The Literal Worst Way to Interpret Norse Myth | Mythic Literalism 

"stroke ymir's hair" just doesn't have the same ring as "touch grass"

Last time I was this early Odin was making people out of driftwood

"Humans are not infallible. Gods are not infallible. Therefore there is no one available in heathenry to produce an infallible text" is an extremely comforting thought for an ex Christian. Also: trying to reinvent the wheels of an ancient faith using texts written SOLELY BY ITS ENEMIES is going to involve a LOT of guesswork and reading between the lines. Cause the authors of those texts were all strongly motivated (some more obviously than others) to present everything in what, to them, was the most unflattering way possible

We love our bald bearded youtuber talkin bout heathen shit 😂

As a heathen, I’ve found that most Christians I know who scoff at Heathenry do so precisely because they themselves are mythic literalists. They often assume that their own literalist approach is universal amongst all religions.

Babe wake up, our blessed and most holy beard has spoken through its host once more.

Brother you really really need to write a book on the metaphysics of polytheism in particularly heathenism. That is a serious niche that needs to be filled.

So, in short: deriving facts about the gods from the stories is always hit or myth.

One of my favorite parts of paganism is to avoid the problem of evil, the idea of an omni deity is just a source of endless frustration for me. I'm glad to get away from it.

2:49 I’m here for the glossary of definitions and word usages 😂

Every time I turn on an Ocean Keltoi video, I am impressed and left with much to ponder. I hope life is treating you well, friend. Thanks for another great video!

Of you were a professor I would love to go to your classes. Everything you have talked about is so interesting and makes a lot of sense. Thank you.

was asleep after my social battery being totally drained yesterday, woke up to this. couldn't get better

Definitely wish for more of these more philosophical/theological discussion pieces. It’s something I’ve felt the pagan community has been lacking.

If Christianity was so infallible there wouldn't be so many different interpretations of it. Methodist, pentacostal, etc

I myth'd you.

What I've come to understand is that Odin teaches us that seeking knowledge is difficult and can be dangerous, Heracles illustrates that while life is often unjust, we should keep going--a message similar to Beowulf--and on and on. Are the gods and heroes real in a historical or scientific sense? Who knows? But they are good stories for structuring a life.

Loki’s binding to me is another poetic way to show he is the god of bindings, similar to his crafting of the fishing net.

I love the "I have a tattoo of this story!" interjection. Lol Great information and well put together Ocean! Keep doing your thing.

The split second 40k nod made my day 😂

I always feel like I gained a colony of new braincells when I watch your stuff. And also, I feel rejuvinated in my convictions. Thank you for taking all the time you do to put these together.

At 27:52 I just gesticulated aggressively at my phone in agreement. That's another piece of what never sat right with me during sermons or studies. I think it's what is stopping me from reading either Edda now although I bought them both last year. Fear of being caught up in more of the same rules lawyering dogma decorated in a new religions aesthetic, rather than having the freedom to experience the stories for what they speak to me for my own growth. Which makes sense given my trauma was being forced to mask so hard in order to comply I didn't even know who I was until well into my 20's. I think I need to journal that, that feels important.

Been talking to people alot about mythic literalism as of late so I'm stoked to see this video come out

Tyr's karma was dog maw.

18:00 if someone says "Everything comes from Zagreb," is that a believer in Croationism?

"Christian Mythology is boring", finally someone said it.

Gods know I needed this today... Note: I know you would've made this video anyway, but thank you Ocean, you always seem to upload at the right time.

This reminded me of a video by HelloFutureMe. He talks about fiction, wrtiting and world building. It gets worse Ocean Keltoi!! People are taking literal fiction literally!!! In one of his latests videos "Should Azula be redeemed?" he talks about how characters are not real people but parts of a narrative that serve the purpouse of a message. People in real life shouldn't abandon a 14year old girl in a prision somewhere when all the love and validation she knew came from a psycopathic narcissist but Azula is not a real girl, she is the foil of Zuko's characterization. Zuko embodies the hope that you can break the cycle and nurture meaningful connections and Azula is the warning of how hers is an empty life. My favorite quote from that video is "Zuko becoming the Firelord is not a commentary on how monarchy is a valid form of government". So yeah, literary literalist apparently, big facepalm.

Here's some shiny teef. Hopefully, i can join yall for a gathering someday. In the meantime, encourage wolf the red to upload more. It's the closest i can get to a gathering.

Very nice! Was figuratively glued to my screen.😊

“I think you misunderstand the myth” “No, just Ask”

If a god/goddess had a single, unbreakable truth in mind, we'd be born knowing it.

Ocean is back! I was thirsty for heathen content. ...That sounds dirty, but I'm sticking with it.

Okay, I have to insert my bad joke at 13:28. Someone who stubbed their toe the wrong way could have written history. Okay, I'll stop there. This is a good video.

I literally saw ocea and immediately clicked my phone a thousand times OCEAN!!

Yesss new Ocean video! I was just wondering what I was gonna do with my evening. Now I have my answer.

Another great overview, as per usual. Ya spoil us, Ocean-thank you. 0:39 - 0:46 The opening already framed it perfectly: the ‘slightly different question’ on the reality of the gods, with the implication of dismissal on the part of the questioner. When I encounter this, I attempt to clarify that the concept of there being minds greater than human is genuinely profound, and is not the same question as to whether characters in stories are real.

Often "mythic literalists" also take a pious "I am a better heathen than you because I really believe these stories as factual more than you do", which is not the case at all. It is hard to explain this to someone, that they are wasting time being angry over details in myth stories, because if you try they turn around and imply your spirituality is deficient compared to their "my faith and true believer" nonsense is "superior". Thanks for this video~ I hope it will help a lot of heathens

As always, thank you, Ocean. Of all the heathen content out there, yours is by far the best. I appreciate your humility and excellent explanations. I always feel spiritually uplifted after watching your videos. Thank you for all you do. I see and appreciate your hard work.

Loved this well done! I Always learn so much from your videos. Thank you !

Great to hear from you ya crazy turtle wizard

Good stuff Ocean! Very important information to get out there, especially the arguments against literalism and the connection between biblical literalism and mythic literalism. Also, great performance throughout; the points of comedy and sincerity came across well.

Excellent vid. As modern pagans, we are not reminded often enough that our sacred stories are presented in the form of poetry: Iliad? poetry. Theogony? Poetry. Rig Veda? Poetry. Poetic Edda? Poetry... this alone should remind us to never take any of these stories literally. Anyone who studies poetry has been taught that poetry makes free use of metaphor, allegory, hyperbole and anthropomorphism to 'suggest' and 'imply' deeper truths... poetry is seldom explicit or factual. And I think you're right, many of us coming from a Christian background come into paganism with baggage such as the Christian idea that there is one singular 'canon,' that there must be one 'correct' version of every myth, and that our lore is somehow infallible... meanwhile, ancient pagans held none of these ideas. In ancient Egypt alone, every major city had its own creation story and we never hear of them having civil wars over it.

I'm not QUITE the target audience, but as someone with a passing interest in Nordic mythology and a passion for worldbuilding, this has been enlightening for how to interpret old myths for inspiration. It's the spirit of the thing I should heed, so I don't get hung up on the details. Otherwise, it'd be a hollow imitation.

WoO is a great example of a mythic literalist. He not only seems to take it all at the word of the author, and then pushes that as the way to go about it, and to see him as an authority. He seems to straight up believe we are on an arm pit.

You just had to drop this on a holiday weekend where I had to wait to be able to sit and enjoy it :P I find the relationship with the gods needs to be way more personal than mythic literalism allows. When you are talking about powerful, but not ALL powerful, beings that exist beyond space and time and are largely seen in the natural world around us, you can't put them neatly in a box and say that's how it is. The tales and lore were not concocted to put asses in the pews and foster a fearsome control over people's actions. An animist shaman living in the wild, partaking of plants, reading the signs of nature. That's how we probably got most of our information regarding so many of the Indo-European tales that seem to permeate the mythos of the various parts of the ancient world. I have found that knowing the gods is best when you don't try to put a strangle hold on what they are. They can be very loud, but most of the time their actions are subtle. I have felt the warm and tenacious protective strength of Thor many times. At no time did I ever feel that he was a giant red-bearded guy holding a massive, if short (no judgement), hammer. So while when in ritual i may call upon Thor as "The striker, chariot rider, wielder of Mjolnir, etc", "protector of Midgard" is what I feel is most important. My interactions with him have mostly felt like him nudging things out of the way that meant me and mine harm. I don't see him as a literal brawny dude braining giants and monsters to solve issues. I see him as more of a force that guides these dangerous natural things (storms, damage, violence, etc) away from whom he is protecting. That means more to me than him literally catching a world encircling monster on a fishing trip. Although much respect if he really has the gams to pull off a wedding dress. To me, the most beautiful aspect of my religious/spiritual path is the lack of dogma. Now, with that freedom comes the responsibility to not go down a path of fluffy bunnery, but while the lack of a "big book of truths" can be frustrating it can also be freeing in a way that a more dogmatic religion cannot. It's not a set of hard and fast rules. It takes time in practice and in homework to find your path, but to me it is a much more rewarding road to trod than any literalist could force themselves onto.

Ocean you made me dig into polytheism alot more and made me realize its something I believe so i thank you for that! I'm more attracted to the greek pantheon then the Norse mainy because i always loved the old greek story's but i really appreciate you opening my eyes more I used to believe that all the gods were just archetypes for different aspects of nature but but the more I researched it the more it didn't make sense to me and you're one of the main reasons why I started looking into it more so I truly appreciate it hail the omnipotent beard!

I love your videos, keep up the great work.

Love these kind of videos!

Well well look who showed up.. glad to see you on RU-vid 🤘🤘👍😁

21:56 I’m sorry, but I now identify as a stick, and I still soon become a wizard’s staff. You cannot stop me.

Oh it is so good to see another video from you! I was starting to fret that our Beard had forsaken us 😂❤

This video was a long time coming and so important. As always, this is a remarkable breakdown and one I’ll be watching multiple times. Thanks you!

Yesss, the return of the Hair Fart!

Yey, been looking forward to this topic 😊

I really like your videos. This one was particularly good. Thx! 😉

He lives

An excellent, and much needed, video. Much food for thought, many great points made.

This video is going to do good for the community. Thank you for explaining this expertly, yet easy understandable.

11:45 ...probably not 😂😂 Please keep making content. Your videos are informative, interesting, and funny. Thank you for your hard work.

Thank you so much for your great work..lot of love from Chile..

Awesome video. you put it into words alot of what I've been thinking and feeling about some things for awhile now. I just couldn't formulate the words to describe it myself.. gj brother

Great video!

I love how you explain your point of view while also expressing how other narratives fit as well. It makes your content feel more welcoming, like a safe space for thought dialogue. I hope that makes sense. Anyway another great video, thank you for all the work you put into these

I would love to hear more information on Epicurean polytheism.

Wanted to give thanks for your videos and the knowledge that comes with them, so, thank you.

Very important video. I started to feel like I was somehow wrong being heathen because I don't literally believe in the myths. And get frustrated when an atheist assumes so. I believe the gods exist but the myths are ways HUMANS have connected with them. They are probably stories, very old upg maybe a dream one had that helped them draw closer to the gods. Humans have to put names into feelings. They put the name Thor for this masculine protector type deity. The myths help us understand the gods and their nature but arnt ment to be taken literally. From a scientific minded person it just never made sense to me. And I was often confused as hell feeling such a strong draw and strong presence from the gods. Even responses from them after an offering. But I couldn't make the literal myths make sense in our physical world history. Because again the myths are to help us understand not be taken literally.

Great video man. Always great to hear what you have to say.

Informative and funny as always : ) Keep up the good work Evig ild og SKÅL

Absolutely fire video 🔥🔥🔥

I swear I've been listening to this video for an hour and a 1/2. How is it only 30 minutes long?

Dagnabit!!! I posted a link to the RU-vid channel Grimfrost. They are a Norse Pagan group, and they have a great video about the return of the belief in the Aseir (Tyrs Aterkomst [The Return of Tyr] by the group Hindarfjall).

I think what you say here can also apply to reading about any mythology. Literary and oral stories offer a glimpse into the beliefs of a given culture, but they can only reveal so much when not considering the other factors that go into their telling, and they're never a perfect summary nor are they meant to be taken word for word (of course I'm not perfect either so please feel free to correct me).

Having a fairly irreligious-yet-spiritual childhood, I always had a fascination with science and the natural world, as well as world mythology. I recognized at a young age that there were so many stories about creation and the natural world that, sure, weren't factually accurate, but were beautiful and poetic and illuminating in their cultural significance. Now, as a heathen, I'm able to walk into the mountains and the desert, walk down a beach, watch a thunderstorm gather, and recognize the biological, geological, climatological, etc, and also see the fierce power of Skaði, beauty and vitality of Jörð, the strength of Thor. It doesn't take anything away from my belief and experience to not take the myths literally, and my exposure to mythic literalists has always left me, not only baffled, but also with a feeling of pity that they are missing out on a whole level of wonder with which they could be approaching the gods and landvættir.

Thank you once again, ocean. You continue to broaden our minds and help us learn

Fascinating video. It defiantly gives me a different perspective to consider while I contemplate my spirituality. Well done!

I always interpreted Ymir’s Skull as being the Oort Cloud. Comparing the Norse description of Midgard to an outline of the Solar System gets surreal. Even Jormungandr aligns with the Asteroid Belt. 🌌

Great stuff! Thank you!

Superstition in the Danish language highlights this meaning. "Overtro". Literally 'excessive belief'

Like the video ,great fan & love all of your work (keep it up ❤👍😊)

More videos like this, please. Champion among heathens!

I can not wait for you to make more videos about this topic specifically! I have always been fascinated by theology of all kinds! It’s Christmas in heaven when the Mormons come to my door lol

finally!

Yes, I'm still here. The intro/outro music is a bop, okay?

Wow. Loved the video. Saving it up for the next time somebody starts bugging me about my beliefs and the eddas...

Thanks for another great video! I sincerely believe that videos like this one will become foundational to the next generation of Heathens. Understanding how we read the myths, how we interpret them, and what they can tell us about the Gods and our relationship with them is vitally important. Like Folkism, I think some groups will use mythic literalism to push a specific pre-conceived agenda. Rather than learning and growing from the myths, they use a limited interpretation to justify erroneous beliefs. Hopefully videos like this will help turn people away from this way of looking at these sources and broaden their perspective on what Heathenry can be.

Though I love the subject matter I also really love the way you construct your points.

I always think of the myths as true, in some way. Just as the ancients who wrote them down were inspired by the Muses (or equivalent) and thus probably a bit mad, so too we need to be a bit mad to interpret them. And if someone says "that's a myth" I say "so it's true then? Thanks for confirming that for us."

It makes sense especially when it's cloudy

Good video ocean, I think exploring the accessibility and how to provide spiritual growth should be considered as well as concentrated on in the over all heathen community as a whole more often.

We have to Look at the sagas, myths etc like we look at a scientific text. We have to find the bias to classifie and understand them. In my opinion myths show us an event or story that was found important enough to be saved for future generations. And the changed from skald to skald a little bit. They tell us more about the mindset and points of view in former times, than about a special historical event. Sorry for my english, it is not my mothertoung, but I give my best.

"Surely that didn't just flash a quick 40k jab at the Arch "lore" screechers" *backs up video* "Well I'll be damned". Earned a sub off that one second alone. lol

Would love to see a video on how you perceive and imagine gods, that would really answer to a lot of questions. Unless there already is such video and I missed it

It does help! I've literally been going in circles about which direction I want to go in or which gods I want to follow. Having someone tell this autistic man that is about our morals and life philosophy will propel me further into my journey

Thank you thank you thank you. I'm so glad you saw the need for this video, because the need was great!

Ocean I appreciate you brother you have given me a great understanding of polytheism

Great discussion. Thank you.

17:00 have you ever read The Last Days of the Justice Society of America (published in 1986)? It isn't a deep theological treatise, but it does contain one possible solution to this dilemma, and it uses the Norse gods and the scenario or Ragnarok to do so. Essentially, foreknowledge without omnipotence isn't enough to stave off the inevitable

Loki was bound because he had to save the multiverse from the loom of time exploding!

May I recommend two video ideas? The first would be a video on heathen Cosmology, such as Yggdrasil, the 9 realms, and what they all mean, their interpretation and so on The second would be a complete breakdown of the Trinity and why it is incoherent and flawed. I am a Polytheist, and I've been having some discourse around the Trinity and it can get tough arguing against them when they result to special pleading or "it's a mystery"