If I had the game, I'd mess with the steering linearity and make it super sensitive near center and not sensitive at extreme turning. Cars probably don't turn much near center to help controller users. Still disappointing they didn't seem to try to tune wheel use. They even keep the controller center steering dead zone when you select wheel. doh!
Even on gamepad the steering in this game feels slow and artificially delayed. It's like they dumbed down the input settings to be friendlier towards players with poor motor control. Older FM games definitely felt better, but even Horizon 5 had some of this same issue. It breaks the sense of connection between the joystick and your wheels, making it feel like you're issuing vague commands rather than controlling the vehicle yourself.
@@scorpioassmodeusgtx1811 100% this. The gamepad experience is not good in this game and I can't be bothered to fiddle with the settings enough to get it to a point where it actually feels playable. Especially when GT7 kind of just works out of the box.
Microsoft is small indie company you see, they can't afford to buy a bunch of popular wheels, and get some simracers to test them with forza till it feels right
The game doesn't even work properly with a gamepad that they've made themselves lol It's like none of the devs have seen a car before, let alone driven one.
Jimmy, you ARE wrong, this game is not supposed to be played with a wheel. ... In fact it's not supposed to be played at all, instead you are supposed to notice how cool reflections are and how realistic the grass looks, which was 99% of their billion-dollar marketing.
Part of the problem is that the default set ups for the cars are also complete junk. I suspect someone just went through them, moving sliders randomly. Things like 10+ psi difference between front and rear tires is a regular thing. It's totally stupid. *Also this causes some of the wobbliness. Both the Ts020 and the 60's honda F1 cigar tube were basically undriveable, The honda was see-sawing up every straight constantly from left to right. Standard steerings game pad filters likely hides these issues for a lot of people, maybe no one tested to see if they actually worked properly with sim steering.
It honestly kind of feels like wheel support was tacked on later on in the cycle and they did just enough research into what the settings are to make it passable after some tweaking for most people.
@@RotGoblin it's really frustrating in multiplayer where there will be 5-10 people all within a few tenths of a seconds of eachother in a competitive lobby on quali and then the person on pole has the magic setup sauce and is 4 seconds faster than anyone else. Drives me nuts.
Since Horizon 4 it kept becoming more and more apparent that T10 just cared about how the game looks rather than how it plays, and this game is the perfect example of that. All of the pre-release ads basically showed how good it looked and very little other improvement. For over 15 YEARS the tuning system has remained almost the exact same. FIFTEEN YEARS. Its worked for the horizon series because its more arcade like, sure, but to release a MOTORSPORT game and to not attempt to bring the tuning to AT LEAST Gran Turismo levels is just insulting as a fan. Not to mention, daddy Microsoft works along side partners like HP, who have a VR headset out on the market. Why TF does this game have 0 VR support? Assetto, a game that came out almost 10 years ago has VR, Carx for christ sakes has VR support, but god forbid T10 realize that VR is a growing thing and make us stick to monitors. This game is just genuinely insulting to those of us who want nothing more than for this game to actually grow and become better after playing for, if not more than, half of our lives.
Considering all the shouting they did about building the most complicated tyre model EVER I was really pissed off when I drove it for the first time. I thought they were going serious again, back to Forza 4, but no. Just more Forza panel beating and pseudo controls.
it's because their marketing team already approved their marketing on the OLD version of FM2023 that T10 was developing. That is the form of Forza that many people tested quite some time ago when T10 was reaching out for a closed test. Everybody who tested that game were at the very least amicable to it if not outright loving it as far as I've heard, but rumor has it that Microsoft stepped in and hated it. Something about FM2023 "taking away" from Horizon or some goofy corpo garbage like that. So the marketing team kept running with their "from the ground up" marketing scheme that was previously approved, when suddenly the developers were forced to create Forza Motorsport 7.5 instead.
@@PURENT I think maybe you misunderstand me. I mean if the game can't use the results of those tyre physics and translate that back to the player (via whatever wheel) then it's useless. Basically the player shouldn't have to try to guesstimate what wheel settings are required - that's the dev's/playtesters jobs. It does beg the question, did they get any sort of consultation? Did no one, at any point say "erm hang on, no car on earth feels like this through any of the wheels you've given me to test". What I'm getting at is the physics underneath may actually be good, but how the hell is anyone supposed to know?
Hokihoshi’s wheel settings guide is the best imo, feels better than any other ffb guide I’ve seen on here. Plus he gives values for dd wheels and gear/belt driven wheels
I wasn’t a huge fan of the settings, but it’s a great guide to use to tune. Ended up finding some baseline settings from a Logitech person on Reddit and went from there. Feels great now
I’m partway convinced that the understeer issues almost universally come from an inability to tune goddamn anything until you level a car up. Getting to tweak anti-roll bars in any way made a big difference for me, but that takes ages to get opened up on a new car even after the updates.
The problem with 90% of cars is that you have to tweak everything to the extreme in order to get something that drives halfway decent. Cars should be perfectly driveable from the outset, and then you get to refine that experience with tuning as you progress. Instead we start with a shitty fucking mess, and only after boring ourselves into a coma with "Levelling" our cars (Whoever thought up that idea, and whoever greenlit that idea, both need sacking immediately) and pushing all the tuning settings to max, do we get to experience a somewhat driveable car. I will not be buying any more Forza titles after this experience, and the utter lack of anything interesting in the Horizon series since the 3rd game. Microsoft just can't do this properly, it seems.
Hm...I don't know why it takes you ages to unlock the ARBs. This pretty much happens after the first race. Especailly after the 1.0 update I unlock almost everything to get a good base tune after the first race+practice. But anyway I agree that you have to apply upgrades and you have to dig into tuning to get a compatible car. But honestly thats fine..if I don't want to think about that and want to go full throttle throughout the whole course I go for NFS, Horizon or the Crew. And also a YES for the base tuning settings are weird and a bit random sometimes. I would have loves MS to stick more to real life settings especially in a Motorsport title. But once you know the meta settings better it's actually not that bad. One more thing @GraceMcClain, sorry to say this but it just doesn't make sense to have every car car perfectly driveable from stock on because...no car is perfectly drivable especially on a race track. I just see this making sense for GT cars or anything which is build for a race track. After all, I think it's not a bad game! Whats just pisses me off is that it was obviously just released too early and certain things are simply not finished or missing at all. I'ts a motorsport title and I want to tune cars and make them better over time but I DONT want to mess around with my wheel settings for 1h. That's something what should work out of the box.
To me it just always feels like Forza has a very very specific point in the wheel settings where it feels pretty good, but a single percentage change in some of the settings can already make a huge difference sometimes, making it close to impossible to find this sweet spot. Combine that with the terrible default car setups and it will just never feel good.
I used 2 love forza but I 1M% agree with your opinion on it. I did hear the game is great on controller but didn't by an expensive wheel to use a controller.
As someone who sold their wheel a couple years back, it's not great on controller. Turn in is really slow, the wheel rotates really slowly so wheel users always have an advantage in tight corners.
@@RotGoblinur probably using the wrong controller settings lol. Leave steering in normal not simulation, simulation is for the wheels. That was actually one of the biggest complaints by sim racers that the controller was way easier and it took hours of driving on the wheel to match there controller lap time.
I've heard from a few people in the Forza community that the version of Forza people had tested a couple years back is VASTLY different compared to what we got. The following is just rumors I've heard, but seem to be an educated guess on the circumstances. Rumor has it, Turn 10 actually WERE revolutionizing their physics simulations from the ground up. That revolutionized version is what those testers played quite some time ago, and most of who I've talked to about it were positive. The most negative comments I heard were, "it's different than what I'm used to," but they often followed it up saying they were glad *something* about Forza was changing. Most considered it an immediate improvement. However, the rumor follows that while testers were generally happy about this, Microsoft wasn't. The justification behind this opinion from the C-Suite varies - from valuing consumer familiarity over necessary improvements, to the new physics engine negatively impacting Horizon somehow - but generally it follows that the executives hated this revolutionized Forza, and instead forced the team to make Forza Motorsport 7.5 The game was SUPPOSED to be built from the ground up, but Microsoft hated it and forced them to change it AFTER the marketing team's strategies were already approved. So while the marketing team got started with the "from the ground up" strategies, the developers were forced to abandon their ground-up project and essentially tweak Forza Motorsport 7. In essence, we didn't get Forza Motorsport 2023. We got Forza Motorsport 7.5. That's why the wheel feedback sucks; it's because it sucked in Forza 7, too.
Also, I've actually spent a VERY long time tweaking my own wheel FFB settings in FM 2023. No matter what you do, it's always going to feel bad. Even perfect settings are going to feel excruciatingly vague and outdated compared to current simulation games. *Even The Crew Motorfest has better force feedback than this.* Of course, if you find the perfect settings the feedback will feel amazing COMPARED TO THE BASELINE SETTINGS, but it's still going to feel bad. At the very least, I want to be able to feel a jerk in the wheel when I climb onto an elevated kerb and no matter what I do, I never feel it. Even using the Telemetry menu to analyze my FFB and prevent clipping doesn't make elevated kerbs give me feedback. The feedback is bad because this physics engine's feedback interpretations are bad. I wish Turn 10 were allowed to keep developing what they already had, because it genuinely could have been an absolute banger.
I’ve driven more KM since Spec II than I did from launch until Spec II. Really enjoying it. The Weekly events, event directory, and easier to see progress screen are really simple things but were enough to get me committed to 100%ing it. And Sophy 2.0 is fantastic for close racing. Even if they do make contact they feel it too and don’t magnetically turn you around like the standard AI does.
This video perfectly encapsulates my issues with Forza Motorsport. A big problem though, is that when you tell people that, they get super defensive, call you an idiot, tell you "jUsT tUNe uR cAR, n00b" and deflect all responsibility for the terrible feeling and handling of the cars in the game off the developers and onto the players. I posted about this on reddit myself, trying to gauge other players perspectives and find out maybe they knew something I didn't, but they did exactly what the majority of the Forza community does best; call you an idiot and tell you to tune. Not to mention, people just mass-downvoting anything on reddit because they don't agree, and refuse to actually read anything and believe only they could be right.
They are just trying to justify their purchases of a factually unfinished, buggy broken mess made with no love, care, passion or any form of QA testing It's one of the worst games they have ever released It's an embarrassment to the franchise Get the 2018 BMW M5 and if you have the patience to grind out the wide body kit, put it on and thank me for the.laughs later I have more if people really want to see how unfinished and in polished this game is, BRZ too in cockpit view in races bugs out
I’ve tried all the FFB settings and ones from Overtake weren’t that great… the best settings are by far Ermz settings on his channel from 3 months ago. The way he set it up is brilliant and I had almost lost all hope for Forza Motorsport until I tested his settings. One of the things he mentions in the end of his video is that each car’s FFB strength is customizable and you need to change it per car as some are stronger than others. Once you set it up like Ermz you’ll see Forza Motorsport is extremely fun and wheel FFB is awesome! I still play F1 23 and IRacing more, but Forza Motorsport is still quite fun too!
You absolutely nailed it with the comment about releasing a game with settings that don't work for any wheel. No other sim I've encountered has this issue, and it's infuriating that you are meant to, I dunno, guess what feels realistic? This was the same with Forza 5-7 as well, and I can't believe they obviously don't think it's a problem.
I just want to say thank you so much for being honest. Honesty seems so rare in any motoring- or gaming-related walk of life today that this is a proper breath of fresh air. Lots of love Jimmer.
That's exactly how I've felt using a racing wheel in every Forza game I've tried. They really are games specifically tuned for controllers, very frustrating.
@@fifteen8850 that´s great! But apparently it doesn´t seem straight forward to set the wheel up correctly, otherwise it wouldn´t be such a hassle for Jimmer. It´s good to hear that some people got it to work for them properly, thank you. Now I know it is possible to set it up correctly, but I also know that I might encounter some issues if I try to set it up myself, thanks to Jimmer.
@@Zitronenstrauch-uno While that is true, it’s pretty disingenuous if he didn’t take the time to try. Maybe he did and just couldn’t get it right or didn’t know how to, I don’t know
This makes me feel SO much better about my experience with Forza. I spent hours trying to tweak my wheel settings and car setups, and no matter what I do, it feels terrible. This video highlighted every experience I've had with this game, and I feel way less alone now. I can deal with imperfect FFB, but the biggest problem I have after several hours is that it's just plain not fun to drive in Forza Motorsport.
I spent a looooong time tweaking the FFB settings for the R16 and I think I landed on a pretty solid setup. I went through and adjusted each setting to minimum and maximum and several points in between to get an idea of how they affected the feeling of the wheel. It feels really hit and miss sometimes because certain settings will affect other settings in different ways. I do not understand why big developers don't do a little bit of experimentation on different wheelbases and such to find good settings right out the gate. I get they figure people will figure it out eventually, but it also turns so many people off of the game because it feels like complete garbage by default and will only work well with a lot of tweaking.
I agree with your statements. You shouldn't have to spend 2hrs to figure out wheel settings and youtube search for settings that only make the feedback feel less flacid. I was excited to hear about forza but after spending 2 hours trying to get the wheel to feel good over multiple races and the poor pc optimization, it was a refund for me. I really thought this forza title would be more "sim-like" and offer good road feel but it's just a mushy mess
@@jasonash6002winning and having fun are 2 different things. I haven’t played the new FM (not got a next gen console), but I have played FM7 and AC back to back, and While I was better at FM, AC just felt so much better. It felt like a real drive, much more so than Forza.
I think someone in a RU-vid video I saw ages ago explained Forza on a wheel: you're not setting up your settings based on preference, you're setting them up to get the game to a playable level.
I had all the same issues described in this video. Particularly the weird understeering and i noticed that when you apply too much steering, understeer seems to be magnified. So if the deadzones and sensitivity isn't correct the whole thing is terrible. I fixed this by setting all inner deadzones to 0 all outer deadzones to 100, steering sensitivity to 100 and steering linearity to 0. Turn pneumatic trail way down to around 30, adjust to feel, turn mechanical trail up to around 160 and adjust to feel. I found this to be a great base to work with and got lots of good feeling from the car, and i could be pretty quick. The rest is standard stuff you can adjust to your liking. This is on Xbox with a CSL DD 8nm. There is a vibration on sliding that is useful feedback, but too strong for my liking but i dont know how to tune it out. The vibration setting doesn't seem to affect it very much. It was still there with that turned off. You're right though, it should be much better out of the box. All the tuning is so unnecessary.
I changed my settings to your suggestion, and it did make the feel quite a bit better. So, thanks for that. I'm on the (ironically) Fanatec GT DD Pro wheel.
Jimmy during this video you actually gave the solution without realising. Every car needs the tyre pressures dropped to get any feeling. I have found dropping these on every car and when chanhing tyres helps hugely.
There is nothing you can do to make Forza Motorsport feel even remotely as good OG Assetto Corsa. Going back to Assetto Corsa was like finding water in the desert, it was like sleeping in your own bed after a long-trip, it was like going into an air-conditioned room on a sweltering hot day, it's like being able to see clearly now that the rain is gone, it's like being able to see all obstacles in your way, its like the difference between using your hand and.......not your hand 😏
I know forza motorsport is not a sim but i have a lot of fun wile plaing it on my thrustmaster wheel and i stil love asseto corsa and it's by far the best racing /drift sim ever
Funny, the Jimmy describes the feeling like when he cannot turn at 60mph is how I literally feel about every "sim" I've ever played, I got pretty much all of them and they all feel like crap.
Hey. Just letting you know that if you play with damage OFF, (Club Rules) Your gas tank is forced to 100%, which can heavily weigh you down and give you severe understeer in lighter cars.
I really enjoyed you raising lack of low speed turn in and the weird snap under or oversteer with no warning. Even on a controller the standard settings are inert or numb and you have to rely on forums or subreddits to get things to work, or to even act as a starting point. At least for a lot of us. And YES! Horizon does somehow feel better than this.
Agreed. The first Forza race I entered felt good because I drove a low-performance, understeering FWD car. Then I played more and... everything felt like that. And gave me zero feeling through a wheel.
There are a couple tricks you can do to make the cars feel better. Review your tyre pressures, by default most cars have their tyre pressures set way to high. This is the main cause for slip/push/ understeer. I bring up telemetry and tune the pressure so that you are running the tyres at 33psi when warm. I find you get a much better feel/control of the cars once dialed in. Also they often start you off with way to much fuel. Reduce the fuel levels to only what you need. If anyone is interested I was also able to dial in some pretty useful force feedback settings in game and for my CSL DD (8nm). GAME SETTINGS Vibration Scale 40 Force Feedback Scale 100 Steering Self Alignment 45 (this is one of the main problems) Mechanical Trail Scale 105 Pneumatic Trail Scale 95 Road Feel Scale 100 Load Sensitivity 50 Wheel Damping Scale 0 Center Spring Scale 0 Dynamic Damper Behavior 0 Steering Sensitivity 50 Steering Linearity 50 CSL DD (8NM) SETTINGS SEN 900 FFB 100 FFS Peak NDP 20 NFR off NLN off INT 6 FEI / FOR / SPR / DRP all 100 BRF and BLI (set to your preference)
when I 1st started motorsport I tried the LMP with the wheel and the dam car would not turn. At 1st I thought I was driving it wrong but now I don't think that was the case. I was looking forward to finally try motorsport with a wheel but I was a bit disappointed
The game should come with preloaded settings for the wheel you are using, especially considering the price of the game! I’ve spent hours watching videos, changing my settings, testing them out just to say fuck it I just want to race.
Why would they do that though when they know brain dead fools will throw money at them regardless This proves that Maybe if the average gamer and a shred of standards we would still have Forza making quality games like FM2 through 4 people buy sh1t, they make sh1t, just like most other devs nowadays, why put in effort when it isn't required
I don't think I've heard X (formally known as Twitter) referred to simply as X yet. There is ALWAYS a comment afterwards saying "you know.. Twitter...."
Almost every car understeer to a degree in Forza. And in every single car, I increase mechanical grip by changing the anti roll bar settings. It’s actually not hard to negate if you spend a bit of time tuning.
According to ERMZ, all the cars are tuned for tons of understeer for controller users. I haven't watched his hacker guide on how to tune the GT3. In essence, there are broken ways to tune cars that don't reflect real life settings. Basically, wheel users have to mess heavily with car settings to tune out controller help settings.
What bums me out is I really love the level of customization that you can do in forza, and that is so limited in other games. I've gotta go through so much bullshit just to make a custom livery in Assetto Corsa and forget about changing rims or body kits or anything else. I keep finding bits of my dream racing game scattered around four or five different games.
It’s why I just bailed on it. It was counter to the muscle memory I had across so many other titles that I had in close ballparks to one another. May be worth it to me if there was something unique about its offerings, but at the end of the day the only truly stand-out feature is “it’s on Xbox”.
"It's not a sim though, so why would you expect a wheel to work, or feel good?" Ok then why even have wheel settings, or support for it at all? There's no excuse to have a 5 year old feature be consistently bad. If you don't want people to play on wheel, don't tell them they can.
@@iNathanLite It’s not an insult. Just an expression. Once you’ve felt what a decent quality force feedback feels like, and go back to forza, you’ll understand. Meanwhile enjoy the game.
I'm so glad you have taken this from the game because these things have been driving me mad in FM and no one seems to be mentioning it. The understeer, awful sense of speed and complete lack of front-end grip is just ridiculous. It feels like you literally almost have to stop at some corners just to get around them, otherwise the front just washes out. The cars are tameable but you have to really adjust driving style to get them to play ball. Entry speed of some corners has to be so slow that you're actually unable to take the intended racing lines to maximise exit speed. I've never experienced that in a racing game before 😂 I have been having fun with it and appreciate it's something I can play casually with mates but physics and tyre model are absolutely wild!
The way I got things feeling even vaguely as good as Horzion 5 did (and tbh FH5 has had the best sort of wheel behavior/feel in Forza so far to me personally), was I entered free play with a reasonable fast like D-class Muscle Car, and did a test drive on VIR and the Shorten NASCAR layout at the Glen. And just adjusted settings after each sort of vague lap to dial it in. This game has some of the same wonky issues that FM7 had (Not going full r/Forza on that), but the Steering self Alignment setting seems the be the biggest issue. 0% Steering Self Alignment? You now are driving the vaguest of vague boats 100%? Congrats your steering wheel now requires the same sledgehammer force that it takes to get into 3rd gear in a early war production T34 just to turn. So far the sweet spot on that setting for me is like 28%. However every other setting is vaguely close to my Horizon 5 ones, accept force feedback has been cranked up to about 165% to give the wheel some form of reasonable heft instead of being stuck in concrete if you use higher SSA settings. On the top of the cars themselves, massive improvements across the board, I can take a even a E-class Monte Carlo with stock tires but about 210bhp up to about 110mph and properly yeet it through the Bus Stop at the Glen the way your supposed to take it and not have a ounce of doubt, On 7 I didn't trust the feel of the cars enough to even bother attempting such a thing because they never felt quite.....right....Like there was a point that you know it could "Do it" but all you felt as a hard wall that suggested maybe it could not do it well before the point you'd have overdriven the car into the corner. Likewise word to the wise. Turn 10/PG can not tune cars to save there life. This goes for Jimmer and everyone else, learn how to tune, take time and dial settings in, because the stock tunes are godawful. The reason why the NSX GT3 stalled on the line is 1st gear in that thing goes to the moon and is geared insanely too high for the stock BHP levels. The Caddy GTP Hypercar thing in the intro? Yeah there is a reason that thing understeers like an utter bastard, same with the E-Ray, the stock tuning settings on cars are often not very good, or at least serviceable. This is the same Turn 10/PG that apparently looking up JIMCO's actual website and the webpage detailing the build sheet of the Fastball Racing Spec Trophy Truck was too hard for them, and thus even that truck in FH5 is not tuned correctly, however once you vaguely copy paste the actual build sheet settings in, it's insanely good, wonder of wonders. TL:DR Forza Wheel Settings have always been wonky, however a lot of it is the stock tuning on the cars that make even good wheel settings feel jank. Edit: I just realized Jimmer here used the Accursed Jag. Yeah.....yeah remember the whole "They can't do stock tunes to save there life?", Yeah the XJR-9 is that car in spades. So 1st-3rd are basically almost too short to really use without nuking the rears, 4th goes from like 115mph to 150mph. 5th goes to 200mph exactly and then hits the rev limiter hard. So why is that, what is the issue here? Well....you see Turn 10 in a spat of utterly insane stupidity. Base the settings of the IMSA GTP versions, and not just the GTP versions the gear ratios the used at basically any track not named Daytona, Road Atlanta, Road America. You know how Project Cars (Which youtube thinks this is for some reason lol) has two XJR-9s? One with the wheel fenders and one without? This car has the setup of the one without, aka the short track car, but the XJR-9 in Forza has always been the Daytona/Le Mans version. So that car stock actually can not even do the old Le Mans track it would have ran at because it's ratios are too short, hell even with the current Le Mans layout your having to half throttle it near the end of each straight just to stay of the limiter. This is why tuned cars will always be much better than a stock rented one sadly. Turn 10 ladies and gents. Edit 2: So having watched the sort of "Vague boaty" steering Jimmer has with the XJR-9. Turn down the Steering Axis Deadzone Outside to about 65 to 70%, like wise in the tuning menu if you own the car is a "Steering Rotation" setting which functions as a steering ratio setting just for that car. Also increase Steering Sensitivity to around 60 to 65%. Steering Linearity to about 60%. Then work from there and adjust as needed. Why they didn't just use Horizon 5's wheel settings and system is beyond me considering that was a marked improvement.....I'll never know, at least once you somehow manage to drunkenly figure it out the sheer volumes of improvements the cars have physics wise is insanely clear to see..... Oh also for some reason Controller has it's steering axis deadzone inside (the bad one) at 24% out of the box........Because Reasons I guess Edit 3: Yes Jimmer, they are overpressued from stock......44PSi on some race slicks on some cars....I've seen as high as nearly 49psi on the fronts.... Also back to "Turn down the Steering Axis Deadzone Outside to about 65 to 70%, like wise in the tuning menu if you own the car is a "Steering Rotation" setting which functions as a steering ratio setting just for that car. Also increase Steering Sensitivity to around 60 to 65%. Steering Linearity to about 60%. Then work from there and adjust as needed. " Do not ever run settings that are effectively "900 degrees of rotation" the out of the box settings are just that. The settings above around around 380 to 420 degrees of rotation which is actually the typical max on most GT and Touring cars even dating back to the 70s, hell most Rally cars, let alone the full on WRC/Rally1s only run at most 540 degrees of rotation if the stages require such. 900 degrees is basically having a steering rack of a literal dump truck, they have that much play because of the high center of gravity so they need to be able to steer but do so at a slow enough ratio to not fall over (See the early 90s to early 2000s Ford Explorer Rollover issues, they used the same steering racks out of like a Escort of Focus for an SUV). Edit 4: His best time at Spa in the XJR-9 that I saw was something like a 2:17.759. He was doing under 55 in 3rd for most the 180 turn after Les Comebes -Malmedy, my current settings can enter the turn around 62mph-ish in 2nd, stay above 55mph before getting on the power fully post turn (I drive like senna, throttle blipping in turns). However overall best time I've ran in the XJR-9 in a test drive at spa literally right now, done in just 3 laps of figuring out where my braking zones and stuff are is a 2:16.649, I lost about a good second of time to do wheel spin on lower speed corners do to the bad stock gearing and what is likely a god awful stock settings on the diff. It is possible to not only get the cars to feel decent-ish on a stock tune, let alone god like on a decently done tune once you get the parts unlocked. It just takes trial and error unless you know someone that has sort of vaguely managed to figure things out. I do agree however that Turn 10/PG should figure this shit out to start with, as well as Horizon 5 having better wheel feel, even with my current settings it's closer to FH5 but something does feel somewhat off, but I can't figure out what it is. Granted having gone back to FH5 for some weekly stuff I will have to do some fiddling with that because the wheel feels way to light on FH5 now after getting it dialed in on Motorsport. Edit 5: 7 Laps. 2.16.005. Likely the exact same stock XJR-9 has Jimmer, yet nearly 2 entire seconds faster. Not bragging about this either, however given I'm running wheel settings I took nearly an entire day dialing in over many laps. that's an insane gap between refined and out of the box settings in the same car. And Jimmer has actual real race car boi experience, and has real race car boi trophies to prove it. He's likely even been to Spa IRL and milled about on track. **I'm 1 to 2 entire seconds faster than him per lap in the same car at Spa** and I do not have "Real Race Car Boi" experience. In fact in AM2 or Project Cars he'd probably end up making me look like a rookie out of their depth. I've even faced his rivals ghost on FH5 a few times. He's quite fast on 5, he's actually on a few tracks within the top 3% or even the Top 1% of overall laptimes. However he's beatable, but the times he's set on some tracks on Horizon 5 checks out, someone like him I **Expect** to be able to break the top 5% of times on rivals with great ease, His lap time on Spa? That 2.17.759 on the rivals board? Likely with world ranking around like 3,800 to 4,200 at best, and there are around 7,529 players that have set a time at Spa in P-Class (The class the XJR-9 is in). For further context. I just set a 2.13.888 clean lap in rivals at Spa in a stock XJR-9. I'm 2,241 out of 7.529 players.
There are fast drivers on a wheel playing this game. They are just more willing to put the time in to fine tune their settings, rather than copy and pasting other people's work. I'm a Forza G920 player that went half insane trying to get my wheel to work for the previous title. 2 years ago I took my Sim Rig and moved it into a Winnebago RV. I can say that the driving experience does get much better if you are willing to put in the time. But for a busy guy like you, maybe that's not realistic.
Omfg now people are saying it's the car setup. Goal post officially moved. Next it's going to be Jimmy's hoodie. That hoodie impedes your ability to turn the wheel with the proper torque required. Also, have you checked your PC Jimmy? Obviously hiding the search bar on the taskbar unleashes Forza's wheel settings. If you wait until the next lunar cycle while being west of the prime meridian you could probably make the game feel good.
This game looks like it should have come out 8 years ago. I wanted a new racing game to play, but this isn't it. Not yet, anyway, I'll buy it on a massive sale when it has cooked for a while and maybe has way less issues.
Sets wheel to 900 degrees rotation In game its still 540 as I hit the soft lock I feel like fm8 doesn't let you push, use above a certain steering lock or go off line without immediately overheating the tyres and they turn to jelly. Its like the physics engine can't comprehend the difference between tyre load and tyre heat
Final red flag for me was when I was driving a race car down the straight and the virtual wheel was wiggling on the screen from the bumps in the road but my T300 was doing nothing. And that's with a blend of Hokihoshi's and overtake's settings. I loved every Forza Horizon but I just can't like any of the Forza Motorsports. GT7 is my go-to simcade racer where I feel very connected to the car and it greatly improved my skills IRL.
Couple of thoughts. Maybe you’re on normal steering instead of sim steering? Also, tuning changes car feel an INSANE amount. Definitely don’t expect a 3rd video about the game though, until maybe when Nordschleife is added.
Agreed, i don't feel Jimmy has properly tested the settings, tuned a car, used sim steering, levelled up a car, etc. It DOES feel good, ultimately. T818 DD user here, and I've dumped ACC for this game.
no settings from other youtubers felt good. i had to literally go in and turn up each setting from 0 until i felt it was good. it actually took like 2 hours.
Hey guys I had the same issue, I managed to make it feel a lot better after hours of trying. I have a Moza R5 so not the most powerful wheel but I got it to feel really good. At least for me. My settings are: Force Feedback Scale 110. Vibration Scale 10. Steering Self Alignment 105. These next ones are the most important. Mechanical Trail Scale 130 ( can go higher with a more powerful wheel) Pneumatic Trail Scale 20 ( THIS IS WHAT CONTROLS THAT CLIFF OF UNDERSTEER). Road Feel scale 90. Load Sensitivity 100. All Damping at 0 and center Spring Scale. Leave Steering Sensitivity and Linearity at 50. Hopes this helps.
Still having the same issues I had back in Forza 4. After that one I gave up any hope with driving with a wheel in forza and have limited it to game pad only. That and the idea where you have to finish first in order to progress and often times ramming your way through the field to get there, just isn't fun. But that's a different topic. Best advice I can give for driving with a wheel in forza is do some races with a game pad and watch the steering wheel move. It's only going to move so far at any given speed. Remember that and then turn the wheel in that same way on your wheel. Your not driving with a steering wheel your driving a controller that's impersonating a wheel and doesn't like anything that's not neutral.
I drove in cockpit view on controller for much of FM7 and this absolutely helped me transition to wheel for the new Forza. But now, hood cam feels the best.
@@Sean1Happy yeah the hands get distracting pretty quick if you're on a wheel. I'd prefer to turn them off or use that dash cam that some games have. Even better when you can control the fov and seat positions separately.
Honestly I only even bought FM7 for the 8-car 1 mile drag racing. That was literally it. Could not stand the driving physics. Glad to see this, means I won't have to waste more money.
Even as a person who has to reconfigure two sticks and a throttle for stuff like DCS…I find it unacceptable that Forza doesn’t inherently support wheels well. Even with a controller-first mindset, you have plenty of console-centric sellers that work and feel great out of the box. Even GRID honestly does a better job. Let’s not even forget that EVERY CAR needs its FFB strength adjusted in tuning options, because they don’t equalize their values across all cars. It was such a relief to pick up WRC and it just feels great and works.
With the past couple of Forza releases, I find myself wondering if I should give the franchise another chance. Between this and the whole grind a car to level 50 or whatever nonsense, it's easier to say no. Really thanks for that. There is too little free time as it is.
You’re not wrong!!!!!!! Coming from a controller user 24/7 The game feels dead asf!!!!! It’s impossible to correct a slide when ur getting on the power It feels like the car is floating!!! Embarrassing!!!!!!!! I’m going back to Forza 7 that’s it!!!!!!!!! “bUilT fRoM tHe gRouNd Up”🤡🤡🤡
yeah appreciate 100% honesty jimmer, i can appreciate all racing games for what they are but i think forza motorsport came short with a lot of things here
I have played the majority of the time, with no force feedback, and was driving with only the spring in the wheel. I have switched to FFB around 2 years ago. From that, I really got to rely on both my hearing, and my sight, so I know what the car is planning to do (and doing) I mostly learned on Assetto Corsa, Beam, Dirt Rally, and RaceRoom. Now, in all those games, you can pretty nicely get a comprehensive overview of what is happening, with so much clarity. Even with just sight and sound. I do not see, nor hear what I would consider to be appropriate sounds for various things happening around the car. The camera movement feels too smoothed. Tires breaking traction sounds fuzzy and inconsistent. The input feels filtered, even with just me looking at the video. I cannot explain what is wrong with it, but I just see it. I also noticed that the car doesn't seem to be gaining grip while going through a dip, which is like wtf. I also have autism, that may be why I am having these feelings. I also might just be projecting. Whomst the fucc knows at this point.
yeah it feels awful and doesn't communicate much of anything useful. Assetto Corsa compared to Forza Motorsport is like night and day when it comes to the quality of FFB and how much valuable information is communicated to you via the FFB as well as the audio and visuals.
glad its not just me who thought the camera was a bit weird, my brain doesnt like to decode sound correctly so ive always had to have extra reliance on my vision and imo the camera movement was a bit behind the car movement which could also be affected by the smoothing you noticed.
The thing I hate more is that ppl say "uhhh, but u didn't went in the very specific menu and spent 3 hours tweaking the settings to make it ok to use" guys, it was supposed to feel ok to use WITH THE DEFAULT SETTINGS, after that you go on the default settings to make it so it fits your driving style and all that other crap
my older friend, an ex-race driver got a wheel and wanted to try gaming. I started whit asseto corsa and he was like "ok this is fun" then i gave him forza he was like "wtf, i cant drive in this" he ask me to change some settings. After a few test he said that he dont think that there are any settings for this game to make it work.
I find that FFB is like flavor. Everyone likes it a bit different. What feels right to someone, may not feel right to someone else. You start with some base settings, and fine tune from there to your liking.
Everything you’ve said is exactly what I’ve been feeling. Spent days getting good settings for the game after copying about 10 different peoples settings. Something that made a bigger difference was turning up the FFB per car in the tuning settings. That combined with better wheel settings definitely helped but again like you said the feeling is just all wrong with the FFB and I feel like I’m constantly fighting to keep the car on track and pointing in the right direction, instead of being able to push the car to its limits like I could do even in FM7 on a wheel
The strangest thing about this is Forza has had full wheel compatibility with force feedback since Motorsport 2 with the Xbox 360 Wireless Racing Wheel, and then later in Motorsport 4 with the Fanatec CSR Elite, and you can find reviews of these that mention that they feel pretty good apparently, albeit at least one also talks about using a wheel on PC as a controller, which is most definitely something you shouldn't do if you can avoid it, even if you can't actually use force feedback. I'd have to actually find all of these to be conclusive about it but obviously I don't feel like doing that right now, but the question is have the games' wheel support actually gotten worse over time, or is this actually somehow better than its predecessors?
95% of the fanboys telling us wheel settings are fine are not using wheels. Fanboy logic: I'm having a good time so its impossible for you to have a bad time.
@xILoveFishyx The terrible lack of front grip feedback and the huge sloppy middle deadzone is not fine to me. Saying to not expect it to be the next assetto corsa, a game that's a decade old, is a bit of copium. This doesn't even meet the modern standard of arcade racers.
You're not wrong. I managed to get some 'useable' settings on my csl dd, but I'd be a liar if I said they were great. Other games do it so much better.
@xILoveFishyx Are you using a wheel? Even with the deadzone removed in the settings, there is still a massive slop in the middle of the wheel. If you're going to try and patronize someone, at least know wtf you're talking about.
I play on a controller and what jimmy said about being forced to drive really smoothly still relates to me. Have to be so precise with the nobly little stick to get the best out of the car to the point where you end up overthinking it and end up on the grass. Still enjoying the game but it's pretty tiring.
In this game it seems car setup is even more important than FFB settings. Leaving FFB settings the same and just changing car setup (suspension, diff, and aero) make the road feel totally different.
I used to love the Forza motorsport games, played the hell out of 2 and 4. Amounting over 4k hours just in the 4th. To me Forza stopped being my go to game when they went into the Horizon series, I moved onto PC, onto greener pastures.
Truly a mystery as to why a developer would advertise the game as a simulator, and claim to add so many simulator-like features to the game, and just not deliver lol. I feel like it'd be fine if they were like yeah this is a simcade meant for controller, and they'd get no flack from sim racers
So glad that all these issues aren't just me, the complete lack of front end grip (and the resultant chundersteer) is shocking. Going around a corner at 40mph in purpose built racecars with bags of aero, and still suffering chronic grip issues, really shouldn't be a thing.
So..... People sit with the overrated piece of shit that is assrto corsa for years to basically rewrite it.... And now it's amazing...... But the elitest sim community start shitting on something that's a month old and... Out of the box, shits all over the "ultimate sim experience"and no I don't even own forza..... Don't really need to say much more......oh wait. we also need to tweak our AC ffb with 3rd party app to get something that works..... But we can review forza in a few hours and decide the ffb is trash.....ok...now I'm done😂
ACC feels great out the box mate. AC does need work but thats one example. IRacing feels great but can be improved with tweeks. Rfactor 2 (even RFactor 1 which i still play) feels very good too. same with GT7. what you are saying in nonsence. you could boot up Grand Prix Legends and have better FFB than this new forza and that game came out in the fucking 90's Edit: And yes, ive played all the games i mentioned including the new forza, on a wheel. various wheels mind, but point still stands.
Assetto corse is a decade old, Forza is a 2023 game. It should be better, yet in almost every way, it's predecessor from 6 years ago is better. Runs better, has more cars, more tracks, more events. Forza has gone backwards, if anything. It deserves to be shat on.
I think I have a good example of the state of Forza. Was using the mustang starter car. Should be oversteery. Loaded into one of the campaign races, time to beat was a 1:07. Car felt horrible with loads of understeer everywhere. Had to use a handbrake to get any sort of rotation. Had to exit for dinner and load it again later. On the second time, time to beat was a 1:06 and the car felt completely different. I could actually check it in and get a lil rotation. Mid corner was still terrible but corner entry was ok. A GAME SHOULD NOT CHANGE SO DRASTICALLY WHEN ALL THAT I DID RELOAD THE TRACK
Its subtle but I've noticed in this game they actually turned up the tires by default so you can hear them cry easier. As opposed to previous games where you'd have to adjust that yourself. Its trivial but I feel like they're trying.
You're not crazy. It feels like this on controller too in most cars. You have to brake too much and too early to get anything to turn in. Either that or the car turns readily but immediately slides, and you lose all speed and grip. You have to play dead zone chicken with the thumbstick for every corner because if you push all the way your car slides.
