The Canto 4 Tierlist and First Hard Mirror Dungeon! | Limbus Company - Foreman Plays Stuff 

Trying to analyze Canto 4 is tricky Because most of my memory has been taken up by filler fights discord.gg/foremanplaysstuff

7Ryoshu casually clashing onpar with egos is always my favourite part about running 7shu in full 7team

On topic of comparing Ishmael and Faust, I think Ishmael is class president type and Faust is the one who gets 1st in every test.

I like to put it this way with Heathcliff - he's very much a visual learner, rather then one that learns from books.

I love the Faust tier existing, its great.

11:41 Regarding this, remember Canto 2? Where Ishmael saw that Dante is not a competent manager, therefore she has a self imposed duty to be the straight person. There was a line that Dante in Canto 3 that notes Ishmael started to be pushy and more leading the sinners because she was disappointed in Dante

I will say, you absolutely have done it, it was difficult for you but you managed. A bit of luck getting a fight that's NOT bullshit for Floor 5, but honestly, even not bullshit fights there are pretty damn hard, so absolutely good on you to have won that! Looking forward to Canto 5 and Intervallo 4.5 before that~

"He's visual learner." *Looks at part 1 of Canto 6*.....oh boy..... Foreman's onto something alright..... Seriously, in my opinion Gregor and Heathcliff are just "those guys" man. Gregor is incredibly likeable even from the start and will always remain as one of the most memorable sinners while Heathcliff grows on you overtime until you finally admit that he rocks. It's also funny to me personally since these two are the closest to Roland's personality which may have something to do with why they're so unbelievably likeable. I can only ever seeing then remain in either A or S or circle back and forth between them. They have the "staying" power that the other sinners don't have currently or haven't reached yet.

Always love to see people react to My Form Empties. It's the first actually decent gimmick fight

Surprised you didn't mention "street smart" when discussing Heath's surprising intellect. Like when he explained to Sinclair that former G corp guys were gonna backstab us anyways.

Congratulations! I was rooting for you. Respect to Outis and Ryoshu for actually winning some clashes without E.G.O.

have you noticed that yi sang's and faust's sprite's poses are completely mirrored? suspicious... i thought heathcliff would be my least favorite sinner. how wrong i was... because same, he's so entertaining and has a genuinely interesting personality.

Damn, getting MFE on your first Hard dungeon is a doozy, but I'm glad you got to experience what I think is one of the cooler fights. But also, one of the two hardest fights in the current Mirror Dungeon lmao. So, about the question of how to even win without ego spam, and obviously some broken ego gifts or teams that give you insane clash power. First, obviously, having tanky units (like Lantern Don!) helps a lot, even in that fight, not clashing, letting them eat shit, then transferring their karma onto the adds helps. The adds can be nuked down quite easily even before they get to 108 karma, going hard with a few pierce attacks on Aida lets you kill her turn 1 even. Once you have more egos, using a specific ego to make the tank's sin resistances better is also a useful strategy. Secondly, and this is a tip very useful for the hard dungeon in general - offense level doesn't do shit when you use evades. So, even if they roll a 20 during a clash, they might roll only a 14 when you evade against them. The base power mounting trials will still roll higher, but all the level up buffs the enemies get are irrelevant when you evade against them. This is why having someone with a good evade is REALLY good - and if they're getting targeted by multiple attacks, as long as you evade against the faster one, the evade gets recycled and used again! This is why I think Cinq Outis, even though a 00 unit, is insanely good for people struggling in the dungeon. An evade tank, she has both aggro and the strongest evade in the game. You can just get her to simply nullify 2 or 3 enemy attacks in a turn, insane value imho. BTW - Hard dungeons use up all 3 of your weekly bonuses - this means that you can do a singular hard dungeon a week and it counts as if you've done three runs, giving you some 21 levels of battlepass at once.

I think its fair to have Yi Sang here for now. I will be interested to see how that opinion changes in the future. That is all.

Honestly, I appreciated Canto 4 a lot more after having read Leviathan. The League of Nine does not hold as much weight without knowing the impact they've done (and most likely will do) firsthand.

WOO!! congrats on your first mdh clear! the fucking. full body shudder I've had when your final boss was MFE... but its good to see that you've pulled through, even with lower levels and way less resources. and yeah mdh runs are bloody exhausting, there's a reason I don't do them often despite having 400+ hours in the game.

Just to let you know, you only get increased starlight for any hard run that does not spend the Hard run bonus. Also, as I have mentioned previously, a new mirror dungeon should be appearing soon after the Canto 6 story releases, and none of your accumulated starlight will carry over.

it physically hurt to see him not pick up the carmilla after floor 4 😭

Pretty impressive first Hard mirror dungeon. It really is a difficult mode. You were a bit lucky obviously. Fininding Faith was such a godsend (and that EGO gift is really rare). Spamming EGO probably wouldn't have worked if you didn't have a way to recover that sanity. And you didn't get some of the nastier fights you could have found. But you still needed to convert your luck into a win, and you did. Also I really appreciate the music edit. You adding the first warning music during the My form empties fight made this all the more enjoyable.

Checks video Heathcliff's in S, "Fuck yeah" Stops watching

I can confirm Dead Rabbits Meur is easilly the HIGHEST 00 Rupture ID clasher other than Meat Lantern Don He doesnt do great Rupture infliction wise, but he does win clashes VERY often Also the Support Passive is way better than W Corp Meur if you are running people like W Yi Sang in Rupture Team

New IDs! Deadsault is awkward. He's a rupture unit with +cPw against Rupture and a S3 that can clash up to 26 and hit for 62 with Regret, which isn't bad at all, but there's so many other IDs that can do better with easier conditions, and he's very count negative on his skills. His support passive could be useful for easier clashing on rupture teams, and he's cheaper to build than Wsault. Boutis is really strong. Good sinking support unit that also deals damage through sinking, even though not to the extent of Tree Sang. The start of Canto 6 is pretty challenging but I found that a sinking team that includes her keeps all enemies extremely SP-negative, letting you win pretty much all clashes.

'Faith' is an absolutely busted Ego Gift, getting 'Commemorative Coin' with it is even more ridiculous lol. By all means, most people struggle greatly with 'Mirror Dungeon Hard Mode', even with having more of the Starlight buffs. Think a good chunk of players rely on getting "Resource" gifts and spamming EGO's as best they can or rely on the 'Fusion' gifts to greatly buff their team. Got quite suspenseful seeing how'd you would do on the last floor since it's your first run and you got 'My Form Empties' as the final boss. That thing's a battle of attrition with Aida being the scariest thing there with just deleting a Sinner sometimes. You did really well considering your EGO resources though, without 'Faith' you'd probably have to figure out which attacks you could take if possible and start figuring out how to play more cautious & defensively, which for you will be much harder with less EGO's to adapt your resistances with. Like you said, one way to deal with the high rolls is with ID's that can actually match up to them, such as N Corp Sinclair, or with strong enough EGO's. There's a good few ID's that can do so and it might surprise you as of which ones. Knowing how the damage is applied on either end also greatly helps, lets you do things like solo the Brazen Bull with Liu Ishmael. Honestly, it's a shame Refraction Railway 2's gone after seeing you beat your first Hard Mirror Dungeon run. Kind of really want to see you try and tackle our current Railway now lol.

My current battlepass is at 66. It's been barely over a week. I need mental therapy. Note, these ID reviews are considerably more vague and questionable due to my lack of hands-on experience with them. I will probably return to fix it if there is anything new. Wuthering Heights Chief Butler Outis: A core ID for the Sinking team composition. To refresh, Sinking normally does Sanity damage, which works great for enemies with positive coins and... SIGNIFICANTLY worse for negative coins. The absolute best of Sinking occurs when you use it on an Abnormality though, where it deals Gloom Damage, functioning as basically Gloom-Rupture. As for the ID itself, the debuff it inflicts, Echoes of The Manor, sidesteps the issue about Sinking being less effective against Non-Abnormality fights completely by crippling your enemies the moment they panic, and it also clashes incredibly solidly, doing quite good damage as well. All in all, a fantastic ID. Dead Rabbits Boss Meursault: An interesting Identity. As a rupture-focused unit, he is completely pants at doing anything with Rupture and absolutely can cripple your setup due to his almost comical lack of Rupture Count mixed with the fact his S3 has 4 total coins. The benefit he gains, however, is that assuming you don't accidentally cripple your own Rupture (Which is completely possible), he clashes insanely well for a 00 Identity.

'My form' was the final boss of the first Railway, and because you needed to do everything under 100 turns (or was 120?) for the big rewards, man, I still remember everyone both loving and hating the fight because it was a pretty cool one, but the timer just fucked people over.

for checking new characters from targetted extractions, it'd probably be best to look at their uptie 3 and 4 variants from the targetted extraction menu. uptie 1 is inevitably going to be trash and you're never going to use them at uptie 1 anyways because uptie 2 at the very least is practically free lol.

My form Empties, the final boss of the very first Railway, a massive pain in the butt back then, and amped up as a final boss in this mode, even more so. You did absolutely great with it, good job taking down this annoyance. Imagine what it is like to arrive to this boss without any EGO resources left.

Nice pulls and great run. Good job

EYY congrats on winning against MFE! Love that guy. He was the first boss with a proper unavoidable gimmick in the game when Refraction Railway 1 came It was especially hard due to us not having as much options in ids/egos/lack of any gifts in rr1, and i'm really, really glad it was made a floor 5 boss, it most definitely deserves it It was a bit painful when you decided to grab crown of thorns instead of carmilla, definitely would've saved you time and sanity on the way to mfe, but i think i wouldn't catch the fact that i can replace Ryoshu's s1 for a third s2, so definitely props to that A few tips for future mdh runs - use your cost well and look carefully when choosing gifts/buffs after a floor clear as at times choosing the right enemy buff can be oh so much more important than taking better gifts As you figured out yourself, having ego-generating gifts and healing gifts is really important, especially if you don't get many gifts to increase your clashing capability (speaking of, tremor and sinking teams gets a bit better than rupture due to said gifts (and sinking i guess)) Having sp-healing egos is also very much recommended, though i wonder if you could defeat mfe without holiday, considering you had faith Lastly, reaching floor 5 is already an achievement for many in any mdh run, so if you feel like you can't progress further on the last floor, you can absolutely just end it there, you won't lose much exp at that point Personally i can get to floor 5 semi-consistently in less than 2 hours and at that point if i was in ways running out of resources: hp, sp, sin, or even cost, if i didn't have proper gifts, i'd just end the run right there if i didn't find anything in the shop to help me out After canto v the dungeon gets a tad bit harder >_> And with part 1 of canto vi done, i'm genuinely really scared of how much harder can the future edition of the mirror dungeon get

Now you have to do it every week once. Don't know how other people play it but i just speedrun it with high rolls ids (random). Then just quit without fighting f5 boss to save some time and still get all rewards (% based).

So MFE is actually quite a fun boss as there’s a few ways to deal with it. -your way of just clashing everything and letting the statues karma spread randomly -letting the statue hit your allies so you can intentionally spread it to a specific target -face tanking most of the attacks (when they’re not fatal) and just targeting down each lured character in one turn each (only really able with the right team or egos) -then the cheese method of using burn/rupture/sinking and just focusing the statue and using the statuses to bypass the protection. Often needs a tank ID or an AOE paralysis EGO like Heath AEDD or Greg apple ego

Oh, My Form Empties. I remember this one, if Im not wrong, was the last railroad boss! Terrible, but beautiful, and surely a important learning experience... And great job finishing it! That was great.

Excellent work, Executive Manager~ Next thing you know, you might be making MD3H Sinner Solo videos in the future~ Those levels do indeed skyrocket with each passing floor. You took it all in stride, it seems. Generally, it's better to pick the least dangerous Mounting Trial instead of choosing the best EGO gift after boss fights imo (Unless it's Lunar Memory, ez win with that). There's always a chance the gift will appear in the shop or as a reward from a node, after all. Speaking of gifts, Nebulizer and Bloody Gadget are my absolute favorites~ Nebby, when upgraded twice, can give you 5 poise Potency and Count if you simply have Pride Resonance; only two Pride skills, which you can use EGO for, insane! Stacking up poise with it is lovely~ Bloody Gadget, when upgraded twice, can give the dmg up buff to two allies, and if they have Lust, that's free 40% dmg right there. PS: Did you know? Butler Outis steps on people with her Skill 3, which means she can step on me! And I'd love that any day~

So When Faust eventually leaves Faust tier who will take her place?

Damn Foreman good job on beating your first ever Hard Mirror Dungeon, you did a lot better than I did on my first one :P

Always glad to see the post canto tier updates but I'm begging you to use Vergil's other portrait to match the sinners art style

Great job and congrat on beating the mirror dungeon hard for the first time. When I first did this the floor 5 boss just straight up out roll my ishmael waw ego and leave me flabbergasted. In the future run, there are some tier 4 ego gift that rip the game in half bases on the team gimmick that you can fuse them at rest stop (a tier 3 + a tier 1). You can check out their recipe on steam guide or wiki. And Im looking forward to your liu team line up in the next canto.

My Form Empties in this current state is weakened twice. It first showed up in RR2 as the final boss, then became an MD2H boss. However, when MD3H rolled out, they significantly reduced the health of the 3 minions, making them far easier to deal with using AoE egos instead of concentrating on 1-2. It's entirely possible to kill all the minions on turn 1, and fight the boss directly without engaging in the karma mechanic. Then there's the other strategy of dumping sinking/rupture into the boss in that you are able to 1-2 turn it because sinking and rupture damage aren't affected by the protection buffs. Naturally, either of these tricks demand a more highly developed account and/or a more focused team dedicated to capitalizing on specific niches. Also for the goodness's sake, when you roll the extraction, just click the middle ball of chains.

Congratulations on your first Hard Mirror Dungeon clear Manager Esquire! Especially against MFE, that one was by far the hardest boss during the last Mirror Dungeon season. A tip you´ve probably already figured out yourself but i might as well say it: When picking E.G.O Gifts in Hard Mirror you almost always want to choose based on the Mounting Trial attached instead of the Gift itself, the only exception is if its a very rare Gift that you desperately need for a build, otherwise you should always pick the least bad Trial and just buy the Gifts you need with the Cost you get from selling any useless Gifts you get with them. The least bad Trials are always anything that only affects Defensive skills, Damage Taken/Dealt, or HP%, the second best option are actually Offense Level increases because Evades ignore the enemy´s Offense Level entirely and only roll against the skill´s Base Value which even in Hard Mirror is usually well below 15 even on most bosses. Evades in general are almost essential for a comfortable Hard Mirror clear imo, since they drastically reduces the amount of E.G.O spam you need to do for clashes. And a way more niche but even more important tip: Enemy attacks that are labeled as "Unclashable" (Like this one 1:01:44) can still be nullified using Evades, most unclashable attacks also can´t be redirected so having a unit with an Evade that can also gain Aggro like Cinq Outis or a unit that can give aggro to others like Captain Ishmael to make sure those Unlashable attacks target your units with Evades can make fights that rely on Unclashable gimmick attacks significantly easier.

1:02:10 game doesn't know in which order you will clash, so it treats any amount of paralysis as an infinite - aka enemy rolls all tails. So when you inflict paralysis you really have to be careful with clashes Edit: nvm

"He is just shit whenever it gets more complicated than like two syllables" Just waiting for Oufi Reaction. Heath channeled his inner Meursault

I still havent finished the video, but regarding the "giving up on a dungeon and leaving" if you forfeit you get rewards depending on where you are at. On my first hard run I got to floor 5's boss and gave up because I was getting bodied but I still got a TON of rewards

I wonder if Foreman remembers that base Heathcliff does in fact use a bat. And perhaps, the possibility that the Dead Rabbits aren't just an alternate world possibility for Heathcliff... At least, that's what I inferred from that story. The bodysack, the bat, Heath joining a Syndicate... It all kind of lines up.

Heathcliff in S is a massive W. He was my least favorite sinner in the first 2 cantos, but once they started showing Heathcliff’s intelligence, he improved an insane amount. Foreman hasn’t even seen the best of Heath

I suggest you should not look at Butler Outis Uptie Story yet. There are some slightly bigger spoilers in there so if you still wanna see it only guessing than fair enough but i recommend you not to watch it until you cleared Heathcliffs Part 1 Story.

Honest question - but why are you buying healing on every rest stop even though everyone is at the full health and you have both healing support passive, egos and ego gifts? And at the same time you never reroll shops

Trivia: My Form Empties was the final boss of Refraction Railway 1, it is kind of hated because Refraction Railway is about minimum turn count and I doubt I need to explain how a boss that heals its allies every turn made that a struggle.

19:16 Yeah I don’t remember much about the introductions but I do remember that Faust was introduced last… so… Faust tier will probably be a thing for basically the whole game

Wow congratulations you really first try the hard dungeon

To be honest, I like to quit at 5th floor because clearing all of them often takes too long. I only go for 5th Boss when I have fused EGO gift. You can still get rewards between floor 1 to 4.

He did it. He did the hard mirror dungeon. Well, some fun facts: Faith, that gift you got? Its fucking insane. I genuinely cannot fathom you beating the hard mirror dungeon without it (no offense) As for that final boss... fun fact: It used to be harder. Those minions had about 600 hp, and it was the final boss of Refraction Railway 1. If i could have given tips... Take some hits from them, and bumrush a single guy, you can kill them without karma if its in a single turn. Guido is weak to blunt, B.G is weak to Slash, and Aida is weak to pierce. Seriously, even at 600hp, the meta was to bumrush Aida first turn with Rabbit heathcliff (because he was the best ID at the time, and debatably still is.) Overall, good job on the hard mirror dungeon. now you know never to skip that fucking lighter.

There was something absolutely comical about spending 4 hours to beat this super hard thing, for the game's equivalent of pocket lint. I know he'll be able to redeem it all later, but it was still hilarious.

I hope you're aware of the exitence of fusion ego gift of rupture. It just makes the boss fights piece of cake.

OOF! Getting My Form Empties in your first Hard Dungeon is simply cruel... At least they nerfed it.

Спасибо за лимбус :)

Unfortunately, You *Do* In Fact Lose the E.G.O Resources, even if the EGO Skill in question loses in a Clash.

AY YO, heroic monk but white knight

Honestly I think soon you’ll definitely be putting don up in A tier yes I am biased however I have my reasons spoilers below This should be far enough so time to say words Don is such an interesting character to me and I can’t wait to see where she goes from here as firstly we saw her being the first one to tell that Donrang was distorting as well as someone else later on as well as having at least more knowledge about distortions then most of the other sinners probably besides Faust but Faust is Faust I believe she also knows who Ezra and Moses are due to her reaction from both the end of 5.5 and the thing between 5.5 and 6.0 so yeah my personal theory is that don probably saw someone distort in her past I’m guessing this being related to the skeleton horse thing in her base ego as well as all the skewered corpses in the back and maybe don was saved by Moses and Ezra thus being why she is familiar with them (or she could just know them due to her obsession with fixers with them having showed up in an issue of her fixer monthly thing) or another possibility being that perhaps it was don herself who possible distorted ( we do know that people can be brought back from distortion thanks to both Dongrang and Kim so perhaps that’s why those skewers in the back look similar to the Lance she uses in her base ego attack would probably be very messed up considering her room looks like a daycare room. But with the more serious stuff out of the way I also like her because she gets funny lines also her voice actor does and incredible job (rip sir squirrel thou shall be missed) so yeah I know we’re still in Heaths canto but I personally can’t wait for Dons canto which I do believe is next so yay

Oh god MFE as a first floor 5 boss is some dirty play by the game. I'm sorry. Edit: clean fight! Be proud because md3 hard *is* truly difficult and you did it with flying colors.

Faust pain

This is out of the topic, but where can i find the BGM? I know it's Child of the City accoustic, but i seems not be able to find it on YT.

well to be FAIR you're missing out on like 30% of hardest enemies in the md because you haven't cleared Canto 5 yet

Getting Faith which allows you to just EGO spam without a care of sanity was definitely lucky. My Form Empties is also one of the luckier Final Bosses to get as the Mounting Trials don't have a big effect on this fight as its more of a gimmick boss. So its hard to say if Faith ego gift carried the run or not but certainly made it easier. Kind of wish you didn't get Faith as you didn't have to work with the Gimmick at all. Honestly that's where the main difficulty in MDH3 comes from is did you get the right Ego gifts and mountain trials.

Legit I dont think any sinner needs to justify where you put em. The actual difference between the ranks aint actually much of anything, so your own vibes matter most here.

Nice

Not to scare you or anything "mfe" was heveli nerfed and before and after nerf is/was probably easiest mdh finał boss you could get, hope you can enjoy md "bull" or "the bigger fish" or "clam", before story md change

dıd you not enhance your rupture ego gıts (talısman and thunderbranch ıf you get ıt) also you seem to have not gotten abılıty to start wıth two ego gıfts oh and rupture sınkıng and burn ıgnores all defense related status aılments addıtıonally congrats on fıghtıng the Fırst Raılway final boss

Yisang does get increased screentime from here, but still canto 4 was his peak imo. It's all down hill from here 😂(for now)