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People live fascinated with the twist of the season 2 finale, but the series became the gem it is because of eps. 3, 4, 5 and 6 (S2). The finales of both seasons were good, but Boar on the Floor ("Hunting" in general), Kendall's suicidal vulnerability and his relationship with his family (ep. 4), the arrival of the Pierces, the final fight between Nan, Logan and Rhea, and the politics behind it, are the reasons Succession soared. It was in those four moments that S. went from having a slow pace to becoming HBO's most ambitious series. From Hunting to Argestes, Succession crystallized its ambition and could show what it would represent culturally as a mega-series. Love all this.
@@freedomm This may be an unpopular opinion, but the more I watch seasons 1 and 3, the more I fall in love with season 2. Everything about Hunting, Argestes, Tern Haven and D.C. worked perfectly. And Cherry Jones' staging in both episodes was sublime. The Pierces, the Roys and Rhea elevated Succession to the top. And I very much doubt that the producers of Succession can top that set of episodes (and D.C.).
Just noticed that the Roys + Gerri are all in black while the Pierces are wearing white (Naomi wearing black and white symbolic of her mediating both sides). God damn
I must have watched this scene 20+ times. It is a masterpiece. Logan is desperate for the deal to materialize and yet he refuses to be cornered. That is what makes him what he is - strong, ruthless, fierce, respected and successful.
Their negotiation was so moronic, Imagine you went to a car dealership and make an offer, they agree and then later ask you even more money and when you say yes to that BS they add "also I don't like the way you drive so fast, could you gift this car to your daughter ?" Either you sell it to him or not but don't ask for his money and in the same breath dictate what the fuck to do with his company.
@1:46 love the look on her face when he goes to 25 billion. You can see on her expression how hungry she is for the cash even though she's banging on about ethics. Great acting all round in this scene.
Logan was a brilliant business man. He wanted this deal more than ever but still could never let someone else dictate his heir; even though both him and the other party wanted Shiv to succeed. He still rolled the dice on them caving, which they did.
@@potatorecipe742 he was trying to groom her but obviously it'll take time despite her connections she has no experience being an executive in the corporate world - but she wanted it NOW NOW NOW - such a brat
@@never152 but Logan is just dealing in bullshit too. He was going to name his daughter as his successor, he already decided. This was also the only viable was at the time to stop a takeover of his company. He was willing to trade away billions of dollars more and put his company at risk, only because he didn’t like being told what to do……that’s not business, that’s childish
It’s interesting that they had Kendall in the room but not Roman. It’s also interesting that when they demand Logan name Shiv as his successor, the camera lands on Kendall looking disappointed, and pans to Logan looking at or near Kendall. On top of it being a power move, I’m wondering if the Pierces were slyly figuring out who Logan actually wants as successor.
That was it. The dinner bullshit that Shiv pulled obviously did not land well with everyone. And they felt like a true leader would not pull that shit. Hence they tested Logan's true ambitions. And they obviously weren't with Shiv. He always had eyes for Kendall. It was just his disappointment that he wasn't a killer like him. But from all his options, Ken has always been the true successor. Without Logan alive, Ken eats everything just as Logan did as Logan was his freedom's guillotine.
When asking for too much goes wrong. So often the people who do business with Logan can simply be given what they want if they just “take the fucking money” … but they always want to dig further and twist the knife into Logan. He senses it every single time and would rather walk away from a good deal than to have his own self dignity & pride chipped away as well.
Well Logan loves twisting the knife too. "Take the money" is not out of kindness or generosity, its purpose is to maintain complete dominion over his companies by not giving up any board seats, leadership roles etc. if he can help it.
@@vasvas8914 Logan saw her face quiver for more when he said the number. It's like the same deal when Logan confronted his kids at the karaoke bar. He realized a good deal was already in place with Mattson. Why ask for more? You'll only annoy the buyer when agreed upon numbers are already agreed upon.
@@moonlightfitz she really is something! Constantly talking about how she despises money talk while soaking them for every penny, and I’m talking about season 4. I love her!! 😂
logan's last line here is so brilliant because it both resonates with and mocks them at the same time; he's essentially saying: "see? im also a man of your level of intellect and depth of humanity--I love shakespeare! but this is purely business, not emotional: _take the fuckin money_ . "
i don't think that's accurate lol. i think what he means is we're all primal animals, just the green gold like every other greedy animal takes it, like i take it.
Except it’s not business to Logan. It’s pure emotion. At this point of the show he had already agreed with Siobhan she would be his successor. What the pierces are asking for is nothing he said he wasn’t going to do. This merger with the pierce was also their only viable option to prevent a takeover. Logan risks his entire company because he doesn’t like being told what to do.
@@ThePsychic24 he’s definitely mocking them and their family for being snobs about politics, education, and ethics. It’s also a great portrait of how many of these rich elites pretend to be activists but are really just money driven opportunists behind closed doors.
“You can buy our company for $25 Billion. But we also want to stay on the board, decide what goes on the air and pick who’s in charge.” Pierce isn’t cutthroat. She’s fcking delusional…
i mean shes one of the only characters outside of Marcia and occasionally kendall to ever own Logan in a business deal. its true shes delusional for not getting the maximum money but shes already probably a billionaire - it really doesnt make a difference.
She thinks it's a merger of equals, Logan is buying them not the other way around. Logan was quite generous with the other demands she really did push her luck.
@@solidoperative It's not technically a merger of equals but the purpose of the sale essentially was. Waystar had to bulk-up to avoid being taken over by Sandy, so if this deal fell through, Waystar would've been fucked. The Pierce family probably could have gotten away with their demands had Logan not been an expert negotiator
lol the word "demand" makes it sound like she was the one chasing Logan. Logan wanted Nan to accept a sale that went totally against her ethical code and she added a component to the sale that couldn't be reduced to a string of integers. It's not out of line to at least try your luck at doing some good.
My favourite part was how she says you can't put a price on what we do and then they ended up agreeing to the deal in the end of the episode cause there is always a number
Logan was able to hide what he really felt about leaving with no deal. He had an outburst in the helicopter. I thought he was okay leaving with no deal. Then at Argetes, Logan Roy, the powerful and scary man, chased Nan outside to the pickup area. Even banged on Nan's car door. I've never seen Logan so vulnerable and that upset before. Turns out he needed the deal more than Nan.
It would be good if they had a prequel series that showcases Logan Roy's rise from humble beginnings to wealth, and how he sold his soul to get there. Probably call the show 'Success'.
It's amazing how the Pierce family consider themselves the virtuous ones. Logan quiet, respectful and receptive. The Pierce's were rude, openly insulting them and making outrageous demands.
Imagine having a puppy and you are going to give it away. You are gonna make sure you arent gonna give it up to just anyone or make sure there are standards.
@@williamalfonso1373 He does address those concerns, he allows them editorial protection and agrees that Tom is to be kept away. They go too far by firstly demanding even more money and then try to dictate who will run Waystar, the overall company after Logan retires. The latter being the most outrageous and insulting demand.
@@solidoperative Well Its corporate America 🤣. You always try to squeeze out the most $, that's the point of negotiating. The seller tries to get the most, the buyer the least and once you reach an equilibrium, the deal is made.
@@williamalfonso1373 I think you are skipping over other key point so whilst I welcome your commentary on corporate America please don't try and portray it as the be all and end all of what I was saying when I made several good points. I did say dictating Logan's successor was an insult, and a demand which they later were forced to drop.
The costume design is so straightforward but effective. Black and white for the polar opposites, and mixtures of grey and white to indicate those with unclear allegiances or morals.
This was it. The scene that showcased Kendall's importance. The dinner nonsense that Shiv pulled obviously did not land well with everyone. And they felt like a true leader would not pull that shit. Hence they tested Logan's true ambitions. And they obviously weren't with Shiv. He always had eyes for Kendall. It was just his disappointment that he wasn't a killer like him. But from all his options, Ken has always been the true successor. Without Logan alive, Ken eats everything just as Logan did as Logan was his freedom's guillotine. At the end of the day, Ken tried to kill him and that is at least, the attempt of a killing, even if the person is not a killer at core. Logan always liked that but didn't like the ending. He didn't like that Kendall always placed himself in the position to fail.
I swear when she said that's her final offer, I was like "yeah Logan is going to get out and refuse" and I would do the same, sure they might have leverage against the Roy but Logan has the high ground and they can't demand more, he gave them more money but the succession is his not theirs to demand.
@@em.415 Ego!? A man who made a company from zero until it became the biggest company for news in the world, and you demand of him to name his successor the one you want!! I don't think it was his ego playing there, and I believe if there is anyone in his place would do the same. And we call it pride, sure too much of it is bad for you it not in this case.
@@napolien1310 I agree, Pierce went too far. Logan gave them more money, board seats, enshrined their editorial independence, ring fenced Tom and agreed to keep him away. They got too greed and it was not only unreasonable it was embarrassing to demand that of Logan especially when his offer was exceptionally generous and had agreed to every other demand.
Nan did not negotiate well in this scene. She was openly rude and insulting to Logan. She got an extra billion dollars for the sale but pressed for more. Logan played this hand perfectly - didn't speak when he didn't need to, held his emotions in check, was clear and decisive. And walking out called Nan's bluff. When you sell something you can't tell the buyer what to do with it. You sell to sell. Once it's gone it's gone forever!
This is why Logan was a true king. Contrast this with Kendall negotiating with the Vaulter guy in the first episode. Kendall was always out of his depth.
Logan knew he had her, she said "I THINK we would also like to have a conversation about managment" She said I think before what was supposedly an iron clad contigency to the deal. Saying I think shows a little uncertainity, like she was actually opening it up for negotiation. She blinked first and Logan saw that uncertanity and pounced. Sure it was just a feeling and he started to doubt himself after but in the moment his instincts were spot on.
*SEASON 4 SPOILER* I cannot believe that after all Logan went through to acquire Pierce in S2, after miffing it up and eventually selling to Gojo, that his kids bought it for less than half of what they agreed upon here, JUST to spite their dad. This show is unreal, I can’t wait to see where the rest of S4 goes.
Don't ever disparage the original Dallas, the reboot was liberal claptrap, but the original JR would have these 2 families washing his mercedes inside of 3 episodes
bruh, she doesnt. she's wayyy to self-absorbed in almost every sense and blames other ppl when it doesnt go her way. she thinks having an open marriage is normal while you can see in Tom's face its killing him inside.
@@Ty-io7bv 1. demands open marriage night of/before wedding 2. ignores their original plan for Tom to become CEO and jumps for it, while completely ignoring what his role will now be 3. Continues to sleep around while shaming Tom when he shows interest in another woman. (i.e "you can't sleep with her, I know her) 4. Blurts out that she's going to be next CEO at the Pearce/Roy dinner - destroying both her own and Tom's place in the pecking order 5. Starts playing both sides of the Kendall/Logan fence, and leaving Tom out of any of the plans 6. Encourages him to take the fall for the company and offer to go to prison for Logan 7. Shows absolutely zero empathy for him when he thinks he's going to Prison 8. Shows absolutely zero happiness for him when anything good happens to Tom, like avoiding Prison, Job promotions 9. Rejects sex with Tom every time he initiates, but demands it from Tom every time she initiates 10. Tells Tom she doesn't love him 11. Leaves Tom out of the sibling plan to remove Logan - finally forcing Tom to betray her and decide that he's going to go for it himself I probably left some things out. But yeah... Shiv is awful to Tom in every way, shape and form. However, this does make for an amazing series. And this is the most Shakspearian story there's been since probably the Godfather. And before that, it was actual Shakespeare.
Logan wants to buy Pierce because of pure ego. I recall Ewan watched those news. Nan Pierce is desperate for the money, but she's also used to being the power in the house. Siobhan seems annoyed that Logan is sidelining her. Kendall is broken and wingless.
I was happy Logan rejected her terms. All that self righteous b.s about money being fake but 25 billion is a hell of a lot of "fake stuff" and then still wanting control. Sell it or don't but for 25 billion I'll do as damn please with the business.
@@starlord6433 Extremely narcissistic. With their Shakespeare and PhDs.. and being greedy for money at the end of it all. At least the Roys are not pretentious hypocrites.
Lol you missed the whole point of this episode. What they series goes to great lengths to show is that at the end of the day it's all about the money. Even for the supposedly virtuous, cultured, moralistic Pierces. The money is the reason they agreed to meet in the first place. Look at her face when he increased the offer. That was greed. That's what the show wants you to see. That beneath it all, despite their differences in outlook, they're all driven by money. No different from Logan. Enough money can compromise anyone's lofty morals.
FYI people may not see Ken as capable but Shiv never had it and Logan knew it preety well. She was his last option not because she is a woman but she is not like him.
This was well played by Rhea. She clearly wanted Pierces to sell, yet she was pushing for more money so that Nan doesn't suspect she's in some kind of cahoots with Logan. Funny enough, she was later fired by Nan when Nan suspected her for this.
1. Logan wanted revange on Pierces for decades. 2.Logan need this deal to save his company and keep his control over it. 3.He’s more than willing to pay a ridiculous amount for pierce. But he refused the only demand left from pierce for this deal to announce a successor, even though he could shred this deal whenever and however he want later, like in multiple other occasions. I think the only explanation for his action here is that he doesn’t want to hurt any of his children’s chance to inherit his empire when he is still around to protect it.
This was a great episode of culture vs. non culture. If the kids were more like the Pierce kids, there may have been hope for them. But, look, all the opportunities in the world and they don't - and can't do anything! Do they play sports? Do they speak any other languages? Have they seen the world? Do they have an interest in art? They are bullshit. Just like Roman says at the end.
They should have sold to Logan right then and there. Nan later sells it to the kids in Season 4 for 10 bil. Her family could have walked away with 15 BIL more.
Logan knew they would ask for more. More than just more money cus they're just like shiv they hid behind the veil of being kind gentle generous and moral but they were ready to sell out for 10 then 25 then 10 again and they had to have the final say in everything.
