When a Bike Shop Tells You a Bike Isn't Designed to Be Converted to Electric 

Just bought an old 2016 fatboy se (specialized) for 550 euros. Motorised with my bbs02 from another bike, it cost me 170 euros on refurb market. And a 200 euros new battery. For less than 1000 euros I have 19kg 750w 26" fatbike with top quality frame and wheels. I just love it. Thank you for your work.

I'm DIY for 90% of bike work..whether my converted ones or my "Acoustic". However the bike shop I use for the tedious stuff (AKA TRUING WHEELS!) is smart and very open to eBikes. This is why he is thriving while the others are falling behind. He'll sell used, new, conversions, etc. Will build folks eBikes that they buy online..rides them himself and still is a high level road racer. He gets it and will survive!

Within my community we have shop-based riding groups, and a lot of people on the trails. Make friends with those willing and trade skills. Buy lunch for someone that can help guide you through the process. Get rid of the "gotta do it all by myself attitude" if you have little to no experience. By ourselves we struggle. Together we can form Johnny NerdOut groups across the country. Make it happen people ! LOL (I'm retired and bored. Can you tell?)

I agree with this video whole heartedly. Even the bike parts in regular mountain bike like cassettes say they support ebike. But i have a story i can tell you about that here. It makes me smile now as been through an adventure upgrading motors over the last three years. When i first wanted to get an ebike I saw the price and thought what happens if it breaks will be too expensive to fix. So years ago I researched and bought a decent mountain bike just to convert it to an ebike with a mid drive kit. I remember watching a video from Johnny about hub motors vs mid drive and that convinced me to get a mid drive. The bike i got was 11 speed SRAM cassette, hydrolic disk breaks the bike is Voodoo Bizingo 29inch tyres and good reviews for its spec. I added a Bafang BBS01 motor its like a tank never had any problems with it. Worked great but i wanted torque sensing as its a mountain bike. I went to a bike park wales for the first time with BBS01 and I looked really out of place next to these expensive embts. My breaks were squeaking so i took it to the bike shop there and the mechanic who was fitting new break pads said to me that my cassette was not strong enough for that motor. I just ignored that comment as i did my research. I know its way cheaper to replace the cassette (and will eventually have to) than buy an ebike and the higher spec eagle cassette that costs 3x as much and its the next tier up from my SRAM 11 speed cassette. I then got a TSDZ2 for the torque sensing. Loved it for the ride feel but that motor just falls apart its not robust. I did the open source mod and heat sink mod. Had 4 TSDZ2 motors break over two years so I did loads of maintence like replace the clutch, controller, blue gear. So many things went wrong with that motor every few months. It turned out the mechanic was also right that the cassette was not strong enough for that motor though by then i had changed from Bafang to TSDZ2 by then. Two teeth on the smallest gear on the cassette broke off. I think the motor jerked as it was downshifting and applied too much power via the chain and so broke the teeth off. I read in the SRAM marketing pdf for the 11 speed cassette its rated to support ebike motors. But evidently it was not strong enough. It was super easy to fix i just replaced that one cog and kept the rest of the cassette. So even if it does break you can very cheaply replace the parts. I finally got the TSDZ2B which has some improvements on the clutch but that also died 6 months later with water damage from cleaning the bike. Two others died because the screws inside the motor galvanised (that means aluminium case fused to the steel screws) so could not remove the internal motor to get to replace the broken blue gear. One caught fire as the amps were set too high (my bad). For the cost of all those four motors i could have got an Ebike. But i am not deterred with conversion kits. I now have a Toseven DM02 motor fitted about two months ago. Very happy with it. It has a two year warranty. I dont need to do any mods or open it up. Supposidly its more waterproof than the TSDZ2 IP54 dust and light rain rating as it has IP65 light water jet proof. I guess that means i can clean it. The ride feel is almost as good as the TSDZ2 open source once you put the torque sensor in sensative mode. Happy riding.

Yup. I totally agree. I've been converting since 2016 with Bafang products. Frames built for mid-drive and internal battery look "better" but I prefer conversion ebike every time.

oh man, i saw ur mid drive install vid, so i went and bought a new bike to do it to. When i started asking spec questions and detailing what my plans were, they went quiet... not just ordinary quiet, they went real passive and mentioned that "they hope i know what im doing" LOL. i built it under your guidance and used it for work for a bit, then a mate paid me a tidy profiting sum to run off with it. 5 outta 5 stars, will ride again thanks to you.

I was literally just told by my bike shop that my Specialized Chisel was not a good choice because it wasn't meant for a motor. Thank you.

1:25 This is so true! I had an old 1989 Trek 1200 and rode it down a hill at 32 mph and it was fine! A bit sketchy perhaps because the tires were old, but bikes are made to go fast.

100%!!! I first converted in 2017. Back then the LBSs didn't even want to work on e-bikes. Being in NYC they had to get with the times since then. That said, a 1kw motor can do damage to an old & unmaintained bike. I broke a number of spokes & a chain in my first few weeks. Each repair was a learning experience & I'm riding the same spokes & chain since 2019 (& with more power). Those were problems created by my neglegence not the motor breaking a bike that couldn't take it. A properly maintained bike can absolutely handle up to 1,000 watts.

In 92 on my giant cross trainer I got a speeding ticket for doing 96kph in a 60kph zone. So even without a motor bikes go fast.

A good bike is worth it and is e-bike-able. I have a Motobecane X2 gravel bike, and it's now electric. It went with the CYC Photon mid-drive. I liked riding it before, and now it's even better.

While the vast majority of bikes can be converted, some won't be very good after converting depending on the intended use and fitment of the conversion kit. A lot of mountain bikes have a downtube that would make the motor part stick down at an angle that would technically work but would make your ground clearance miserable to ride on all but the smoothest mtb trails. Also, as I found out, converting a hard tail mountain bike makes for a miserable off-roader since the extra weight of battery/motor really needs to be part of the suspended weight. I have both full and hardtail emtb and it is night and day on actual trails. Hardtail is only good for greenway and maybe gravel rides - I even put smooth/street tires on the hardtail since it is useless off-road. If you are just converting a bike to ride on relatively smooth surfaces (paved, crushed gravel bike paths, etc..) then pretty much any bike that fits the rider will do.

I've been watching you for a couple years. Always enjoyed. Your honesty as a small business. I do bike coversion kit to myself. I'll enjoy talking to you just for different ideas and the fun conversation. It's all about community on this one.😊

dude, I love talking to people in the shop about conversions and the pros and cons of buying a new bike versus converting their old one. not to mention I’m the one that ends up working on all of them so it’s kind of cool.

My second and third ebike i bought were kit bikes i bought used with bafang motors and the only problem i've had was the clutch went out. One is a fat tire fame the other is a triple triangle gt frame. They work just fine!

Thanks for the solid info! 👍 By the way, I'd love to see videos on making a frugal DIY electric bike. Maybe it could be driven with a hoverboard motor, since hoverboard might be available used, at a good price.

I've had this happen to me. So, I electrified my bike within its own capabilities.

I went from a pre-built to a bafnag kit and th enumber 1 thing I appreciate with teh Bafang is the ability to repai tmysel for take it to any repairer. I had that first bike battery die after a few yars, whihc is expected I rode it as a cimmuter and charged it every day. But the replacement was going to be 1300+ shipping. so I bought a 1200 Bafang and kit.

Synopsis for "When a Bike Shop Tells You a Bike Isn't Designed to Be Converted to Electric": It's in the bike shop's best interest to steer you away from converting (which they don't do) and instead buy a pre-built ebike (which they DO sell). Realize what is happening, ignore their self-interest statement designed to get more of your money, and move on to a different bike shop. Remember, bike shops exist to make money. If they don't have to pay someone to do ebike conversions, and sell ready-made ebikes, then you know they are unwilling help you attain your goal of converting your current pedal bike to an ebike.

Nailed it as you always do Johhny. Over and above, bike sales people being largely ignorant, a bit more to it. Bike shops would never want to accept the 'liability' of creating custom high power e-bikes, in particular, ebikes with power say 1500+watts that exceed normal 28mph Class III in US standards. In fact, it can go a step further. Where I live in FL where they sell factory ebikes to tons of oldsters who don't have a penchant for speed, my local bike shop will not work on any ebike with a throttle. They deem them as 'electric motorcycles' and not ebike. So ludicrous can go to the extreme. Many factory ebikes are made with a throttle and I wouldn't build a high power ebike without a throttle even though I come from a cycling background. A. bike shops don't have the expertise B. bike shops don't want the liability C. lot easier for bike shops to just to sell low power factory e-bikes to the masses for their set profit margin and truth is, the public are largely ignorant as well who may in fact be even intolerant...I have seen it...of higher speeds enthusiasts actually prefer. A parallel universe of sorts of what the consumer wants. Keep preaching the gospel Johnny. We will be listening.

I seen a $7k e-bike in the store. No way in hell i’m buying that. I converted a Specialized enduro with a BBS02 and 48v 13Ah battery. Bike is a blast to ride and I can fix it. Bike build is solid.

Thanks!

I live in Alaska. I'm gonna do a build in about 2 months. I plan to order the CYC Photon for my 2023 Giant talon but gonna talk to you on a consultation call next week to see if that is the right fit for what i want to do. Also, am I going to have a problem getting a battery up here? Thanks for your videos. looking forward to this build!!!

Good afternoon, Dr. Nerdout, and thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience with us! I have a question which I've not yet seen in any of your videos or comment sections.... Do you know of any insurance companies that will insure a custom converted e-bike? (mid-drive kit installed on an MTB) Thanks!

I did a BBSHD conversion on a hybrid bike. Nothing broke but the frame and fork are too flimsy for the added weight.

2500 Watts some athletes can put out riding bicycles with rim brakes, putting 1000 watt mid drive is half that. I shake my head when a bike shop tells me the bike is not designed for a 250w motor I am installing.

The rule now seems to be that bike shops will refuse to do ANY kind of maintenance work on e-bikes that weren't purchased from them.

You alluded to it but didn’t fully state it. A lot of the store bought e bike are proprietary. You can’t replace the motor or the battery or even the display without getting ripped a new one. An extra low AH battery alone cost ~$700 dollars. That’s absolutely ridiculous!

Yea I bought a Walmart schwin al comp threw bbhsd on there and it rips. Great learning experiences but man that was not a good bike to take to mountains

Ive been told they dont want to touch my Paratrooper with BBSHD because they didnt sell it. Just need brakes fixed, WE CANT TOUCH IT BECAUSE ITS ELECTRIC.

What about breaks they don’t need upgrade

Are you open on the weekends? At your shop/

Hey ...bike shop said I can't do my 2012 specialised epic carbon bike. Help me prove them wrong. How do you convert the 46mm bbshell to fit a bbsdhd

dont convert anything that already has a reputation for breaking. that is why I avoid carbon fiber frames.

People are super scared of change. Think how long bike geometry sucked. Remember hub bearing just 10 years ago! I also make and convert custom electric transportation options that most people don't even know are a thing.

I've spoken to 10 different bike shops who won't touch my conversion. Does anyone know of a shop around Los Angeles that will do it?

True,the ebike here is like an iPhone ,they cost €7000😂

The bike shop wants you to buy a $10,000 POS money pit. The ones they sell are design to fail quickly, leaving you without your money and without your ride. DIY or no motor

Heres the scenario, You put motor on my Rockhopper, while riding the wheels fall apart and im in the icu. I then sue you and win. This is why bike shops WILL NOT convert

I actually disagree completely. I have had great success with converting the cheapest Walmart and Amazon bikes. What you really shouldn't convert is a coaster brake bike unless you want to convert the brakes as well then that's different. Also carbon fiber you shouldn't convert it above anything street legal. A lot of mountain bikes sold at bike shops are carbon fiber and have thru axles which makes it harder to convert unless you use Grin Tech motors. If you want a bigger battery on the frame and not on a bike trailer or backpack, you may have to be picky about what frame you want. Basically don't covert anything that wasn't made specific for Ebikes to something over 5000W.

I have been seriously riding a bike for 56 years now. I raced professionally in the 1980s. Today at 66 years old I don't own a car and ride my bicycles 10,000 miles a year, and my Ebike 500 miles a year. Over half a century on bicycles has taught me they are the weakest, most fragile vehicle ever made. They don't have to be, but they continue to sell recreational bikes with racing specifications, NONE would ever pass a DOT test (if there was one). Even with the strength (weakness :) of a 66-year-old, I stretch chains, break spokes, crack frames, tear up freehubs, and can potato chip a rear wheel in a sprint. I am the most skilled cyclist in the world, with high and low cadence options, developed 5 main pedal strokes, 4 pedal strokes out of saddle, and can efficiently travel at speed over 6 hours of continuous riding without stopping. All learned over the last half century of high mileage and intense training in all terrains, on and off-road. So disappointed and frustrated in bicycle weaknesses I started using mountain bikes on the road and convert with aerobars, bar-ends, street tires, and gearing. But even with the added strength of an off-road bike, the failures are almost the same, with the main advantage of tires, I can use a Schwalbe 26x2 inch Marathon Plus tire and ride without flatting. All other tires would flat 3 times a week. Now you want to add 10x the stress to these weak fragile bikes???? Yes, you can get away with it in the short run, but add the power of a rider to the motor, and the bicycle will fail catastrophically 10x faster. Since your conversions are mid-drive, the wear on the bike is enormous. The only reason people don't understand this or experience it is because they don't ride more than a few hundred miles a year.

At this year's CES show I noticed all of the Chinese e-bikes being made for the US market. What a bunch of crap in terms of practicality. Lots of whistles and bells and flashy lights. Just make me a low speed high torque affordable bike. How difficult is that? With a relatively small amount of skill and one of your upgrade kits I can make something that's actually practical and affordable then why can't manufacturers crank out thousands of these for 500-750 bucks each. It seems like a no-brainer.