Watchmen: Killing millions to save billions 

But he still failed as Rorschach had sent proof to a newspaper if I am remembering correctly.

@@limemobber Uh, no? Rorschach got obliterated by dr man Hattan, because if truth got out, total war would happen

@@TinyBitMouse01 Prior to them going to Antarctica, Rorschach had sent his journal with his findings to a newspaper. The movie ends with ambiguity as to whether or not that journal gets looked at, though.

@@TinyBitMouse01 He sent his journal before he left.

@@nameisme9727 ah thank you, I will say, who knows how much information that could destroy the world is in that journal, I'll have to review the comic to see if they also left it ambiguous

Brilliant.😆

Holy shit that was good 👍🏼😭😂

Oh that is just brilliant

@@JorgeBraceroPR Reminds me of the joke "I don't know who this Rorschach guy is, but he sure likes drawing naked men."

Geez dude, it doesn't, the images on his mask are what you interpret them to be. It's not actually your parents fighting.

Even the Blue God cant stop his plan.

It’s in the original comic but yea it is so epic

In this Universe the bad guys win 😅

"movie" villain. You mean the graphic novel villain that was written like 20 years prior to the movie entering production?

@@FacemanGaming108 Not that he can't, but probably doesn't want to

"I'm not a comic book villain. I'm a graphic novel villain, there is a difference you know."

lol

Insert Osbourne's "I am something of a villain myself." line.

Ironically, that would be extremely fitting considering the original Ozymandias poem

@@missbelled6700 Is the same bullshit

it's hard to be burden with knowledge and capability. it's like the hardest choices requires the strongest will.

@@malikhaidar lmao you kidding me ? Special forces in the military usually all have higher then average IQ

@@mftripz8445 source?

@@malikhaidar literally quoting Thanos to justify the actions, wild.

Read his comics backstory - he took up crimefighting after his girlfriend overdosed on drugs. He was truly at a point beyond selfishness

In my timeline he says 'ant'

In order to save the colony I had to trick it.

What’s funny is that he’s absolutely right, but Ozymandius still wins.

@@destroyerblackdragon Antz reference?

yeah but he beat Dr manhattan, practically without a fight

Thanos be like killing trillions, to save trillions

Zack Snyder is the blue print

Killing trillions to save other trillions

Oh come on don't bring marvel shit everywhere

Nite Owl only killed 1 out of every 1000 people.

Lmao saaaame

That was just brilliant writing. Something no one expects.

"Oh... well I turned them all off thirty minutes ago." "Oh."

Just like he did in the original comic.

@@MMTrigger there it was space alien monster, i liked it cause it doesn't blaming dr Manhattan, but did not liked it cause, come on, space alien thing? Thats just ridiculous.

Literally what I said

Because it’s not the lame people’s style. Too many lame people today prefer to watch cheesy movies like Ghostbusters female version, Terminator Dark Fate, and Batwoman

Is the best,no doubt about it.

Agreed 100%

it was ahead of its time and way before all the superheroes movies hype . the theme is also too dark . why marvel did so well with their lighter and juvenile theme.

It's a different kind of story, one that is far too rare. Most movies are about the hero overcoming the villain and everything feels good and blah blah, but when the villain has a point this compelling, he/she can be allowed to win, and really it makes the rest of the heroic movies look like a sandbox compared to the gravitas in this ending.

Russia did something similar..

This is a line from the comic, written in 86 almost 40 years ago

He's most definitely the villain that will have bomb explode while still having 5 min remaining on the timer

@@jonathanlipp3213 Anytime anyone says something like "why don't movies/books/comics do this" or even "why isn't anything good anymore," there's a 99.9% chance they just don't bother trying to find good media and just watch the biggest hits, which by design are made extremely generic and are for 8-16 year olds who will drag their parents to see whatever Cool Thing is on

@R B Well ACKSHUALLY the squid monster is teased earlier on in the comics. Ozy hired a bunch of biological scientists to design it, and then he assassinates them too.

@R B well it was actually from our world and it had the cloned brain of a power psychic in it that's why it's scream after ozzy teleported it killed so many

It doesn’t make sense if dr Manhattan leaves. In the graphic novel ozymandias in addition to formulating the scientists to genetically engineer the squid for decades used his massive amount of resources to do a propane campaign to show extraterrestrial life could be possible

He's an American agent. He's been the dominating instrument of American will in the setting for decades. The squid worked because it was a new, neutral threat that America and the USSR would both have to be ready for. Well now, America's superhero went nuts. There would never be peace around that.

@@SmarkAngel yeah, thats why this framing dr manhattan dsnt work, shoulda kept the squid

I wish we had same villain in reality. Modern politics marches to WW3 out of pure greed.

@@heyhoe168 I really do not want to be turned to specks of dust by them. Sacrifice is a powerful thing, but being sacrificed kinda sucks.

@@MrBud85 nope, he is an average greedy politic.

@@heyhoe168 he's more than just that

@@MrBud85 believe me, he is nothing more. Product of the system and result of the time. Brother in capitalism, btw.

If I were a villain, there's no way I'd be able to resist taunting them as they try and fail, seeing their efforts in vain. He'll, I'd properly do the anime thing of explaining my overpowered abilities just to make them feel despair the hopelessness of it all. It reminds me of old saying I half remember: of a gun I ever held to your head, hope that their evil, they'll take their time pulling the trigger, enjoying the act. But if they're good, they'll just pull and kill you on the spot. For Ozy, he was the good guy in the fact he didn't enjoy it. The completion of the goal itself is what he wanted.

no. if they had stopped him billions would die in ww3, no one expected them to save anything. you clearly went into this movie with the wrong mindset. the movie frames roroshach as a flawed person who you should not be rooting for.

@@williamwoolf8072 This may have stopped WW3 temporarily, but it is not a permanent solution and only delays it. Making a bigger bad exist will only work for so long before war starts again, it’s just a flawed attempt by Ozymandias which sacrificed millions of lives for a temporary solution that doesn’t even address any of the real problems of the Cold War. Also if Dr. Manhattan actually cared about humanity, he could easily solve all of lives problems from ending world hunger and poverty and so on, but instead he lets the Cold War brew hotter and hotter and just dips after an easy band aid fix is put over it because he wasn’t doing anything to help. Rorschach is obviously flawed, but he is obviously meant to be rooted for more than Ozy or Manhattan as he can see how bullshit and insane this solution is and how people deserve to know the truth for while a large population of people were just killed. It reminds of Thanos wiping out half of all life to stop them from getting to the point that they run out of resources, which is obviously a flawed and temporarily solution to deal with a much bigger issue, just like here. TLDR: No man should have this type of power to make a decision like this, and even if they can this is a horrible solution that is temporary at best, which is why Rorschach was trying to stop it.

I can only assume you haven't seen the movie. The young guy would come to the older guys news stand and read comics.

@@DagothWit Correct. I don't remember if the theatrical cut showed much of that, but the extended director's cut does, including the animated pirate comic segments that the kid was reading.

If you read the comic they fight like cats and dogs always arguing but seeing each other everyday and there's many scenes in transition where the two of them talk while the newspaper highlights what the heroes are doing this scene shows humanity at its finest two people who argue everyday but care about each other becoming family in the face of death. Beautiful writing

As far as I'm concerned that's kind of the most important panel of the comic. It's the contrast between two shlubs who aren't even friends really, but in the final analysis recognise that we only have each other and how we are together in the here and now, and a group of high-minded superheroes, some godlike and some deranged, carrying out terrible acts of violence because they want to make the world a better place. There's a question running right the way through Watchmen, implicitly dropped by Rorschach at the start: is the world worth saving when people are capable of so much evil? And with these last few seconds of a pair of unimportant people, the coin seems to finally come down on Yes.

lol

True

Only one in this scene to be still kicking, too!!

the fucker is still alive too

Apparently not anymore. Thank god.

He was wrong. If people would kill themselves then that moment could not be avoided. Ozzy just simply delayed what was coming anyway. The only salvation for humanity is expansion towards the stars.

@@Anarchizer - But even expansion to the stars only staves off the inevitable. Mankind, to save itself, must somehow divorce itself from its own evolutionary heritage. We must breed out our violence. What Ozzy did was AT BEST deferring the coming war. But given Rorshach's journal and its probable fate, act two of this little tale becomes considerably more problematic.

So he never watched Star Trek , then he would understand the true meaning of life.

The Moral to this story. As smart as he was he was so ruled and controlled by fear that he let fear dictate all of his decisions. He had no way of knowing if either side would launch a nuke, so out of fear and I guess Hubris he did it himself. He was so smart that he could of figured out an alternative. Sick man.

@@kegginstructure He prevented humanity to face consequences.

I watched the movie first, but when I read the comic it really got to me, and I can't recommend it enough. You spend time getting to know all these regular people in the city, seeing how they interact, caring about them, then in a moment they are all gone, killed

@@EpicFail7777777 It also forces you to actually confront the monstrosity of the act. Its not a noble thing and its utterly horrific. Evil, even if done for some noble end, is still evil.

i agree, its the rare occasion a director "tweaked" an ending of a source material.... only to actually make it better, crazy really

Paul atreides: I'm going to kill billions to save bazillions

Yes

Quantity vs. Quality

More like "I'm going to kill billions so that the thousands that are left have a real reason to exterminate millions".

Only to be stopped by the power of friendship

I think he is an antihero,,, his purpose was to save humanity from themselves, even Dr Manhattan knew the world was going to end soon, sacrifice millions to save billions is a good trade

I wouldn't really call him a villain. One of the points of the movie (and comics) is that good or evil are relative.

agreed, memorable performance indeed

I would say Diligent rather than Meticulous.

With it being the major cities all over the world, pretty sure it would be billions. His math must not be so good.

@@stevegoldstein3402 He didn't say he blew up _all_ cities, and for his goal he only technically needs to attack cities on opposite sides of the Cold War. Tokyo has 14 million (probably far fewer in that time period), but the population of most-populous cities drops rapidly. So I could see the total casualty count being less than 50 million.

He’s quite literally the smartest man alive, of course he would’ve considered that.

The movie didn't drop the final line that the graphic novel did. Ozy was extremely pleased with himself when Dr. Manhattan showed up to announce he was leaving. Just as Manhattan teleports away he says "It works, for a time." Then Ozy has a mental breakdown as he realizes his plan only delays things and he can't do the math to justify his actions because he has no idea how long his "peace" will be kept. One of the hardest hitting parts of the Watchmen is that by the end of each characters story you realize each and every one is screwed harder than the last one. With Ozzy being the hardest because he did it to himself.

He would have easily tricked Wanda (MSheU). Ozy truly is the smallest man alive in the Watchmen Universe!

It's over

the watchmen have fallen

Comic book not republic

@@willasproth That’s the original quote from the graphic novel

@@NeoCreo1 is that true

@@willasproth Yeah, the movie changed it to “comic books” because they weren’t sure modern audiences would get the reference (“Republic Serial” refers to old pulp films from the 1930’s)

@@NeoCreo1 wow, what an interesting fact

I agree but don’t you think that not using an external threat like the alien monster and using what is basically a weapon of the US of A may actually generate conflict, against aforementioned USA ?

Technically the squid creature did the same thing, it scared the entire planet into unity because they were afraid an inter-dimensional abomination was going to return. 🤷🏼‍♂️ I’m on the fence, both could have been acceptable if done properly.

I honestly prefer the Squid Monster. I like the change to Manhattan and it works for the film but Manhattan was quite literally a U.S weapon and citizen for most of this film. People would be blaming the U.S for not keeping proper control of literally the single most power 'weapon' they possess. The Squid Monster works better because it has no prior affiliation, it was simply an unforeseeable disaster outside of humanities control, they don't know where it came from and when it would strike again which would work to unite humanity as they would come together against a threat outside of their own creation and control. I get why Zach changed it because he might have thought it was too dumb or didn't fit the tone but it really worked in the graphic novel and I'm sure it could work again but Zach already changed very important aspects of the graphic novel that it doesn't really matter.

@@nicholaskhanyola989 I might be totally off base but I seem to recall (or just imagined? who knows) that the squid got changed because it was difficult to fit in the interstitials of the boat in a way first time audience would be able to follow (which are sort of necessary scenes to keep the entire thing from feeling like a complete ass-pull).

@@missbelled6700 I think you might be right. I'd still prefer the squid to Manhattan but I guess that could be difficult to do within the story Snyder was telling.

I was always happy to see those 2 make it into the movie as well lol, if you know you know, i often think of the book the black kid was reading too lol, for some reason its just another random story inside of a story lol

Just a bunch of edgelords

@@CeeDoubleU "Ozymandius did nothing wrong..." "Ok, he's going to sacrifice your ass..." "I change my mind... "

I think you're wrong. Most people at the end of the day would not make that sacrifice because the weight of what they were about to do would dawn on them and most people would not want millions of deaths on their hands. The Dark Knight portrays this type of decision perfectly with the people in the two individual ferries. Doing horrible things for the "greater good" is evil and only a sociopath finds that acceptable.

Agree. Actually I think people would sacrifice many strangers to save few loved ones.

funny that someone else mentioned Eren Jaeger in this comment section because people who defend him make the exact same argument you're using to argue *against* Ozymandias. I guess it's kind of a "no shit" conclusion since they have opposing ideologies essentially but i just think it's interesting how both are extremely polarising.

I don't know that it was intentional. If it was, he's even more deranged than he first appears. After all, the fragile peace he creates is predicated on a lie, paid for with the blood of millions. If that lie is uncovered and the peace fades slowly to the brink of war again, their deaths were in vain from the start.

To be fair, even a broken clock is right twice a day. One good movie does not excuse another bad one. The true mark of a master, is consistency of performance.

oh its totally possible to make a more comic-accurate adaptation. literally another watchmen just adding the squid from the comics would make it comic-accurate

@@sleystad872 I actually prefer this to the squid ending. It allows dr Manhattan to leave forever

It was storyboarded and written for him, which is why it was great. He’s a _fantastic_ director of photography, he’s an artist with a camera, but his actors and plot suffer immensely when he tries to do everything himself. Case in point: Lex Luthor. The lines are fine, menacing even, but the delivery was seriously lacking. A good director would have fixed that rather than put manic pixie Eisenberg opposite of Superman at the climax.

@@vysharra Have to disagree, they went with a young & modern ego-centric billionaire pyscho genius, if he delivered lines like an old man or deep voice or slow delivery, there wouldnt be enough difference in character between lex clark and bruce, the dynamic of these individual characters having their own personality that greatly differs is better than a bunch of dudes that look, sound, and move the same all in conflict with one another. Bruce is already brooding and clark is troubled with his own existence, having the lex many mostly knew from the animated movies wouldn't pose enough dynamic to the other characters.

It’s not a great adaptation of the book, but it did for cbm what the original did for cb

It'll get the respect it deserves in time. Lots of great art is not appreciated in its time.

The problem is, the good parts of the movie are really just Snyder staying faithful to the comic, in that the comic is a masterpiece. And that's half the problem for the film. It is very hard to replicate a masterpiece.

If you take a picture of the Joconde it won't be a beautiful picture just because you have the Joconde on it... The difference here is that the movie try so hard to look like the book sometimes even shot per shot, that the quality of the film are not to be credited to the film it self but to the quality of the books it was adapted of, and there's the problem with the ending, in the book it end kinda the same way except it's a giant telepathic squid that destroy New York, not Dr. Manhattan... If Allan Moore made that choice it was because the squid was so different from anything humanity could imagine that it cannot be replicated unlike Dr. Manhattan that the US government has studied, so the day humanity can replicate his power I don't give much of this new found peace... While for the squid, it's the opposite, it's so radically different the only solution humanity has it's to ally to face the threat... So basically the book tells us to be aware of symbols and how people use history while the movie tell us that fiction can't be trusted and to not believe those that tell you story while telling us a story, it's completely autodestructive, by replacing the squid with Dr. Manhattan Snyder got himself stuck to come up with something that would has symbolic has the squid was...

This came out at a time where Superhero movies were very by the book, bright and had you leaving the theater with a smile on your face. This wasn’t that movie. It challenges the entire notion of the superhero and people simply didn’t know how to react. This was wayyyy ahead of its time. You release this now, it’d probably do a lot better..

Have you read the graphic novel??

@@AReallyLongAndUnremakableUser No unfortunately

@@mohamedomar6862 its worth buying.

@@AReallyLongAndUnremakableUser Will do👌

The incredibles wants to know your location.

That's why in the comic he used an unexplainable octopus monster. He thought a collective shared fear and the need to prepare for something impossible suddenly happening again might just be enough to unify humanity indefinitely. Of course in the comic Ozymandias was not as sure as the movie one that his plan would work. He was actually spurred on by his fear and ego and did not see an obvious solution like the movie version.

​@@bdeamon1 Which is why the comic is superior.

The reason USSR and US are much closer to nuclear war in Watchmen is because Manhattan is giving the US an insane ace. He can wipe out the USSR at any moment and is constantly helping the Americans win wars to tip the scales in their favor. He can even stop Soviet nukes in flight. No shit the Soviets are way more paranoid and Americans way more ballsy in this universe. The world would be saved because Manhattan would be blamed for killing people on both sides AND leaving Earth, no longer making the balance of power…unbalanced.

@@HarryK-ld2ed I doubt that

The "Truth" would have led to continued escalation and eventually nuclear war. Only a lemming (a worse concept than even a Sheep) would blindly want to follow destruction so badly for an ideal. No wonder Dr. Manhattan was curious about humanity's nonsensical nature too.

I agree with you. That was one of the most powerful messages in the film and it ties into reality as well.

@@Swordsman99k Ozzy's plan was retarted. Humans would have been right back to square 1 in less than 5 yrs at most. Its the anatomy of misremembering.

"The person is smart, People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it"

Alan Moore declared on an interview that he made Rorschach as the guideline of what people shouldn’t strive for, absolutes, (That’s the reason why the character sees things black and white, his mask is symbolic of this) but made him so understandable as a character that people took a liking to him. Rorschach was not the “good guy” but the idealized and romanticized hero. Ironic for people not to see this.

rorschach asked for it to show manhattan that while possessing godlike powers, he doesnt have what it takes to change humanity s nature

Or turn him into a flower.

As good Watchmen is, the capabilities of Dr. Manhattan is a huge plot hole . For example: Why couldn’t Dr. Manhattan just make every nuke simply disappear before they were even fired?

@@mariopalos9238 i think thats a plothole, not loophole

@@handleonafridge6828 Great point! But the answer would probably be that humanity would then just use conventional missiles to destroy each other. And if those were taken away, they would use regular guns and knives and bats to destroy each other. The goal was to get people to stop fighting each other and instead cooperate with each other, in the face of a common enemy. Taking away one form of weapon would just lead to the use of other weapons.

If he cares so much I don't think a large-scale massacre should have him screaming with joy, no matter how many people it would save.

​@Giovanni Martinez And how would your argument work if that "save everyone else" wasn't in quotations? Why do you condone mass murder for personal reasons? Why isn't "the safety of everyone else" as much of a personal reason as "I love my child"?

@Giovanni Martinez Its not selfish because he isn't doing it for personal gain Evil maybe But his intention is world peace and maybe he doesn't care for the individuals but he cares about the human race

@Consilium Pacis Why not? He thinks he just saved billions of lives. It’s perfectly reasonable for him to cry for joy considering his mindset. Not to mention it makes him much more interesting and unique than the “I’m doing the wrong thing for the right reason so I’m dark, conflicted, and brooding all the time” cookie cutter villain. We all know the real reason comic Ozymandias wasn’t in this movie is because Snyder can’t direct a convincingly happy character to save his life.

@Giovanni Martinez fundamentally, you can see nothing but megalomania in this clip. In the comics when he screams with joy at preventing nuclear war (although as the pirate comic illustrates, it may not have happened) you can at least see his intent was to help people. You can claim he is evil and you may well be right but seeing his joy at helping people adds a layer of nuance

It even has the rich egomaniacal German dude at the head

I think he's the only comic book villain that actually subverted our expectations. He didn't reveal his entire plan to the heroes, giving them a chance to stop him. He told them everything AFTER it was done.

Sounds like an excellent class- got any course materials left over?

@@zonian1966 AND the ‘Atomic clock’ on the wristwatch ‘1 minute to 0 boom.’ I mean wow I have watched this movie so many times and still pick up stuff.

Actualy Thanos in MCU intended to kill half of the galaxy's population so the other half would trive with the resource the galaxy can afford. On the side note I prefer condoms than mega genocide.

@kid man no it wouldn't have worked, the entire thing is stupid. It would provide aboundance for the remaining 50% for a time only because they benefited of the production left by the other 50%. In the years 1700 the world population was about 10% of what it is today and yet the 18th century was not remembered for its lack of poverty

Creating double the resources would have only went against Thanos's plan in the first place, to slow down development since he saw what happened with his people when they reached max capacity

The problem is this: Who the fuck are you to judge who lives or dies? "I think we should start bringing the world peace by killing you and your family first." If you disagree with that statement, then you are a hypocrite. I would have had so much respect for Thanos if his snap included himself. But no, he wanted to play God and murdered countless lives while sparing his life. To me, he is no different than a school shooter.

@@csguak Oh I don’t really agree even if logically he was “right”, it’s morally grey too which is why he’s such a good villain. Thanos DID include himself in the snap canonically in the comics, he simply won the 50/50 coin toss and survived. Not sure if that applied in the movie though.

@@csguak but the whole point is that it chose at complete random, Thanos even sacraficed his daughter he loved to get an infinity stone, the only true and far way was that the snap, snapped Half of everyone which could have included himself

“You know we can’t let you do that?”

You will find no greater evil than someone acting in the name of the greater good under the premise that the ends justify the means.

Its almost like people agree with Ozy just for the sake of it, not because he did the right thing (because he did not). Like you said, the moment it became a subject of numbers, humanity failed

"His goal may be 'for the greater good', but whenever we demote the value of people (every individual) to JUST numbers in calculation, we as humanity have already failed" Naive platitude. As far as I'm concerned Ozymandias is the anti-hero and Rorsach's the misguided villain who thinks he was doing the right thing but was in fact causing harm. The coming 2nd U.S. civil war would already have come had it not been for WW2, the Cold War, and 9/11. Common threats make people band together. If supergeniuses like Ozymandian really existed, and were able to trick humanity into banding together and living peacefully at the cost for a few million, I'd call that a bargain.

@@The1980Philip That logic reduces humans to ants in an ant farm.

@@aureate We ARE like ants in an ant farm. Believing otherwise is the height of conceit. Humans are NOT special. Rights are, ultimately, acquired and enforced by might. People just delude themselves into believing they've been endowed such rights by their "creator" because the reality of it is uncomfortable to contemplate. People often label me as cynical, but I'm just realistic.

The comic book universe isn't real life. It's implied the existence of Doctor Manhattan (as his status of living nuclear deterrent and functional God, who also ended the Vietnam war in America's favor) was accelerating the nuclear arms race even worse than it did in real life.

@@HideyoshiKinoshita84 still, it is just implied not shown/experienced. The ambiguity remains, it's not set in stone even if the author himself told it

Yup! I feel like I'm on crazy pills sometimes. He was wrong. He had no faith in humanity.

@@HideyoshiKinoshita84 So nothing in this movie matters because it has no bearing on reality or our world? It's just a pointless, silly little story about funny men in costumes?

@@nonuvurbeeznus795 I think that he's not saying that since it's a comic it does not matter, he's saying that since this is a comic, in this alternate reality, which is different from our earth, things could have gone differently

Thanos did something similar if I recall

Not really, they knew Thanos's plan from his children, they knew his goal. They just couldn't stop him@@joshuacarpenter5997

Might not be the case tomorrow or the next day. Things can change in an instant, one second it’s peaceful, the next is annihilation.

So far

*We win,* you misanthropes. Every day we wake up, every night we go to bed, _we refute you._ Stop dragging us down, akchually.

The geopolitical situation in Watchmen is different, due to America taking Vietnam. Then again, it’s hard to imagine a situation with tensions higher than those of the Cuban Missile Crisis.

That's the wrong MCU parallel imo. This is more in line with Secretary Pierce.

@@MrDK0010 'Humanity cannot be trusted with its own freedom' Personally I think thats a much more engaging motive then Thanos genocide to conserve resources

@@taleoftwowolves74 Indeed, this scene reminds me much more of Hydra than Thanos.

Inception, Edge of Tomorrow, Jumper, Good Will Hunting, Shawshank Redemption, The Prestige, Pulp Fiction, Constantine, Gladiator, The Departed, Collateral, Hot Fuzz, The Fifth Element all be like: "ARE WE JOKES TO YOU??"