Also Piccolo actually trying to save 17 when Cell arrived probably gave him a reality check. No doubt he saw himself in a mirror with Cell who was an uncaring monster and being the victim for once made him realize what it's like to be afraid and weak against a stronger enemy that sees you as prey and decided he wouldn't emulate such a grotesque person such as Cell.
22 years ago when I was first watching the Cell saga, I never would've imagined that this random guy would become the ultimate savior of the multiverse.
A character that went from simply "that guy who tags along with 18 and got absorbed by Cell" to someone who can stand on his own and become one of my favorite characters
He was always one of my favorites from the beginning of that saga. I was 7 and just thought his style clothing wise and the voice actor was perfect. He reminded me of Woody from Toy Story in a way. When him and Piccolo teamed up I was pumped. Even though I knew they were supposed to be a lot worse his style was just really cool to me.
Honesty, he was straight up ALWAYS one of my top 3 favorite characters since the start, lol. His fun attitude, unique dynamic with 18 and 16, and the way in which he slowly came to respect and even learn from Poccolo during their fight was just really memorable for me. Topped off with having one of my favorite voices in the series, getting to see a "What if" future for him in the History of Trunks special, and his tragic fate in the Super 17 Arc of GT. It's really no surprise he stuck with me so much in hindsight. His character expansion in Dragon Ball Super's Tournament of Power just reinvigorated my love for him, and solidified him (properly this time) as my favorite character in Dragon Ball.
17 and 18 being orphans makes sense for Gero's plan. If he needs to experiment on people, he would go for someone who's homeless and has no family to report their dissapearance. Since they were allegedly delinquents (probably just to survive though), Gero might have rationaized his actions by claiming these were people no one would miss....dark
I’ve always interpreted 17’s decision in becoming a Ranger as a nod to him trying to show his care for 16, it’s actually amazing how much foreshadowing was packed into his future decisions
Man 16 to me is just as iconic as Android 8 goku learned not to kill from him so really the quote heratless machines is wrong for the Android's as they still were just as much humam
If you told me like 20 years ago that Android 17 would enter a Multiverse Tournament, end up as the winner, and wish back everyone that was erased; I would have laughed in your face. Yet, here we are, and they took a character that I already liked and made him better.
17 & 18 needs a movie about them honestly. Im more interested in their background and power potential then goku and vegeta. Imagine if 17 & 18 trained with whis non stop for years. The amount of power and potential is limitless.
While I'd love that, I think 17 and 18 would need a significant reason to leave their cherished families to train on the other side of the universe. The android/cyborg siblings care a lot more for their families than Goku and Vegeta.
If they ever adapt the Superhero saga to anime I would love for 17 and 18 to be more involved in the story along with Goten, Trunks, Gohan, Piccolo and Pan, given the fact that the Red Ribbon army had such a close relation with Dr Gero and the creation of androids. The two of them would certainly be pissed there's still people trying to replicate Gero's endeavors
The amount of insight this gives...honestly it just gives you more reason to love his character. Some people just know how to make you see things in a different perspective and I love it
Fully agree, 17 had so many opportunities to kiII it's very clear he goes out of his way to avoid it. For example when the police tries to arrest them. 0 casualties. Which at this point is EXTREMELY untypical for DBZ villains. Most of them feature an intense disregard for life to the point of casually offing people for pure boredom. He even stretched out the kiII Goku brainwashing. Every other villain with his intellect would have just broken into a TV station(leaving a trail of body parts). And just asked Goku to come to him so fewer people have to die for crossing his path in search of Goku.
Notice this trope about Androids: they live playing games. 1. In the future timeline, Androids 17 & 18 were killing people for a game. 17 shouts "Haha! I get 10 points for every human I hit!" 2. Vegeta mocks Android 19 by saying "You're the one who started this game, & now you don't want to play anymore?" 3. When Dr Gero reaches his lab, he says "Hahaha! It seems I have won this little race!" 4. Androids 16, 17 & 18 wanted to hunt down Goku as a "game" 5. The ultimate Android Cell made a literal game called The Cell Games 6. In GT SSJ4 Goku mocks Super 17 when he had him in a chokehold and said "What's the matter? You only want to play the game if you're winning?"
This why i love 17,he and Krillin and 18 represent what humans can be if given the chance and that he's a badass,and also i would not mind helping him out from time to time.
Something that I also noticed about his sacrifice is what vegeta says after the explosion "he must've intended to sacrifice himself in the very beginning." And yet after 17 revealed to be alive he says that it was a complete gamble that he wasn't sure he would even survive. It actually seems like 17 was fully intending on the explosion, killing him, even though he himself wasn't actually sure he would die or not He knew that if he actually didn't end up surviving that there mightve been a chance of the universe getting erased because his team might lose to jiren He had complete trust and faith in them to do so despite knowing the risk and did so anyway all for the sole purpose in that it just made him feel more human It sounds selfish but not only did he avoid doing so for the whole tournament before that point but he also did so in order to protect his teammates He is one of the most selfless, caring, and most importantly human characters in the entire franchise They could not have done a better job with him in the anime if they tried and I hope toei uses him more often
15:00 You mentioned the “tragic childhoods” of Goku and Android 17 here but I think if you posted a clip of Goku and his loss of Grandpa Gohan it would’ve hit a lot harder.
For sure, i was more considering his split from his originally family but that also is a premiere and maybe better example. Also worth noting that he was basically forced into saving the world as a little kid, even though he seems to enjoy it, it definitely wasnt a normal childhood lol
@@PlanetLevelDBit's also funny that being "forced" to save the world was more or less accidental. Him saving the world was more a byproduct than the intention.
A nice retrospective look at Android 17 and the humanity that he still has. For the record, I don't think that the super dragonballs were the reason 17 entered the tournament of power, despite claiming that he would use the wish to get an expensive yacht for his family. When Goku brought up the super dragonballs initially, 17 still refused to join. I think Goku helping 17 to save the endangered animal was enough to convince 17 to compete, coupled with how similar 17 and Goku are. Although I think Goku's more humble than 17 as one of their core differences.
It's funny cause looking back on when I first saw him on the show, 17 wasn't necessarily a character I was interested in, but when he and Piccolo temporarily teamed up against Cell, I liked the respect they were showing for each other. That was the point when I started thinking maybe he could be a cool hero. When they met again before the ToP, I know that moment was fan service, but it was appreciated. Seeing these two together and still showing each other respect was epic.
Thank you for the effort and passion you put into your work on this platform! I don't know how long you've actually been doing stuff like this, but the quality of your content is already top notch. Keep up the great work man, and thank you again!
A17 easily has one the best re-introduction in DBS. Edit: Just watched the video and I can't believe I have begun to like him even more because of his morality and nature.
Just finished Super last week as I stopped watching DBZ back in high school. I picked up the series after Frieza saga, and 17 was always my favorite character on the show. What a surprise Super ended up being, finding out this weird android guy I thought was so cool from back in Z ended up being debatably the savior of Universe 7. Very cool.
Thanks for making a video for Android 17! He's the coolest character in db universe and he's super underrated i wish he was in the super hero movie he deserved a spot! i was so disappointed
I would say the absence of Android 16 caused that timeline to occur. All that more heartwarming that he may have converted 17 into such a likeable hero
The simple explanation is that it could just be a timeline where the doctor was smart enough to alter their minds to make them as bloodthirsty and world conquering as him. Another explanation though could be that without 16 and without the Z fighters to kill Doctor Gero at First they likely never got the bigger picture that the Z fighters were just good people and that they were trying to keep Earth safe and tat would've ended up spiraling into basically a world wide murder fest that to them still feels like self defense with the two more jaded androids.
in our timeline gero had to desperately activate them to try and win whereas in the future one he probably had all the time he needed to alter their personalities completely, plus no 16
This is just a fantastic character analysis, thank you for that. This seems like it took a lot of work and mulling over material. I hope you become one of the greats in the dragon ball content sphere, because this kind of stuff is quality.
Man! I just subbed after watching this amazing video! 17 is my favorite dragon ball character period! How you described him I've never seen another RU-vidr do and that's no shot to them I enjoy their content too but this video almost made a grown man cry watching my favorite get the recognition he deserves. I play as 17 on an rpgmmo game called dcuo (DC universe online) I am thee 17 on there even does his voice and mannerisms... Yeah I get into character on there lol... But definitely love his character. So thank you for uploading this beauty of a video. Shouts out to 16 and 18 as well 😊... But thank you again champ keep um coming.
I just absolutely LOVE that my favorite DBZ character got so much attention and spotlight in DragonBall Super! It was just so unexpected, but very exciting. I the really liked the Super 17 saga in GT as well, although it was quite short compared to all the other main villains (Baby got so much screen time during his arc that it made legit sick of the character).
7:40 I think this is an interesting view with a good bit of validity but I think it also attributes a bit of moral righteousness that's probably not there, he might not have killing Goku as his intention but he would probably be fine and isn't going to avoid so to win, a natural byproduct of his goal that happens when you aren't trying to spare your enemies like the good guys.
I always loved 17 but couldn’t put into words why, this video did a great job of that. Additionally, he just has one of my favorite designs in the series.
Discovered your channel with your Zamasu video today ( awesome btw ) and it's a good welcoming surprise, even I as a die hard Dragon ball fan learned a few things and discovered some traits of his personality, which I didn't pay attention in the first place It's really great to see in depth character analysis, keep the work up man
I wish a video like this existed when I was younger. 17 was my favorite character the moment I saw him. Thank you for making this video. It's a shame that there's no others like it, but also a blessing that even one exists at all.
@@UnlimitedIvory I don't think that's the explanation considering Trunks told Goku that 17 and 18 would appear on May 12th, which they did. To me, it has to do with the butterfly effect of Cell and Trunks travelling back in time causing History to change.
While he isnt my favorite i do love him. The idea of a character going through hell and refusing to change there morals no matter what is always a cool thing. He didnt care what the world threw at him from years of turtore to the whole world wanting to kill him
Great analysis and presentation. The only criticism I would offer is that I would have loved to see more insight from the source materials and not just the dub interpretation. But awesome, nonetheless. 17 was one of the best parts of Super for me and I'm glad they took the opportunity to develop his character beyond what we got in Z 🙌🏼
Dude… you’re right. 17 never wanted to kill Goku. The Z fighters over reacted and instead of working with 17 and 18 to defeat cell they tried to “stop” them and allowed Cell to become complete. Their irrational assumptions almost got them all killed. Had Goku been alive, Cell would have died at imperfect
I can't express just how much better 17 and 18 are in the super anime than the manga. In the anime not only do they tag team like they used to do, but they also reflect on their past lives and how much better they are now as parents and living with normal people, and their chemistry was also just really good. Compared to the manga... I don't even think they directly spoke to each other once😐
17 had a fullfilling job, financial security, a loving family, a great group of friends and a reason to exist bro already had everything he wanted in life, he was so complete that he could only think of a yacht as an "I guess" wish if the opportunity ever arose
9:47 Planet Level: "He still took all of his opponents down with nonlethal means." Also Planet Level: *shows 17 tightening the chokehold on Tien's neck, which is very lethal*
Ye, 17 is one of the best characters. That's why it's all the more horrific that dr. Gero twists his and 18's personalities in Trunks' future, turning them into actually heartless machines.
Somewhere in there young Lapis was still there all along. He was changed to a degree no doubt power corrupts afterall, and he was a delinquent. There still a playfulness about him when he fights or causes chaos. He's down to scrap, but unlike Frieza or Cell he doesnt enjoy needlessly torturing people, he just wants to win. But somewhere inside there is a sadness that he wears a mask over, he doesn't want to be a villain. I think even in the Future timeline everything probably got sent into chaos by Gero as well who in his Android form in his own right, was capable of extreme destruction. Even good people can turn bad if its the end of the world, and 17 and 18 probably mentally broke in that timeline forcing them to adapt to a post apocalyptic world. We assume that was all the Androids fault but its also possible that Frieza and King Cold caused major chaos before they were killed as well.
I always liked the Android trio and In all my time watching Dragonball I was sad to never see 17 again. I had stopped watching at GT. Makes you wonder what happened to cause them to turn evil in trucks timeline
ANDROID 17 in Z: a minor antagonist & pure evil in the future timeline ANDROID 17 in GT: a major enemy in GT who was forced to fuse with his machine mutant counterpart Hell Fighter 17 to become Super 17. ANDROID 17 in SUPER: the winner of the Tournament of Power & savior of many universes
Android 13 : Don't Lecture Me with you're 30 Dollar Haircut ! Wait Goku got a soft spot for nature and animals ? Goku would kill a wolf, Ceatures and eat them like a snack no problem lol
In the Trunks timeline, the Z Fighters didn't know to intercept Gero and 19's attack. Gero had enough time to finish brainwashing 17 and 18 before releasing them.
@@somejerk5662 That and Goku was dead. Meaning Gero had no incentive to build 16 (who’s sole purpose was to kill Goku) Which meant 17 & 18 didn’t have a gentle giant like 16 to keep them more “collected”. 16’s influence on 17 & 18 is a big reason why differ from the 17 & 18 from the future
Ive always loved the trope of taking the fight to a location that will minimize collateral damage, i find it funny considering collateral damage is a huge issue in superhero media.
I would have loved dragon ball super heroes being a movie about 17 and 18. It could be 17 and 18 vs gamma 1 and 2 while cell vs gohan and piccolo. OR 17 and 18 vs cell. This would be dope because it would be an emotional fight because of cell absorbing them.
I found out that the VA for Yuichi Tachibana from Initial D voices this android 17. Both sound just like each other, and It's kinda wierd hearing the voice of a 42 year who owns a gas station coming out of this robot.
My favorite thing about android 17 is the irony that dr gero’s creation that he made to destroy goku ended up being the one to save not only goku, but also the entirety of mankind
New subscriber after watching the Zamazu video. This channel deserves a lot more attention👍 I really want to see videos on angels, especially Whis, Vados and Mohito
