Are Version 2 Characters Still Good? | Genshin Impact 

So regarding my Yun Jin evaluation I zeroed in on her attack speed boosting aspect without giving enough credit to her attack damage boost via her ultimate and I should've at least mentioned that part too. But I stand by the opinion that at the present moment she's just outclassed by a number of other damage augmenting supports with better universal application that even within her own niche there are plenty of other choices you would want to pick before you arrive at her. She definitely has potential to return to form if we have other hp/def scaling normal attackers like @yeguang7095 said but compared to where she was when she first came out to where she is now, like I said in the video: instead of enhancing normal attack damage/speed there are supports who can either just boost total damage (not just for one person but for the entire party) or they themselves can bring the damage. Technically speaking Yun Jin is niche, but pragmatically speaking her niche is extremely overrideable. She would need to provide offensive bonuses on the level of Shenhe to make players want to consider fielding her when they can field more damage, as opposed to Shenhe where her cryo enhancement is SO big and all encompassing (covers attacks, skills, bursts, etc.) that there's veritable reason to use her over Bennett/Xingqiu/Kazuha/Yelan/Shogun/etc. in regards to supporting. For teams where you could field Yun Jin such as boosting Yoimiya or Ayato damage, you could replace her with anyone else. Point being she does have a niche but doesn't do it good enough, which is why I consider her benched.

Yun Jin’s primary role is buffing normal attacks, I think you’re mixing her up with Mika. She gets the attack speed buffing at I think around c4 or c6

I would argue that Yun Jin belongs in niche since her Normal Attack bonus damage is comparable to Bennett’s Atk buff. She would be even better if future characters have normal attacks that purely scales of Hp and Def; being a dmg support means she’s always going to get better over time.

Sayu powercreep everyone in exploration tho. She heals, giving anemo resonance, makes crystalflies easier to catch, mining ores, and going from point A to B so much faster all in one package

Yelan is hands down one of the most insane characters to this day. She’s so insanely overpowered

Not a bad tierlist, but I dont agree with your reasoning for Heizou, the existence of better characters doesnt make characters out right bad. Heizou is still very much usable and capable unit.

I can't wait for "Why everyone uses Furina" in a few weeks

Yoimiya should’ve been given the normal attack ability like Itto and “Wriothsley”(idk how to spell it) where you can still complete your attack combo after you dodge

Yin Jin’s main aspect of her kit is normal attack damage buff not normal attack speed that’s just her c6, I believe she should be in niche cus I can see how she would be more relevant as more normal attackers come out

I'd honestly argue that heizou was a bit unfairly placed because he was never meant to support, and yet you compared him to three supports , it's understandable to compare him to wanderer and xiao cuz all three of them are DPS units and if you'd just compared him to them from the start it would make more sense for him to not be the best , but comparing a dps to supports and then saying he was never good cuz he doesn't support as well isn't really fair imo .

Geos being benched is definitely not the most objective take. Itto geo basically matches or outdoes most of the 2.x teams in the damage department and it's not like that level of damage is suddenly not valuable. For something to truly be benched it should just not work anymore, like Diluc's damage output for example. Itto's damage is not outdated by any means he slaps with an iron hand. Does the permafreeze aspect of Ayaka teams really push them that far ahead of Itto teams despite doing comparable damage?

Heizou vs Wanderer/Xiao would've been a better comparison from the beginning because of his role instead of comparing him with Sucrose and Kazuha.

Yunjin is Shenhe for normal attacks. It's a massive flat damage buff of the same type. ASPD is just a secondary effect and C6 locked too. She should be in niche. Also Thoma should be in niche because he does not trigger his shield without spamming normal attacks.

Putting Sara in niche and then putting Gorou in benched just seems a bit contradictory. Geo works almost exclusively of Gorou and Itto relies on him a lot to get the proper support he needs. You mention Sara not being BiS that much anymore for the very thing she's supposed to do in team comps but Gorou gets put in benched despite being very literally the best option for Geo focused teams doesn't make sense. You can argue that because of Itto's damage falling off a bit lately that Gorou doesn't have a place but that's more of an issue of his damage carry being worse than him not being able to do his job. He provides everything his teams need, it isn't him being the weak point. I think he still fills the niche he's suppose to but his carries aren't as good as they use to but still useable.

Saying mono geo is rendered obsolete makes it pretty clear you don't use it, "rendered obsolete" is implying it isnt even usable. i have C2 itto and he pretty much matches most of my teams dps and clears abyss with zero issue 2 years later.

With the predicted release of Navia in 4.3 and a supposed other 5-star geo character, I do hope they'll improve and utilize things like crystallization and stat buffs. With the 4-star HP claymore on banners, I wonder whether or not Navia or a future hydro claymore would be able to use its HP and EM benefits.

Mono Geo is definitely still Okay at least. I play my Itto team every now and then just because I love playing itto and I'm always surprised how easily it clears abyss. Geo doomerism is so prevelant that I forget how strong my mono geo team actually is (it is high invested and really well optimized tho)

Heizou's niche is having the best birthday art.

If I’m being honest having yoimai and thoma in the same category is just crazy

you can always count on vars for bad takes

I will say this again and again, people underestimate the versatility of Ayato, Ayato was never meant to be a hyper-carry, he is best use as the Driver/ main DPS slot for any team archetype that needs hydro, he doesn’t need to change builds around, you build him as the normal DPS with good gear and you can slap him anywhere. In my opinion he should be a higher tier over Yoimiya just for the fact that he is a hydro character.

Of the characters you mention that compete with Heizou, only Sucrose is a 4 star. Heizou outlaces her for anemo damage as a DPS, and is on par with Ningguang for personal damage. The main reason Heizou's release was awkward was because he came so late that most players would have already heavily invested into better non-anemo 5 stars DPS, else a 4 star team that heizou wouldn't have added much to (unlike support Sucrose). Basically Heizou came too late to be useful to long-term players. It's not because he was outpaced by Venti (who was not very effective against Inazuma enemies), Xiao, or Wanderer.

Sayu was almost forgotten it seems. Yun Jin definitely deserves better especially if we're looking at her with constellations, she focuses on normal atk damage increase. She's indispensable for my Yoimiya team and she works on many different teams she's a versatile yet niche unit not benched. Only Yun Jin and Candace directly boost normal attack damage. Definitely downplaying Heizou, he is one of the best elements in the game, with a small em buff and also has decent on field damage to drive teams that require normal attacks. He's a capable and decent unit for what he wants to do even if there's another who is better then him. He's a versatile unit who can be used in many teams even if he's not best, just like how characters like Ayato and Raiden can be used in a lot of teams but isn't best. I think he belongs in ok.

Can’t wait to see Sayu’s value increasing heavily with Furina’s release

Thoma is also used in other teams like Wanderer where he is even better than with Hu Tao. Thoma gives your Bennett energy and Bennett gives Thoma energy. The one advantage that Zhongli might have had with Tenacity set is eliminated because c6 Faruzan is a much better Tenacity user. In addition Zhongli resist shred is not as useful because Faruzan already shreds anemo resist a lot more. So his only purpose is a shield while Thoma provides pyro aura, pyro energy, and charge attack damage at c6. It is very minor but Thoma also lets you swirl pyro in AoE. This matters when you need to break shields.

Zhongli's tenacity set and resistance shred actually overtakes pyro resonance in a Hu Tao team by a significant margin Zhongli's strength imo is that by being geo, you can slot him into any team that needs a shield and he won't interfere with that team's reactions, while additionally providing 20% atk and 20% all res shred

I'm confused as to why you're comparing heizou with sucrose? They don't remotely have the same role at all and the only similarity is that they're anemo catalysts. Sucrose is a swirl crowd control support who's most comparable to kazuha, not heizou, and heizou is a main dps. I would understand if you said heizou isn't good because we have wanderer who's also an anemo main dps catalyst, but no, for some reason you compared him to sucrose? It kind of makes it seem like you don't know what you're talking about.

"if we want, we also have Jean [for Anemo healing]." Even for day one accounts that's not a given. I can't say that it's my situation, but the scattershot nature of going for *anything* that isn't featured means that it's still totally realistic that someone playing from Day 1 could still not have Jean, or Mona or whoever else. You also forgot the "Aloy" tier.

poor aloy was forgotten XD i was expecting her to be put in the "was never good" category but forgetting about her like mihoyo did is hilarious

idk if i agree with Heizou’s portion. I could potentially be convinced of his placement there, but the reasoning being that you can just use Sucrose feels off considering they’re entirely different and their only similarities are Anemo and Catalyst user. Sucrose, while she can do damage, is very much focused on buffing and supporting the reactions of her teammates. Heizou, on the other hand, is much more oriented to dps/skill dps. It doesn’t feel accurate to take Heizou, someone who’s usually meant to have the team built around him, and compare him to someone like Sucrose who’s entire purpose is different I don’t think he belongs in Never Good. Maybe Benched would be better bc Heizou can certainly be a good unit if you build around him like you’re supposed to, as opposed to trying to slot him into other teams as a support

A lot of people are so focused on the tier placements of characters that they don't think about the reasoning behind why Vars puts those characters in those tiers. You are free to disagree with his reasoning, of course (e.g. I think Raiden and Kokomi should have been put in a lower tier), but I can understand where his justification is coming from. Utimately, he values different things from a unit than what I value, and that's okay. And now, a few nitpicky comments (not about the placements specifically, but about the reasoning behind the placements): 1. I agree with Thoma being okay, but I'd like to add that, outside of Burgeon teams, some noteable teams people have used him in are Burnmelt Wrio teams where he can be combined with Nahida to achieve burning for Wrio to melt off of and Wanderer/Xiao teams where he provides Pyro resonance and helps battery Bennett. Thoma isn't often used with Hu Tao, even in her VV Vape teams where you WANT to have off-field pyro for Kazuha/Sucrose to swirl. I think Thoma fits the "niche" category in this sense since these are the only teams where his kit actually offers some utility, and even in these teams, he's not the BiS or anything, but "okay" fits well too. 2. While I do think Ayaka stays in "pretty good", Cryo not synergizing with Dendro isn't the reason Cryo is falling behind. The reason Cryo is falling behind is that abyss lately haven't included freezable content, and Melt is a lot more janky to make viable compared to Vaporize. Mono Cryo is fine, though. In my opinion, she has fallen off a little. 3. I think Yun Jin and Kujou Sara share a more similar powerlevel than Shenhe and Kujou Sara, and while I understand Kujou Sara and Shenhe both fulfill the role of being "niche", it doesn't speak to their individual strengths (or weaknesses) when they're put side by side. And, if you're going to be putting them together in niche, Yun Jin might as well fit there too. I would PERSONALLY place Yun Jin in niche, but I can see an argument for her to be benched (however, that argument for her to benched should apply to Kujou Sara as well). The problem with Yun Jin is that she's a support that needs above average artifact and primogem investment while also having ER issues in any solo geo team. Yun Jin's buffs also run out quickly in anything outside of boss content. Her being Geo isn't useless though: She helps activate Geo resonance when used with Zhongli, typically seen in a Yoimiya team. 4. I agree with Yae Miko's placement, but I don't agree with comparing her to Fischl. Yae Miko currently thrives in Quicken-based teams, with her upsides best seen when playing her as an electro sub-DPS in a Spread team. However, she's most popularly played as an Aggravate driver alongside Fischl (which is why I think it's disingenuous to compare the two when they work wonderfully together). 5. I don't know about putting the Geo characters (Itto and Gorou) in benched. They have definitely fallen off, but they're not "unviable". Maybe a less polarizing word for benched could be used, or just put Itto in "okay" and Gorou in "niche". 6. In my opinion, Ayato's role in a team is more synonymous to Kokomi's role in a team, and if Kokomi can be put in "God Carry" when all she does is be a decent hydro driver in hydro-reaction-based teams, then Ayato should be given the same treatment as Kokomi. However, I won't deny that Kokomi DOES have higher comfort and has more teams where she's significant in compared to Ayato.

The one trait I like about crystallize on YunJin is that it actually works sometimes with Yoimiya, I don't and won't have Zhongli on my account, so occasional shield surprisingly helps as a bonus feature Ofc it's not reliable and never really saves the day, but it's a little ray of sunlight :D //Will probably replace her with Layla once I get her con which buffs normal attacks for that added feeling of ✨ synergy ✨

I love Kuki's redemption story, such a cool character have a powerful place now fills me with joy

One thing I'll add is Ayato is very good at wide aoe hydro application when built as a burst unit. He is much simpler than hydro+anemo (plus role consolidation)and also has the advantage of being Nilou compatible.

As an Ayaya main, I’m sad to agree with you, I wish the “Frozen” aura was there even when they can still move, that alone would make a bunch of Cryo units so much better. Also, a tip for anyone who wants to main her that I wish I knew before I picked her, she can not farm for her own artifacts. The enemies are immune/resistant to Cryo in her domain, so make sure you have some other team/characters that can farm for her. That, or just strongbox all the Shiminawa pieces that we got when we were wanting Emblem pieces (please oh please have mercy on me domain gods)

My only gripe about your approach to this is that its pure combat focused. You even realized that Sayu was prob niche for the fact she is S tier explorer. She might not be the best for combat, but she is really useful for farming and gathering as well as moving. She is so useful for the other half of the games mechanics.

Ayato Mika Thoma is a really good team. The other one can be a dendro or another hydro. There is a dramatic difference between Ayato with atk spd buff vs Ayato with no atk spd buff.

Some fun ideas for geo reactions if crystalise were to be removed: Splash: hydro and geo, applies aoe hydro damage that also staggers Shatter: cryo, just the shatter in the game, but can also be activated by geo application Molten: geo and pyro, damage over time, increasing with increased pyro application, and provides some crystalise shards of geo allignment Static: applies jolt of staggering electro in aoe

I would argue Ayato, because as you said, he fits perfectly in just any possible teams unlike Childe and gain buffs from any support in the game unlike Neuvilette. So if you put Kokomi in highest tier for the reason of being one of the most versatile units in the game, Ayato is the same case, but a little worse. So oblectively at least "pretty good" tier for him. If Sara is in Niche, then Junjin must be also, and as other guys said in comments, her na buff is comparable to Bennet's Q allowing you to put Benny in other party. Finally comparing dps unit Heizou with supports like Kazuha/Sucrose is just kekw

Heizou is a good unit, his issue is that he's competing with broken unit like Kazu and Sucrose

I think you were a bit harsh on sayu. Here's why, she is the only anemo healer that can scale off EM so she is a good user of swirl and on top of that she heals just as good as jeane, so she heals and does alot of dmg at the same time just like kuki (not as broken of course) but she heals infinitely better than her and well yes the exploration aspect is there too (I for one never slotted her out because of the exploration lol).

I have pulled C2 Itto and he is so much fun to play. I don´t have to worry about reactions at all and i really enjoy using him from time to time. However, he is not my "go to" carry, when i need to clear the abyss. I still use Raiden as hyper carry because i don´t really enjoy hyperbloom, i usually only use a Nilou Team if i want to play Dendro.

I agree with your spot for Yae, but for different reasons. Sure the triple electro team exists, but it isn't great unless you are mega invested and you are using it to speedrun since the damage distribution is uniquely good for speed running. The spread team is, yes, one if the better options but if that is all she had I wouldn't think so highly of her. Instead she is best in an on-field role in an aggravate team, where that team is one of the best in the game. Its a quick swap team that takes advantage of the way Fischl's a4 interacts with aggravate consisting of Yae, Fischl, Dendro, and flex. Dendro is either Nahida, DMC, or one of the defensive options, and the flex spot is between Kazuha, Sucrose, Zhongli, and then maybe kuki or a dendro defensive option. Best damage wise is Yae, Fischl, Kazu (sucrose technically provides better damage but Kazuha has better grouping), and Nahida, switch out Kazuha for Zhongli for what is IMO the best version of the team. Thoma outside if burgeon teams is actually really good in Wanderer teams, but in vape teams he is a downgrade to Zhongli. I would argue Shenhe can escape from Niche due to being used in 3 comps, mono Cryo, Freeze, and reverse melt. The other dedicated supports, however, dont have that much variety because all they really do is hypercarry. Itto and gorou deserve a higher placement than that. Mono geo Really hasn't "fallen off" in fact it has similar damage to Yoimiya teams, and i would argue he should be higher than Yoimiya given that His team fills a niche whereas Yoimiya is effectively a worse version of hu tao except for flying enemies. Either way they should be in the same tier. Gorou deserves niche for obvious reasons. Heizhou should not be in never good, he's not intended to compete with Kazuha, hes supposed to be a on-filder for a quick swap team. His teams aren't amazing but you have to think about on-fielders differently from off-fielders, if you had to be the best in your role or don't see play then a TON off on-fielders like Yoimiya Keqing and Tighnari would be in benched or never good. Granted i don't want to put him in the same tier as Yoimiya Thoma or Ayato but that is an issue of the tier list not his issue.

Archons like Raiden Shogun, Zhongli, Nahida, etc. should ideally be timeless which is why it's good that their kits are catered toward support rather than main dps (though, obviously, almost any character can be a main dps depending on their build). There won't be a patch in the game where you can't benefit from teamwide buffs or energy generation or a giga shield + all of the other crazy passives their kits offer. I'm honestly really glad that the archons serve the role that they do, except for my boy Venti who they kinda fumbled with by giving Kazuha and Sucrose more versatile/useful kits.

I would say you should probably add the traveler to each version because each time they get a new form and especially in the beginning of version 3 you'd be looking at very skewed data about dendro characters without mentioning dendro traveler.

Geo would be much better if mihoyo buffed it as a universal shield breaker dealing more damage to all shields(abyss mages, lectors and wooden shields)

If you're not gonna do version 3 anytime soon, what do you think of Tighnari currently? He came out in exactly 3.0 so I'm really curious about what you think of him now in 4.X.

I use thoma since his introduction because he was the only option for my hu tao team (that i pulled on the same banner). The team was hu tao xingqui kazuha and thoma. This team is acutally super solid, especially with c6 thoma to boost hu taos charged attack as well as give her pyro resonance interruption and a solid shield which she refreshes pretty well. I like the double hydro and I use it but this team has a special place in my heart becasue i learned how to use thoma in a good way.

Sayu is also helpful in farming Crystalflies due to her passive.

Yelan and itto are my absolute favorites for different reasons.

Some may not say.. but your way of doing video where pictures of characters pops in or shown, its such smooth transition that makes me wants to watch more

Heizou works so well for quick swap teams. He needs 3 seconds for 100k and because of his low energy cost he can do this easily every rotation

i agree with you about sayu but i have been clearing abyss since forever with her as a healer with vv in one of the teams i just find her easy to build if you have c6 then its easier

Sayu deserves to be in nieche cause without her exploring would be so tiring

Im starting to think that Vars knowingly puts controversial decisions in his videos. He not only have no clue how Heizou or Yun Jin are used, but straight benched whole geo team just because. And its just this video alone.

Tier lists are always a tricky thing. Sayu is actually almost good the issue is that she has no CC at all, even in teams where she could be a good mix of anemo and healer it's better to run Kazuha with another healer and it's not even about the damage it's just because Abyss punishes teams so much if enemies are spread apart and Kazuha fixes that Geo's underrated big time as usual, it has a rough start but at a high level it performs well and comparable to most non top teams The Niche category feels odd, some characters like Venti are legit niche units, works in almost any team as long as the enemies can be grouped, its niche isn't tied to a comp but to a situation. Shenhe is tied to the Cryo element but she's not niche to any given situation, she's just a Cryo support just like Ayaka is a cryo dps, if Ayaka is not niche why would her support be? Sure Shenhe has less team comps than Bennet but Bennet isn't universal either, transformative teams or non ATK scaling teams don't really make use of him. There are very few truly universal supports like Kazuha who you can put on almost any team and he will be a good team option. And no element is "niche, they all work in most situations except vs their natural counters. How is Thoma less niche than Shenhe? They both have a few specific teams that make use of them. The only team tha truly wants Thoma to my knowledge is Burgeon. Yoimiya is at her best vs a single target, the more targets you add more her performance diminishes, isn't that literally a niche too? This ties to Yunjin, her main team is with Yoimiya because she just buffs normals that is her niche normals just as much as elemental buffers have a niche with their elements. Now Kuki's kit is actually not very good at face value it's flawed and for a long time she was at nearly never used tier but hyperbloom gave her a place in a comp with a good consistent performance so she became as good as that comp itself, take her out of hyperbloom and her value goes down a lot, isn't that niche as well? I just think perhaps tier lists have a lot of room to evolve. Not disagreeing with the overall placements based on the way the tier list is set up tho. It's still a good reflection of the amount of investment needed for each unit/comp to perform sufficiently well to clear , the impact they have on their team's performance or the amount of teams they can fit.

it makes me wonder. with navia and chiori in the horizon, it seems that hoyo is not ready to give up on Geo yet, now that dendro is out of the way I think geo is going to be their New focus alongside pyro.

will vars ever do a good tier list...

I look forward to a future review of fontaine characters if that happens. Subbed!

I love the octopath music in the background

So the heizou problem is that he is anemo, so he gets compared to venti, kazu, sucrose... but his personal dmg might be lacking... let's look at his play style, take a 4 star team, Bennett, xinqiu, xiangling, And heizou... his personal dmg in that team dwars the rest of the team, I play that team in abyss for fun sometimes and even screenshared it with a friend who thinks heizou is bad. When you start seeing the consistent 100k hits, realize they are aoe. Tons of swirls everywhere. Energy particles everywhere I think you realize he is actually... on the better side of ok but not good. Too many characters do his job easier, safer, and better. I love heizou but he really suffers from 4 star.

L take. Heizou is not Kazuha or Sucrose, he is more like Alhaitham or Wriothesley. He is a very good unit with double atk arti pieces. His normals do 20k and his skill easily does 500k. You should not build him as an anemo support.

I am so glad to see someone give Kokomi an honest review. I love her design and kit due to me being obsessed with catalysts and healers so she was an easy choice for me, but I've seen so many people trash anyone not using Yelan or Xingqiu

So Raiden is in godtier because She's versatile but Ayato is in OK because he fits into many teams but it's not bis in many? Like by the reasoning given in Raiden's placement, either She's in OK tier as well or Ayato is on godtier lmao

Heizou being extremely fun to use as an on field driver is enough reason to use him

The problem with freeze is that Hoyo has shifted the meta. Like with the rift hounds, making shielders useless, Hoyo has introduced a lot of enemies which cant be frozen …..

Tartaglia wasnt included in the version 1 in his previous video because he will be later included in Version 6 along with the Cryo Tsaritsa so please be patient Childe Lovers.

This was fun, can’t wait for the 3rd!

Nah you are BIG TIME BUGGIN' on Heizou, why does he need to compete with Venti, Kazuha, and Sucrose when he's not even designed to do any of their jobs?! 😂😂 He's more comparable to Xiao and Wanderer since he's clearly an on field DPS just like them. Now I know how much you underestimate Anemo main-DPSs which is still absurdly stupid but still, Heizou IS good. B-tier good, he's a good on-fielder. Nothing you can say can debunk that, ever.

Shinobu being that high feels off like yeah she got buff but outside hyperbloom yeah idk. damn ayato being in okay. is kinda sad but understandable, like he's more of a jack of all trades master of none, he has solid damage not high, and large aoe. compared to the other on field hydros i think he's the best for burgeon since Neuvi doesn't really work well thoma and dehya can somewhat feel worse outside of her in hyperbloom. as for childe since outside of grassional he tends to have uptime issues.

As for Ayato, while i don't have him (yet) I'd be willing to argue he can go up a tier due to how massive his burst is and while he's likely to be slowly creeped up on as is what happens with Gacha's (Neuvillete is already showing that) he can still deal good personal damage while being far more versatile with Neuvillete's passive being team based and as for his comparison to kokomi, XQ and Yelan it may just be because I either would and or do only slot those 3 as sub DPS/Support comparing them to the main DPS slot of Ayato feels...wrong. fun video tho.

yunjin increases the damage too tho 😞

I feel like comparing heizou to sucrose, venti and kazuha isn't a fair comparison, considering they are all anemo supports. Heizou is not that, he is meant to be a dps so yeah idk. Otherwise though i agree with your video! And nice production value😊😁

I believe Ayato should've gone into still pretty good. Despite Childe and Neuvillette have better hydro application and damage output, one aspect of ayato that most people look over is how flexible and huge his AoE is. And his ER need for consistent burst uptime isn't bad (around 140%-150%) w second hydro unit. I just think in terms of huge AoE hydro coverage, Ayato does the job pretty well.

Bro really put Yoimiya in the same category as Thoma 😂

If your a controller player ayato is much smoother to control and honestly i also feel he is more adaptable and useful. I've been loving neauvillette but atm his rotations just feel slow and for most people you likely only have enough characters for one of his good teams While i appreciate finally having a character who isnt ping sensitive (i play at 250 to 280 ping usually) ayato even with his ping issues is still just more fun because i can chuck him in any team and he will be the goat 24/7. Maybe furina will get neauvillette there soon but honestly i just dont like character who are relient on other characters to be fun to play

I will probably never stop using Sayu for exploration, even if I get a character like Yelan or Kirara, the reason being is that her skill is too useful(for me personally). Being able to go around and make up for, say, not having a hydro character to get rid of the fatui agent’s pyro shield, well Sayu can just roll in a puddle of water and then I’m all good. She’s just to valuable to me as, with seven elements now, she helps to make up for what I can’t put on my team, she applies the vv debuff, she heals, and she helps to explore faster(she also lets me go past the Piamon barrier).

Shinobu is awsome when she came out i was not impressed by her kit but now i like her a lot.

because of the way yunjin's normal atk boost works, she could actually be really good on normal atk characters who don't necessarily have high base multipliers but can augment their own damage via a basic dmg% buff (think yoimiya/wanderer/wario but instead of their skill boosting the dmg multipliers of their normal attacks it just gives them an elemental dmg boost) and unfortunately none of the normal atk focused characters have that synergy ironically her buff synergises pretty well with candace's since that one is a bare dmg multiplier so they would feed into each other but neither character is good to begin with

Damn I figured Sayu would be benched since she can be better than Jean sometimes but I suppose that died quickly since she’s not battle balanced, I will argue Shenhe is more OK since she’s much stronger and little more flexible than Sara.

Honestly i would put yunjin one down and ayato one up. Ayato (i dont have him) just can be used like yae miko to cover more area and with nahida in example nilou bloom oor something like that he is a better option.

"Everyone who's been playing the game for a reasonable amount of time has Sucrose" My AR 60 ass missing Sucrose and Fav Codex:

I no joke wanted to find a niche for Sayu only to literally never come up with a team that could fully utilize her talents and not be stupid at the same time... the closest I got was basically budget thundering furry with her, dori, nahida and dehya for overload + burning with constant pyro shred with vv, but even that never really got past the theocrafting phase

You missed Sayu's most important niche: crystalfly farming 😉

When it comes to ayato, he is hands down the best hydro applicator for nilou bloom teams, thanks to his burst.

I don't know why people don't like long video, I love the long format video. You can do alot of things while listening to Vars talking about games, or maybe I'm just old

I suppose raiden hyper was never intended as a thing before c2. And funny enough Sara c6 is approximately the same investment as raiden c2 so it kinda works.

Tier lists are stupid and the meta doesn't matter. I clear abyss with Sayu, I clear it with Dori, I clear it with physical Xinyan. Genshin is too easy to make any sort of fuss over meta. Build your team smart with decent artifacts and you're fine.

mono geo is still fine its always been nieche and it feels the same atleast to me although i understand your reasoning

I mean looking at the order of the list i would say it looks about right, but the names for the tier list really aren't matching it that well. (except for niche i guess, gotta have those in an extra category, understandably)

Hey Vars. Can you do the same kind of video but like, for every charcter in the game? I was watching the video and reflecting about your opinions (I want justice for sayu, she could be on benched at best), when you started the outro. I was like, thats it? Its over? But it was soo good! Without the fact that you just bullied my best girl because of her NAs

pretty good over all, but for me both itto and ayato are at least in pretty good (maybe itto in the "okey") because ayato can be in so many teams and the diference with tartaglia is not as much, and honeslty he does to much damage even if it looks really low (if u want a hydro on field tartaglia is not always worth it and kokomi can't do ayato's job, and yelan in aoe is no that great) and itto... he is kinda misudertood, many people play de 4 geo team but that's not the best geo team, is 3 geo (itto albedo and c6 gorou) with a fischl, bennet, shongun , etc. unlike xiao, c0 itto is a beast on his own.

Ayato should at be in the still pretty good tier imo he doesnt fit well next to thoma and yoimiya. He doesn't lose out in terms of DPS againt childe in national by a huge amount and the same can be said with him in hyperbloom etc swapped with neuv. His versatility makes up for that performance drop since he can work in more teams which is good pull value. Only problem is he doesnt have any good 4star weapon options. I have a well invested yoimiya and ayato, the yoimiya having better overall crit value and ayato outshines her on my account hes a clear tier above.

the only use i have for sayu is when i need to travel the desert in sumeru, she's in a team with razor, Yelan, and venti just for her roll

For the longest time I only had Sucrose and Sayu as my anemo units (Anemo MC is not a unit) and the only other healer on my team that was built was Bennett, so Sayu is mega useful in situations like that. If she's compared to any other anemo units she obviously pales in comparison but I'll always think fondly of her for being indispensable in the early game. I still use her a lot on the overworld where she is S+ tier. Totally agreed on Shinobu, she's definitely in the top 5 four stars. I think I'd put her above Sucrose but just below Fischl.

Sayu is best in slot for exploration. You get your mining, movement, anemo resonance, healer, and butterfly catching in one slot. Abyss though, she is just 4 star Jean. Still useful for enemies that run away a lot, like the Thunder Manifestation but that's all.

i think you still massively underrate yoimiya idk

I absolutely love sucrose and ive been playing the game for a reasonable amount of time yet i dont have her (or heizou). Literally the only other 4 stars im missing are kaveh and freminet bc i didnt pull on their banners. I did pull on sucrose and heizou banners many times and yet they elude me.😢

Hmm, i wonder if Golden Troupe has any play with Heizou... his role (if he has one) is always built around One Punch, and trying to set up nice VV shreds. I think Faruzan and (to an extent) Heizou's problems are they want to support (or be supported by) at least one other Anemo unit, but then you have crappy options for Swirl, which they rely on. Heizou has an okay balance between NA, Skill, and Burst, so DPC seems like a nice fit for him, but it's tricky to get all those pieces moving in unison.

Aight this is what I think from Ur list Underrated- ayaka, ayato, shenhe, Sara, itto, gorou, Yun Jin, heizou, sayu Perfectly rated- Raiden, kokomi, yelan, yae, yoimiya Overrated- shinobu, thoma