Sorry but no, my father came to this country dirt poor from Mexico city in the 40's, never quite learned english well but he worked his behind off to give his kids college in the best country in the world, "el modo americano", he says...a person that behaves like the character Tony is an embarrassment to immigrants and to what America represents
Thomas Just chill out dude, latins are all brainwashed to think the usa is the best country in the world 😂. There are far better countries than that dumpster fire. Plus USA is keeping the drug trade in your country alive. All the poverty in latin-america is thanks to the USA and Europe. And i’m from europe. We live comfortably off the backs of poorer countries. Thats just how the world works. Don’t kid yourself. Usa is average in every regard. Bad school systems, poverty, homeless people, no free health care etc. Europe is years ahead. The only thing the usa has is plastic cities that makes you think they have it all. Trust me, the american dream has been a sham, and yet muricans still cant see it 😂. Show a little pride in your homecountry my man. Usa doesnt owe you anything. Youre a descendant of the aztecs and shit. Thats true history right there. Latinos should wise up. They’re so easily opressed.
Yea, but he's not a hypocrite - he admits it wasn't for him and his kind, he literally says "but some of us didn't want to swarm". Man I don't know why, but people are unfair to the character of Tony Soprano. That might be the hallmark of the greatest character in fiction history, idk.
@@hansolo631 It's not unfair when the main theme of the show was to point out the hypocrisy in the American mythos of honorable men and honorable traditions in the mafia of all places
You didn't understand what w was said then, he called working men drones for the American crime families, Rockefeller, Carnegie and the rest. His entire point was he wasn't that.. no wonder th3 comments are low iq Jesus.
@@matthewmayorga917the main point of the show was to embarrass Italians and it backfired , round2 jersey shore 'let's make something so obnoxious, so low iq, such a.mockery of their culture that they'll have no choice but to be embarrassed, we will ASTRO turf it as well, force feed it down every Americans throats. If you ask why would they want to embarrass Italians, of all people, then you - like most here- know absolutely nothing.
@@norbath1650 And you remain a half ass internet self acclaimed critic who thinks being a good actor is having many roles that are a full 360 from eachother
David Carrafiello Since when is selling drugs to your own people any less honourable than extorting money from your own people with the use of violence/murder? As for the Irish, they happen to be one of the most beloved nationalities in the US.
+SapientSpaceApe it's about the time in jail that goes along with it.. It makes a guy selling drugs and probably using them much more likely to flip government witness when he's facing sixty years and is addicted to drugs to boot.
"Those evil fucks deserve to die. Not my nephew." Lol, the way he scratched his t-shirt after saying that, like he's so sure of the non-evil nature of their occupation. It's these little mannerisms that JG brought to the role and made it amazing just to watch a guy sit on a sofa and rant. Also, props to Michael Imperioli who wrote this episode. One of the best ones. "Satanic black magic. Sick shit!"
ur a dumbass that’s not what he’s doing he’s just saying that’s how the mob works people die for mistakes they kill each other they don’t go around shooting innocent civilians for no good reason
Lorraine Bracco's acting was so understated but absolutely amazing in this scene. Also it really showed Dr Melfi not doing her job very well and, for a few different reasons, losing her cool in the face of Tony's tirade. It's scenes like this which is why Sopranos was one of the best TV shows ever made. Also: shineboxes, blood type Ragu, Interior Decorator etc....
@@seronymus Ethical codes for any therapist would be to report any action which might put someone in psychical danger. This could be their patient in most cases, or in a case like Tony, the many implied killings that he basically used Melfi as a sounding board for. You can help someone like Tony when they've been convicted of their many crimes and accept them, not when they are still rationalizing them and not even being addressed in therapy.
Notice how Tony says at the beginning that Chris “will be fine.” But at the end of the video when Tony gets all defensive he says “my nephew might not get out”
He knew how to manipulate peoples emotions on how he was feeling. Another reason why the writing and acting of this show will forever go down as one of the best series ever to hit TV
"When my nephew is in the fuckin hospital he might not get out." The way he delivered that line along with the buildup, was worthy of an oscar on its own. That is reaaaaaaallllll.
This scene is so intense, she knows she is taking a side because Tony affects her emotional health and leads her to alcoholism, and Tony says all the justifications of a psychopath. It is perfect.
Tony is a despicable human being deserving of Hell, but I disagree with the idea that he's a socio/psychopath. I don't think those kinds of people would spend so much intellectual energy justifying their immoral, insensitive behavior.
Actual people whose job they have jobs for put their food on plates in tables or something like this those people have families and friends that American treat us as well sometimes steps own away from them but we are people who live with our families we pray begging for our lives we pray eat our own meals Italian and our children
I feel like Chase encapsulated the whole subtext of the show in this scene, the decline of the Mafia as a symbolic of the overall decline of Italian-American identity, the very identity the Mafia purported to uphold, brought about by inexorable assimilation into mainstream Anglo-Protestant, capitalist culture. On the one hand, the mafia was ostensibly about preserving the traditions, the culture, the community of the old country against the forces of dissolution and exploitation by the new. On the other, it was the contradictory embrace of the Protestant work ethic, the avaricious American way, the corporate model, to “get a piece of the action”, as Tony says. And slowly but surely, the the former gave way to the expedient demands of the latter. Not to say you didn’t always have extortion, murder and sociopaths like Capone in organized crime but I think Godfather part 1’s plot highlights well the cultural shift that occurred in the midcentury Mafia as gambling, prostitution, and organized labor gave way to narcotics. Hagen captured the prisoner’s dilemma perfectly the night before the meeting with Sollozzo when he said “narcotics was the future”, and if the family didn’t jump now, didn’t compromise its moral reservations, someone else would, and the superior profitability and resources of the one who did would ultimately doom the family that didn’t. In other words, any residual values had to be subordinated to the creative destruction of the newest market opportunity. Vito, of course, turns Sollozzo down because drugs is a “dangerous and dirty business” and gets a couple bullets in the back for it. Michael’s arc really captures the short lived apogee and subsequent fall of the Mafia after it turned into a glorified violent drug company. Cold, calculating, ruthless and technocratic in a way his father never was, Michael was more American than Italian. He really did approximate a kind of Mafiaso Rockefeller until, like the real Rockefeller, his operations became to big for their own good and drew the ire of the feds that would unravel them and him. In sum, Michael, as the personification of the Italian-American Mafia, gained the whole world only to lose his soul, the collective Italian-Catholic identity, values, community that had constituted them and whose preservation had informed their animating purpose. Crappy as part 3 generally is, Capolla did justice to this metatheme with Michael’s concerted desire to give up the ruthless, violent corporate competition, the Americanization of the Mafia he had previously embodied, in order to recover the original social purpose of the family, recover the Italian-Catholic identity, recover his estranged personal family. His ultimate inability to do so, the success of his business dealing at the expense of his daughter’s life, I think, is the temporal punishment due to his sins. And I see the Sopranos as kind of an ironic, postmodern part 4 godfather continuing of this theme of compounding damnation. Whereas Vito was Italian and Michael Italian-American, 3rd generation Tony is really just American, and a self consciously postmodern one at that. Whereas Michael lost his soul, Tony never really had one to begin with. While Michael confesses his sins to the future Pope John Paul, Tony confesses his self-pity to a female shrink. His Italian-Catholic identity is purely sentimental, nostalgic, aesthetic, it’s informed as much through popular Hollywood portrayals as it is by any acculturation to the vestiges of authentic Italian culture. For Vito’s generation the mob was a means for “getting a piece of the action” for a poor, Italian immigrant community. For wholly assimilated and therefore alienated Tony, being a mobster is Italian-Americanness, or rather, its the convenient excuse a deracinated, 21st century criminal like Tony tells himself. Means have become ends, and Tony’s basically a living parody for it. Gotta love how Melfi cuts to the bone of all this after Tony’s deflective, self justifying monologue when she asks, “that may all be true, but what do poor Italian immigrants have to do with YOU?”
Man, Tony is a ninja Master of deflecting questions and believing his own hype. Then again, a man in his position needs to be that way. How else would he be able to go to sleep at night after all the fucked up things he and his soldiers have done. Excellent acting by both James and Lorraine.
“I like money and kill people because I’m a soldier but it’s ok because my ancestors were poor” amazing how he tries to conflate the two of these to shield his fear that he’s probably going to hell himself.
His point was that everyone powerful, which didnt include italians yet, were so because they were crooks, maybe sophisticated crooks but crooks. Hence italians also started doing crookery and you have mafia
I find it fascinating how Tony can be so aware of how American corporations actually operate (on the exploitation of the working class), and yet be so unaware of the fact that his business relies on the exact same thing. Maybe it’s blissful ignorance in order to avoid truly confronting his choices in life (something that Tony has proven to do with a lot of aspects of his life).
For all the people saying this scene is pointless because Tony and his crew steal and kill for nothing- that’s exactly the point of the scene, to show how people, especially Tony lie to themselves and justify their actions even tho deep down they know. That’s the theme of the show.
Some people have criticized Lorraine Bracco's acting on this show---the criticism being that her acting is somewhat "wooden." IMHO I think she plays her role superbly!! As someone who has seen a therapist before I can say that her reactions, demeanor--the questions she asks Tony and the way she asks them are a dead-ringer representation of how a therapist talks to a patient during a session!!
nyterpfan I totally agree with you, I think shes brilliant in the Sopranos. Plays the part perfectly, and the chemistry between her and Gandolfini is terrific. Some of my favourite moments in the show are in the therapy sessions!
nyterpfan that's how I always viewed her role. As a psychiatrist trying to reach into the dark recesses of Tony's soul. To rescue not just him, but all his victims too.
+Nicola Raciti "they can even mimic empathy". Strange how it doesnt look like he s mimic his sadness about Chris, and other times too. Until the last season when viewers being forced to see it. Its probably because of acting of Gandolfini, as well as T himself intended to be a good actor to wrapping everyone around his finger
The way he scratches his chest and makes that face after he says he won't go to hell...it feels so real. Like, "I like how I put that, let me scratch that itch."
I love the mental loopholes he goes through to justify his actions. And despite professing to be a Catholic, and by Catholicism's own rules he's basically guaranteed a trip to Hell, he somehow decides otherwise.
STUDIO BENCIVENGA Marcus Bencivenga Imagine calling the single-largest religious group (Catholics) a “cult.” Catholicism is also not “controlled” by jesuits. Jesuits are a monastic order just like Franciscans. Wtf is with conspiracies about jesuits lol
@nauticadon my friend everyone who wasn't a wasp got fucked in America. Irish, Italians, Jews polish Russians, all sent to ghettos with no chance of leaving. The difference is that they had fathers at home that forced the kids to go to school so they could have access to all opportunities that had been denied to the previous generation.
@@vegancandy9570 Yeah, cause it's our fucking country, or at least was. The rest of you are just visiting. You want to immigrate and be a minority and expect NOT to get the short end of the stick.
These bozos describing themselves with flowery language like "soldiers" when their entire livelihood comes from preying on the working class and siphoning money from them were the actual funniest scenes in this show.
I agree with his comment about the banks, but nooo we cant talk about Tony, 'hE's bADaSs' according to his blind sheep followers. No matter what he does
Indeed. They behave like real people. Only more sociopathic. They rarely say what they're truly thinking or feeling. There's always some subtext, repressed emotion or whatever.
There were two moments in my life when watching a movie I thought it wasn't a movie, but like I was peeking through a secret hole into other people’s lives, at first it was the Godfather when Michael kills Sollozzo when he comes back with a gun I was just sweating listening to the sound of train and this moment when Tony says they're soldiers, what kind of acting is this, amazing! The best!
I remember watching this scene and thinking WOW what a masterpiece. Cool to find someone else found it moving enough to upload. I honestly believe this is one of the most important scenes in the whole show. Im surprised every line from the scene hasnt been quoted or sampled in some rap song, like the scarface lines.
I think something James gandolfini does so incredibly is portray a person who isn't fully convinced of himself. Sopranos is a show where everyone's true feelings are clear through the blatant lies they tell, though the person most convinced of those lies is often themselves. James portrays the battle between Tony's self awareness and delusion so perfectly in these therapy scenes, looking off into the distance repeating his inner mantras to himself. Tonys true motivation in therapy isnt to better himself, or even to convince melfi he's bettered himself, it's to convince himself he's good through the mirror of his one sided conversations Infront of melfi. Nobody portrays this shakiness like gandolfini.
Or send a huge truck full of toxic material and leave the pepcock underneath to the tank holding it open, and send the thing from one end of the country to the next, slowly spilling it for free onto the highways vs. paying any storage fees for a proper landfill....or extort money out of honest folks trying to get by. But I am with them totally on the cunts who run shit.
"We're soldiers. Soldiers kill other soldiers." all I can think of with this is Paulie killing that old lady who was friends with his mother, all so he could steal her money to pay up to Tony and cover his own ass. she wasn't a soldier, she wasn't a part of the life.
I would Love that! Gandolfini/Bracco, no doubt, it would be magnificent. I would go back to see it over + over again. It'll never be... Rip Mr. Gandolfini🙇♀️
"We wanted to stay Italian and preserve the things that meant something to us like honour and family." Killing people isn't fairly honourable and get cheats on his wife constantly?
But that was the genius of David Chase's masterpiece! You liked those people; you hated those people. He, simply, made them "people". Then you add the magnificence of Mr. James Gandolfini and ahhhhhh! Great, great Art!!!! I miss Gandolfini still😔
There is a lot of difference between culturally ingrained code of honor and actual honor. Most western people don't get it because we are fairly open societies but there are societies where your honor as defined by cultural norms and NOT your conscience is the most important thing you have. Klingons in Star Trek would also be perfect example of this. There were multiple instances in the show where Worf got himself in trouble for having actual honor as opposed to ritualised concept of honor.
@@Turtle1631991 Worf accepting discommendation was a most honorable sacrifice. With Worf it's truly all about conscientiousness. The Soprano crime family is more like the Duros sisters. They only ever use honor as a shield for selfish reasons.
@@likaner1 Confucianism is an ancient chinese state philosophy. Some ideas might have been exported to japan over the centuries, but during most of the samurai era (basically Nara - Edo period) Shinbutsu-shūgō was the only state religion in japan and dominated most of the country. It is a shintoism - buddhism mix. East and south asian religions are often structured around the samsara (concept of rebirth) and when you reach enlightenment in buddhism your soul enters the nirvana and finally escapes the cycle of rebirth, which essentially is the opposite of becoming one with the world. Imo that is very simular to christianity, judaism and islam.
@@ollih.901 Escape from worldly suffering is the core philosophy of buddhism yeah, but as I understood it Shinto was more about being in harmony with the nature deities. I just assumed Edo Japan had a mix of Shinto and Confucius ideas. Anyway, thanks for the interesting comment, it’s definitely something I’m not an expert so I appreciate the politeness.
But it didn’t start off that way when Italians entered the country. They didn’t speak the language and no one protected them or their neighborhoods. They worked for almost nothing and yes, built the bridges and skyscrapers and the subways. All they had were each other so they decided to become an entity that didn’t want to be taken advantage of any more.
@@fieryeurochick3194 It might sound harsh but that is life for you, they made a choice coming here and sometimes you gotta eat shit in order to progress.. there is always an excuse to take the easy route and tony wasnt a first generation, tbh he had it much easier by choosing his mafiosi life he decided to crap on all the hard working italians that stuck to it. I might understand when your only option is to work in a skyscraper and risk your life on daily basis for peanuts but.. you see your mates doing it and the other option was what extorting money from your own? Stealing money from other skyscrapers? What kind of honour is that? Tony is just full of shit he knows thats why he gets so mad dr.melfi touches the right spots. She is a psychiatrist she sees Tony's damage obviously, I wasnt sure he was a sociopath but after reading about his actions not just watching im amazed I was charmed lol. I watched the show when I was a kid and a teen perhaps I should re watch it again as I am an adult now I might enjoy it even much more with all the new perspective and stuff I have missed with my younger mind 😋. Sorry for the long comment if you read god bless if not god bless again haha 😇😅😁
"soldiers kill other soldiers" Adriana, the angry waiter, the Elvis impersonator, and Minn Marrone were definitely the weirdest "soldiers" I've ever seen 🤔🤣
That last line is so revealing, “he might not get out.” Meanwhile, earlier in this session Tony goes, “he’s gonna be fine.” Always playing what will get him the most sympathy
I agree so much, my cousin, who never seen it asked my brother "it's a show about the mafia, right?" My brother replied, "Not really, it's a show about a guy who happens to be in the mafia."
I love Melfi. She has her morals and she knows that. She can see things from different perspectives but still chooses to live her life what she considers to be the right way.
I get so lost in his performance and notice his emotions and almost crying I literally forget I’m watching a TV show. This first time I heard James G talk with out his accent it blow my mind. What an actor what a loss.
Tony uses his grief over Chris to shut Melfi down. He wasn't faking those feeling though, like a sociopath would, the crack in his voice is a testament to that. Rather, he uses genuine feelings to manipulate others into feeling sorry for him. He does it time and again over the course of the series. That's what makes him such a fascinating character.
were soldiers.. The first time when he sais something that shows who he is and what he is for real. I love it waht he sais best television ever, movies included
The interesting thing about all of the below comments saying..."Preach on, brother, Tony!"... If the mafia's actions were legal, it'd still be despicable. It doesn't matter whether other organizations do things that are EVEN WORSE...there's a certain point where you're just depraved and evil. And the mafia qualifies. Tony's argument has the moral weight of a bully on a playground, arguing that the recess monitor is the REAL BULLY (even if she IS quite a demon).
If you think about it, tony's right. The show, shows us the fbi were just as bad as the criminals they were trying to arrest. They were just as corrupt and they threatened and lied just as much.
@@tuoy1 Yes and no, he's right about the Carnegies and Rockerfellers being crooks and killers, like the FBI too. Soldiers part is debatable. But killing civilian old ladies and waiters who aren't 'in that life' for the silliest reasons discredits his argument
Ah yes, the values of honor, family, and loyalty coming from the man that ends up breaking apart his family, who has zero loyalty to people, like Christopher, and who betrays the idea of honor every time he cheats on Carmella
All of that immigrant talk is true. I can relate through my parents and I get how it worked for the mob back then. But it was the first (or at least the second) generations that have no excuse anymore. They turned what was once all about doing something better for your family and community and the off chance that a person within their group had to go. But now, the whole thing turned into any reason they could find to kill and rob people. They had opportunities their parents or grandparents could never have and they piss all over it.
+gutz1981 This was also my interpretation. It all goes back to the first episode when Tony states he knew he was getting into the something at the end, something that had run it's course. Tony's inability to justify his actions to himself manifest in the need for therapy, the panic spells, alcohol/drug consumption and erratic violent behavior. This in turn compromises his leadership ability throughout the show, as the family deteriorates. In the end there is no real family, just a rotating cast of characters.
A lot of Mexicans feel this way about the cartel. They are at a point where they can no longer justify their bad deeds. The days of Stealing from the rich to give to the poor are gone.
This episode made me fall in love with this series. Tony says the people who go to hell are those who kill for pleasure, the ones who order deaths (Hitler's, Pol pots) and the ones who torture & kill babies. Later, he orders the Bevilaqua hit then for pleasure gets in on it. Then he tortures and kills the Bevilaqua kid when he's screaming for his mommy. Brilliant writing
The Bevilaqua kid was part of what Tony described as "everybody involved know the stakes". He chose to be part of that world, and he knew full well what happens in that world if you fuck up. Well, he fucked up. There's no hypocrisy there on Tony's part.
He got in on it for personal reasons like he wants to feel it not just order it. Lol torture? He didnt torture anyone, he just blasted the guy, if anything its quicker death and opposite of torture. Not defending him as a person though.
yeah its stupid because the whole pursuit of the mafia is personal gain and pleasure without regard for the people they hurt and extort the point of this scene is that tony is full of shit.
He was being cornered and knew it. That’s why he started deflecting at the end trying to bring up how “distraught” he was by Christopher being in the hospital. Great writing man.
I watched The Sopranos for the first time a decade ago. And watched The Wire for the first time a couple of years ago. Having watched both shows, I've realized that the soldiers in The Wire are what the soldiers in The Sopranos like to think they are.
I'm reading Man of Honor by Joseph Bonanno and chapter 9 of this book ties in to this topic really well, especially the explanation of war and honor and loyalty. and what Tony says about the early industrialists and the American Way is great writing
+InfamousMedia After watching the show again and dissecting the mafia's original purpose in their respective communities I understand exactly what he is saying here. The downside was that he was lying to himself here and James Gandolfini acts this out perfectly. He knew he had little resemblance to the men of honor he was referring to in the past. As he said in the first episode of the series to Dr. Melfi, I knew I was getting into something at the end.
When my great grandfather came to this country from Italy he wanted to be a cop. All the cops were Irish and said " hell no.' The Irish were very discriminating to Italians back in the day. Instead, my great Grandfather helped big the Brooklyn bridge and help build New York with his own hands. So yeah, Tony is right.
Very cool story!! Props to your granddad, those men who built our infrastructure deserve our thanks. Yes, both Irish and Italians were very much discriminated against after arriving in Ellis Island. Irish turned to law enforcement jobs and many Italians turned to organized crime type jobs.
Aries when my great grandfather came to NYC from Ireland some 100+ years ago they also did construction work and were the first Catholics to come to America, having to deal with the protestants before them. We also started tammany hall for all catholic immigrants, so you're welcome.
And many of those Italians like the Irish before them all assimilated into greater Anglo American society by discriminating against blacks, Chinese, and Native Americans, effectively making themselves “white” in the process.
@@4everspacetrue, I was naive about politics myself for a long time but there's a lot of criminality in this thing, every once a while a stand up guy like trump or gaddafi comes along and they swat him out like a fly.
He’s a sociopath, a murderer, a massive hypocrite, a terrible parent, a terrible husband etc. Why the fuck would anyone wish to know an uncle like that??
@@sn-up6rc well knowing the Mafia he’s probably put on an image the average family member not involved in the life would get to know so if he was related to you, you’d probably have positive or indifferent feelings towards him as an Uncle.
