The Sydney Sleeper has “No random critical hits” because when it used to have random criticals because it couldn’t headshot. They had to manually remove it later on.
8:54 During Halloween, I put on the Mk50 helmet when playing pyro with the napalmer on the off-chance that I run into a scout running the alien loadout. It's only happened once, but the real kick in the jaw was that we were on the same team when it happened.
8:09 During the pyro update, there was a sort of scavenger hunt and if you equipped that set on medic, it help you find clues by changing certain item descriptions.
The increased damage against scouts wearing the alien set technically makes the nostromo napalmer a direct upgrade, even if the chance you get to use it is so astronomically small. It does look pretty slick, though
@@breadspy5974 yes, scout will insta kill you with a melee weapon that normally deal 35 damage. Which mean: stock bat, the sandman, any stock reskin, and the boston basher. When was the last time you see a scout running at you with their melee out insteal of ANY scatter gun in a serious game? Youre a pyro, fuck over melee class is like, your thing, so even if that scout is meming he wouldnt want to come near you Unless he is in a Dewill video lmao
the real reason the nostromo is a direct upgrade to stock is that the model is so much shorter. normally a pyro around a corner or thin wall can be given away by the long flamethrower model, but the nostromo's is uniquely shorter by a substantial margin. you can door camp without having to face perpindicular to the door, and reduce the enemies time to react very slightly when rounding a corner.
@@45.chuminh81 Yeah, Scout being one of my favorite classes, there’s a good chance I have the atomizer and I prefer keeping my distance and using my pistol against pyros anyways.
I will stand by this, the shortstop shove is good for one thing and one thing only. In MVM, it makes it so you don’t have to run a pyro to pit giants, air blast meds or prevent super scouts from capping. I’m not kidding, I was playing two cities the other day and the shortstop shove literally saved a cap by a super scout that leaked through lmao.
IMO, IF Valve were to give the mercs a light rework with mouse 2 and mouse 3 for abilities(stock items getting alt fires that are appropriate, or just a " hold R with shotgun/rocket launcher/sticky bomb you can load 1 more shot or scattergun/grenade launcher for 2 more shots, no random crits have to reload when whole mag is empty" or a "third hit with stock melee does XYZ on enemy" and definitely alt fire on medic primary and melee items does burst healing with med kits for syringe guns(throwables) and injector syringes(plus 33% range melee hit buffers that give 25% HP that can overheal) as upsides.) I see the Shove as a mouse 3 ability, if it was improved and the Shortstop gets the 20% healing boost when active back. I would make the shove be 15 damage instead of 1 damage and minicrits are crits, as well as make it the Humiliating ability, by which I mean SHOVE HIT and SHOVE KILL are to be seen in the kill feed. as well as "when airborne: shoves do kicks, which are plus 100% damage(meaning 30 damage kicks), can also turn minicrits into crits and can kick off surfaces and drop kick players" plus KICK HIT and KICK KILL in the kill feed.
On the other hand, it's generally regarded in the MvM community that knockback is a gimmick at best and fucks up everyone trying to shoot the bots in most cases.
7:20 fun fact, the sudney sleepers "no random critical hits" is not useless, beacuse in release sydney sleeper didn't had this atribute, which made that sydney sleepr COULD ACTUALLY SHOOT A RANDOM CRIT. Valve later added this atrubute to remove these random crits from it.
7:09 the crossbow has the no headshots stat not JUST because it used the huntsman arrow model but it also used to actually headshot because the crossbow used the huntsman as a basis for its mechanics so there was a short time were the crossbow did headshots (like a sniper rifle or the huntsman) Edit: Yea Nvm I'm Dumb
You people really need to read the wiki before posting whatever you think is true The crossbow did at one point use the huntsman arrow model. It also used to have 75 base damage instead of 50 with reverse falloff, but it never did headshots.
@@puppieslovies Yeah it was more a warning of "I know this looks the same, but it can't headshot" rather then something added in after it could originally
@@eevee_mon nope, it never had any headshot stat. It would be even more busted if it did The crossbow was not really designed as an offensive tool even though it does damage. It's much better for healing and you can't get a critical heal lol
The Eliminating the Impossible set used to change the descriptions of some of the craft items added in the days leading up to Pyromania, however these items don’t exist anymore so yeah, it does nothing
The fact that the alien items stats against each other isn't just flavor text and is actually a real mechanic is one of those little things that makes TF2 that much more awesome.
I feel so bad about the shortstop, I forgot about the 80% knockback, dude we used to launch the map, one dude on the enemy team with a force a nature and one of us with a shortstop. I miss it
The Shortstop knockback vulnerability thing can actually come into play in MvM sometimes. When you have the bullet/blast and crit resistance and you're being flung around from crockets and Heavy-bot lasers like a ragdoll before you've even died, the 20% can add up quickly. Though at the same time, you'll be knocked back like a fucking launching missile either way so eh. Also sondsmit said shove good because shove funni so therefore shove good
IMO, IF Valve were to give the mercs a light rework with mouse 2 and mouse 3 for abilities(stock items getting alt fires that are appropriate, or just a " hold R with shotgun/rocket launcher/sticky bomb you can load 1 more shot or scattergun/grenade launcher for 2 more shots, no random crits have to reload when whole mag is empty" or a "third hit with stock melee does XYZ on enemy" and definitely alt fire on medic primary and melee items does burst healing with med kits for syringe guns(throwables) and injector syringes(plus 33% range melee hit buffers that give 25% HP that can overheal) as upsides.) I see the Shove as a mouse 3 ability, if it was improved and the Shortstop gets the 20% healing boost when active back. I would make the shove be 15 damage instead of 1 damage and minicrits are crits, as well as make it the Humiliating ability, by which I mean SHOVE HIT and SHOVE KILL are to be seen in the kill feed. as well as "when airborne: shoves do kicks, which are plus 100% damage(meaning 30 damage kicks), can also turn minicrits into crits and can kick off surfaces and drop kick players" plus KICK HIT and KICK KILL in the kill feed.
The Mysteries Solved stat used to be good back when Valve still cared about ARGs and making cool updates because it actually helped solve a Pyro related ARG. It was actually great.
@@KingKayro87 Basically youget clues form somewhere that you have to get in real life, like a scavenger hunt but the clues are online sometimes and you sovle puzzles to go to real life places.
There is exactly one situation where the fire vulnerability is an issue, and that's Uber Dragon's Fury pushes. The DF does exceptional building damage, and doesn't need a pause to reload between killing buildings and people unlike rockets and pipes. and because it penetrates targets the engineer is likely to melt if he tries to Dispenser armor, making it REALLY hard for him to use the Wrangler and/or Recue Ranger to save the nest/stall the push long enough for his team to counter. Bear in mind, this is also assuming his team is completely absent, and there isn't a single allied pybro ready and willing to stuff with airblast, or demo with stickies to punish a premature push.
Even with a demo he can air blast or use a shotgun/scorch shot stickies away if he’s got the reaction time, also depending on the range a pybro might not be able to save everything or the engineer
imagine a game mode where one (or a group of) pyro wearing the astronaut set must fight against an horde of scouts wearing the alien set. The scout obviously can respawn while the pyro can't. That would be nice, at least in my head.
If you ask me, the widowmaker amage bonus helps reach the threshold of you doing enough damage to gain more metal than you're using. So I wouldnt say it's that useless when talking thresholds.
It doesn't make that much of a difference considering Its just 9 more damage. Plus it always let you gain enough metal than you shoot its why everyone thinks its the straight upgrade.
It's also a very useful stat in MvM because you can get upgrades to increase your survivability, and thus help out your sentry kill giants faster. Keep in mind, the Widowmaker is just a shotgun with no Reload downtime against giants and tanks
8:00 Actually a weird thing here - "Imbued with an ancient power" is listed as an upside, but Spy-cicle's "Backstab turns victim to ice" is listed as a downside, even tho both do almost the same thing - turn the corpse into a statue after kill
I think it's because when you see a golden statue you just think "oh someone has a golden weapon cool", but ice statues make you go "ok the enemy team has a spy so I'll be on the lookout for one", which genuinely can make the spies job a bit harder
The reason they needed to specify that Sydney sleeper can’t random crit is because it could actually random crit at first. The only reason snipers can’t random crit is because they crit on headshots, so because Sydney sleeper can’t headshot, it was never given that no crit virtue. You can probably understand why am infinite range 450 damage body shot could be considered unbalanced, so they specified that the sleeper can’t random crit.
I mean, given the slow firing speed and how you can't plan around a random crit because they're, you know, random, I'd say a rifle that can randomly deal 3x damage is more fair than one that can consistently deal 3x damage if the sniper has halfway decent aim. IMO, no random crits isn't a significant enough downside for ranged weapons due to how low crit chances are for them. The only ranged weapons you can make an argument for no random crits being a major downside for are explosive weapons due to how crits nullify explosion falloff, but the only explosive ranged weapon that can't crit is the cow mangler, and that goes one step further and is flat-out incapable of dealing critical damage period. Because of this, I think that all ranged weapons with the no random crit stat should also get the Cow-Mangler's "cannot be crit-boosted" stat.
On the topic of cosmetics that give you stats, “the bootie time” a set of elf boots for scout has the negative downside of “jingle all the way”, every time scout walks with it equipped, there’s a jingling noise.
i know of a few cosmetic items that make the player leave a trail of flames or other effects when moving... now imagine trying to play as a SPY that way!
@@ericb3157 Actually, disguised players don't have these trails or sound effects- this makes it really easy to spot spies, so they're banned in competitive whitelists.
2:24 "The Pomson, Bison, and Manmelter can be hurt by the damage penalty, specialy if they are your long range option but they mainly have that stat for the sake of consistensy" But the Manmelter has no "Only does 20% damage to buildings" stat despite being a laser weapon, same applies to the phlog.
I’d say the Manmelter’s projectile speed increase is pretty useless. Flares are already faster than the Direct Hit so there really isn’t a need for it.
I actually find myself hitting more shots than I do with the Flare Gun since I'm used to tf2 mobile bullets (virtual hitscan but not actually hitscan) so unlike others, this actually helps me play more effectively!
The no random crits is explained in a recent video about weapons with the no critical hits stat. It is because it was able to random crit for a while. No headshots is probably there because the crusaidors is based on the huntsman in some way.
1 hit point difference adds up pretty quickly actually. In Overwatch devs IIRC increased S76 primary damage from, what 23 to 24 I think? And he went from "Mediocre meh DPS" to "Mustpick Meta". Given Syringe gun clip size 1 damage per projectile is quite a chunk of damage.
The Southern's fire vulnerability gets me killed more times then I would have imagined by fire magically going through my buildings or the several times a cow mangler charge shot hit my dispenser and lit me on fire in the process. Burning me to death before I could get back to the resupply.
I will argue that the 10% damage from the sentry target is relevant in MvM, and it does boosts the engi’s damage by a noticeable amount if you decide to whip out the widowmaker
The Widowmaker's 10% damage to Sentry targets doesn't cross thresholds by itself, but remember that you're shooting your Sentry's target. As in, the Sentry is already dealing damage, so the thresholds aren't as high. 10% damage could easily be the difference between an enemy getting away and getting shot down by the Sentry. Also, it's a SHOTGUN. Not all the pellets are gonna hit, so more damage gives you more leeway.
8:45 if my memory serves, technically it does so something, as the tombstone doesn't spawn on deadringing spies, meaning you can tell they did it (of course you can do this with the enemy death list on the HUD but y'know)
Something I've found rather redundant is the Homewrecker's double damage to buildings stat. I don't find it useless, but removing the stat wouldn't do much of anything considering everybody just uses it to destroy sappers. I have a similar reasoning for questioning the Neon Annihilatior's destroying sappers bonus because people only use it to get crits on wet enemies.
It's pretty useful on the Homewrecker because sappers are technically buildings for code purposes and the extra damage to buildings lets Pyro destroy them in one hit
having an intelligent medic amongst a bad team can be a niche for homewrecker. I've used mine before at end of ubers when sentry is still alive/wrangled/blocked/etc. 1 hit is usually enough for your team to destroy it after you, and only 2 to kill. Other than that I use it to clean up nests as I gotta raise those strange part stats somehow
It also lets the homewrecker instagib minisentries; And while that isn't revolutionary, it's hardly uncommon to get use from when you're playing aggressively. Sure, you COULD W+M1 the minisentry from slightly longer range, but when you do find yourself in melee range of engineer buildings it's the perfect option to mix into your degreaser combos. Just like you weave in flaregun shots to destroy people more quickly.
And not just any comp scene, the 6s comp scene; notorious for its inflexibility (biggest weapon blacklist, smallest map pool, non-existent gamemode variety, etc.) Like come on! 6s isn't even consistent in its restrictions! "Only 1 of any given class on a team, except for scout, soldier, pyro, & heavy, who you can have 2 of."
the 10% bonus damage against your sentry's target on the widowmaker actually also applies to the metal you gain. It's supposed to encourage using your mini sentry instead of going full shotgun engineer, by making the mini pay itself off.
@@donovanjoseph737 Okay. So how come the weapon that makes you lighter allows you to push any class around with a shove? I'd argue that you would need to be heavier for that
If I had to guess, the widowmaker sentry damage is there not as any kind of actual buff, but a way to encourage a certain playstyle to new players. Like you said, using the widowmaker with the mini sentry is a good idea regardless of the damage buff. The listed stat helps encourage people to try out said playstyle.
what about the thermal thruster extinguishing allies? I've never once used it because you know, airblast exists and using a charge for extinguishing is just a waste, also if you are using the phlog you can just equip the manmelter and actually help your team
I've found that the shortstop shove can actually be pretty useful, in the sense that you can push enemies away from vulnerable teammates and/or off the map. It's nice to keep the medic alive.
The “reduces mystery solving time by 88%” was related to the fireproof diary I believe. Also I’m pretty sure the Nostromo stats actually do a LOT more damage
the nostromo stats are really big (iirc he said +200% and +500% damage which is fucking HUGE) but you're almost never gonna use them, since an emeny scout has to use the other full set
the thing about the shortstop is that the shove lets you get back to the midrange situation that the short stop is nice for, and the nock back speed is a debuff because if you get knockbacked less, you don't get hit into the range that the shortstop likes best.
I think the increased knockback actually helps with keeping your distance, which is important for this weapon as I'm pretty sure it's classed as a pistol in the code, since it doesn't have the Scattergun's 33% increased damage ramp-up stat.
7:30 the Sydney Sleeper could originaly randomly crit because it is the only sniper rifle without any form of guaranteed crits but this was later changed because of balance
I don't get it. How is a rifle that has a 2-15% chance of dealing 3x damage instead of being able to consistently deal 3x damage if the user has halfway decent aim unbalanced? Was this before they lowered the crit rates for ranged weapons?
I mean. The only unfairness I can think of would be it being stronger in pubs compared to competitive, but even that I think would be balanced out by the lack of coordination in pubs making the weapon's main gimmick less useful.
4:25 a lit huntsman arrow counts entirely as 'fire damage', as opposed to it usually being 'bullet damage', and would make you take 20% more damage from the arrow as well. This means a fully charged bodyshot arrow goes from 120 damage to 144 damage + immediate afterburn.
Another thing I'd like to point out. The golden weapons stat for turning people to gold is an upside, but on the Spycicle, it's ability to turn players to ice on a backstab is listed as a downside. Why? As Medic would say, "I HAVE NO IDEA!"
well someone sees a person who was frozen they'll just think "oh there's a spy around" but if they see a golden statue they're way more likely to think "oh wow someone has a saxxy/gold pan" and will probably look around for it, are you really gonna pass up the chance to pick up a gold pan/saxxy?
@@saucedealer True. But you can still tell it's a spy with the golden weapon by the killfeed, you'd see a backstab with a golden background instead of a red one, unless the Spy very unlikely Butterpans/Buttersaxes the victim, displaying the normal kill icon.
6:21 I’m the hardcore Shortstop user with a really strong opinion on the stat. Credentials: 7365 kills on the only strange unusual shortstop in the game. I love the knockback increase. I’ve done some insane damage surfing that only barely got me to a ledge which reaffirms that it was the knockback that did it, and I find that being AWAY from knockback/damage sources is pretty beneficial after a first hit. As for pyros on cliffs, it’s an active stat. I can just switch to the Atomizer (ever-present in my loadout) to stay afloat for a bit, best case scenario.
The mystery solving stat actually did do something. Before the pyromania update a bunch of items were added such as the scorched diary and when equipping the set, the description of these items changed
The stat on the loose cannon that says the projectile travels 20% faster is useless because of the shorter fuse time and how the cannonballs travel slower then default pills due to source stuff.
@@ashtongiertz8728 TF2 treats shotgun attacks as a single large attack, not multiple smaller ones. It just factors in how many of the hitscan lines connected when calculating how much damage that attack should do (this is also why multiple shotgun pellets connecting always shows one damage number even if you don't have cumulative damage numbers enabled; it's only one instance of damage). This means the number that gets multiplied by 10% is the _total_ max damage of 90, not the individual per-pellet damage. 90 * 1.1 = 99. Plus, even if the damage boost was applied per-pellet, TF2 only rounds after _all_ calculations when dealing damage, rather than after each step. So it wouldn't be 9.9 damage per pellet, rounded to 10, times ten pellets for a total of 100. It would be 9.9 damage per pellet times ten pellets for a total of 99, at which point you already have a whole number and don't need to round. So the result is the same even if the boost was per-pellet. (Besides, even if it was actually ten damage, that's still barely anything considering the specific context that it would be happening in.)
Fun fact about weapon switching: on weapons with a switch speed penalty, it doesn't actually activate unless the weapon you switched from was pulled out all the way. A similar thing happens with honorbound on the half-zatoichi, as putting it away won't damage you unless it's fully unsheathed.
crossbow has the "no headshots" stat because it uses the huntsman as a base, which can sidney sleeper has the "no random crits" stat because (likely) the "crits on scoped headshot" part of stock is removed, but includes the "no random crits" in that stat itself
I think the Sniper Rifle's inability to randomly crit is tied to its headshot attribute, so when they removed that attribute for the Sydney Sleeper, it also removed the property that prevented it from randomly critting, so they had to add an additional attribute to re-disable random crits for the weapon after the bug got reported.
Shortstop is a mvm game changer if used right. If bots are about to cap even giant bots you can stand in the center aim at them and shove them for just enough time for your teammates to kill before they can cap. It’s insane how many times we’ve been saved because of it.
Reduced mystery solving was used in an ARG for a pyro update; I think it was the pyromania update but anyway. Basically it changed specific item descriptions of no longer existing pyro weapons that together created a poem. Remnants are the slightly melted capacitator and the fire prove diary. So back then it was useful but today it really just like that apple hat with an arrow through it that reduces hunger.
The Huo Long's Heater damage penalty Why? A dps penalty, on a dps class, for a dps increase only at practically point blank range (where if you shoot someone there's probably no difference whatsoever) Also the firing speed penalty, the one that the manmelter had Why?
if the Huo Long Heater had a "tap the weapon slot to change firing mode or hold R to change firing mode" and it can choose between Fire ring and Incendiary Ammo(ignite on hit) but it still causes 4 ammo consumption, what that make it better? Also, if stock had a choice between Normal Fire and "tap the weapon slot or hold R to change to Hollow point rounds(bleed on hit)" with the new firing mode using 4 more ammo consumption and no random crits, would that be fine? Manmelter could take all debuffs expect the bleeding(meaning afterburn, mad milk, jarate and Gas passer Gasoline status) since bleeding is solved with surgery/getting healed instead of vacuum cleaners. plus a fire mode switch when holding R between fire bolt and a explosive shot would work.
Frankly, in MvM, I only notice the 10% bonus damage as really useful against tanks. It helps out a tiny, tiny bit; because of the sheer amount of shots you bust into a tank + usually being at point blank, the slight damage increase builds up over time. Really, though, it matters very little anyway. Wow, 99 damage instead of 90.
The Widowmaker's 10% damage against your sentry's target was (according from Lister's History of Engineer) introduced to encourage players to build sentries, since at first they ignored them and just spent the metal on shots 😮
For the Sydney sleeper, basically the reason snipers don't random crit is because they can headshot, so in dev the SL was probably intended to random crit as it doesn't headshot, but gladly they realized there's other reasons a sniper rifle shouldn't random crit (or any weapon tbh) and gave it a no random crits stat
You’re really close. They didn’t just consider making it random crit, it straight up COULD random crit on release. It only took them a week to remove its random crits, and that downside was listed as a result.
Random crits are more balanced than headshots, so it's more likely that the Sleeper's brief ability to random crit was a bug caused by either Stock's inability to crit being tied directly to its headshot attribute, and after learning about the random crit bug they decided changing the new "no headshots" attribute to also disable random critical hits would be redundant, so they just added the "no random critical hits" attribute to the weapon instead.
7:14 - The Sydney sleeper did actually have a secondary weapon viewmodel made and it's been leaked for a while now. It was actually so far into development alongside a scrapped Revolver sniper that the QC file for Snipers animationset referenced it up until it was removed in the "Fixed crash caused by Sniper trying to eat his gun" bug.
Widow Maker: it incentivizes you even more to target the enemies targeted by the sentry gun because you will get 10% MORE METAL BACK PER SHOT as well as 10% more damage.
Widowmaker and its damage bonus when you shoot the same scout your sentry aims at. No one really use it and either: •leave the heavy-caliber tripod-mounted little-old-number built by engineer do the job •rush like a mad mann toward the target outside of sentry range
The Windowmaker's damage bonus isn't meant to be significant, it's supposed to communicate to new players how the weapon is best used. It's actually pretty smart.
the shove has a few purposes: -push apart uber combos like a knockoff pyro -cliffs -get off of my cart -no spy you may not tauntkill our sniper please leave -stop scouts from drinking their bonk or crit a cola -get away from me please pyro
>Third Degree hits a Medic's patient connected to the medi-beam when you aim at the Medic That is the only difference between Fire Axe and Third Degree.
The reason the Sydney sleeper has the "No random crits" stat is because before it did mini-crit headshots, it instead had no headshots at all and _could_ randomly crit. So this was added on when the weapon was redesigned to disable that ability. It should probably be a hidden stat though, since yeah, no one would expect the new sleeper to be able to randomly crit
6:27 the tooltip for knockback vulnerability should absolutely be written in blue as a positive, buffing surfing by 20% on the fastest class in the game is valuable and functional both offensively and defensively. those sorts of dives are one of the only things that the shortstop is capable of outshining the stock in, between the longer jumps and the time it takes you to deal 150 damage. being able to ride a rocket that little bit further isn't an insane buff, but when it works it /really/ works to the point at which i'd say it's malicious and misleading to say that making the lightest class lighter is somehow a bad thing
Back in the old days of TF2 crusader's crossbow had huntsman arrows that would crit on headshot, hence why valve changed that and it would still confuse some people thinking the weapon could headshot There some trivia for you folks
I remember I got killed by a Nostromo Napalmer Set Pyro as the Alien Scout one time in my near 1000 hours of playtime on Tf2. I’ll never forget when his flames licked me and I died instantly lmao.
Good MvM Engineers can make use of the extra 10% damage on Widowmaker to squeeze out a bit more tankbusting DPS in since it's such an easy target. Using the Wrangler and crit canteens is redundant since the sentry firing speed caps at 3x (the canteen actually boosts sentry firing speed to the max), so running Widowmaker in that instance makes more sense.
