The Arrow Video Issue | Are they trying to satisfy everyone? | The end of Physical Media | 

"They're charging 18 pounds for a single movie yet you can watch it on the streaming service for free." Well it's not free, is it? The hike in prices doesn't seem to have stopped their limited releases sell out. All they need to do is slap a few slipcovers on something, sell it exclusively through Zavvi and whether it's collectors or scalpers, they're going to sell out. The market is clearly going to continue to support that when it comes to their physical media, and they're just catering to the streaming market at the same time. Makes sense really. People like us are going to be choosy with stuff like this (like the situation with their new releases hitting streaming first), but clearly there's a lot of people who aren't haha.

I can't really detect a problem with this business model: first stream a movie (try-out, first time viewing)... then decide if you like the movie enough to buy and own it. Perfect! I wish I was living in the UK!

Hey Graham, this is a topic you’ve been talking about with increased concern over the past few months and it something many of us have been noticing too. Arrow have been caught up in a bit of a flux lately, and is sadly not the sure fire Titan of boutiques that it once was. The pressures to continue growing as a premier Distribution Company must be immense. Acquiring licensing, remastering, creating new supplemental material, commissioning new artwork, etc is a costly enterprise especially now that competing Boutique brands have stolen much of their thunder. In such a niche arena profit margins must be extremely tight. Brand identity is crucial and it feels like Arrow have lost their way or are panicking a little, realising that they have lost a lot of ground to their competition. Arrow from the beginning became the champion of heavy-hitters in cult and genre filmmaking, Bava (father & son), Fulci, Argento, Romero, De Palma were all prominent. Forgotten classics and under appreciated gems were given the five star treatment, and fans of physical media were in awe. Quite rightly so. From the early days I was a diehard acolyte, like many people I have gladly spent thousands of pounds over the years on their past glories. Graham, we have spoken a couple of times about when we first had niggling worries. Arrow started releasing a couple of lacklustre titles , double/triple dipping Limited releases, Zavvi Steelbooks, etc. It seemed as though they had lost some of their mojo. I do think that the rise of the other Boutiques is what really started the trouble. Arrow got a little complacent. It was a case of the tortoise and the hare. All of a sudden dependable labels like Eureka MOC & Criterion retook the mantle of ‘Quality or Classic’ cinema, Indicator rose with its clean distinctive aesthetic design, and 88Films burst Arrows monopoly on Italian horror while pushing popular recognisable sub genres such as slashers, martial arts, etc. As you yourself pointed out recently Second Sight is now the vibrant distributor of the most essential Limited Edition Set, even improving on titles that Arrow used to release, case in point, ‘Dawn of the Dead’ & upcoming release of ‘Martin’. It could be view that Arrow have dropped the ball and allowed its competitors to look overtake its once majestic status. Competition from Labels from the US and the rest of the world have also hit hard. Collectors are more open to look across the globe. I think Arrow has an identity crisis. What are they known for? Genre and cult movies essentially. That’s why they unceremoniously dumped the awesome Arrow Academy Brand, they worried that it was watering down their core image, and they were losing to Criterion & MOC anyway. It seems as though this identity crisis has lead to a scatter gun approach, jumping into 4K, jumping onto the Streaming Bandwagon, more Double dipping, and more Limited Edition Boxsets. Companies are usually at their most vulnerable when they try to expand and push to the next level. This is probably why the Hut Group/Zavvi buyout needed to happen. A make or break move. It’s also interesting to see how Arrow compare with companies such a Vinegar Syndrome with regards to customer loyalty. VS definitely mine the more obscure exploitation oddities but do so with a more personal touch, you can feel their passion, their effort into presentation is exemplary, and their interaction with loyal customers seems a lot fresher. The Arrow that used to set forums alight during the cultlabs days have gone, they need to rekindle interaction again and connect with their fanbase before they go elsewhere. Saying all that, I’m still a huge fan & truly hope that they can settle. Their jump into 4K have been awesome, despite the Demons and Donnie Darko glitches (which were spotted and sorted quickly enough), I hope they can capitalise on these successes. I know they’ll always get my business, although I will be more particular (unless it’s a 4K transfer of Deep Red of Tenabrae 😉). For me the last thing I need is another streaming subscription, especially for a site where I own most of the films. I agree it’s odd to stream titles before the physical version goes on sale. I assume that Arrow are hedging their bets and preparing for the future, it does give the impression that they don’t have more faith in the shelf live of physical media (please forgive the bad pun).

The Arrow situation in regards to streaming is really hard to grasp. I've got the service and have watched about 4 titles, that I never would have picked up. It's making me rationalise what I'm paying for, and wanting to pick up. The big films I want I'll be buying physically, but seeing a lot of the titles on my shelf on a streaming service for a much lower cost does feel like it de-values them

When Arrow ditched their Academy range I pretty much gave them up as a go to label. I don’t suppose they even noticed. I have bought some since, of course, but only in sales. Actually I tend to buy more Second Run in the sales. Several other boutique labels seem to have begun to release the sort of titles Arrow used to have a bit of a monopoly on, in the UK. The very expensive 4K box sets I pretty much ignore now, not because I don’t like the films (not just Arrow) but because if I spend that much on one film (that I often have already) then I can’t afford two or three others I’d like. All the prices are going up, not just Arrow’s, and with the arrival of Radiance and Australia’s Imprint, my ability to buy anything is being systematically reduced all the time. I’ll not stop getting physical media, I don’t stream boutique films (apart from the Studio Canal films on ITVX and the selections free on Prime) so I just buy less. The YT reviewers seem to have more money than I do, but I love the discussions and join in when I can, as well as them helping to guide me on what might be worth considering.

Arrow strikes me like Shout Factory now. And I used to really like Shout! They seemed hip and cool with their titles, fun releases of Roger Corman movies, John Carpenter classics, underground music icons, classic TV sitcoms like WKRP. But recently they seem to be 'shooting fish in a barrel'? Nothing too exciting, rehashes, no great incentives to purchase anything. And streaming - like TV, many of these movies won't ALWAYS be there. And what happens when one wants to watch Pink Flamingos, or needs to watch Fog Of War for a school project and can't find it anywhere? And if any are found - do they have all the extras and insight still, or just a copy of the movie now for the curious? And like The Joker in Batman - "Hubba hubba hubba! Who do you trust? Me, whose got everything intact on disc with loads of extras. Or the Batman...? Wasting time searching for movies that aren't there anymore, or got corrupted due to a data glitch on the HD?"

I think Arrow have lost the plot. They're always having sales, they're bumping prices up on physical releases. It now seems to me that they're forcing prices up even more because they want us to subscribe to their channel instead. I think the end is nigh for them. They're no longer the 'go to' label. They're getting outbid on sought after titles.

The Criterion Channel is similar in that they have many of their titles which all the extras, but they never put it up before the physical releases. Strange to me that Arrow does

I don't pick up many Arrow titles anymore & I've not been impressed by hardly any releases they've put out in 2021, only the Battle Royale set has won me over enough to pick it up recently as it's a beautiful set & a film I love enough to feel a 4k upgrade pick-up was warranted. A Tale Of Two Sisters is cool though, looking forward to that one & will definitely pick it up.

Good video. It’s a double edged sword haha. It seems all the boutique labels are doing this nowadays 😢 I like streaming prior because I’ve done enough blind buys that I sold most of them off and just replaced it with something I truly adore As for 4K and all that I have my issues with it. I came to find out I like Blu rays best. 4K looks great buts it’s almost unnatural. I believe Blu Ray has the best representation of film

Release titles at full cost, then run sales intermittently is what businesses do. The streaming part is easy. They want customers to pay monthly and stick (streaming will be their "sticky" feature) on their site in hopes they also buy physical media. Every boutique will jump into streaming at some point and charge a monthly fee which is more consistent revenue for the brand. The rest will follow soon.

I have never bothered with arrow player myself. There are plenty of films I imagine I would want to watch on there but all the titles I really want, I already have & for me BFI plater is the best streaming channel with such a diverse choice

Streaming just gets you the movie, physical you're getting the extra features. Thats why I love arrow physical releases. The making ofs and commentaries etc.

But many of the limited editions will not be available in the sales. I doubt Dune 4K or the Daimajin box set will show up in a sale, for example. I could be wrong...but am I willing to risk it? Probably not. And even if the Daimajin films are available on the Arrow channel, that packaging looks so amazing, and the main thing is that streaming quality is never as good as disc quality. I would rather watch almost anything on a disc than from a stream. But maybe that's just me...

What changed my collecting drastically was unfortunately Brexit. It’s now waaaaay more expensive to import UK titles for me. I used to take part in the Arrow sale but it’s almost not worth it now. I just buy the titles I want from Swedish sites since the difference in price is minimal (even during the sale). Still love Arrow though and prefer them over Criterion and other boutique labels.

I think the price increases make sense if their goal is to push people to the streaming service. It will remove the semi casual customers while the die hards will pay more which will remove some of the losses. Maybe the longer turn goals are to reduce the physical side and special editions only on the physical side for the larger markup. They may end up not having sales in the guture as they don't do standard releases

In my opinion, releasing a title that is guaranteed to be popular on blu ray and later down the line releasing the 4k version is deceitful and stinks of a cash grab. If we were given a choice between the two latter formats at the same time then that would be very fair to the customer.

It hasn't affected me much on buying. A title I want i will still buy physical. Steaming titles are for titles I would not have bought even on sale but might try for a few quid. I do tend to 4k upgrade on streaming and keep the physical copy of it's cheap. I view it as a luxury but I don't need it.

It's good people use the streaming service as a "vetting" tool for purchases for me I've jumped on the releases of cat and bird because I missed out first time round I think they have another sale starting this Friday can any one confirm that?

I don't follow this channel too closely but when you go and buy expensive special editions instead of waiting for a standard edition (like I saw in your video about buying the Battle Royal set) then you aren't you a part of the problem? Sure if it is like your favourite movie then make an exception, but you are conditioning them to charge higher and higher prices for stuff that you don't really need, that also takes up extra room on the shelf. Another downside with buying straightaway is that sometimes the initial release is botched. Personally I go for quantity and a cheap price while still being 4K, not packaging. I might buy a special edition but for 1 out of 100 movies, but that could be because as well as being relatively new to physical media, I never watched many movies before collecting so I don't have many favourites and mainly blind buy.

In regards to Cat and Bird, while I’m tempted to upgrade I still have not pulled the trigger. Arrow makes it hard to justify the upgrade with the price point. I have no idea why they don’t add Atmos mixes to make it more justifiable to double dip and feel like you are actually getting an upgrade. People always complain about Blue Underground, but them adding an Atmos sound mix makes me a lot more comfortable upgrading titles and makes me feel like I’m getting something new with it. I know not everyone has Atmos or DTS-X capable sound systems but I’m sure most collectors like the option to help future proof their purchase. Once they do upgrade, they will seek it out. I know I do.

Not all there titles come to Arrow player, future titles like Giants And Toys or the Bill Rebane Collection are not on there, and there's a fair few older titles like The Funhouse that's also not on there, I like it a lot it allows me to spend money on other rare oop titles, i do think they need to reprint some titles as there getting rare and expensive like Rabid Dogs i got it from Cex for £20 but the cheapest on Ebay is £50.

I suppose they're just trying to cover all their bases. But it does seem somewhat contradictory, and undermines the whole notion of physical media. At least the streaming aspect allows you to sample something before you decide if you want to own it. And somewhere down the road, that particular title is no longer available to stream, but you've got a copy in your library.

I’ve really lost interest in Arrow in general. Limited editions are no longer all that limited. Constant re releases. Fairly mainstream releases of films we’ve had decent blu rays of for ages. Overpriced mega sets. Quality control issues (Donnie Darko, demons etc). I actually prefer labels like 101, which have fewer releases, but generally are ones we’ve not had on blu ray before (a little more like arrow used to be when they first started). I’ve even opted out of the 4K market and sold off my 4k collection as Im pretty tired of the re-release cycle in general anyway. We’ve been there so many times before! I think arrow maybe owned by Zavvi now, so I doubt things will get any better.

Wanna hear something funny? When I started watching your channel I wondered why you called movies "tatoes", like in "potatoes". Then I realized you said "titles". I'm from Sweden, sorry, my bad 🤣

I'm gonna watch Love at First Sight Australia on All4 thanks to this video now

Man v Film, as I've said in the past im happy with blu ray, but if they released Zombie Flesh Eaters in uhd that could tip me over the edge and buy a new player and tv, but only if its Zombie (cant believe i just said that i love blu ray.) 🤣🤣

I’m not prepared to pay more than £10 for a standard blu-ray

This is an interesting thing I found on arrow video the player the shinya tsukamoto box set that came out in the US on arrow video a couple of years ago is on arrow video player in the UK streaming, can someone shed some light on why the box set was US only but not released in UK on physical media, we missed out on that set but can watch all the films on arrow player still.

If they wanted to please me, they would release more eurocrime films haha thank jebus for ‘years of lead’ box set coming out soon

Honestly, I feel that you have the approach most people have regarding Arrow. Just use the streaming service as a testing ground to see if you want to bother getting them. Even then, I don’t feel that you’re part of a problem because in my opinion anyway, streaming services and physical media are striving to two entirely different things, Streaming just feels like modern day cable television while physical media is for a collector/someone who’s very serious about film. Also, lets not forget how as of now, BD/UHD are so much better in terms of video and audio quality. Also, even then there are people who mostly stream who will still go out and get a physical version of a film/show because they love it that much, I know because I have a friend as well as a few family members that are just like that. I also don’t feel there’s anything wrong with not getting a BD immediately, especially if you have no interest in it. I also feel that streaming services are perfectly fine with physical co-existing, especially after seeing the relationship between Netflix & Criterion for example, as well as a few other labels. If anything these services are more concerned about Piracy seeing how not only does it harm their businesses but also is actually rising up in terms of popularity and advocation for it. And as I mentioned in the last video you made, I especially don’t see physical media going away seeing it’s a relatively popular niche, especially with all of these high-end labels, there’s many people that are very serious about the art of film and it’s preservation, film is like music in the fact it has the advantage of being an art form many take seriously and want to preserve. Lastly, let’s not forget the fact that physical media is still popular in areas like Japan, The United Kingdom, Germany, France, Hong Kong, Taiwan, etc. etc. even in countries where piracy is popular, physical still manages to be a relatively big thing. So yeah, apologies for this extremely long college essay, but at the end of the day I still don’t think physical media will go away. Especially when collectors, film nerds, and preservationists exists. Or people like me that don’t bother with streaming services unless I’m using a friend’s or family member’s account where they still don’t get money, aha! Physical is my way to go.

Part of the problem!!!!! They're a few hundred richer from your influence on me alone. God knows how many others have been affected 😂

After watching this i am going to get the arrow streaming service no more blind buys from them,i will still buy the blu ray if the movies good

End of phisical media? Totally opposite Streaming is dying.

Physical media is dying and the boutique labels are charging more and more money for their products because they need to make up their bottom line to a shrinking customer base that isn’t migrating to 4K UHD in the way they transitioned to DVD and Blu-ray. Arrow is hedging their bets that they can survive by getting into streaming. Makes me wish Vinegar Syndrome still maintained their Exploitation TV service.

I think Arrow know the writing’s on the wall for physical media over the next 5-10 years, so they’re prioritising the Arrow Player and hiking the Blu-ray prices to take advantage of the collectors who will pay through the nose. Maybe it’ll work, or they’ll just push collectors to streaming and lose that side of the business over time. But if millions are watching their streaming service for a guaranteed £5 a month each by 2030, maybe they won’t care.