2 Nephi 2:2-4 Nevertheless Jacob, my firstborn in the wilderness, thou knowest the greatness of God; and he shall consecrate thine afflictions for thy gain. 3 Wherefore, thy soul shall be blessed, and thou shalt dwell safely with thy brother, Nephi; and thy days shall be spent in the service of thy God. Wherefore, I know that thou art redeemed, because of the righteousness of thy Redeemer; for thou hast beheld that in the fulness of time he cometh to bring salvation unto men. 4 And thou hast beheld in thy youth his glory; wherefore, thou art blessed even as they unto whom he shall minister in the flesh; for the Spirit is the same, yesterday, today, and forever. And the way is prepared from the fall of man, and salvation is free. Not exactly a mental disorder!!! Massive blessings at a very young age. Good luck finding a patriarchal blessing with those words!!!
Helping people navigate their questions? I had a dear friend who spent 3 hours a day every day of his adult life studying the scriptures and History of the Church and teachings of the Prophets. He was excommunicated a few years ago for asking too many question and having questions the GA's could not answer.
It doesn't sound like his case is being conveyed accurately. People don't get excommunicated for having questions. If that did happen then it should be appealed.
That doesn't sound like the whole story. Members aren't excommunicated for asking questions. Questions are the catalyst for revelation. Something else was the issue.
I have listened to this talk multiple times. I tend to be pretty hard on myself. Bro Halverson, your knowledge and understanding of the gospel eases my my mind and helps me see things in a more hopeful light. Thankyou.
When you sang the missing verse from "Follow the Prophet" I started busting out laughing because it is so true. I had to pause the video to call my mom, who is her ward's Primary President, and tell her about it. It harkins back to your comment on the faith journey - simple, complex, and then a return to simple. That missing verse is part of the complex portion of our individual journey of faith, hence our not including it when we are teaching our children the basic concepts of the gospel of Christ.
Also contrary to what many of the early church leaders said about gaining knowledge. They were taught to "seek ye out of the best books words of wisdom; seek learning, even by study and also by faith." (Doctrine and Covenants 88:118.) I support my leaders, which includes politely letting them know if they are in error (which in my experience is rare). But here's the thing: The more we study with a prayerful heart, the better we will be at discerning truth from error.
What the church chose to do was not right. It's never right to deceive. What Satan did was not right. It is not in God's plan to take away free agency. Justification does not promote healing. God bless those who are suffering and searching for truth and forgiveness.
Can you add this to your podcast? Whenever I find myself stepping too far in either law or love I come back and listen and it guides me back to the middle.I’ll never be perfect at it but I’ll keep trying!
All people are ever responsible for their own thoughts 💬🤔🧐💭 and feelings that are going on in their own minds and hearts 💕😘🌹😘😇❤️🤩😍🥰 to help them navigate all issues.
I’m trying to figure out why a comment that does not agree with him would be considered anti-Mormon. What I got from his presentation was he has a doctorate degree in religion, he knows more than Joseph Smith because Joseph didn’t know what he was writing. And the glory of God is confusion? I myself am looking for true messengers, and you shall know them by their fruits. His fruits seem too point you to him being really really smart, and history is very confusing and trust in the LDS church. The actual fruits I’m more interested in are messengers who point me back to Jesus Christ and following Christ and not anything else. This seemed more like religatainment, I hope he gets the calling he wants and sells a lot of books and has a great big following.
Agreed! Was hoping for a little more substance and a little less priestcraft and self idol worship. Introducing him by how many followers he has on RU-vid made me throw up in my mouth a little. Glad he finally used the Book of Mormon to teach in the end. But I didn’t appreciate him talking evil of the Lords anointed, Joseph. If someone stands to teach about seeking truth and doesn’t even bring up James 1:5 or Moroni 10:3-5, I wonder if he has even consulted with God prior to speaking. It is a double edged sword to stand and teach and try to persuade people and should be done in accordance with Gods will for the listener and not the desire of the speaker to sell books or gain a following. I too am looking for true messengers from God. I’m sure they won’t be chasing celebrity though. You can only worship truth or comfort in this life and this talk was filled with comfortable half truths. It should be deleted and replaced by someone just reading from the whole truths found in the Book of Mormon.
@@CalledtoShare the message I got from this 90 minute video entitled “finding faith in an age of doubt” is that he intentionally didn’t speak about the problematic details of church history, teachings and policy. The details matter. The details are much more difficult to reconcile. It’s easy to defend faith when you gloss over the problems at a superficial level. The details are so problematic the apostles don’t dare discuss them. Always deferring to lower level people and apologists or groups like FAIR Mormon to try to answer the problems that are shaking the faith of today’s youth and even long time devout members. Talks like this are so disconnected from what’s really happening to people experiencing faith crisis.
@@CalledtoShare Better look around a little harder. The agitators are seeking disciples of faith crisis, and they are all over the place these days. They have been trained in Sherem methods and don't really feel the need for their comments to relate to the material they are tearing down.
I had to pause and comment again. When you mentioned the question "Are you the intended audience?", and you talked about needing to teach two separate lessons to your class, it reminded me of a specific lesson that Jacob taught in the Book of Mormon. The one where he lamented the tender hearts that would be broken by the message he was commanded to share. He also had to teach two lessons, and even though he might have more clearly known how to "break up his class" there was probably no real way to do that, and so he was stuck in the same conundrum as yourself. I am sure that you both navigated the situation through the promptings of the Holy Ghost - to the blessing of all present then, and now. I am grateful for the lessons you share and have a testimony that you have been prepared by Heavenly Father, through your unique training, "for such a time as this."
All that sounds complicated Jared. Proven contraries. When we went to the Washington DC temple to do baptism for the dead. I was hooked Line and sinker To the gospel of Jesus Christ. I guess I got to feel a little bit of heaven when in the temple. Doing the work of people that needed to be baptized.I don't know how I got devoted so eas😢ily to the commandments of Jesus Christ. I find repentance is not a problem. I believe that The older you get the better life gets throw repentance and Jesus Christ. Through my journey of life. I feel like I Had the hand of the Lord leading me where I needed to Go. Sure the boat got mighty Unbalanced back-and-forth. But I depended on the inspiration of heaven to lead me through. Real hard times of life Even divorce and children. I guess I found out ahead of time that the Lord's joke is easy so I let him pulled The Load for me when I can't pull any longer. Being obedient is a precious Seer Stone.
I really enjoyed this talk. He’s like the Jordan Peterson in our church. I’m a big fan of JP’s and there are so many similarities between what Jordan focuses on and what this brother says. Chaos and order and how they aren’t exactly polar opposites and we need a little bit of each in our lives for growth. Good stuff!!
I am currently reading The Complete Father Brown collection so I loved the GK Chesterton quotes. However, I believe you mentioned he was an atheist and I couldn’t find any evidence of that in a cursory search. Is it possible you confused him with CS Lewis?
I loved this! I will need to listen more times to ensure it sinks in. It reminded me of a quote attributed to Yogi Berra - "When you come to a fork in the road, take it!" haha
I've thought for a long time about this contrary issue because of Alma 42, where the phrase "can mercy rob justice". It made me start to understand the concept of contraries but I never knew the name or just how deep it was. Thank for this talk.
You are trying to sell the gray area for a church that is distinctly black and white. I respect that you are trying to create a new Mormonism, and I hope that teachings like this can help moderate my wife's black and white thinking, but it isn't Mormonism, it's Halversonism.
What I took from this talk: When learning about church history, don't stick to the facts, but use mental gymnastics to explain the inconsistencies away. Like this? "The book of Abraham. Translated from the papyrus, by Joseph Smith. ... The writings of Abraham while he was in Egypt, called the Book of Abraham, written by his own hand, upon papyrus." (Abraham, Introduction) vs. "None of the characters on the papyrus fragments mentioned Abraham’s name or any of the events recorded in the book of Abraham. Mormon and non-Mormon Egyptologists agree that the characters on the fragments do not match the translation given in the book of Abraham..." (Gospel Topic Essay "Translation and Historicity of the Book of Abraham")
The decades of infantilization of LDS doctrine has left membership vulnerable and unable to reason beyond the correlated narrative. The CES has failed the congregation. Now we gotta teach membership how to think and discern...
It's always supposed to have been about individuals learning how to think and discern on their own. From Joseph Smith on down to President Nelson this is what prophets have been pushing for.
Great job Brother Halverson. Thank you for your years of intellectual, secular, spiritual, anti, and all kinds of study which have brought you to this point. And thank you for compiling your thoughts and sharing them with the world. I am going to share this talk with a lot of people. Thank you thank you
You continuously and consistently outdo yourself! Hearing you talk more in depth on subjects you can barely touch on was so inspiring and illuminating!! I will forever be grateful for the nurse at Primary Chiidrens Hospital that mentioned your Unshaken scripture podcast as my daughter’s baby was being cared for in the NICU for almost 3 months!! What a life saver!!
Correction: I meant you were able to go more in depth on some subjects than you normally can on your weekly program. Fun to see you in a little different format! Loved it!!!
I don’t like being told that my concerns are doubts or questions. I used to have questions about the church. I still have some questions but I used to have more. I got some answers after a lot of research, pondering, prayers, and spiritual experiences. I put a lot of time and effort into this pursuit for years. However, the answers I got are not what the church leaders support. I could say more here, but I would like to keep it to myself.
I love this message! The only contraries I struggled with was law vs love. Should love ever be restricted or balanced? And aren’t laws a manifestation of love? And are we not showing love when we correct someone who has broken a law? I think the contrary to law may be more in the lines of leniency or something similar. For example, sometimes the law is broken under extenuating circumstances such as when Nephi killed Laban. Whatever made it justifiable for Nephi to do that would be the contrary to law. But I loved all the other contraries - especially humanity vs divinity which is helping me navigate a faith crisis! Such an amazing speaker - I was blown away and still thinking about it.
Those were my thoughts too! I feel I understand what he’s trying to say with the love vs. law contrary, maybe a better word would be “compassion” instead of “love”? Compassion if out of balance can lead to being too lenient? Yeah, I don’t know…it’s hard to find the right word, maybe “mercy”. ??? But, I totally get what he’s saying and I totally get what you’re saying here too! Very good insight! 🙏❤️
Very respectfully, may I suggest a Biblical justification for Nephi killing Laban? In Exodus 21:12-14, the command, "Thou shalt not kill" found only a few verses earlier in the Ten Commandments (Exodus 20:13) is modified with words that the Spirit quotes to Nephi as he is instructing Nephi to kill Laban ("And if a man lie not in wait and GOD DELIVER HIM INTO HIS HAND...) referenced in 1 Ne. 4:11,12, & 17 ("...the Lord hath delivered him into thy hands...") it is easier to embrace that sanctioned taking of Laban's life). My son showed that verse to me a few years ago. I hope my comment is received in the charitable manner in which I am sending it. 🙏
Hurry and get your book out! Can't get enough! I think your a terrific teacher, because you get to where the tire meets the road and your so right, I think the whole world would understand themselves better if they could understand this talk.
This was an amazing message from brother Halverson! My son took his class last semester at the U, but he’s not taking it again this semester and I’m very sad. I did email him this video With hopes he will change his mind!
Wow what a wonderful fireside. I am so glad I found it on you tube. I follow your lessons fatefully every week but it was wonderful to see you in a different setting. You are amazing. Thank you for your time and most of all your testimony. May the Lord bless you in all you do.
WOW... I really loved Jared Halverson's explanations for everything in his talk. It really opened my eyes to how we can be so one sided on so many levels about so many things, if not all things. Truly a great speaker and teacher. He has certainly opened my eyes and given me much to think about, and has given me the tools to make the necessary changes. I am striving to be like Jesus every day, but after hearing Jared speak, now I can be better in my efforts. I am not kidding myself, I know it will take discipline to master a good balance, but I now have a better understanding of how to achieve that. My name is Gina McDougall, of Capalaba Ward, in the Brisbane Australia Cleveland Stake, Queensland, Australia. Thank you for sharing this fireside video. 😊❤️🙏🇦🇺✡️🧔♀️🪔🇮🇱
Brother Halverson. I am grateful. For your faith, for your worthiness and your willingness that has enabled our Father in Heaven to use you and an instrument in his hands to share the knowledge and wisdom that He has blessed you with to bless us in ways that are much wanted and needed!. Thank you so much.
I loved the talk and learned a lot about contrary truths that have helped me better understand disputes in life. However, I don't agree with what was said about following the prophet. Yes, one should get a confirmation of what the prophet says, but when the prophet speaks from the Lord, he IS infallible.
I' ve really appreciated your videos especially the Come follow me, teaching older teenagers including a son of mine whose struggling with athiesm. If I could just make one teeny request. In more than this video you discuss suicide and you would really be sparing some cringing and heartbreak if you could use the term 'die by suicide'. Saying "committed suicide" is very stigmatized and hurtful to survivors. I work with AFSP and at all our speaking events we instruct speakers to not say "committed." A Suicide victim did not commit a crime, suicide is the final devestating symptom of an illness. I lost my oldest son to suicide because of mental health. If you really want to approach someone struggling, imo it's not a 50/50 justice vs mercy. 90% of suicides are tied to mental health and that is a medical issue, so I'd say 90% mercy is more appropriate, if not 100%.
You say your son is "struggling with athiesm." Most likely, he grew up learning your point of view and knows it well. Have you ever actually considered his and not just dismissed it as wrong? IMO, you're turning to the internet for religious validation and justification because you're unwilling to accept the possibility that you might be wrong. Consider reading the Gospel Topics Essays (and the documents footnoted) on the church website and then talking to your son about them.
I am a Boomer, a child of the "Greatest Generation" father. What an amazing experience especially commitment to God, how they treat others, long suffering , ethics, inclusivity --at least my father and his 12 siblings. You saw Zion people in action. Compare the G. Gen with the last three, very fascinating. My father would have loved the last three no matter the differences.
I was thinking that President Nelson's first talk as prophet was an attempt to help us prove the contrary: "Revelation for the Church, Revelation for Our Lives". April 2018 ... and then Brother Jared brought it up 5 minutes later! 🤗
"In the kingdom of God, there can be no halfway measures, no starting and stopping, no turning back … When difficult things are asked of us, even things contrary to the longings of our heart, remember that the loyalty we pledge to the cause of Christ is to be the supreme devotion of our lives." Jeffrey R. Holland, General Conference, October 2021 When we are more interested in maintaining our following and not offending anyone vs preaching the gospel in pureness and boldness, it is time to step away- you're doing more harm than good for the cause of Zion. You will be found without. Zion or Bust! The Kingdom of God or nothing!
This is so powerful, I just feel the spirit, and love the Gospel as a Convert to the Church this is the best decision I have made in my life, to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. And continue to learn so much. Thankful to be a Ward Missionary as I love to teach.
Wonderful presentation. I’m so very sorry to hear about the mental health struggles your children are afflicted with. I know the pain. I know the question of "why" and I know the comfort that can come in spite of the raging storm . Prayers for your family. 🙏
Thank you Brother Halverson. This is what I’ve been learning but never had so many words for it till now! Here is a response: Which do we choose? Choose Life - with its ever living promise of another day to find the sweet spot - aways remembering that He is the Life. Choose Him - not an idea of Him but Him. We are redeemed through relationship with a real Person. And repentance is a moment by moment turning process. Turning to Him (and towards his body, the Church) “Till by turning turning we come round right” 🎶
Why is it so hard for the church to except the humanity of the church? We lead with divinity we speak as if the whole entire thing is divine and so we hurt people who look at the church and it’s practices and see humanity. We have to have truth and the truth is there are two of’s in the name of the church for a reason. We have to except that the leaders of the church are humans and so make mistakes they have prejudice they have experiences they are not Christ they have ups and downs the same as all other members.
I married my return missionary, to learn that he's one of those GBT in Uni. God thought me to ❤️ him out of the closet, then I did a magic trick before he could convince me to go down that path, with him. Sleeping with the enemy is very scary thing to learn, not to betray them to any one is the trick to success
The square as the lower law. A square is exact and true without any variance of degrees. A square is fixed and rigid and confirms order and definitely serves a purpose.A compass as the higher law which can create an infinite variability of radiuses.It is more open to flexibility and creation, Yes it receives its direction/revelation from one point but has tremendous flexibility in how it moves and measures. What’s interesting is that you can use a square to make a circle or radius and you can use a compass to check or make a square. Just some thoughts!!?? BTW I loved your devotional and it made me think of this.
Excellent! Have learned so much from you. We are UNSHAKEN fans. Thank you for sharing your vast amount of knowledge, insight and testimony. We need it.
It is not true that there is no professional or paid ministry. The GA's get paid. But if they don't pay local ministers, then there is more to pay the GA's with.
General Authorities are called to serve full-time in the church. Because they can no longer earn a living and practice their careers, my understanding is that they receive a living allowance and other things such as travel expenses for church related assignments.
True. The GA does get a living expense. False as far as they get more. If you do the numbers they take a drastic pay cut being a full time disciple of Jesus Christ!
We can expect both? Yes, we can. We Thank Thee, O God, for a Prophet, and Praise to the Man who communed with Jehovah. Either He was or He wasn't a Prophet. Yet He was. Joseph Smith brought us the fullness of time. Through the Restoration - “I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts, than by any other book.” (History of the Church, 4:461.) The Father and the Son appear, and Joseph is called to his prophetic ministry. (Verses 1-20.)
I thought briefly about tattooing an "&" on my hand during a difficult phase in my faith journey when I was fighting cognitive dissonance and trying to convince myself to embrace the "and" of so many contraries or paradoxes in the Church. I've since learned that "and" is really not sustainable. As LDS members, we were trained to seek for and embrace truth. This fireside seeks to obscure truth by teaching that the actual truth of a thing is not as important as embracing obfuscation and deception to stay in the middle. I've never heard the Church describe itself as the middle in all my 50 years. We are different, peculiar, etc. The middle is filled with lukewarm, spewed out fence-sitters, right? Halvorsen's main contrary is whether to live by the strict, dogmatic, approved-source only teachings of the Church or by this confused, fulcrum-surfing, everything-is-true-but-its-more-true-if-the-Church-says-so middle method. This will not bring you to know the truth.
No where in scrioture sats "FOLLOW THE PHOPHET" that was a statement made by a member that turned into song. Scripture tells us to FOLLOW THE LORD, but LISTEN to the phophets, study things out, then take it to te LORD for us to be able to listen to the spirit for ourselves!!! Thank you for this eloquent talk!!!! I agreed with EVERYTHING you said!!!
@@corythewiz There is no place in scripture that says to "Follow the Prophet".... we are to follow the Lord. I'm not saying that we don't listen to the counsel of the Prophet, but we are to study things out, listen to God's 'servants' (as they are identified in Scripture) then pray for our own personal revelation with our Father. The prophet himself has always talked about personal revelation and reminds us often. It's very insulting to see people use him as a weapon to push their own opinions...
Letter of the Law vs Spirit of the Law (reconciled by inspiration of Holy Ghost) Nature vs Nurture (reconciled by epigenetics) Purity vs Passion (reconciled by Temple ordinances) The Miracle of Forgiveness by Spencer Kimball vs Do what feels good reconciled but The Divine Gift of Forgiveness by Neil Anderson Godless Evolution vs. Bible creation (reconciled by Quantum physics) Or not.
You mentioned there was not much written about "proven contradictions". Actually Friedrich Nietsche dedicated much of his writing to this issue, and I would refer you to him for deepening your understanding of how to deal with these problems.
You / we , have court advantage in Beautiful South African stakes. We delight in your work and it sounds like uts ur wife too whom we listern too avidly. "Come see"
I find that we need to hold to opposite things that are two in the tension without disregarding either one while we wait on the Lord to show us the fullness of the truth. The Saviour is the fullness. When there seems to be contradictions it is the Saviour that makes both possible if they really are both true, He makes mercy and justice possible simultaneously. God will either make it clear that one is wrong or show how they both work through Him.
