The men are back! Today they tell us about their actual marriage experience... from a guy's perspective! You can follow the guys on Instagram on Shiv - / shivsimani Bien - / bienaimesol Bright - / brightgameli
I agree. She carries a lot of wisdom, she speaks with authority and power that is not harmful but quite homely and friendly. I can listen to her all day.
I think it is important for couples to discuss bills, parenting styles, credit, debt, religion, how to deal with family, what beliefs will be instilled in the children, childhood traumas, sexual expectations, family health history, mental health history, bucket list, dream home, careers and education, political views and whatever else comes to mind before marriage. Love alone is not enough.
Bien's level of openness is on another level. He is so truthful and I just love that. Over 25 is the place to go to when you want to be part of authentic conversations.
Glad to have watched this session and bringing in dudes to share also from their perspective. I would suggest a session on The men speak: Pregnancy journey. I'd like to be part of that discussion though I'm based outside +254. I host 'diaper' parties for men based on my experience living away from home with no family and getting through that journey wasn't easy. I carry out diaper parties to allow any upcoming father to come and share his expectations and we (other young fathers) listen and share views from our experience. Continue the great work.
I think Julia nailed it at the end. The objective is to bring men and women together in a cohesive manner. However, speaking to Ivy and Shivs discussion on invisible roles and competition, it's incumbent on both sexes to appreciate what they each bring to the table. No role is more important than the other, as the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.
To be in the kind of marriage that Bien is speaking about, you have to have a Very strong relationship. WUEH! It's admirable but the practicability is hard!
I thought so too and thought why not divorc, because if you were to act on your feelings coz someone is hot and you feel attracted I believe it will happen more than thrice ,my question is there limitations is such arrangements and are both parties aware of what they are signing up for or when it happens you realise it's not what I thought it would be...,
Wow, I am 22 and as a guy whose father passed on when I was younger. This is teaching me a lot. You guys keep it real as you have been. I'm learning lots of things right now. I wish you guys knew how much this means. 🎇
@@McElitsome Don't listen to Irene. Sometimes wisdom comes with age and sometimes it doesn't come at all. If Shiv, Bright and Bien are at a place you want to be in the future, then they are the best people to advice you on how to get there. Ignore constructive criticism from people who don't construct anything.
@@digitallocations1423 that's true. Plus I find myself generally drawing friends who are way older than me. Mostly cuz of the maturity that comes with it. That leads to trickles of wisdom on the way. Sometimes I learn from other people's mistakes in life. Since everyone is trying to figure out life, my mentality is to learn more from those who've made more mistakes and have learned from them. And at the same time gotten better. What a great place to do so than people who have essentially lived more. Basically, what @Irene Concierge is conveying is true, filtering out all the details. Which leaves a lot of room for uncertainty and misunderstanding. I guess that's the point of your reaction. Your comment is still valid though
Theres a new breed of men who seek to preach how sexy it is for a woman to 100% hustle and 100% take care of the home. This is how one gets wrinkles.Miss me with the BS.
Over 25 should always have the guys. Not that we don't like you ladies. We absolutely adore you!!!! The guys bring a different perspective of things and it's very enlightening to see things from the male point of view. And this panel is definitely it!! Bright, Shiv, & Bien are perfect. If you add one more maybe Ng'arua he's kinda nasty 🤣 in a good way.
Thank you Ivy! I was a stay-at-home mum for years! I went back to school when my last born went to university! I make no apologies for not working for money. I expected and got all my needs met. I still don't work, I still get my needs met. Everybody's different and that's okay too.
My question to Bien & Ivy. What happens when you allow your significant other to probably get involved with another person & they want more. What if they continue seeing each other? What if a child is born in that one night? What if his/her feelings towards you fade & get stronger for the other person? What if they contact an infection in that 'jibambe' night? Things rarely go as they're planned. The difference between human beings & animals is the POWER OF CHOICE. ONE NIGHT HAS RUINED KINGS, QUEENS, CAREERS, MARRIAGES & EVEN DESTROYED KINGDOMS.
It's refreshing to see someone ask these questions. I almost fell out reading comments and seeing so many ppl okay with the concept. To each his own but that's a very dangerous line to walk. Not I.
Marriage has no set manual, Bien's view is fine and so is Bright's .. What I've learnt from this episode is marry your type, I've met biens in the dating field and I've been frustrated but i want a marriage as bright describes it so i'll wait for that.
1h long 😭....and I have an exam tomorrow at 8am...and am not even married but I still can't help but watch. I feel bewitched...😂❤ I hope you guys pray for your listeners...cause I'll need them tonight🙏
Loving how Shiv shares his mind and doesn't back down from speaking the truth even when opposed. Both gender roles exist for a reason and work as a team. Don't compete because at the end of the day, you're on the same side!
I think the problem is that there are gender roles assigned to begin with, instead of tasks that need to be done of which people get to agree and quantify what those are
I agree Brian. Both genders compliment each other. Sadly, we compare roles for competition, instead of looking at how helpful it is for both parties and as a unit.
I have been married almost 20 years and totally disagree with what Bien is saying. There is truth to the fact that one will meet attractive men or women throughout the course of one's marriage. The question I have, is ... do I have to act on the attraction??? Do I have to tell my husband about my crush. Personally, I CANNOT SHARE MY HUSBAND. I cannot stomach the idea that he has kissed another woman, like so, touched her like so... the same way he touches me, whispered those love things to her... then come home to me do the same. If he comes home and tells me ati some chick is hot... I will be like.. "why are you telling me?" as in what am I to do with that information. I expect him to sort that stuff out himself. The same way I do. Sort it out, crush it.. and keep moving. Crushes come and go. You really do not need to act on it!! Hubby is of the same opinion... I am not allowed to be touching and whispering love things to another person. We have watched many we know get divorced throughout the years and it has been rather sad. All the couples we know over 7 who divorced... the person they moved on to.. waliachana tuu!!!! Then there are those who stay because, he will turn around, ama, because the lifestyle is good... the misery.... the heartbreak. What Bien and Ivy are talking about is akina Will Smith and Jada entaglement situations... and hiyo... is not for me and I do not know how it even works for anyone. See how that kijana who was entangling with Jada.... ended up feeling. Him he was in love.. Jada was... doing her entanglement thing... in my eyes.. Will Smith lost major man points and I am willing to put money that Will Smith does not sleep with his wife!!!! IF people what entanglements.. they should not marry... Waache kuharibu the institution of marriage. The worst thing that can happen is for an entanglement person to hook up with a monogamous person! Woi...the heart trauma. PS. would also like to say that in a marriage you can also grow together... there is the idea that one person in the relationship grows living behind the other... that is a half truth. You can both grow, both evolve and the sex can get better... aki... it can....
But you see, you and your hubby are from an older generation. Having been married for 20 years I'm gauging you're over the age of 40. This new generation doesn't think like that.
@@lauracate5066 True.. I am in my 40s and what is being discussed is not new at all. Only this time, women are more open about it! Entanglements or as we used to call them, being cuckolded, open relationships, or threesomes... they all lead to heartbreak and heartache... Even polygamy none of it is ever happy or contented. I do realise, new generation has to try out things which they think are new... but as the scriptures say, "there is nothing new under the sun"
@@mremboblog Being from a polygamous family myself I'll have to agree with you. Plus being older you've seen life and are wiser than me haha. Enjoy your day!
I agree with you on the issue of entanglements, threesomes and debauchery. 🤮 Where we part ways is on the issue of polygamy. First of all, it is legal Kenya and allowed under Islamic and customary law. Secondly, polygamy is not about a man sleeping with another woman (he can do this even when married to one woman) but about ensuring all women have suitable husbands and children grow up in an environment with male figures. It just breaks my heart to see all the single mothers struggling out there yet there are capable men who can take them as second and third wives as was the case before colonialism.
@@kijana2030 To your point on polygamy, show me a happy polygamous family. Where the children feel loved and cared for, where there is no jealousies between the wives....where the man provides equally and loves fairly.... Where the wives willingly share the man.....
Marriage comes with change. You got to come out of a cocoon of singlehood ndo iwork. 'Kukaliana' in a good way. You can't be single and married at the same time, simple
@@kijana2030 and what makes you think that the three men represent all men. Someone needs a statistics 101 to kick off. Bien is here to mislead people, wake up
@@lilywhite8902 and therein lies the problem. You have dismissed what the panelists have said, myself included. Bien is not misleading anyone he's expressed his position which I agree with since that has been my position all along. You on the other hand want to kalia your man which you are entitled to. There are millions of these men out there and I think women call them mama's boys; men call them simps. It's in your best interest to marry a simp but don't complain after a while when you discover they have no alpha male qualities.
Great video guys. Loved it. But aki let me just say that watching the part for men and babies triggered me. Here is why: I had a baby with my then-partner and I did absolutely EVERYTHING. From washing to feeding, to changing, to staying up at night...you name it. All of it. Mind you we were living together. Over and above that I was paying for all household costs with the exception of rent, so I was working as well. (We won't even go into the other things that were wrong with this relationship) I had zero emotional and physical support. My nanny was literally my crutch. (I was so lucky to have her, God bless her.)To be honest, I didn't mind chipping in financially, but this man gave me no emotional support whatsoever, so I grew very contemptuous and lost respect for him. It became such a toxic environment and I realized my child was feeding off that energy so I had to end it. But let me tell you, I'm jaded. I don't want any marriage/partnership/etc of any form, and I absofuckinglutely do not want any more children. That experience really did a number on me. It's refreshing to see the fathers in the video doing their part, but the lesson here is: Don't have kids with the wrong people :D
“Its not a competition” !! I needed to hear that😅and i know i’m not alone. Jeez yaani this was an hour long? Didnt even feel like it! I’d want to see Ivy and Shiv talk it out😂 waiting for part 2!
We need more such episodes. This dynamic really works. Loved every second of this episode. Also, set up a Patreon for the unedited version of the convos we didn't see perhaps? And maybe live stream once in a while, to interact with and field questions from your audience.
Lorna said something about indoctrination *wanting to get married 🔥 Shiv talking about "it's not a competition on who works harder "🔥 Sauti sol B talking about Therapy Ivy talking about "non monetary contributions " The list is endless 😂 and this is me 🤭 enjoying shiv and shikies subtle romance 😂
Ivy I love how you listen and internalise!And your point on how many things mum's do that go unnoticed and that can't be monetized 👍👍👍I stopped working and got rid of my dayburg,I reduced weekly shopping by a significant amount of money and I drop and pick my kids from school,I have saved my household over 50k monthly and I'm sure someone says I do nothing I just stay at home 🙄🙄🙄🙄 However my husband understands and appreciates and he gives me a stipend monthly
Another problem that arises is when couples divorce and the man says he was paying the mortgage so he should get the house. What about all the bills the woman paid and her contributions that she made that were not recorded. So the man gets something and woman nothing.
I love Shiv, it shouldn't be a competition on whose doing more. If one partner feels overwhelmed or need help they could communicate. Episodes with Men should be an hour or more, great episode!!
Bien's level of self awareness is astonishing: I'm always taken aback and even jealous of his grasp of these concepts of life. Then add his honesty and just whoosh! His marriage must be something else.
I loved this, but I have to challenge Bien's perspective of a focus on wealth building as his way of being husband. It is acceptable and it is a possible life but it has its costs. No amount of wealth or success can ever replace active presence and a middle ground is a necessity. In reality, there is often many people who can replace your course, vocation or the work you do on earth but your presence to your family has no substitute. You gotta find ways of making it count amid all the chaos and demands of capitalism.
Ivy was 100% on point on the unpaid labour women have to shoulder being greater than mens and you guys should do a video unpacking it. Also, the article has not been linked.
I think a big problem I have seen is majorly two things: 1). Either/both partners think it's a competition 2). The sense of ownership (completely agree with Ben; make your own decisions I am not your property)
I am not married but what I got from this video is that there is no one right way of doing marriage. If people want to run their marriage traditionally or in a modern way and they are happy with whichever arrangement, then that's that. Also, communication must remain alive at all times.
What Ivy and Shive were talking about is the economical advantage men will often have over women. The previous gender role for men was to work and provide, while now women were expected to no house keeping. The gender roles and expectations for women as house keepers in the house have remained irrespective of the fact they have picked up new economic provision roles. Did men pick up any additional role? Some households men have made attempts to bridge this by also sharing house keeping roles. But what happens when child bearing comes in? Is it possible to share that? All in all, its a very valid issues that deserves a lot of airing and discussion and as Ivy said without both sides speaking from a point of arrogance.
@UCfBw440Pq_kbYzcj9iVIgpA I did not pick a side in my response if you read it well enough, I simply elucidated the questions that have raised the debate and just to re-state what Ivy said "let's not speak from a point of arrogance". Now to address your point, the assumption that all people have nannies to take up such roles is really speaking from a point of privilege. Not just financial privilege but also educational and 'woke' privilege. Only a minority of homes have left stereotypical gender roles behind. Forget hiring nannies, not all ladies have awareness of traditionally overbearing gender roles, they are still groomed for marriage being taught these same roles. If they make the 'mistake' of getting married to traditionalists as you say, I dare not point a finger at them when they 'cry wolf' on realizing how overbearing it can be to take up such roles. Finally, it's essential that we see matters as 'societal issues or gender inequality without turning them into a war between men and women. Needless to say, there are also many unhealthy gender stereotypes that men carry on too that harm them mentally. So this shouldn't be a fight of men against women or traditionalists against the modern. It's a societal issue that should be open for mature discussion and deliberation. FGM, domestic violence, period poverty, child marriages, all these issues sounded like victim mentality until they were duly given a stable legal platform
If classes in UNI were taught like this...we would never miss classes. So engaging, interesting, educating...yani sat through a whole one hour to listen and I enjoyed, I did not zone out....
Am actually learning a lot from your episodes ladies, keep it up and God bless you. Personally I do everything from cooking, to washing, to cleaning, to be on toes with our children's education, to staying home with the kids, to ironing, to coaching my babies swimming and athletics and still be a husband. On the the other hand, my beautiful wife is hands on rent, school fees, power, shopping e.t.c because she earns more than i do. It's not a competition or some form of show off, but that's just how we live! Word of advice: Live freely, let it flow... If your wife is home late, get into your aprons and fix the kids something to eat. If she says she doesn't have money because she accidentally fell for a ponzi scheme thinking that she was investing, pay the nanny on her behalf and still pay for her salon, she's your wife for heavens sake... and vise versa! Upbringing really matters, so be careful when choosing partners. Don't go for her beauty or handsomeness and then spend the rest of your life fighting... Alaaaaaaa (in Atwoli's voice 😆)
@@didiash well, sometimes if you feel you're no longer benefiting from something or someone, it is best to leave and follow your path. If she has outgrown them, then its ok for her to leave.. But ivy makes this show more fun so 🤷🏾♀️
That ka'tension at the end of the video was so loud. Everyone all of a sudden became uncomfortable with what everyone else was saying. But that was expected and is okay. Bien and Jules wisdom!!!!
Ivy's point on you can do it all....me and you both honey. Non-monetary contribution is very much undermined. If you say someone takes care of the kids, it doesn't seem much but actual care is sooo much more.
I don't think its fair to base your relationship on "I am working as hard as I can" Some things need to be talked about pre-baby and pre-marriage. Work needs to be quantified so that people don't develop resentment. Also moms are not better at child care, they actually don't know a lot of things and they learn on the job because the job needs to be done . Always remember your wife could die, and the child still needs to be taken care of. Its technically in the best interest of the father to learn things about your child...Because there is a lot of performative incompetence from men as a thing...Also how come nobody encourages or applauds mothers? Its a difficult conversation but it needs to be had. If someone cares about you and the child, they show up. My dad did both homework and changing diapers. They (my mom and dad) split the day so that everyone could go to work. FYI he is in boomer generation. we also need to quantify mental load on this conversation. A mom needs to know that she can go away somewhere and her child will be taken care of by its father without her having to invoke the help of a female relative, caregiver or having to give you step by step instructions
Wow, you've really put it into words. And I completely agree with you. But just to indulge you a bit further. Say your partner grew up seeing the father out working "bringing home the bacon" and the mother doing all the house work and taking care of children. You on the other hand, grew up seeing "50/50" contributions on both fronts (work & home). You both decide to get married, now what happens? 🤔
@@yourstrulyKe there is a need to have a conversation about this before you get married. You don't get to 'compromise' on that because it is really important. We may be brought up differently but at some point we have to take responsibility for our own happiness and not being an ass to our partners
women's view of marriage sometimes makes it look like a jail. They stop going out with their friends, get rid of male friends, quit hobbies, and basically stop having a life of their own and start tracking their husband's every move. And they expect the man to do the same. I'm all here for liberated and fun marriages to be honest. Be complete on your own then come together with someone who is also complete on their own.
Been saying this for years...you can't peg your happiness on another human being...this will be the beginning of the end because that is an impossible expectation on anyone. Find your own happiness. Boundaries, Boundaries, Boundaries...it's a must for the married.
On the issue of spousal ownership, my interpretation is that Jules fears losing her man to someone else. The solution to this is to create an environment where both parties enjoy being in the marriage/relationship. Key to this is communication and listening to your partner's needs and wants. Caging, tracking and nagging will only drive them away.
@@ekrahmatu2799 that as Bien said is where therapy plays a very big role. Only through a journey of self-discovery under the guidance of a trained professional can this question be truly answered.
Oh Shiv... Shiv... Shiv... Shiv... Heartwarming sentiments but that is not the reality. Full-time working women DO work more than men, period. It's not a competition, it's a FACT. My hours don't "end" when I get home in the evening. I enter my "second shift" caring for the kids, husband, household, etc. Weekends I'm also running the household, going to the market, etc. So, no, it's not the same.
That was awesome love the show the guys view were on top. finding a balance between the husband and the wife is very important and as Shiv says mostly depends how your raised, is not about competing is how you compliment each other.wonderful👍
This is one of the best ever episodes since my better half introduced me to your channel..... I've learnt a lot and the positive energy you people are giving out is immensely appreciated🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥......keep it up!!!👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
I love loooove this conversation. It is refreshing to know that there are hands-on men with their kids, but could we have an episode where the men talk about the kids they had or might have had before marriage with other women who they are not currently married to? Like do they choose which kids to take care of and which ones not to take care of or how far can they go as far as taking care of these children? Or maybe how or why they can even choose to take care of the children in the current marriage and ignore the children from previous relationships.
Leme leave my comment here coz I really feel this conversation .I think its all about partners understanding that, am here with you by choice. And am complete by myself..so you too should be complete by yourself. And this needs two healthy partners to really understand. That we are married yes, but am still my own separate individual from you, still with my dream career or job , friends family , etc, that you too should be in your own path, individually, but also as a couple we have want we do together.now the kids, finances , everything else .I think this is how a relationship gets to be healthy. And the way sauti sou is saying..if the chick gets the guy of her dream, enjoy babe, simply because he will never force her to be with him .she has freedom . he doesn't own her. I could write a book. Haha..but this thing needs you to really be a mature,complete person who loves their own self to understand
It is a wonderful thing for a woman who can and enjoys working to decide to take time off and stay home voluntarily to invest time in herself and the kids. Knowing that her man has her for that 2-3yr span.
It is never a competition but also cheering on your partner on the things they do is essential. There should not be a list I think because this gives room for saying- me this- you that, as long as it is seen as WE cause there should be no I did this or that in marriage- it happened because one or both partners put it the effort.
Fire episode! 🔥 In conclusion, be with the person you're compatible with. If, for example, you know you're person doesn't like housework, decide if you can live with that or not. But don't marry them and then force them to change. But in the end, marriage is dynamic, people grow & change and compromise is the name of the game.
THANKS OVER 25 for having our male counterparts on the show and discussing on how to being a husband or should i say a good respectable husband,some of us like me where brought up by a single parent who is most of the time are mothers so i didnt really experience that husband type of situations and know how things are supposed to be or not to be.It was a very educational episode and i have learned and noted a lot..keep it up cant wait for the next episode.. thanks gents and always looking spectacular ladies.
I love the space marriage creates for partnerships, with that said just the way we protect our business partnerships is the way we should our marriages. All the same I'm loving the series with the guys. Please have more episodes with them, it's great to hear a mans perspective.
As a married working woman, I do agree with Ivy and Shikie on just wanting to work as a homemaker and mom. It’s definitely a full time job and I can say I have not spent as much time homemaking. We split roles with no gender bias. We both cook, we both clean, we both do anything that needs to be done.
I feel like bloggers totally misinterpreted Bien's point of view,I totally agree with him,its just sad that some people abuse that independence. Love the show!
I love that he said you are meant to experience people not own them. If you listen to him from this view point he spit facts. Because I'd be wary of intertwining my life with s/o so much that we live the same life. Of course connections are nurtured so if we've agreed to be together in whatever dynamic that is(open or monogamous) you can't disregard your s/o and just do you cause that's disrespect to the partnership.
I love this episode... Going into marriage is very scary especially when you and your partner haven't had the hard discussions while dating. This has been enlightening. Thank you guys!
