Way of the Astral Self Monk in Tasha's Cauldron of Everything | Nerd Immersion 

Wisdom modifier plus monk level on deflect energy got pretty insane once you got to higher levels because you were reducing the damage by 1d10+25 at 20th level which made things like dragons breath not really a concern even if you fail the dex save.

But the arms last 10 minutes, on subsequent turns you can attack and use flurry

Okay but that's not what OP said. He said on the first turn you summon the arms you can't use an extra attack or flurry of blows and they're correct.

Yeah, that confused me for a moment.

@@ringodingo6990 I assume you meant the martial arts attack? Because the actual Extra Attack is part of the action, so that's free to go on level 5.

@@AguionStryke yeh but you dont start off at level 5 do you? You get the arms at level 3 so when you get the ability you can't attack with it the same turn. Like I said.

I'm actually running a game like that right now. We started before this book came out, so there wasn't a healer monk option, but the rest of the roles are pretty well filled. We have Open Hand, Four Elements, Kensei, Shadow, and Drunken Master, and I gave them a homebrew item that lets them spend ki points to heal each other.

These ideas are awesome

"DM, can I make an investigation check to search for a road roller?" 😂😂😂

@@augustocoelho105 "You're in a fantasy world dude, so that's MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDAAAAA !! WRYYYYYYYYYY!"

I'd honestly go for foresight, timestop is kind of garbage.

@@skullkrusher-dx4kg do you not get the joke? It’s an anime reference

@@justmyself5770 i do get the reference im saying foresight works better.

But visage only costs 1 point?

@@codebracker No, it costs 2. 1 for the arms and another for the visage.

@@ShirotoraGodsbane you don't need to use arms tho? unless you want the body bonus

@@codebracker Yeah, but I'm talking about powering up like in DBZ, as in for combat. Why would I not activate the arms in combat?

They removed the free bonus action attacks which would have made the arms better than simply using a monk weapon, but was what made the high cost for the subclass's abilities worth it.

Also once you hit level 11 it is now obsolete and and that ASI is basically gone for good. But considering most campaigns don’t go much higher it’s still an option. Edit: forgot you can retrain on ASI so I guess you can switch to Blind Fighting or something else.

Give em grappler feat, and that poor monster is never hitting anything ever again.

@@davidsoyele7829 If the character is also a Simic Hybrid with Grappling Appendages, they get another unarmed strike AND can grapple at the same time!

how does that works? i mean, if u grap him u cant hit him right?

I love them too but my favourite is the one she put for this particular class 😂

All of Tasha's notes for Artificer subclasses are just choice

I think its too much twiter comment for my taste

ORA ORA ORA ORA ORA!!!!

STANDO POWAAA

MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA MUDA!!

WRYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yare-Yare

I agree . I have been interested in this subclass since UA and im happy they nefted the KI point ability as it was a bit much considering monks regen their massive amount of KI in just a short rest. I think its been balance well but suffers from post Xanithar issues of outclassing some older classes.

I like tha adjustment as it makes the late game weaker, but streamlines the early game to make it feel nicer.

I do think the class was a bit overnerfed with removing the extra attacks from the first feature, nerfing the deflect ability AND removing the ki Recovery. Feel like they could atleast have kept the high level feature.

It's such a small yet significant change, originally there was zero way of improving the arms externally whereas now the Talisman of Claws or whatever it's called can be used to enhance them.

@@martinfriis4613 Honestly, that ki recovery was absolutely insane. Even without the bottle of ants idea, it's not that much to reduce a creature to 0 especially with as many attacks as you can make

@@martinfriis4613 That was totally insane. It doesn't matter if the monk needed those things or not - it was totally unfair compared to other subclasses. I'm glad Astral Self got nerfed to a needed degree. It's still strong, possibly stronger than old subclasses, but is no longer as blatantly unbalanced.

I think it's an overall buff. The class was really powerful at the end, but it was almost worse than a base monk until you got to level 11. At least now its viable for the entire length of the class.

That's actually sounds so cool

And now that they do force damage instead of radiant/necrotic it kinda works really well

@@Nildread Yeah you can even flavour the armour to be artificer inspired too having it iron man-form over your body in the later levels. Even the normal monk feature of stunning strike, could be reflavoured to a taser like punch from the mecha-fist.

More like a Mechanus Self than Astral Self

I also like the idea of them being holographic arms. Gnome technology is getting crazy!

Which makes it quite horrible. If you don't insta kill the caster, your low saving throws will hurt you pretty bad from these effects.

@@archmagemc3561 Monks do however get Proficiency in every Saving Throw via Diamond Soul.

@@jamesgrieves2669 truly, Diamond is Unbreakable

@@jamesgrieves2669 Sure, but that means very little. They get Wisdom and Con, the first and third most common saving throw, Chasima, the 2nd most rare, and Int, the rarest saving throw proficency. They technically get Death save proficency as well, but if your making death saves, you screwed up something fierce and 2 kobolds can kill you with coup de graces anyway. Meanwhile, at HALF THE LEVEL paladins get +5 to ALL saving throws that STACKS with their proficiency and it applies to the whole team. Monks would need expertise in all saving throws to justify that level requirement since paladins get a better version of it at level 6.

@@archmagemc3561 why are you comparing it to paladins???? the point is that monks can deal with incapacitation because they have many ways to avoid magic effects/attacks. This has nothing to do with the paladin

What is this Jotaro’s theme? All I’ve got is a piano

Yeah this would be a very strong dip. The question is when to do it in the level progression. Argument for doing it early is to get that d8 damage dice asap before you get it anyway from natural monk level progression but this delays ASIs in a class that is notoriously MAD (slightly less so when you can lean on WIS more with this subclass but DEX is still a god stat and monks need the HP from a half decent CON)

If you don't need or don't want the action surge, you don't need the dip: just make a variant human, or a new lineage type, and get the feat that let you get a fighting style. Then you can learn it. But I do think that a 3 level dip in fighter is very good. You can get a battle master, and pick up that grappling strike manuever. Lets not forget riposte too hahaha. Any class with a little dip in fighter gera good hahaha.

@@GustavoMartins-hg9wl a 3 level dip loses you empty body, so it probably isn't worth it

@@FilosofiadiCazzeggio I do think it would depend on the level limit we are talking about . A normal campaing ends at most level 12, so it would be good to get it after level 7 or so...

@@GustavoMartins-hg9wl yeah, if you aren't going for late levels it's worth considering a fighter dip, although I'd probably go for more precious ki at lower levels of monk

Are you sure it isn't ARMara?

@@Nildread lol

I feel like 4 elements fits better tbh. Astral Monk only fits her Brawl tree. You lack her PhaseCast, Grasp, and Flare. Maybe Wildfire Druid would be good as a dip for casty shit

@@jakestavinsky3480 ya I definitely think you would have to multi class to make the character

WotC has repeatedly stated than none of the balance is taking magic items into account anyway, meaning you could probably run a game without it. Now, they say that, yet a lot of monsters are just straight up resistant/immune to nonmagical attacks, so...

@@bouboulroz they say so, yet theres no point in playing a fighter unless you have magic weapons

@@The_Yukki That's... exactly what I said. Anyway, Monks can just use tattoos to make up for their lack of damage now. Just get the Eldritch Claw Tattoo (shouldn't be too hard as it's uncommon) and call it a day.

@@bouboulroz my bad, read the first part only >,

@@The_Yukki Been there, done that. It's okay, we wouldn't play d&d if we were afraid to look silly once in a while.

Not entirely sure if it works that way. The feat makes your unnarmed attacks do a d6 if you are holding anything in your hands, and a d8 if you are bare handed. It uses strenght, but as a monk, your unnarmed attacks use your best ability acorde bettewn str and dex. It is also start as a d4 that is your martial die, as oppoised to the normal that would be a 1+ your mod. So just like a using a weapon, you would do the d8 for most of your damage. Also, when a you can retrain your fighting style when you get a ASI. So It is not really a loss. I beg pardon if I am wrong, but I don't think that there is anything against the rules, neither you would lose anything.

​@@GustavoMartins-hg9wl I think you missed my point. First, yes, you can make Monk attacks with Strength, if you decide to build a Strength based Monk. The point is, that is not how Monks tend to be built, since Strength has poor Stat synergy. Dexterity does more overall. Second, a Quarterstaff does the same amount of damage as the Feat does...

@@moquips but the feat lets you do a 1d4 damage if you are grappling the enemy, and as a astral self, you can use wisdom to strength checks like athletics. You will not really need strength. Also, the feats lets you retrain at a ability score increase level, so you can pick another one when it is irrelevant. With the right combo, you can grapple the enemy with a bonus action with tavern brawler, and then give advantage for your part members to attack him. And then you attack it in the next turn, and give them hell. Damn you could even thrown him as if he was a improvised weapon hahaha.

There's a feat in this book that just gives you a fighting style

Sees Yoroichi: "Ah yes, a fellow man of culture"

I mean, yeah. But I think it's still pretty balanced, considering that many weapons a Fighter can use deals a d8 of damage (or even more), and monk can use monk weapons and/or DEX for attack.

@@ender4101 It's not unbalanced at all. I think it just shows that monks might need to get that d8 a bit faster :P

@@typoko Eh, maybe. I don't think it would be bad if they did it.

Oh and it gets better. In Tasha's, when you hit a level where you ASI you can change fighting style. MY MONK CAN GET FIGHTER SUPERIORITY DIE OR BE A DARKNESS FIGHTER. Blind fighting! Have a friendly cast darkness, where the only thing that escapes is the screams of your enemies Superior Strategy! IDK, take trip attack or disarming strike. Hell dude, just disarm that one. Screw THAT guy in particular! In essence, do your 4 attack monk (4d8+5 from level five onwards) until LVL 12, where then you just go even further beyond

but it's with strength modifier instead of dex

Since visage gives you basically drow style darkvison I would go the thrown fighting style

@@rabbidcreature9681 Blindsight is useful even if you have darkvision since invisible foes can still screw with you without it

Nvl1 fighting initiate, unarmed fighting style, be a 1d8 unarmed strike monk

@@nshikamaru08 Yes, but that feat will become useless when your martial arts die becomes a d8. To off set this, use the mechanic that lets you switch it to another fighting style at that level (or ASI I believe).

If your target is grappled, Unarmed Fighting also lets you do 1d4 bludgeoning damage after all of your other attacks. This sadly doesn't get upgraded, since it isn't an unarmed strike.

You do have a point . But it would be good to get other feats like sentinel, and use that extra range , or even grappler and/or tavern brawler so you can grapple as a bonus action and get advantage on all your attacks.

Keep in mind, you can still hit with your meat appendages too.

Yes, you can. A Simic Hybrid's Grappling Appendages (or the Tavern Brawler feat) can be used to grapple as part of an attack action, and then Unarmed Fighting allows you to deal another 1d4 damage afterwards. RAW, unarmed strikes from Grappling Appendages cannot be used in addition to Astral Barrage, because they are not your astral arms. But if the target of Astral Barrage was grappled by any means, you can still add the 1d4 damage from Unarmed Fighting, because that one is not stated to be an unarmed attack. So that means the ideal combo at 17th+ level would be: Activate Arms of the Astral Self; make 2 unarmed strikes from your basic and extra attack, 2 unarmed strikes from Flurry of Blows, 1 unarmed strike from Ki-Fueled Attack (optional feature) and 1 unarmed strike from Grappling Appendages. That's 6 unarmed strikes that each deal 1d10 + your STR, DEX or WIS modifier in force damage. Use Grappling Appendages to grapple. Use Unarmed Fighting to add 1d4 bludgeoning damage. Bottom line: If you have Grappling Appendages, you don't even need to use Astral Barrage!

@@RokuroCarisu Thanks for that explaination :)

I was thinking beast path but yeah the pun is worth it.

My favorite thing is that the most you can take from any dex save is a quarter damage. Also the strength monk reigns supreme.

I'd go combat Zenyatta. Astral self all the way! (Although sun soul is kinda nice for that ranged attack)

I'd actually say that Zenyatta would be a Cleric. Monks in DnD are frontline fighters, swiftly dodging attacks and stunning enemies up in the enemies' faces. Zen, on the other hand, prefers to stay on the backline, supporting his team with healing and damage buffs while only jumping in when he uses his ultimate. While he can do decent damage, he typically does it from the backline, avoiding much of the skirmishes that the tanks and close-ranged damage heroes often find themselves in. While some cleric subclasses can be on the frontline and perform well, others prefer to stay back and let other people tank damage while they support, so I think this would fit better. As for which subclass he could be, I'd go with Life Domain because Preserve Life can act as a good stand-in for Transcendence. Grave domain could also work since the Path to the Grave can give a damage boost similar to Discord Orb, if a bit more extreme.

Was planning to do the same thing LOL

the things a uncommon magic item so if your any kind of monk I HIGHLY recommend the magic item

Look There is 30+ magical sword 10+ magical axes 2 or 3 Magic spear (I want more spear) You can actually give Monk an offensive item lol

@@anonyme4881 Very true, but to add onto your spear point I also want more bow

@@allenfortenberry9924 I want more magic item in general.

20th level Divination Wizard

What people often forget is that we have the right of an opinion, but the DUTY of making an informed and responsible one

I usually just give em the "Dude" gif/quote.

It is so sad when people are incorrect. No opinions for you

astral monks can swap their strength and wisdom mods around when summoning the arms which means that an astral monk at lvl 3 can do 1d8 + wisdom per punch (3d8 +12 if all land excluding crits and if wis = 18)...just food for thought

Yeah, you'd definitely not want to keep it with most Monk subclasses, although it's a bit more generally synergistic with Way of the Astral Self thanks to the Wisdom based Strength checks making grappling way more accessible to a Monk of that flavor.

I'm pretty sure it is "a" martial weapon, not "all" martial weapons. Short Swords are martial weapons.

Though i had an idea of making a bugbear astral self monk with high wisdom multiclassing for 2 levels in to war cleric for divine favor. Because divine favor gives you a d4 on every attack you make. So you boosted your damage output by quite a bit and the benefit over hunters mark or hex is that divine favor is on yourself so you don't have to use a bonus action everytime you kill someone.

You can take Fighting Style as Feat. Though I think there are better things for monk to take.

The blast of energy the arms make are not a melee attack

No it don't, but you can retrain it and get other fighting style.

No, action surge only gives an extra action. You only ever have 1 bonus action

True but you can swap the fighting out at level 12

@@NerdImmersion Oh, I didn't know that. If that's an optional rule in Tasha's, I haven't gotten it yet because I'm hoping to win your giveaway!

@@rallozarx4215 not an optional rule, that's just part of the feat's wording!

Yeah, that's the general issue with monks. They're kinda like rogues in that they still need a solid frontline tank and then they can dance around them. My shadow monk always was the first to go down if I didn't retreat or patient defence after every attack

My issue with this one in particular is that your "Stand" doesn't really come out until level 17.

One unlucky game is in no way a display of subclass strength.

@@RokuroCarisu They worded better so the stand come out at lv 11

@@antongrigoryev6381 it's not even that she was unlucky though; if it weren't for the armorer artificer with sentinel she probably wouldve been killed outright. the 10 foot reach is great so long as enemies don't get within attacking range. enemies like, for example, fire elementals with 50 feet of movement who can set you aflame just by passing through your space

Yeah the capstone is actually really terrible compared to the UA version. You don't get a 6th attack anymore, and now that you have force AoE in the Astral monk, it competes with this capstone. I don't think you can use the AoE after popping the capstone. And finally you gave up 5 potential uses of stunning strike to unlock these once-per-turn attacks. Which seems like a poor tradeoff.

@@bodbyss it's written that you summon all 3 parts with the capstone, arms included. The way I understand it is that you still can do the AoE damage. The capstone is still terrible though

I can honestly agree (even if the comparison is technically a bit hyperbolic in so far that the capstone stacks with all the previous subclass features and doesn't require concentration). Without the Ki Consumption trait, not to mention the way the feature has been reflavored, it really feels like it's missing something to give the full awakening an appropriate level of impact. Also, using that Haste spell comparison, it could be said to effectively be even less cost effective than the much complained about Way of the Four Elements subclass's Ki prices for spells. Trimming the fat and making everything more streamlined throughout the rest of the features I think was handled pretty well, but the capstone deserved a bit more tweaking, even at the risk of being more complex. First thing I'd do, make the cost 4 Ki. The only reason the original version was so expensive was because you could easily recover the cost as part of the feature, so simply half the cost is not enough of a reduction. With it set to 4 instead of 5, the Monk's level 20 Perfect Self feature would allow one to always be able to bring out their fully Awakened Astral Self each battle (at the expense of having no Ki on hand for any other usage, though, so it still doesn't make the feature particularly worth doing every fight as is, since it's then overtly limiting your flexibility with base class features). Next, some options for how to make it stronger. It's already adding an additional attack (alongside the level 11 plus one martial arts die per turn on attack of your choice that you can easily pick to add to a crit), so additional passive improvements to damage output should be taken off the table. Increasing the burst damage when activating it might not be out of the question, though, or maybe more favorably adding an additional effect to that burst damage, like knocking the targets prone or imposing disadvantage on the saving throw against it to make up for the higher upfront cost of summoning the Arms this way instead of in the previous ways. Or, you could Stun creatures that fail the Dex saving throw when you activate it, as an extension of your Stunning Strike (which might help against high Con monsters, but is a bit more unwieldy to repeat within the same combat). That said, it's a bit late in the class to be enhancing that burst of damage aspect and it'd not really fit as a bullet point of a "when it's active" trait, so maybe not the best option? The other thing the capstone could do is enhance other existing features of the subclass. Some ideas that jump out at me are making Deflect Energy no longer take a reaction, and/or being able to use it like Deflect Missiles to hold the energy in your astral arms' hands and throw it as attack as part of the reaction, not requiring the reduce the dame to 0 part (although, the fact that it was nerfed to not include Monk level was quite the disappointment ...honestly, this idea could have been part of the level 11 feature including the reduce to 0 requirement if not for the nerf, always found it weird the feature was named after the base class one yet didn't just copy its mechanics wholesale). ...And, I got tired of writing the comment, been setting on it unfinished for a while and already too long anyway.

@@iandormoy7487 Maybe you can do the AoE when you activate the capstone, but you can't re-do the AoE on the next turn by spending the ki point. Which you could possibly do if your capstone wasn't active. That AoE every turn actually seems like one of the best features a monk could possibly have unless you're purely fighting one single creature. 2d10 to 2 or more creatures, vs an extra d10 + mod to one creature as an example.

Monks as a class get to make a single unarmed strike as a bonus action with martial arts and at second level they can expend ki points to use flurry of blows which is two unarmed strikes as a bonus action. Hope I helped :)

@@evanboeckh5033 ahh that's what I thought but then it wouldnt be special for astral self which is what confused me

And this is a problem... why? You have options, you aren't forced into one pattern of behavior, why it is bad? Plus if there are at least two enemies, AoE already worth it.

If there's at least 2 targets in range, the AoE is probably better than making 2 attacks.

@@antongrigoryev6381 not really You lose out on 2x your dex. So if you have a +3 dex at lvl 3 a flurry of blows does 2d4+6 if you hit both. This ability does 2d4 assuming they fail the save

@@TheGolleum13 The ability deals twice martial die to one target, so it's 2d4 to each and 4d4 in total. Considering average Dex at 3rd lvl as +3 and average d4 roll as 2.5, and assuming the chance of miss and of successful save the same, you don't lose that much, while getting reach for a minute in the process. And reach early on is super useful if you have other frontline characters - monks are not the tankiest characters.

@@antongrigoryev6381 but you are procing yourself out of using a quarter staff so you are downgrading from 1d8 to 1d4 for the duration of the ability I am just saying you are losing damage by taking it, and while the reach might be worth it in some campaigns its very much a trade off. Its also better to do all that damage on 1 target than it is to spread it out. Killing one off is better for the action economy. If it was the exact same damage (which it isnt) its still better to unload on 1 enemy

JoJo Bizarre Adventure, but your stand is Susanoo.

You can indeed use all of the Astral Self powers with your echo. Taking 3 levels in Echo Knight Fighter with the Unarmed Fighting style and the other 17 levels in Astral Self Monk should be ideal. If you want to go for maximum "ORA!", play a Simic Hybrid with Grappling Appendages and get the Grappler feat. ;)

monks naturally have proficiency with shortswords, a martial weapon

@@thurismundbotheric7598 Just checked, fair enough. Didn't think Shortswords were martial.

@@Cosmic_K13 No worries, it's easy to forget since you almost never see them

Turn 1... Movement: if needed in order to get into range Bonus Action: Awakened Astral Self Action: Attack three times (Stunning Strike if any hit) Turn 2+... Movement: not needed Action: Attack 3 times (advantage if stunned) Bonus Action: Flurry of Blows (attack two more times as a bonus action)

Whaaat, why seya ? I ser nothing alike. You mean the armor?

I feel you man, imagine you punch and It is like a dragon flying out of your arm, or a Pegasus coming as you do Flurry of Blows