Against bad teams*, a good player spawning will knock off the red tape and upgrade the teleporter back to 3. Best to just quickly destroy it + revolver.
@@MoarCheeseBirb Diamondback gets crits for every red tape recorded building being sapped. So from a full lvl 3 sentry nest, that's 9-12 crits minimum. This is probably what Diamondback was supposed to be combined with, before it was buffed even further.
It’s also great against mini sentries as an engineer most likely won’t put himself in danger to destroy the sapper since mini’s are cheap and quick to build and he won’t have a placable sentry for the duration.
The weta workshop laser weapons really got the short straw with the devs when the rework happened, the cow mangler is the only one that's passable and even then it's downsides make it feel iffy at best.
OR, if they gave it the Explosive upgrade from MVM in its normal state, but weaker, So a 30 Damage explosion could do massive damage to a crowd, Almost like a Cow Mangler,
@@impossiblecompletedhd6390 So like a Molotov really? "Maniacs Molotov" Throws to create a large area of liquid fire over the land, Dealing constant damage to anyone standing in it, Lasts 5 seconds
The Pomson was obnoxiously good when it could penetrate players and deal multiple hits. There was nothing like draining an uber by shooting through the medic's heal target. It could also make the deadringer cloak end crazy fast. Keep in mind that it drained that percentage of cloak and uber with every hit. You could take a medic from full, or nearly full uber to zero if they moved away from you.
Maybe it could be situationally useful if it could drain uber charge even while the uber is in use, thus reducing how long they could stay ubered. That's hella situational tho.
A good idea might be for the red tape recorder to just disable buildings and is harder to destroy so it's easier for pushes when there is like 6 engineers on 2fort
@@temkin9298 battle engies already don’t care about their buildings, regardless whether or not it’s disabled for the entire duration the red tape recorder is on or just destroyed by a standard sapper
@@gipsydangeramericasmonster9632 Except having a sapper that only disables buildings would completely stop battle engis from being able to place down new mini sentries
man's really just saying part 2 will be hard to follow because of missing part 1, and not because the intro was made by someone who belongs in a straight jacket
The most ""effective"" way to use the shortstop shove is to shove someone while backpedaling to enter your effect range. This is better with scout, spy and maybe pyro because these classes thrive at close range while you are effective at mid range.
I really wanna interview the guy behind the shove mechanic. None of scout's weapons were built with it specifically in mind for almost a decade of their existence until like 1 major update ago. It's like the Chris Chan of tf2 items. Nobody gets why.
I'm not the guy, but I think I understand their reasoning. Since the Shortstop is less effective at close range, the shove is likely intended to get people out of your face so that you can pick them off from your effective range. Trouble is, the shove sucks.
Another use for the red tape recorder is mini sentries; as the engineer usually places them down the moment they get into a fight (if they're going battle engie) you can effectively stop one of their biggest advantages, and force them to either fight with just a shotgun or go and remove the sapper, either of which you usually have the advantage against him.
You could have mentioned one other feature of the Red Tape Recorder: It's also good when you know you cannot reliably sap a choke to destruction. The instant a red tape recorder is placed, it will strip off the level 3 requiring effort to bring it back to full. If you know you won't get a full 8 seconds, reduced for revolver shots, this can be an alternative to help push. That being said, you might be better off slipping further behind enemy lines and interrupting supply chains
with the Red Tape Recorder, there is also 1 extra use: Frontier Justice engies. They live off of quick-to-place sentries, and would normally let a sapper run its course, but the Recorder either forces them to lose a sentry but slower, leaving them open to other classes, or to destroy the sapper, losing out on their crits and ending up with a level 2, or even level 1 sentry
Honestly if the Pomson just, applied the drain FIRST then damage, shit would be a whole different story of DR Spy mains screeching at the top of their lungs on the forums. What a world we are missing...
The fact that you put the shortstop above the enforcer fills me with rage. While the shortstop is worse than stock it can still do work. It deserves d tier at most. It doesn't have damage fall off so you use it as a spam tool very easily with it doing good damage even at range.
The Shortstop is worse than stock for its class, while the Enforcer is basically stock with the upside of shredding wrangler engineers for a tiny fire rate decrease.
Shortstop is better than FAN and soda popper. More shots that are easier to hit beats burst damage, even with the damage decrease. Its the reason that the scattergun is the best primary for scout
First off I love the red tape recorder. As an engine main that dabbles in spy, nothing is more frustrating than being backstabbed, then hearing 20 seconds of bleeping letting you know your building are being being destroyed with your 17 second respawn. Not to mention if your running in before your team pushes in with an Uber, they are dealing with a lvl 2 sentry instead of the level 3, and it drains metal from a dispenser if the dispenser loses one level. As for the gas passer, I have yet to confirm or deny this but I think it could make the pyroshark more viable on land.
8:14 I don't remember which TF2uber mentioned this upside about RTR, but I'm glad it's catching on in community. Tho the problem is that your teammates always destroy buildings which means you can't even use RTR upside
Such a great video! i love the when people make skits and jokes in the middle of a "serious" video, really fits the TF2 tone! but did you really have to add THE song in the video? man i miss carson..
@@herobrain1717 You failing in finding the sweet spot doesn't magically make it "only work most of the times!". The source engine always calculates stuff the same way
Buff for the pomson's only interesting ability: It can drain uber even when the medic is ubering. How much? I dunno, 25% at least. 50% sounds a bit much.
Just wanna say that the RTR, as ive seen can be quicker than stock. when an engie places down a sentry you can sap it and destroy it MUCH quicker. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ZbiumC0QcuI.html for a run down on how this is possible
The sad thing is that a lot of these used to be overall meh but fairly good at niche play styles but then got nerfed because apparently being too good at one thing but bad at everything else makes you deserve a nerf
Hot take, but the red-tape has a lot more common uses than you’d expect. The main thing is tackling sentry nests. This mostly goes for ctf maps like 2 fort or landfall, where there’s not going to be a coordinated push from your team to break through the defense. A decent engineer isn’t going to just let you kill him and sap all his buildings, especially if he’s got friends. The red tape is extremely useful because even if you don’t fully sap the sentry, it’ll waste the engineer’s time and metal to upgrade the buildings all over again, which can easily be the inch your teammates need to break through the nest. It’s a lot easier to take down a sentry with less health and doesn’t fire rockets at you. Maybe I just play a lot of ctf. Maybe I just like ruining the day of engineer mains by having them watch as their precious children slowly crawl back into the toolboxes from whence they came … which is kind of weird because I am an engineer main.
I feel like the Warriors spirit should have stats more similar to the Escape plan. Where having it out Mark's you for death and lingers for a bit after switching it off, but it constantly gives a BIG speed boost(like about as fast as medic) while still keeping that damage boost. And instead of 50 hp per kill, I think 75 per kill should be better
Caber should definitely be A tier or higher. It has one specific scenario where it can maybe one hit light classes and even then you can only do it once before being stuck with a worse bottle
He's right about only being able to effectively use the back scatter on snipers. Scouts are too fast to actually shoot in the back Engineers are probably going to be near a sentry gun And spy tends to avoid scouts since he can never really backstab him.
Well, I really like to use the gas passer when I play pybro. Especially at the last point, where you have to defend yourself for a few minutes. In such a situation, it is not bad, but I very rarely see someone with this strategy ...
Another upside for the caber is that it can be used as a movement utility, if you crouch and hit the ground, it'll essentially be like rocketjumping, except only going up. it can be useful if you're using a shield, although you could just use your pills to do that.
I love the back scatter, and it’s one of, if not, my favorite of the scout primaries, but I definitely agree with you about it being out classed by stock and the other mini-crit giving options. Also I love your Back Scatter, beautiful name, mine’s “Got your back :)”
I actually use a pomson in my regular loadout, alongside with short circuit and gunslinger. I even planned to buy a strange Pomson. Was it shit? Yeah. Was I frustrated every time I use it? Yeah. But goddamn it was hilarious to torture my sanity so I use it regularly.
I have actually made a Medic rage quit from deleting his Uber with a Pomson. I was hard-focusing him and his buddy on 5Gorge, kept knocking his meter down lol As a longtime user of that silly thing, I really appreciate the in-depth analysis. While I wouldn't say it's quite as bad as the Gas Passer or Bison as the Pomson can at *least* do respectable damage in the right hands, I do agree it's in terrible need of a buff. Honestly though, as a Pomson aficionado with over 2000 hours in the game under their belt, I don't think it needs much of one to be viable. With the slow projectile and inability to have its damage decreased by the Vaccinator, all its lasers would need to have is the ability pierce targets and teammates or damage all enemies connected via medi-beams, and I can honestly see it being a good tool for dealing with clumped enemies or a decent long-range support weapon.
Red-tape Recorder's two best uses are stuffing minisentries and softening up massive engie nests on 2fort and the like. The mechanism for the former is as you describe in the vid (gunslinger engies usually like to plop out their mini and go do other things, this keeps the mini unusable for longer), while for the latter it's that you can downgrade any sapped building by at least one level before the engies can kill you and remove the sapper, and 50 level 2 sentries are much easier to push into than 50 level 3 sentries.
for using the shortstop for an extended period of time, i can safly say that it is GOOD ! like omg, i've gone one some seriouse rampage with that thing, and that is mostly for one up side that nobody really talk about: the faster firing speed, you can dish out some incredible damage really qwickly with the short stop, expecially at close range, you also shred throught other scout (minus: you need to have perfect aim, wich is not always the case). i also find it really easy to escape with it wich is really good, the shorter spread will also benefit you a lot when dealing with soldier and demo, the reload can be a bit anoying when in head to head combat but if you got a good get away for reloading it's not that bad, the shove is usless lmao but still really fun, and of course paring it with mini-crit or more rang option make for some realy good combos (my loadout is: shortstop, clever and fan-o-war, sometime switching for crit-a-cola, if yall wanted to know)
I will make the best defense I can to prove that the Red Tape Recorder is just as good as the Stock Sapper. The main argument to why the RTR is bad is the fact that it takes longer to destroy a building, this is wrong due to the fact that the all sappers as a weapon is unreliable and bad at destroying buildings. Any sappers placed on a building will likely be destroyed by an engie unless they are dead. The sapper is meant to disable a building so that your team has an opportunity to destroy it, So by this logic it is simple enough to say that both sappers do their job. And here is an argument that balances out the two sappers, The RTR guarantees a lasting effect. The RTR downgrades buildings so if the engie gets there before the building is destroyed or there is a pybro, the building will be downgraded which makes it weaker, if you were to use the Stock Sapper the building would be back to normal, but if you use the RTR the building will be downgraded. So now I dare you to tell me where I'm wrong, no I challenge you. But I am afraid I am done here. The RTR is just as good as Stock.
for fat scout i prefer the fists of steel and panic attack combo, it lets you close distance safely and the increased switch speed lets you quickly attack
Honestly I think the Pomson should shoot a hitscan beam instead of projectiles, kinda like the ghostbuster's gun. That would be cool and fit the Engineer's arsenal really well.
man we really need weapon updates, after bot and an actual update also fun fact the Classic had a automatic feature in TFC just like Widowmaker from Overwatch
*good things about the gas passer* - intimidation tactic, makes enemies less likely to go certain ways and therefore more predictable - isn't the scorch shot - extinguishes teammates in a radius if you have the phlog on you - isn't the scorch shot - isn't the scorch shot
I still think that the pain train is more forgivable than warrior spirit, because the warrior spirit at least give you something, the pain train effect is usseles.
I personally use the Red Tape over the Sapper because I feel that, even though it's slower, reducing the threat is better than leaving it the same should the Engineer break it off. That, and I have a Strange one.
For anyone who was wondering, the red tape recorder does say something when slowed down. "Let's make some noise..." is what it says, it's actually a pretty cool line.
Red Tape Recorder can completely CRUSH Battle Engis that rely on their precious Frontier Justice crits. Longer time for mini sentries to be destroyed = less crits incoming = easier time to deal with Battle Engis. Not a very good use for the RTR, but it does allow for some niche use.
I remember a few weeks back I was playing Caberknight just for the hell of it, and I did something so stupid, it was glorious. I was goofing around on 2Fort and when I walked out the front door... surprise! Half the Blu team is camping the bridge. I was gonna die no matter what I did, so without even thinking, I decide to go out with a bang. I charged DIRECTLY INTO A LEVEL 2 SENTRY GUN, swung my caber, and took out THREE enemy players in a blaze of glory.
I have found a use for the Warrior spirit but only in MvM. With the Buffalo Steak Sandvich and with enough resistance, it makes you pretty much this unstoppable tank of crits
There is another niche for the Red Tape Recorder, if you’re fighting mini-sentry engies, the long time could be more effective than destroying the sentry because the engineer can immediately put down another one.
