I have a love/hate (mostly hate) relationship with this team. Man, did they make me nervous as a Lakers fan. Were the 2008 Celtics a Top 10 team in NBA History?? NOTE for the longtime viewers: If this sounds familiar, this is an updated version of a video I posted a couple years ago. I really liked the script, and I wanted my editor to polish up my janky editing. I think he did a really good job, and even added some insightful stats. Hope you guys enjoy it as much as I did.
@qzurx Not really. If I had to pick one, it would probably be the Nuggets, probably because my wife's favorite player is Nikola Jokić. She loves how introverted he is sometimes, and how obsessed he is with his horses. Very relatable for her. lol.
@@jonnyarnettCan you make a video on how underrated Bob Pettit is I think he is top 20, people disrespect him for playing in a pre merger league, & don’t actually speak about his game, let me know if it’s a good idea or not
You know, that's the thing i love about this channel, Jonny loves basketball talks about it, he is not a casual, biased or oldhead fan. The things about KG and Perkins injuries are true, also you can take in count how bad Doc was that game 7, he let the Lakers cameback because he didnt make some defensive adjuments those last 5 minutes in the 4rth, lol. They could be proud of what they did, but they cannot be mad if casual people call it delusion, they wont see how you win or lose a championship, they just care about the ring and that's all. But, let's not forget Doc Rivers is not a top 15 coach of all time.
@@GarlicOasisor, he understands how to respect basketball opinions? He never said people were wrong with calling that Big 3 deluded, he just subjectively disagreed with it
I remember reading an article mid-season after their win, and one of the big three was quoted in saying something like, "If We don't win another championship, no one is going to remember us as a great Celtic team." I think this is why they talk so much now, because they were really great and they want to make sure people don't forget about them.
@@GarkKahn Thats what im thinking he seemed like he really cared abt celtics legacy (for obvious reasons) more than the others. I remember when he was crying when he passed larry bird 😂
@@akeembrown7661to be fair who can blame him, the guy was carrying mediocre Celtics teams for nearly all of his prime, then when he finally got that ring he never left that pedestal
Great video I have so much to say and you made some excellent points, this was my favourite era in the NBA! Perfect and balanced play, spacing was perfect, 3's attemted was perfect I just loved that era so much. Also I loved that celtics team upto 2012 more than I have any team ever, dynasty or not they are certainly ICONIC
I like this take. A lot. Acknowledges that they were unable to achieve “greatness” but clarifies their potential as a truly great team. Plus, I think it’s is a historic demonstration of complimentary basketball.
Yes, I agree that without the Garnett injury in 2009 and the Perkins injury in game 6 in 2010 they *could* have threepeated. But it’s not like the Lakers were completely healthy in all those three seasons, is it. In 2008, the Lakers lost Bynum before the playoffs. Maybe he could’ve been the X factor to match the Celtics’ physicality and that way maybe the Lakers three peat. Also in 2010, Kobe was playing with a broken finger on his shooting hand and if I’m correct a second injury on his ankle that forced him to have injections before each game. If Kobe is healthy maybe he’s more efficient from the field and Perkins’ injury doesn’t even matter. See there’s many reasonable ifs we can take into account. All that being said, I do agree that this Celtics team was exceptional.
2008 celtics teamed up 4 year earlier; they would have been a potential dynasty the lakers & celtics were a true rivialy that wish extend for more years doc rivers is the only flaw with the 2008 celtics
The FIRST BIG 3 of the modern era. The lost proper one as well. After them, stars joined together in their prime to topple the league. These fellas stuck it out as the GUY on their respective franchises until it was no longer acceptable. Respect.
There was kind of an attempt with 2004 Lakers. People blamed Kobe and Shaq's feud for why they lost but Malone and Payton being old has more to do with it. The Celtics got Garnett and Allen at the right time, a little later they could have end up like the 2004 Lakers.
@@iamhungey12345 Lakers had little depth and the depth they had got railed by injuries. Karl Malone was on one leg, Horace Grant injured and didn't play at all so Slava Mvedevenko a third stringer played heavy minutes, Rick Fox barely played like only 30 minutes total in the Finals and Payton who struggled in the Triangle the whole season and Fisher both played terribly against the Pistons, single digits in points in the 30s percentage wise from the field from everyone not named Kobe or Shaq. When Malone was healthy, and the dude was like LeBron when it came to durability prior to the 04 season, the Lakers ran through the league despite the poor chemistry, locker room problems and Kobe's court case.
The Rockets tried a big 3 concept way back in 1997, but they were about 2 or 3 years too late, as Olajuwon, Drexler and Barkley were all on the downside of the career. It would have been amazing if they teamed up in 1992, 1993, 1994 or even 1995. By 1996-1998, just too late.
This team is one of the craziest teams of all time. So good Jonny didn't half to mention rajon rondo. I said they were gonna get a chip as soon as kg got there. We all did
It's crazy how much his reputation has declined since this team. I think he was prematurely given a lot of credit for the leadership that actually came from KG. He was kind of the player-coach of that squad.
@@Soldier979 I agree, 2008 made him so overrated that even after 16 years he got Bucks with Giannis and Dame. He doesnt deserve it and most likely will blow it.
Great video, Jonny! I agree that they were a great team and injuries doomed them in 09 and 2010. I don't think they are the greatest but they are among the greats. Hope you have a great Wednesday 😊
I don't think they were overrated, but they definitely underachieved..... That group should have at least 2 championships during their run together, although I understand injuries got in their way
That Big-Three-Boston Team had the ingredients to become a dynasty, but they were just to old to begin with and ran out of time. This team being assembled 6 or 7 years earlier could be a case for your "what if series".
@@apriltiff6452 I would also like to know the impact of such a Big Three in Boston on the Eastern Conference during that time period. If the Boston Big Three had assembled in 2000 or 2001, how would the other eastern teams have reacted ? Would the James / Dwayne due plus another top player have been formed before 2010 ? ^^
Health was a big factor with that team, and it was kind of obvious that they would have a few short, great years because the main trio was old. But I would have to say that the 08 team was crazy good, and KG is a beast. He is very underrated. I honestly feel that he should be mentioned along with TD as the greatest PF. He gets downplayed because of the lack of championships but KG spent most of his career in a crappy team. KG is what would have happened to Lebron had he stayed in Cleveland all these years and going to Lakers towards the end and winning one championship and because of Lebron Cavs never would have gotten Kyrie. KG is looked down because of the lack of championships won but he was just in a horrible team in a tough conference without much support.
Do you recall the Lakers were missing Bynum and Ariza for the 2008 Finals due to injuries? Those 2 players are difference makers in a role playing capacity so an argument could be made the Lakers would have won that ring vs the Celtics. but injuries are part of the game so I tend not to factor that into revisionist history, like Perk being injured in the 2010 Finals, Kyrie/Love in 2015, KD in 2019, etc.
I agree the Lakers were without Byume and Ariza in 08 finals if they were both healthy it would have been a diffrent series people forget before Byume got injury he was avg 17pts 8reb Ariza was the second best defender could have three peat maybe boston wouldent have won a ring
Lol, I didn’t “forget that”, it’s just not totally relevant to my point about the Celtics. Ultimately, 08, 09 and 10 were all potentially effected by injuries. The same way you can’t simply say “a healthy lakers team was better in 2010”, you can’t say “a healthy Celtics team was better in 2008”, because the unfortunate truth is, we never saw these 2 teams square off in the Finals when they were both completely healthy.
The Big 3 Celtics are my favorite team, all time. They made me really get into basketball at a time where I stopped watching for a couple years. Ray Allen became my favorite player at the time and I remember the joy of watching them compete. It was so awesome to see.
You need a RU-vid Oscar award…consistently producing the best basketball content on RU-vid! Couldn’t agree with you more with this team. I do believe they were “that good” and if they could’ve stayed healthy, they would have been a 3peat team. 3rd worst team in the league became the champions the next season. But unfortunately with only one chip, not a dynasty. I do feel this team gets underrated overall.
People forget that Celtics team started 27-2 the year after winning the title. They weren't on their way to 70 wins before KG's injury but they did look poised to going back to back. Still, they ended up with just won title but hearing them talk, you'd think they won 5 or something. As far as Kendrick Perkins missing some of the Finals rematch, I don't want to hear that otherwise what about the Lakers being without Bynum in the first Finals matchup?
Hey Jonny, just a hot take to tease each one of us, and just because I'm a Lakers fan, but with Ariza and Bynum in that 08 series, that could have been an upset in favor of the Lakers. The Lakers lacked length and hustle as well on that series, and Bynum and Ariza would have really been cool with that. I was doubting their 2008 championship (even though yes I know they're the best team that year), because it took them 7 games on the first 2 rounds, and 6 games in ecf and the finals. Lakers on the other hand, swept a 50 win Nuggets team as the 8th seed, demolished the Jazz in 5, and gentleman's swept the defending champion Spurs in 5, so the Lakers actually we're steamrolling at the right time. But again, the pieces that LA lacked, are exactly what Boston had as well. Honestly, I'm at that "they're a great regular season team, but a standard post season team" ship. Or maybe, that's because Doc Rivers was their coach. :D
And in 2010 bdw, Kobe had a bone spur and a broken index finger. So we could also look into that factor, because if we had a healthy Kobe in 2010, we might also have a 6 game series instead of going the distance.
Don't forget how crazy uneven were the conferences back then. Lakers, Spurs, Nuggets, Mavs, Suns, Jazz in the West, vs. Celtics, Cavs ang Magic in the East.
This era of the Celtics was a great one, but injuries had a major part in derailing them from winning more than 1 championship. But they didn't. They went to 2 NBA finals in 2 seasons winning 1. Which in my opinion does not make you a "1 hit wonder", much like the 04 and 05 Pistons. If you go to 2 finals in a 3 year span including winning one are a great team.
Watched every single game of the playoffs and to have 3 game 7s before reaching the finals was crazy this was one fun team to watch with their defense ! However would have been more dominant if Kevin Garnett didn’t stay away from the low block !
I watched KG most of his career in Minnesota and that always annoyed me. I'd see other stars like MJ, Barkley, Shaq, Kobe, Hakeem, etc. going to the basket while Garnett seemed to settle for jumpers too often.
The only thing I've always wondered is why Minnesota or Seattle did not demand Rajon Rondo be included in the trades for Garnett and Allen, respectively. In a way, they were a big 4; this became more true as time passed and Rondo improved in skill while the Big 3 declined in skill. Without Rondo, they probably win the single ring in 2008.
On paper they were definitely 1 of alltime great teams but only winning 1 title makes them a 1 hit wonder.While I will agree that the injuries are the main reason they only won 1 title they still had other players that should have been able to step up
The only guy allowed to talk that level of smack from this team is KG. Pierce never did anything without the other stars before or after they joined the team, Ray never needed to talk plus he and Rondo each won after they left Boston. KG was a league mvp prior to joining, then ended up as the biggest reason they won in 08 and remained relevant for several years afterwards. Great video as always and I really enjoy your content.
That's not true. At the time it was more of an experiment that most believed would not work. It wasn't until. Maybe December, when they had lost only like 3 games when everyone knew they were a problem
I would rank the 08 Celtics on the same level as the 04 Pistons. They are an objectively great team and you can't call them a fluke considering how close they got to winning multiple championships, but just one level below a dynasty because they didn't deliver that 2nd or 3rd championship at the end of the day.
2005 Finals was underrated, the Pistons gave the Spurs a run for their money despite dropping the first two games. Too bad for them Horry stole the show in Game 5.
Consider the impact these three had on the Celts.. going from 24 wins to 56.... Then consider the fact that a rookie Larry Bird took the Celtics from 29 wins to 60 with no other changes to the roster.
To this day they are still one of the best defensive teams I've ever seen. Nobody was stopping kobe back then, even wit a broken finger that no one ever talks about. 3 legit players on offense, Rondo doing Rondo things. They were tough.
Assuming they just play the lakers I think they could just three peat. Idk if they beat a healthy Rockets in 08 or the Suns in 10 tho. The Lakers and Celtics were somewhat built to play each other imho.
i watched entire '09 Bulls v Celtics 7 game series as a Bulls fan... going against rookie DRose, Rajon Rondo was awesome... i think Celtics win in '09 easy with Garnett... fax!!!
I think the 2008 Celtics are one of the most important and dominant teams in modern NBA history. So much so that they set the standard and trend of what NBA superstars would do for the next 14-15 years. I legitimately think they are the blueprint that almost all superstars looked at and decided that was how to win championships. You try to team up with the best and get as many superstars stacked on a team as soon as possible.
Unfortunately the players now are joining up in there primes or before they even hit 30 These guys joined up afer 10+ years of playing on bad teams(besides Ray Allen he played on some solid teams)
@@user-lt5dg1ix6u Yeah, players twisted the idea that stacking teams through free agency should be the team. They are robbing the fans the rooted for them for cheap rings. 08 Celtics maybe a superteam but it is one made in the right way.
Easily one of the greatest teams of all time. To me, they were the blueprint or best example of what you could do with an archetypical type built roster. The pass first pg, the greatest shooting 2 guard of all time, the 2 way scoring sf, the defensive anchor center... some of the most beautiful basketball ever
It depends on how far you extend "greatest" but I don't have them in my top 10 playoffs teams of all time. I will take a (way) quieter 2014 Spurs teams clearly above them for example. Then you add the dynasties. The 2023 Nuggets. The 2010 Lakers. And so much more.
08 - we CLOWNED them for milking ONE Championship but it is the reality, they only won one. 09 - if KG was healthy, they are advancing instead of Magic 10 - If Perk(clown analyst) was healthy on gm 6 and 7, that's a 50-50. 11 - i forgot what happened here 12 - if they didn't choke that gm6 or let's say if Lebron didn't go ballistic, they could advance and win too. That's a GREAT 5-year stretch if not for some circumstances. Oh, again, we almost have the same view regarding NBA.
'11 they got plagued by injuries. No one was in condition for the playoffs aside from Rondo. '12 this was a miraculous performance. They should not have gone that close with the Heat, and if lebron didn't activate Super Saiyan, his legacy would've gone in the gutter. Ray Allen was no longer a member of that Big 3. He was old and rapidly declining. I think KG played really well, but post injury, he's never been the same. The rest was mainly a Rondo and pierce duo. But the big 3 dynamic was broken by this point.
In 09 even if KG was healthy they wouldent have beaten the 09 Lakers they were better team all year the bench was better Gasol was tougher Kobe was player in other level wouldent matter who came out of the east it was there year
Honestly, every player of their starting five is a top 10 player for each position. They resemble the classic position based traditional basketball team. Their plays start with their choking defense anchored by KG and Rondo. They have the best passer and shooter of that time with one of the best 2 way player like KG and a reliable iso player Pierce. Perkins just doing his things to be the center. Getting rebounds and being a solid man in the middle. KG excels with his quick off ball defense and reading plays ahead of time. One of the best balanced team ever assembled but they're not just the best. If they were all in their prime at the creation of that team, there could be an argument for that.
I was a celtics fan back then, I was there. If you are a basketball fans and know the facts, you would agree that without injuries, the Celtics could have won 3 straight. and think about the implication of this, ie. kobe bryant would have no rings in the post Shaq era, it was that huge of a difference in history. > KG gone in 2009, they had no chance, lost to magic in second round in game 7, and magic went on to the finals to face the lakers and it was auto win for the lakers. Young fans wouldn't know, back then in round 1, the series went 7 games and multiple OT, because the bulls got derrick rose, if celtics had KG, Noah couldnt do as much in the paint and they would have won more easily, and wouldnt be as tired in second round and had a big chance to defeat magic, which they again lost in the final game 7. > Perk gone in game 6 in the 2010 finals vs lakers, look up the contribution Perk had with his defense, scoring in paint and rebounding, and Celtics narrowly lost to Lakers in game 7 > 2011 Celtics destroyed by the big 3 Heat. > a lot of people forgot, old man celtics in 2012 lost to the lebron big 3 heat in game 7....they were up at one point, no one thought they had a chance, but again, age fact only harm them more and more in long series and against young teams. imagine the damage they do to lebron's lagacy if they have won, although it was quite unlikely, but still, game 7 lost. with hingsight, if everything remain unchanged but celtics got the benefit of no KG injury in 2009 and no perk injury in 2010 final, it is fair to say they had a pretty good chance to win 3 straight, especially considering how they played against the Heat even in 2012 when they were all old men. and for people to call it the first big 3, this is stupid, you only know the celtics big 3 because it was the only big 3 that were put together and actually won anything. and dont disrespect the spurs, you telling me 3 HOFer is not a big 3? and, imagine what happen to the spurs if tim duncan is out ? like KG did? but yes, it is what it is, no dynasty, it could have been one, but unfortunate event took it away, there is no shame, just bad luck. just like rose, t mac, yao, grant hill, etc, these could have achieved much more, but is now remembered as "what if". the one thing is, people call big 3 celtics an under achieving team, mostly because they dont know the context and how close they were to realistically beating the lakers 3 times in a row. no one talks about this "what if", no one wants to acknowledge them
I think it's the what ifs is the reason everyone hypes them up. I'm a Celtics fan and i thought this team would win 2-3 more titles after winning that first one but what everyone forgets is that they were old and injuries got them and prevented them from winning another one they weren't like LeBron and the heat who created a big 3 with everyone in their 20s which is why no one likes LeBron because he took the easy way out. But the way this Celtics team dominated in the 07-08 year I would say they're probably the best one hit wonder to ever win just one championship. Like i said it's the what ifs that keep everyone talking if this team could have stayed healthy they would at least have a 2nd championship without a doubt and kobe would only have 4 rings instead of 5.
imagine this players togheter when theyre in his 28s, damm no one could beat that team, sadly they became unit at their 31s/32s but they dominating anyway
The Celtics had the potential to be great, but at least for the 08 championship run, the 10 total games lost was also the most among all championship winners. We never saw the core in the peak of their powers, and thus they shouldn’t be credited for what they didn’t accomplish, which is being a consistently dominant team.
I was still a Celtic hater at this time, as their 80s afterglow was still strong to me. Plus them beating the living S out of the Lakers to get their ring drove that sting in even worse. And Perkins was out of the Laimbeer Hockey Enforcement Academy. But I knew that they were a strong and solid team. I could appreciate them more then as well, as I was older and not just a blanket Lakers guy.
Hey, is it Ok if I recommend an NBA what if Scenario and you make a video about it? Ok in 1998 was The Last Dance for The Chiago Bulls. Let's say they stayed together a little bit longer how many championships do you think they could have won more? Let's The Bulls stay together from 1999-2003 1999 Lockout, 1999-2000, 2001-2002, 2001-2002, 2002-2003 I predict that many more years long 5 years The Bulls stay. I think you should make a video about that. Hey, I think it's an interesting what if.
Could’ve been a real dynasty but the league changed too fast on them and they ran into Kobe. Which is fair because they changed the league on the pistons before them.
Really w rondo that was a big 4 you had 3 hof players & a all star caliber borderline hof player w Perkins who played his role well them yrs it just all fit
For me, I dont think Perkins would have change the outcome of the final game. Because apart from perkins you had Rasheed Wallace who, in fact grabbed more than double rebounds than Garnett in that game, also is not a bad defende at all and is a far more talented offensive player.
They were very good. But they were also from the times when playing till 40 was almost unheard of, especially not at a high level and without PEDs. And they were some rough and tumble cats on top of that which aged em a little faster. So time wasn't on their side. As others have mentioned too, they were in a fairly weak East and beat a so-so Lakers for the lone ring. We'll obviously never know for sure, but I believe they coulda still beat almost anybody and woulda done much better against Miami if the refs hadn't been so blatantly all-in on the LeScam that started after the Mavs embarrassed the Heat (LeBron specifically), probably robbing OKC and the Spurs of at least one ring each in the process. They were great but aging, not dealing with the highest level of competition, yet seemed capable of just about anything. Had they joined together a few seasons prior or found some diverse, young talent to carry more of the load a dynasty woulda almost been guaranteed. But time, a superteam Miami, refs, and Ray Allen's treachery made sure that never happened.
Whatever one thinks of Doc Rivers, the Big 3 Celtics didn't underachieve. Got a ring 1st yr, KG missed playoffs 2nd, went 7 games vs Kobe's Lakers in 3rd, and 4th yr Big 3 were 33, 34, and 35, and then vastly OVERACHIEVED 5th year by taking the much younger and more talented Heatles 7 games in the ECF. Doc didn’t cure the aging process. Not much of a “Doc” since either CP, Blake or PG13 were injured in all but one playoff exit at LAC.
It’s 50/50 depending on how you look at it. Yes the team was good but they were competing with a weak eastern conference. But also this is the team that caused Lebron to flee to Miami. And they faced a good lakers team but not a top 5 lakers team all time in imo. So yes it was a deserved ring, but you need context to go along with it
Oh damn I hated so much this team. When it was formed I really thought that they would run the league for 3-5 years with no competition. It was the first superteam in modern NBA, and his legacy is still prevalent today, starting with the Heatles, the Durant GSW, today's Clippers or Suns (and not far away Lakers awful superteam with Westbrook).
