Daniel "More rake is better" Negreanu will save us, no doubt Another issue is that if 5kNL+ is unbeatable, some regs might move down to 1k or 2kNL which would cause the regs in this pool to move down etc. so it potentially makes every stake below harder in a domino effect kind of way. Maybe the reg pool is the same from 1kNL and up and in that case it would not change much
Many know this there is also a videos in youtube as you can't even beat the rakes or the highest stake rakes the only ones that beat it are the pros with the site and I'm saying pros to be nice if you get my drift a few of us new this a few years ago about online poker over its just not rakes it many other factors gl play live at least you know what and who and no in the back in your mind they are not using anything of any program at all
Well, I am a fellow startup poker pro. Only been at it for around a year. Thankfully, I am a US player, so this doesn't directly affect me (yet). I feel really bad for anyone who relied on GG games to make a living. I already fear having to find new games and just can't imagine. Good luck guys, hang in there and keep your chin up. Regardless of monopoly tho, the market will likely self right as long as they lose enough business over rake increases. The nightmare situation is if people continue to play at GG despite the rake increase. If that happens more sites will follow suit.
No one feels bad for poker pros. You provide no value to society - you take, rather than giving. This is coming from someone who has played professionally.
Yeah this is tough I don't play on GG, but find their actions appalling. I wonder if you could be the man to start the poker union. I would pay $5 a month to have an organization that had my interests in mind.
No one and i mean no one should playing there! If a firm increase a Rake and basically scams all there customers, by not telling them a Word, they get no single dime from me, but we as community are so blind and have no moral in these cases. GG hasn't be like that since yesterday, but all saying ahh it's okay there playing fishes and so on, but the fact that they demand preflop rake is a huge no go for me! We should only blame ourself to let that happend
as an mtt player im lowering my volume on gg and hope players will push on social media on the sponsers players/ambasedors . this is really scary and must be changed
I heard Elky was in on the negotiations. So basically you’re saying you’d be ok with a 4 rake instead of a 7? It’s funny how all the other ambassadors are silent. I’m not a high stakes player by any means. But that rake is crazy. PLO didn’t change its take. Maybe everyone needs to go play that game. Who knows. This is very interesting to me. I’ll be following this story for sure.
The reason low stakes games are beatable despite high rake is they have far more recreationals than high stakes games. Typically, as stakes increase, both the rake and number of recreational players go down.
@@mobiuspoker Shut up with the excuses You just admitted you only did this to keep your stable happy so that's why you didn't even want to talk about helping the power guys
They are criminals. What else they have been doing regarding cheating player/bots etc is wild. I saw this player with 1.5 MM winnings, who on Sharkscope had only logged games in Microstakes and less than 100 games total. I send support an Email, next day the player was gone. I wonder what happened to that 1.5 MM. Telling you its a matter of time until the house crumbles. It just takes one whistleblower..
I've always enjoyed poker, but I could never get into the online poker scene because I just assumed every app/website is completely rigged against the average player since it's so incredibly easy to get away with.
Please understand they anticipated a boycott and don’t care. This is intentional and they won’t be backing down. There is a POSSIBILITY that they may be regulated out of business if there is a global financial crisis and they are going to grab as much money now as possible. I wish poker players would step away from solvers to evaluate the world around them. A company doesn’t intentionally make a move like this out of pure greed. This move was a fear move.
What is the link between a financial crisis and more regulation? My understanding is that governments tend to actually deregulate vice industries during/after a financial crisis in order to generate more tax revenue.
@@hschuler7892 gg probably sees the writing on the wall and if financial institutions keep crashing and getting backstopped by the fed under fed rules and regulations alot of the business they’re doing could be considered laundering and if the banks they deal with crash those books will be the demise most likely. I may be talking out my ass idk but rich people usually know shit before we do
Best comment on this whole thread. I wrote a whole diatribe of why I felt that way, but I'll save it, cause most won't listen or care anyways. No one will care about Rake on a poker site in the next few years, they'll be far more concerned with where to find a cup of rice. But most have no idea cause the Tell-lie-vision hasn't told them to care yet.
@@hschuler7892 you are 100% correct. The last recession in 2008 saw regulation around gambling soften significantly due to the amount of tax revenue contributed by gambling companies as the y do much better in recessions than during booms. The outcome of this in 2008 saw gambling being advertised on TV for the first time. Government had refused this for a decade prior to the financial crisis. The also contributed to the end of the independent bookmakers (I was a credit and hedging officer manager at this time, I took bets from other companies and helped manage the liabilities on their bets). The person who posted the comment about the financial crisis and more regulation does not know what they are talking about. Facts.
you still can step out of offline poker and go to Macau or Cyprus to play live if u dont think 200k yearly is enough, literally thats 4 buy ins in some of their tables
Would I be correct in saying that a side effect of this will be 5k regs moving down limits? which will then make lower limits infinitely harder and so on?
The rake is even worse the lower you go Poker players own fault for making this the most played site Pity they didn't care about the rake for everyone else before this It's now impossible to get the community together because everyone only cares about the stakes they play It's also hilarious players are complaining about getting targeted when it's still less than all other stakes I'd also love to know where he got that 7million hand database as that's usually scraped from sites illegally
im playing just for fun on low stakes when i have spare time so maybe my question is dumb , but why people just dont move to a software with less rake ?
we need a poker brotherhood of all players new and experienced. all on board.... stop playing till they give us fair terms. tired of this. seriously needs to be an underground movement here.All you trainers need to get together and force the poker world to make a crypto smart contract uncheatable (by the company..not the players) platform. ridiculous that poker can not get the glory it deserves as a sport, similar to chess or go...insulting imo.
Is this a guy preaching about the health of the game and at the same time someone who has manufacturing pro players and churning out lessons for maximum profit, and at the same time has a full stable of players that harvest nonstop for him ? XD
So we are scared. And moe what..... Be aware that 80% players are loosing for tears do to high rake on all sites. Ambassadors/pro/ winning players/ sites dont care. I dont think a strike of a couple of pro will help this time.
I don’t understand...rake at HS has always been proportionally peanuts compared to that of SS and MS cash games. It seems to me that even if the rake gets doubled, it still should not even move the needle regarding overall win rate since the pots won will normally trounce the tiny capped-out rake. What am I missing?
I don’t even understand why this needs organization. Any high stakes player knows 7BB is ruinous and shouldn’t play. Just don’t play-they killed the goose that laid the golden egg.
Wait so we know 5k is basically unbeatable. And 1k nl is -3.5bb/100 on average with gg'g pvi shit do the players even make money? Presuming 2knl is just as bad but like....do gg regs even make anything on 500nl 200nl 100nl as it is? Christ.
of course the average player is always loosing that what rake is, hes being a little misleading with his stats but rake increases does make it worst of course
@@michealjaymurphylike yeah the average casual gets destroyed but if this is the average reg meaning professional in some capacity at these stakes thats scary as all fuck
@@michealjaymurphy in general reg also doesnt mean recreational. i see these numbers and get scared. im assuming hes not including recs in this sample so even if there shitty regs they are still probably good players.
Not only that. Bots and collusion is really a big problem. Played about half a million hands in the last 6 months on apps and I am running roughly 300 stacks under ev at plo. Fkn shit times
I mean, the crushing regs at these stakes profited a few million last year on GG. The way the games run right now is that one fish will sit at these stakes and 5 of the best players in the world will sit immediately to slaughter the fish, the higher rake makes it so that maybe now 2 or 3 fish would have to sit at the table for a game to be profitable for a pro. this creates a more fun experience for the fish and encourages them to deposit more money into the site. it honestly makes perfect sense from a business standpoint from GG, after all, why would they care if anyone could actually profit from the games, they get their rake and have a business while providing entertainment like all other gambling games. its basically a courtesy by sites/casinos to allow poker to be profitable after rake
More rake doesn't "create a more fun experience for the fish". The fish also pays rake and just loses money faster. Everybody loses except gg. Makes sense for people to go to other sites
@@nardinitPokerStars is not n1 poker site only because they excluded many countries... If PokerStars is available in my country i would never play at GG...
Yeah I second, professional players provide liquidity in games. Without them, the recreational players do not always have a game whenever they want to play, and eventually get bored of waiting for games, and stop trying to deposit money. So its a give and take thing between pros and sites.
I've seen a lot of videos lately going on about how GG poker is rigged to get more rake from the pot by creating action and not by randomization. Being that i live in the US, i don't play on GG poker but i do play or lesser known websites like Ignition and ACR. Which makes me doubt them even more. Recently I have been playing more live games because of this notion. THEY HAVE TO BE REGULATED SOMEONE.
i don’t think its a fair assumption to assume they are going to just raise the rake at lower stakes, high stakes has never been and never will be a profitable game for sites its an advertising budget, sites would much rather players loose slowly at lower stakes where they can be retained to play sports betting and pit games
How is high stakes not profitable for the site? Even at the old rake rate of 4.02bb/100 they were raking like $100/hr (2bb per hour assuming low estimate of 50 hands per hour). I’m sure they make more overall rake from 50NL etc because of higher volume but I can’t see how they’re losing money hosting 5Knl.
@@maxrosgen5712 opportunity costs They can actually rake more if that fun player plays lower stakes for longer which they will High stakes cost the sites money hence why I and others call it advertising
@@michealjaymurphy I agree it’s definitely advertising but even at 1bb/hr in rake, it surely doesn’t cost GG $50/hr to host the internet bandwidth required for one high stakes poker table. Some of these regs are paying $200k+ in rake a year and there’s no way it costs GG 200k a year to host those tables.
i agree... this game is supposed to be played live... all of this multitabling and solvers and so forth... u just have to play a ton and study with solver and wait for the score to hit... wtf is that?!... so souless and boring... and it obviously opens up doors to all sorts of scams and schemes etc. it has killed the essence of the game. plus its much much more fun and enjoyable to play live! online poker absolutely fcking SUX
you are failing to see what they want, they dont want a site with regs that are destroying the community, they wanna get rid of the boomhunters, these so called pros that don't fight each other, only target weak players, if they want that, they have to play on GG conditions.
Online poker is rigged af." If you are "beating online poker" you are really just streaming or some type of ambassador. Thery dont let normal people win. Its all a scam. YOU HAVE TO STREAM OR BE AN AMBASSADOR or you are fucked. Dont play online poker!
Good riddance. The history of Online poker is rife with thieving Site Operators, bots, multi-accounting, account sharing, team play, and other greasy tactics. Anybody that thinks they're playing a fair game is just delusional.
Always the high stakes bum hunters cry when shit hits the fan... on micros it's 12... why not advocate that low stakes rake is lowered? How are people supposed to climb up stakes when gg takes everything from everyone.
I'm an exclusively microstakes player and it only makes sense that the rake be (relatively) lower on higher stakes. In terms of providing service, it doesn't cost the casino significantly more to run a higher stakes game. In a free market environment with healthy competition, these games should cost roughly the same as low-stakes games - which means lower rake in relation to the stakes.
@@baby_boi123 although you will probably say it's bad luck/collusion; it's the classic excuses from losing players, absolutely anything before blaming themselves. Every site has players that claim it's rigged, do the maths (although that's not your strength) if you did think about it properly you'd see why it doesn't even make sense for the sites to rig the games!
@@BWOOHAHAHAAA I don’t mind. I can still win hands against players. Higher rake is far less frustrating than these alien wizards that crush you every hand
Poker incomes are not evenly distributed. If the top players make $200k, the average pro will make maybe 10% of that if they're lucky. Given the risks involved, there is no reason to get into poker if the ceiling is this low.
@@mobiuspoker I agree. But, my comment was based on what you said starting at 12m30s. Which I think what I said stands. P.S. GG was ridiculous before and I think this shows a Money Management issue, tbh. But, what do I know😁
If you have a recreational player with a budget of $10,000 a month, it's in the site's interest to have them play $1000 or $500 NL and lose slowly, instead of blowing their buy-in in 2 hours at $5000 NL. I'm sure the site has done the math and determined that this rake change to discourage high stakes play is better for their bottom line. It's not the site's job to promote poker as a career path, their job is to maximize returns to their shareholders.
