Remember when fans made dozens of theories, about Snoke being Darth Plagueis or Mace Windu? Yeah, good times. Little did we know what was to come in the future.
There's a picture of Rian Johnson holding a mug that says "f*** your Snoke theory" while flipping off the camera. He literally insulted the audience for getting invested in JJ's story. Sounds jealous, psychotic, and emotionally immature to me.
@@LoopHoleLeeRoy snokes true origins has been revlead months ago by a star wars channel on youtube snoke is a clone of sidious he has some of sidious powers but not all of them he is a clone of sidious and snoke orginially was suposse to be darth lageuis in the last jedi but when it got leaked rian johnson changed it back to snoke but the true origin right now is that snoke is a clone of darth sidious he has some of sidious powers but not all of them just some
It actually all started with the Force Awakens. It literally undid everything the original heroes achieved. Relagated Luke to an island, leia to a failed general, and Han back to his smuggling ways. Turned a rebellion that won back into a small pack of "resistance" It also narrowed the world down again to just Skywalkers and recloned Vader and the empire in Kylo and the first order. I don't know why so many people fail to see how terrible of a setup TFA was for the rest of the sequels
That's one of my numerous issues with these films. It basically just recycled more or less the same plot from the OT. Rebels vs Empire, Jedi remain extinct and Palpatine is behind it all. It's like as if nothing after Anakin Skywalker's sacrifice changed for the better.
@@death-king1834 I know. At the end of Episode VI, the villains were defeated, the heroes had won, and the Jedi were coming back. Yet, at the start of Episode VII, the villains were back in control, the heroes once more reduced to an underdog resistance, and the Jedi were extinct again. It's as if the efforts and sacrifices made by the OT heroes were all for nothing.
@@FuryanJedi13 This is exactly why I refuse to acknowledge these movies as being part of the same Saga or being the ''official'' continuation of the story. It didn't progress or advance anything. It just took everything back to square one. Honestly speaking the Expanded Universe by comparison did a much better job at advancing the progression of both the universe and story post VI minus a few things here and there.
I'll just add one important detail in relation to that whole issue of struggling...Rey wins every fight against Kylo Ren. This is precisely how to make a villain not at all intimidating. He ends up being the cartoon villain shaking his fist and yelling "I'll get you next time!" right before the credits roll.
@@mmarvel2003 Nevertheless, for whatever reason, she has an unbroken track record of success against a villain whose first appearance showed him stopped laser beams mid-flight. He was never that intimidating past that first scene. Luke spent his first two films getting smacked around most of the time and needing help from Ben Kenobi and Han repeatedly. He even got some training, and yet Vader still maimed him on their first encounter. Vader felt like a real threat.
@@lvldarwin Matt Easton did a video series with IGN a while back where he analyzed the Lightsaber combat in all three trilogies. When he was reviewing the Finn v Ren duel he noted that Ren seemed to be toying with Finn, and the moment he actually pressed Ren he was disarmed and slashed across his back. I highly recommend checking those videos out for yourself, they're good.
@Football Oklahoma Yeah, they toned the gore down hard. But with regard to Finn's injury, Kylo Ren dragged it up his back slowly in a shallow path that would leave a nasty wound rather than cleaving him through, presumably to show how the audience how cruel he is while also getting to keep Finn for the next movie. And he spent about a week in a coma while getting some combination of surgery and Bacta treatments, not sure how the jacket is still pristine though XD
lets not forget in less than a few hours, rae goes from "jedi are a myth" to mind controlling a guard without knowing jedi can do that, or any training what-so-ever
@@shawnkurtz4424 or the fact palpatine still being alive ruins Annakins entire story arc, rise fall and redemption. Destroying the sith and bringing balance to the force? Na! Annakin failed as Palpatine survived,,,,,,somehow!! Just so Rey could kill him because,,,,,, MA-REY-SUUEEEEEE!!!
It is kind of hilarious how Rose has to explain how bad being oppressed is to a guy who was kidnapped as a child by a group of genocidal fascists and forced into becoming a slave soldier.
Right? It’s like as she’s explaining how bad war is, and how the rich profit off the suffering of poor people, I was shocked Finn didn’t just tell her “I know, I literally grew up in a military”
It was peak comedy and a piece of art imitating life. Many examples in the west of liberal arts college students lecturing veterans and other people twice their age on things they don't know about.
@@vincentthendean7713 you can be old and a veteran and still be wrong. Look at how many veterans joined an insurrection to overthrow an elected government earlier this year
I remember the Emperor stating Luke's faith in his friends was his greatest weakness. Luke never stopped believing in people...that is the Luke character I admired growing up.
Gets captured - rescues herself. Fights a fully trained Kylo Ren - wins without a scratch. Luke doesn't train her - already has everything she needs. Rushes off to redeem Ben - Snoke dies and she escapes. Blows up a ship accidently - Chewy wasn't on it. Goes to an island to hide after thinking she killed Chewy - Luke gives her a new ship. Dies defeating the Emperor - brought back to life. It never stops.
We didn’t get ONE scene with Han, Luke, and Leia together. That is unforgivable. Especially since Carrie is gone now. We missed our chance. I’ll never forgive Disney for that.
They were only used to attract older Star Wars fans that grew up with the original trilogy but their scenes and appareances were more cameos than be a solid role .
They loosely followed the established comics with the MCU, they could have loosely adapted the Expanded Universe , but instead ignored it and now look where we are
@@lko5545 he's getting into Star Wars now but damage is already done. Have you noticed how they are suddenly focusing on prequels or the past. Completely ignoring projects expanding upon Rey's trilogy? Even Kenobi & Anakin are back.
The Rose/Finn moment at the end was also so contradictory: "We don't win by killing what we hate. We do it by saving what we love." That's what he was trying to do. That's almost exactly what Holdo did ten minutes ago and was praised as noble and amazing.
@@Quincy299 do you mean Rey and Finn were supposed to be together? I got a bit of that vibe in Ep7, though part of me says it was more one sided than reciprocal.
Except Finn would've died pointlessly accomplishing exactly nothing. The vehicle Fin was using was literally falling apart around him and everybody was screaming at him to stop. Rose saved Finn from killing himself for nothing.
@@immortalfrieza you’re trying to use this logic as if she didn’t crash into him RIGHT in front of the enemy line anyways. They would have both been fucking killed. The movie just glosses over this fact and apparently they walked hundreds of yards back towards their allies while injured without dying in clear view of an entire enemy fleet.
Those 9 movies should be called the Palpatine saga. It clearly shows the rise and fall and rise of the Palpatine family. At the end of the day, Palpatine bloodline survives while the Skywalker line perishes. To add insult to injury, the last Palpatine even adopts the name of Skywalker.
This has been my exact thought. Episode 9 reframes the entire series so that it is all about Palpatine and his effort at galactic domination, and the Skywalkers were just an insignificant speed bump towards that goal; Anakin was just a tool used by Palpatine, and Luke was his annoying son.
Just another reason I absolutely detest these horrible movies and refuse to acknowledge them as being part of the same continuity. They have as much relevance to the story of the first six films as all the equally awful follow-ups for the original Highlander film. The Expanded Universe for all their ups and downs honestly told much more interesting stories post-Jedi then what the mouse gave us.
"This was Johnson's movie and he had every right to throw out Abrams' ideas, but..." Did he though? When he agreed to direct Part 2 of a three part trilogy, doesn't that kind of come with it the expectation that he'll need to accommodate whatever story the first director in the trilogy decides to develop? If Johnson wanted to make his own movie, then he shouldn't have agreed to continue someone else's movie. The whole thing just strikes me as incredibly immature, selfish, and arrogant.
Sure, the expectation is there. But Rian actually didn't have to accommodate the previous story. Remember: He was able to do whatever the fuck he wanted after JJ was done. He even asked JJ to change the ending of EP7 to accommodate his story in 8.
He didn't have that obligation to accommodate the story from TFA as Disney and KK never forced that issue with 8 and 9. In fact JJ had written outlines for the next two movies, but Johnson threw it out in favor of doing what he did with TLJ (a bad knockoff of Empire with a little RotJ thrown in). To be honest, Johnson was the wrong person to count on to write and direct a chapter in the ongoing story of the Skywalker family. He admits himself he has no interest in world building, and these movies, if nothing else, rely heavily on world building for their success.
I'd say that Abrams wrote Johnson into a corner due to how incredibly shallow the worldbuilding was in TFA. Remember, it was Abrams who set up questions of: 1) Why did Luke exile himself in the first place and not return when the galaxy and his friends were in trouble? 2) Who is Snoke? 3) Why is Rey so special? Who are her parents? 4) Why is Finn the only Stormtrooper to defect? 5) Where did the First Order come from? Why is the Resistance separate from the New Republic? 6) How did Ben Solo fall to the dark side? 7) ...Is Poe even a character? Johnson somehow had to provide answers to these 'mystery boxes'
Your part about Luke was SPOT ON. Take into account years of the EU too, where we see a Luke who not only keeps fighting after the death of his wife, Mara, but STILL tries to turn his nephew, Jacen, who was responsible for her death back to the light side, instead of immediately trying to kill him. Luke absolutely would never have given up or gone into hiding.
@@jaaaaaaaaaaaaaay the New Jedi Order set out to right the wrongs of the Jedi Order from the prequels. The old Jedi became complacent, blind, and dogmatic. Luke set out to make a better order. One change was Jedi could marry. Attachments weren't the path to the dark side, Jedi SHOULD love, the fear of losing those attachments was what lead to the dark side. Btw, Ki-Adi-Mundi had like 5 wives and 7 kids. Etain Tur-Mukan married a Clone Commando. Ayla Secura and Kit Fisto had a secret romance. Quinlain Voss had a wife and kids. Obi-Wan had like 5 different love interests. It was all over the Jedi of the prequels too.
@@Nidstang_ i think the new jedi order really corrected the mistakes of the old jedi order, and improved the jedi as a whole. plus i loved the whole njo series it was great
Welp, you covered about every issue I had with the sequel trilogy. It’s truly mind-boggling how Disney could spend billions acquiring one of the biggest entertainment franchises in history, then proceed to make a new set of movies WITHOUT a cohesive story plan from the beginning.
I mean I think he put it perfectly say what you will about the prequel trilogy but that had a plan it had a set storyline and it had a progression to get where it was going. Meanwhile the sequel trilogy is just a jumbled mess that never had a clear overarching story and by the end it just was doing its best to limp to the finish line and be done.
And not only a new set of movies, but episodes 7, 8, and 9 in an on going story. You would think that they would have made a better effort to make their movies a natural continuation of the previous films.
@@JohnDoe-wq5eu Amazing, you've described all of the trilogies. Also, having a 'plan' does not equal a good or even cohesive story and I find this a shallow critique lobbed at the sequels. Don't get me wrong, the sequels aren't all that good, but planning an overall story wasn't it's issue in the slightest. Personally I would have preferred JJ Abrams fanboi finger to stay off the franchise because to me that's really where everything doesn't work. It's the 'reboot but not really' first movie combined with this silly 'mystery box' thing where he's fine to ask questions, but never bothers to answer them because when he does, it shows that he didn't have a handle on anything to begin with, just a concept with no follow through. I think Rian had a better set of ideas and fresher thinking for the series and it's a shame we didn't get him on all three movies in some capacity, whether directing, story or screenplay because he was opening up the universe in TLJ, something that JJ apparently wasn't unable or unwilling to do. The funniest thing about star wars is it's a huge battle spanning galaxies and yet only 6 people apparently are even halfway important in it? What a small galaxy apparently. Then again, I'm not a fan of long running IPs in general because even movies with just one sequel rarely justify their existence in the movie itself. It's only justification is *outside* the movie which is always 'yea it'll probably make the studio some money with low effort."
@@JohnDoe-wq5eu that’s what I think about the prequels too they had a planned story not a well executed story, but there was an idea to where to take the plot in that trilogy.
@@heavysystemsinc. You're talking about the deeper issues. Stuff like series fatigue, corporate greed and how mediocre at best most writers in Hollywood are. All true and all factors in why Star Wars died long before the sequel trilogy existed.
I felt that the biggest mistake the franchise made, was re-establishing the conflict of Rebel vs Tyrannical Empire, instead of making a new conflict. That, and giving Rey a staff for most of the first film, only for her to use Anakin’s lightsaber as her main weapon. Like double blade that shit.
I mean they could have had it be that the first order had been corrupting the new republic’s government for decades so that after the attack in the first movie, the New Republic becomes fractured leaving the good guys having to rely on Allie’s they can’t trust as some switch sides and others try to make their own independent fiefdoms.
I always felt that, for the first movie at least, they should have turned this entire conflict around: Turn the First Order into a ragtag band of fanatical Terrorists (ISIS in Space, if you will, complete with a fundamentalist angle and suicide attacks) operating from a Hidden Fortress, fighting like cornered animals. In other words, let the Villains be the Underdogs for a change.
When Poe was doing the “your mother” joke I wondered if I was actually watching the movie or if this was a gag reel or commercial before the real movie started. When Luke threw the saber the theater was completely silent. I think we were all shocked.
To be honest, I really only watch the original Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back with any regularity. While there are some great "scenes" in RotJ that's where I feel the commercial success of the first two films influenced the franchise and threw it off the rails from what was originally intended.
I've even watched the prequels several times. I went to see The Force Awakens in the theatres and kinda enjoyed it, but the next movie turned me off completely (I can't even remember the name of the movie if that says anything). I refused to pay money and be disappointed again, so I pirated the last movie.
@@blueshattrick Snap. I have zero interest in watching either of those movies. The Last Jedi killed Star Wars for me. I have no interest in watching its corpse being desecrated further.
As a man who was old enough to see some of the original trilogy in the theaters, you absolutely hit the nail on the head with this assessment of the newer trilogy. Aside from episode 7, I haven't seen the other 2 more than once. They were jarring and cheapened one of the best IP's in movie history. You are also dead right on Mando and Rogue One as well, I loved those so much more than the sequel trilogy. One of your best videos Mark!
I also remember watching Star Wars in theaters. Before it was renamed episode 4 A New Hope in 1981. I figured George Lucas was seduced by the Dark Side and he saw an opportunity to make more movies and merchandise.
The Last Jedi...the whole movie was basically the scene in Monty Python and the Holy Grail where Lancelot is running towards the castle. It cuts back to the guards, then back to him. Sometimes it seems like he gets further away and then after a few minutes, "HA!" and he starts killing everyone...but stretch it out for the length of a whole movie.
I was lucky enough to see an original print of episode 1 in a private viewing back in 2019. It was so cool seeing that piece of history. The sequels are just trash. I too never went back to rewatch Ep 8 or 9. They just make me feel apathy or annoyance.
As a man who saw all of the original trilogy in theaters, I liked the sequels,...for the most part. I mean sure, they weren't super terrific awesome, but at least they were still better than the prequels. Hell,...Force Awakens and Last Jedi were even better than Return of the Jedi! I'll take a Porg over an Ewok any day!
I am quite young, born 2007, and i disagree with the point that most kids who grew up with the sequels will think they are the best. Most people my age who have seen all the movies prefer either the prequels or originals. We all think the sequels are significantly worse.
As someone in your age group I couldn’t agree more, from my experience most kids who’s first experience with Star Wars was the sequels ended up assuming they hate Star Wars, the Star Wars Saga will always be 6 movies no matter what Disney says
@@alcarbo8613 it’s funny you say this. I’m 27 and when I was a kid the prequels were coming out. Most fans rejected that trilogy and said only the original 3 are real Star Wars movies lol. Tho I definitely agree that the most recent trilogy are clearly pretty awful. There are at least some things I like about the prequels, especially episode 3. With these new ones I’m not sure if they’ll eventually be accepted or not.
What they did with Lei and making her a force user flying thru space and having Luke throw his lightsaber out was completely mind boggling and ruins it for me
Why was Luke's hand obviously metal and skeletal looking. In Empire Strikes Back, his new hand looked like a real hand. I did not like Luke or Leia in The Last Jedi. Neither one of them was acting like themselves.
@@Nick-4K Honestly though, Disney should have had a laid out plan and stuck to it. Instead it really does feel like they were doing a lot of stuff on the fly making important decisions script revisions etc. The whole two different directors thing wouldn't have been such an issue had they been forced to stick to a more rigid framework which of course they weren't.
@@Nick-4K It's just as much on Abrams for putting a highly visible wound on a major character in such a terrible spot to begin with. Abrams wasn't thinking about how it'd look a few scenes down the track so Rian had to deal with the mistake. At any point he could have said 'what's the gong to look like by the third movie' and seen his mistake. I really don't like TLJ or a lot of Rian's decisions but there are plenty of instances like that where he was handed something bad to work with and had to make the best of it.
@For the 501st "save" she nearly killed him. And it's still a mystery how they managed to get back to the base safely and before everyone else. Well to be fair, they already did that few moment earlier by escaping the ship (with incredible luck) and arriving before everyone else, somehow. Also a mystery how she managed to turn back and catch him by taking a longer path while he was obviously going as fast as he could in a straight line.
I fully agree. I actually leaned in from utter disbelief when Finn began his charge and remember thinking "they might actually salvage this movie", then Rose happens and I just check out. It just gets worse from there unfortunately.
I never really respected Finns character he was always somewhat of wasted potential right? When I was in the theater and he was about to yeet him self to save everyone it was one of the few times I felt any emotion when watching the sequel trilogy and then Rose came and knocked him out the way and I lost all respect I actually walked out of the theater at that very moment I’m a huge Star Wars fan have been my whole life but when that happened there was no hope left in my body to try and salvage the Shity Disney franchise in my mind
The complete lack of a coherent story arc for the sequel trilogy is even more jarring when one considers that, within the same company, Kevin Feige was able to craft Marvel's Infinity Saga with minimal bumps and missteps and still keep true to the story that they wanted to tell.
That is the big difference between the people in charge of marvel and the people in charge of Star wars. They didn't even try to have a basic outline of where they wanted things to go. It wouldn't have even been an issue having different directors had they had basic things in place that couldn't be messed with instead they thought it would be a good idea to give these guys all the slack they wanted to do basically whatever they wanted. And the results were exactly what you'd expect.
@Steven Perez Have to agree - There was a definite lack of imagination... Or far too much, Lets be fair - Rian Johnson wanted to do something different and NOT play it safe - Yeah, he totally screwed it up, but to his credit he did take chances... To a degree!!! Disney, Rian Johnson and JJ Abrahams all made one CARDINAL MISTAKE!!! And it shows when you really look at it... I am a fan of the Movies, I am not well versed in Expanded Universe or Legends Material... But even I could see very, very clearly that ALL decided to try and appease Legends / EU fans by constantly borrowing or referencing EU Materials - Really bad with Johnson as he even posted Twitter Photos to explain where he got ideas from - Forcing Fans to read the EU Materials to understand his vision!!! NO! THAT IS NOT HOW A VISUAL MEDIUM WORKS!!! Palpatine back from the Grave in a Clone Body - Its in the EU, so CHECK! Palpatine's Grandchild... Its in the EU so CHECK! Rey being Related to a PREMIER Force User... Pure Sodding Fan Service ... CHECK! Yellow Lightsabre - Knights of the Old Republic, An EU Game so... CHECK! What makes it worse is with a little thought and imagination - These pieces of Fan Service COULD HAVE WORKED!!! They really could have... SCRAP Rey being related to ANY FORCE USER... That's NOT how the Force Works despite fans ASSUMING it does!!! (If it did, Then the Entire Star Wars Universe is about Incest!!! GROSS!!!) Have Snoke being one of Palpatines Clones!!! One that is steadily failing... MAKE SENSE! The Yellow Lightsabre is when Rey realises that True Balance means Embracing BOTH Light and Dark Side... And she forms teh GREY JEDI... Leading to another Trilogy then where Both Jedi and Sith can be Antagonists as BOTH believe they have the true path! There was simply NO THOUGHT! Only MONEY!
It helps that there's source material to go off of. Sure Kevin Feige changed things, but he mostly stayed true to what was already in the comics. KK/JJ Abrams/Rian threw everything out, EU and George's own drafts, in favor of their own shallow, uninspired, and derivative writing.
You mean the story that spent over a dozen entries painting Purple Hulk and his minions as evil douchebags and then turned around and expected the viewers to turn around and like him because he farted out some bullshit about random genocide creating balance?
I absolutely agree that rogue one was an excellent film. It didn't try to mess with any of the original story, it just added to it. It was a very good side story.
The recent Star Wars trilogy could have been outstanding. The best thing they could've done is to flip roles, and make it so Kylo goes from villain to savior, and Rey goes from chosen-hero to ultimate villain. There is all sorts of dramatic material there for the actors to work with. Luke could have been a believer in Rey, but is forced to reconcile with his blindness to her susceptibility to the Dark Side of the force, and grapple with how wrong he was in wanting to kill Kylo, instead of giving him a chance to grow and change. Fynn would have been a fascinating character if they followed up on his being a Storm Trooper, and they should have made him less naive and goofy, and more serious and haunted. He should have a rough time making the transition as an opponent to the Empire. Poe could have been a perfectly likeable hot-shot pilot who comes in and does heroics when needed, and he should have died in the second movie to galvanize the solidarity of the new Rebellion. Come on people, this stuff writes itself.
Fact it stumbled so bad and fell not only on its face but apparently on its face into a giant pile of dog crap is just the monumental failure of Disney all around on this trilogy. Multiple directors, Katherine Kennedy the horrible horrible basic writing and the fact that they couldn't even form a basic arc structure for the freaking story ahead of time really shows how poorly planned out it all was. Everything about this feels so rushed to get a product out and it shows.
"The best thing they could've done..." was to give it to somebody else to make the movie. Logically, the appropriate story would be for Rey-Rey to be identified as a force user and be hunted down. We didn't need a so-called first order, just the remnants of the Empire trying to keep control and assassinate threats to their power.
Finn and Poe should been paired up and fought together like in a buddy movie, like a live-action version of Robotech. That would've been a perfect counterpoint to the heavier scenes of Rey training and being tempted by the Dark Side.
the thing that got me the most annoyed with Leia "flying" back to the ship through space is that this moment was a perfect time to kill off her character since her actress died a couple of months before the release of this movie. I just...dont understand what they were thinking
Leia is a "strong woman" She lends credibility to the resistance just by being there. And if they killed her off, the feminists would have burned this movie to the ground. If she died, who would have told all the men what to do all the time? Narratively, it should be Poe, hero of the resistance. But he's a dude and after getting yelled at and demoted for wasting lives with reckless behavior, Leia and Holda waste lives with their stupid plan. But because they are "strong women", they can't possibly be wrong.
@@ericpeterson8732 Yeah, sure "the feminists"... And the incel has spoken. Dude try improved personal hygiene and not being an obnoxious asshole. It's you, mate. It's not them, it is you!
I mean it is hard to have a reasonable conversation considering the absolute fervent anger and hatred toward it. And though I think most of that is warranted I do feel like it's gotten way out of control for what it is. I have to say though at least things like the mandalorian prove Disney can do things properly it's just you can't rush it.
Mark: *"Again, Disney paid $4,000,000,000 for this. Don't you think it would've been a smart idea to just take some time to plan this out and make sure everybody's on the same page?"* Critical Drinker: *"Nah, it'll be fine."*
The part where light speed is used against star destroyers broke the entire franchise, in my opinion. Why didn't they just do that in the first movie if it was a thing?
Because suicide is a bad idea and a last resort, and they had a plan that could have worked with a few figters. If it "broke" the whooe franchise then why would jan ever bother doimg calculations and worry about colliding with things when jumping to light speed? Hitting things has been a part of the lore of hyperspeed since the first movie so please stfu. Its a moronic argument about a bloody scifi movie about space wizards.
@@pepsiipep7842 pilot what, an entire capital ship? As if the rebelion has tons of those just lying around. Also its shown droids have personalities, do they would still need to be willing to kill themselves. And even then the both of the death stars were a lot more massive than the ship snoke had.
"Subverting expectations" just means unpredictable. You could've ended the trilogy with Jar Jar Binks wanking off on Han Solo's grave... doesn't make it good or compelling.
The biggest issue is that they didn't have a story mapped out. They just make it up as they go along and it's become ridiculous. Di$ney is the Galactic Empire.
Everything about the prequel trilogy just feels rushed and poorly written. It's very clear they didn't even have a basic outline where they wanted to go with it and just sort of built the bridge as they were crossing it as they say. That and the fact that Ray suffers from the same problem 99.9% of female protagonists have in these movies. No decent progression and no needing to overcome any obstacles or adversity just they are super powerful no need to explain why the end.
I don't agree that it's the biggest issue. You don't necessarily need it all mapped out. Making a bad movie, then an awful movie, then another bad movie is the biggest issue. Not caring about the characters, the story, plot holes, inconsistencies, contrivances is the biggest issue.
The story of the original movies was pretty much just made up as they went along too. Much as Lucas likes to pretend he had a plan-- he really didn't. Anakin was never meant to be Vader, Leia was never meant to be the mysterious twin sister, Luke was never meant to be the one to take down the emperor (that was going to be his sister in her own trilogy), Jabba wasn't meant to be a big slug monster, etc. His original plans were a far messier and more convoluted story and they quickly veered off that plan by Emperor Strikes Back. Instead the sequel was going to be Splinter of the Mind's Eye. Only the prequels had a "road map" and even that got royally screwed up by choices that were made in the Phantom Menace. But there was at least a set end-point they needed to reach.
Fun fact almost no one has noticed: The last two fights in the last movie (ray vs storm troopers and ray vs storm troopers) are the same shot, just taken from two different camera angles. They altered the cg so that it appeared different. It's hilarious. In the reused footage, because perspective is flipped, laser blasts come out of no where and take 90 degree angles. Some deflect off of nothing because they were originally planned to hit the person next to the shooter. Honestly give it a look, you'll have a blast.
@@HardCR0W Okay, sith troupers. All the same. She fights them twice in a row. It's the same fight. Same shot. Just a different camera angle and new cg.
The drastic change from Mark's tone when he was talking about the first sequel to when he started talking about the second sequel has noticeably gone from chill to "I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed"
I think i was in 5th grade when force awakens came out, super excited after watching the originals and prequels. I quite enjoyed it, same with rouge one. But when I saw the last jedi in imax I remember sitting there with everyone when the credits rolled in silence. No one clapped like force awakens or rouge one. When i saw rise of skywalker it was dead silent and people just left during the movie. The rise of skywalker had to be one of the most disappointing things to me. Not just because the movie is bad, but what it did to damage the star wars canon. I agree with what you said mark. From the prequels we know anakin is destined to destroy the sith. Within the originals he did destroy the sith. He completed what had to be done. Anakins legacy is completely pointless in the rise of skywalker by the return of the sith he destroyed. It saddens me that rey then completed the same task as anakin had. I believe that is what is damaging the most.
You have my sympathy. The few times I've been among an audience that clapped at the end of a commercial playback of a recording left me feeling embarrassed to be part of such a group. Fun fact: _Rouge One_ was originally going to be titled Vermilion One. They changed it when Disney's accountants discovered they were going to be charged by the letter.
I saw the Force Awakens in 5th grade as well, and I liked it, as well as Rogue One. The Last Jedi I thought was divisive and I didn't get any answers of origins stories for characters and things looked pretty slow. When TROS came out I kinda liked it cuz it wasn't like TLJ.
But...she wasn't in a position to save anyone? It was the slave children who saved Rose, and they used the horses to save her and Finn. Trying to get the children out of there while already being hunted down by the police would have accomplished nothing. Meanwhile, setting the horses free wasn't the original goal as much as it was a pleasant byproduct.
@@purefoldnz3070 I don't exactly know how to respond to this comment. At this point, it seems like you're so dead-set on seeing flaws in this movie that you'll twist anything I say into a perceived crime. That said, I still don't see how "endangering animals to save themselves" is a logical reading of what occurred in the film. It was the kids who let the animals free, and as far as "endangering" goes, they would probably be far safer by attempting to escape the city than they would be remaining in captivity.
@@purefoldnz3070 The idea of the main characters returning to save the enslaved children is yet another baffling complaint that smells like you're simply trying to cook up critiques. I think it would be amazing for Finn, Rose, and co. to eventually return to Canto Bight to bring justice to the criminals and victims there, but to think that they should do so at the end of TLJ, where they barely managed to escape with their lives in tact, is asinine. Meanwhile, the ending of TLJ does bring up back to the children and shows that the main characters did in fact accomplish something for the children -- they provided the kids with hope. Specifically, what we're shown is that Luke's act on Crait became a story that swiftly traveled the universe, bringing hope to children within the universe in the same way that Luke in the original trilogy brought hope to children in the real world. And if you turn around and say that hope is worthless in comparison to actually saving the kids from their captivity, then I would have to surmise that you don't actually understand one of the major themes of the original trilogy.
Honestly if the movies didn’t disrespect the old characters and their accomplishments, and had actually character development for the new characters people would accept them much more, but the thing that doesn’t make sense about it is the directors and Disney double down on their bad choices, calling people names for calling them out or not liking their bad work
They hire the worst kind of people to work at Lucasfilm too, and fire people who were just speaking their opinions online at their own free time no less.
Ya I heard kk Actually said that we are scared of strong women i mean bro i like Ashoka tano and she is crazy powerful i mean she held her own against greavus as a padawan and took on Darth Vader later on and even damaged him Quite a bit which is a great feat to accomplish and here kk says that the sequel's are good but the fans are shocked by strong women
If I could rewrite the sequel trilogy, my main character would be Finn, a defecting stormtrooper who could *maayybbee* become a Jedi (seeing as him being Force sensitive was hinted at in ROS). Even if he didn't end up being a Jedi in this rewritten trilogy, I still think he should be the main character. The only time we really got any mainstream media focusing on non-Force sensitive people were the clone focused episodes of Clone Wars. It'd be interesting to see a different perspective on both the inside scoop of how the Empire works and the normal person side of things. I would also have Rey, a Jedi apprentice, and Kylo Ren, a Sith apprentice, swap places in the span of the trilogy. Rey falls to the dark side and Kylo discovers the light, resulting in lots of internal conflict and trust issues within their newfound organizations. I feel like all of this could be an interesting twist on both the Star Wars mythos and the Hero's Journey. I feel that with some work, this would be a good way of subverting expectations while not butchering the foundation or creating a twist just for shock value. TL;DR Over the course of three movies, main character stormtrooper turns rebel, Jedi turns Sith and Sith turns Jedi, concluding in a climactic battle where loyalties are questioned and the war could be tipped either way, maybe the audience doesn't know who to root for anymore.
agree 110% The way the movie started set that up better than anything. It follows Finn the most, treats him as the protagonist, then kicks him to the curb once Rey comes into the picture.
If I could rewrite the Sequel Trilogy I'd keep everything exactly the way it is... up until the end of The Last Jedi. The entire Sequel Trilogy was doing brilliantly up to the end of the second movie... and then Disney sadly decided to listen to the blind haters and thus made Rise of Skywalker (A stupid name to start with) ignore, retcon, or even outright mock everything The Last Jedi established. What they should have done was continue with rather than avoid the rather large amount of plot hooks that TLJ set up. Most notably, the fact that the Resistance is reduced to a handful of people in an old smuggler's freighter and the fact that a psychopathic manchild was in control of the most powerful military force in the galaxy. Either one of those alone would've been enough material for an entire TV series not to mention a third movie.
I mean-- so long as you are a character who has existed in more than one scene in Star Wars, a crash landing is never fatal. That was long, long established before that scene. The really silly part is just how long of a conversation they have out in the open in front of a large army with no other targets. The first order was rather considerate to just stand there motionless for a good two or three minutes to let them have their emotional scene.
The parts of the last trilogy I hated was all the repeated times Finn kept hollering "Rey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!", plus he couldn't use a lightsaber, and yet he said he felt the force. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@TheHobgoblyn I dunno man, the way they shot it made it look like she murdered Finn. I remember watching the HISHE of this movie and I thought they exaggerated the crash for humor only to find out that's exactly how it looked in the movie.
I was a bit confused when Finn was such a focus and then progressively became less important. They hinted he had force powers. They should have went all in with Finn along with Rey learning the force together and then ultimately becoming enemies when Rey joins Kylo in the end. And now you can use Finn and Poe like Luke and Han. So many missed opportunities.
The actor said this himself. He actively complains now that his character arc goes nowhere and was basically a bait and switch. He should have become a Jedi (Rey does train him in an animation but that's too late). He should have had a far larger importance.
@Jon Hesson I know they delete certain people from the marketing, but Disney knew before TFA China hates "British" people. So why even bother giving him the dope backstory and the second lead? Its almost as if Disney is now run by a bunch of dipsh*ts.
@Jon Hesson Is saying "black" taboo or something? But yes, one of the main reasons I never made it past TFA was Finn running around like an idiot after "Reeeyyyyy!!!" Just a waste of potential.
9:15. This! This! “I’ll tell you where I thought I came in - in the forest, when the lightsaber [wiggles] like this, and flies off. I thought, ‘Oh, what a great entrance! GAH! Rey caught it…? She hasn’t even been to Dagobah for training! What’s the deal?'” Mark Hamill is absolutely correct. Everything was building up to the moment where we see Luke Skywalker. In that signature moment where everything seems dark, the setting was perfect, the suspense was great. And as the lightsaber flies outwards, it lands in the hands of our favorite farmboy turned Jedi. This would have allowed us to see Luke Skywalker in the flesh once more. There were Mark Hamill's voice in the trailer of the Force Awakens. Many were left in eager anticipation about what was going to be the next Star Wars movie, to see Luke Skywalker again, and see how strong he has grown three decades later. This could have shown Luke's Mastery in the Force and what he has learned in the past 30 years. Luke would have caught the lightsaber, confronting Kylo Ren, and allowing Rey and Chewie to save Finn. Luke would express his disappointment to his nephew, and showing that these writers respect the legacy of Luke Skywalker and the original characters. This would have completely made sense. Luke would felt the disturbance in the Force if he felt so many innocents being murdered and would have definitely felt Han Solo's - someone who was like a brother in all but blood - death. Luke would have been kept in the character that he was in the past movies, and had the arc established three decades ago respected. Luke's appearance would have benefitted all of the characters. Kylo Ren would demonstrate his abilities against his old Master. This moment would have humanized Rey as well, giving her a chance to be able to grow. It would show that she is not above being rescued. Her catching that lightsaber and defeating a TRAINED Force user in combat. This would haven't allowed Rian Johnson to ruined Luke's character. Kylo Ren would have remained fearsome and show he is too much for both Finn and Rey. Luke would tell him that he could still come back - that alone would have shown that he is still that man who doesn't give up on his family, expressing that there is good in him and that he won't ever give up on him. That Vader redeemed himself and that he could too. Kylo Ren could have shown even doubts about the deeds he done. There would have been a mystery surrounding Luke's character, the backstory with Snoke. And after disarming Kylo Ren and allowing him to flee, Luke could have returned to the Resistance with the main characters and have a reunion with Leia where they both would cry with Chewie about Han's death. This was a extremely miss opportunity that should have been reality.
The way they lackadaisacally wrote how Poe survived the ship crash with Fin at the start of the 1st movie was a very big warning sign that these movies were piss poorly written.
Yeah, a tie figher literally crashed from space and both survive? That made me instantly worry about TFA as i watched it in cinema. I feel like not enough people talk about that aspect.
@@BenRai2k I wasn't even thinking about that aspect. I was referring to how Poe just disappears, the ship sinks underground and later he's like 'yeah. Don't worry about how I escaped certain death. It's not important'. He might as well have just said 'I'm a main character, idiot'. I think movies like f&f have made me numb to crashes actually causing anyone harm.
Just shows the lack of effort that went into the writing. Originally was supposed to die, but JJ, upon hearing that so many of Oscar Isaacs characters have been killed decided that he would spare Poe. However he didnt bother changing the story to justify that decision.
i was already done with last jedi when poe and hux had that extremely funny conversation in the first few minutes. as if the lightsaber toss wasnt enough, by that point i knew 'oh its gonna be that kind of movie'
Rial Johnson not taking into account the death of Carrie Fisher, (keeping the character alive at the end when they literally filmed her being flung into space, an easy out) and killing off Luke, the only other original trilogy main (except Lando who was just ignored for two films), when he had nearly a year for reshoots severely undermined the final film. It’s especially infuriating when the original director of episode 9 asked to have these changes made, and Johnson refused even though JJ made similar changes to the end of 7 to fit his film. He just comes across as a completely self centred person who did not care about the franchise he was working in, and frankly he should not have been involved.
i hated episodes 7 8 an d 9 i blame kathleen kennedy j j and rian johnson of course disney themselfs for destroying the sequel trilogy rushing it and not taking their time with each film ot and pt trilogy took 2 years between films the only charecter i liked was kylo ren/ben solo but they didnt how to use the charecter and i hated this entire dyad bullshit which screws up the entire first 6 films they are changing the sith rule of two to match up with that piece of garbage film known as the rise of skywalker i hated the last jedi i loath that film defending the sequel trilogy is wrong the sequel trilogy is garbage pure garbage u grew up eading star wars books and movies and rey is not a true skywalker shes a palpatine at the end of the sequel she gets the rank as jedi master she never trained nobody how come she gets that rank plus jedis dont kill but kylo ren killed snoke in bloody murder when you kill off the main bad guy snoke was suposse the new palpatine but then they killed off te main bad guy and brought back a bad guy whos already dead the sequel trilogy is garbage and it will alwas will be garbage rey is the worst charecter ever created known to mankind
Filming had completed on The Last Jedi and Carrie Fisher was signed up for Ep9., and you want a director to completely restructure a story due to her death? You don't like the movie, you don't like Rian Johnson...fine...but suggesting that a scene be re-purposed (and completely changing the plot of the movie as a consequence) simply to provide a tacky death scene for Leia...is just nonsense.
@@daviddobarganes9115 i consider episode 8 a trashfire of a film i hate this whole force dyad stuff im a star wars superfan but this is not how to make a film this movie trilogy is totally disjointeded and feels rushed
The characters become gods, it was too unbelievable. I remembered how Luke struggled to lift his starfighter, in the sequels, the emperor lifts up an entire fleet, and Liea flys in space, WTW…lol at least be grounded
I thought this trilogy had some of the worse writing i ever saw. Force Awakens is a lazy rehash. Someone spoiled the movie for me and told me the main villain is Han and Leia's child. I thought it was joke because it sounds like fanfiction... I like how in the second movie they say Rey's parents were just ordinary people. I like that because im sick and tired of everybody being related to a main character from the original trilogy. There were so many theories about who Rey was related to. I even saw fan theories about how Finn could be related to Lando...you know because they're both Black i guess 🤦♂ And the biggest nail in the coffin for me was them bringing back Palpatine 🤦♂ Jesus Christ the laziness. Oh and an added bonus Rey is Palpatine's granddaughter 🙄 What a retarded trilogy.
I'm guessing the whole palpatine angle was basically an incredibly lazy and hackneyed attempt to explain/shoehorn in the poorest way possible at the last possible second why she somehow has an innate ability to basically do all the crazy crap they think she's capable of doing for some reason. I mean the movie has the worst tendencies with the Ray character it takes the worst and I mean worst current trends in movies and just shoves them into this movie in the most in your face we don't give a damn it's all about the message kind of way. I really truly hope that the series is finally done and we will never see another continuation of the story ever again.
@@JohnDoe-wq5eu the crazy thing about trying to explain Rey’s powers is that it’s already done in The Last Jedi. Snoke says, “Darkness rises and light, to meet it.” The reason why he wanted to kill Luke is because he thought it was him, not expecting it to be Rey, which ties in well with the whole thing about heroes coming from common or unexpected places. The force awakened and Kylo and Rey are the emissaries who will decide how things balance out in this new age. I was satisfied enough with that, but 🤷🏾♂️.
Palpatine was just... Before the final film I read that Jar-Jar could be revealed as planning everything as a Master Villain, that would definitely been better.
It really boggles the mind for me how Disney spent billions on this franchise, and then goes into making a trilogy WITHOUT having written some script drafts for the WHOLE thing. Even James Cameron did some preliminary drafts for Avatar 2-3 and those movies had a decade between them. This is just dumb.
It would have taken one hour and a whiteboard for a rough but workable skeleton for the entire trilogy. This could have taken place at the same time they seemingly just let Michael Arndt struggle alone on the script for episode 7 for a year or so. Heck, they could have let him look at and contribute to the bigger picture of the trilogy as a whole as a constructive way to help him out of his rut. But instead they just let him flounder, panicked when time ran short, kicked him out and got JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan to rewrite the script from scratch in 6 weeks, leaving a ridiculously short amount of time to contemplate any planning beyond the next immediate deadline. Shambolic.
I remember being in the theater being like "okay, Leia is dead I can deal with that. Her son couldn't do it, but his troops shot from behind him." But then she opened her eyes and I immediately sighed and slumped in my seat.
Johnson, with Kennedy's blessings, didn't do a sequel, but a "deconstruction." "Kill the past" is the movie's battle cry as it trashes Luke's character and has Yoda himself BURN THE JEDI LIBRARY! I was shocked when that happened, and I'm still amazed more people don't have a problem with TLJ's obvious hatred for its source material.
It's only viewed as hatred for the source material because it was bad Were it a solid film in its own right, breaking the cycle of "we know exactly how this is going to happen because it's a Star Wars movie and Jedi are good and perfect and anything else is bad and evil" would've made for a very compelling film in the movies Looking into any of the SW lore outside the main 9 films tells you the universe and the dichotomy of the Light and Dark side is more nuanced, tells you not all Jedi are good/not all Sith are bad, etc. The destruction of countless years of dogmatic religious worship, the recognition of Yoda's failings and how his dogmatism led to the rise of Vader and Palpatine, etc are examples of themes that could've been explored and resulted in something very much fitting for the source material, but the film (independent of the Star Wars name) wasn't all that great, which means instead of the message of "the fact we keep doing the same things over and over expecting different results and that clearly doesn't work" (i.e. "Kill the past if you have to") could've made for a very compelling narrative, *especially* immediately following The Force Awakens which might as well been a shot-for-shot remake of A New Hope The Last Jedi had the potential to be one of the best Star Wars stories we had, but RJ clearly didn't want to step on too many toes, didn't care enough about the characters (Yoda I personally think was done well but Rey is still garbage and Luke was a major disappointment), and JJ was just gonna retcon anything too outside the norm anyway If JJ or RJ had control over the entire set of sequels, we would've gotten very different films. JJ would've made a fanservice extravaganza where Rey is perfect cuz god forbid she not be (I still think it would've been crap tbh) RJ might've made something that added complexity to the story the way Darth Vader's character arc added complexity to the originals. Personally, of the 3 films, TLJ is my favorite, to many people's surprise, because it at least took some risks and wasn't phoned in copy-paste like 7 and 9 were to me. It doesn't hate the source material, it just tried (badly) to do something actually *NEW* with it pulling from lore outside the main movies, and big daddy Disney didn't want too much of that, and JJ basically gave the finger to all of it in The Rise of Skywalker (like RJ did to TFA in TLJ) As someone who grew up with Star Wars, it was a much-anticipated breathe of fresh air for the series to me, and unfortunately that "fresh air" ended up being a strong hit from an exhaust pipe instead. Of all the sequels I actually have the most respect for TLJ, even with all its fuckups, because at least it isn't a friggin' clone of movies we've already seen. That's still a very, very low amount of respect and I don't intend to ever rewatch any of those films, but I'll take "new risks" instead of "laughably rehashed money printer".
I, like millions of others, walked out of the theatre for The Last Jedi, and then out of the Star Wars fandom forever. Disney doesn’t want my money. If they did, they wouldn’t have released The Last Jedi.
Both trilogies had the opposite problem. The prequels suffered from Lucas being way too overly involved with every aspect of the production to the point where he micro-managed the fuck out of the actors performances, whereas the sequels suffered from him being so uninvolved to the point where they completely discarded the treatments he'd already supplied them with beforehand.
Probably has something to do with the fact that George Lucas is a no talent credit stealing hack who in reality had barely anything at all to do with the Original Trilogy and thus creating Star Wars.
@@immortalfrieza I don't think that's true. He does have talent, but that talent comes across much better when he collaborates with people who are willing to offer constructive criticism and challenge him when needed. And for far too long, he surrounded himself with people who were the exact opposite of that.
@@dkamphaus43 This may sound strange, but I don't buy this whole "Lucas needs to bounce his ideas off other people" schtick. Everybody brings that argument up without recognizing that Lucas isn't a very conventional filmmaker, maybe he's not trying to accomplish necessarily what we think he is, and therefore stop criticizing him for something he isn't trying to achieve
This was one of the most well-thought out critics of the new trilogy. My thoughts echoed a lot of yours and I too cant believe Disney didn’t create an outline for the trilogy before starting them.
Disney probably did have a plan, it's just that it got constantpy changed due to everyone's reaction after TFA, everyone, and I literally mean *everyone* loved it, then after 2 months *everyone* again decided it's a trash rehash. Then the plan probably got completely scrapped after TLJ.
@@oliverklosov5153 Seriously? Mauler? The same guy that makes 15 hour long podcasts bullying people who disagree with him? That guy is a full blown degenerate, idk how can anyone follow him.
@@user-ly2ll5od1r Allegedly, JJ had scripts written for 7 8 and 9, but Rian Johnson threw out the script 100% for 8, which is why its so out of place and doesn't make much sense, and why 9 retconned much of 8, and was also a huge mess.
The retroactive subtitle "Episode IV: A New Hope" was not added until 1981. The original theatrical release was simply called Star Wars. The title change was in anticipation of plans to make a horrible prequel trilogy & the eventual addition of Jar Jar Binks level CGI bullcrap to the original trilogy. Any real Star Wars fan will get the original theatrical version of Star Wars & chuck their CGI-laden Episode IV: A New Hope DVD into the trash where it belongs.
@@proto-geek248 I've seen an original title crawl on RU-vid without Episode IV written in. Probably edited digitally but still looked good. From my understanding the studio took back all the prints from 77. All subsequent home media releases have episode IV written on the title crawl.
Only a couple of minutes in and it's so refreshing to heat someone critiquing star wars whilst not treating people who disagree with you like idiots. People can like things you don't and it's nice to hear someone acknowledge that for once
Thanks for posting this. I am 2:33 in and paused to comment on how shocked I was to be witnessing actual maturity and reasonableness. That and I completely agree about Rogue 1 😀.
I don't think growing up with a trilogy necessarily means it will be your favorite. I was 6 when I saw Phantom Menace in the theater and I remember being utterly bored unless Maul was on screen.
I saw the last jedi opening night. I was absolutely dumbfounded with the direction Disney took this movie. It single handedly turned me off to star wars. I wasn't expecting pure fan service, and I'm not mad about Luke dying. It's like it was a huge troll for the sake of Johnson pissing off OG fans.
Analyzing the sequel trilogy has been infinitely more entertaining than the movies themselves for me. Another take on it is always welcome, especially from you. Cheers!
2 года назад
lol yes, I have watched the sequels twice, but I have watched MANY hours of YT videos demolishing them lol
It's actually insane how obsessed media has become with nostalgia currently. Eventhough we recently get so many reboots that "nobody asked for" we're still watching these out of curiosity, familiarity or nostalgia, which keeps the cycle going. So I'm not even sure the producers care about the critics since everyone (me included) is watching those anyways 👀.
@ Agreed! I think majority of us dont even want something new. We are more comfortable with things we are familiar with. The exploitation of nostalgia was not always like this so I'm curious what this means for the future of hollywood and media in general. (btw I enjoy these movies too its not that I dislike nostalgia in media in general)
Disney hired two director/writers. One who likes to build up empty expectations and one who likes to subvert expectations. WtF did they think will happen?
The original trilogy promoted growth, and naturally appealed to those with a growth mindset. The sequel trilogy depicted innate superiority, and appealed to those with a fixed mindset. If you think that the current generation of young adults are entitled and emotionally fragile, just wait another 10 years...
I mean that's the whole thing the Ray character is like the worst tendencies of current Hollywood and female leading characters. We've seen the same kind of stuff with the Mulan live action version, Captain marvel and the list goes on. A character that needs to never overcome anything and simply is stronger and better than anyone else, just because. I hate that anyone that tries to point out this obvious fallacy is immediately considered chauvinistic or sexist. Good female leading characters can be written I've seen it done it should have been done instead you have this mess which makes it all the worse.
I don't care about Star wars but I love this video. I appreciate both the critical and well-motivated take, and the sincerity. Mark, you're pretty darn awesome.
Thank you for doing this video. Oddly enough, all three of them are on Hulu and I'm watching them. Yes, I'm watching them and regretting it. I forgot just how bad they all were, especially "The Last Jedi" and "The Rise of Skywalker"... Time did these films NO favors. And thank you for pushing "Rogue One" a bit, I'm like you and feel the movie, while not perfect, really feels like an actual Star Wars movie.
Abrams' is a Hollywood trust-fund baby. What do you expect from the child of tv producers? He's a businessman. And he's a good businessman. He and Disney knew more people would flock to see an established franchise than something new and original (and, presumably, well-written). And they were right.
Yeah, that is exactly the problem with Abrams and his "mystery box" bullshit. He just sets up intriguing mysteries that he has no interest in ever explaining, then hands off the project to somebody else like Lindelof & Cuse or Riann Johnson to finish. Joke was on him this time, though, when directing the Ep IX fell back into his lap after Johnson had dismissed the plot points he had set up.
My biggest issue is the fact that JJ Abrams wrote and directed the Force Awakens which is legitimately a copy, rewrite, paste of a New Hope, but everyone only blames Rian Johnson for why the sequels failed. What plans did JJ have? Daisy Ridley and JJ Abrams himself even admitted JJ didn't have a plan. However, it's another director who takes all the blame and the Fall of Skywalker proves it. JJ Abrams can't even write his own original stories correct. Lost and Frenge are prime examples, and also Star Trek which hardcore fans will say he ruined. However, he's never faced the repercussions of being a bad writer. He just blames someone else or the company, then moves upward.
The reason jj-abrams isn't blamed as much as Ryan Johnson for the Star Wars theme is that a copy of New Hope is far better than what Rian Johnson did to Luke Skywalker which was an outright injection of the source material. I'll I'll do both are bad one is objectively worse common to most people
Rian Johnson never should have been allowed anywhere near Star Wars. He didn't have the slightest understanding of how anything in Star Wars works. Look at the opening scene and then, if you're a fan, tell me you're not wondering why the Y-Wings aren't tearing the hell out of that ship instead of those bizarre bombers. How about the infamous Holdo maneuver that literally breaks space combat in Star Wars? How about the idiotic old woman with danger hair who puts the entire resistance into serious jeopardy and CAUSES A MUTINY because she can't be bothered to give a hint that she has some idea of what she's doing?
Even thought Force awakens is an straight copy of A New Hope. Johnson takes the blame because he discontinued the movie before for an plot that ended nowhere, also the decharacterization of Luke were just too much.
Eh... I would argue that the Force Awakens was lazy and safe. Typical JJ Abrams. But we didn't trash the Force Awakens because it did two things and didn't do one very important thing. The first thing it did was what it had to do: introduce a new generation to Star Wars. Never assume your audience knows anything about the story you're trying to tell. Now... one should not assume the audience is STUPID--which is something JJ Abrams tends to do--but one should not assume the audience is well-versed in the lore of the universe. The second thing it did was that it opened up several possibilities. Who is Rey? Who is Snoke? Why is Anakin's lightsaber still around? Why did it call out to Rey? Who is Finn? Why did Kylo turn to the dark side? Why is Luke hiding on a remote planet? All of these are compelling plots that could have been explored. But, since JJ Abrams is lazy and safe, he never actually bothered to explore what the end result of those plots should be and just handed off an incomplete project to the next guy. That next guy being probably the worst human being in the history of written language to be given this creative task. And the one thing that TFA didn't do that TLJ did was that it didn't destroy anything that had come previous. In fact... it pretty much just copied everything that came previous. The Force Awakens had its problems but nothing it did was fundamentally incongruous with the rest of Star Wars. It fit in the universe even if that's the only thing positive we can say about it. Now... I know what you're thinking. I know people get in arms about Han Solo and the way he was handled but in the context of TFA alone, this isn't an enormous problem. Don't get me wrong: I think it was a crappy thing to do making him a deadbeat dad cruising the galaxy in his '67 Chevy and then killed off like a punk. But, Han Solo being a selfish space pirate is not out of character. That's exactly what he was when we met him. And I get what they were going for with his death--he was trying to redeem his son. It definitely could have been handled better but I at least understand where they were trying to go with it. None of this can be said of the Last Jedi. The purpose of TLJ was to take Star Wars to new levels; break new ground. Instead, it basically destroyed everything that came before it. Not only did it completely ignore all the plot points that Abrams set up, it crapped all over Luke--being a depressed hermit was NEVER in Luke's character--it ruined space battles, it added elements that have never been an issue before, it was logically inconsistent within its own narrative structure, it defied the tone and themes of the Star Wars universe as a whole and, to top it all off, took ever opportunity to tell fans of the franchise what horrible people they were. Yeah... The Force Awakens is not masterpiece. But it was The Last Jedi that destroyed Star Wars.
Everyone kinda forgets the hatred for the prequels before the sequels were releases and everyones fear that disney would destroy the soul of star wars. I get the feeling that TFA was intentionally created to say hey we are not making the mistakes of the prequels.
Mark, this video best showcases your intricate knowledge of storytelling and how it impacts the discerning. Your critique of terrible movies goes far beyond the obvious, delving into the filmmakers' basic failure to...tell stories! For me, THAT'S why your videos are utterly hilarious. You find ways to offer your opinion that are far more humorous than insulting to those with the gumption to MAKE these films, and STILL recognize their effort. Further, it's clear that you have a genuine love for good cinema. You walk a fine line in ways your peers can only aspire to. Thanks for, at the very least, helping to make my long working hours considerably more interesting. What you do for the art of filmmaking is a contribution to the canon.
It’s amazing to me that they didn’t plan out the trilogy to have at least a general outline to have how things are supposed to go when they have had a supreme track record with Marvel. They had a perfect example of how they could get the trilogy they wanted while allowing directors to have some wiggle room to put in things they want in a movie. Great video Mark, you nailed everything about what was wrong with this trilogy.
After watching "The Nostalgia Awakens", I was done with Star Wars. I didn't even want to watch it after the prequels but all the nerds were creaming their jeans about it and saying it lived up to the hype but it was just a garbage remake of the first movie and I hated Marey Suewalker so I was done. I've never seen another Star Wars movie and you know what? I'm absolutely OK with that. I grew up on the original trilogy. Those movies defined my childhood. I'm not a child anymore and I don't need Star Wars in my life anymore. I feel like I've left an abusive relationship and it feels good. I highly encourage everyone to just quit watching these shit movies and move on with their lives. So, be strong, people! When Disney cranks out the next Star Wars trilogy, don't go! You don't have to watch it! You'll be OK, I promise!
Yeah... hopefully there are many people like you who realize that movies ain't what they used to be. I think they must have, by the 3rd movie. My parents were idiots who thought Episode 7 was "good". But I strongly suspected it was going to suck from the moment they announced that JJ Abrams was going to direct. He is a soulless director, never liked a single thing he made. And I don't think they should have included any of the old cast, or made it directly following Ep 6. It completely invalidates the great victory at the end of that movie. But no, nobody in Hollywood has any balls, or knows how to make a good movie, so they went with the soulless cashgrab route, all the way. I disagree that kids today will like the new trilogy the best. I don't think that's humanly possible. The original Star Wars was a fun time at the movies; now it's just an assault. It reflects the vastly different eras in which they were made. There's a video online of a McDonald's in the mid or late 80s. The restaurant was packed; it was like the entire town was there that day. Everyone was smiling, laughing, enjoying the food. But I don't know if scenes like that exist these days. People are worried, anxious, nervous. Something terrible has happened in society, and the poor quality of our movies reflects it.
@@jaredbond7908 Yeah, I'm not a fan of Abrams, either. He's very derivative. I didn't bother watching "Lost" because I knew what was going to happen to it. I haven't like any of his movies that I've seen. I'm not a Star Trek fan but I felt for the Trekkies when I saw his horrific remake. It was awful. He clearly had no understanding of what Star Trek is supposed to be and should've never been given the reigns for those movies.
@@HarryBuddhaPalm Frankly, I'm only watching mostly clone wars/ bad match stuff/ and only involve with the older parts of star wars. And even then I'm be getting into anime like gundam which frankly entertained me more than what new movies brought/ still to this day haven't seen the tros
Some other critic called this the "anti" trilogy. Each movie was reacting to the previous. The Force Awakens was the "anti-prequel" movie. The Last Jedi was the "anti- Force Awakens" movie. And the Rise of Skywalker was the "anti-Last Jedi" movie. Each one was reacting to the criticism of the previous movies without building enough of their own stories. And Rion Johnson doesn't understand Star Wars.
It's amazing how Disney had the MCU simply adapt stories from the source material just before this, but then had multiple higher ups each try to mold Star Wars into their own conflicting images while throwing away the source material You know you're screwed when Kathleen Kennedy says "we don't have source material" after gaining command of a franchise with 40 years of novels, video games, comics, and animations Pretty much the only showrunner quote that reaches this level of screwed-ness without going full Rian Johnson is D.B. Weiss going "themes are for 8th grade book reports" in the middle of adapting one of the most thematically dense series in all of literature made by an author who made 30 years of smaller stories with different themes just to warm up for this
"Dumbest moment in all of Star wars"'. You got that damn right. I literally burst out laughing in the cinema during that scene, and I was far from alone.
not really the dumbest was sending your entire fleet of bomber to bomb a capital ship with the bombers being the worse design bombers in star wars> I mean you went from Y wings and B wings to those things. HUH how they an improvement??
@ they were trying to do a stratosfortress that it correct but the execution was wrong. the Fortress could remain aloft even after severe damages. they are story if bringing her people home with part of its wing missing. So your my imput remain that design they use for that film was stupid and remain stupid. It not a sci fi version of the fortress. It is a slow moving deathtrap that get destroy cause people in formation are so close to each other that damage pieces destroy there own ship and they own bombs destroy them after releasing. So your statement doesn't dispute mine. It was a badly design bomboer when they previously had better ones.
2 года назад
@@Marveryn Your only arguments are: 1: The MG-100 isn't as durable as the Stratofortress 2: The MG-.100 performed badly against the FO dreadnought These arguments are easily invalidated: 1: The Starto and Starfortress have different designated purposes, the MG-100 does not require any extraordinary durability as it is designed for air sovereignty. 2: The MG-100 in the film was used incorrectly due to the lack of alternatives. The bad performance in THAT scenario does not conclude it was also bad in a scenario that it was designed for. You cannot call a Fiat a bad car because a Porsche is faster. A Fiat wasn't designed for racing, but it excells at normal tasks like storing groceries => bad at very specific task does NOT equal bad at the tasks it was designed for. You talk a whole lot of shit yk
Two things really cement the impact of the new films for me. One--The huge big box store I was working in at the time stocking THE HELL out of toys for the new series; only to see them move inexorably towards the 50% off bin. And sit there, unsold. Merchandising for Star Wars has made FIVE TIMES the money the box office for the films took in. It's where the real money is made. They should have immediately become VERY VERY worried. Two--Going to Galaxy's Edge at Walt Disney World. It was COVID time, the parks had just reopened; so any characters were up on balconies far from people. Rey, every time I saw her, was FAR in the back, behind other characters. Chewie was out front, getting the cheers and attention of the crowd. No matter how hard they tried to sell her, people just can't relate to her character. The tired and resigned look on that character actresses face said it all. I wasn't impressed by Lucas's sequels--Jar Jar and the horrific dialogue and writing really wrecked it for me. They were Kubrick next to Kathleen Kennedy's three-film vanity project.
I'm 51, a long time Star Wars fan from 1977 on... 🎬 The Force Awakens 3rd act clearly sets up Luke as a super hero who swings in to save the good guys(new cast). The audiences would go 🍌🍌🍌🍌 if JJ ended The Force Awakens with Luke returning.
I didn't like it, because we didn't get to see the transition. I get that because the actors were so old they were kind of limited on what they could do, but ideally we should see the story of why Luke would be so jaded. We see that he makes a bad decision, one that I don't think he would ever make, and that's what we're supposed to believe jaded him.
I don't even think the way he behaved was so much the problem. Just change the backstory. Make it so that the importance he placed on family and blind optimism caused him to totally spoil his nephew and ignore the growing dark side influence in him until it took over and when the Knights of Ren attacked the temple, Ben sided with them. That would have linked his motivations from RotJ to the sense that he had lost faith in the Jedi ways and had no interest in teaching anyone-- especially if they showed dark side tendencies.
@@michelecastellotti9172 Nah-- Legends Luke Skywalker is like "comic book that should have ended years ago and is written by a dozen people who don't know how to resolve a story without just giving the hero more powers to trivialize any enemy we can dream up for him" Luke Skywalker. As that was never what the character was ever meant to be, can't really call that the 'real' version. More like the bad fanfic version.
As someone who “grew up with the sequels” I can say this whole generation hates them as well because we are also the generation that grew up with the clone wars (in case you complain about me not being young enough I was 9 when the force awakens came out)
The worst argument for how powerful Rey is, is that she must be related to a powerful Force user. And though she is the granddaughter of Palpatine... After some retcons... That still doesn't mean she should know how to use the Force in Episode 7. Being related to a powerful Force user never meant that person was able to use the Force right then and there. Perfect example, Luke and Leia. Both the children of the literal Chosen One. Yet, Anakin, Luke, and Leia all had to have training before being able to use the Force effectively.
Yeah and that sent out the worst message to kids. Rey's character basically saying that, talent without dedication would yield success. Which is not true.
And I'll just remind you that after Anakin became a Padawan and trained under Obi-Wan and Yoda for several YEARS, Dooku just annihilated his ass in a minute.
One of my biggest problems with Force Awakens was the New Republic. What had they been doing all those years while the First Order grew and built their weapon? Why was the only opposition to this a small, poorly equipped Resistance when there should have been full blown war like we see in the prequels? I actually liked how Snoke was just taken out by Kylor Ren in a bid for power. It felt so properly Sith.
I saw phantom menace in the theaters when I was like 8 and it's still my favorite star wars movie. Even though watching it objectively as an adult I see the validity of the criticism for it.
This video was so fair and balanced, so level headed and we'll put, that I actually got excited to watch the whole thing in ways that I don't feel when I watch more sensationalist videos.
I roll my eyes whenever I see a Star Wars fangirl cosplaying as Rey. Like, if you want female role models in Star Wars, there's Ahsoka Tano, Padme Amidala, Princess Leia, all far better options.
i love your explanation why LUKE SKYWALKER would never give up. the reason why i dislike the last jedi so much is summed up by your points and arguments.
I think Finn not being force sensitiveis honestly a missed opportunity. Telling the story of a stormtrooper becoming a Jedi would have been an interesting story. Him being conflicted about having to kill other stormtroopers who were once his comrades
That fact they exist is the biggest mistake. I was a massive Star Wars addict my whole life, until the moment I saw the credits roll in the theater at The Last Jedi. Terrible. Done. Haven't watched Rise, didn't care enough to watch past Mandalorian episode 4. Rogue One was great, I can say that. I just don't care anymore. I'm also not a big fan of the MCU, and I feel Disney is trying to make Star Wars feel like the MCU, so that doesn't work for me. That's my main issue. I'm a horror freak/addict anyways, no real loss, old ones are always still there.
Rogue One was okay, but it suffers from too many cooks in the kitchen. It also rushes the second act, making it feel shoehorned in, similar to the Dagobah mission in The Force Unleashed II, where an entire section of explorable map was left inaccessible because the game was rushed, so Starkiller shows up, walks a few paces, talks to Yoda, and then leaves; that's what the second act of Rogue One feels like. Then, the third act is actually bogged down by cutting back to the main characters, and was actually strongest as just a battle, followed by the passing of the Death Star plans from person to person. Really, over 50% of Rogue One was better left not happening.
@@ZeroFighter You can call things "great" in context to a certain category. In the whole of Star Wars, it's mediocre. In the steaming pile of crap Disney put out, compared to all of that, it's "great". Throwing them a bone, and saying you like the half decent thing may cause them to realise that's a better idea of a path to pursue, if enough people say it. Also, no, there was no reason for them to die in the end. Added nothing to anything. At least parts of it felt like I was watching a Star Wars movie, whereas TLJ felt like I was watching a movie that was insulting me, wearing the skin of something I loved. Oh, edit: If they had have kept Jyn Erso alive, I would have gone to see her continuation in other movies. Disney's obsessed with "strong female leads", well they had their own new female "Han Solo" if they wanted. They could have had her doing things elsewhere during the OT timeline, people probably would have liked that. No need for a recast Solo movie. Hell, she could have had run ins with Vader, etc. Disney would have gotten what they wanted in a few ways. Anyways.
@@jzacrack1978 The reason they all died was to 'maintain continuity'. The characters didn't exist in the OT, so they couldn't- for whatever reason- survive into the start of A New Hope. Just ignore the fact that after catching the Tantive IV, Vader wasn't at all worked up over having just seen the ship flee the Battle of Scarif, a planet that was never once mentioned before in the last 40+ years as some world of Imperial bureaucratic storage where the storage facilities are all on tropical islands rather than actual, secured fortresses where no one should be readily able to creep around without getting detected. But yeah, I know what you're trying to say because basically everyone has said the same thing. Compared to the Sequel Trilogy, Rogue One was an absolute blessing of film. Compared to the first six films, it's just serviceable, getting a lopsided, oblong gold star. The problem I have with that is that if you aren't critical of something you love, then mediocrity will take over. I always want there to be a push for excellence. I give Rogue One the credit it's due by saying it's not the complete train wreck and utter failure that was the Disney Sequel Trilogy, and I dare say, as flawed and often stupid as it was, its story was better than the disappointing travesty that was Battlefront EA 2, which was completely turned into a time paradox thanks to Rise of Skywalker, a movie that had its name before the ending was even settled on. Fun fact, the titular 'rise of Skywalker' was supposed to be Kylo Ren rejecting the Dark Side, and redeeming himself as Ben Solo, grandson of the redeemed Anakin Skywalker, nephew of Jedi Master Luke Skywalker, and adopting the name of Ben Skywalker to re-open Skywalker Academy. But Kathleen Kennedy said, "Uh, no. Rey Skywalker."
@@jzacrack1978 The 'many Bothans died' line was from the briefing regarding the Death Star II in Return of the Jedi. The speech was given moments after Han and Lando reunited in the briefing room, and was followed by Admiral Akbar going over the ground attack on Endor to shut down the station's planetside shield generator.
The thing about The Last Jedi that really makes it clear how little forethought and planning went into the story is Luke's wardrobe and location. Rian Johnson wants us to believe that Luke has given up on the Jedi and abandoned the Force. Except he also wants us to believe that Luke is hiding out in an ancient Jedi temple and wearing what are very clearly Jedi robes. This is like if a movie told us that "John" is a former Catholic priest who has rejected Catholicism and turned his back on God, and now lives in an ancient Catholic holy site and continues to wear his priestly garments while studying the Bible. Like what the fuck is that? That makes no sense at all. It's clear that JJ intended for Luke to still be a Jedi master, and then Rian was like "I don't care what you set up, I'm doing my own thing." Paying 4 billion for a franchise and then releasing a trilogy without actually planning out that trilogy will go down in history as one of the dumbest, most short-sighted mistakes in Hollywood history.
I mean-- its really more that he doesn't want to train anyone else because everyone he trained went evil or died. So he probably went there to try to find an answer to what went wrong and never found a satisfactory answer. But he also never felt like going on a shopping spree to get new clothes. And I guess Amazon doesn't deliver to secret Jedi tenples that exist on now star maps.
The rest of the "Skywalker Saga" should have started in the time period of the mandalorian. I disagree with Mark on not needing to see any more from those characters. We barely got a glimpse of Luke as a fully trained Jedi in ROT. That is why seeing him truly kick some ass in the mandalorian was loved by everyone. We need more of that.
@@darthkai8242 Yes, I agree that story arc was complete in ROTJ. I still want to see more adventures with him, the founding of the new jedi school, the events of the sequels NEVER HAPPENING and his school is a success....
So happy I got to watch the original when I was young on VHS every single day…and I was SO stoked to grow up with the prequels being released. Spoiled on solid Star Wars content growing up 🙏
I loved Force Awakens when it first released because of the potential it presented for the next two movies. It was such a shame they never utilised this potential.
Absolutely true. Most of us wanted to see Rey train with Luke, Kylo to train with Snoke, we wanted Finn to become a Jedi aswell, wanted to see the Knight of Ren being more than a bad cameo but to do something. To see what happened to Lukes Academy. So many interesting plotpoints - completely ignored by Roundhead Rian Johnson.
Yeah I use to like it a lot too.. not anymore since I know episodes 8 and 9 retroactively ruin it.. actually it ruins alot of original trilogy.. ACTUALLY that applies to the prequel trilogy aswell lol. Just gonna pretend these new movies were all non canon.
the old films set a bar for what a star wars story can tell, the prequels set the idea of how much expansion and exploration the universe has, and the sequels showed how a monopolized capital business can milk a franchise that already had a complete end. They opened a story that was already finished, which already placed a bias and feel of garbage to the films. This is why Mandalorian and smaller projects have been beloved because they would rather expand and tell better/new stories we havent seen before. Not to mention they destory character arcs of the older characters we know already.
9:12 “and being a pilot” did we watch the same movie? Rey said she had never flown before then immediately pulls off level 100 Millennium Falcon maneuvers. 👎
Yeah this guy trots out like all the most base arguments, like “star wars is for kids” and other nonsense. He says Rogue One is darker and more mature than ANH when Luke literally sees the burnt skeletons of his whole family. The only thing darker is the lighting. Weird video
My overall review of the sequel trilogy is this: I don't remember any of them. I've got little flash memories here and there, but that's it. I remember quite liking Rogue One, because it was different to other Star Wars films and probably better for it. With the Force Awakens, could they at least have used something that doesn't almost exactly resemble a Death Star? I remember that.
@@oriandthesleepytime What do you mean? Mauler covered everything, while this video cherrypicked specific flaws to indicate the trilogys lack of quality.
