I know this comment is completely irrelevant to the context of this video but I wanted to ask a huge favor if you're not too busy. I've always enjoyed your avatar videos more than anything and would really appreciate if you made more Korra videos (not about villains but about other things) also Katara and Sokka's character arcs wouldn't hurt. Thank you.🙏🏿
I hear what you are saying, and it sounds like you're in a place where alot of people have been, where *I* have been. Can I recommend something that might help or give you some further thoughts? The video "Losing Faith" by Therimentrees and the video "Creating Sickness" by Therimentrees. Both are here on RU-vid and both are very good.
I'm 25. Spent my life in church and I'm also undergoing deconstruction so I might have to give this a read. Can I make a song recommendation? "What We Lost in the Fire" by Troy Baker (Joel's voice actor TLOU). The lyrics gave me a lot of hope during the process. It might not have the same impact for you but maybe it will. Take care! ~A parasocial friend 🙃
I feel, as a christian myself, a lot of sympathy for this because often times the church can become all bout repetition and it’s so easy to fall out of relationship with God because “faith” turns into rituals rather than relationship. Faith *should be* a connection, but like Tim has said before, people are messy, and it’s hard to buy into a God who cares about you when He isn’t well represented by messy people.
That's the beautiful thing about God, though. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Peter, John, Paul.... all of them were cracked, damaged vessels. God never uses anything but weak and damaged and sinful people, because with the exception of Jesus, that's all there are. "There are none who are good; no not one." "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned-every one-to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all." - Isaiah 53:6 If God depended on us to clean ourselves up and make ourselves presentable, none would be saved. We're all damaged goods. But God delights to use us because, as Paul says, His strength is made manifest in our weakness. This is why we must never look to others and compare ourselves to them. We must never think that anyone, even the most sincere, who claims the name "Christian" is ever anything more than a pale shadow of the glory of Jesus Christ. We can't look to men or institutions and think that we learn there who God is. We have to look to Jesus, in the Word of God, learn to see Him through eyes unclouded by the failings of our fellow Men - or even our own failings. When we do this, we will not be surprised that every Christian you'll ever meet, even the most mature, is little better than a failure. Our standard is perfection and, next to that, even the best are as nothing. But thanks be to God that He has clothed us in His righteousness, and that we do not depend on our own righteousness. And we strive to please Him now, not to earn anything from Him, but because we love Him. And we love Him because he first loved us. So, when we look at our own messiness and sinfulness and think, "HOW can God love ME?", we should remember that, if we can see our own unworthiness, how much more clearly can God see it? And yet He loved us still - enough to die for us. And THAT....is WONDERFUL. "In this is love, not that we have loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins." - 1 John 4:10
A friend of mine told me about something she read and it stuck with me. It said that when you a young, you borrow your faith from your parents, and as you grow up, you either find your own faith, or lose it all together. I found my own faith; my friend did not. She described the feeling of it as losing a friend. It was hard knowing she was going through that and being unable to do anything more for her than stand by her and listen when she needed to talk.
I wanted to thank you for sharing this because it helped give me language for the relationship with my sister. We both grew up in a Christian household, and she chose not to keep following it. I chose to stick with it in my own way. It hurts when I see our own family members go after her for it and all I can really do is let her talk and vent and stand up when I can for her. I'm glad it's not just us, and hope you and your friend are doing okay.
@@mirandahughes2312 I'm glad I was able to help. My friend is doing well. She married an amazing guy with a similar religious background who worships the ground she walks on and moved to another town. We keep in contact, but long, introspective conversations about faith and changing beliefs are best to have in person, so we haven't had any in a while.
Not knowing what you believe in isn't knowing yourself less, being honest with yourself and being able to admit that you don't know what you believe in is knowing yourself more than if you were trying to lie to yourself that you had kept your belief in something when you know you have lost faith. Not that I'm saying you knew yourself less when you were a practicing (church-going) christian, you knew yourself then I think as well as you do now, you perhaps just don't have that anchor-point and it's up to you if you want to affirm to yourself a belief in something or not. Regardless, fair sailing on this continuing voyage of self discovery we call life.
My favorite parts were Lydia's by far. Seeing the origin of Gilead, and the choice to survive and grab what limited power is available for women was captivating and horrifying.
As someone who really dislike a handmaid's tale you convinced me to go pick up the testaments. Not to be super weird about it but I'm going to pray for whatever is going on in your personal life, as someone who's going through something somewhat similar.
That book sounds really intresting and I really want to read it but I live in Poland and I don't think I could make it through this book without crying all the time.
@@ghostnebula8805 Opposes Leftism and gets called a Nazi. Maybe look at yourself a bit harder, if your only reply to someone mentioning the destruction of western civilisation is, "Oh they must be a Nazi". Pathetic.
Ok so the profound part is the ego death, the shaking of your self identity, who you think you are. Specifically deconstructing institutional religion i kinda think has been done since the dawn of time. people whining about rich or hypocrite priests etc has probably been a feature since before written history was even a thing.
It's funny because I enjoyed The Handmaid's Tale a lot, but found myself struggling to get through The Testaments. I'm glad it resonated with you. Take care!
I got it as a gift and its sat on my shelf for awhile. I heard it was very YA. And 9 out of 10 times YA disappoints me now days. People don't realize how falling out of faith effects us. It is very much like loosing your longest loyal friend. Its a deep and difficult battle. Its really hard to rationalize life when you leave faith behind. Its hard. It can keep you up at night. And it gets terrifying. Utterly dreadfully, terrifying.
Thank you for this. Truly. When I lost my faith, it wasn't a sudden thing either, just a gradual awakening and slow realization that an epiphany or anything like that. Also I just got into Goodreads too, it is so fun!
It's so interesting hearing a review like this that's so different from my own opinions on and experience of reading this book. Thank you for sharing how you related to it personally - I realise that must have been tough, but it's really cool to see a more intimate understanding of that element of the story. The Testaments wasn't a book I particularly enjoyed (and I really liked The Handmaid's Tale), but it's fascinating to see the value that others found in it where I couldn't.
Hmm... Losing my faith was more... liberating for me... as a teen that didn't yet know she was trans... losing my faith freed me from giving the harmful dogma any weight
On the topic off systemic evil: "Down there - he said - are people who will follow any dragon, worship any god, ignore any inequity. All out of a kind of humdrum, everyday badness. Not the really high, creative loathsomeness of the great sinners, but a sort of mass-produced darkness of the soul. Sin, you might say, without a trace of originality. They accept evil not because they say yes, but because they don't say no." - Terry Pratchett
This review hit me, it looks like I'll have to add this to my list. I relate so strongly to that description of a gradual loss of deeply-ingrained faith.
I grew up in an extremely religious community and family. I deep down always knew I didn't believe but I went along because we were told that non believers were evil and influenced by the devil. It was around the time that I was also 25 that I was ok with openly telling people that I stopped believing. I remember right before this a friend and I spoke and she told me to leave religion behind, but for a while I told her I wasn't ready to be this new person. Once I was ready it was like shedding old skin that I had outgrown. Good luck Tim. I hope you discover these answers for yourself, because truly only you can.
I've never stopped believing. Almost fell into this trap until I saw the same people telling me over and over and over that I was stupid for believing in non sense, fall into their own insanity. Promoting Pedophilia as normal and other madness. When the so called Bible thumpers can answer what a man or a woman is, while "professionals" are terrified of such a question because of backlash over a reality not even early Americans questioned. You start to re evaluate your life and realized who the real gas lighters are.
Thanks for the candor Tim, you didn’t have to do that but I appreciate that you did. This is my first time poking around on the second channel, I’m looking forward to checking out more. I don’t know if this would be of any benefit to you. But but when I was 25 and on my journey out of my parents’ version of Christianity and into my own world view it helped me to have someone to talk to who didn’t have any stake in my life. As in they didn’t know me before and wouldn’t be around after. They had no reason to push me one way or the other. They didn’t know my family or my friends so there was no apprehension or fear of causing offense or negative consequences or in our conversations. I had been raised in such a bubble for so long that even bringing it up to anyone I knew felt like it might be taken as a betrayal. So if you ever need a stranger who is willing to listen but has no reason to push you one way or the other and will be more honest than the echo chamber of a comment section or Twitter post: I’m literally the only me on the internet. I’m real easy to find.
Not having an answer is perfectly fine, even though it can feel scary at times. [. ] I don't know. It is an honest reply, an honest statement. Life is just one long journey of learning/discovery and *change.* We will never have the definitive answers. And most importantly, You are not alone. Others have been where you are now. I have heard that talking to and listening to others who lost their faith and how they found themselves again, does help. I wish you well in your journey. ................. Also I do enjoy listening to your book and game reviews. ♥️♥️♥️
Tbh I didn't like the Testaments while I really liked The Handmaid's Tale. But you've helped me see it in a new light and I might try picking it up again some day.
This does make me want to read The Testaments. I know how it feels when a book hits you in a particular way because it happens to mirror something you're grappling with at the time. It doesn't even have to be a great book to speak to you, although it helps when it is.
Leaving the Catholic faith, or having the courage to keep going, took a out 10 years to resolve. The hardest part was how people turned on me for no reason other than I was no longer Christian. Drifting outcast I finally found a new faith in myself.
This is my experience tbh. When I was 13 I only knew Christianity, it defined me as a person, it encompassed my mind and heart. Not in the good way, I used it to tell myself horrible things. To scrutinize my identity under the standards of the Scripture, thay if I was just more faithful, more devout, God would make me no longer queer. He would make me normal, I wouldn't be neurodivergent anymore, I wouldn't feel this pent up anger and emotions. It was slow at first, but over the course of a bit more than two years I began to fight back against the doubts in my head with more faith, more devotion, I became less me and more Christian Boy. The Churches, youth groups, all of different denominations encouraged this, I was the Bible Kid, I spat vitriolic hatred to those around me, threw the Scripture at them as if it was the only thing I had. Until it started to fade, and I couldn't fight any longer. It was like a being put into cold water, slowly, no shock. Just ebbing realization going past skin, into muscle tissue, and finally to bone. I wasn't me anymore, I chased away anyone who wasn't like me and surrounded myself with people like me or even worse than me. It was a journey, one which I still am I taking. I'm now a pagan and openly queer, and I feel more me again. But I'm not fully me yet, I'm only 18 and I feel like I would take many more years of this path I chose to walk. I don't even remember me, maybe I'm someone new, who knows.
I really like this book and I'm writing a thesis about it, your review helps me a lot. Your accent is charming but i don't quite understand. So i would like to thank you and the subtitle. lol
@@xipietotec his destruction of humanity may have less to do with his aspergers than the state of humanity in that book, but this is not the whole story. He plans to replace humanity with something, and this is where his aspergers becomes problematic: “Crake uses his prominent position to create the Crakers, peaceful, gentle, herbivorous humanoids, who have sexual intercourse only during limited polyandrous breeding seasons.” (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oryx_and_Crake) I grant you the beginning is innocent enough, however the Crakers having sexual intercourse only during limited polyandrous breeding seasons might not have been written so explicitly in a novel with a neurotypical Crake.
"Two things I ask of you; deny them not to me before I die: Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and say, “Who is the LORD?” or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God." - Proverbs 30:7 - 9 Success can tend to shake ones faith, as one begins to believe that one doesn't NEED God. It's also worth noting that we in the West live in a scientistic (NOT scientific) society. In other words, we tend to think that science as an enterprise has ALL the answers to EVERYTHING, and everything around us tends to reinforce this idea. On top of that, all the "noise" in our lives doesn't often leave us the head space to think deeply about the big questions, so we tend to farm out the thinking on those subjects to "experts", and simply accept their conclusions. But if one can take the time to think clearly and rationally about the world, one is led inescapably to the conclusion that there IS a God. And if one continues along that same path of reason, one will be led inescapably to the knowledge of exactly WHO that God is, and what He wants. Sadly, many times, those who start down that path, upon realizing where it will lead, what it will require of them, and what it will cost them, turn back and reject the knowledge. After all, the first, and to this day fundamental, temptation of Man is that, "ye shall be as gods". We don't want a God outside of ourselves, we want to BE God. We want to be the arbiter of our own morality and the ruler of our own universe, and we demand that everyone around us recognize us as such and treat us accordingly. Just look at our world today. Acknowledging who God is and submitting to Him would cost us that. After all, what God demands is that we surrender our pretensions to godhood and recognize HIM as God. For many people, that is just too high of a cost. But we fail to understand that, though the cost is everything we have, the reward is everything God has. Because we don't truly understand what that means, we refuse to open our hands, let go of the little we think we have, and receive the infinite riches God has for us.
Here is my offering to the algorithm: Tim's video made me really want to read the Testaments, despite not having read anything by Atwood. (As I write this comment, my copy of a Handmaiden's Tale glares at my from my bookshelf. Sorry.) I've had a weird aversion to reading Atwood books because they was part of the reading list we were forced to read in high school. 90% of my class (myself included) decided not to read the list because we thought it was either very boring or too long (30 - 35 books over 4 months? No thank you, Mr Brown.) Might pick it up now.
I have had a kind-of similar experience with Christianity, and I really related when you said "when people ask 'hey what do you believe now', I don't really have an answer". It is definitely very confronting, as you say, to be faced with not knowing an answer to a question about who you are. One thing I've thought about at times, is that it just being asked can feel like there is pressure to *have an answer*, as if you *should* have the answer, that there's something wrong for not having the answer. But I also feel, at least from my perspective, that there's nothing wrong with not having all the answers about yourself. Heck - maybe there isn't even "an answer" in that way. I think, despite how pressuring it can feel, "I don't really know" is always a fine answer for anything you're asked about yourself.
Hey just wanted to say thanks for commenting this. I’ve also struggled with these same issues, but I’ve never known how to voice them. You’ve really put this into perspective for me. Cheers.
Wow, okay, way to convince me instantly that I should immediately purchase and read this book, xD. Honestly, Tim, I don’t even know how my life in the writing and reading world would be without you and your channel. Thank you
"With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil - that takes religion."- Steven Weinberg
@@mannyoftheeast3318 well this quote is more about blind faith. A true believer can, with conviction, take actions that can be harmful to others or support leaders who make harmful choices while sincerely trying to be a good person. They don't always knowingly harm others in ways that from an outside perspective can seem evil. They can simply do what they blindly believe to be good without question or doubt, and as a consequence of thinking themselves to be good, without remorse.
I'm so glad to hear I'm not the only one who didn't really like The Handmaids Tale but did like The Testaments. Maybe it's the differing perspectives but I found this one more compelling. Personally, I preferred Agnus's perspective over everyone else's. Aunt Lydia's story was really interesting but there was something about hearing the passing years of growing up in Gilead and how Angus's treatment changed as she went from a girl to a woman in the eyes of that society. I also didn't care much for Jade/Daisy, though that might have something to do with how she was read in the audiobook version I listened to.
Disillusionment but not being able to let go of the faith one grew up with reminds me of Transcendent Kingdom by Yaa Gyasi. I don't know if it would be your cup of tea, but I loved this book.
Your review of this is very pacific thought-provoking I like the quotes that you picked out and the structure of society and the indoctrination and root of beliefs but at the end it’s still very ambiguous and makes you think doesn’t it
There is a difference in believing in a higher power & attending & being a part of an institution (church). I couldn’t get thru life without my belief in God.. but I wouldn’t step foot in a church!
I hope you are going to be oké. In the end, I even think you will be. You look like an smart guy, and soud wise beyond your years (I hope that didn't sound dramatic) But you also look like you are worring a lot/not sleeping well. I realy hope/think you'l get true this, so good luck! En vooral, sterkte
P.s. a very close frend with PTSD is coming home tomorrow from weeks of treatment. I'l be there for him, as I hope there'l be some there one for you. Zo niet: dan des te meer sterkte!
I very much liked this video, thank you for making it! It made me feel a bit motivated to share something that might be a bit tangential to the review of the book, but was brought on by Tim's own story of his faith. BEFORE I CONTINUE: This is not directed at anyone. I am not calling anyone out. Some of the things I say, I say to give anyone who reads it something to think about. If you feel insulted by any of it, I am very sorry, I my goal was not to offend. The people I wish I could speak to with this comment will probably drop off halfway through and hate me. For the rest, best of wishes to you all. I am personally faithful, have had plenty of doubts, and have asked plenty of questions. My position is not one I hold out of ignorance. I want to start there for honesty, so anyone reading knows where I stand. I am not here to preach, or to argue for being faithful. There are plenty of mediocre faithful people out there, and I would be happy enough if they where honest and let it go, for their own wellbeing, if nothing else. There are also plenty of bad, immature faithful people who I really wish would read their own book and learn to be more... self reflective. Wherever you are in your journey, I wish you the best. The first thing I want to say; it makes sense that anyone, when they start to grow more independent as a person or start to develop their own feelings and thoughts on portions of their life, that the things they stay active in pursuing will become more understood and mature with them, and the things they cease to be active with will either fade away or remain immature or underdeveloped. If your faith is one of those things you do not actively pursue, fair enough, but please do not misconstrue lack of pursuit with the faith being untenable. I believe this is an issue of a lack of maturity in understanding, not a problem with the system itself. Why do people leave (IMO, of course)? The way other (another comment called them 'messy' and I like that word) the way other, messy, people practice what they *believe* their faith says. I believe it is people with less honesty about who they are and what they believe, taking what they THINK their faith has told them to do, and acting it out ignorantly. It is this ignorance to faithful people's own beliefs that I want to highlight as I say the following: I see and hear a lot of deconstructions of faith and stories of leaving a faith behind. They are all focused on the personal journey away, the disillusionment with what they thought a faith was, slowly crumbling. They focus on how a faith is a system that exists to subjugate and control. The idea that the faith could instead be a system meant to do good, being misused, is never or rarely put forward. It seems to always be an assumption that even if the faith lead to good things at some point, it's ultimate end is to be deconstructed and left behind. I very much disagree with this inherent assumption, and I want to caution others about it as well. At the very least, I want to shine a light on it. What I have found in my own questioning is a system of belief that is deep, hard to understand, and sometimes infuriating in what I still fail to understand about it. However, I have not found a system trying to subjugate and control people. I have found a construction, formed by people (and if you believe, guided by God) trying to mature us and make us better as individuals to other individuals. What I also see are immature people taking that faith and twisting it to their own ends. Misusing and misquoting, or just ignoring the spirit of the faith they follow, to spit vitriol and hatred that is only rooted in their own hearts and their own immaturity. It is these people who should draw our Ire, not the system they have bastardized. I hope that my novel of a comment gives anyone something to think about. It was somewhat rambling, that is my weakness, I apologize for it. For those of you who are losing your faith, or have already lost it, I wish you all the best. Truly, I hope your lives are fuller and more fulfilling without the burden placed on you. For those who are struggling, I am sympathetic, I urge you to hang in there. For those who are faithful and confident, keep striving, and keep learning. And to everyone, thank you for being you. My TLDR, if I have one, would be this: Systems are not evil, People are evil. The faith is a system, not the people who believe in it.
no offence but im not really sure how much this comment makes sense in context of a book that's about systemic oppression. you can say systems aren't evil, but i mean, gilead's version of christianity should be described as unethical at the very least. it's a bastardization, sure, but by the time the book begins it's still already made a permanent impact on how giladeans understand their faith. evil people designed this to happen, sure-- they unjustly weaponized religion, sure-- but it's not like it can be undone. it can only be destroyed, so that nothing but the unbastardized version is left. that's why characters in the testaments go through a loss of faith: because their faith was never organic. it was a lie manufactured by evil men to help them gain power. and besides, the lie doesn't even make them lose all their faith; it only makes them lose their faith in gilead. because gilead *is* the lie. gilead *is* the system of faith they were taught. and it's a system that only requires innocent people not to know any better; a theocratic belief system, designed to be self sustaining. of course the natural trajectory of the book's characters was to lose faith in it! they were actively being victimized by it! i say all this because, again, i just don't understand the point of your comment in the context of the testaments as a story. it's not trying to demonize faith, or say that it inherently must be eventually deconstructed or lost. in fact, i'd argue that the book never really even gets close to saying that.
@@TheRandomzcookie That is a fair comment, because what I posted was not a comment on the book itself, but on a section of the video. I was not intending to comment on the book or it's circumstances. Admittedly, I have not read it, but recognized in Tim's description a lot of the same trajectory of ideas I hear in other places. My comment was a response to that trajectory, and not meant to be more than a passing musing for anyone who might find it interesting or helpful. The subject itself is what motivated me to post that, not the book or it's specific story. To that, I apologize if it appears that I'm using the subject to inject or add something too tangent to it's material. Being honest, I recognize that impulse in what I wrote. At the same time, I felt that if what I wrote was helpful or insightful to someone, then I might as well just post it and see what happens. Then, let the algorithm do it's work. To speak to your own comment, and specifically about the loss of an inorganic faith; I can very much agree with that representation, and hope that I left room for a loss of inorganic or ingenuine faith in my comment before. That was my point, ultimately, that people who have malformed faith should lose or re-examine it, and that makes perfect sense. What I am worried about, and what my comment is chiefly about, is the meta-textual insinuation (or: potential interpretation) that current religion (primarily Catholicism in the west, but does not have to be.) is already, in the current time, the bastardized version the book is representing. I am not saying definitively that it is or isn't, , nor am I saying that what we have today could not become that, I am only trying to caution against the idea what what exists today definitively is. To be the most candid I can, I am worried at the number of comments that lean towards a loss of faith as the inevitable answer to any question posed to religion. That religion has no answers, and the only direction is for someone to lose their faith. I worry about that because I see it outside in the world at large, and because it is a question I wrestle with myself, and have no good answer for, but also deeply believe giving up is the wrong impulse to follow. All I know is that if I give up on the question, I will never find a satisfactory answer. And if everyone gives up on the question, then it drifts into obscurity. If it is doomed to obscurity, then my shouting into the void will not affect it's trajectory in the least. But, if there is something there worth merit, then maybe I spark that in someone. Again, I apologize for my more than likely self indulgent post, this is something that weighs heavily on my mind. When I posted my previous comment, I decided I wanted to say something, rather than stay silent. Beyond that, I concede that this can only be what others interpret it as. My best wishes to all who have read this far, thank you.
I do believe you don’t have to like the book in order to -need- to read it. This seems to be that kind of book. I can’t imagine myself rereading The Handmaid’s Tale but it did help me grow. Your review made me feel like I should start gearing up to read the Testaments.
The quote you read sounds like my de-conversion in a nutshell. I thought I was going to suffocate when I lost my faith. It was a part of me that died suddenly - there was no withering away until it fell away. In the end, I'm glad it happened; I'm glad I had the strength and wherewithal to continue the path through the frightening abyss of "now what?" That happened when I was 18 or 19 years old. I lost a semester at college and had to move universities. Now, at 35, I look back on that horrid day and smile. I am the person I'm supposed to be.
Amusing that you liked this better than the original (The Handmaid's Tale), because I had the exact opposite reaction. The Testaments read to me like a YA novel. The Nicole character is able to infiltrate Gilead easier than water through a sheave. She is essentially neo Katniss. Aunt Lydia is presented as never having believed in Gilead's religion/mission (the television series depicts her motivation so much better and presents a far deeper portrayal). And Agnes is just there to be a victim. This book struck me as superficial in plot , dialogue, and world building, whereas HT showed how easily a secular nation can slip into theocracy during times of trouble and the toll it takes upon its citizens. I would advise anyone to skip this novel and stick w/HT and the series, which are both interesting and chilling.
Religious belief is what humans have created in order to find answers for things we didn't understand in the past, ;like the weather. Surely there was an angry god up there throwing thunderbolts at us. Of course we now know that is not true. It probably also provides a degree of comfort for people who are afraid of dying. WE all all. But I prefer to face dying truthfully even though it means nothing will happen after death, than to cling to a wishful dream.
It ain't a wishful dream. I have given up on putting faith in humanity. When you realise that we have built a world where one dictator can end it all. Nothing you do matter at large except your own little sphere the dictator couldn't care less. You know what's more powerful than Human Rights? Nuclear weapons. Its the reason Human Rights court have never gone after Nuclear wielding violators of human rights. What good are human rights or the paper its written on if you are dead? What good is it to the dead? That's why they go after weaker African Nations for human rights violations. Its already a lost cause trying to get Nuclear power countries to surrender to a court with no means of enforcement.
Agreed. In simple stories it is easy to say look that the bad guy/gal behind all this, when in real life it is more pervasive and nuanced. I think the Testiment would be an interesting book for me to read.
I wish I'd seen this video when it was new. Deconstructing one's faith is a hard thing to go through. For a while, you will definitely feel adrift and not sure how to move on. But you can and will make it through the other side, likely stronger than before. It took me years to fully leave my cracked and painful relationship with my then faith behind...But I emerged better, more mentally healthy, and more moral than I was as a christian. No longer was I an anxious wreck terrified of offending a god, afraid that I deserved only scorn and doom. No, I had become someone who understood that I have value beyond my ability to believe, someone who understands that if this life is all we have then we owe it to one another to make it as good as possible. And I do good now purely because I want to. Because I think it makes the world better. Not because someone told me to do it, or because I'm afraid of punishment if I don't. Deconstructing is hard, and often painful and confusing... But it's not the end. It's just another beginning. Edit: If religion works for anyone reading this, I'm happy for you. It just didn't for me. That's how life is sometimes.
It didn't for you because of the exact same problem I kept hearing Everytime I hear these stories I can never understand them because it sounds like they were completely reading from a different script. No matter how many people say their piece. It sounds the exact same with the exact same reasoning. Same problems leading to the same results. 10 different people with the exact reasoning of leaving their faith. I have seen plently of people become more moral after being a Christian. In some cases, in ways that defy human reason. General Butt naked aka Joshua Milton Blahyi. The most infamous conversion case. His story from Warlord Canibalism to Preacher who want to establish a War crime Justice court in his country is...unbelievable to say the least. I'm certain most prominant atheist thinkers would have agreed killing him at any point would be the most moral thing if you read what he did before. And yet here he is, captured in documentaries and recently documented on YT to where he's working for a War Crimes justice council but facing resistance because most of everyone in power are technically war criminals. I don't expect anything from this comment. I'm just tired of the brow beating against Christians. There is nothing brave about taking a position that's accepted and praised in society.
@@silverhawkscape2677 Did I really come across as "brow-berating"? If so, I'm sorry? I guess my description of how my mental health was rough as a christian, but not as rough as an atheist seemed like an attack? If it was taken as one, I'm sorry, that was not intended, I just have some raw emotions there about the harm I caused myself in that state. My intent was to offer an empathetic comment to someone who was going through the same painful, difficult process as I was, and to assure them that things do get better, and they can (and likely still will) be just as good and moral as they were before they deconstructed. And I'm sure there are people who became more moral after converting. That's something people come to expect. But there's a lot of people out there who claim you can't be moral and not be religious, which is a harmful stereotype. Hence why I addressed it. I understand that you don't understand my experience. That's fine. That's how humans are. Our experiences can be radically different based on how we were raised, how our brains work, etc. There are plenty of people whose experiences seem alien to me. Finally to your last line about it "not being brave to take an accepted position" ... It really depends where you are in the world. In some places, atheism is accepted or praised. In others being an atheist can be heavily vilified.
@@AegixDrakan I highly doubt you were in those places. Most Westerners are privileged to believe they are brave for taking accepted positions. Not like your experiences are unique. It's a repeated script at this point when you hear the same thing from ten people. And all it paints is a different world most people don't see.
@@silverhawkscape2677 I mean, I never claimed I was brave for not being a believer? Just that de-converting is a difficult process for a lot of people.
I don’t know if it is the truth but I feel like Buddhism is a nice evolution from the ideas surrounding Christianity. If you really look into, it covers ideas that have only recently been discovered in quantum physics and neuroscience, such as emptiness of matter and no-self, respectively.
No. Buddhism is BS. Ask other atheist and you'll find several different answers on Buddhism. Worst if you start asking the people from India where Buddhism originated.
Yes - I've just finished The Testaments and I found it brilliant and utterly Humane. BTW I've just watched review of it - which really amused me. Check out some of the other reviews and you might recognise that one. I could easily imagine Aunt Lydia dryly remarking on youthful attention spans & high spirits, if she were to come to life and see it. LOL 😉 ps. Is Aunt Lydia a baddie or is she a survivor who does what she can (within extremely narrow bounds) to ameliorate Gilead?
I have faith in nature, art and beauty. Nature is all around us, and though it can cause problems, it is magical and miraculous on many fronts. The most dangerous people are those who have faith in technology and AI. They live in a very small bubble, are usually socially dysfunctional, and are disconnected from nature or any deeper reality..
Hey man, I think I know how you feel when people ask what you believe in now. You just don’t have a label for the way you are without a religion to define you. There are other forms of thought that have been given a name like Zen. I recommend looking at Zen and perhaps listening to Alan Watts and stoic philosophers from ancient times.
The way of zen is without doctrine or real definition. It’s whatever you feel it is… or that’s what’s I’ve gathered so far~ seems very go-with-the-flow to me
Wow, I super appreciated your perspective on religion as someone who was indoctrinated with it for their entire life. As someone who grew up in a secular environment with almost no religious teaching, I feel there lives the deepest mystery as to the powerful hold religion holds over humanity. Is it a fundamental part of the human condition? Where is religion going, and what will it look like into the future, should humanity somehow manage to survive itself and continue to advance in all of the sciences. I wish I understood the compulsion towards religion better, simply because for whatever the reason, I just don't have it inside myself. Sometimes I wish I did, as I can imagine it could be very comforting, but it is simply not a door that is open to me. Anyway, thanks for making this video.
It's really rude to suggest that all people who grew up with religion are indoctrinated. Yes, some are, but some aren't. Some people come to religion on their own, later in life. Or it's a part of their life, but not pushed on them by elders - they have a choice to stay or go. I say this as someone who also grew up in a Christian household and lost my faith in my early 20's. It's really dehumanizing to be called 'indoctrinated', especially if you've never held similar beliefs, many of which were actually a positive influence. Even if we choose to leave them, as the text said, it's like a part of you - a core belief that helped give life more meaning - has died. But you are no less intelligent or 'you' than you were before you changed your mind.
To me she feels similar, tho I saw the series before I read eighter book. I actually believe there has been a bit of mutual influence. The excellent performance of the actress portraying Aunt Lydia must have influenced how Atwood wrote her, while Aunt Lydia's arc in the 4th season is reminiscent of Aunt Lydia in the book. I could believe TV Lydia to take a big spoilery part of the plot, in a similar role book Lydia has in her plot. The other characters would probably be different, but maybe not so much. The fact that Atwood herself is part of the production team behind the TV series might also explain the similarities.
Great review, Tim, but (spoiler alert) I found myself unconvinced by the deus ex machina ending to this book, if we accept it as following the TV series. The redemption of Cdr Lawrence in the latter was more plausible because he was a “head in the clouds” theoretician uncomfortable with the real impact of his work, whereas Aunt Lydia was so embedded in the brutal mistreatment of individual women that it’s hard to believe she suddenly decides to sacrifice herself to save them. I found Oryx and Crake a better read.
The whole point with Lydia was that to get power and hold it, and also to be unassailable was that she had to be convincing. I don't think you understood the book properly if you don't get that. She learned from her experience at the stadium that if you expose your real feelings then you die, and she made a choice after that torture. She was a very clever woman, and knew that to beat the system she had to play along, otherwise she would have been suspected and caught. That's not Deus ex machina, that's the long game that was hidden from us
Further to this, by being part of early Gilead, she was able to create loopholes in the system that would help her later on, by creating a 'woman's sphere' that the men couldn't enter and giving the aunts an enclave where she ruled meant that all the things she did went unnoticed by the commanders
@@eleanormason2647 well maybe it’s a veeeerrrry long game (brutally abuse thousands of women in order to save more in the future), but I think you’re inferring too much there. I found that turn of the plot unconvincing, anyway.
@@nf6386 well, it is a long game. It's unrealistic that you can gather enough evidence to topple a whole government and military force in a year or two, and even more unrealistic that it could be done entirely from the outside. She operated from the inside, heading the whole of mayday and the 'underground femaleroad' whilst maintaining an image of repute and respect that no commander would ever suspect. Had she not been so powerful she could have ended up in the colonies or executed, and then you have no high up inside contact. Without her, Gilead would have remained in power for so many more years to come. We don't know, potentially hundreds of years since they had a very strong military and neighbouring countries that didn't want to pick a fight with such a powerhouse. This way it toppled within a lifetime. I think it's naive to argue that she's done too much bad, whereas if she hadn't, then she could have had her power taken by one of the founding aunts, which again means farewell to the revolution. Don't get me wrong, I hated aunt Lydia before reading the testaments, but all of her actions take on a new meaning when you consider the outcome- and from what I remember of the book, I think the TV series played up some of the/ created new acts of cruelty (for example there was no burning their hands over a gas stove in the book).
@@eleanormason2647 okay, well I’m glad you found it so persuasive. I just didn’t. The whole “greater good”/“just following orders” argument is morally ambiguous in real life, at least, and surely intentionally so in this book.
I still believe in the bible, but I don't go to church anymore and donxt really wan't to support it anymore, because it does feel like the Church is nit what it is supposed to be, more an institution stuck in its ways than a group of believers working together for what they believe in
Good for you. You don't need faith to give your life meaning or purpose. Find your own, or accept that there is none. It's okay for nihilism - the original meaning - to be the answer. It seems to me that, unlike me, you didn't become a jaded cynic early in life after being raised by an abusive, alcoholic, cult-happy parent or suffering truly sociopathic levels of harassment in school. But it's okay; the world is a nightmarish place sometimes, and faith is doing nothing more than making people feel better about it - it fixes nothing.
I feel that religion in general is unethical, but I'm not sure that nihilism is the answer to your life's meaning in and of itself. Even if life has no objective meaning, as Nihilism is often understood, I don't think that stops our development of subjective meaning. I'm not convinced that you could continue to live if you think that there was no subjective meaning at all. I don't think philosophical nihilism makes that claim. Perhaps I misunderstand your point, though.
Thanks for the review! I enjoyed The Testaments too, a lot more than the Handmaid's Tale. I admit I was curious how you were able to deconstruct fictional religions, beliefs and worlds so well, understand the history, psychology and geopolitics of how religions come to be well enough to discuss how to invent new ones in fictional worlds...and still be religious. I hope you find peace, personal meaning and happiness in a worldview free of the controlling, restrictive and often bigoted aspects of organised religion. There is a lot of meaning and wonder in a universe that developed undirected, and could have developed so many other ways. Everything is so fragile and temporary and therefore (to me) beautiful. Also there are real, true answers to EVERYTHING, and the answers aren't "a wizard did it"! That's simultaneously exciting and reassuring - exciting how much there is to learn and reassuring that there are reasons and structure to things. "We" (really, "they"; scientists) just haven't found a lot of the answers yet.
I think faith is a set of tangled paths, it doesn't need to be singly defined by a building or religion, if you find faith in something and that faith brings love and happiness, allowing it purchase in your soul is usually a good thing. The answers are never black and white, anyone who says they are is probably trying to sell you coal painted like an egg.
I don't know why I should read a book about "hurr durr religion bad", I hear that every day since I was little. But I'm glad I found out you have review channel !
To be fair, the book really doesn't say that religion is bad, it just says that religion can be bad if you want to use it specifically to oppress people. One of the caracters even says that you can either believe in God from the bible or God from the regime, but not both because they do not match at all. It was surprisingly subtle ;)
@@Noeton I'll admit, I was doubtful myself before reading it. As someone who grew up religious in a secular environment I probably heard the same comments about religion as you have. I would recommend the book though, perhaps even more to those with the attitude of 'hurr durr religion bad'. It adds some overdue nuance to the debate
