Thanks for taking the time to show people this. This was so frustrating I was ready to throw all the old brass out or get rid of the gun to a non-reloader.
Thx for the video I also have a Winchester model 70 in 270 WSM always have issues with new ammo fitting inside chamber and all my reloads where the same. After finding your video I tried Just pushing the shoulder a 1/4 more and like magic it works wonderfully now. Thank you for the advice. Now I have a great shooting and very accurate 270 WSM. 😀
Thanks for the info - this confirmed a suspicion I had about some rounds I loaded for a bolt action target rifle. The issue you had mirrored mine. My cases had 4-5 firings before I experienced the problem.
Interesting. Learned something today. I have been reloading 30-06 hunting loads for 50 plus years and your experience was new to me. Having said that, this is something that I have been doing for 50 plus years. I started reloading military brass that i fired through my Springfield rifle. What I learned is that, neck sizing is all that is required for bolt action rifles as long as the original brass/bullet was fired in my one hunting rifle and none other. This is the important part for neck sizing and It makes resizing/ reloading long bottle neck cases much easier.
Thank you! I have never heard of this or even knew RCBS even made the other dies. Oh my, I'm actually going to load some .300 WSM this week. Great cartridge! Great video!
I fixed this same issue by taking 20 thousandths off of the top of a shell holder. Used a flat surface and some 1000 grit sand paper. Took some time as the shell holders are hardened. I sanded for awhile, ran a case through it, then try it in the rifle. I repeated the process until the round fit. You could really notice a difference when it got around the 15 thousandths. Got to remember that shell holders and dies are mass produced.
@@nt_wicked_bunch2717, Right My Redding shell holders are size .002 - .010 so i would need to remove more material off if needed. Thanks for the instruction vid.
I had the same problem. Have a lot of brass I picked up at the range. Bought a bunch of SB RCBS dies to fix the problem. Also bought some Lyman case gauges. I saved so much brass through the years. I finally decided to keep only certain head stamps for each caliber. They are not from the same lot. But still come out accurate enough for me. Although I just bought some Peterson brass. Going to try the premium stuff finally.
Also... After using the small BASE die 1 time, If you reload for ONE firearm and reload again with the "NOT SMALL BASE DIE" the brass should chamber again in the same gun w/o needing the small base die...
I had the same problem with .308 Lake City Brass that I was using to reload for my AR10. Spending countless hours trying to find some way to fix the same issue Google showed me your video, I’ve a RCBS short die in route as I post this. Thank you, thank you you’ve saved my sanity, or at least prolonged it haha.
I know your comment is 2 years old. I have 7.62 lake city once fired that is very likely machine gun fired and i can not chamber it. I have 3 sizing dies including a small base and none are helping. Was wondering how it worked for you and if you were dealing with 7.62 or 308 lake city brass? Thank you
In my experience it depends... Depends on the rifle being used, depends on the brand of die. My issue was that a Lee FL die wouldn't resize some 308 to pass my Lyman ammo checker, so I bought a FL die set made by RCBS and it worked the brass a little harder and it all passed my ammo checker. Lee offered to send me a different size die in exchange but I opted to try another brand first. In my particular case, I didn't have to go to the small base die set. Just depends on what your goal is to overcome the issue. Also, all of my brass would chamber in my rifles, just didn't like that some were passing my ammo checker and some wasn't. Last thing to note, I was resizing 3 different brands of brass fired from different rifles. So they were all stretched in different places and different amounts out of spec, so needed to all be resized a little differently.
I am currently having the exact issue with my .308 brass by Hornady. Lee FL sizing is passing most Lyman Ammo Checker test, some tend to still be sticking out at the top. I may buy an RCBS FL die like you did. It is frustrating trying to find out why some were passing, and some were not. Thank you for your testimony.
I cheat, I take a .010 feeler gauge and trim it to fit in the shell holder . Put the brass on top of it to take up the slack and run it through my die. Works like a champ and my bolt closes. 👍
I have had the same issue for the last 8 years. I was able to get my bolt to close tight but it was more difficult on my son's rifle. My first thought was that when the expanding ball pulled back up through the neck it stretched the shoulder up. A friend had an extra set of dies from some one that gave them up (equally frustrated), I removed the expanding ball on the second set and resized my brass twice. Once with the expanding ball then again without. Brass worked better but was still tight. My thought was then that I needed to "bump the shoulder back a little" but the die was in contact with the shell houlder. After some thought and reluctance I placed a length of emery cloth on a flat surface and polished the top of the shell holder until the tight caming issue was resolved. I have yet to see if my modification effects brass life.
Also, be careful of trying to pre-load the press with an additional quarter turn of the die. You will move your headspace further back and cause chaos had separation after a couple of reloads. The small bass die is definitely the way to go. Stay safe.
I always recommend a headspace case gauge and a SAAMI minimum chamber ammo checker for any ammo you reload for if you reload for non-custom chambered guns. I get a decent supply of free second hand once fired rifle brass for common calibers, so everything I reload for goes through a small base die. First the brass case must pass a headspace gauge. Second, it must pass a SAAMI minimum chamber ammo tester. If it does not pass these checks after two resizing and checking attempts, it goes in the garbage. All the ammo I have reloaded within published safe limits that passed these two checks has always chambered and went bang for me.
Inside diameter of full length die is .556, inside diameter of small base die is .553. Once or twice fired brass was sizing appropriately in the full length die, three times fired brass would not size through full length die and required the small base die to squeeze brass back down in size that would chamber.After firing 3x's the brass was measuring .556-.557, becoming very stiff to cycle out of the chamber and was only sizing back to .556 in full length die. After sizing through small base die the previously measured .556 brass would measure .554, it sprang back from .553 (die size) out to .554 on some cases but that still allowed brass to fit in chamber.RCBS says this of "small base" dies...... RCBS Small Base 2-Die sets are useful for reloaders loading for semi-automatic, pump action and lever action rifles to help ensure that proper functioning. Small base sizing dies size brass to minimum specifications and help to ensure that cartridges will chamber every time. Due to the fact that this product sizes more than regular dies, it is crucial to have a sufficient amount of high quality lubricant to prevent stuck cases
If the force needed to size is high, I change the case lube to a smidge of auto grease, cases size easier and allow the die to go full length rather then stopping short .040 - .050" which is easy to miss.
I had a problem trying to reload 5.7x28 brass. The RCBS die set that I bought was too tight and it scraped the polymer coating on the brass thus ruining it. I then got a set of Lee dies for 5.7x28. These were made to a larger tolerance and, they did not scrape the polymer. The problem then was the cartridges were too large to pass through my checking gage. So I made another pass with the RCBS die. This time the RCBS not only did not scrape the polymer but also resized the brass further so that it would pass muster in my checking gage. I had to use a copious amount of Imperial sizing wax with both dies. Curious.
I have been having the exact same problem with my .30-06, Savage action bolt. I have spent hours, after re-sizing and trimmimg my brass actually running each unloaded case through the chamber. About half will not chamber, so, I have thrown the brass away. (Recycled, actually.) Thank you for the vid. I am going to order the small base dies and see what happens.
I don't think this is the problem. The binding occurs at the base of the case before the neck even gets close to being chambered. But, thank you for your input.
I have a 223 wssm. It will not fit after 2 reloadings. All the measurements seem the same. Not the web like your 300wsm. I cannot check the angle of the shoulder. I think it must be it. I neck sized and maybe needed full length sizing? Thanks for your video. It all helps.
CAPS 2C NOT SHOUTING. I AM THE LATEST TO FALL INTO THE NOT FULL SIZE DIE TRAP. HAVE JUST ORDERED SMALL BASE DIES, BOTH RCBS AND READING. HOPE THEY WORK.. PS THANK YOU FOR TAKING THE TIME TO MAKE YOUR VIDEO… JR SRQ FL.
Ive never seen a semi auto rifle in 300WSM. Im surprised you found a short base die set in stock for a 300wsm, Ive never seen it nor have did I even know that RCBS made that die. I have a 270WSM but haven't had this issue before
Been handloading for my m&p10 for a few months and allllll my handloads chamber and fire without fail. I got my first bolt action Tikka T3 chambered in 308. I took it to the range with some handloads I had made up and we didn't not have a good first date at the range...lol. 308 Base spec .470 Chambered and fired formed new federal .469 Handloads that wont chamber .469.5 - .470. Any new brass chambers easily with no scratches on the casing after being fired. Any handloads that wouldnt chamber would leave scratches along the side of the case. Hopefully this will work
That scar looks like it is right at the head. Most full length dies will not resize the solid head area. I had a bad batch of new brass with the head oversize. It took a LOT to swage that head down and most got stuck. I looked at the SAAMI specs for brass and returned it for a different lot. The drawing you have is a rough drawing. SAAMI specs are online. Small Base my butt. If my full length dies won't resize. I'm sending them back. I really hate the word "Bubba", but have seen so many "cures" for reloading with bad dies and chambers lately that it just comes to mind. I have never had that happen unless I overloaded the brass and the head eventually started to grow. After thousands of rounds of high power reloads, some reloaded so many times the cases started to get hairline cracks where it thinned out.
I am having the same problem with my Kimber 300 WSM. But only with the nickel cases, brass cases chamber easier but still not great. Thanks for sharing!!!
Joseph Parsons you bet, after using the small based die set I never had another issue chambering anything I sized for that gun regardless of how many times the brass had been fired.. I believe I've heard / read that nickel-plated cases are stiffer which would make sense that it'd be harder to size them back down.
Good video I went through this some 8 years back with 308 when I had to load for HK 91 and M1A 7.62x51 or service rifle 308 good explanation I was surfacing through lyman case gauge saw your video watch it to the end
Do you still full length size the rounds before you use the small base die set or are you just using the small base die set. Will the small base die set bump the shoulders also.
Donald Sharpless , No need to full length size, just use the small base set. I would have to look at the specs but I don't believe that in this particular die set anything is different than the base, no change to how it sizes the shoulder.
No , think about what you said. In a standard chamber all you need is full length sizing die. If you have a custom gun with a tight chamber , then you would have had a die made for it. Small base dies are for semi auto rides. I use them for my at 15's,10'sand some old 742. Now as for the SAM have a 300 WSM sniper rifle it has a tight chamber all I use full length sizing die. Yes I know all chambers are not the same. Trust me when you take 762 brass out of a 240 , turn that in to 6·5 creed more and neck turn that,, load it . Run it in a gas gun. And itworks.Trust me you can't do any of that with out a case forming die. If I had to pic between the to I would pic the case forming die. That my 2 cents.
I have a fairly new rifle that when you shoot factory loads in it , before I can get the brass in a sizing die , I must trim and burr the neck , then after that it will go in to the sizing die but when it comes out , it must be trimmed again ,,,this rifle almost shoots one hole groups at a hundred yards with any ammo.
I am wondering how the primers fit in the primer pocket. Typically if the base of the cartridge expands this far, primers just fall out. I’ve had this with a 270 and a 300 WinMag.
All rifles and chambers are different. You probably have a tight or slightly smaller chamber than the average 300 WSM rifle, possibly an almost worn out reamer. A good lesson for all reloaders !
Hornady dies are generally considered similar to RCBS Small Base die sets. I much prefer RCBS dies over Hornady, but if you don't have any other option for your cartridge or local availability, the Hornady dies might be worth a try.
My regular Hornady full length die does this on a new 6.5cm barrel but my Lee you can't feel the bolt closing ~80% of the time. Also when the rounds got stuck they got STUCK.
I have a question about using the small base resizer. Will the small base resizer increase notable pressure more than the FL resizer? If so, I am worried about pressure spikes even though I load my .308 nowhere near the max loadings.
There should be no pressure differences between the two, the difference is a small base sizer is working the brass a little more to get that base sized down for pump action and semi auto rifles. But the load pressures should be insignificant between the two
It's 2021 right now and I found this video, before you buy a new set of dies check your shell holder. I was resizing some 308 and 30/06 pick up range brass and ran into the same problem on BOTH rounds all of a sudden and I had been using those dies for over 35 years. What I had found was I had purchased a couple extra shell holders to put in my priming tool and trimmer so I wasn't swapping my original holder all the time. Somehow one of the new shell holders ended up in my Rock Chucker press and it turned out the upper surface of the holder was thicker, .012" thicker. When the top of the shell holder contacted the base of the die and stopped there still was .012" of travel to go, the brass was not being fully resized. I threw out those shell holders and replaced them with a set of RCBS holders, problem solved.
Good insight still. Lots of people run into this type of issue and are looking for solutions so your comment may give them one that fixes their problem.
@@samuelcarstens6152 I've run into that problem more than once and with other peoples equipment so I just run the shell holders down to a local machine shop and have them run through a surface grinder so they match a RCBS holder. Cheaper than buying new and will resize to SAMMI specs. The competition units will allow you to resize under spec, they just assume you know what you're doing.
i need advice as well guys. Ive had the same issue, when i turn it down so that it resizes down far enough, my brass becomes so difficult to pull out of the die. ive tried multiple dies, rcbs sent me their lube which made a slight difference but it should be this difficult. maybe i need a small base die set but for now im wondering if im doing something wrong or if its just the die? reloading: 223/556 once fired from an ar-15 for my remington 700 223 bolt action die set: RCS full length die set for 223
Yup.. I've been having the same problem with 308 Win LC military fired brass- just won't resize.. I have an RCBS small base die enroute.. hope that solves my problem.
@John Beige Yes.. I use Lee dies for all the calibers I reload.. I recently resized 1500 mix mil and civilian 308 Win range brass using a Lee full length die. I tested each one for size using an LE Wilson brass case gauge and almost all fit-I rejected those that would not. Then I made some dummy rounds and tested them for fit in my Savage bolt action rifle.. Most would go into battery but not all.. I got a Sheridan slotted ammunition gauge and tested my dummy rounds and most would not fit.. I then tested all 1500 resized brass against the Sheridan and about half would not fit.. After researching this problem, I got an RCBS small base die and resized all the brass that would not fit the Sheridan. After that almost all fit the Sheridan and all would go into battery in the Savage.. I cycled a bunch thru my 308 semi auto and all went into battery.. Some reloaders are concerned about over working the brass, thereby limiting its useful life. I am reloading to make ammo for self defense and so it will probably not be reloaded a second time.. I do save my brass when I go to the range and so that will be reloaded more than once however primers are scarce and so I don't shoot for recreation, only to sight in my rifles. In the past, I reloaded a LOT of 5.56 using Lee full size dies and tested all against a Lyman steel case gauge.. I never had a problem with that ammo going into battery.. however, in future I will test it against a Sheridan slotted ammunition gauge just to be sure.. Hope this lengthy reply answers your questions..
I think that the rounds fired in your own gun will be fine for reloading after resizing. Either that or maybe the chambers on there WSM's are a bit oversized ?
While I do agree with the 'remedy' that the presenter arrives at (going with SB dies), I did notice one minute detail which could make things go just a bit better. He indicates that if he forces an expanded casing, it results in light abrading on the brass near the base of the casing. This tells me that his particular chamber is on the tight side of specification and just a bit rough near the cartridge base and might be improved by a light chamber polishing. This polishing would also help case extraction should he be shooting this 300WSM in hot weather with near max loads. Something to think about...
I had assumed my chamber may be on the tighter end of tolerances, but being short on gunsmithing experience, and patience with this rifle, this was what I found worked. Great insight.
I ran into the issue tonight reloading 300 WSM for the first time, glad I seated only 1 bullet first and checked. I'm using Lee full length sizing die. My rifle is Winchester XPR. Federal brass, once fired, 180 gr Federal big game bullet. Thanks for making the video. I'll measure a factory load and compare tommorow. I have a Tikka T3 to compare chambering in also.
Would you know the base measurement for a 270 WSM. I have the exact same Nosler Reloading Guide and it doesn't list it for the 270 WSM. I think the 270, 7MM, and the 300 in the WSM's are all the same. The only diff is the shoulders I think. Of course the neck Diameter.
I'm not sure of that on the 270 WSM, as you have probably found, the 300 WSM, 7mm WSM, and 270 WSM have the same base, neck angle, and length of brass, so I would assume that the .555 maximum off the base is a requirement for all 3, the 7mm WSM shows that in the Nosler manual as well, but I can't say for sure. It does seem logical however, you can measure the inside of your full length die to check, I would assume it is like the 300 WSM was. Just inside towards the base, the die measured .556, but it couldn't size down below that after the rounds had 4 or more loads through them. Then I found the small base set that measured .553 and kept them under that .555 size every time. I believe they stayed at .553 regardless of how much use they had when I used the small base set.
TY, learn something new everyday. My 270 WSM Lee FL die measures .548. My casings measure .5525. I must be getting some springback but as long as the casings stay under .555 i'm good. Thanks to you, I now know my chambering problem is not the bases but I need more shoulder bump which has been a problem from the beginning. These WSM's seem to be pretty hard to bump the shoulders back. I guess it's because of the steep angle.
Donald Sharpless I use the Forster neck/shoulder bump die to bump the shoulders back efficiently. My problem is how expensive Nosler brass can be for the .300 WSM.
This is just an idea... Try using a bit more lube right where the case is not getting sized correctly.. The added lube has a hydraulic effect and does take space.. maybe enough that you won't have to buy another set of dies???
I'm not there with hands on to see if your FL die is adjusted to touch the shell holder during the sizing operation. If they don't touch you are not fully sizing the brass. # 2 you can size a loaded round by removing the decapping rod with the expander ball. # 3 if you are crimping and the crimp die is coming down just a little too far it will bell out the shoulder and the round won't chamber. Even small base dies won't fix those mistakes.
It was set up correctly to size the full length of the case, I believe I even set it up to cam over slightly to try and fix it, which still didn't help. I think I concluded the chamber was on the tight end of things, and the brass was blown out and couldn't be sized down far enough with a FL die. The small base set fixed it, but I no longer have the rifle anyhow.
I found a ton of reloaded .348 ammo and most of it is oversized at the base, some would hang out 3/8 of an inch out the chamber. So I pulled the bullet and resized, checked the shells in a gage made to Sammi .348 chamber specs because the Wilson gages are way to sloppy to check the diameters. This fixed my problem. But I did consider using another full length sizing die with the bottom of the die turned off (or ground back) maybe .010 or so and cutting the shoulder sizing part out of the die as to not push the shoulder back. ( might still do this trick as the small base dies might not exist).
this question is for everybody. I had the same problem with my dies, when i went to turn it a bit more so it sizes down further my brass was becoming so hard to push in or get out of the die. was everyone having that issue as well when working with the full length dies?
I would guess that you went too far down with the die so that the brass couldn’t easily form as it was compressing more than intended, do the necks need trimmed for length? Not sure Exactly why but those are type of things I would start considering
Ok so my question is this, why would you ever buy a full length set when you can just get the small base and rock on. Is there a circumstance where small base set will cause issues if the brass was otherwise in tolerance?
Joshua Mitchell that's a good question. I don't have all the answers but here are some of my thoughts as to why, first this is something that I believe is unique to Magnum calibers, what I'm referring to as having a specification of the size of the case at the base near your shell holder. If you look at Weatherby cartridges the Winchester magnum the 7mm Remington Magnum or the 300 short magnum as in this video, there is a specification for a maximum case size a certain distance from the base of the case and the overall dimension of that portion of the case. I believe it has to do with the pressures exerted on the brass from those Magnum loads, if you were to compare a 30-06 a 270 Winchester a 280 Remington a 308 Winchester none of those cartridges and especially those below those sizes will have a belt at the base of the brass, they don't exert enough pressure for the base of the case to expand enough that they need to have an extra sizing Dimension there (of the Magnums I listed previously this 300 short mag is one that does not have a belt and is probably even more prone because of that to have extra pressure expanding the brass of the base). If you think about a 30-06 or a 270 the case is long enough that there's enough brass for the pressure to be spread across, however on a 300 short magnum there's a very short case that exerts a lot of pressure across a shorter distance, therefore the base of the case is getting worked harder and the brass is expanding more than with say a 30-06. So I believe that answers a question as to why these cases could run into those problems just as a Weatherby or Winchester Magnum or Remington Magnum could, as to why not you always use a small base die set? Many Reloaders (not me) but Precision Shooters will size just the neck of the brass to accept a new bullet when reloading, they leave the brass fire formed to fit their chamber exactly and do so in hopes to obtain greater accuracy. I've never gone down that road and I couldn't speak to what the accuracy changes are available or other reasons they do so but accuracy is one of them. So if you were to use a small base die set you essentially would every time you chamber around have a looser fit between the cartridge and the Chamber of your rifle, in the situation of a pump, lever action, or autoloading rifle that's beneficial in that you ensure that the brass will cycle out effectively after it's been fired, a bolt action rifle that's less of a concern as you're the one who is using the force to extract that cartridge, therefore precision Shooters can leave tighter brass in their Chambers because they're not relying on the semi-automatic or lever action to extract that brass.
Great Info thanks a lot! I have been having this exact issue with my .308. My bolt action had the exact same issue. I was checking brass after resizing they fit fine. After seating the bullet the walls popped out and were sticking. I was loosing my mind trying everything. I have a question. Does the small base die fl Resize the brass ? Thanks again
Sounds to me you my be either crimping the bullet slightly before the depth is finished and could be compressing back the shoulder a bit or over rolling the crimp. Also if the case is not trimmed consistently the longer cases will over crimp and the neck can swell up and cause this problem
I have a rcbs in 6.5 and no matter what I've done if i run a case through it it wont chamber new dies new Tikka rifle iam going to buy a different set I've ruined about 10 before i new i had problem and then another 10 trying to figure it out if that's the problem rcbs is getting a nasty email from me.
I reload for. Ten different calibers and my three hundred w s m has always been a bit of a problem child I had to work with a lot more than the other 10 calibers that I do, it's. Finicky I guess
How is it that RCBS gets to sell dies called FULL LENGTH SIZING DIE, that won’t size brass sufficiently to fit in a rifle chamber of the same caliber? What next, “Super Duper small base” dies when small base are no longer sufficient?
Small base dies are intended for "autoloading and semi auto" This rifles chamber was apparently at the max of the range, and the dies barely size to meet the max spec, they dont size down below it. With the brass springing back after sizing they couldn't size down far enough after multiple firings. I don't fault RCBS, its just how things are now and then between the manufacturing tolerances. I also believe that these short fat cases are much more prone to an issue like this.
I find it amusing the Die company’s deliberately force the “small base” Dies on rifle owners. Just because a chamber is a bit tight in diameter has nothing to do with case length. If Saami max is 376 a die should diameter size at .004 under. That has nothing to do with length. What keeps a round in place in a chamber is the head space. That is from the bolt face to the angle above the shoulder. No one should have to buy the so called short base Die. It has nothing to do with length.
i need advice as well guys. Ive had the same issue, when i turn it down so that it resizes down far enough, my brass becomes so difficult to pull out of the die. ive tried multiple dies, rcbs sent me their lube which made a slight difference but it should be this difficult. maybe i need a small base die set but for now im wondering if im doing something wrong or if its just the die? reloading: 223/556 once fired from an ar-15 for my remington 700 223 bolt action die set: RCS full length die set for 223
223 brass shouldn’t be that difficult, maybe upload a video of die set up, case prep (lube amount) and then running it through the die, post a link in the comments and I could give my opinion.
You've probably figured it out by now--or not--but cases stick at the base, and if you're not lubing the base, that's why you're sticking. Forget that nasty RCBS lube, use Imperial resizing wax. You won't stick a case and it's much less nasty.
