Can't believe that article. Let me just leave this quote here: "I am a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it." - Thomas Jefferson
@@williampan29 Totally agree, but that doesn't really apply to the quote I shared. In other words, he's actually making fun of the concept of "luck" by saying it just takes hard work to get "lucky" in the view of others. Unless you think the idea of someone working hard (like Chris does and potentially you) is false, but that wouldn't make much sense.
@@williampan29 "Rentier economy" doesn't mean lack of hard work, just because you're not doing physical labor, those two concepts aren't mutually exclusive. Yes, people make money from capital gains for example, that doesn't mean they got lucky and picked the correct asset to invest in. A lot of time and energy and research is done to get to that point. If it was easy everyone one with a little bit of money would be in the market right now making money.
@@williampan29 You're right bro, you will never do anything significant or successful with your life because you're not lucky, give up.. But for anybody else reading this. Become a hard worker and determinated consistency is key and never stop chasing your goals I wish you luck :)
If you're watching this as a new dev: don't give up! I've been an engineer for more than 13 years now and I am self taught as well. It's SO WORTH I T if you stick to it.
So feeling this video! Thanks Chris! I have been trying to learn code off and on for the past 10 years. Now I am determined at 47 years of age and going to coding boot camp.
I wanna be honest It is not easy When I first watched your videos in 2019 , I taught I will be lucky enough to get a job in six months when teaching myself but it didn’t happen. It took me two years to get a job as self taught.I studied a lot . I applied for jobs each day. I consistently call company and told them I wanted to be hired but no one give me opportunity. I stopped everything for weeks but then get back to it because I didn’t want to give up everything I have sacrificed. I woke up one morning , applied at Booz Allen hamilton , go to the interview process and got hired as full stack engineer. I have been working for 6 months now. This journey is not easy even for people with a Cs degree . You gotta keep push it Thanks Chris Sean for your motivation on RU-vid.
Felt this. I became a truck driver after 2 years with learning code. I realized myself I wasn’t consistent and fully disciplined .. i was looking at the dollar signs to be able to provide for my wife and kids… now as a truck driver I’m finding more time to get back to training myself with code, and loving the ability to learn to create things that can help me. I’ll eventually apply again, but for now I’m loving to learn and getting myself disciplined with the technical stuff. I hope she gets in somewhere that can provide her a financial uplift and she gets the spark to get back to tech
Luck=when hard work and opportunity come together. Not sure who said it, but I've found it to be true in life. Let people know what you're doing and be able to do it.
You made numerous videos telling us this is gonna be a industry hard to get into, told us the obstacles we’re gonna face, even in your early videos we saw the pressure get to you but you kept GOING!! People don’t realize how much bullsh*t you overcame, from Homelessness being in debt, but one thing who made you was the HUNGER, for a better life.
It feels like a joke haha. She said that location matters haha. I'm living in Cuba. I can't even have Mastercard, Visa, Paypal, and so on... Even though I've landed jobs with salaries similar to Southeastern Europe without a degree being only 20 years old. It's not perfect but it is more than enough for me to make a living and make some savings for my future plans. If I were living in Canada, dear God, I'll be making much more money. Nonetheless, I don't think I'm special or something, I just dared to learn English after my 18s and a valuable skill like coding. It takes time and I'm not yet as good as I want to be, but it's a journey not a walk in the park.
Chris, I have been watching you since your first (few days) on RU-vid. It has taken me a lot longer than many to get a job, but I never gave up. I keep listening to your videos, being inspired, I still have a screenshot of a few messages you sent me many years ago when you were at your old job. I did get my job (after a lot of stop and go) and it wasn't until I decided to finally take that leap. So thank you for being there in many ways (some you might not even realize). Keep up these amazing inspirational videos Chris, thank you.
Bro... I freakin agree 1000000% with everything you said. I wouldn't be a developer today without the grind I did. I know I may not be as smart as others so I had to put in 13-15 hours a day of studying to get a job that others might say that was "lucky". No, it was definitely the hard work and preparation I did to land my first job.
I am starting my second year of learning coding on my own and man it is so hard. I don't think I have ever studied this much, going back and forth between two different coding camps and trying to absorb as much info as I can from friends and co-workers. I have a pretty good grasp on HTML and CSS, I got like 6 certs, but still I have to keep learning and keep updating what I know to make pace with the changes in libraries and languages. But I love it, and I knew in Jan 2022 that if I couldn't make it a month studying then it wasn't going to work. It truly isn't for everyone, it is extremely hard, and you absolutely need to have dedication and consistency to make it.
I’m dyslexic too and really do love coding. It’s really inspiring to me that you can still do it to spite that because I believe I will be able to do it too!
Hey brother, Im a electrician been around people in the tech industry. People my age (23) love to complain and make excuses for themselves, which is the reason I like to watch you content. You don’t make excuses you keep your work flow consistent well teaching the youth how to get into the industry. There gonna be cry baby pointing fingers. A lot of people who are serious about career their will move and sleep in a car a for couple of months. People really want to be in this industry some just want it to be easy with handouts 🤷🏽♂️🤷🏽♂️
I am from Calgary, Alberta, Canada. So she from Canada too? it not much different than the US. She is 30 something years old, she can move to Vancouver, Toronto, Calgary, and other smaller tech cities. If she really want to make it work she have to believe she can do it and keep learning in tech. For her depression, it because she compared herself to other. "Comparison is a theif of joy". Never compare to anyone, everyone live differently. Chris, you are a hard working person and never gave up and so you created your own lucks. Everybody want to be somebody but they don't realized......they can't be another chris sean, mark z, bill gates, etc. Even for myself at 40 yo, i am just learning HTML, CSS and soon JS, it so hard tbh, and yes i want to land a job ASAP too. even if it just a starting 30k/year. I would do it for the experiences. It may take me 5 jobs and 10 years too to get to 180k but it ok. it the journey to get there. Anyway, Chris, you can't help and please everyone but I am glad you are wanting to reach out to your viewer and do your best to help. Just remember this, talking to us.....babying us will not help us grow either, we are competing with so many *laid off* dev too! and yes softskill.....it a personality trait. Not everyone can learn it over the weekend, it take years to build and seconds to destroy it.
Hey man, I just wanted to let you know that you inspire me greatly to develop my skills in coding. I’m currently learning HTML & CSS. Then I’m going to move on to JavaScript & React Framework. I’m self-teaching, so it’s harder to know where to start, but you’re helping me a lot, along with other engineer’s. If you can give me any further advice I would appreciate it more than you could fathom, thanks man.
I learned on my own, i believe i can make almost everything i see on other apps/games except for the art parts and AIs in terms of quality. I never asked for jobs, i just put out my apps and make a living.
It's tough, for sure. I went through computer engineering in school (also had a depressive episode much like yours and OP) and had a couple of semi-dev jobs after graduating in December 2017 but it was not as helpful as I thought it would be in obtaining a full-fledged software developer job. It wasn't until 2021 (after pandemic related hurdles) that it's a whole other game to network/market/prepare yourself to land an actual software developer job. Applied to 200 jobs in 2021, landed many interviews but landed no jobs, and realized it's best to not go at it in a "shotgun" approach. Learned a lot in interviewing though. Currently a web designer and working on building a couple of frontend projects before going at it again since that's what interests me the most
Luck is when preparedness meets opportunity. The advice I have is just do your part of being prepared then wait for your opportunity. Don't give up. You'll make it💙.
Chris, I share your same thoughts. I joined a bootcamp beginning of this year it was a part time course and during the course I become friends with a guy that was a QA team lead at the company I am currently a jr full stack software dev at for the past 6 months. I got hired on as an intern. During the internship I had to relearn everything I was taught, the tools being used was different the code was different. I asked a lot of questions I befriended a lot of the devs that ultimately decided to hire me on knowing full well I was new. What they did see was the effort I was putting in to learn the effort I was putting in to get to know them genuinely. My journey was not easy and I’m still learning on the job everyday. I have fun with what I’m learning, there are days I spend hours on how to write a method to do what I need to do then I ask myself how much better I can make that. Although I do feel lucky I also realized I manifested my own luck with the effort I have put into me achieving where I am now. I started my bootcamp in February finish in May and started my internship in June and got hired on full time in August. I was taught react, ruby, JavaScript postgresQL and now I use VueJs, JavaScript, Golang, some php, tailwind. Although I had a quick road to becoming a dev I never measured my skills to anyone else. For those struggling out there, it’s possible. Put yourself out there learn how to fail because that is when you grow the most. And when you finally make it, you’ll be farther ahead than you think.
To be honest, in some countries, being self-taught in anything without a degree or experience, you will not get a job! I have friends that live in Canada and in Western Europe, and getting a Dev, Software Engineering or Network Engineer job over there is very hard because they value the degree and or the experience, and they look down on people that are "self-taught" as being a wanna be Dev, Software Engineer or Network Engineer, because you don't have the formal training and experience they want from a candidate! In the U.S., it's also very hard to get a job in any tech area being self-taught because there's no track record or formal schooling to back up what you learned on your own! For instance, I worked at Google as a Software Engineer! You will not get a job there being self-taught! You need a degree, preferably in Computer Science from a big time university, with a big time Computer Science program, because you will be competing with top-notch talent to get into any of the FAANGS. I have never met a self-taught Software Engineer at Apple, Inc., Samsung Electronics and Google. My last Software Engineering job was at Nvidia and only met one guy there that was self-taught and he was considered a mediocre Engineer at best.
Thank you! You’re right. I’m at where I’m at in life because I never quit on myself and made employers love. Yes some luck but more work than anything to get ahead. Much love to you
It be best to go to school and learn software engineering that way! It's way, way, way harder to learn on your own doing anything!! As for me, I learned from a mentor and at school over 2 years!! I originally started out with a degree in Finance and Paralegal Studies! You do forget everything or almost everything you learn in tech after a year, if you haven't used it! It sucks! I've been in tech for 8 years, started out as a Hardware Engineer, then a Network Engineer, and now a Software Engineer over the past 2 years! It's definitely not easy to learn anything in tech, if you have never done it before, and if you have stopped using a tech for more than a year, you will forget how to use it, as I said early!
I can relate to her, everyday I feel like quitting but I can't afford to. I'm in 7-8 months learning front end and I still can't remember most of what I've learned. I wish her the best tho, not everyone gets to be a winner in life. It's survival of the fittest.
Yeah, I have to disagree with Chris on this. The woman in the article is *_correct._* While Chris may not think "luck" and "location" played a role, the both certainly did. For one, I can't believe he has the audacity to claim luck doesn't play a role when he has no degree, attended a boot camp, and almost immediately landed a job at *_Entrepreneur Magazine._* That is beyond atypical; most aspiring devs bust their asses learning to code hoping to land a spot at a major corporation like that, but never do. We're living in the digital age and the web dev market is viciously competitive...which brings me to location. Employers want to hire someone they think will be a good fit for the position with minimal headache. You know what's a major headache? Having to relocate someone across the country or work around them having a 2 hr commute everyday. Chris has always lived on the west coast, and tech jobs have never been scarce there. But where I live - the south-central US - large swathes of rural countryside stand between larger cities that are at a minimum, 150-200 miles apart. No company in Memphis, TN is going to hire someone living in a rural Alabama town when they could just hire someone living in MEMPHIS. I've lived my whole life in the rural southern US, and my hobby of mountain biking has taken me across four different states down here. One thing I've learned: there are no "rich people" in rural towns. You only see beautiful, $500k homes in the few major cities that dot the landscape down here --- because all of the wealth and opportunity has been concentrated into those areas. Do you have to work hard to be a coder? Absolutely. You have to study hard, too. I did all that. I put in applications daily. I went to college. I spent over six months on Codecademy. I've had two responses so far -- one from Albuquerque, NM, and the other from Mobile, AL. Both decided not to move forward with me after they found out I'd have to relocate. LOCATION MATTERS.
She can win in other areas of life though, coding isn't for everyone and this rough, fiercely competitive job market isn't for everyone either. Location and timing matter a lot.......especially with most companies not going remote anymore, they are giving people a harder time over location now.
It makes me sad that so many people agree with that post. It's littered with insecure messages and the premise of it is really bad advice. If she stuck with it, its likely she would have found a job.
Not to be mean to the person who wrote it but.. Kind of a bad shout and a little rude to chalk someone they barely know as just lucky lottery winner. Sort of de-values someone's hard-work all because you gave up.
Coding is not easy. I started self-learning in 2015 but it took me like 5 years to get that ah-ah moment. I still have a long way to go. I am focusing on Angular. Those companies ask a lot even for junior developers but I never gave up, even after being fired. I seem to have a knack for CSS, the languauge everyone hates, somehow I solve a lot a CSS problems. I think it's my specialty but I need to add Angular to make myself employable. Don't give up and keep it up !
@@osmanbajraktarevic833 if you wonder about the time means you are not willing to put in the work. It can be 2 months or 2 years. Don’t think about « when » but « how » am going to be enough
Starting my first programming job (c++ programmer) tomorrow. I have been learning for almost two years. Every single day... I think I might have missed 2days. I for sure was very lucky as this was the first job I applied to. I guess its being ready to take advantage of the opportunity when it presents itself. I am eager to see what the industry is actually like and I am stoked to learn more and more. I just really hope I will be able to keep up with the demands and perform well. I guess I am in a really privileged position as I was atleast given a chance to get into the industry. (There was a crazy amount of technical interviews) .
There is something this person is doing wrong. I can almost gaurantee she is likely relying too much on applications to working at companies vs networking on LinkedIn. She likely applies to a bunch of jobs and does cookie cutter applications with no custom cover letter to each company and tailored resume to get passed the filtering system of these companies. I much rather market myself on LinkedIn in and show my project and skillset and show that I’m a likeable positive person. Something is very off by her post and the gatekeeping is insane.
Hello chris, am Chris by name from Nigeria and I love hearing u talks and motivation on dev. I have been leaning font end dev for about six month and I have been facing a lot of challenges and one thing that always keeps me going is saying to my self that if Chris sean can do it I can do it even maybe better regardless d time it takes me. I have seen lot of videos on youtube talking about learning how to code in 3 month i don't know how true that is. I started to learn code just for me to understand code like my native language and that has been helping me a lot to use little coding experience to crate great project I don't even imaging I will ever be able to build with my little time of learning how to code. Thanks Chris for ur supports.
dude, I am self taught programmer and a switch career warrior, I learn code in udemy ( colt steele course) , freecodecamp, codecademy, coursera for about 1 YEARS, I learn that shit while I'm working full time monday to friday ( as a staff admin ), after 1 year I had 2 big portofolio ( blog from scratch, full stack airbnb clone ) and then I apply for backend dev job ( more than 50 jobs I apply ), and thanks god there are 1 company who accept me to work as backend dev, lesson learned is there are no such thing like a plain luck, luck is when preparation ( work hard and pray hard , honestly I PRAY A LOT) meet opportunity, but there is one thing you need to make sure before you dive to programming world, and that is Logical thinking, I may not succeed to switch career if I doesn't have that logical thinking
First of all there are other jobs in IT that just developer. In fact its the hardest way to make money. Not sure why that isnt discussed. Its almost sad listening to all the hard luck stories...
I too was lucky. I got a job a month after my bootcamp. I was learning to code by myself for a little over a year before the bootcamp. Luck has a lot to do with it but drive and consistency is key too.
Nope! Blaming luck is an excuse my friend. I lived in a more rural area of my state where there were zero tech jobs. In order to get my foot into the industry, I moved out of state to a big city and landed my first dev job. When I started to learn code, my social life tanked, my full time job suffered, my wife was alone at home while I spent many long days and nights after work and on weekends sitting at a starbucks learning code because I didn't have wifi at home. I did not land my career because I got lucky, I landed my career because it's all I wanted and I gave a lot to make it happen. Today, I make multiple six figures as a full stack engineer working remotely. I'm sure this person put in a ton of effort, but until you're willing to up root and rock your entire life to make your dreams happen, don't expect the greatest results.
Taught myself how to code from Oct 2016 until I got my job in Nov 2017... I quit my job in Jan 2017 and told myself I'm going to focus on getting into tech no matter the cost. Now I'm a full stack developer with .net/c# as my specialty since Nov 2017. What I did was, I applied all over the US ( I was super open to living anywhere just to get my 1st job). I lived in GA at the time and that's where most of my family lives and I got my first job in Arkansas... Because of this sacrifice, I can get a job anywhere and I am now a Tech lead for my current company. Just because I sacrificed time and my willingness to move anywhere just to get that 1st job.
The only luck I would say you had was the market wasn't as competitive back then, Right now it's almost impossible for an absolute beginner to land a job in 3 Months because the bar is so high even for Juniors as everyone and there pets are learning coding nowadays.
I gave up after 4 months but for health reasons lol. My high cholesterol and adhd didn’t let me sit down and focus. But now I’m back at it after losing some weight and taking some meds. We have the same bd btw lol- nov 26
Chris, there are so many devs out there on youtube now talking the talk but you walk the walk. Have so much more respect for you after listening. You really come thru genuine and I can really appreciate it.
I get what she is feeling, trying to accomplish something while working hard and not getting results is hard. Honestly i quit watching your videos because I felt you were way too positive, but came back because your recent videos you talk more about the cons and bad stuff of being in tech, self taught etc.. To me that seems more real. I also think that youtube influencers have been fking up people minds with expectations, not saying you, but there are others youtubers that give false expectations just to get more views. Hope she gets better.
It is sad to be honest. I noticed that about myself so I decided to rebrand myself and focus more on the realities of working in tech while still talking about the best parts about working in it.
@@SD-wj9bv USA has the greatest pool of talented, smart and rich people in human history. Salaries are great, startups abound, opportunities limitless. Imagine being born in a village in Somalia or Romania. No amount of smarts and hard work will ever make you reach American standards...
I watched a lot of your videos before I started my front end coding journey. I had it engraved in my mind that there would be days where I want to give up. There would be days where I think I’m not good enough and honestly its only been 3 months and that thought has came across my mind at-least 2-3 times and that my friend is when I think of you and everyone else in this comment section. I’ve learned to give myself grace on this new journey. The amount of doors that will open if I just don’t quit is what keeps me going. You’re literally going to feel every emotion on this journey but just don’t quit. My hope is that this reaches someone in time. Enjoy the process, challenge yourself, be well & keep going🚀
The two places I genuinely recommend to learn above all else is ZTM, freeCodeCamp for self teaching and coding dojo for for bootcamps. For backend: boot.dev
It's all about the full package. Do you have a CS degree? Are you personable? Is your resume/portfolio squared away? Are you sending out enough resumes? Do you have work experience in tech (even help desk)? Are you grinding data structures?
Often it's about what you did with your knowledge -- you can have 5 fancy degrees or have done amazing bootcamps, that doesn't mean you're a good engineer. You still need to learn from others who have been in the industry for a long time and have made their mistakes and build your own side projects to make it happen.
Don't give up. Tech is also a broad field even if we're just talking about programming. Find something you truly, absolutely like, and work at it. Imagine the joy of building something and showing it to your friends. That will certainly propel you. It's true that luck is required, but the best thing about tech being so accessible (vs. something like finance) is that you MAKE your own luck. Keep nurturing the love, the curiosity, the passion, and jobs will come.
I've been learning for 7 months and giving up is NOT AN OPTION, im gonna start projects any time now, proper ones, and get a job by the 12 month mark. Mark my words. P.s. I pay a tutor who im now friends with and his a senior developer, I have 2 hour a day lessons with him.
hey there, to the writer of this article, you have my sympathy. I deeply feel for you. I hope you can re-consider about giving up Coding. You have invested so much of your time. A little bit more before you touch the finish line and cliche as it is - you are set for life. Just like those soldiers stuck in Omaha beach, the only way to move is forward, no other choice.
While Tech skills are important, the ability to network and connect with people is almost as important, in some cases moreso. Tech skills can be learned such as long as there's a base in skill. Perseverance is very important and realizing you may need to take steps in getting where you want to be. Your journey is yours alone. Don't ever give up regardless of the next man/woman is able to do. Keep the content coming Chris! Edit: I hate it for that person who is hurting with depression. If possible get the support and encouragement needed. Bless up
Thing is some people are very very slow learners and slow in everything else. I am VERY slow at learning. I have been studying Programming, Networking, Hardware for DECADES but I'm not a professional at any these things. Just a hobbyist. To become a professional you need to really focus yourself and I never have. I'm a girl of all trades and can do a lot of things but not at professional levels. For some people it might never be career but a pass time like it is for me. There's also the factor of Depression. This is a big one. It's a honest to goodness disability for many and makes it impossible to be employed. If YOU don't believe in yourself it's impossible to convince an employer to believe in you. I have zero confidence in myself while others are full of it. I've watched as confident (but not all the bright) men talk their way into better positions and fake it till they make it. It's amazing to see just how far someone can go on hot air and guile.
I can understand how this person feels. It's happen to me, I gave up once, but while yes I can't compare my self to you or others it does give me hope. It's all about me, how I do how I talk, how I work with others, how well I am told to change what I worked hard on. It might have some to do with my current manager, because he does want to see me move on from being a phone monkey wasting my abilities. Don't let your self forget you're still an inspiration because every video I have seen from you has been motivational, because you are honest about it. You are straight that it's hard, it's not easy and it takes work. Most of all, I can 👏not 👏give 👏up. It's also good to know I am not the only one sneaking in doing coding while at work, LOL. Props doing 10+ of learning code while working a full time job taking phone calls, and also living pay check to pay check. Massive debt. For anyone watching this who wants to take the same path. Do not give up, dont think you cant. You can do anything you put your mind and heart towards
She needs to keep practicing and keep applying until she finds the right company who will give her a chance. Maybe it's not right company for you to join or right time to get the job you are seeking. Timing is everything. Applying to a job in a different state, not just the state you currently reside in, relocate if you have to. I heard , some people apply to 200 or more jobs before they get a tech software job. The key is to never give up on your dream eventhough you get no response from the majority of the companies you apply to. Eventually one company will come along and offer you the job, stay positive. Positive attitude attracts opportunities. No negative, downer thinking or attitude drives away any job opportunities that might come your way.
I've been wanting to say this for months, take no offence anyone, but I love watching people fail at coding on RU-vid videos and when they cry and say its so hard, I say yes, 1 job more open for me lol. Im 7 months into my learning, and yes its hard, but nothing im not gonna overcome within the next 3 months, then gonna applying for jobs, my goal is to have a job by the 12th month of learning 😊
I paused & read the post & I don’t think she meant to come for Chris or devalue what he has done. Everyone successful has a bit of luck, that doesn’t mean they didn’t work hard or didn’t deserve it, but not everyone who works hard will be successful. Yes, you increase your chances the better you get, but you still need an opportunity. Anyway, I get why he was a bit offended, but she didn’t seem like she was blaming him for being misleading, but just warning people not to go into it with expectations like she did.
I don’t care, some people just want a ready-made excuse when something doesn’t work out for them. They don’t know how many times you also failed before you made it. It happens. It is disrespectful to discount someone’s hard work and diligence because YOU gave up. If we all gave up every time someone slammed a door in our faces, then we would all be without a job. Adversity comes with the territory. If you’re not up for it, then it didn’t matter if it was becoming a developer or any other job. You might have to work harder than the next person to get the same role, but you have to work hard. You have to also accept that it may not work out, so have a backup plan. A plan B, or another route to take. Stop dimming someone’s else’s light because it didn’t work out for you.
Yea, no, I hate coding with a passion, didn't help that I went to college originally for that and changed my major after 2 semesters because of the bullshit. I rather fix things as an IT Technican than build shit that will break consistently unless I 100% know what I am doing.
I don't believe they didn't get any offers for years, they either never looked properly and expected it to just land on their lap or they rejected offers that they felt were beneath them, a lot of the motivation for most people is money, they expect massive salaries and when someone shows up offering you something similar to what you might make waiting tables people refuse. My first few jobs barely paid above jobs that don't require any special training. I stuck with it because i enjoyed the work i was doing and that provided it's own value for me, in time it paid off but i was happy either way. I think this is good actually to weed out the people who are coming into it just because they think it's an easy way to make a lot of money, because it's not, that's all false propaganda from recruiters and others desperately trying to increase the amount of leads they have for jobs. Most jobs you won't be paid more than you might in construction or other such jobs, don't enter tech if your goal is big bucks cause you're highly unlikely to get them. All that said i think that recruiter propaganda also set up false expectations in people that this sector is constantly hiring people for tons of money, it's not really true, most of it is start ups that hire and lay-off people by the hundreds it's very volatile. And as of late i'm noticing a LOT of new people entering the market, more i feel, than the industry really needs and so wages are slowly stagnating as supply of coders equals and starts to surpass the demand, this will also make it harder for people to get in now compared to how it was a few years ago. Another major difference is the economy is on it's a** now, this directly impacts the availability of venture capital which most tech start-ups relied upon to operate at all, less venture capital means less risky startups, which means a lot less entry-level jobs available as everyone rushes to get a job in the big corporations The more new coders, the lower the wages companies can offer to new joiners and the more demanding they can get in terms of formal education, it's somewhat of a natural response to the massive influx of people coming from all kinds of bootcamps and "women in coding" style initiatives over the last few years Also a lot of these aforementioned bootcamps and initiatives have direct links to big companies that automatically grant entry-level spots that would otherwise be on the market to graduates of said bootcamps , this wasn't as much of a factor a few years ago as it is nowadays
Realistically to pay bills (like rent, internet, utilities, phone, food) where for 1 person or a family, if you can't get a position in even 1 year or even half a year then you shouldn't start that endeavor. Especially if you're expecting to start a career. These luxuries only exist for people (like the "junior developer" that made it in 4+ years) who don't have to manage being an adult. The truth is, not only is it very difficult to get a start in software without a degree, it's incredibly difficult to get one with a degree... You have to grind out hours on algorithms, force out "projects", and go through weeks to months of interviews for tens if not hundreds of companies all while trying to prove you're better than all the other candidates on their list. Then after getting in, you'll learn what burnout is and why the turnover rate at all the tech companies are so high.
Im currently in a boot camp. Tbh I don’t think I’m going to be able to get the certificate since I kind of joined very impulsively without any previous experience but I refuse to give up. Even if I don’t get certified I’m still going to keep doing it.
How can it be luck? They think companies just reach out to us and say hey wanna be a software engineer with no prior knowledge? I’m a self taught too. Took me 3 years to claw my way in but I’m in
She is right about luck and location playing a big part. If she wasn't willing or able to relocate then that'd make things a lot harder. If you're trying to crack into an industry being willing to relocate opens up your opportunities x1000 rather than just relying on the limited options in your city.
If you saw her comments,why not respond ? It could've meant the world to her,you never know,some people need a little push,and if you are able to help,why not ?
I graduated with a degree in IT, concentrated in networking. I just want people to know there is so much more to “tech” than being a software engineer.
To be honest, she kind of has a point. Not that it's impossible to get into tech, but that there are so many youtube videos and bootcamp ads making it seem like you can get a job in tech in just a few months and that does skew a lot of people's expectations.
That article isn't objective at all. Just because one person failed where another succeeded shouldn't be the reason to belittle the hard work that someone else put into their craft.
Took 9 month boot camp and got a job 1 month before graduation. My first job started at 70k. I think the biggest edge I had was my likability not so my technical ability as a junior dev … got my second job 6 months after increased my pay substantially.. don’t compare yourself to others and focus on yourself is the advice I would give.
Back in 2020 I was trying to learn coding because I wanted to become app developer. I bought a band new Mac book pro that cost $2500. I quit before I even started learning. I watch a few RU-vid video and I already quit. I make so much excuse on why I couldn’t learn coding. Because I have work that day or this and that whatever the reason may be. I was only motivated for a while. At the end of the day there nobody to blame but myself. I just turn 27 this December. I already feel like I’m too old to learn anything. 😢
Hell no wtf? You have so much time man, 27 is still mad young. You can get yourself going in a few years and you’ll thank yourself later when you see the checks coming in..
Don't give up! I'm also a self-taught dev, and it took me about 8 months. It was A LOT of hard work, but in the end, the stars aligned, and I got my first role as a full-stack dev. If anyone wants to add some open-source experience, I recommend looking at Hack for LA.
I get what OP was saying. I came in as a self-taught developer but I also happened to live in a city where a company had a paid apprenticeship. She was doing projects, but it does take someone giving you a chance to break in, and you can only control that so much. I agree that consistency matters, but it's tough to keep the momentum up without external validation. And Canada is probably less open to self-taught developers than the US. I'm on a panel of interviewers at my current company and we pass on _competent_ devs if there's a lack of consensus of on a "strong yes" for them. So the rejection is not personal! It also doesn't have to be the end.
Yeah ‘results’ don’t lie. Money is never an accident. Life isn’t easy. Luck is good sometimes.. Finding a good occupation is hard work. Programming isn’t for everybody. Haters are going to hate unfortunate.
Facts. She wasn’t a hater, I think she just needed to vent her frustrations which is totally understandable considering how long she’s been trying to get into tech.
I got my 1st job as a feontend react dev a year ago after 10 months of hustle, self taught no CS degree no bootcamp. Its doable but i was learning my ass pff for 10 hours a day. Now year later i am backend developer, completely new field, i am still learning....
I think that's the thing though. People want an easy way to get a job so they think just going to a Bootcamp is going to get them a job. It was that way some years back when every company was borrowing money for free and then hiring like crazy to keep up with a lot of customers using their services/product due to COVID, lockdown, WFH, etc. Just like how you did, they need to grind and make connections to get a good job cause it's not going to get handed to them whether they have a college degree, bootcamp cert, no degree/certs, or whatever. Not every person is going to get a job. Some will get it, some will take a long time to finally get one, some will never get one, some others will quit along the journey, etc.
My biggest mistake when learning how to code was not learning how to be an programmer. They're coders and they're programmers. Coders don't know the art of the programmer. I'm teaching myself all the keyboard shortcuts and learning how to use an mechanical keyboard properly without using a mouse. Anyone can pickup a katana called themselves an Samurai but don't know the art of the Samurai.
I'm currently a trucker trying to learn to code every free moment I get my laptop is out and I'm practicing. I want so badly to get a job without a degree, I work 12-16 hrs per day and only get a 10 hr break. Very discouraging to see the requirements for tech jobs rn
with chatGPT out now and only going to get better in the coming years, is going the self taught route/bootcamp worth it to become a frontend dev? I understand there will always be a demand for software engineers, but with ai that can produce code within seconds and is a free tool, I fear getting a entry level frontend job will be even harder than it is now. What would your advice be for us going the self taught route?
You have to realise that if you put code from a project inside chatGPT it will stay there. Every conversation is saved. No company that is not open source will want their employees to do this. It is sensitive data.
Question for you or anyone that can share light on my situation. I am 53 years old and looking to change careers, I have been hobby coding since I was in 7th grade. I started out on apple 2e's and commodore 64's and progressed up to COBOL on mainframes, and I currently have written several fairly complex programs for my current employer. I am currently learning Java on my own, last year I tried python and completed a project, but did not stick with it. What are my chances of becoming a software developer in the midwest? I love coding but don't want to be delusional that I will ever be hired as a software developer.
I know a female that went through coding boot camp and easily found a job. She’s Making over 100k a year. Another female that I know, didn’t even know networking but gets hired for networking at a hospital and she also making six figures.
Chris, you're spot on with soft skills which come in the form of but is not limited to the following: -Communication -Self-Motivation -Leadership -Responsibility/Conscientiousness -Teamwork -Problem-Solving -Decisiveness -Ability to Work Under Pressure
I don't know why people think skipping the degree is some sort of a shortcut; when in reality, you're choosing the harder route. Not only that, if the degree takes a minimum of 4 years to complete, how is she upset that she didn't get a job before committing a minimum of 4 years?
I relate to this person writing this post more than anyone in this comment section will ever know. Luck is a bigger part than most of you will like to admit. Giving up sometimes is the best thing for some people's mental health. Where is the compassion for this lady? The post she wrote, in my opinion, was very brave. Self-taught development community can be so toxic sometimes. It's okay to choose your mental health over a potential career.
In the United States, it is also the same issue. "You will only get a chance with employers if you have a college or university degree." The problem is that there are a billion people out there in the world and employers want the small percentage who has everything: A diploma, experience, a lot of soft and hard skills, someone who they can trust, and who looks like a person who can be part of the team. The same thing is with people who are complaining that it is hard to get into romantic relationships. Instead of relying on an employer for money find a way to make money by yourself, or else you won't last under capitalism.
One thing people don't understand is that they emphasize a particular trait too much and assume that's a sole reason for the causation. It's too bad that not much research has been put in on determining what makes people get hired and what doesn't but I also feel if that was made public the data would be incredibly messy and random to point out big reasons why. One thing that I find that holds true is just simply trying something different as the saying goes: "Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result". I know many people who transitioned careers even at a late stage of their life and having to do that made a world of difference.
Asking someone to wait beyond a year and now four years plus to land a tech job in a skill set that is supposedly not common and requires a skill set that is hands on and must be practiced in order to retain is a tall order in deed. However, I have no idea if this woman was being proactive in trying to earn a job instead of just shot gunning Indeed, and I don't want to assume she was "lazy.'
I ended up taking a year before getting my first job as a full stack right out of university. i wasn't able to find a job right out of university despite having experience in fullstack, IT and devops. It really does take a lot of time, effort, consistency and self teaching to get to where you are at. I can definitely guarantee you that a lot of CS majors coming out of university don't know how to code for jack shit. I've been in group projects with some of these people and some of their code is garbo. Even then, some social skills that some cs majors have are just terrible... I agree that luck doesn't play that big of a role but it does matter during situations where candidates are equally good at what they do. For example, I interviewed 20+ candidates and 5 of them were solid and were almost equal in skillset and experience. The candidate we ended up going with just seemed better to work with than the rest; situation like that is just luck. They all were great candidates and all seemed great to work with. If I could, I would've hired all 5. My team and I knew conciously that those other 4 candidates we didnt pick would be able to find another job. You just have to keep grinding and keep going. If you don't know why you didnt get the job, it's always okay to ask why you weren't picked. Most of the time it's like "oh we found a better candidate" or it's a "timing" thing. In that case, yea it's just luck. I know coders who are leagues better than people I know currently in the big companies but just didnt get the opportunity to get in.
