I like the look of that merchandise you've got but I would love for you to make a shirt saying how Game of Thrones also screwed us over the very end😂😂😂😂😂
He is not accidentaly correct, he is actually correct. Daenerys is a true Targaryen who has obtained dragons. Something no one has seen since the Dance of the Dragons, the scars of which still linger in his time. Tywin ,a man of realism and realpolitik shushes his grandson, who still has some imagination and real concern.
@@SantomPh They're not mutually exclusive. He was correct, but his reasoning was bad. Joffrey was right for the wrong reasons. Tywin drew an incorrect conclusion, but his logic was better.
You all can say what you want. But Tywin just denies what ever he doesn’t want to believe. I’m sure the many specialist of the kingdom told him his daughter and son weren’t fucking one another too. Not to mention one of the last reveals of Tywin is that he was always a hypocrite who beds prostitutes just like everyone else. He could have been just as worried but trying to keep up a strong face of calm for his grandson. Or he could just be doing his usual deny deny deny anything he just doesn’t want to acknowledge. But Tywin has a habit and history of denying anything he doesn’t want to believe. How his wife died just being natural? No he wants to blame his son. Tywin does this stuff all the time. If he doesn’t want to acknowledge something he just refuses to acknowledge it. Tyrion being the one with the mind most similar to Tywins? He doesn’t want to acknowledge it cause he just doesn’t want to. You can go on and on about Tywin doing this. It’s one of his biggest faults.
Keep it mind, the Maesters only had Targaryen dragons to go on. Dragons that were chained up constantly in the Dragon Pit and never grew as large as Balerion or Vhagar. Daenerys Dragons grew abnormally fast, within half a decade because they didn't have this limitation nor were they born from the eggs of stunted dragons. In HOD, Syrax is way too small for a dragon who is supposed to be three decades old.
No. Tywin wasn't wrong.. just like Ned. Keep in mind that they had spies keeping and Eye on Dany across that GREAT Sea Span.. and THAT (The Sea) was their Best Defense against Her.
@@GoldBanks60 I'm wondering why people didn't notice, he knew she was a huge threat, but not an immediate threat, why do you think he offered Oberyn that deal, Tyrion to marry Sansa and Joffrey to the Tyrels, it's a part of a bigger picture he just died on the Privy.
His idea for a standing army - instead of having to raise one from bannermen every time there’s a war - is the right idea and it’s the direction real life history went in, but he got shut down without a chance to explore it.
@@Champs-ek7lh The vague idea is good, however his planned execution wasn't. Not to mention the decentralized nature of the empire hampering how effective it would be and the massive debt problem the throne already had.
@@renevil2105 If Daniel Radcliffe could be Harry Potter for ten years and still get other roles, it's not like this would have been a problem. He "retired" (from the big mainstream stuff) by choice.
@@perlundgren7797 you are ignoring the difference Harry good guy, Joffrey bad guy. The actor for joffrey was getting a ton of hate mail and death threats.
@@renevil2105 Another GoT example, then: I'm guessing about 95+ % of people still associate Iwan Rheon with Ramsay, and that hasn't killed his career. Also, no. You can google "Thankfully, I've never had any negative fan experiences or anything" or "Nobody’s ever said a mean thing to me", and it should lead you straight to Jack Gleeson interviews with him alking about how nothing like that ever happened. People just love gossip.
If Joffrey could’ve reined in his sadistic impulses - or just hadn’t been an absolute lunatic to begin with - he’d have been freakishly smart. I often think it’s sheer boredom that gave rise to his psychopathy. When he’s actually trying, rare though it is, he shows an ability to grasp ideas at 14 that most men twice his years can’t fathom. Cersei ruined him thoroughly.
What are you talking about? Even in this instance he's only right because he believes in what's the equivalent to magic, and Tywin doesn't. When did Joffrey ever show any sign of intelligence or even awareness?
@@niklaspietzschke8785 his declaration that a standing army is better than a feudal one. Costly but actually an advancement. Also is it really magic if it actually exist? The dragons were only gone for 300 years. Not really a long forgotten story
@@Hangman11 His standing army argument itself was solid, but misguided in the sense that during that time it was impossible for the Iron Throne to actually raise a standing army. And in regards to dragons and magic you have to realise that dragons followed the evolutionary path of any other animal (even if accelerated): less space and inbreeding led to smaller and smaller dragons. There was no reason at all to assume that full sized dragons would suddenly appear out of nowhere (the eggs were supposed to be inactive decorational artifacts when they were gifted to Dany). The fact that the eggs Dany had hatched was essentially the equivalent to magic.
@Niklas Pietzschke Joffrey had somewhat decent ideas, but instead of tempering his youthful inexperience and impulsive cruelty with wisdom and patience, Cersei coddled him to the point that there was nothing to do but ignore and work around the vicious idiot of a king they were left with. His ideas were flawed and he often misread the room, but he did occasionally display unconventionally intelligent ideas. If, perhaps, he had been raised better, he could've been a decent king. But...we will never know.
I watch this entire scene at least 3-4 times a year. Charles Dance just fucking nails it. So does Jack Gleason. That little look Charles does as he says "Of course",after Joffrey says "Many important matters require a kings attention" is perfect.
Ironically this is Joffrey's best scene. Even though it is Tywin giving the lecture, Joffrey shines as the wiser of the two. A rare low moment for Tywin.
Everyone I can think of who becomes king or queen gets cut by that thing at one point or another. It's a fucking chair made out of swords. I always thought the thing about the throne choosing people was just superstition. That or the throne just hates everyone who's spent any significant amount of time on it. Maybe that's the point. That there shouldn't be a king or queen.
@@armandosmith2684Dany wasn’t an immediate threat, you realize that right? They were already at war. Why worry about Dany when you have kingdoms in open rebellion?? Dany is a later concern that needs to be dealt with after you deal with the issues already on your doorstep
Actually, Ser Tywin also has a point. The last dragons on the world weren't bigger than cats, the biggest perished in the Dance centuries ago: It has sense that he thought Daenerys's dragons couldn't get into large creatures.
Except that since it was known (I believe) that the last dragons of Westeros didn't have descendance, whatever dragons were born after that must be at least as close to Balerion as to those small dragons.
@@CdFMasterVideo To be fair, nobody even thought the dragons eggs Dany had were even possible of hatching. They were intended as symbolic gifts, to remind others of her Targaryan'ness. Not Illaryio's fault he didn't talk to Varys about trying those magic flames the sorcerer threw Varys' balls into.
the plan of Robert was to have Ned tutor Joffery to be king before Joffery ascends the throne when he is of age, but sadly, that's not how things turned out
This is one of my favourite scenes from the show. Tywin Lannister was my favourite character mainly due to Charles dances acting, Tywin imo didn’t really do anything wrong. He was just cleaning up after his stupid family
Honestly seeing some scenes individually as clips, reels, and shorts makes me realize that Joffery wasn't completely stupid, honestly if everything began a little earlier and he could have mitigated Cersei's influence, Ned really may have been able to make Joffery one of the best kings Westeros had known, until Daenerys invaded at least
He was a brat, but he never would have been evil if he wasn't spoiled. You almost feel bad for him during the battle of Kings Landing when he doesn't know what to do.
Except he’s severely mentally ill. That wasn’t Cersei’s influence. The child literally tortured animals then moved to humans once king. ^^; Pretty sure casually using a prostitute for target practice isn’t Cersei’s influence.
Allowing lannister boys to be king puppets so they could pull the strings was their downfall. Lannisters got ahead of themselves and found themselves really paying their debts at the end of it all.
What? No. We refused to listen to the experts. Most politicians haven't listened to any of the ecpert advisors since 2020 or even before. What the hell are you talking about?
Tywin knew about the dragons, but he was focusing on battles in his doorstep. The Starks, the Baratheons, allying with Tyrells, etc. Tywin couldn't focus on a conflict across the sea.
People calling joffrey correct here forgetting and that this is the guy who cant even be bothered to show up to his own council meetings. If he cares so much about this he can show up to the meeting but he doesnt, does he?
"You are being Counseled at this very Moment." One of my favourite Tywin Quotes.. second only too, "The King is Tired.. see him to his chambers. Grand Maester, perhaps some essence of Nightshade to help him sleep."
That man brought life to the character. In only the way Charles Dance could. When viewers hate and respect characters, the goals been achieved and we all hated and respected Tywin...😅
Robert was also telling this to Ned. Tywin was correct in a way. You can't worry about someone you don't even have as an enemy yet when there are others raising arms. It's just a priority thing. But the way he and Ned thought it would *never* happen was just ridiculous
I just wanna point out that many people are pointing out joffreys right and tywins wrong, Tywin isn’t wrong or being stupid. He’s being manipulative. Tricking Joffrey into thinking Daenerys is no threat so he can carry on being easy to control. If Joffrey was panicking he’d make a bunch of mistakes and Tywin doesn’t want that so he lies to him and tells him to be ignorant
I kinda like how Joffrey was right on this because it’s the one thing he would be right on, as the only extra dimension that was added to Joffrey’s character was that he was a massive history weeb, like it’s actually something he’s passionate about. And so naturally he would take the threat of dragons more seriously because they’d be so vivid in his imagination.
@@sjonnieplayfull5859 I guess that is history. But there many times he displays a passionate interest in history. He may not have a reverent respect for the physical condition of historical documents, but still.
@@sjonnieplayfull5859 I think it's perfectly in line with his character. He gets something he likes, he uses it to break something else he likes. He's a spoiled king. He could get another book if he wanted, he'd probably expect one. Plus the book he destroyed was just given to him by Tyrion. He'd probably do it just to humiliate his uncle.
If they did a “what if” got gamr of thrones it would be fantastic entertainment to see Joffrey and Tywin live longer snd more grandson/pa interactions.
It's scenes like this and his royal army idea that illustrate that if he weren't such a vicious little shit, Joffrey actually had the capability to do be a decent king. He wasn't stupid he was cruel. Some of his cruel choices are actually smart. Torturing Sansa is vile and disgusting but it sends the message that he's not taking Robb Stark's campaign lying down and it sends a message to other would be traitors what can happen should they rebel. Afterall if he's willing to brutalize his queen to punish her brother what will he do to the families of others. Same with him slaughtering Robert's bastards. They are potential claimants people like Robb could rally forces behind to depose him. It's cruel and monstrous that Joffrey would have babies butchered but it was actually a smart decision. His stupid choices like executing Ned and ordering the deaths of the person who chucked a cow pie at him are also cruel. It's not that he makes stupid choices. He makes cruel choices, some smart and some stupid
I just caught this in the story line. Per Tywin's words 300 years passed before the dragons at the end of this season. That's 300 years for 3 dragon eggs to have never been hatched. Does that make sense to anyone? That just shows you that great writing (as people love to talk about when hating the last season) at the beginning of this show still has significant imperfections.
This actor is sooooo good. I just started watching him in Keiser Sutherlands new show, the rabbits Hole. He’s really good at playing both good guy and bad guy.
Lol which one?? They are both amazing! (I'm pretty sure you mean Chuck, I think Jack quit acting after this, he just wants a normal life.. I could be mistaken but I heard that a few years ago..)
Joffrey seems like a intelligent and calculating individual.. Seems like a good king... Tywin however comes off as arrogant and oblivious... I hope nothing happens to Joffrey and he continues being a good king.
Joffrey honestly wasn’t dumb and had plenty of great logical ideas. But his lack of empathy and arrogance hindered him. Imagine had he grown in a better family.
Honestly, if Jofferey was around in S7, I think he'd support the idea of banding together to fight the Night King and his White Walkers because of how worried he was about dragons in this scene.
Joffrey should have been played by an older character. In the books he’s not a man, but a full grown late teenager (18) who even dueled Robb Stark at winterfell who was described as his same age!
It's funny though that Tywin tells this to Joffrey as if he doesn't know about the dragons. Tywin tells Arya Stark when she was cup bearer that the dragons were the the only thing that could destroy tower of the hand.
@sjonnie playfull I think it was Harold the black that built the Castel. It was built to withstand any attack from land. Then tywin says look at it now in ruins. Because of dragons.
@@jarvishamill7717 I kind of remember it was Harren the mad, hence Harrenhal, and that the book told how on the day it was finished, Aegon landed at Kings Landing with his dragons Several years ago that I read the books, but this is how I remember it
One of my favorite aspects of Tywin. Even when he is blatantly and provably wrong, he still sincerely believes he is the smartest man in the room enough that you kind of buy into it..
I think Tywin knew they if the dragons are like well... the old dragons, he's done. His house is done. His history, done. He could be exterminated from history completely. He can't accept that as a possibility. He just can't.
The Lannisters were that family living off their names. Tywin and his children destroyed themselves. The only competent one was Tyrion. Joffrey was raised by the worst of them all.
It seems like Joffrey is having a good idea. But Tywin is right not to worry too much about the Dragons at this time. If I’m not mistaken, at this time in the show he still at war with against 2 army’s. The current and most pressing threat is in Westeros not the other side of the planet. Tywin is keeping an eye on the situation with Dany. As soon as she’s hints at becoming a threat he will act.