Should I be charging my EV to 90% each day if I only drive a short distance? 

PLEASE NOTE: This information is intended for EV owners who only drive a short distance each day and then plug in each night. The data presented only applies to ternary type lithium batteries (e.g. NMC), not Lithium Iron Phosphate (LFPO). If that isn't your situation then don't waste your time watching or posting irrelevant comments. Also note that a "DST Cycle" referred to in the Battery University study means one discharge and recharge to the levels specified in the test (e.g 75% - 65% SOC). However the industry term "cycle", when used to predict battery life, means one transition from fully charged to fully discharged and back to fully charged. So there would be 10 X 75% - 65% events before one charge "cycle" is clocked against the battery's lifetime cycle count. While the science may seem complex the key message is simple: - You don't need to change your lifestyle or stress about your battery - You can keep driving as you do currently and plugging in each night so your car is always ready at the start of the day - If you simply lower the maximum State of Charge (SOC) from 90% to something more appropriate, like 60% this can enhance the longevity of your battery. This is because the battery spends less time standing with a high SOC. Lastly, I am not telling anyone what they should do, just presenting the science. In the end it's your car and your choice how you charge your EV. Have a great day ! 🙂

I own my model P85 for 10 years already. Not a sign of battery degradation because I never charge above 80 %. When I don't use my car for a while it stays on 50%. Then when I am going for a trip I charge the power I need for this particulary trip. Sometimes I supercharge up to 80% to heat the battery to get a temperature to remove condensation and water out of the battery pack. Corrosion in the electronics also damages it. Still super satisfied with my Tesla after 100.000 miles.

I think the math is a little off here. Since let's say your commute is the 10% you're talking about. If you would do the 100-25% charge, you can drive for 7,5 days before charging (so 7,5*1000/365=20 years), while with the orange line you need to charge daily. So if you look at it that way the light blue and pink are the best modes 5*3000/365=40 years or 3*5000 which is the same. 40 years seems very unrealistic to me, since you will have so degradation over time itself (storage). So all in all I don't think the factory 80-25 is all that bad. Maybe 75-25 or 75-40 might be bit better. I now charged up to 80% so I think I'll set it to 75 instead. My commute takes a bit more of the batter though, about 15%.

In our training from GM for the Bolt EUV we have been told to recommend to customers that they use the moto ABC: Always-Be-Charging. Their explanation was that the car will manage the battery temperature while the car is parked. One fellow on RU-vid has a short video showing his Bolt expelling excess heat during a very hot day. His car wasn't running, just plugged in. So while not charging everyday may be a good idea that would be only when the outside temperature is neither too hot or too cold. At least where GMs are concerned. Charging to a lower level most of the time seems to be a good idea that most agree on. My cell phone has a battery management setting that you can switch on and it limits the charge to 85%. This is meant to increase battery life (Samsung phone). I drive a Bolt EUV and have set my maximum charge at 80%. I may lower that to 75%. I also use slow charging as it seems to be recommended by most. Thanks for the video. I found it most useful. In addition, the comments left by some viewers also contributed to my battery education.

The magenta (75%-45%) most closely represents my usage cycle and I charge twice a week which = 43 years (I'll be 106 years old) btw - the warranty is 80% and I had a starting capacity of 331 miles so at 90% I still have 300 miles of range & (80% = 270 miles) which is still quite usable

You omitted the fact that part of this 'precautions' are already done by the BMS auromatically. If you charge to 100%, this is not really 100%, as the battery physically has 8% or so more capacity, which is 'fenced off' by programming in the BMS. Similar at the low end...

I was charging to 80% and then only charging when less than 50%. Since, on my daily commute, I always came in right at about 50%, I am going to only charge up to 70% and see how it goes. I am also intrigued by potentially charging at a lower rate too. I can recharge in two hours, but I have 8 hours to do it in over night so am giving that a try too. Thanks for the food for thought.

I've been looking into this question for a week now and finally came across some actual data! Thanks!

Also important to remember that most manufacturers don’t allow you to use the entire battery. So 100% is not really 100% and 75% is not really 75%

This is good advice. Keeping the EV battery balanced is the best for longevity. I got a 14 year old Prius and can monitor the battery charge level. Toyota seems to keep the battery between 45 and 60% charged. It is still running well on the original battery.

Great video. I feel you nailed in your sum up and what you are personally doing with the 40 - 60% cycle, a pity that study didn't include that or even 45 - 55%. I think this rule of thumb would also be great for someone who can only charge by fast charger, if they are also an urban dweller whose commute is short, then they could do this just once or twice a week for probably only ten minutes a time and end up way better off than those who fast charge huge depth all the time. Also I'd be very interested to see the results if it was dialled back even more to say 20 - 40%, the battery is charging very quickly at this stage because it is under virtually no stress. Could be even better than that mid range. Just an amateur thinking out loud here :)

Were we live and work, lots of people travel over 100 miles per day. So my Leaf, uses 75 to 80% per day. Current at 48000 miles. And the car came with extra warranty on the battery.

Thank you for your hard work and very clear presentation! Thanks also to your source.

I put over 250,000 miles on 4 plug-in hybrids over the last 10 years. They had a built-in battery buffer of 20%, so that "100%" charged/full was actually only charging up 80% of the battery. The result was that none of the PHEVs showed ANY visible loss of range during the time that I had them. Granted, because 20% of the battery capacity was not shown to the driver, they could have lost up to 20% of their capacity without it being seen. But they also could have actually lost minimal battery capacity over the years of daily driving and charging (L2) use.

Really interesting... thanks for your research and clear summary. My charging routine was to use the 80-20% range but after this, i’m going to follow your recommandation. Apart of course when i’m doing à road trip. Then i slowly charge to 100% during the night befor departure, and using my obd connector, capture the capacity of the battery so that i can follow up battery degradation. ( i have a mustang mach e with edtended battery)

Spot on! We LOVE having plenty of fuel in the tank with an ICE car. We also LOVE having plenty of charge in the battery for an EV, but for the majority of us that’s complete overkill. HOWEVER keeping the max charge below 65% to 70% is always going to be much better for the battery …. and even more so in hot climates. If you must fill it, don’t leave it there for long, drive immediately. If you arrive home near empty, charge it to at least 20% immediately.

Excellent video, thank you for doing this. I however had a clarification. I was wondering if we should charge from 75-65% SOC, as that seemed to prolong the battery life the most based on the last chart you showed. Although I might have missed an explanation of why you thought the 60-40% was a better charging pattern. Thanks in advance for the clarification.

Great info! Thanks 4 taking the time 2 make this video. God Bless!

Very helpful - just wanted to say thank you for finding and highlighting this research

Thank you, Mark. An excellent piece of reporting with a clear conclusion which is easy to implement. I will start this immediately.

Great video. Thank you so much for your work on this. Leaving a comment to show my appreciation, and also to express that for a very technical subject, this video gives a perfect explanation and context of how to optimize your EV's battery life. Cheer my friend. Thanks again!

Excellent points, Mark.....thanks for doing the hard work to investigate the subject. I would add though that it is important to prriodically charge to 100% SOC, in order for the battery management system in most cars to perform cell balancing. Perhaps adopting a routine that the first day of each month, you charge to 100% using level 1 or 2 charge point, and return to your regular routine for the rest of the month, would preserve battery maintenance and maximize service life. Thanks again for doing this.

Excellent video! Extremely useful for those of us contemplating the purchase of our first BEV; gives us an idea of how to charge for maximum battery life. Many thanks!

Thanks for sharing this. My daily commute is 30kms through motorway which means I don't really need to worry about battery range. I can also recharge less often, keeping within ideal state of charge.

Been basing my model 3 LR off the 75%-25% line, and the battery is doing well, the car is at about 110,000 miles in 4 years. Just plug it in every night, and every morning it's at 75%, much less than is needed for a typical day.

A lithium-ion battery is happy between 25% and 80% SOC. However the BMS needs to know the extremes as well so do go to them occasionally. It is okay to charge to 100% but it is bad not to use this first 10-20% shortly after: like if a battery being under stress while fully charged: the shorter we leave it in that condition, the better. So please just charge to 100% the night before occasional long distance trips.

Thanks for putting this explanation together. It's easy to follow and is well supported by evidence.

Very valuable information. I have owned a model Y for almost 3 years and have been reviewing charging advice videos. This is the best one I’ve seen by far. Thank you.

Thanks for that interesting information. And .. saw your T-Shirt of The Smashing Pumpkins and thought, well that's something from my youth and find some good old songs again on youtube. Sad that I can only give you one Thumbs Up instead of two :)

A significant variable to degradation is also depth of discharge (DOD). Avoiding large depth of discharge prevents expansion and contraction of the electrodes which leads to cracking. A DOD 10% to 20% has a little impact on battery degradation above 20% has increasing impact. 20% of discharge provides very little degradation above 10%, but provides twice the mileage driven. Therefore the ideal charging range is in fact 40 to 60%, pushing this to 30 to 70% may be ideal for most peoples practical usage with the additional small degradation being worth the increased usability.

All wonderful theory. But.. a vehicles BMS handles a lot of this. Cars are now coming with 7 year unlimited km warranties, incl battery, so this might suggest the manufacturer has thought about what end users may or may not do. Limiting yourself so religiously to using such a small % of a battery is very counter to the whole driving experience and can become an obsession. There are so many variables indicated that affect battery longevity that you zero control over. Here in Australia, days and weeks go by where temps well exceed these "lab tests," and I would guess the same is true in European winter based climates where it goes below zero. The alternative to all of this science and maths, etc, is to enjoy the car you drive in the climate conditions that prevail for you and use common sense and manufacturers recommendations given they cover your warranty 😀

Great eye opener.. Thank you for uploading this video.

Think of it like your own stomach. Don’t wait too long before you eat (get too empty). When you eat don’t eat too much. Basically, be diligent and mindful about it.

Thanks for this interesting video. My Megane e-Tech EV60 is always charged at 80% and when the percentage is down to 60,50 or 40%, I charge at home with 7 kWh (32A). After one year, Renault told me the battery is of 98% capacity. Now, after hearing what you told, I’ll switch fom 80 to 75%.

This is good information. I drive my Ioniq 5 about 40 km daily and charge level 2 free at work several times weekly. I think it is reasonable to lower my end charging a bit, dropping from 80% to 70% with a goal to keep the battery between 40-70% state of charge. My understanding is that the Ioniq 5 needs to be above 40% state of charge to recharge the 12 volt battery. Thanks for posting this.

I have been slowly transitioning my home to all electric. It was built with normal natural gas service for appliances. I first installed solar and a Power Wall. Then I installed a heat pump. I am in the process of adding a heat pump water heater and induction stove. I had intended on getting a Tesla Model 3 but the size wasn’t acceptable. By the time the Model Y came out I became aware of Aptera and I like their BEV solution much more than any other focusing on efficiency instead of electrifying a conventional vehicle. I am in California on the central coast so we have mild weather making it much easier. Good luck with your transition.

A cycle is 0-100%. Charging 10% daily is only 1/10th of a cycle

माहिती साठी धन्यवाद👍🙏

Thank you. It kind of fits what I knew about batteries (storage % voltage for batteries waiting to be shipped and sold by battery companies is 65%). Until now I was charging my car at 80% every day (Model Y 2023, Long Range). Now, I will charge my car to 60%, use 3% to get to work, it will stay on parking at work and lose 2% more during the day (sentry mode usage-security), then lose another 3% on its way back, then it will be at 52% and stay that way until the charging start 3 hours later. Friday, I will charge to 80% in case of a longer driving during the weekend.

Thank you for the very interesting video. Two questions: 1. Is the same rule applies to modern mobile phones? (iPhone, Samsung, etc) 2. 10% DoD is 6000 cycles from 0 to 100% or from 90 to 100%?

Thanks for the video. I have used the Battery University's advice with my Lead acid batteries. They have so lasted over 10 years.

Very interesting. I only use my model Y once a month and this is the first video I've seen about how to maximize your battery life; other than the usual recommendation of keeping it between 20 and 80%.

Fantastic video and high quality content! 👍👍

Great video! Exactly the information i was looking for. The doubt about what is the best practice to keep my Tesla battery healthy for longer was turning in my head for a while 👍

Great advice. I plan to drop my daily change down a bit more. I dont drive much each day. When I go on trips I do work the battery a bit harder, buts thats only a few times a year. Even on trips I try and keep 85%-25% range more for peace of mind on the low end and charging times on the high end. Super changers tend to slow a lot after 80%, My only concern is the Im guessing the change % on the Tesla display is prob not exactly battery %. That may not matter as I think the main issue is stay kinda in the middle unless you need the range.

thanks... was wondering why the 45-55% available stored energy data reading is missing from the table?

Very interesting presentation. I have a polestar 2 but I'm not sure of the battery chemistry. Is it the same as your Tesla as if so I will seriously consider doing the same as you as I only do short journeys too. Could you let me know please?

Great info to think about. It’s a similar discussion to how many kms should you drive before an ICE oil change for maximum longevity.

Interesting my BYD has a 60KWhr LiFePO blade battery configured 126S1P. The recommendation is to charge it to 100% once per week. Our daily driving during the week uses about 60%. Consequently we slow charge it (AC3KW) each Sunday (mainly using solar panels) to 100%. We only fast charge on trips, typically at the 50KW rate. Under fast charging, charging efficiency and rates decrease markedly over 85%, with a good deal of energy lost as heat. So when fast charging we normally stop at 80-90%, particularly if the weather is warm. The BMS rolls the fast charge back anyway over 90%. On trips we mainly operate between 15% and 90% for an effective range of 300km between top ups. On routes we mostly drive, this works well. So far we have not detected any battery degradation.

Thank you so much for putting this information out there.

Great work to explain the study. I’m just wondering about the cycles to year calculation. If I discharge the battery from 80% down to 20% I need to charge it maybe once a week. If I use the range from 60% down to 40% I need to charge it maybe 2 times a week. So need more smaller cycles. Is then the number of cycles the battery can have before reaching the 90% mark for getting exchanged higher?

@marksjustimagine I understand and agree with the logic of not charging to 100% or discharging to near zero, however, one major flaw in the approach is that charging more regularly (daily) from 35 % to 75% SOC (40% for say 160 km) would require twice as many charging sessions as one charging cycle from 10% to 90% (80% for 320 km)

I travel for work and leave my car at the airport for 3 or 4 days in a row every week….so I have to account for phantom drain. I’ve stopped using sentry mode on my Tesla since it consumes about 10% per day 😯. Without sentry mode it only consumes about 1% per day.

Thank you for sharing such great information and for the time you took to gather it. If you could help me understand something? I still have a doubt about what is a battery charging cycle? Thank you!

Please where did you find that optimal SoC is 50% as you are mentioning at the end of this video?

Thanks for a very informative video. What about rate of charge: DC fast charging vs level two (destination) vs level one (trickle charge.) Is slower better or is there no difference in battery lifespan?

Thank you for the work you did here.

Very informative, thank you, I just bought a new ev on a lease so battery life is not too much of an issue, but i would like to buy a used ev after my 2 year lease, I do 15 miles per day so looking forward to a very long lasting battery when I buy one, the lease gives me time to decide which vehicle to buy and weigh up the pros and cons of Ev ownership 🙂

So to maximize the longevity of your battery only charge your battery up as much as you need between each charge cycle and charge more frequently smaller charging cycles. Also keep your vehicle in covered and environmentally controlled storage when not in use. Also it appears that 40% is the sweet spot so cycling between 30%-50% would appear to be better than cycling between 40%-60%.

Really good. Thanks. This one is well researched -- and there isn't any hidden agendas. There is so much bad information out there. My Tesla S has 216,000 kms -- and I've lost about 10% of capacity. I've tried to stay between 20%-80% SOC but I do many road trips so 50% of my charging has been on superchargers.

So what's more important, is it amount of charges you do or SoC regardless of charge cycles? I'm luck as I only use about 4% a day in my model 3 long range. If SoC is the primary factor then I should do something like 40-60 but if amount of charge cycles is primary then I should do something like 35-75. So which is it for my circumstance?

Nice briefing. Thanks. Nuno from Portugal.

Good video. Tesla does state a happy Tesla is a plugged in Tesla. Cheers 👍🏾

When these tests were performed were they using an actual car and the cars BMS, or were they just testing battery packs or even just cells in a lab setting? Seems the the manufacturers BMS would have a pretty large influence on the batteries and their lifespans, regardless of how much or how little you were charging. EDIT: Just looked at the article - they were testing batteries for handheld devices, not batteries for automotive use. Not sure these guidlines can be carried over directly.

Remember as total charge drops the cycle capacity also shrinks. They should normalize their data to full cycle discharges. So a cycle from 75%-25% is only half a full depth of discharge cycle.

I know my iPhone batteries have a lifespan more than double the length of everyone else in my home. And usually longer runtime each charge. Everyone else plugs their phone in overnight daily so it’s “fully charged” each day. I never plug in until after I get the 20% warning and whenever I am able, try to unplug between 80-90%. The info in this video seems to concur.

The question should be how much will the cost of the battery will be 5-10 years from now to replace. Might only cost a few thousands to replace a battery at the rate of how fast the cost is dropping. Also, by then there will be more fast charger available like gas stations. So do u want to pay a little extra for less inconvenience?

Excellent info, thanks !!

If I were to do what that chart said, I think I’d extend my battery only 4 more years. I only charge once a week, which is a 100-25% discharge cycle. 1000/52weeks = 19 years. My bigger concern is the temperature being in a hot area. Daytime temps get up to 40C regularly. Now, I could absolutely reduce my max charge and get a longer life but I think I can stick with the 100% for now. Maybe I’ll drop it down to 80 when it gets realllllly hot

Hi there! Could you please be so kind and explain how can you relate the 1000 (Number of DST Cycles) to 3 years as the duration for a battery that is being charged on the range 25% -100 SoC @ 20ºC? And the following numbers (estimated duration of 6 years, etc). Thank you! Regards from Lisbon, Portugal!

Great video. Very informative

Very nice chart to examine and think about. Its funny but I find plugging in to charge at home just enough of a bother to not want to do it so often and wish my Kia got 400 miles of range instead of 275 or less in the Winter. Since I really don't want to get caught too low on one of my slightly longer trips and have to use an expensive and notoriously undependable fast charger I regularly home charge to 90 % to have more usable range. And just to remind myself to charge I usually plug back in at 50%. I wish they had tested a few more variables so I could see more closely what my 90 - 50 % system is doing. Thanks.

One more thing to consider is the usable battery capacity. Depending upon the model that range can be from 90 - 96% very roughly from only looking at a couple of models. That's programmed in by the manufacturer to ensure that the battery does not charge to 100% and shorten the battery life. Check this out and maybe you can charge your battery to a higher level than you may otherwise think.

A great summary thanks Mark

This was an excellent review of battery life and charging practices. Well done. I just bought my EV and was very stressed about the state of charging since I drive 65 miles a day and do not have access to a fast charger close to home. Thank you for sharing this useful information. 😅

You need to normalize the data for amount of battery used. For instance the 75-25 cycle gets you 5x the driving distance of 75-65 yet it lasts more than 1/5 of the cycles. So based on this chart a 75-25 cycle seems to be the best option. Just don’t charge it every day. I’d take a look at you median daily drive and make sure that you battery covers probably 3-4 times that distance at minimum. Then plug it in only when you get to 25% and then charge to 70 or 75%. There is also time degradation which is why you don’t want an overly massive pack unless you do frequent long trips. Basically the first gen electrics with 100miles or so range are probably the sweet spot for most people.

My 2021 Standard Range MG5 is now 56,000 into its life. Probably around 90% of charging is on my home charger at 7kW. I always fully charge it to 100% daily. SOH as confirmed on its recent service is 99%. It still returns an average of 4.2 miles / kWh and the range is the same as when it was purchased new. MG have certainly got an excellent BMS and Thermal Control System in the car.

I’ve just ordered a Skoda Enyaq. This is very interesting information. I won’t do a great mileage, so I’ll only charge once a week at home. But I’ll probably set the maximum charge to 75% and then charge back up at 40%. Good video and well explained.

Cutoffvoltage at tesla is at 3.3v so 0% charge is actually more or less 10-15%

Thank you, finally some real research based information! I think I'm gonna reduce my charges to 80% from now on and charge twice a week instead of trying to go all week on one charge 🙂 Have you found any info about cell balancing? Some say that you should charge to 100% once a month to balance the cells

Graph at 12:00 : it appears that Yellow is better than purple - but its not. The purple covers a 30% cycle min/max- 3 times more power than the yellow (10% cycle min-max), so I need only charge up a third of the number of times. In fact purple has half the number of cycles at 90% capacity retention, so is providing 50% more mileage. Purple looks optimum on this basis so one should aim for keeping charge in the 45% to 75% range, but dropping to 25% is not a disaster as the blue line shows only a minor degradation hit.

Thanks for posting this video…!!! It will be very helpful…!!! Nice t-shirt too…!! Regards from 🇲🇽

With the information, I got that the best range is obtained with 75%/25% or 75%/45%, with this formula (.75−.25)×360×3000 My car has an autonomy of 360km, and at the 75/25 range it gives about 3000 cycles, that means 540,000km, and the same amount of km on the 75/45. If using 75/65, the km reduces to less than 400,000, and with 85/25 to less than 500,000, so the best is 75/25

Very informative ❤ thanks.

Curious, why did you decide to not top off each night? We have been the same as you with our Tesla but I had read somewhere adding frequently small amounts of charge 10% (50-60 SOC) was better than waiting two nights and adding 20% all at once.

i charge my tesla only to 50% usually thats where it sits 90% of the time if ive got longer distances i charge it a little more just before hand. i havent needed to be outside of 40-60% in the past 6 months

Very interesting, I have set mine for daily drive to 65% charge and discharge will land around 40% as I use about 25% on my daily commute. No degradation yet after 3.5k miles.

Thank you, and what about calendar degradation?

Good information to consider. Thanks.

Thank you 😊 Very good information! I guess many EV owners are charging to a to higher SoC - it’s another way of doing things than in a ICE car 🚙

About a year ago I was reading another study that suggested maintaining the charge between 35% and 65% was ideal.

Interesting stuff, thankyou. Question though; if you use the “best” data line and charge from 65% to 75% range daily won’t that count as a “cycle” and give you let’s say 30 miles for 1 cycle? (My Ioniq5 gets about 30 miles per 10%) Someone who charges from 10-90% zone will have 240 miles per cycle. So even though his battery will last fewer cycles, he will perform a charging cycle much less frequently and perhaps get the same mileage life from his battery. Guess I’d like to see the data results presented as miles of service rather than # of cycles. Does the data show that indeed your battery lifetime “miles” will be optimized by useing a zone such as 65-75%?

Great video, I learnt a lot. Thanks.

Thank you 😊

Great info/video, thanks!

Thanks very much for this article - mate (Adelaide Aussie). I have an LFP Tesla (2023) and only use 4% each day to and from work (as per your assemssent of average). So i dont need to charge it more than once a week unless we drive it into the country side...ie over the weekend. What this site doesnt say is how to optimally charge an LFP battery. Now as you know Tesla says to charge it up to 100% once a week, but having read most of the article on the linked site, this doesnt make complete sense - espcially for low km Aussie's. Have you done any further reading on LFP since writing this and can you comment on my assessment from this reading - to only charge (even an LFP EV) up to about 85% and down to 45% to optimise battery longevity? PS I have a trickle charger and a 7.0kw charger (Tesla Wall Connector -V#3) so I can nominally do what is best...just need to get peer review advice? PPS dont like following generic models made for masses. P

Is there a comparable study specifically on FLP batteries?

The is the best video on EV batteries!!!! Thank you:)

There are two ways to measure cycle life. One, is to count the number of times the car is driven, and the number of times it is plugged in to recharge. The other way, is to measure throughput. That is the total number of amp hours the battery puts out over its lifetime, divided by its rated amp-hour capacity. (sometimes referred to as "equivalent cycles") I do believe this would be the most relevant, because that translates to the total miles the battery lasts in an electric vehicle, before it needs to be replaced. In many cases, the best margins would be between 30% to 70% states of charge. Most manufacturers recommend 30 to 80%, to use the middle 50% of total capacity on a day-to-day basis. Occasional charges to 100% aren't too detrimental, as long as the car is driven immediately after the full charge, and is done only on the occasional long trip where you really need all the capacity the battery has to offer. You don't want to charge to 100%, then leave it at that state of charge for a full day. I was looking at the cycle life graph of a Trojan golf cart battery, (liquid filled deep cycle lead acid)and calculated the total equivalent cycles, and it didn't make any difference whether the battery was discharged 80% down to a 20% state of charge, or, if it was drawn down 20% to an 80% state of charge. The total ampere hours available over its lifespan was the same! (keep in mind, Lead Acid batteries REQUIRE charging to 100%, to avoid sulfation)

I've read somewhere that to expose battery charging system to extended charging periods with low current it's harmful, not for the battery itself but for the elements involving in the charging process. Could this be true? Thank you for the excellent presentation, from Greece.