@@LeoGibsonGtr Hey man. Depending on the IR used and this includes the kemper, the latency changes. Almost doubles if it is longer. So, you have to take this into account in any test. If the kemper profiles something long it will have more latency. And some of the profiles suck because of that. If you add effects in any of these you have to go AD-DA plus the time it takes to ...produce the effect. So yeah. Crap.
"Profilology" was a great comment. Ease of use is king. Can't wait for Tone X 2.0 with built in drives, delays, reverbs for an all-in-one solution. All units sound great. Great video as always Leo. God bless and rock on 😎🎸👍
If I understood the results of the latency test, the Kemper won with the slowest processor. So I'm assuming the algorithm is more important than the processor.
@@guitartoneSA It comes down to how software uses hardware resources, and how it is engineered. You can have strong engine in a small car but it wont make it go faster, it may flip or have other problems, but that small car with weaker engine can be faster. It come down how it is designed.
Thank you for another wonderful, informative and entertaining video comparison again Leo! I must admit, with my current pedals Im finding it harder and harder to resist the Tone X Pedal. Thanks gain!
Nice work. I had a QC pre-ordered after NDSP announced, but canceled and decided to wait for plug-in (I own many) and desktop app support. I was torn after the Tonex was announced, and your videos helped me make an informed decision. Thanks.
Thank you Leo, these vids are really well put together, thank you for your efforts!! My ToneX arrives later today 😎 can’t wait! Hope you & loved ones are well.
@@christoghost 😂 you’re right & that’s the upside but I ordered it 3wks ago & it was meant to have been delivered within 7 days (or so they said).. anyway, no drama but I can’t tell you how impatient I felt the last 2 weeks!! Like a child!! 😂 Hope you’re well
Wow! This is illuminating indeed how these devices can vary so much when it comes to latency of their stock profiling, or adding custom profiles, or pairing with other things or turning blocks on/off. I would start to ask the question, are these inexpensive pieces of gear, (NUX, Valeton, ToneX), getting as good as the expensive ones, granted with certain limitations, but for what you're paying for them, and what the average user can get out of them, so they're really really competitive in a certain scenario. Thank you as always Leo!
There is one important factor, that wasn't tested in this comparison. With Quad Cortex if you use it full potential and use both cores (Effect lines 1/2 and 3/4 in the Grid), it adds even more latency. You could test, what is the Latency if you have Amp Block on Row 1 and Cab Block on Row 3. The result will be interesting.
Leo, amazing comparison and incredible video as usual! The tone X really does the profiling really well! Small suggestion: I don’t know if you’ve heard of the free plug-in Neural Amp Modeler (NAM) but if you haven’t, I really suggest you give it a try (it sounds as good or even better than tone x if the profiling is done with enough iterations, and it’s free!)
Superb video I'm late to the TONEX and really digging it. I own own a bunch of 100 watt tube amps and at home I have been using my Kemper rack in my home studio. I recently downloaded the TONEX Max software and I'm blown away by the sound and how it feels playing. The response to playing is amazing. Now I wish I had bought the pedal and would have gotten a better deal lol oh well. The TONEX ONE will be released soon and I will get that one as I don't play with a bunch of effects anyways. The amp tone on its own is the most important. Thanks again for a great video
Another great video Leo! It is always a treat to hear your thoughts and watch your magnificent presentations. I have had my QC for about 2 months. It does so much. It is way more than I need, but a fun device to have. I do wish they would get the Desktop Application out soon. The software that comes with the ToneX seems pretty nice. Thanks again for making such great content.
After watching tons of Leo's reviews and having a Boss GT 1000 for a while, I realized it is the best value for money. And you dont need a Tonex unless anyone shows me a tone that is impossible to be exctracted from the Boss.
Amazing video as always Leo! ToneX sounds amazing! Could you please share your opinion or perhaps make a video in the future comparing the tone quality between ToneX & different modelers like Helix, Axe FX, BOSS GT 100? Thankyou!
Hey Leo, nice video..but you glance over a few big things. 1: The ToneX let's you daily in the 'right' gain' before you finish the capture. So that you have to maybe bump up the Gain on the Quad Cortex is kind of a mute point, I think you will agree? If the QC would let you do the same before finishing the Capture, I think this would make them more in line 2: The Quad Cortex let's you run let's say 8 Captures in a single preset, of your amps, cabs, boost,OD, EQ pedals. That is a Big selling piont Keep up the good work
Hi, thank you, I'm happy that you like the video! Here, I prefer not to modify any parameters after the tone capture, so that you can hear the result of the profiling procedure without my interventions. That's right about the possibility to run many captures in a single presents, and there are even many more options in the QC and also in the Kemper compared to the ToneX. But this video is not intended to be a detailed feature comparisons. It is focused on feel and the main use cases for me, for all the three units. Thank you!
You are the best reviewer of this king of gear on the web hands down Leo. Fantastic work man and you are one of the best creative guitarists on the web period. Love your work man. Hello from Australia. Does the tonex software perform as well as the pedal. Is the Tonex great for finding new sounds, dialing and fiddlings etc.? It is soooo much cheaper..where is the catch?
Thank you soooo much for this great compliment!!! Yes, the software is even better, especially if you have good DI Box and converters! As regards searching new tones, you have the ToneX net, which is kind of overwhelming...I mean there are a lot of amps / profiles...and searching for the best one / the one you like...could become a difficult task...I would say.... It is cheap, in my opinion, because it does basically just one thing, that is hosting profiles...where the other units do a lot of other things.. Thank you once more, your appreciation and feedback is very important for me!!!
Excellent points! I have a tones and I pair it w/ the TC Elctronucs Plethora x3 and that's covered everything - its a great soundsnlibe rig .. Still under 750.00 ... Thx!
Hi, actually I have not tested the cab switch off...I have tested the reverb switched on and off and the compressor switched on and off and the difference is very thin...but I didn't test the cab off... Thank you for your question...
Great video Leo. I have all three and I agree with your assessment. But the big difference is amp in the room, not with studio monitors. Thru the monitoring outputs and Kemper kones, the Kemper is far superior in feeling like playing and hearing a real amp.
Let me add that latency some up...so if you add for instance a wireless transmitter, its latency sum up to the latency of your modeller...the distance from your speaker sum up latency etc....we always have to take into consideration the overall latency of our system
Great video! The sound of your amp is perfect 👌 I like the colourful sound of TONEX. Shame about the effects, when you start stacking up the latency it puts me off a bit. Do you know the minimum latency of the TONEX plug-in through Logic MainStage? I guess it would be 6ms but I’ve never tried it. The video was excellent and I was wrong in one of my previous comments, where I said the sounds were too close to hear a difference using a phone or iPad. They were close-ish, but it’s nice to know that you can’t beat the real thing 😊
Thank you, I'm happy that you like the video! I prefer not testing latency of USB connection with a computer, because it depends from the power of the computer I use, the buffer settings etc...therefore it would not be an "objective" measurement...in my opinion. Thank you!
Excellent comparison and thoughtful presentation. I was disappointed in the latency when the ToneX was paired with the HX Stomp, as that is the combination that makes the most sense to me. Can ToneX IRs be imported into the HX Stomp, and then how good do they sound?
Thank you! As regards IRs, actually I don't know if you can download the cabinet inside the ToneX...I don't think it's possible: if someone knows, please drop here a message!
@@LeoGibsonGtr With the power of AI, I wonder if something like ChatGPT could modify a ToneX IR to work with other Modelers. It's crazy what is becoming possible with AI. Here's an Example: I recently saw a fascinating YT video called "Can ChatGPT Build A Guitar Pedal Plugin?" at ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Ra7WUfaQNrM.html Though it took a number of iterations, the results indicate that AI, like ChatGPT, is rapidly becoming a powerful tool with a wide range of applications.
Hi, thank you, I'm happy that you like the video! I have not done a direct comparison, therefore I can't tell. I would say that with both the units you can get pretty good tones, and it is quite a matter of personal preferences.
Thank you dear Leo...Tonex seems to do a better profiling job at my ears... your comments on its pros and cons are very accurate... Just would need to ask if somehow it can be paired with amplitube 5 and an ipad for using it's effects and post effects along with the Tonex preamp? Also for example I'd like to switch the tonex off and times for example in order to use the Amplitube dimebag CFH or Brian May programs which are way better than what you can have in fractal or QC if available as far as I know.... Also amplitube variety of effects is huge so I'd like to use tonex together with amplitube 5... Thanks again Leo....
You are welcome!! I think you can directly use the ToneX plugin in the iPad doing the thinks you are mentioning here. But I'm not 100% sure, as I have not tried myself...for sure an interesting topic... Thank you!
Kemper still has the best ecosystem..For instance, the Kemper Kabinet does FRFR and amp in the room....In addition, it has the inbuilt power amp (for the powered models) and the richest selection of profiles.
It's important to adresse the fact that around 5 ms of latency is totally ok by considering this: when you stand in front of your full analog amplifier with no effects at a DISTANCE of 3,5 meters, you already have 10ms of LATENCY DUE TO THE SPEED OF SOUND.
Yes, you have to take into consideration the latency of your whole rig...for instance you may have wireless trasmitters, maybe digital devices, or you maybe be far from the speakers...all these devices add latency. Thank you!
after testing the Axefx,Kemper,QC and Tonex,to me Kemper still the King,im still working on the QC but i really liked the captures,Fractal is a pretty great unit too i prefer to use the Kemper,Tonex sound good there is not doubt,all of those devices are pretty good just use what make you happy to play
As a pro in a wedding band, I'm on a clean rhythm sound for 90% of a gig. Otherwise, you just need a Crunch 1, Crunch 2, Clean boost (solo) and Big Rock solo. Five presets in total and I'm solid for anything. On my axe fx I also use a "virtual capo" for 1/2 down when needed (MAYBE one song ever) and delay for ambiance, but both of those are just luxuries of my A rig and not needed to make money. You should be able to do anything you need w/o delay even in a wedding band.
In the video, the only appearance of the Tonex plugin the sound seems to be slightly muffled from the Tonex hardware sound. Do they both sound equally good in the studio or is there one option better than the other?
Hi, I have compared the ToneX plugin to the ToneX Pedal here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Z1w8PHa8LDU.html I was also interested in this question... Thank you!
I like the idea of tonex wish Kemper would had done it years ago. Latency could be an issue when pairing it with other effects bc of thr conversions each pedal can sum. When comparing it to Kemper…the profile seemed cleaner in the tonex but doesn’t it take 30+ minutes to capture in the tone x vs less than a min in the kemper?
Yes, but obviously it takes time..the Mooer GE Labs app works on iPad and needs totally different connections with my audio gear to make profiles, which is time consuming...I need time to do it. Thank you!
I love it but.. next year we might have a tonex with more fx capabilites and then another one with more dsp .. and we will end up like the mobile phone industry ..
Sorry for posting two links without comments. The first might be interesting if you know a bit about dsp-programming and own a quad cortex. The second might be interesting if you wondering about AI vs traditional dsp-programming.
Dear Leo, thank you very much! I have a two question, if possible - what is your opinion?: 1. I am using using iOS tonex app with other iOS fx effects (eventide and ect..) but I can’t compare my staff with real tonex pedal - Can you compare tonex ios app with real pedal? 2. Is it possible to make high quality sound guitar processor from iPad m2 with Apollo audio interface and wireless boss footswitch and pedal? Or quad cortex is better than my idea? Thank you!
Hi, you can do what you are saying and you can obtain great results. I would just say that I would not use this setup for live playing, as it is less "reliable" than an amp modelling pedalboard that is built just for playing...an iPad can do many thinks...Furthermore with an amp modelling pedalboard you just have one unit, where with an iPad you have to connect more devices and each of them can fail. Thank you!
HI, I test latency for external devices through their analog ports. In my opinion it's kind of pointless to measure latency and compare it to other devices using plugins, as it depends from how powerful it is your computer, how you set the buffer, etc. Therefore it wouldn't be a measure that could be used to compare many different devices... Thank you for your message.
Hi Leo, I haven't watched the video yet. but I noticed a typo in the title - is "best" supposed to be in there? ie: "ToneX Pedal vs Quad Cortex vs Kemper: which is the BEST profiler in the world?"
Hi, thank you for your suggestion! Let me say that it depends from your computer, the buffer you choose etc, therefore it would not be an "objective" video...every different computer, with different settings would give different result. Thank you!
Yeah. I understand that it would not be an "objective video" but,anyway, it can give at least some information what to expect. And if you give you PC specs with that, it will give much more information. Thanks for your answer!
Hi, in this video I have introduced the "null test" where basically you can check out "scientifically" which profiler is closer to the real deal: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hsc44yTiMrg.html Thank you!
I’m still really trying to decide if I just could add this to my fender 100 solid state I put two new speakers in and sounds way better but I’m so lost if I need this or a regular pedal board I’m trying to start my own thing not just play covers
Hi, if it has an effect loop you can potentially use the ToneX or something like a TwoNotes Revolt as preamplifier. You can also use other effects like delays and choruses
It will take years and years for the QC and ToneX to equal the amount of touring bands currently using Kempers. Bands who actually tour don't spend their time on RU-vid watching hyped up videos about the next best thing especially when the next best thing hasn't been tested under tour travel/playing condition for 10 years. If you Refine a Kemper Profile for as long as it takes a QC or ToneX to make a Capture, 5 to 15 minutes, the Kemper Profile will sound the same as the Capture.
@@guitartoneSA Maybe, but that would be the case with any neural network. Also Kemper snapshots multiple IRs, it does not do AI (neural network algo). Also Kemper has been around for 10 years now, whilst QC (maybe 1 year) and ToneX (literally one month).
Wrong. Kemper still has the best ecosystem..the Kemper Kabinet does FRFR and amp in the room....Moreover, it has the inbuilt power amp and the best selection of profiles.
Kemper sounds downright broken. In this comparison Quad sounds artificial, whereas in others it has in my opinion been the best one. But, ToneX is extremely impressive. Only thing it fails a little bit at is the note decay isn't as good as in the real thing, but I don't think anyone cares much about that.
I dont care about anything but the sound. An kempers woofy, flat sound has been a issue for me for years. Here you can hear it an i hope they get their crap together and update the profiling. I do not want to sell mine. Cmon kemper
tutto giusto Leo ma se aggiungi alla tua patch una seconda stringa e usi circa 10 o 11 blocchi con circa il 47% di cpu il quad cortex genera 9ms di latenza!!! e sinceramente mi sembrano veramente troppi per suonare a tempo! e lo dice uno che lo ha! grazie all right Leo but if you add a second string to your patch and use about 10 or 11 blocks with about 47% cpu the quad cortex generates 9ms latency!!! and honestly they seem really too many to play in time! and says one who has it! Thank you
@@LeoGibsonGtr non proprio solo..metti 4 blocchi su row 1 e misura la latenza. Poi indirizza la 1 sulla 3 e SPOSTA i blocchi sulla 3 e guarda che succede. Quello che succede non ha senso..spero e credo che verrà risolto
@@LeoGibsonGtr qui ne parliamo un bel po per farci sentire dalla Neural perché non esiste che una pedaliera come questa abbia 9ms di latenza! here we talk about it quite a bit to let Neural hear us because there is no such thing as a pedalboard like this having 9ms of latency! Grazie/thank you unity.neuraldsp.com/t/latency-solved/10297/122
Far too much focus on latency. Sound quality first, user experience 2nd. Latency is only a subset of user experience and as long as latency isn't affecting your enjoyment then it just doesn't matter. There is no reason to graphically measure it. The same can be said by analyzing wave forms of captures. Who cares. If you can't tell the difference in a mixed blind test, then it just doesn't matter.
Hi, some of us are really interested in how these pedals "feels", which (in my opinion) is not just related to how they sound in a mix and if you can (or not) tell the difference in terms of pure sound. For me the "feel" is related to latency, dynamic range, frequency range, and note envelop representation....that's why I try to focus on these aspects, providing you with the most objective tests that I can do. Thank you for your message
@@EricTetz oh really. When I used to play on a big stage we were 30 feet from our amps and 15 feet from our monitors. That's 1 ms per foot not including the processing time through pedals. You end up figuring it out despite the latency.
@@deans.4705 (1) Latency is cumulative. You want to minimize it at very step. (2) How much latency _you're_ willing to tolerate is completely irrelevant to my point.
