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@@mattt198654321 Its nothing to be cut off of. Those times when these magnetos were used (they were actually primary used for little 2tact starting motors, that started bigger tractor diesels, so they tend to not last long, as theyre designed for short operatio time), people were also still able to rewind or wind from scratch their ignition coils. Diatributors, caps and rotors, and ignition contacts made bigger problems. But the bigges problem were batteries actually. In soviet union there was a huge problem of shortage of batteries. And their quality was also very low.
That's the kind of starting mechanism they have for the last working tiger tank at the bovington tank museum right? (Forgive me if I've misspelled the museum name, I've never been) I remember seeing a video on some of the tanks there and their maintainance
@@dylanshepherd6232 No, the hand crank on the model Ts turned the engine's crankshaft directly. You have to be careful of kick-back on those because it could break fingers, your wrist, or possibly your arm.
I say: these guys never cease to amaze me with these experiments. And the viewers that suggest these experiments are great too. But it's even better to see the G54 way of making these ideas work. And thanks for BMI for translating these videos!
That's pretty cool, although there are special magnetos for 4-cylinder engines, that would be much simpler to use. These single contact magnetos are likely from old stationary or marine engines, and are quite hard to find in working condition, the 4 contact ones are more common from what i've found. I'm always on the look for functioning single contact magnetos since i'm working on a lot of old stationary engines from the early 1900s.
Another classic Garage 54 video. Next while on the topic of magnetos, maybe fit a 1-cylinder motorcycle engine (or similar) to the Lada. Or better yet 1 motorcycle engine per wheel. Also saw a video a while back of someone putting an outboard boat engine into a car - that would be interesting to see your take on as well. Keep up the good work - love watching what you guys come up with.
I think a 1 cyl motorcycle engine just strapped right to a Lada gearbox (perhaps with the motorcycle transmission intact for extra gear reduction) would be a fun video... heck if that works, maybe just keep going smaller and smaller until they can't get it to move anymore XD
@v2nce That isn't that crazy, a Mercruiser V8 is just a standard automotive V8 with some slight modifications (special cooling accessories and sometimes water-cooled exhaust manifolds)
@v2nce Technically the Mercruiser is an inboard/outboard (not a full inboard, but not a full outboard either). That sounds like an interesting video nonetheless
Flywheel & fan combination on small engine mowers are my only exposure to magnetos. I always marveled at how simple & serviceable it was as a method of providing spark. Maybe the chip shortage will prompt auto manufacturers to rethink their current assumptions. Great episode garage54. 107%
This video reminded me how much I miss the good ol’ carbureted car engines. Very simple basic engines that are very easy to diagnose and repair. Maintenance is easy to , no computers and 100 different sensors that are needed to run the vehicle, and yes the will run (and possibly clutch start) without a battery.
It wouldn't work. It would ignite at the beginning of every stroke. 2 TDC and 2 BDC. Meaning, it would ignite the mixture at BDC of the compression stroke (which is after the intake stroke) and not work. That's the reason why manufacturers used 2 coils for a wasted spark system in 4 cylinder engines. If they could save time and money by not adding another coil, they would have. But they could just run 2. Since they're already wasting a spark.
Nice video, love the whole magneto thing. Also the hesitation and loss of power at 4000 revs is most likely due to the lack of an advance on the ignition timing. Higher revs require a more advanced spark. Keeping the spark timed the same across the board will limit you to a certain RPM range. Anyway awesome video.
Don’t really need 4000 rpm really not if it’s geared worth a shit. I rarely exceed 3500 rpm in my Saturn on the Highway only when I back down to 4th to pass someone.
@@308dad8 I was mostly just explaining why it wasn't wanting to run higher than 4000 RPM. Truth is it wouldn't have any power past 3000-3500 because the spark isn't advanced as the RPM rises. To get optimum spark timing across the board, distributors advance the timing as the engine speed increases. A magneto does a great job when running an engine at a set speed, but the timing is set for whatever RPM you intend to run at and only that speed. If you set it up optimal for 3000 RPM, you'll have a hard time revving past 5 as well as starting it. It'll be too advanced and possibly backfire at low rpm, and be too retarded at higher RPM leading to the loss in power and limited revs. The spark will only be timed right for a certain RPM.
You guys have the minds of an engineer! Very cool! My 95 grand cherokee 4.0l engine uses a wast spark system and if anything it will burn cleaner by igniting and left over hydrocarbons.
I really enjoyed this video. I did not think it would work. But you showed me it can and will work. Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to your next project.
The main reason we use a complicated electronic ignition system is because it makes it easy to adjust the timing on the fly for all driving conditions magneto systems work alright with single speed engines like lawnmowers and tractors.
@@MarioAPN 4 foot of timing chain spinning at 3,000 RPMs has a lot of inertia. It flies loose and whips around at 3,000+ rpm, that will cause a lot of damage. Timing chain isn't light either- pretty heavy stuff.
I know how you could do a hand crank. Fit some sort of valve that opens the cylinders to the air, reducing compression to 0. This is a system used on some older semi trucks
I want to see G54 "go green" and swap a lada engine for a generator motor from something and power it with a bunch of batteries in series in the back seat and trunk.
This good sir should be given a Nobel peace prize for showing us what we can and can't do with cars.....come to think of it us in the motor world should have our own awards...viewer based and result oriented.
Now you can build a Lada with a complete mechanical set up using a mechanical fuel injection system and the magnetos. I'd say to get the most revs out of the the engine you will have to advance the timing of the magnetos by a few teeth on the gears to get the best results. Other than that, that set up is impressive.
It would be interesting to run a slightly longer chain and a tensioner mechanism that slides from one side to the other laterally that can provide advance. Possibly put it on a vacuum actuator hahaha
😂 I don't know how this comment didn't get any likes. Come on people, don't you guys want SOLUTIONS?!? Could you use a derailleur with some gears, like on a bicycle? 😆 I'm not too mechanically inclined, so I'm not sure offhand if that's feasible.
Make a wind up spring loaded hand crank like they did on old airplanes. You wind it up and release the spring loaded gear and it turns over the engine several times. Also using a heavy wheel that you wind up and the inertia turns over the engine!
When the generator on my 1991 Mercedes 190E 2.0i stopped working and it emptied the battery and stopped in middle of nowhere I had to push start it after fixing the generator. It was no problem push starting it alone... But my 450ccm dirt bike is pretty much impossible to push start alone as it will either just lock the back tire and not turn the engine at all, or not turn the engine fast enough to start if you put it in higher gear.
Yeah old bikes ...I still have one which does have battery and magneto too...battery backup is for lights, horn and side indicators ...and battery got discharged and dead long time back never cared to replace it ...as bike works quite nice and hardly it needed any major repair except service and oil, clutch, brake wires change.
Old school race cars back in the old days used megneto ignitions as well! They can be quite ideal! I kind of want to use something like that for my old 1920s rat rod. I think modern fuel injection systems might not like them, though.
Vlad, You can replace the four magnetos with just two. Magneto number 1 is connected to cylinders 1 and 3 ( I assume they are running at same engine speed, not half speed). Magneto number 2 is connected to cylinders 2 and 4. As they provide 2 sparks per revolution there is correct timing this way. Also, did you set a reasonable advance on each magneto when you timed each one? Usually something like 6 degrees before TDC is what most cars use. Perhaps that was the reason why the Lada engine would not rev past 4000 rpm, not enough advance. Most motorbike engines before 1950 had magneto ignition and an advance lever on the handlebar. You started with ignition fully retarded, so the engine would not kick back, then progressively advanced the ignition for normal operation. And indeed the ideas you test in Garage 54 are great and give us often a new understanding of car mechanics. Please keep up with the format.
2 of the dual spark mags are all you need to run a 4 cylinder. Sure will make things considerably more simplistic also. This was really neat though. Thumbs up
was thinking that as well! wasted spark ignition. the ease way would use the distributor with out the coil, use one mag to send hi voltage to the distributor and time the mag for best running. would probably need the points in the distributor in place of the ones in the mag to make the mag pulses sync with the distributor rotor. been a long time since i have seen a multiple cylinder mag. have used a 1 cylinder mag on a 2 cylinder it worked!
If you can pull that off, then you probably can fit a single lawnmower flywheel with built in magnets with four Y-shape magnetos. Fitting an advance timing system is optional.
Since they’re doing a wasted spark, they should minimize the system and do 2 magnetos and I still want to see them play around more with the diesel injection pump
The problem is that they are ground-referenced, so you can't feed it to two cilinders at the same time (you can't parallel spark plugs). Possibly mount them isolated from the chassis and each other, and use a timing belt instead of a chain.
Four stroke mowers have a wasted spark too. It's fine 👍 Why not try magnets and Briggs coils? Then add a four stroke weedeater engine as a pony. No battery just start the pony and get engine spun once a lever is pulled.
