The Great Whole Wheat Bake Off: Hard Red vs. Hard White Wheat 

Brenda: Great tip! Jim

this was very helpful in ferreting out what king midas/occident flour was and the wheat berries it came from so i can use the vintage recipe book i have.

@@grandmananners I blend hard red and hard white. When I have used 100% hard red, i mix the in the flour to the sugar/yeast mixture. I don’t use measurement. I go based on feel/sight. I grind 6 cups of wheat berries. Whatever I don’t use I feed to my sourdough. Depending on weather I sometimes have to add more or less. I let it sit once I get half the flour mixed in and do a first raise. Then I knead more flour in after the first rise if it’s needed otherwise I punch it down and add a little more flour on the countertop while I am kneading it. This process allows for my ground flour to fully incorporate/saturate. Hope this helps.

We bought organic soft white winter wheat berries to plant. I see no treatment on the wheat, would this be safe to mill you think?

I have made her recipe twice now using white wheat. We love it. I also made the pancakes with white wheat but didn't telll my husband they were whole wheat as he HATES healthy things. He went back for seconds 😊

Thank you so very much for sharing this information!!!! I was about to throw in the towel on making 100% whole red wheat bread and I went to her channel, watched her video, made the bread and I could have cried I am so happy!!!! Bless you!

If you make sourdough, which takes a long time to rise and starts digesting the protein before it's baked, the extra strength of the red wheat is helpful or even necessary as dough made from white wheat will get too soft and be flat by the time you bake it. So if you're looking for a use for the red wheat, try some artisanal and/or high hydration breads.

Thank you so much. I had not heard of that.

Pam, the nutrition is the same among red & white, hard & soft. The one difference is that red is higher in protein. But white tastes better!

My understanding is that both hard red and hard white have pretty much equal nutrition and protein for yeast breads. The SOFT white has less protein and, thus, less rise. It makes good biscuits and pastries. I’ve always used hard white, but do want to try the nuttier flavor of hard red. They say combining the two 50/50 is quite tasty. Perhaps you can use that hard red by mixing the two together?

Don't be intimidated I just started last week n haven't stopped. After a few u will feel like master!! Like y have I waited so long???

Read The Tassajara Bread Book. It will walk you through step by step and you will be able to make a decent loaf of bread from the get go. His method is fool proof. He uses a Sponge and it is so easy once you get the hand of it. I have used this method for over fifty years and you can convert this method to any bread recipe. Good luck. Keep on trying because it is worth it.

Was there a flavor difference?

@@Bebeembop I've heard there is. I've not tried it but will be doing so soon!

I love using the Dollar tree shower caps to cover lots of stuff. I'll place a paper towel over salad to absorb excess moisture. Works like a charm.

Good idea!

Dollar Tree sells in the plastic bag area bowl covers, comes in different sizes.

Thanks for the idea Heather.

Nice tip, thanks!

It's easy to grow too. Plant in late Oct, or early Nov. Scratch the ground, throw some seeds liberally, soak, and watch it germinate and grow. Waiting for my first yield.

@@petelieske517 good for you! I planted some spelt last fall for the first time. Hoping it does well. It's about 8 inches tall now...

Okay, just harvested and threshed. Do not over water wheat. Maybe one or twice a month, a small soak. Two, let it dry out before picking. It will lump over, but that's normal. Use scissors, mot snippers, to cut wheat tail, and not knife either. It's just silly when people use a knife when we have easy to use scissors that work easy while cutting stalk.

@@petelieske517 nice! Thanks for the update! My spelt is still growing good. It's about knee high now. 🙂

Janice: We agree. Jim

I did this about a month ago, and yes mixing both gives great results.

Who is your quality supplier? Are they online?

@@tillisross2246 Palouse Brand (100% Desiccant Free • 5 lbs • Non-GMO Project Verified • Kosher Parve • USA Grown • Field Traced • Burlap Bag) ordered from Amazon. Not the most economical if you are ordering 25 lb buckets but nice for smaller amounts.

@kennysgramma I went with a WonderMill Wondor Jr Deluxe. It handles the volume I use, heavy duty construction, and came with both stone & steel burr sets for grinding various items I might want to try. This is a manual model for off grid use but has an adaptor available (which I splurged on) which allows semi-motorized operation with a heavy duty drill (which hubby shares with me from his shop) when electric is available. The motorized option is good for me since I have a touch of arthritis but I liked being able to use it off grid if required. I've used it manually to grind enough wheat to make a couple of loaves and, while it gives a workout, was definitely doable for this older lady :-).

Have you tried mixing einkorn with the hard varieties?

That is so exciting! Thank you so much for sharing your success. Congratulations!

For a light rye, I use 4 oz rye and 18-22 oz AP to 1 cup water. You can make it heavier but I don’t like to. I only use 1 tbs caraway. If you want a nutty onion taste, misc some dried onion in after the first rise.

@@erinobrien3506 Thank you! I don't care for onion bread but light rye sounds too good to pass up! I'm going to get some rye flour so I can try this 🙃

@@gsdalpha1358 The recipe I love best is essentially the How to Cook Everything recipe, but I use all water, no milk, and I use all AP instead of AP and Cornmeal, and then I add a little olive oil- I think 1/8 or 1/4 cup. I do the first rise without the caraway and the dried onion, and soak those in hot water to cover in a small dish while teh first rise gets under way. Then befoer I shape the loaves, I roll out the dough and spread the caraway and onion in the bread, only kneading to mix, then form my loaf. YOu could also jsut roll it in cinnamon bread style- the flavor will still be tehre and it'd be less effort. I wait to add the herbs so that the gluten isn't torn byt the sharp seeds and onions. Be sure to let it rise.... proof proof proof. If yo ucan find high gluten or strong flour, use that. But proof a wee longer and be patient. You REALLY want to wait until it's double in bulk.

@@erinobrien3506 That sounds AMAZING! Well, I'd have to leave the onions out to make everyone here happy. I used to be able to find bagels with everything seeds (no onion there either). It had sunflower, caraway, poppy, sesame, maybe others. Wish I'd thought to write down the ingredients - the bagels were just gone one week and haven't come back. Yes on proofing! I'm going to try using my dehydrator next time I make bread after hearing it's an *almost* fool-proof proof. Thank you for the recipe!!!

Herschel1738: Thank you for coming for the gadget and staying for the research. It sounds like you have all of your food prep supplies where you want them. Let us know about your adventures and successes. Jim

Shelia: Your welcome! Jim

Brenda: Thank you! Jim

I have converted over to white winter wheat for most of my bread making.

Glad it was helpful!

We are happy to help. Jim

I made 100% red fife flat bread yesterday and it was hearty. I might mix it with all purpose if I want a lighter bread. I used yeast as well. I found a good Naan recipe with yogurt instead of yeast and going to try that next with this red fife. I'm glad I like it as I put away many kilos of the grain.

Palouse Brand has a wonderful recipe on their blog. I use it all the time. I think it calls for hard white wheat, but I do a mixture of different types of wheat most of the time.

@@kristinanne6534 thankyou, I had not heard of them before just checking it out now. Thanks again.

@@kristinanne6534 thank you for the info, much appreciated.

You can sub in 100% hard white whole wheat for all purpose pretty successfully, but the red you need to have a couple tricks up your sleeve to help condition your dough and be prepared to let it rise longer. Kind Arthur Flour has some great tutorials.

Brenda: We agree! Jim

Glad it was helpful! Thank you.

What kind of mill did you get?

Vicki: That sounds great!! Jim

Thank you, that sounds fantastic! Jim

You are welcome.

You are welcome. Jim

Wanda: Our pleasure! Jim

If it's bread you want to make it's best to purchase hard white wheat. Soft white wheat is more for cakes, muffins and biscuits. I don't know what hard red winter tastes like, I grind hard red summer and I don't taste nutty, I taste a very slight molasses flavor.

Soft white is good for cookies or cakes, I’m told.

Donna: Thank you very much. Let us know the results of red wheat baking. Jim

Donna: Thanks for the very nice complements and watching our channel. Jim

You are so welcome! And you can blend them and be creative in your ratios of each flour. It is really fun to experiment.

Like you, I have used hard red for decades and only recently discovered how wonderful winter white is for making bread. It is good that we can keep learning as we age!!! LOL