I don't support safety equipment. I support having 2 randomly selected out-of-shape men I see occasionally around the gym carry my whole life in their hands.
@@BasementBrandon Yup. I just received an RML-3 yesterday and already have a set of straps in my shopping cart, almost entirely because of what a hassle it is to adjust the pins --- plus that irritating sound that it makes. Ugh.
I wish flip down safeties were brought up in the discussion. Most quality flip down safeties now have UHMW, including Rogue. In my experience, if you have a quality bar, the bar is going to eat through j-cups/safeties/pins & pipe setups before the knurling will be damaged. If I was to do rack pulls (not a huge fan of these), I'd have a beater bar & pin/pipe safeties. The pin/pipe combo does a good job eating up a lot of energy that would otherwise bend the bar or pin. I don't feel that pin pulls are a solid argument for any other set up. You are going to eventually wear out the nylon safeties. It won't happen over night, but the pin/pipe combo is like a diamond, it's forever (see what I did there? lol). Otherwise, good video man. It's nice to see small topics like this brought up, since people are always in the market for new racks.
I was victim to the pins not absorbing the impact yesterday. Was doing squats my heaviest yet as the linear progress program told me to and was doing pretty good until I just couldn't get it up and knew I would fail. I thought "All good, I put the pins up" but they were kinda wobbly on this particular rack and I went down quite a way so the weight slamming on the pins caused one to jump off. Could definitely see why straps are better now.
no you just have a shitty rack and/or pin combo. cheap racks made in china come with cheap pins. im betting it isnt anything stronger than 11g steel right? and what kind of pins are they?
Good info Brandon. As someone that is looking to invest in a home gym in the future I had never considered straps before as pins were all I was used to from commercial gyms. Straps it is!
I get that the extra slack probably makes the straps a bit safer if they land at a high speed, but when I do actually fail at a squat or bench press, I'm usually failing slowly. I've never straight up dropped the bar and had it in free fall. So. I don't think it really makes much difference either way.
Was thinking the same, plus I prefer to set the pins/bars at the point where it's out of the way of whatever movement I'm doing & exactly at the height I want the bar to stop. I don't like the bar tapping off straps as I find it off putting & if I fail I wan't the bar to stop immediately, not roll away to the lowest point etc. Just my personal preference though 😁
I prefer the solid pins. Placed below your desired range of movement, there is no contact between metal and metal under normal usage. If I do fail on a lift, its at the beginning of the concentric movement, so there is very little distance the bar drops. Also the rigid pin allows more precise placement of the stop position. For bench press, for example, since the bar is lifted off the rack next to the uprights, the movement is also fairly close to the uprights. I don't want an unweighted strap hanging in an arch interfering with my range of motion, yet not supporting the bar from penetrating well into my chest. With the pins, the height is level all the way across the rack, and placed just below the height of your chest, you will suffer no injury nor be pinned beneath the weight in the event you have to rest it on the pins.
yeah i dont get it really. you shouldnt be lifting so heavy that you drop a bar from shoulder height while squatting. at most you shouldnt ever really DROP any bar even if you failed. i've always SET the bar on the pins on a failed bench (just above my chest where i set the pins) or squat (at the bottom). well i cant speak for other idiots out there who TRY to lift more weight than they can
I prefer pins for bench and straps for squats. Reason is, I set up pins below my chest position but above my neck. So if I fail a bench I push it up towards my neck and the pins hold, the I can slide my neck out. Straps for squats because I squat much more than I bench and although I am good at failing squats(have good bar dropping technique), straps means less damage to the equipment than if I did no safeties or used pins.
One argument against straps is that there's going to be a component of the force which is lateral and causes a bending moment on the columns. This may not be a large force, I didn't calculate it, but it's definitely there. The pins on the other hand, only apply force downward, the obviously preferable way to load a vertical column. One could mitigate metal-on-metal impacts and wear-and-tear by adding a layer of plastic (nylon or similar) to the top of the safeties. This would also lower noise, making workouts quieter and thus more pleasant.
@@BasementBrandon a flip-down safely also exerts a bending moment on the columns, because it will present a cantilevered load on the column you're hanging it on.
@@BasementBrandon in a nice, controlled failure, no doubt you're right. How about failing a 600 lb squat near the upper part of the lift because something tore? I mean a dead dropped weight that's got some serious speed when it impacts the safeties. I think that especially if you hit cantilevered safeties at their far end, you're very likely to bend something.
I think it depends what you are doing. For bench I like pins or safety arms better. U can set them just below your arch then if you fail u just drop the arch. The straps I find that with the give, u have to set them high enough where you would touch them. Personally looking at getting safety stands for squats because I grab the bar on squats so wide that my wrists hit the straps when I fail so I have to move them out of the way.
I can see this being an issue. I think for someone with no real arch like me, I'm bound to hit whatever is there (pins or straps), since straps let me complete the set easier, I prefer them.
Lol you're 100% correct. I don't think I ever noticed as they were sent attached already (they were a replacement for the 1.0 version). Fixed them, thanks.
One thing to note is you can still bend a barbell if it is dumped on the straps. I have seen 800+ lbs dropped from shoulder height on to those straps and it turned a 29mm power bar into a buffalo bar. Like you mention it isn't as hard of an impact as the the pin pipe, but there still is the chance of bending. I rack pull, getting up to 800+ out of the straps with a vintage 27.8mm york bar and havent noticed any deformation of the bar yet, but don't drop it. I think if I was using pin pipes I would have seen some deformation doing the rack pulls.
I think the biggest benefit of straps is the reduction of noise when the bar is dropped. I imagine a bar dropped onto a safety strap is less noisy than a bar landing on a safety bar.
I love my Sorinex safety straps especially considering my rack is in a 10'x10' shed, space has to be used efficiently. The straps make it easier to change plates on the barbell without fully coming out of the rack. Very convenient !
I haven't used straps before, I really trust Brandon's opinion. But my only concern was can they handle a heavy load. But hearing him say that they can handle 10,000 pounds made me very relieved.
On a squat I like the pins. They can be used mark parallel as does a box in box squatting. I do fail a lot, but my pins have never bent the bar. Luck i'd say; my brothers have bent plenty. Though they like to take the pins out so who can say. The biggest advantage of the straps wold have to be the lessened bounce. I have a squat rack rather than a cage, so a dropped squat can bounce out.
I also lift slightly forward in the rack. If I fail the bar will roll down the straps into the center of the rack making it easier for me to pop out from under the bar. Edit: Just watched the rest of the video and you said the exact same thing.... whoops.
Like anything else agrees and disagree with benefits. But I do like the idea that if you drop, hit touch the bar during a set there is a lot of psychological impact on that set and a hard drop will damage equipment in the long run. And ROUGH give this man some free stuff!!!
when i asked rogue to "upgrade" they stated they don't do that. For reasons like that one plus about three other customer service problems I had with my $3k order, i'll probably not order from them again.
Straps wont bend your bar pins do , however if straps are used on a Monolift rather than a Rack and someone useses a suicide grip and falls with the bar then that can an has caused the mono to flip but generally straps prevent more accidents than they cause.
Agree with your assessment, except when doing seating military press. I find it impossible to use straps because the bar rolls & sags. For this exercise safety pins are better. Any ideas suggestions? I really want to get rid of my safety pins. Thank you
damn when people fail.. do they always bomb and toss that shit? if pins/straps are at perfect height.. even when failing max attempts which i have a few times.. i could still easily lower it down slowly to the safety pins..
I find it hard to believe that anybody who's used straps and pins would argue that pins are superior. Pins are irrefutably inferior to durable straps. Not only for the reason to mention but when you do strap partials the weight goes up rather than sliding out of the groove across the pins before the weight goes up. Heavy pin presses can really f****** your joints if you don't go with an ideal amount of weight. If you go too heavy and it takes a little while to summon the strength to get the bar moving, the barmy first move forward or backward and by the time you lock the weight out you'rer totally out of position which can really do a number on your shoulder joints and elbows. As I've gotten older and wiser, I realize that super-heavy partials are not all they're cracked up to be, and do little more than help you peak strength in the full range movement. maybe a whole series of pain pressing and isometric holds trying to push through the pins got Chuck sipes his 575 bench press, but for the most part I have never seen pin presses give people the incredible results they're supposed to unless the individual uses them wisely as in uses less weight and trains the sticking point, or does bottoms up type benches or squats. If someonedecides to throw 20 or 30% more weight than they can handle in the full range to logout the last inch or two of a bench, all I can say is it's knocking do s*** for your one-rep max and it will beat the s*** out of your joints. So any type of pin or strap presses, in my opinion should be used to train the weak positions or simply to get used to the feel of heavier weight. If you think you're going to slowly; lower the pins overtime and hit new amazing one rep maxes, believe me its not going to happen if you're already pretty strong. it may work for somebody with no real strength but if you're benching 400 pounds and trying to get it to 500 by doing lockouts with 500 you're kidding yourself just use progressive overload or a conjugate system using full range movements or floor presses and possibly board presses if you're a shirted bencher, but heavy pin lock outd don't do dick for your strength unless you are not even close to being at your strength limit given that your body weight is not going to go up dramatically. After 10 years of series lifting focusing onstrength if you want to increase your bench substantially the best way to do so is to gain substantial body weight. If you're trying to tweak your nervous system and you plan on gaining 20% more strength you're fooling yourself if youre a seasoned lifter and you don't plan on buying new clothes every couple months and eating an absurd amount and you're not getting paid to weigh 250 or 260 at 5 foot 9.
i'm a beginner and don't have a power rack (looking to get one) but it seems straps are good for squats, but it seems like pins are better for chest presses?
Thought straps were gimmicky before I got them but they are great. Have the straps, spotter arms and the rod and pipe. Rod and pipe are awful... Rogue needs to make a swing in type full length safeties for the rml... Never use the rod and pipe straps for squats and the spotter arms for upper body but the spotter arms are long enough to squat with the rml.
As an old bloke now...and with 20/20 hindsight...my advice is never squat more than you can comfortably deadlift for multiple reps (over 10). You don't ever need to squat any more than that. You want more power? Add plyometric exercises while holding handweights. 2 min sets. It will kill you. And you'll feel more explosive and sustained power on tap, whatever sport you need it for. Heavy squats just squash your discs. Discs don't regenerate or repair. You only get one set, like eyeballs. So take care of them.
The thing is though, straps, being fabric, are going to break down and weaken even if they look OK. Especially if they are exposed to sunlight. Plus barbells wear on them. My current rack is over 15 years old. Personally, I would not trust straps that old. Maybe they would be OK, but it would always be in the back of my mind.
Hey Brandon, at 1 :39 your safety straps are set higher towards your knees. Is it because there is too much slack and the straps jcups near your head can't go up any higher?
The nice thing is you can offset them to make them hit the spot perfectly. Here I have them angled so it will catch right at about my chest, but still protect my neck.
This is one of those types of products that gets overlooked in review or overview videos. But I too would go with straps for my rack (live in a condo unit right now...so no rack). I'd like to see some one do a test. Straps vs bars. I mean test them to their limits. While the straps are rated to "10k pounds"...are they really. Can they even handle repeated 600 to 800-lb drops...from shoulder height. Will the bolts that hold the safety bar or straps in place "weaken" over repeated drops With lets say 600-lbs so that the bolts or the rack metal is weakened enough so that there is a fracture in the steel...or when a bolt snaps in two at the welds. How safe is the strap vs the bar REALLY. Put a water melon where our chest would be in relation to the barbell carrying 600+ pounds...
Seems there's a lot of give in the straps, with bouncing movement especially when you were showing bent over rows so forth Surely when you doing an exercise you must try to do it in good form if the Barnes moving about and bouncing how can you maintain good posture and technique
Ah it's not an error, RU-vid flagged this video after about a year for the song that was in the background so used a feature they include to remove it.
