13:23 Elspeth is a devotee of Morr, the Empire god of Death. The Knights of the Black Rose were included in this DLC likely because they're an order devoted to Morr, so it goes along with her theming.
Finally, been waiting for this replay to get uploaded since it was teased. Kholek getting healing isn't just Pwn's fantasy, I've been waiting for it too.
Aspiring Champions are one of those units that will just keep on killing for days if nothing is sent to specifically take them out. Throw infantry mobs against them and they'll carve the lot up. And for the severed claw they can fight through large targets throughout the whole battle.
@@MonkWren The empire player had easy counter to them, he just botched it. That bjuna would have basically killed the rot knight unit but he used it on something irrelevant.
@@SRMal8723 Every PvP WH player ever absolutely POGs at the mention of Flock of Doom, yet nobody woops and hollers for the easiest to use "NO" button in the game, Fate of Bjuna. It even does a fair job against single entity units in the event of a misclick, unlike Spirit Leech if used against a multi-entity unit! It's so strange to me, I get that Flocks are harder to capitalize on and make for epic skill moments, but Djuna casts against top-tier units are so, so satisfying.
@@Supercohboy No one hollars about Bjuna because it's an anti-elite tool that's actually pretty expensive, and there's just _so_ many of them in TW: WH that it isn't worth mentioning yet another one that costs more. Like there's a huge toolbox that can answer the Rot Knights, it just requires focusing them down. AP missile fire, nets to stop the charge, a couple of other spells to reduce their armor and/or have AoE armor pen that absolutely dunks on elites, properly supported anti-large infantry (the halberds being caught out was a huge boon for Turin), the list goes on. None of it was brought though because of the new toys people are wanting to play with. It costing 22 winds is a kick in the nuts though, since it doesn't actually kill any models, just weakens their health pools and only targets a single unit. Flock only costs 6 and hits multiple units.
@@tssb7 If they ever look at him again, he should be dread saurian sized with an HP pool to match. He hasn't been lore accurate in strength for quite some time.
Maybe they should nerf the tracking but keep the damage of the breath attack. That way you can dodge and avoid most of the damage but if it hits it nukes SEs
The tracking on that breath weapon is insane and is the thing that probably needs looked at. If the Empire can trap a big target and line up the dragon I think it's fine that it does good damage, but even when you were microing Kholek pretty well it didn't seem to miss at all and that's the problem
@ksvens8658 not everything needs counter play. Just like spirit leech has no counter play. Other than, healing. Or how slower entities can't dodge artillery. The only reason they managed to threaten kholek is because her breath attack is good. If you weaken it, this battle would have been a stomp.
The hidden killer this game for the empire was friendly fire the dragon and a couple outriders take significant damage from the barrages of stray shots that the new outriders have a tendency to pop off
I never leave home without aspiring champs. They just anchor for so long grinding down any infantry. They may get meh values it seems but they basically will never break outside of army losses or super late game scenarios. They just hold down so much for so long its amazing.
I think you could get a positive value trade with 2 demigryph halberds and then after clearing off rot knights you can use the now uncontested anti-large cav to hunt down the other monsters that chaos will inevitably bring to bear
@@Tarico_ Demigryphs are still super meh according to the Zerkovich vid he did for the Rot Knights. Even with Outrider support, I don't see the Demigryphs surviving and thriving in this match-up. Fire shuts down regen and would've been the play vs. Nurgle forces, but I doubt that the Empire had a chance to build their army to counter them specifically.
I may as well ask here, but do winds of magic affect both players the same? Like if i throw expensive spells will it reduce regeneration for both players?
11:20 If they want it to do really good damage against single entities that's fine. But it looks like the beam follows the target? Seems strange to me. Gives no chance to dodge then.
I've been wondering if Be'lakor is now worth taking as a big centerpiece monster now that WoC has healing but I wonder if he's actually worth his cost currently. Would he be able to punch into the weight class of his peers like Imrik or the Dark Elf dragon characters? That's where I'm just not so sure. I think his low armour and expensive price tag are just too big a flaw to overcome.
Not a campaign standout? Maybe a couple years ago but they are an easy doomstack since CoC. They get buffs from all 4 chaos gods in the tech tree. @@futhington
Yeah, it seems all the opness spread all over the Previous DLC (mutalith, elemental, crow men, tzangors, mama stank, yuan bo) was all concentrated inside the thunderbarge
Do the new outrider rifles shoot way too high and miss a lot or am I crazy?? They look like they hit nothing most the time and the bullet keeps traveling…
I feel that the empire could have done so much better if Elspeth was focusing on the hero. With the breath attack, spirit leach, and the spirit leach like ability that also heals her Kholek was no problem, if only the hero is deal with early.
1:24 is this a dom thing? I was wondering why the ice trolls were nerfed cause in land battles they are seen as pretty shit and are basically never taken.
Ice Trolls are good because they regenerate, hit hard and inflict slow. The slow in Dom prevents the other player from escaping or moving to another point, which is a good thing since Dom matchups have you spread much further apart.
Gelt went from one of the two main choices to still pretty viable, I’d say he’s fine, but marcus sure got shafted cuz his ranged attacks likely weren’t fixed along with orions and others
Honestly I think the new repeaters make outriders too inaccurate to be reliable. Need to do testing before saying anything conclusive but it seems like most of their volleys go way off target even when shooting huge targets like Kholek.
Do you think the power of healing is something that should be addressed? In my opinion it's a bit overbearing how game-changing it is in both campaign and mp
Healing is a super powerful option but I think it's necessary as a counterweight to lord sniping and gooning strats that could get a bit degenerate themselves (and are pretty strong already) if you couldn't mitigate damage to units without regen.
@@Aayren Sucks to suck. More seriously though that then becomes part of the game's dynamic and variety - no or limited access to healing is a strategy you have to work around and also enables some play to counter you that might not work vs other stuff. This might seem like it contradicts my point a bit but healing as a viable option is good and healing not universally being a viable option for everyone is better and the two aren't really at odds.
I really dislike having ranged armour piercing mounted units that can fire while kiting. It just defeats the whole purpose of having to position when they just do it all
Cool game. I don't think your build was legal thou. I'm pretty certain Rot Knights and Bile trolls count as NG marked units for the purpose of army caps. So that puts you at 6 marks, 2 over the limit. I know, rules are fun
The new nurgle units are bugged in the current build. They and I BELIEVE the nurgle caster don’t count for marks, though it’s noted for the release patch, same with elspeth in the dwarf roster
@14:30 on Chaos dealing with empire cavalry: Regular Chaos Knights + character/magic support and marauder cav has always worked just fine. A unit of Halberds or two is also never a bad call in a match up where you can expect some large units. They also have access to skullcrushers, which are a decent anti-large unit, and Dragon Ogres are also an option, though Dragon Ogres have never really made the competitive meta; as good as they are vs cav, they're a bit slow and not very good vs anything else compared to other options, and Skullcrushers, while a better generalist, are a bit vulnerable to focus fire, and similarly are a bit slow.
Man, everything I've seen from Nurgle compared to what Empire and Dwarfs have gotten seems so underwhelming. Like the rot knights and Tamurkhan LOOK so amazing but have struggled to perform in most replays I've seen. I feel like some of the bigger Nurgle units should've gotten a missile resistance from clouds of flies or something.
I kinda held this same sentiment but the reason is because nurgle is already carried heavily by their amazing lord choices, so having another lord without being OP but serving a different role while still being worth taking is tough, and the new units seem so lackluster because nurgle is just filling in their missing bases while empire and dwarves have had options for most, if not all situations
You got the chad gw chaos warrior posing right next to whatever the fuck that whip guy is doing while the bile troll is doing a fortnite dance for good measure. I wish they brought back the old artist its the only thing i can think about whenever i see these battle intro screens.
Talks about the breath attack needing to be looked at because it might be too strong. Meanwhile rot knights taking on 4 cav units and lasting until the end of the game. So tired of the bias in the mp community.
Don't know if it it's just me, but the volume on this video seems lower than normal. Had to turn it up to the point where everything else was loud just to hear it at normal volume.
The Carmine Dragon's breath attack definitely needs a heavy nerf what with it's undodgeable insane damage. Despite that though, the Empire player made some pretty terrible misplays. Imagine how different the game would have been if he didn't waste a FATE OF BJUNA on a marauder horsemen unit of all things...
I just don't like how new units end up in a ton of different races. In campaign at least mechanics restrict what you can recruit. Chaos Sorcerer of Nurgle meaning Kholek can heal is cool, but what's the point of monogods when you can run WoC and use Rot Knights, Bile Trolls, and Chaos Sorcerers? You'd only play Nurgle for roleplay reasons or because their LLs were so broken that patch that they can't be ignored.
Maaaan that laser breath is just too strong - yeah i know that asur stardragon too can make ridiculous damage, but it must be perfect hit - on a big stational target, right from top, precisly. So u need some hard work and somehow pindown your target completely. But that laser just straight aimbot which doesnt require big effort to deal almost 2000 damage! Just click it and whatever, guarantee damage, not that other from direct-spell-damage ljke spirit leech. Its not competitive. It should be nerfed somehow.
