#26 Lima Class 47 Ringfield Motor Upgrade - Part B

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This is the fifth video in the Lima Class 47 upgrade mini-series and is Part B of replacing the ringfield/pancake motor with a brand new CD/DVD drive motor.
Part B focuses on fixing the motor into place, creating a small diode array to drop some volts so that the motor is less stressed by higher voltages and then wiring it all up to the DCC decoder.
In Part A, we looked at dismantling the old motor, removing the gears for cleaning, adapting the plain bearing to accommodate a smaller drive shaft and positioning the new motor ready for gluing. You may wish to watch Part A first.
These are detailed, step-by-step videos. If you want a brief overview, you’ll find other options on RU-vid and elsewhere. The methods used in this video are not necessarily the only way to do it, nor necessarily the best.
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00:20 - Gluing the new motor into place
05:39 - Reassembling the gears
08:00 - Making a diode voltage dropper
18:48 - Wiring up the new motor
22:58 - Testing the new motor
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The 10mm CD/DVD drive motor should work in most Lima models locomotives of the following OO gauge classes: 08, 09, 31, 37, 40, 47, 52, 59, 60, 66 and 92. Other models may be able to accommodate a larger 12mm motor, but you must check dimensions yourself first.
The replacement motor is a 12000rpm, 6V, 0.03A DC motor. The output from a DCC decoder or a DC controller can reach 12V DC (sometimes a little higher) at the top end. In order to avoid motor burn-out and prolong motor life:
1. Diodes should be used to reduce voltage (as shown in the video),
2. DCC decoders should have their CV5 value reduced (if available), and
3. Top speeds should be kept to a minimum and run at higher speeds for short periods only.
Our accompanying website article is here: tinyurl.com/ringfield-motor-r...
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You can buy some of the consumables featured in this video via these Amazon affiliate links:
* 10mm 6V motor: amzn.to/2HtkpYa
* 8-tooth, 2mm ID/5mm OD gears: amzn.to/2HtWI1C
* 2.5mm OD brass tube here: tinyurl.com/2-5mm-brass-tube
* Surface mount (SMD) rectifier diodes: amzn.to/2KPv5Hp
* Through-hole rectifier diodes: amzn.to/2sQweSH
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Thank you very much for watching.
Please comment, like, share and subscribe!
Visit us at: www.strathpefferjunction.com
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Please note: I’ve drawn upon ideas and suggestions from a range of channels and people, as well as implementing my own. If you choose to follow any of the steps outlined in the video, you do so at your own risk and any damage to yourself, your models or your equipment is your own responsibility.

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7 июн 2018

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Комментарии : 82

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

+ Update + You can now buy ringfield motor adaptors for your own Lima loco at: www.strathpefferjunction.com/hornby-lima-ringfield-motor-upgrade-conversion-kits

@roydom5 5 лет назад

Great video, well presented and comprehensive. You've put a lot of work in to share your knowledge with the rest of us - thanks so much!

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Many pleasure. I'm glad you enjoyed it 🙂👍🏻

@onnomulder9775 6 лет назад

Thank you for these two instructional videos!! Regards Onno.

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Many thanks, Onno. Glad you liked them :)

@barrybrown9351 5 лет назад

Brilliant explanations, camera work and descriptions of quite involved technical projects. Have been considering upgrading some of my older - mainly Lima - models to provide better drives, directional lights and sound for somde considerable time. Your videos inspire me with the confidence to proceed. Probably some of the best "how-to" instructions I have seen. Many thanks. Janner305

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Many thanks, Barry. Really appreciate the feedback and kind words. 👍🏻

@TheDaf95xf 6 лет назад

Hi and yet again a great tutorial video 😊 At the time Lima made a fantastic British outline model at a reasonable price 💷 But with that motor letting the model down.....😫 So Thanks to the likes of you their being brought back to life 👍🏻 Lima locomotives are a great model too kit bash as an entry level like weathering etc and not mentioning that bad running!! So thanks again for your tutorial on converting the class 47 to run for some more years to come!! Looking forward to seeing it on your layout 😁 Stevie

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

I'm really glad it's useful for you. I totally agree about the Lima model. For its day, it was great and the fact that even now, with a little fettling and detailing it can hold its own, is quite something!

@michaelwolak3098 6 лет назад

Hi I purchased the up grade for the Lima from Phillip on e bay and followed his instructions and it worked out great ,have also purchased the hornby kit again it worked out great ,just one other thing the Lima kit comes with the gear already assembled. Really enjoying your video’s Michael Wolak

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Many thanks indeed, Michael. Yes, I think his kits (assuming they're the ones I've seen on ebay) come with the gear trimmed and fitted (and maybe some tube too?). They're a nice product and certainly save a bit of hassle and simplifies the process, and probably makes sense if you're doing just one or two locos...but if you're going to do a few and are happy to do each step yourself, buying the components direct can be a bit cheaper.

@tomjenssen7486 6 лет назад

Thanks very much for this tutorial. I have some conversions to do, myself. All the best....Tom

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Hope they go well :)

@BritishRail60062 6 лет назад

Thanks for this video mate. It is a big help for me as I may well repower older Lima and Hornby models when I buy them. Ash.

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Really glad that you enjoyed it. Best of luck with any conversions that you do! :)

@BritishRail60062 6 лет назад

Thanks mate. I will just keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best! ;).

@Gordons1888 6 лет назад

I’m glad you subscribed to my channel or else I wouldnt have found yours I have a Lima 37 with a sound chip but the ringfield is too loud this video helped a lot

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Really glad that it's of help! I'm a train simulator fan too :)

@drewliszka4186 6 лет назад

superb tidy work mate hope you get lots of use out of it .

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Many thanks! Yes, I'm hoping to. I wasn't a fan of Lima locos, but since having started this project, I'm becoming a convert. There's a lot that you can do to them to make them really nice to have and use :)

@alanrochester5771 6 лет назад

Really neat work. An excellent informative video. Thanks Al.

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Many thanks, Al. Really appreciated.

@kinkong1961 5 лет назад

Another great video very informative easy to follow i love to see old trains come back into life and that motor conversion is a great idea and will save many old lima train which would probably end up in the bin or as a stand still model rotting away in an old yard another like from me all the best from john from rugby .ps cant wait for your next video .

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Many thanks, John. Much appreciated. I was replying to another comment of yours, but it seems to have disappeared. I'm not ignoring it!

@TonyDocksStation 6 лет назад

After seeing this, I might not sell my Lima 66 anymore. I’ll hopefully give this a go! Great video and well put together too!

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Thanks, Tony. I've just finished a video on a slightly different, alternative approach. Stay tuned...

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Here's my new and improved method! :) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-A8Pgx9IUDRM.html

@jamesevans4498 6 лет назад

Great video! I was thinking about doing that to my Class 90 of which I have just posted a video showing the upgrades I have made to the loco

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Many thanks, James. I'll check out your video later on today. 👍🏻

@Deltacon84 5 лет назад

Love this and i also love cd motor conversions. However I’ve always found the original Hornby and Lima motors much better if serviced properly and the correct chip used. As each chip delivers different running qualities. I have a Lima prairie with DCC’s concepts zen in and the original motor it runs better than my Bachman 45xx. As for noise most of that is from the gears. Whichever it is it’s all good fun tinkering with these things. Lima motors just need heavier gauge wire to deliver more current to them. Love the vid Rob :)

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Many thanks for the comment. Yes, I alway recommend that folk try servicing their ringfield motors first. They can often be made to run a lot better, even through little things like shims under the gears to reduce the slop. However, it doesn't always work and slow running performance is not always great, and that's where a cd motor can come in. 🙂

@johncarvil498 6 лет назад

Excellent video's Mate, I might have a go myself.....................John.

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Best of luck if you do! The ones I've done work pretty nicely and definitely an improvement on what they were. They will never have the performance or pulling power of a newer Bachmann or Heljan etc., but they can be perfectly serviceable :-)👍🏻

@JPMiller14 5 лет назад

Good video. I have spent the last year modifying these. It's much easier putting the motor in if you remove the centre wheelset, in fact get them all off whilst in there and clean the wheels. There's no point in having a nice new motor installed if the wheels are still that corroded brass colour you see on a Lima loco that has spent it's entire life boxed.

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Yup. It's always good to give the whole thing a good clean, service and lube as part of any motor change over.

@SimonLivertonCentral 6 лет назад

Hi David, watched this video and Part A, very well put together, I do like your use of different camera angles. Do you use two or more cameras at the same to or multiple videos you edit together with sound over the top? Hope that made sense...Simon

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Thanks, Simon. I have two cameras. Both record in 4k, but I render to 1080p. That allows me to have two different angles, but also gives me the scope to zoom in on either without losing much/any quality, which can make it look like more than two cameras. The second camera is a wee compact Panasonic, but the 4k video is really very good on it given its size. I record sound on both cameras and use it to sync the video. I occasionally use and offboard sound recorder (Zoom) to record as well. I think I'll use that more in the loft as it captures better sound.

@Coloribus2004 4 месяца назад

So do the Diode Voltage Droppers arrive pre-made or do you have to make them yourselves? Also, when you place the black Lima pick up wire to the voltage dropper, do you add the black or red wire from the motor?

@kinkong1961 5 лет назад

great follow on question from my first one, One question i would like to ask could you add a bigger value resistor to drop the voltage further so to give a closer speed to the original one .

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

You probably could. You'd need to get one with a high enough wattage. It may also get hot, so keep it away from the body just in case. I've not tried it myself, but there's nor reason why it wouldn't work in theory at least. Probably best with analogue though. Not sure if/how it might affect a decoder supplying the motor (with back emf etc).

@derekorchard9487 5 лет назад

I have enjoyed this conversion video but noticed that the various CD motors have a large variation in speed from 6000 to 12000 rpm which speed would you recommend ?

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Hi Derek. In my experience, many of the descriptions accompanying the Chinese ones can vary wildly in accuracy and when the chips are down, they are often much of a muchness. I would, however, generally try to go for the lower rpm, because when you factor in the higher voltage being fed to it by the decoder, it's still going to spin fairly fast. Whether the motor will actually be that rpm, is another matter! I've seen absolutely identical motors being sold by different supplies with different rpm rating, sometimes different voltage ratings too. All of the motors are effectively overdriven when used with model locos, but so long as they don't overheat, it's rarely a problem.

@johnkennetharkwright699 5 лет назад

Hi David Your how to video's are fantastic, I know that you have done a 3D holder for the Lima motor but have you found a way to hold the CD into a Hornby ring field motor. would like to hear your view on that. Regards John

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

See my other comment 🙂

@MrSheddy1 5 лет назад

Hi, just come across this while doing the exact same Would you say that using just CV 5 on a decoder is adequate for use on a home layout or is it best to use both CV5 and the diodes? Many thanks

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

Hi. Many thanks for the comment. I'm all honestly, for my own models, if the decoder has CV5 (and the other associated CVs), I tend just to use them. I use the diode dropper with TTS decoders, because they don't have that function, but all my non-sound decoders have CV5 etc., and that does me fine. I would probably use diodes if I was only using the model with dc control, but even then, so long as you're sensible and only feed it as much from the controller as it needs to run at a prototypical speed, it's probably fine (although if you're double heading etc., it's probably wise you use diodes).

@markhudson2684 6 лет назад

Hello just wondering where you sourced the CD motors from that you use?

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

I got it from Amazon. There's a link in the description. There's also a guy who sells them as kits (you get a gear with it too) on ebay.

@tonymoney2275 6 лет назад

Hi just wondering about the soldering of the diodes could there be a problem with heat transfer to the diodes as i was told to hold the leg with pin pliers to stop the heat. I don't know what to say but once more a great informative video cant wait for the next one all the best tony

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Hi Tony. Many thanks for the comment. I've not had a problem soldering smd diodes like this, but you should keep the application of heat to a minimum. There are different schools of thought on using heat sinks. Some folk swear by them, others argue that by drawing away heat, it can actually lead to the iron being held there longer. I also should have said in the video that I turn down the heat a little on my iron when I'm soldering smd components, but of course, not all irons allow you to do that. Watching it again, I would probably aim to keep the iron in place a little less time than I did in the video...but when I'm chatting away, I tend to labour things a little longer than I do when I'm talking to myself rather than the camera. 🙂

@tonymoney2275 6 лет назад

What ever you are doing keep doing it works very well

@FredWilbury 6 лет назад

Hi ....just a dumb question I presume this could be done to similar Hornby motors?......regards Fred ..ps so beautifully explained to modeller but a struggler with electrics...but I do get there😊

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Yes, absolutely. The process is basically the same. The only real difference is the motor size. Some (perhaps all?) Hornby ringfield motors can accept the slightly bigger 12mm thick motors. You could of course probably still use a slimmer one, but I think the 12mm ones are slightly more robust and may (don't quote me) tolerate a little more voltage.

@FredWilbury 6 лет назад

Strathpeffer Junction ..thanks for that just as an aside I run DC ....so hopefully all will go well 👌.... fred

@MrSulzerboy 2 года назад

Ive just swapped my ringfield motor in my lima class 47 for a 6 volt can motor. You mention that there could be a problem with using 12 volts on it, hence the diodes, but I want to change the CV's to set the voltage. Could you recommend any cv settings especially the upper voltage.

@StrathpefferJunction 2 года назад

Hi. I normally start by setting cv5 to half of its top value. Then cv6 to half of cv5's new value. That's often a good starting point. Then tweak them both from there, until you find running characteristics that work for you and your layout.

@MrSulzerboy 2 года назад

I should have said from the start that my layout is a depot layout so speed shouldn't be an issue. Thanks for the advice.

@StrathpefferJunction 2 года назад

You may wish to look at a lower cv5 value then, and then a lower corresponding cv6 value too.

@MrSulzerboy 2 года назад

I'll give it a go thanx.

@HappyHands. 3 года назад

Question. i have a G scale engine that runs so much faster than my other engine that the wheels just spin all the time its running when paired with the older engine. i would like for them to be closer in speed to save wear on the faster engine would this Diode fix work on a simple G scale DC engine?

@StrathpefferJunction 3 года назад

It is possible that it might help, yes. If you can work out the voltage difference between them, you could work out roughly how many diodes might be required. The only thing I'd say is that too many diodes in the circuit and you Stert losing fine, very low speed control, but the rest of the range is fine.

@StrathpefferJunction 3 года назад

Sorry, forgot to say...you also need to make sure that the diodes you use have suitable current ratings. 1 amp diodes are fine for N and OO, and most O. Thru are probably fine for G, but you'd need to double check the current rating of the motor. But 2 or more amp diodes are pretty much the same price anyway, they can just be a big bigger, but for G that'll not be a problem.

@HappyHands. 3 года назад

@@StrathpefferJunction Very helpful thank you. i am hoping 6 amp diodes will be ok

@rajr6383 4 года назад

Hello Can you kindly mention the value or type of diodes used to reduce the speed and can we use resistance also for this purpose. Thanks & Regards Raj from India

@StrathpefferJunction 4 года назад

Any general purpose rectifier diode will work. There's loads of options. You could use a resistor, however I may get pretty hot and it's effect will vary with load/current.

@rajr6383 4 года назад

Thanks for the kind reply. I tried using diodes even couple of then but unfortunately they do not make much difference in reducing the speed/voltage to the motor. Is there any other method ?

@ef7480 6 лет назад

Hi David Did you get any further with your supply of the 3D printed motor pod inserts? Like many others, I'd be interested in ordering one from you for a conversion if you are making a batch. Apologies if inundated with this request. Great channel!!

@StrathpefferJunction 6 лет назад

Hi PJ. I have had quite a few message and emails, but that's absolutely fine as I'm just stoked folk are interested. I dropped someone else a message this morning on this very subject, actually. I've been a bit delayed due to health issues over the summer, but I'm hoping to get some for Lima models out by the end of August. I have a batch complete using one type of plastic, which I think should be fine as it's what I've used for my own conversations, but I'm experimenting with a different plastic which may be a wee bit more robust. If it prints ok, I'll go for that instead. If you want me to drop you an email when they're ready, drop me a line at info@strathpefferjunction.com :)

@ef7480 6 лет назад

Hi David That's brilliant! Whenever you get chance of course. Many thanks for the response!

@longnaughton 5 лет назад

Strathpeffer Junction p

@johnpriestley3714 3 года назад

Is it not possinle to use a zenner voltage testrictive diode

@StrathpefferJunction 3 года назад

You can try that. The issue I had was that the higher forward voltage made very slow speed running (shunting, smooth pulling away etc.) hard to achieve.

@Synthematix 5 лет назад

Be careful with that hot glue, if the motor gets hot it will melt, i use miliput 2 part rock hard solid resin you can get this stuff in black, dont you mean resistors not diodes? i used a 20ohm 1watt resistor, anyway going back to the miliput that stuff will make a mold for the motor if you put grease on the motor shell first its marvelous stuff.

@StrathpefferJunction 5 лет назад

I used high temperature hot glue and just a tiny bit to hold everything in place while the resin set. I've also multiple tests with the motor and my infrared heat camera and it's not yet hit the glass transition temp of the glue. I never thought about miliput for this, but I guess it'd work fine too - it's a really nice product and definitely easier to work with than liquid epoxy. However, I no longer use this method as I use my 3D printer adaptors, which make the whole process much easier and quicker. In terms of resistors vs diodes, I'm not entirely sure which part you're referring to, but I have used diodes to drop voltage for these conversions. I tend only to use them if the decoder doesn't have CV5 functionality. The diodes drop about 0.7 to 1v each. There are pros and cons to them vs a resistor. There is of course forward voltage to consider, but they shed the same volts irrespect of current whereas resistors do not - it perhaps doesn't matter hugely with these sorts of thing, however. Anyway, there are multiple ways to skin a cat and so long as it works, that's the main thing! Many thanks for the comments and your suggestions 🙂

@Synthematix 5 лет назад

Cant remember where, but i bought a lot of 14.2v motors that were a direct replacement for the pancake types years ago, they just swapped over, but yea a lot of ways to do the same job i agree. 3d printers are something i never delved into but gonna have to start as im doing an N gauge 5ft x 2.5ft layout at the moment

@Synthematix 5 лет назад

Just had a look and apparently and someone is now making armature replacements for honby and lima with 5 contact points so they should run as smooth as silk with a lot of torque, so many options lol

@peterforden5917 4 года назад

why does'nt Hornby upgrade to cd motors?

@StrathpefferJunction 4 года назад

There are pros and cons to CD motors. If a ringfield is not running well, then a CD motor is definitely a good option, but a smooth running ringfield is still OK in principle. However, my guess is that as many things with Hornby, it all comes down to cost. They would have to design an entire new bogie, new gearing, new tooling, and that will be a lot more expensive than just churning out an old design from existing tooling in their cheaper railroad-type models.

@peterforden5917 4 года назад

@@StrathpefferJunction I wonder how many wont buy Hornby because of thatout of date motor?

@StrathpefferJunction 4 года назад

@@peterforden5917 Not sure, to be honest. Some people perhaps don't have the money, or they may prefer to buy their younger kids cheaper models, but I think more seriously modellers are more likely to avoid ringfield models these days. I think Hornby's 'cheap' hst released this year has a ringfield, but I'm not sure how well it's sold. I've not seen many about in videos etc.

@peterforden5917 4 года назад

@@StrathpefferJunction Beautiful models with crappy motors USA models crappy models with beautiful motors german models exuisite all round my Märklin 3 rail has never yet needed Gods gerfingerpoking from the sky ulike every Hornby or Lima or further back airfix no idea about Wren couldnt afford them why cant the people who invented both HO and OO get it right?

@StrathpefferJunction 4 года назад

@@peterforden5917 I think UK outline did suffer from some particularly low quality products in comparison to other European countries. Things have changed quality-wise, but I still think you can get better value for money in some other countries (although not all)>.