Let's not forget about meme trains. There's lot's of so far underutilized meme potential right there. Just think of WW1 era armored trains, or all of the silly Gadgetbahns people tried to make work since then. They also go choo-choo sometimes. So we got that going for us, which is nice.
@crassgop Define “average.” I’m fairly confident the average Yank hasn’t watched any anime besides what was on public access channels on Saturday morning when they were kids.
I think the thing that leaves Sydney as an enduring "mystery" is the fact that none of her crew survived to tell the story. And I guess that in itself is also a little bit unusual.
Another comment explained that better but the Germans knew their ship was going to sink as fire was going towards ammunitions. The crew of the Sidney would have been doing their hardest to keep the ship afloat, and when the stern broke off from the damaged it had received from the torpedo, there simply wasn't enough time to get on deck and launch safety boats properly due to how fast it sank.
@@ace74909 they also survived because they were picked up immediately. People didn't know the Syndney had sunk until after the Germans were picked up and interrogated. By that time it's likely any of Syndey's crew who had made it into the water had unfortunately perished already
@@kirotheavenger60That must have been terrifying for those last surviving men just you were the pride of your nation’s navy and now your alone in the open ocean miles from land and you have nothing to hold onto to float and everything you could would pull down through suction and so you swim and keep your head up as long as you can until you finally have nothing left to give and so you sink and down into the depth you go never to be seen or heard from again
Why such a mystery? Ships often lose the entire crews especially in the time of war. Think you can’t accept the the German Kormaran was a smaller ship and you were outfought by it. By the way, it’s not The HMAS Sydney it is plain HMAS Sydney. Think about it.
As a guy deployed to the desert at the moment its def a new experience playing new vegas in a desert, camel spiders are more terrifying then any radscorpian.
The ‘dressing up’ of warships is in a weird grey zone. Due to the fact that a number of ships will have similar silloettes it’s difficult to identify their nationality at pretty much any range, however the colours are much easier to identify. As a result as long as the ship shows the nations war flag before attacking, regardless of if they lied about it up until then, it’s regarded as them identifying themselves beforehand and not a war crime. It dates back to the age of sail where a warships nationality could be identified via the paint scheme and sail colours
Theirs also the matter of nations lending, buying or commissioning other nations ships to fill the gaps in a outdated/depleting fleet thus making identifying even harder and the same could be applied to tanks. Where as you wouldn't be selling off your nations uniforms under any circumstance since if the nation cant make something that basic even if improvised then they really shouldn't be fighting as they got bigger issues on there hands.
@@windowsux that is also true. As true identification of combatants boils down to the individual troops and their uniforms which is easier to spot as a infantry man do to the range and most countries have a distinctive helmet. We’re as in the ranges in naval engagements the time of seeing the sailers on the decks has long since passed
At the short ranges the Sydney was at, the Kormoran’s 15cm guns would probably be able to penetrate her 2-inch extended belt over the magazines. The Sydney’s captain really made a huge mistake by coming as close as he did, especially without preparing his weapons. It should also be noted that this was not the same captain that had commanded the Sydney in the Mediterranean.
Even if Sydney stayed at a considerable distance, German 15cm would still be able to go through her armor. Although Kormoran would've needed all the luck to even land a hit to Sydney.
The only proper penetration values I could find were for a different model of 15cm gun, but they suggest Sydney's 2 inches of extended belt could have been penetrated up to roughly 4 or 5 thousand yards.
@@Cooldude-ko7ps It's pretty common to shift officers and sailors around to where their skills are most needed, or because another ship needs replacements sooner than they can be brought over from the home country
>"And hiding any degenerate activity and anime watching you dont want anyone to know about" >*doesn't flash an image from Girls Und Panzer* >my dissapointment is immeasurable, and my day is ruined
I can’t believe you didn’t mention the time the Sydney fired on an anemic aircraft that turned out to be Venus, the f-ing planet. One of the most memeable moments in naval history. Still an amazing video as always!
I think one of the US Asiatic Fleet ships did a similar after they left the Philippines. It took a Filipino mess steward, legend has it, to ask "Why are we firing on Jupiter?"
Sailors are very wary about any object nearing their ship, that is why so many friendly aircraft have been shot down by navies. They warn that during any invasion they will shoot at anything that comes near.
Honestly given the story about the Australians risking getting hit by a sub to help out all the Italian survivors and leaving a lifeboat with provisions for those left behind, and the story before the fight with the German ship, it paints a picture of a crew that's too damn cautious and polite than would be accepted. I mean I imagine in any normal situation if a ship couldn't answer secret codes, they would just be blasted to shit, but Sydney, wanting ABSOLUTE benefit of the doubt even with the codes and probably just plain not expecting a Nazi raid ship this far from the Atlantic, just got too close for comfort into the waiting guns of the Germans. I mean if anything the sinking was just the ferocity of the Germans backed into a corner, most likely knowing no one was going to back them up or chase off the Sydney, so it's fight or die; hence the two ships mortally wounded by evening. It just simply bad luck that drowned all hands on Sydney while the Germans survived to get picked up by Aussie authorities.
As someone who has a familial relationship with the vessel, allow me to perhaps clear the ending of your words up. From the estimations based on her speed and bearing (which were used to find the wreck) Sydney sank at around 1 in the morning. The crew had been fighting an intense battle against the Kormoran and her compliment was likely decimated by casualties. Those sailors fit would have been fighting desperately to save their vessel well into the night, and would have been utterly exhausted. When the bow eventually fell off, having been compromised by the torpedo hit, the ship would have gone down quickly, leaving little time to get into the water, and with no one aware she had gone down, the carley floats would have been insufficient to support weak men for long. We know this because of the one that washed up on Christmas Island. By comparison, Kormorans crew recognised that the damage done by Sydney’s X turret was fatal in relatively short order, and had plenty of time to provision their boats and abandon ship before the fire set off the mines. This meant that the men were relatively well equipped to survive the days in the sun before being picked up. Long story short, it was not simply luck that the Sydney was lost with all hands, it was attrition, and the Sydneys men lost their battle to it.
@@oldesertguy9616 dont thank me, thank people like David Mearns, who found the ships, or the Finding Sydney Association. They pieced together the ships final hours after they broke contact with Kormoran based off the wreckage. I recommend having a look at their work for yourself, as I’m recounting second hand and with a tired memory at 3 am.
@@maxgamer7951 believe me, I am forever thankful for people like that, and the ones that preserve the old planes, vehicles and weapons from history. I often wish I was in a place and had the time to assist in those endeavors. I appreciate those that do.
@@maxgamer7951 given the hits on the bridge I find it likely her senior officers were likely either dead or wounded. the ship would've been essentially "Fighting by divisions," to use the USN term. IE engineering handling itself, gunnery, triage, etc. at least while the steel was still flying. After the ship opened the range, her badly diminished crew would've been trying to fight the fires forward and get to the bow, likely under whatever senior officer(s) were left. It wouldn't surprise me if many were down below, trying to shore up the sagging bow. at some point though, she just slapped a wave wrong and the whole front end broke off to B turret barbette. she sank like a stone after that, and I suspect the few who might've lived past that were the lucky ones topside. Far too many would've been below running damage control to ever have a hope in hell. It's worth mentioning: Sydney was kind of operating under a set of contradictory rules of engagement at the time. I have to go off memory here, but as I recall it was "If a raider, stand off and sink it: if a raider supply ship, capture it to add to our fleet as an auxiliary." the problem is that requires her to close to some extent to figure out what the hell it is she had. HMAS Australia, I believe, had just lost a supply ship a few weeks/a month or so before because she stood too far off and tried to shell it into surrender while the crew scuttled it. Australia's skipper got a dressing down for it as I recall as well, so that might have been on the mind of Sydney's skipper as well.
I was thinking that we really weren't all that based, and then he listed all our achievements, and I paused and realised... we really are just that based
Basically, the rules of war state that you can’t *engage in combat* dressed as the enemy. What makes the raiders nit a war crime is that before engaging in combat they would raise their repetitive flags and drop the disguised guns. Same reason the Panthers weren’t actually war crimes, they were meant to just cause confusion but as far as we know never actually saw combat
I am pretty sure that's incorrect, it states that combatants can't engage in combat disguised as any party not involved in the conflict, that includes civilians and militaries of non-participating countries. As soon as one is no longer disguised as a non-warring party, no matter which it is, then they can engage in combat with other warring parties.
the best example on-screen has to be the duel of *HMS Surprise* and the *Acheron* in Master and Commander. HMS Surprise, who was sailing near whaling waters, disguised itself as a whaler in distress (they even faked a ship fire onboard). The Acheron, a larger ship with bigger guns and eager for plunder, was tricked into going alongside the Surprise presumably to capture it. Then the captain of the Surprise dropped the disguise, raised their proper colors, and started firing.
Mines Enterprise, because she's OP AF! But more like your answer, I'd say mine would be the Yamato. She was in my first box, and I ended up with three, plus Musashi. all big guns=death in that game, so I never was able to use her right.
That “war were declared” phrase always brings me back to this scene 😂 Sergeant: "Correct, there is no obligation." [Fry and Bender sign the enlistment papers] Sergeant: "Unless, of course, war were declared." [Alarm goes off] Fry: "What's that?" Sergeant: "War were declared."
Holy shit wasn’t expecting a vid on the Sydney, as an Aussie I really appreciate it. I also volunteer on the HMAS Vampire II museum ship so I love my naval history
Sometimes stuff just happens on the sea. You get dreadful luck. HMS Hood had a similar fate of course; lacking a refit or not, whether you think Bismarck would have won anyway or not, her blowing up quite so suddenly the way she did was a case of horrible, horrible misfortune. It is, ultimately, just one of those things and it does happen. Also, sorry about Vietnam. And after you had our back diplomatically in Suez too. Oh wait... Seriously though, yeah. Sydney was a damn cool ship. Not well known enough; honestly I suggest people look up some of these lesser known vessels of WW2, there are some astonishingly heroic stories from all nationalities.
@@thecommunistdoggo1008 maybe, but considering that we Americans had supported France in its attempt to hold onto Vietnam, It seems really hypocritical.
@@thecommunistdoggo1008 I know, but you would think from an American perspective that having the suez controled by British french and isrealis would be better then the Egyptians who were already getting friendly with the Russians.
Grandfather served at Tobruk, he had 5 brothers one of them served at Crete, Greece. Two went to the South Pacific, and one served in the Syrian campaign. and 2 sisters who served in the WRAAF. All of them served in WW2, 8 country kids from the snowy mountains. All of them survived. We’re just build different here in Australia. Great video 👍
I lived in Aus for 10yrs, my Neighbour JJ McCarthy was a Rat of Tobruk :) I took him to Doctors appointments, met his family, hung out almost everyday until he died :) I assume he was a very very effective Soldier, as he would NEVER tell any of us about the War... He was simply not willing to talk about it. And I never pushed it... Through research I know much about his service now, and will share if you or others are curious. His Medals are framed and in my home in Russia now, next to my Families Military heirlooms. Johnny used to be like "BAHH dont you have boyfriends or funner things to do? Too pretty to be wasting your time on an old man." To which I always responded, I dont think you are too pretty to be hanging around me Johnny. 😅 Rip Legend :) changed my life.
To explain ship disguises, it was more of a loophole as a way to get the upper hand in engagements, the British did the same thing with the commando operation that sabotaged the only port on the Atlantic that could supply the Tirpitz.
I’m not saying y’all didn’t fight hard or anything, the bravery shown at Gallipoli is something to be commended, it’s just that strategically it wasn’t much of an achievement
14:40 as someone explained in a reply down below. Ships have actually done this in other manners before WWII and even WWI back to the age of Privateers. It was considered acceptable to fly another country's flag as long as you switched to your own before attacking. And the Hague Convention and Geneva Convention also account for this for infantry as well! You can dress up as the enemy but cannot engage in that uniform. Basically you have to undress and redress before engaging the enemy, thats why British Commandos were never prosecuted for their raids which also included using captured uniforms to get behind enemy lines. Basically the flag is the ship's "uniform", an identifying mark of one's allegiance and what country you are fighting for, if the Q-ship (the British equivalent, although they almost always flew the English flag as they were meant to deliberately draw in U-boats to attack with their hidden guns) changed its flase neutral flag to its true origin before attacking, then no crime was committed. Sorry for the sort of rambling flow of this...
It's sad to see that RU-vid isn't recomending his videos as much bcause of his 6 mounth break. It's sort of a punishment that RU-vid gives to creators who take a break from RU-vid. Btw love your vids dude, storytelling and quality are 12/10.
Iv been binge watching Drach’s video for a couple days now. Really glad you put out a naval video like this right as I’m starting to get into the subject. Also I’m liking the new outro song.
The Sydney is something that I knew about since like, infancy, because where the battle took place is about half hour to an hour along the coast from my hometown, Carnarvon. There’s a memorial up at the point along the coast, so you look out to sea and you’ll be looking in line of where it happened. So on ANZAC Day, which to those who don’t know is like New Zealand and Australia’s own little remembrance day, there’s a little service up there.
I think the people who deny reality are just depressed to see an Aussie icon of a ship get shut down in its prime. And I think us Aussies just fight hard for people we like, Yanks and Poms and anyone, aslong as your friendly.
Since you mentioned it, I think a video on the Australian recovery of the Mephisto would actually be great. It’s already a meme and I feel like Johnny could take that story and make it even more hilarious
As an Australian, the statement for 2:17 to 2:40 makes me very proud P.S. Thank you Potential History, for being the one non Australian to pronounce Aussie correctly.
Ugh... I remember a girl in my uni history class presented the "the allies knew about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor" conspiracy as her semester project. But what REALLY takes the cake is that she didn't even research it! She just went "so, yeah, technically the Americans started the war because they knew about the Japanese and didn't do anything about it and that's why America is the real villain of World War 2!" When the professor asked her for sources she just went "Oh, no, that's just my conclusion." Still don't know how she graduated...
Fun fact: the guy that wrote the book "Who Sank The Sydney" was the son of a communications officer who served on the ship and the main reason he went head long into all those conspiracy theories was because he couldn't accept the official story. No joke.
But even if England told US about Pearl Habour before the attack, the pacific war would still happen because the Pearl Habour battle would still happen
Love this video! I'm always pleased to see the world of the auxiliary cruisers getting more attention. The Kormoran definitely got super lucky compared to her half-sisters who were also caught by Allied cruisers - they tended to explode very quickly.
@@bluemobster0023 In terms of cost investment versus results achieved, the armed merchant raiders were the single most effective arm of the krigsmarine.
Another great video, loved the Drachinifel collab. Not a lot of new info for me since I’ve seen Drach’s videos on her already, but an excellent summary nonetheless. I could have done without the autism joke in the beginning, however. I’m autistic myself, and the current friend of using autism as a synonym for stupid irks me to no end. They’re not the same thing at all. Society is still coming to terms with the fact that we exist, and using autism as an insult doesn’t exactly further that process. Still love the content, and can’t wait for more. I just don’t think that particular joke is gonna age well. So, I thought I’d be remiss if I didn’t say something to that effect. Also, I’m pretty sure the Venn diagram of twenty-something WWII nerds and people with ASD are pretty much concentric circles. Just saying 😛
Go to nordvpn.org/potentialhistory to get a 2-year plan plus a bonus gift with a huge discount! It’s risk free with Nord’s 30 day money-back guarantee!
+Potential History "Germany has like one trick no matter what" As a German & Historian i'm now responding with a 1000-Word Essay to prove you wrong and why i'm OUTR.... Nah, don't worry, we Germans can take a Joke, especially if the Joke has Truth to it. The ones getting offended by stuff like that are usually not German. It's kinda like most People running around RU-vid claiming "Japan is the safest & has the least crime etc." are never Japanese but Wee.. err "People" from somewhere else. Those kind of "Stans of a different Country/Culture" exist for every Country though. That said, i wasn't kidding about being a Historian (I mostly work with the "Institut für Zeitgeschichte (IFZ)" (check it on Wikipedia) down here in Bavaria. And while i focus mostly on Contemporary German/European History & ofc Military i also thought i'm pretty well-versed on non-European Military & History. But i never heard of the Subject of this Video at all, so great Video! Also i gotta add: You should see all the insane Conspiracy Theories regarding Incidents among the Axis in WW2. I know quite a few are also known around the World, but oh boy, i must have come across several hundred in the past few Years alone. There are also some great, hilarious & terrifying Conspiracy Theories among the French & Russian Military Histories & Incidents you should check out Prost & Cheers from Berchtesgaden in the Bavarian Alps
5:56 I would point out that the Italian Navy got the upperhand at the start they had the larger Navy in the area so naturally did, the largest loss in the first week was a British cruiser.
The reason why it’s not considered a war crime for the Germans to dress up in Allied uniforms, use captured vehicles in combat, use fake vehicles that look like Allied vehicles, or use auxiliary cruisers dressed as merchantmen is the same reason the Allies used when they did the same thing; the Hague Convention of 1907 allows for Ruse de Guerre, a ruse of war, so long as the military conducting the action does not commit an act of perfidy. Simply put, as long as you have your national military symbol visible before you attack (in the case of the Kormoran, raising the the Kriegsmarine flag before she fired) it is not a war crime. In fact, you incorrectly stated in the video that the Germans in Allied uniforms during the Battle of the Bulge were committing a war crime. It turns out, that they had been given written orders by their commander not to engage unless in a German uniform in order to follow the rules. Their commander, Otto Skorzeny, was later acquitted of war crimes charges during the Dachau war crime trials because of this. The special witnesses who testified on his behalf were from the British SOE, who also testified that the Hague convention of 1907 allowed them to also operate in occupied France while wearing Wehrmacht uniforms.
This might not mean much but thank you for covering us Aussies and showing that though we were not effective like America in the department of production but we when we were pushed into a corner we fought savagely an example of one time was the siege of Tobruk were one time one of our officers lead a bayonet charge towards German lines when the broke through the lines and captured a few Germans who were dumbfounded that thought the lines the were broken the Australians counter attacked savagely. In short thanks.
This video has absolutely nothing to do with the U.S.S. Liberty but when you mentioned a ship and a conspiracy my mind Instantly went to the U.S.S. Liberty lmao.
Great video on a legendary Australian warship and you even brought along Drachinifel as well! Love these type of videos and can’t wait to see more in the future.
I honestly never knew about this, as a guy who loves learning about war related history and not knowing this story about his own country... Makes me feel kinda stuipd haha Still thank you for the video mate It was very well put together, edited and researched.
I find it funny that people made conspiracies about this saying that it was inconceivable that a converted merchant raider could sink a light cruiser at close range, ignoring the other crazy shit that happened in the seas during WW2 like Bismarck being crippled by a bunch of obsolete biplanes and Taffy 3 facing the main Japanese fleet and winning. Weird shit happens in Naval Warfare.
I've been to a few naval museums and all of them are currently pretty accurate to the official story. Although I'm sure there'd be some Queenslanders that'd be into that kind of patriotic BS. My goodness, still can't believe they elected Pauline Hansen as an MP...
