Chuck has a great point: how do you take a perennially losing team, turn them into the 2nd seed in the West and not get MVP consideration? And the Nash point was solid
Shaq always brings up rings. How many rings did he win with HOF players🤔. Hakeem won 1 without and his second with Drexler. Plus he didn't have to go against Jordan. Plus it helps when the league and refs help you beat Sacramento.
@Micah Izzard People tend to make arguments in a way that benefits their narrative, the year Westbrook won the MVP the argument agains him was actually the team's record. The argument for Harden was that he basically had almost the same numbers as Russ but his team had a better record and that he scored more efficiently because of his 3ball, so really CP3 at that point of the season definitely deserved to be in the MVP conversation while now Jokic has pulled too far ahead for anyone to get him anymore at least in my opinion
@@keandregreen5628 I agree too but it has been the best player with best record for a while...Nash got it in part too bc no one was doing what that team was doing and he was the engine to that
MVP averaging 16 and 8 lmao. Yeah, ok buddy. James Harden is the mvp Chris Paul is averaging Lamelo and Lonzo Ball numbers on a winning team. Let that marinate... Lonzo, Melo and Chris Paul. HAHAHAHAHAHAH STOP IT
Charles is always right when he's serious, I'm just surprised Shaq didn't cut him off saying he don't know what he's talking about cause he has no rings
Jose C. most of that stupid MVP race is fan voting! NBA should ask those previous top 100 NBA players whose the best and not those stupid fans who only vote for his/her favorite.
Kenny acting like Steve Nash never existed, winning back to back MVPs by elevating everyone around him, and not just relying on insane scoring abilities, even though he had them
@@rgh5069 especially today with the amount of brand money in supporting a certain players chances to win. The media is rarely objective. This is one of the few shows that are
@@majormarketing6552 and that same season Oscar Robertson averaged a TRIPLE DOUBLE and STILL didn’t win mvp. You want to know who they gave it to? Bill Russell, because his team won 60 games.
League politics and media narrative play as much a part in the voting which is why the criteria is never the same from year to year. I remember in 2002 when Jason Kidd was considered the favorite for MVP after he turned around the Nets. But since Kidd was still fresh off his domestic violence arrest they gave it to Tim Duncan.
Shows how he approached the game lol I was yelling “then why didn’t Kobe win MVP in 06 when he was putting 35-36ppg?” I look at MVP as the most valuable to the TEAM.
@@angelbedolla24 I mean that’s a slippery slope cuz if you’re the best player in the league hands down then your are also more valuable to your team then anyone else . Based on the simple fact that no one would be able to fill ur possession on that team because you are the best player in the league.
@@watermaster4913 for sure and that’s what I’m saying. Shaqs definition is different for others. If he’s preaching the case he’s making, Kobe should be back to back mvp instead of Nash
I agree he had some valid points....and he was right! Shaq just want a big man to win it,, Embiid and jokic is balling tho I wouldn't be mad if Embiid got it,, Jokic ehh
I like how Chuck brought up Steve Nash winning MVP over Shaq lmao 😂😂 he knows Shaq wouldn't disagree with him. Then Kenny knew it instantly lmao 😂 I was dead watching this live 😂😂😂
The disrespect to Nash is too much on this show. Nash led a previously struggling Suns team to great success, and if Horry didn't cheap shot him and get Amare suspended, they could have won a chip.
Jordan wasnt the best player “3 years before he was an mvp” or whatever. His first mvp was 1987-88. He wasn’t the best player in 1984-85 which is his literally his rookie year
You haven’t heard that yet? We’ve been talking about every year when somebody wins it and we know there not the best same thing for Lebron and like chuck said shaq and kob it’s called voters fatigue
@@Howdidhenotseeme MJ was the best player in the 3rd year before his 4th. Mans literally was averaging an efficient 37ppg. And playing lock down defense.
Exactly I always thought there should be an award separate from the MVP called the Offensive player of the year to show singular success like the Defensive player of the year and the MVP would focus more on the team success, and their individual play as well
Exactly u can be a great player but in order to win a mvp u have to have a great supporting cast he'll Shaq himself won mvp and then won the title in 1999-2000
A perfect example for Charles’ arguments is Jason Kidd’s first year with the Nets. The Nets were a last place team before his arrival. With him they were the #1 seed in the East.
I actually agree with Barkley here. He's just not making his argument eloquently. Even if you don't think the MVP is Paul, the standard he's pressing I believe is correct.
The problem is there is a lack of clarity or definition of what the mvp is. Is it "the best player" according to stats, or is it "the best player on the best team". The mvp will always be an ethereal concept. It will always cause ructions
@@slicktalk98 because his team is doing much better this year than last year. His team is sitting at 2nd and his previous team (OKC) was only at 5th. Obviously he is impacting winning and his stats are good too.
Cp3 should get consideration as far as votes goes obviously he not the leading candidate but he has been insanely valuable. I think Chuck and Shaq are both correct here.
Think its a balance of both Chuck and Shaq's points like how good a player is THIS season over the whole league AND how much they have impacted their team overall.
All I am saying is Steve Nash won back-to-back MVP's playing with amare , Shawn Marion and Joe. That team was super stacked , Steve Nash plays no defence but won back-to-back MVP's. If Chris Paul was white they would be going crazy about how he came to this team turned to round it was all him he deserves MVP
@@tdotsweetheart lol 85%of the nba is black, stop trying to play a race card. There was literally 2 white all stars..... He won’t win MVP because simply, there are better players than him who are more valuable, and those players are also black lol
Shaq and Kenny says what’s gonna keep them a job and what the media wanna hear. Chuck always goes against the grain but he’s always right and makes very valid points!
@@AlejandroSanchez-pl6jw oh no I believe he should’ve won at least 8 too and that he was better than Bill Russell, but he named guys with only 1 MVP or no MVPs so I just let him know that wilt had 4
He was only saying Derrick Rose didn't put up big numbers his MVP season LeBron had better numbers that year but Derrick Rose had the better team so he won the MVP
Had a better team wtf are you stupid he had chris bosh dwyne wade Derick had his 2nd best for half a year and you act like Derrick averaged 20 n 5 and won
The Bulls were still the first seed the next year, with D Rose only playing half of the games. That should tell you allot about D Rose's MVP season. People say MVP should go to the best player on the best team, but just because you have a best record, doesn't mean you have the best team. 75% of the NBA is trash, and just because the Bulls were better at winning against mediocre teams than the Heat, doesn't make them the better team.
Every year for the past 12 years it should've been lebron for both. He's been the best player and the most valuable for his team because without him every team he's been on has sucked
@@PedroRosado22 MVP is a useless award. It’s just a statistical award. Does Westbrook need an MVP when we already know he’s gonna grab his teammates rebound from him and stat pad for the triple double? Or that Giannis can only play an exploitable euro step or Harden’s 50 fga per game? I still agree with Chuck, if you cannot lead your team to the most wins with a convincing dominance in win shares then how are you “valuable” to your team?
@@ant6130 we talking abt stats idiot the league is giving mvp base on stats not team record if that’s the case go back to 2003 and 2006 where he carried the lakers on his back
@@haneecamper4903 yes you right and the 08 season should be his but David Stern finally realized the NBA robbed Kobe of least 2 MVP (03 and 06 in my opinion) so they gave it to Kobe in 08
Charles made a valuable point : team impact is considered in MVP. "Can you make your team win championship/have a great season ? " Is definitely a big factor. The real problem is , they only look at "Dominant" players who score more points , triple double etc. Qualities like leadership is left behind which is really a shame. As Chuck often says, Cp3 is a great leader, each time he is in a new team, he brings a new life in it. It is a unique quality nowadays , not as flashy as others but He should be in the talk for MVP.
But that’s why u can’t just look at the standings if you watch you can see those teams in particular are successful becuz of team ball not one outstanding player
@@bashwill236 unless u put up GODLY numbers like Russel Eastbrook did u gotta have good stats + a top 3 ranking and be the UNDISPUTED BEST PLAYER ON UR TEAM
I used to be advocate for the BLM movement, but the facts support the police. Breonna Taylor’s previous boyfriend Jamarcus Glover is a criminal dealer who used her home address for deliveries. She was in business with Jamarcus Glover and other criminals, so there was a no knock warrant for her address (they linked Breonna to known criminals and spotted her vehicle near a suspected drug house). The police officers KNOCKED and announced themselves despite it being a no knock warrant (there’s a witness). The police officers go into the home after not hearing back and are immediately shot at by her new boyfriend Kenneth Walker. Walker shot one of the officers in the leg. The officers were forced to fire back. Unfortunately and tragically Breonna Taylor got caught in the crossfire. She was not shot in her bed execution style, but was standing in the hallway. Walker knew that his gf was standing in the hallway unarmed and defenseless, but fired anyways. The officer that was indicted was for recklessly shooting a different neighbor’s home during the altercation
Chuck is kind of right on this. It reminds me of Nash's first MVP. Suns didn't even make the playoffs the year before and the next they were the #1 seed and he lead the league in assists and won MVP.
Chuck was absolutely right this section, the MVP...while being a "singular" award is usually given to the best player on the best team. Shaq had no clue what he was talking about lol.
@@TheRealLeonardWashington was an anomaly because he averaged a triple double if memory serves me right he did again in another season or two I think and didn't get multiple, also it made for a good storyline after KD left
Chuck is actually right. MVP has a lot to do with team success vs. best player. If MVP was really most VALUABLE player (aka best player in the league) lebron should win almost every single year, same thing with giannis over harden, etc.
@@howtodo9953 They won in the bubble and still ain’t make the playoffs they’re the Two seed in the west with Chris Paul They haven’t even sniffed the playoffs in years.
@@howtodo9953 you need to get off the bubble topic Jamal Murray and Donovan Mitchell looked like MVPs in the bubble we see now that’s not the case you’re taking an 8 game stretch over years of evidence.
I agree with Charles on this one. Having the best regular season & effecting your team winning makes you valuable. You can score 35ppg but if you're team is losing doesn't really count.
In addition to his assists, Nash is tied for the 19th highest career true shooting percentage out of all nba players and has twice as many 50/40/90 seasons as any other player. People don’t realize how good he was.
@@kobeandcarmelostanaccount5540 I agree if him and Kobe teamed up I could see them winning multiples finals and it would of took some of the stress off Kobe especially with Phil Jackson as the coach that’s the crazy part
Charles Barkley is the only nba commentator that actually speaks facts about basketball. Shaq just screams about his rings, and all other nba commentators just say hot takes for clicks. Chuck the goat
He's the only one that actually watches games in his free time. Ernie and Chuck, in their podcast, admited that Shaq and Kenny barely watch any games apart from when they do the show.
I didn’t hear shaq scream about his rings at all! Seems to me shaq can’t win. He talks about his rings and he gets flack. He doesn’t talk about his rings - he still gets flack for talking about them in the past! He can’t express an opinion that he gets paid to do and gets labeled a hater. Seems to me there is plenty of “haters” in the comments. But hey you are all just expressing an opinion. Just like shaq. Hypocrites much!
@@Litchen-sh7lr LOL who in their right mind is hating on SHAQ? We all love SHAQ and his legacy is solidified but using the rings argument every time almost on cue is beyond annoying and ridiculous. I don’t see how that’s a wrong assessment. It’s like people people pick and choose who to be critical of these days and if you’re critical of somebody people like, then you’re a “hater” 😂😂🤷🏾♂️ We all know shaq got the rings by now but he’s run that statement into the ground. I don’t think Michael Jordan or even Bill Russell spend half the time talking about their rings like shaq does 😂😂
“Team doesn’t matter” well I thought there was a stat showing that almost like 90% of all MVPs were the top 2 teams in their conference.... and Westbrook was the exception? I’m confused now. Imagine saying “I care about team success”, also Shaq “ it’s not about the team success” , while playing in a team sport.
Westbrook got it because he was averaging a 30 point triple double and had crazy numbers. Paul’s numbers are nowhere near as good as some other guys, numbers matter more than team record. Team record should only be a deciding factor when it’s close between 2 players
@@mrjaredsoccer that’s not the point. That has happened before. Nash averaged 15 and 11 and won over Shaq, and Duncan who had better stats than him, but he was the best player in the best team. If the suns get the 1 seed, I don’t see why they wouldn’t consider Paul as the MVP, when they were trash last year without him
@@braydonblanton8218 exactly it depends on the hype of the team and player. i feel like unless the player is having an historic season like Russ, they put team success at a high standard for the award
To win mvp they should give every statistic a value and tally it up, whoever has the highest value wins it automatically. Includes team rank, ppg, assists, steals, efficiency, etc. This would actually make a lot of sense...
When Nash won mvp he didn’t have someone like booker that could score at will or in late game situations. Paul not putting up crazy numbers and the is obviously players having better seasons
We have to remember it’s the Most valuable player award for the regular season not the best player award . So we have to think on if we take that Ayer out of the equation how will the team do without him 🤔
So now they saying teams don’t matter they been saying for years oh his team record this and team record that. Even with the Rose conversation the Bulls had the number 1 seed in the eastern conference that year
@@LockDoWNLou damn yo facts all fucked up drose had the better year and better record was the only player to finish top 10 in points and assist that year
Chuck is spitting facts. Team record most definitely has relevance in MVP talks. There's a RU-vid channel that makes vids about what if the MVP was purely about being the best player in the league. Kobe, LeBron, Wilt, and Jordan would have a lot more MVPs if it was just a pure individual award
From Wikipedia..... "The NBA Most Valuable Player Award (MVP) is an annual National Basketball Association (NBA) award given since the 1955-56 season to the best performing player of the regular season. Since the 2022-23 season, winners receive the Michael Jordan Trophy" So this isn't about how valuable the player is to his team, it's simply the most valuable player in the league.
He was only saying Derrick Rose didn't put up big numbers his MVP season LeBron had better numbers that year but Derrick Rose had the better team so he won the MVP
Chuck is right as always. Kenny arguing that Derick Rose was the best player, not when LeBron was in the league. Team record has a lot to do with the MVP. Only averaging a triple double is the exception.
I got a really big feeling that alot of projected winning teams are going to get upset in the playoffs this year. Alot more than previous years. And point guards don't get MVP consideration like they did in the past. Too many combo guards.
Charles and Shaq are both right..Chris Paul doesn't have a realistic shot at MVP this year, but team success DOES matter..MVP has ALWAYS been the better/best player on the best team..Bill Russell beat Wilt and Oscar for MVP, Wilt had 50/25 a game while the Big O averaged a triple double.. Nash was never the best player in the NBA, we know this, but he had back to back MVPs, team success has always mattered... Should it matter? That's a separate conversation..
If team success matter, then why westbrook won? His team success was 6th or 8th seed if I remember correctly. Years later, everyone realised that he was statpadding . I mean it should win somebody whose team is at least championship contender
I understand this is a per season award, however, not only did he take an OKC team who was projected to be bottom tier in the west to the playoffs - losing to Houston in 7 games, he's now joined a Pheonix team who missed the playoffs the season prior, and is now sitting 1st/2nd in the west! He deff should be in the conversation.
