Will The Last Jedi Backlash Affect Box Office for Rian Johnson’s New Trilogy? 

This. This right here.

Johnson’s writing was absolutely the problem. I agree.

I have also said that I have no problem with Rian Johnson the director. It was his writing (and editing choices).

He seems to be a marvelous director from a purely visual standpoint. But yeah, never let this guy anywhere near a script ever again.

Slap in the face to whom?

Just as many people loved it as the people that hated it

I've genuinely never heard that opinion before and that's really interesting. Although personally when I view the movie in plain film-making terms I think it still excels in most areas like script, acting, score, vfx, pacing. The main issues people tend to have with the movie is just plot decisions and moments. It goes places they didn't like or characters do things they didn't want them to. Thematically too though I think it's amazing.

Zach Gerrity Here are a few of the problems I had with the movie. The new characters haven't grown or changed since we first saw them. Rey's motivations are unclear (why does she want to redeem kylo)? Finn was wasted in this movie. That's a shame because I would've loved to see a character arc from storm trooper to Jedi, but now he's just comic relief and stereotypical. And Holdo and Rose were TERRIBLE characters. Holdo was a stuck up, egocentric, unprofessional commander that wouldn't even trust Poe (the man responsible for destroying star killer base) to hear her plan. SHE is the reason for many of the characters problems! Yet they act like she's a heroic protagonist. Why did Rose stop Finn from sacrificing himself for the resistance (by ramming into him with her speeder) and then deliver a completely contradictory line? SHE could have killed Finn and his death would have been for nothing! And then she kisses him without his permission? If rose were a guy that randomly kissed Rey, with no prior chemistry, no one would take it well. Terrible characters in my opinion. Plot holes that go beyond just this movie. I also think they spent too much time with Luke refusing to train Rey. TLJ also introduces a lot of continuity problems. In the novel, Rey was trained by stealing knowledge straight from Kylo Ren's mind. Why couldn't Jedi of the past do this? Why does anyone need to train? It's lazy how the create these problems and then sloppily try to patch them up in the novelization. Jedi can steal knowledge from others through the force, so no one ever needed to train? Lightspeed ramming is a thing now that was underutilized in the past? Tracking ships through lightspeed is a thing (that definitely won't lead to writing issues later on). Luke Skywalker, the man who wouldn't give up on his father, even after he loses his hand to Vader, gives up easily on his own nephew? Force projections are a thing that probably would've been useful to Jedi in the past. The issues with this movie spills into the others. Lastly, the movie leaves me with no interest to find out what happens next. Kylo Ren has already been beaten by Rey before when she know nothing, and she saved his life in Snoke's throne room, so he's not a very threatening villain. They killed off the only threatening villain, Snoke. The Knights of Ren are still nowhere to be found and haven't been set up. They should've used TLJ to introduce them so they can have more of an impact on the next movie. And there is no tension because Rey already bests everyone she meets. It's visually amazing, but without the flashing colors it's a pretty poor piece of writing that ignores even the most basic dos and don'ts of writing compellingcharacter arcs and likeable and relatable characters. It doesn't fit as a middle film in a trilogy and isn't respectful to what came before, including TFA.

Jesus Christ guys. "here's my cut down version" and then you write a novel xD This is RU-vid there's no time for that. But then again I read it all. And I virtually disagree with every point you made. Firstly basically all Star Wars movies are style over substance, as far as substance goes TLJ has the most of them all, even if you think it isn't conveyed very well. The substance of A New Hope is 'Empire/Authoritarianism = Bad'. These movies are all just pulpy fun they're not meant to be complex perfect explorations of deep themes where every single tiny little thing makes 100% scientific, moral and philosophical sense, they're family movies. Most of your points are nitpicks to the highest degree and you can do that with all Star Wars movies. List of random rebuttals: -The hyper space ramming scene shows Rian knows Star Wars more than people think. That scene is based on a line Han says in ANH where he says you can't just hyperspace around willy-nilly in case you crash into a random moon. It's dangerous, that's why people don't just do it at every opportunity and that's why hyperspace routes exist. She did it out of desperation. -The Leia scene did look pretty dumb but it was fine in theory. Yoda set up in RotJ that she has the force. -Luke thought about killing Kylo for the BRIEFEST of moments, he nearly killed his own dad in RotJ. He knows how much evil and power and destroy the galaxy and he thought about preventing it. And he felt such a deep shame afterwards that he banished himself. He felt how you felt. -Luke couldn't get to the planet physically that's why he projected himself and died on Ach-To. -Yeh the tonal shifts were jarring but at least the humour was actually funny, unlike in the prequels. -Holdo didn't tell Poe her plan because he'd just been demoted and killed a bunch of people, she doesn't have to tell him shit and she didn't expect him to cause a full on mutiny. -Who gives a shit about how bombs work in space? How are there explosions and sounds in space? It's Star Wars its a fantasy. We invent fiction about it because IT IS FICTION. -Rey doesn't fail to bring back Luke. Luke saved the rebels at the end of the movie. -People failing is the theme of the movie. Not everyone is perfect. -Of course Rian forced themes into the movie, he's the writer how else do they get in there. I LOVE Star Wars but people take this movie/franchise way too serious and expect them to be air-tight and perfect and deep and profound, which Star Wars has never been. As far as those things go, apart from Empire, TLJ has come closest to that imo. It's not perfect, but it's not bad by any means.

John Castiel maybe not ant man

Yes, Ant-man. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-uaz6nxyQA28.html

John Castiel Yep! Douglas looked JUST like Gordon Gekko!

Yep, dunno why Rocha can't get his facts straight.... not that hard

Facts

and you know? it was a hologram

Hack Snyder that hack? Rian Johnson is an incredible director

Bellis Reviews Rian Johnson incredible?? I mean if you like edgy nihilistic *never was probably punished or spanked in my life Libtard* movies then sure guess he his Brick is old as fuck and just a some edgy little shit heads dream its the poster child movie to spank your children and FORCE them to man the fuck up in life. Looper has some good moments. Oh and that brings us up to TLJ ooooh yea such a catalog

Lucky Day that all you got kid?

*Pouts with arms crossed*

You don't know what a hack is.

ALL41REVIEW I pray for that every night

Ariba Faheem it'll very likely be Doctor Aphra and Thrawn based. I'd bet money that the GoT's writers will get the Old Republic/Kotor eras, and Rian Johnson will take on the newer additions.

It'll be cool to see a Thrawn movie, and we could even explore the unknown regions that way.

The many problems I have with the movie extend far beyond Skywalker's inclusion.

Praetorian The first order yes, the Resistance was just out of moves. The First Order is run by two emotionally unstable 30 year olds, not ideal for military command and likely their downfall in 9. I actually want a Hux/Kylo infighting sub plot in 9, maybe the First Order turns on Kylo.

Gorlak Yeah I agree and known what you mean about the Resistance being out of moves. There is a huge difference between Hux and Kylo vs Tarkin and Vader! However it seems Hux has been dumbed down for forced comedy purposes.

Praetorian they’re not even in the same league. The only Empire esq commander gets blown up at the start because of Hux’s hubris. The whole movie is pretty much the Star Wars version of Dunkirk, they even escape on little space boats, and like Dunkirk they only make it because of the enemies hubris. Hux wasn’t shown to be smart in TFA, just terrible, but I think they made him the butt of jokes because it’s a kids movie and he’s a Nazi. I really like that Snoke abused him, and that Kylo would continue the abuse, but didn’t like everybody else joining in. Basically I like that they’re a terrible replacement for the Empire and they won’t last long, then they can bring in something new.

Gorlak I don't really buy the entire view of Hux being the but of jokes because it's a kids movie. It was just bad writing and more of a Marvel tone rather then a Star Wars tone. The original trilogy and Rogue One had serious and competent leaders on both sides. I guess I wanted Hux or some commander in the First Order to be more like a Grand Admiral Thrawn!

Praetorian I think they tried to balance the movie out with the jokes and Kanto bit, take them out and TLJ is really dark. I don’t think the first order is a good enough bad guy to invest in. I want them to be destroyed in 9 with Kylo escaping to uncharted space, then after like 5-10 years we get a new trilogy maybe Thrawn leading an army of force users, or Plagues returns with a new Sith army. I don’t really care about Hux, Vader would have already force choked him to death at this point. Actually going to call it now, Kylo force chokes Hux to death in 9.

That is complete bullshit. If JJ fucked up with his mystery boxes, most people would not have gave a shit for the Last Jedi. But it was the opposite. The hype of the Last Jedi was off the charts because of TFA. Anyone that doesn't see that just didn't like TFA or are blindly defending the fuck up Ruin Johnson. He got an easy lay up and he FAILED.

Thats what im hoping eventually, that the toys sales wont improve over the next couple of starwars movies and it will lead to Bob Iger maybe sacking Kennedy.

Aaron Johnson ... One can but hope.

Lol. Nope.

Thats not going to happen

TLJ

Werner van Alphen You were expecting one, and didn't get it. April Fools!

Werner van Alphen Rocha is the joke.

Werner van Alphen Were you dissatisfied that your expectations were subverted? :/

Werner van Alphen the joke is someone liked TLJ.

Salman Abdulla so sorry to hear of your horrible experience as well. I wouldn’t take anyone’s kids to that 4 breasted milked alien movie. That was degrading what they did to Mark!

Um, pretty sure the question was about the bottom line for the new trilogy of movies and would the fall out from TLJ impact that.

And the bottom line is, the new trilogy has grossed AND netted more money than any other trilogy ever with only 2 of the movies out. TFA+TLJ = $450 million in production, $3.4 billion sales = $3 billion net No other trilogy is even close when you subtract the production costs from the worldwide viewership. As for his trilogy, no one knows what it's even about, time, place, etc. Everyone within the company was thrilled with what Rian Johnson was doing before the movie came out, the only person who had said anything that can be construed as negative was Mark Hamill. Disney/LFL continue to parade Rian out to the media and the masses showing their support of him. This notion that they're not happy with the outcome and that they'd break with him is "fan" projection. It's wishful thinking from people who feel slighted that they didn't get the movie THEY wanted, nothing more. Stop blaming Rian for not being given an overarching direction by LFL when he began writing the script for TLJ. JJ and he had been collaborating for months while JJ was finishing TFA. TLJ began full on production 3 months before TFA was in theaters. "The Bottom Line" is the money it brings in. TLJ is the 9th highest grossing film of all time. For all the hate and vitriol some people have spewed about it, a crapload of people went back to see it 2,3,4, and even 5 times. And TFA didn't have the competition in it's second week that TLJ did. 6 days after the release of TLJ Jumanji ($945 mil worldwide) and The Greatest Showman ($415 million) opened, and kids movies Ferdinand ($293 million) and Coco ($780 million) were in their second week with it. TFA's big new competition in it's second week? Daddy's Home ($242 million) and Point Break ($133 million). TFA literally caught the end of Creed and Mocking Jay's final week, and had NO competition till it was unseated as the #1 movie in the daily box office in The Revenant TWENTY FOUR DAYS after TFA released. The only way Disney/LFL would even consider scaling back Rian is if the first movie in his new trilogy completely tanked. If it makes a billion dollars, sorry, but you'll be stuck with him for the second of his movies as well, and most likely the third.

I prefer longer questions to be honest I feel these days people get so in tune with Twitter and short messages they don't take time to think of what they want to say and don't have the space to write it fully. I like fully thought out questions compared to a couple of lines of vague ambivalence.

Matthew Palanca Wow... talk about maximum ignorance. No. Zimmer initially didn't have the time to score POTC. So he Recommended Baldelt. But he did contribute some themes for it. Including the main theme. Baldet only wrote the curse theme for the undead pirates. The Black Pearl soundtrack album MAIN credit even went to Badelt. So yeah. ZIMMER DEFINITELY stole the spotlight from his colleague. Oh and for your information. POTC2, 3 and 4 all had Zimmer at the helm, and they each had a ton of new material completely original and came from Zimmer, and they are far and away superior work than the first.

David Sakamoto The audience isnt making these movies. The audience isnt writing comics or books. The audience does not have the right to infringe upon creative freedom and sequester writers and directors. Its ok to not like these movies, but as the minority in that case, if you want things to change, write a script and direct a movie Reactionary tactics is what landed the DCEU where its at right now.

Daniel Solano, What worries is me is how they doubled down on Johnson. It was announced he was getting a trilogy but as the backlash grew and got more heated they announced they were starting pre-production and script writing. If they had just stayed silent for a few more months and not made any statements about Johnson's future on SW they might have avoided all these people now hammering them as well as Johnson. It now seems they are protecting him after a lot of fans believe TLJ was a disaster.

Yeah, it’s almost like they’re willing to just let a storyteller tell his story rather than caving in to the demands of an obnoxious and vocal fanbase that famously will never be satisfied.

Titanic

😈

That moment when your comment ages terribly and now you look like stupid and whiny.. lol

@@rocketeerraccoonus9654 ages terribly? Did his trilogy come out? Is it ever gonna come out? Lol dumbass

@@TankNBeans I don't even have to respond, bro. I could take the time to beat you down with facts and show how wrong you are, but you wouldn't care or understand anyway, unfortunately. Now not only do you look so incredibly unintelligent to everyone else, but the whiny pathetic insult to salvage an inch of your self-respect at the end is the cherry on top lol Good luck with life, dude.. You're gonna need it.

It’s half of the fandom stop lying to yourself. Glad you loved but stop acting like people who don’t are in the minority

You can go into the comment sections of most Last Jedi videos and speak with this "small discontented group" yourself. Of course the general movie goer will enjoy it. They only came for a visual spectacle. It's the Star Wars fanbase that have been torn in half, and possibly more judging by the 47% on rotten tomatoes. In my opinion, the movie was bad whether it was Star Wars or not.

leonthesleepy it won’t

it will affect. if you really believe that it wont than you are in denial

Cloudy Storm It's gonna affect the money they make, for sure, but I still believe the movies will be great.

Revan 1313 im definitely not in denial. I believe that the same people that saw the last jedi and the other ones will see the new trilogy. Whether they liked tlj or not. It's star wars

Cloudy Storm Yeah but you gotta believe that at least some of them will have enough ego not to see it after screaming at the top of their lungs how "RUin JhOnSOn" raped their childhoods and that they would not give another dollar to Disney ever again. Or maybe not.

acidpunk1 It survived through the prequels

Alec Arena it sure did survive because of its FANS and that’s my point I think u missed that

neosoontoretro it’s ignorant to think that people who didn’t like it are in the minority. It underperformed yeah it made 1.3 but it’s a Star Wars movie that’s the expectation. The fact it didn’t make as much as it could like around the 1.5-1.8 should be a concern and to ignore that would be stupid there is a problem and it’s best that Disney damage control instead act like there is no problem.

@Jackson No, it's not ignorant it's just factual. The idea that TLJ "underperformed" is what's ignorant, you can't honestly claim that 1.3 billion dollar is a underperformance because it didn't make more. With that logic you can claim that TDK underperformed because it didn't make 1.5 billion dollars. I'm sorry, but it's stupid to suggest there's must be a problem despite all the evidence that says otherwise is not being realistic.

neosoontoretro do you think in Disney’s eyes they hit there projected numbers for tlj. TDK is different because the expectations were different the movie wasn’t expected to make as much as it did. I’m only talking comparing the move to itself as a Star Wars movie not anything else. Tlj on the other hand had huge expectations with numbers that are good but didn’t meet what they thought. To ignore that would be simply stupid and not business savvy. You can be happy that the movie made over a billion but for a sequel in the main trilogy should’ve easily hit 1.5 or higher. That’s money left on the table and if ignored could be worse next go round

@Jackson Er... yeah I do. There is no reason to think that Disney projected that TLJ would make 1.8 instead of 1.3 billion dollars. Sorry, but you're basing this on faulty speculation rather than you know reality. What you don't seem to understand is the idea that TLJ underperformed because it could have more can be said for almost any successful box office film. There is no reason to think TLJ should have easily hit 1.5 billion or higher when most films in history don't reach that high. Guy, you're just not living in reality if you think 1.3 billion isn't doing as good as they thought.

neosoontoretro you know Star Wars movies do those type of numbers. Your not looking at the facts or at history. Historically all Star Wars movies make over a billion. TFA made 2 it’s simple math no way Disney thought they would make less than 1.5 billion, Star Wars is a huge movie franchise that has a huge following and makes billions of dollars but to think that 1.3 billion was the cap is foolishness. lookbat the market and you’ll understand that yes 1.3 billion is a lot but what happened to 700k. You don’t think that the sequel would make the same as the first movie because they never do rarely. Surface level 1.3 looks impressive but when you compare it with other Star Wars movies it’s not trending in the right direction. Also if you noticed the movie didnt have legs. Tlj made most of its money in the first couple weeks but had a huge drop off in the second and following weeks at record number highs for any Star Wars film. You can look all this up on box office mojo. I’m saying Disney can rest on their laurels and act like there isn’t any issues or they can be honest and learn so they can maximize their profits for the next film. Nothing wrong with evaluating and adjusting even in success. I’m not arguing 1.3 isn’t a lot of money but for a starwars mainline film, There is no argument that tlj left a lot of money on the table and turned off a lot of fans of the franchise.

Sequels have a history of making less than their predecessors, just look at Empire compared to A New Hope. Your conclusion about people speaking with their wallets is unfounded (in this situation) and I'm willing to bet the next movie will do just fine.

A lot of people bashed JJ after TFA, but after seeing TLJ those people now seem to be looking back at TFA with better eyes and hoping JJ can save the franchise. I like JJ to be honest and liked TFA and as long as Disney stay hands off and let him do his movie we might be ok. Whatever we hear in the press I am thinking JJ is simply towing the party line right now knowing after a while Disney might get off his back a little. Lets wait till we see the first trailer, but I am hopeful Episode IX will redeem this trilogy.

UK Media Warrior I like J J as well. I was never on the Rian Johnson hype train. Looper was ok, but I didn’t think it was amazing. I still don’t understand how someone who’s made only a few movies gets to make a Star Wars movie. There are so many talented directors out there who have made way more movies than Rian, who are getting overlooked. They should have locked in J J for all 3 episodes. Lucasfilm make no sense, yet people continue to heap on praise.

Roger Gregory 100% agree with you on that. It's like how Disney screwed up by giving Ava Duvernay A Wrinkle in Time to direct when she had only ever done small budget movies (only one that made it to the big screen). The odd thing is that movie bombed and WB/DC have taken her on to do The New Gods movies for them There must be well established popular movie makers out there dying to do a SW movie and considering the money Disney splash around it isn't that they cost to much to hire so maybe it's that Disney only want directors who do what they say?

So you don’t think The Force Awakens made $700,000 more than The Last Jedi because it was a pop cultural movement? Sequels to movies that make the kind of money TFA made always come up short. Always. When Avatar 2 comes out, it will make less money than the first one, for example.