@@ValdoMorais but since when did winning finals mvp solely be about guarding the other team's best player? I'll give it to u, he defended LeBron. But overall Curry was the better player in that series.
People really be forgetting DRose is the YOUNGEST MVP EVER !! THE YOUNGEST MVP EVER !!! No one has achieved that, not MJ not Lebron not Kobe not nobody !
@@geordiejones5618 and we can mention the fact that D rose played the best team in the league and AI played in the weak ass eat but not saying the 01 bucks weren’t good
@@geordiejones5618 he didn't choke at all, they threw the whole team at him. Keep in mind he was only 22 years old and they had to do that to him already. Not to mention it was a team with prime bron, wade, and bosh.
To be honest, I feel like we're missing a bulls rockets finals Watching Hakeem send luc longley and bill cartwright to the shadow realm in a finals would've been fun
That’s what people don’t get! Lol o don’t wish injury on anyone but as a rocket fan last year I would’ve rather seen curry on the sideline than KD . Curry you can’t do anything when he gets hot . KD 30 is almost inevitable but it doesn’t affect the game like curry . We literally held curry to 0 in the first half and he finishes with 33 and puts us out on our home floor it’s ridiculous
I got scarred senseless everytime curry was on the floor in games 5&6 last year. I thought the raptors wouldn’t be able to stop him. But pascal and kawhi just balled out. Thank god
Hes the most talented player in history and you could make a case that hes not a ton 10 all time player. For me its disappointing when a player underachieves. You can say the same thing about Lebron just I wouldn't say Lebron is lazy just weak mentally.
@@danielclark6912 But LeBron's career isn't over yet and 4 of his finals losses are not even his fault he did as much as his could. 2007 I mean come on now LeBron was no way in hell beating the Spurs with just him, 2015 Love and Kyrie were injured and he performed great, 2017 the warriors had KD and the team had injuries again and LeBron once again played great, 2018 again they had KD and it was just LeBron and he showed out and got swept. He obviously has lost and you can't change that but you can't blame LeBron when in 4 out of his 6 finals losses he was the best player on the court but still lost because his teams were undermanned compared the his opponent
You can still be successful asf and still underachieved, that's how talented that man is. Guy is a freak of nature, 7'1", 300lbs monster that can move that well. If he just had take care of his body, he could have won more rings. Plus he's lazy asf too, that's the main reason why he and Kobe parted ways.
I mean Shaq was the type of dude where if he shot 70% from the line, he’s the greatest player in NBA history. But because he shot around 50 his numbers will forever drag behind Wilt and Russel and Kareem.
I find the beginning funny because there was a post on Facebook about Steve Kerr being the only player to 4 peat and as soon as I go to comment there was a dude already having a argument about MJ and LeBron when it was just about Steve Kerr 🤦🏾♂️
@Josh derp Curry's 5 year stretch from 2014-2019 is one of the most accomplished and illustrious of any player in history and he should have one or even two finals MVPs on top of that
Ricardo Sines as an okc fan i would say no. Okc didn’t show any signs if getting kd help. Kd had amazing slashing ability and they never sorrounded him with shooters. He was usally the only great shooter when he was on offense with okc. And he got tired of him getting no help and being double teamed cause the 2nd best player on the team shoots 32% from the feild
Ricardo Sines kd was injured against rockets yet curry still owned them in 6 games in 2019? If they would’ve beat them in 2018 without kd then y didn’t they win in 2019? And kd blew a 3-1 lead to them so stop🤦♂️
12:05 "Bill Cartwright, Luc Longley, Stacey King, Bernard King, Dr. King, Martin Luther King, no kings was stopping Hakeem." Bruh I love that line! hahaha
In '94, Hakeem won MVP, DPOY, and Finals MVP while posting at least 27-11-4 and 4 blocks in both the regular season and playoffs. Not to mention shooting 52% from the field as well.
I cant believe they brushed off the rockets wins in the last dance probably because it conflicts with the narrative that jordan never lost in the 90s during his prime rockets 2 pistons 1 spurs 1 if the rockets hadn’t won jordan wouldn’t have been able to continue his dominant finals streak from 93, after a hiatus he conveniently got eliminated creating excuses for the gap allowing for a no lose narrative lebron went to the finals 8 years in a row people don’t understand that the playoffs can change the course of the finals and many times upsets happen, lebron willed his team to the finals year after year despite these odds he upset the better team jordan was never asked to do this because he was always the favorite to win its not easy to not be the favorite and you might lose to the favorite i know the goat is always going to mike because he never lost but people like lebron and steve nash never get credit for the way they run the offense and make their team better they only get attention for their shortcomings we shouldn’t be so focused on story and narrative but more on who games better and for me it’s redundant and obvious Kareem Abdul Jabbar is the goat he put the ball through the hoop more than anybody in basketball history the game is about getting buckets and he got the most for the longest time team ball is variable and winning as a team isn’t easy but individually he has succeeded the most
Steph had some big playoff games like NBA finals game 3 2019 when Steph scored 47 points NBA semi finals game 6 2019 Steph scored 0 points in the first half but had 33 in the other half
@SWISHOUT to me it was disappointing. He could of been the goat. To only make 3 all NBA defensive teams for being how dominant he was is wild. He could of lasted longer than he did.
CA Analysis imagine if he had lebrons mentality of staying in shape and taking care of his body he could’ve easily been the goat but top 15 player of all time is still pretty damn good if you ask me
He has 4 rings but could have achieved so much more. Look at Kobe’s career, 5 rings, all the accolades and (bar the injury) you can’t say he didn’t give everything he could to win in his career
My issue isn’t that Nash got an MVP, or two. I think the issue is when you see that Kobe and Shaq each only had one- when compared to Steve’s, it doesn’t add up
Much more a matter of timing and narratives Kobe and Shaq didn't have a good timing Wade won none for example Mvp is much related to team winning record
The years Nash won, Kobe didn't really deserve it with a low seed. Dirk, KG and LeBron all had better claims than Kobe (I think Dirk definitely should've won '06). Also if you say MVP shouldn't be about wins and should be about numbers, well the year Kobe won Chris Paul had better numbers and had great team success too. Shaq and Kobe cancelled each other out. A shame but it is what it is. Kobe didn't deserve more than one all things considered, but I will argue that Nash only really deserved 1 too.
@@shepardice3775 narratives Nash didn't suffer vote fatigue in the back to back thanks to the suns injuries while keeping a very good record And I also guess on some degree there must be some business to it I mean probably it was a good look on the league to boost Nash popularity and fame I think this kind of thought process do really happen and have impact in many NBA stuff
Don't Forget when Tim Duncan won two consecutive and then Garnett in 2003.Both Shaq and Kobe were balling at that time, winning chips, but you can't compete with productiveness of all time great powerforwards.When dude averages 25+ points 10+ rebounds, 5+ assists, 2 blocks, and leads team to great record, it's hard not to call him most valuable player...
In 05 the Argument for Nash over Shaq was Very Clear Both Steve and Shaw had Just Joined new Teams the Difference was the Sun's were Horrible last year and in 05 they won 33 Games more with very few changes besides Nash
Speaking facts this whole video & Lebron also snagged the board after Curry potential game tying 3 then he hit the free throw to make it a 2 possession game 💯
Yeah nobody brings up the shot Steve Kerr hit to save that game 7 Pacers series but anytime someone hits a big shot on LeBron's team then everyone says they saved his career. If Kerr misses that shot then MJ likely has one less ring but nobody ever brings that up. Plus Paxson hit some big shots during their first run as well.
Himura82 the two situations aren’t the same what wasn’t mentioned in this video was lebron committed 3-4 turnovers in the final minutes of game 6 and missed the game tying 3 had ray Allen not hit that shot and they lost that series coming off of that Dallas series in 2011 lebrons legacy would’ve taken a huge hit.
@@dandreclay8821 well lebron also brought them back into the game and he hit the 3 to make it 92-95. He scored 16 points and assisted 6 other points. So he was responsibke for 22/30 pointsb
3 quick points: 1. When it comes to Steph the wins speak for themselves. Without him they they are plus 4 and with him they are plus 14. 2. Chicago vs. Houston is the dream series that the 90's didn't produce and we're all left with the imaginary games could have been. 3. To step away from ball, when you mentioned Floyd I completely get what you're saying. He dominated boxers who destroyed other boxers so by default it looks easy. But when put up against other competition after Floyd those other boxers were head and shoulders above...and Floyd was head and shoulders above them. And that was the 90's Bulls
Floyd avoided Oscar and Manny for years, people dont knock his greatness they mock his tactics, in a sport where it is honorable for champs people who dominate eras to clash few times during their primes.
When you say Floyd is head and shoulders above them, I understand a little. But he is really on par with manny pacquiao as we can see from the fight in pure boxing. The only reason Floyd won is because his boxing style is fully focused on counter attack so He will always win when counting hits. Although Floyd didn't get many powerful and clean hits, it was still a win for him as he will always have more hit than his opponent. No disrespect to him and I consider him the greatest defensive boxer of all time but it gets really boring to watch which might be the reason most boxing fans don't like Floyd in the slightest.
Duncan is the most disrespected player but he the only one on par with mike tho who played 14 and magic would be the coesnus if he played more as he a retired as a back to back mvp
Tim duncan is the only one of these GOAT conversation players to win a championship on his own, without another star 2002-2003 season, parker wasn't an all star yet, i think manu was a rookie, Robinson was a grandpa then, he had no star teammates and still beat the Kobe Shaq lakers in the playoffs best player in the 21st century IMO
Nobody disrespect Duncan he like Kawhi nobody disrespect him. Most disrespected players I see is Lebron, Malone, Rodman, and Curry people don't like change or people who stand out like a sore thumb or a guy who's to shiny
Shaq’s narrative is formed relative to how talented Shaq was, and how great he was expected to be. If you are stacking his resume up against other players, I get your point about not being a disappointment. With that athleticism at his size and an emerging young superstar Kobe, imagine if Shaq tried half as hard as Kobe did. Shaq’s lazy attitude not only cost him of few more dominant years, but completely drove Kobe crazy that the Lakers has to break them up. Imagine that dominant Shaq completely in shape and in a good relationship with Kobe who was coming into his own... It’s a disappointment however you slice it. His talent was too big to only end up with what he did. He literally had the talents to become greater than MJ. He chose not to, which is fine but a disappointment nonetheless.
I'll add one more point : They came off the greatest regular seasons by a team in nba history, and regular season fatigue is a real thing. You can't expect your best player to ball out the whole season and continue the same in the postseason with a significant injury. But still curry showed out, in the conf. Finals and in the NBA finals to a lesser extent.
Joshua D. If that's the case, then cavs and warriors both win with disadvantages. Cavs in 2015 had two injured players. Warriors in 2016 had injured players too. They're equal now and I definitely understood the excuses.
I feel like his injury made people kind of pity him. Yeah he was an exciting and great player but people act like DRose before his injury was the Goat or some shit.
First of all, I agree with what you said in this video. What you failed to point out was the fact that the expansion draft played a significant role in Jordan's era. At that time, the Bulls organization drastically underpaid both Jordan and Pippen, which to me, coupled with the expansion teams, is probably one of the biggest reasons for the success of the the Bulls. Yes, the Bulls were dominant, but I do believe there's something to be said about the amount of expansion teams that entered the NBA during that era.
Yoh SWISHOUT, great video bro. I think with Steph and why people don't believe he shows up in the finals is because like myself - as a casual viewing fan because of the time zone differences between RSA (the Republic of South Africa) and the various time zones across the USA, we usually watch games live starting at around any time from 1:30 am to 3/4 am. Which is difficult to keep up consistently when you have school/university or a job to go to in the morning and just in general as well. So it's much easier to catch playoff games in a series or different series and not see the full body of work of a player because you weren't able to watch games consistently. Either way that shouldn't be an excuse on my end or for anyone else in a similar situation because we have the internet and can catch game highlights and even full game replays now days, so the onus is on us to do more digging instead of taking things easy and just saying what we think based of very little evidence, which is honestly disingenuous and i do apologize for that.
All statements are oppinions here, nobody says shaq career suck people are saying he is the biggest what if, also in 90s we cant talk about records cause of expansion, and draft during that process those records are inflated. He is just going on vague reddit nephews oppinions that are really easy to dispute
When he was talking about Jordan, he showed that he clearly didn't understand the arguments about him having easy competition. We are comparing them to Lebrons competition, which all had at least 2 HOF in them. His finals oppositions were just greater then Jordans.
@@lucashufner8890 read what I said. I never said he DIDN'T play good players, I said he DIDN'T play teams with that much HOF. All of LeBron's finals opposition's had at least two and most of them had at least three.
Tycko HasThat all of Lebrons finals? Lol. 2011 mavs wasn’t some super star team Dirk was old af, The 2020 heat team isn’t crazy either. 2012 finals the team were all babies except KD. Harden wasn’t even an all star yet. I think you are exaggerating lebrons teams he’s played in the finals. Spurs was an even match up with the heat. Only team that really was truly over powered was the KD warriors and the spurs in 2007 against his trash Cavs team. Which I’ll never hold those losses against lebron. Nobody was gonna beat the warriors with KD. I don’t think Jordan played anyone as hard as the KD warriors team, but I think jordan also played against harder teams than the 2011 mavs, 2012 okc, and 2020 heat too.
@@theflipper404 that’s right there is a best explanation that people or should I say bronsexuals should hear but they gon get butthurt for a reason when what you said was fax
Bro this is the best video fact wise I've ever seen talking about this stuff you spoke straight fax and even changed my opinions keep these videos up bro you're a goat
Great video. Nash deserves some love. What most people don’t realize is just how good Nash was those 2 years. He joined a team that won 32 games the year before and Nash being the only addition took the Suns to 62 wins. If that isn’t an MVP performance then the title has no meaning. Go watch Nash during these years. You’ll see why he won those awards. Dead ass.
U got u a new subscriber 💯 especially with either u said about Steph at the end been saying it for yrs it’s refreshing to hear ppl talk basketball and acting know wat their talking about not just repeating sum garbage they hear off tv
Here’s the thing about Shaq he was 300 plus pounds playing bully ball for his entire career how do you thing those knees were by 2007 or his legs he just couldn’t make it all the way yes he was lazy yes he was fat af in phonex Cleveland and Boston but he was the most dominant big man ever in the nba
CZ did you not just hear what he said? Hakeem was playing at the soft spot of the bulls defense, double teams were not Phil Jackson’s thing. They had good defenders and Hakeem would most definitely scare Michael a bit. He’s said that besides him Hakeem is the 2nd best in his mind. Hakeem and his rockets would win over mike, not all the time but they definitely had tools to beat Mike.
As a bulls fan Noah sat 40 games and boozer also got injured and he had just been traded there his first year Noah was underrated as a defender that no one talk about 🙄
Okay, and? That doesn’t make Jordan’s competition any less good. The man knocked out two sixty win teams in the same postseason three separate times for Christ’s sake.
bird played with 4 hof's as did bll russell. dont blame players for having good teammates. thats some fake criticism. also stop with the 4 hof green aint a hof player. jordan go tot play with the best defenders in the league on his team in the 90s. magic played with by far the best center as did kobe.
Brandon Burley 0.4 points - Durant 6 assists - Lebron 0.3 rebounds - Durant 2.7FG% - Lebron 3.23PT% - Durant You see how KD doesn’t run away with any stat like Lebron does while Lebron was a much superior defender
Thank you, people love to change and twist history to the goat argument. LeBron and Jordan are two amazing all-time greats. But when it comes down to it Jordan is the best.
Ppl must of forgot last years finals that game after Klay got hurt Nd Curry was the only scorer that the warriors had goin into that game Nd he still managed to drop 40 plus
and lost, raps let him go off because his 40 would make no difference, there was no point in the game where the warriors were leading, in fact there is no narrative out there that says curry never had big time playoff performance, thats all I ever hear in fact that he comes up big in big moments, so thats new
Agree with all your point except on kyrie and ray. They both saved Lebrons legacy. You brought up Lebrons 3 in game 6 2013 but what about his 2 turnovers with a minute remaining 🤔
I honestly don't think Shaq maximized his window. He put on unnecessary weight, causing him to be more injury prone, and also waited til the season started to get surgery. He coulda been the GOAT, but settled for arugably top 10 all time (which is still amazing).
