Spoilers for Vinland Saga season 1. Enjoy these heartwarming moments between a loving (if slightly abusive) father and his son (who is doing his best to kill him). Best dad since Bondrewd? You be the judge
@@Kroiiz3 thats true, but u gotta admit it does play a role in the sense of character development. writing a character that can genuinely be counted as a bad person but still be loved by the audience without being amazingly goodlooking is no small feat
@@braboferreira wdym needs some research?? Thorfinn was 6 when Thors was killed, and the characters themselves comment on how it's been 11 years since Thorfinn started traveling with Askeladd and the group.
@@zainebhidoussi1498 agreed! Bjorn was my favourite character for a very long time, and eventually ended second only to Askeladd. He's an honest man just living fully aligned with his culture's beliefs - even his end was remarkable!
I personally disagree with both extremes, no he doesnt view him as a son, but he doesnt view him as an enemy or expendable either. I think Thorfinn irritates askeladd, causs he sees himself in him. A once noble and proud soul demented by hatred and war, and perhaps it irritates him more because his father unlike askeladd's, was a respectable man who renounced war and urged his son to do the same. Askeladd is jaded with his own life and the way he lives it, and seeing the son of the man he so respected growing to do the same likely frustrates him, though not enough to use his skills as a warrior. Or perhaps that bit is due to his jaded and cold nature.
Theres multiple times through the show its pretty heavily hinted that askeladd doesnt really want to be the person he is, but just does it because he knows the situation hes in. Like in fight with thors when he glanced at his crew for messing up his convo with thors. clearly wishing theyd show him more respect, even if he was about to kill him. I think askeladd simply couldnt stop thinking about thors, he knows hes a slimy little shit. And hates it. He doesnt blame thorfinn. Doesnt hate him. He knows what he did, he hated doing it, Hes rooting for him. But given the world theyre in, all he can do is carry on with his own life, hoping the kid gets it.
It’s pretty clear to me Thors reminded him of the king in the story his mom told. Askeladd knew he was being like his own father instead and hated himself.
It's funny because even physically Thorfinn doesn't resemble Thors at all... but teen Askeladd looked really similar to Thorfinn. Hell in the manga Thorfinn use Askeladd's tactics to beat an enemy and even his expressions were similar.
Askeladd, beats Thorffin in an unusual tactic to teach him a lesson: See? A couple of years later, Thorffin uses the same trick to beat someone up: I see... Took him a while but he learned.
@@corgigod5482 Thats what the author was going for, thors had more calm and kind eyes which was rare for the time (since everyone wanted to kill and be strong) so thats why that comes up a lot To show how thorfinn grew not exactly like his father, but still having him a base
@Aa You saying this made me realize Askeladd is a much better written version of Itachi. They both start as villains to us before becoming morally grey characters when we learn their motives much later on. They both make their main victim much stronger and teach them valuable life lessons. They’re very talented, intelligent, elegant, and come from elite backgrounds. There’s a lot of key differences too but can definitely get a similar vibe. Even Thorfinn is a better Sasuke lol.
For manga readers Once thorfinn thanked leif and called him his father. I was moved when thors and askeladd were mentioned then too. Thorfinn not only forgave him but also acknowledged askeladd as an important person in his life
@@Triskelion345 well that good too then as long as thorfinn had the time he needed to understand his father's words, its a good thing that he didn't care to even tell about that, even tho I'm aclined to disagree.
Askeladd would be the kind of dad to say "We have food at home", pull up to the driveway anyway, order a black coffee, and like fuckin buy Thorfinn a pet goldfish and eat it in front of him or something. Considerably one of the better father types in modern times, honestly.
In the series, Askeladd admitted that when he looks at a person's face, he knows what type of person they are. This means that when Askeladd met Thorfinn, he probably saw something within him. Someone else in the comments also pointed out how Askeladd looked similar to Thorfinn when he was younger. Maybe this combination of seeing someone in a similar position who even looked like him made him feel even a little empathetic of Thorfinn. Their main difference was that Askeladd killed the person he hated. He snuck into his father's chambers and killed him, though when Thorfinn was in the same situation, he did not. This probably made Askeladd realize that they were similar. Though also that Thorfinn was not completely like him. Askeladd was a warrior his entire life, though since Thorfinn was still young, he could change to be more. During his last moments, he told Thorfinn that he should settle down and explore the world. I think he believed that Thorfinn was meant for more than just war and carnage.
@leetabern1940 true and his naivety make him look like an idiot, even without that duel thing Thorfinn is already stronger than Askeladd. Just go kill Askeladd no one will get mad except Bjorn maybe.
Actually Thorfinn isn't much different but it's his Father's influence that a new purpose in his heart sprouted: The purpose of killing Askeladd in a fair duel that way, he'll be able to honour the ideals of his beloved father who was strong. Thorfinn always took pride and joy in his Father's incredible strength, I think we all can agree in general that we can take pride and joy in our parents' achievements and can respect their ideologies which might differ from our own but understandably so.
I actually liked Askeladd bc despite being a villain he always seemed to have a soft spot for Thorfinn even if he’d never admit it. Edit: Yes Askeladd is a villian. His character opposes Thorfinn, the protagonist, which is what a villian usually does.
@@seekpenance He was. He is a beautifully written character but still a villain. He's a mass murderer (in a anachronistic view) and even at the viking age he would be realistically be considered a villain. He still killed a innocent family begging for mercy, that's a villain.
@@kookykoruc1827 for vikings what He did is just a large scale raid that went a little differntly than normal. We literally see vikings raiding before this point and they never had any mercy
@@kookykoruc1827 That was not a villanous act. He had to decide if either the family died or let everyone else and his dream die. A cold decision?Yes, but its not abnormal. Surviving sometimes requires cold blooded acts. That is not evil is just human, that is why he is a compeling character. (Plus he didn't even know that family. In a life or death situation i bet most people would prefer that a stranger died than someone they knew)
Askeladd absoleutley becomes Thorfinn's adopted father and this is why: - He agrees to spare his life when Thors threw his blade away. - He decides to adopt him after dropping him off on a nearby village. - He uses him to fight his battles, but despite being manipulative, at times he shows concern for him too. - Towards the end he actually cautions him not to act like a fool repeatedly because he worries about him. - At the end, he tells him to stay back, because if he got involved, he'd be helping Askeladd commit Regicide thus protecting him from the consequences. - At the very end, he tells him to stop wasting his time on revenge and persue a life worth living, hes basically telling him to settle down and get married or go explore and venture the world, he doesnt "belong" in this place implying a place of war/hatred which Askeladd is used too and perhaps envies Thorfinn for the fact he still has time to change that path. The evolution of Thorfinn and Askladds relationship to me was brilliant, because when Askeladd is actually dying, for the first time we see Thorfinn actually deny it, saying "Are you going to die, you?" Implying he cant believe this is the end, that its all over, and, more importantly, that hes about to loose a second father figure. He grew attached to him, he didnt want to admit it but even if it started off as being just about revenge, it became more than that, its why he kept saving him. Despite how much he hates Askeladd he wants him to live, he wants him to live on so he can defeat him, fairly in combat, then make him live a life regretting taking Thors from him. When that was stolen from him, and his second father figure was stolen, he tries to kill Canute in despair. I wont spoil what happens in Season 2 for the Anime watchers but from what I have read into the Manga, you'll be surprised and perhaps cry a good few fucking tears at what comes next.
@@ripper7590 Yes, but he grew attached. A father figure is not exactly who you think your father is, its having a man who you can get your base for ideas from The entire ideology of revenge that thorfinn had was made from askeladd brutality, thorfinn hates him but the connection was made so he feels sad for losing askellad for both reasons
@@ripper7590 Later on, the manga confirms he viewed Askeladd as a father figure. He didn't realize it at the time but in retrospect he accepted it. His feelings were complicated for sure
Askeladd was a horrible person but I admire how honest he was about it. No excuses, no shifting the blame!! I still hated him to the bitter end but felt heartbroken on Thorfinn’s behalf.
He was never a good dad, Thors taught Thorfinn more about being a human being than Askeladd did despite spending about twice as much life with him. It's the lessons Thors taught Thorfinn that define who he is going foreward from the end of season 1, not Askeladd. Another way to put it is that Askeladd only ever gave him tools, while Thors gave him humanity.
He wasn't a good "dad" when he died either. He just tried to tell Thorfinn to get over it already but that also showcases that he does not understand how big of a deal it is to actually kill another human being at that point because it's such a routine for him. He gave Thorfinn a bunch of skills in exchange for Thorfinn's soul and integrity and Thorfinn later regrets having done all these terrible things for Askeladd just so he could duel him.
3:38 this is the part where it finally hit me, Askeladd was trying to be a father to Thorfin, ever since the very first time Thorfin challenged him he adviced him to just go home, but the boy just kept following him, this speech and when he tried to make him Canute's personal guard are the two best things he did for Thorfinn, he really wanted to give him something other than teaching him violence.
Askeladd respected thors so much that he didn’t kill thorfinn no matter how much of a pain in the ass he was, he understood his pain and took him in even if thorfinn didn’t want to.
I believe that Askeladd truly did admire Thors after the fight and Bjorn just snapped out of the rage at the wrong time. So in respect for thors he kinda raised Thorfinn even tho I know it was thorfinns decision to follow him around. Askeladd is one of the greatest Anti hero’s in anime history
I've always thought that the words anti hero fit him better than what villain actually, usually behind villains action there's evil, malicious intents but with him such thing doesn't happen, because in a world where war is a constant morals don't have any real value, it was terrifying for all of his victims but that would imply that everyone in a war is villain while we know that the truth is that lots of soldiers fought because they no other choice or didn't know to do anything else
@@carlacaribe Id say he's more of an Anti-villain. That is to say, he's still in that Gray space, but he's more villain than hero. Especially considering he is the overarching antagonist of the prologue.
I love how the writing is so good that I’m crying for a character who considered pillaging and massacre entire villages as “helping ourselves” and “letting off steam”. There’s just something so good about Askeladd despite being a horrible human being and I think its that sense of humanity when he’s dealing with Thorfinn’s bullshit every time he’s being stubborn or asking for a duel.
is the tragedy of askeladd, he share alot of things in common with thorfinn, but unlike thorfinn askeladd did lose his ways and became someone that hate everything and himself because of that, at least in his last moments he became the hero that his mom always wanted and was waiting. the hero that would come and save wales.
the most amazing part on this bond was the lesson askellad trying to teach on thorfin making him realize that if you live by the sword you die by the sword, Askellad last words on Thorfin as he was dying was actually a way to bend his path truly amazing.
When Askeladd was dying u could see that Thorfinn actually grew to care for him. Otherwise if he did truly hate him he would have killed him when Askeladd was telling him to, despite the fact that he wanted to defeat him with pride in a duel. Just like his father, Thors, did.
Can confirm, no, thorfinn understands Askeladd but when he has to use Askeladds tactics later on he shows disgust in himself for needing to resort to "that mans" strategies. So even if he did in some way care, he still 100% hated the man.
No he wanted to kill him in a fair duel that’s the only reason why he didn’t kill him. It wasn’t out of care. But he grew to stop hating Askeladd and be grateful to him later
That’s the beauty in the writing of Vinland saga. By the end of season 1 I thought that thorfin was just mad bc he didn’t get to kill him but it felt almost like he lost his dad again… Askelad basically gave him the tools to become a survivor and a warrior and many times gave him lessons on how to behave and perceive things in a clear way… A twisted pursuit of vengeance.
I love the bond between Askeladd and Thorphinn. I love the fact that the initial hatred and desire for revenge against Askeladd was Thorphinn's reason for living, but without realizing it (unconsciously) Thorphinn has grown fond of Askeladd. I mean Askeladd practically raised Thorphinn, he spent more time with him than Thors, he was like a second father. I hope in the next season Askeladd will be mentioned/remembered sometimes, I miss him....
considering the creative freedom Yukimura had given to WIT studio in this anime adaptation, they surely will **ALSO SPOILERS!!!!** : : : : as as shown when Einar and Thorfinn fight those farmers over their lost wheat fields, he kind of reminds him of what he is fighting for
No, in the first season, he was not fond of him at all the second season it just gives him more perspective, because he’s older and mature but he definitely hated him up until he died
I think it's also unusual that Askeladd told them his story. Even Björn didn't know it. If he didn't care about Thorfinn he wouldn't have told it. Also noteworthy is the fact that it must have been difficult for him given how he loved his mother.
@Ax4 I can't hide the fact that I'm not quite sure what your comment is about. I know that Askeladd hated his father however his mother really loved him which is evident in the series. I could be wrong however in my opinion telling his story Thorfinn may have been difficult for him. He spoke of his mother's suffering at the time which I think was difficult for him though. Askeladd was tough but you could see that Wales and his mother started a lot for him. I don't claim anything else except that telling his and his mother's story was not easy. Forgive my mistakes English is not my native language.
I like how complex their relationship is. It is a father-son relationship but a very twisted one. Askeladd could've killed or got rid of Thorfinn countless times over the years, and he actually saved his life as well. Their duels were never 'to the death' to Askleadd, but were a 'tool'. They are also a great way for Throfinn to learn how to fight, and are in fact common practice in warrior families: fathers or mentors teaching young children how to fight. The care Askeladd has for Throffinn can be seen in his death scene: at first yelling at him to stay away- so he dowsn't get killed, then showing an interest and advice for the boy's future. He knew Thorffin the best. And Thorffinn care about him as well- trying to save him during death scene, feeling of loss that is similar to the way he felt with Thors, obeying dispite the fact he wanted to kill him. They could've ended this whole thing weeks or days into their relationship. But at the same time there was that tension in the air. What Askeladd did it broke Throfinn and it didn't have a good foundation. He certainly didn't take care of him as an actual patent should. And he was a horrible person. But... Bjorn, his mother and Throfinn were the closest people to him. Truly they were.
I don't think Askeladd cared about Thorfinn as a person, but he understood his rage. I think what he wanted for him was to master his rage, which would crystalize his skill as a warrior... And eventually realize living out his trauma is short sighted. Askeladd developed major ambitions, he had purpose. He saw something of himself in Thorfinn and just wanted him to be better. I think he pitied him in the end realizing how much of a kid Thorfinn actually is. I think Thorfinn didn't realize he grew attached to Askeladd because he represented something indomitable and strong. He seemed invincible and that made him respectable
I agree. Askeladd probably does care about Thorfinn to a certain extend, but he definitely does not love him. Throughout the entire show, he only ever does things for his own ambitions and conveniently raised Thorfinn because he was a useful tool. It's like everytime Thorfinn goes off on his own for whatever reasons, Askeladd doesn't really expect him to come back. He only ever says "Oh you're still around here" or "You're still alive" Meaning to say he never had intentions of keeping Thorfinn around. He was just conveniently there and Askeladd saw no reason to kill him.
Askeladd is everything you would want from a character that drives the story, narrative and characters forward. And a fitting end when Askeladd comes full circle.
Yeah, he softened towards Thorfie somewhat after episode 10 / 11, but before that - he found Thorfinn genuinely interesting, but otherwise he sent him into near lethal situations and didn't try to rescue him, fully expecting him to die and not caring.
In manga thorfin used askelad's techniques of angering and then striking the opponent to defeat someone. And he thought i never had thought i would be helped by him and thorfin realized his past immaturity even more
Askeladd is like the father who prepared him for the harsh world, and Thor is the father who prepared him for peace over violence which has saved him in s2 or maybe I’m tripping
That thumbnail already cracked me up but then when I read the description "enjoy these heartwarming moments between a loving (if slightly abusive) father and his son (who is doing his best to kill him)" I actually snort laughed. Love these two.
Askeladd didn’t have to tolerate Thorfinn all those years but I’m sure that he decided to “bear the burden” of his actions in his own shitty awful way. World’s worst replacement dad but somehow still manages to raise Thorfinn?? I guess?? Lol!
He actually taught Thorfinn on how to live his life more than Thors did as it was the most important on that age. Worst or not, Askeladd actually did a good job as an adoptive father.
@@ServiusSilver he didn’t really. Askeladd taught him to survive by using and manipulating him. Thorfinn uses Askeladd’s methods to survive and he takes his advice on keeping his head in a fight. However it was only at the very end that he told thorfinn to move on and live his own life. And even after that it took years of thorfinn being depressed before her could become a true warrior
@@ServiusSilver he did a terrible job as a father figure. Thorfinn was directionless, vacant and suicidal afterwards. He never knew love, affection, or safety during his time with Askeladd. Only death, pain and trauma that would torment him for the rest of his life. He succeeded at ingraining Thorfinn with a sense of resilience and personal responsibility though.
@@kaze.14 Askeladd doesn't make any excuses for himself and neither do I. I get the feeling he wouldn't appreciate it 😉 No I don't think that he did better than most fathers of those times, though I'm sure there's worse than him. The story gives us MANY examples of other characters and how their father figures influenced their lives for better or worse; Leif and Bugeyes, Canute and Ragnar, Halfdan and Gudrid, Ketil and Sverkel, Hild and her father, etc. But at least most of them can at least recall their father figures fondly. Seeing every memory of your father as a cautionary tale doesn't exactly leave room for that lmao.
the greatest element to Askeladd's character was that he was willing to carry the fault of Thors's death when in truth, he was no more than a merc who was paid to kill Thors. Askeladd's ironic mercy was that he'd be willing to be the object of vengeance for the boy, if it meant steering Thorfinn from pursuing vengeance against a more merciless warrior whom Askeladd knew the boy could never win against.
Something people don't understand about the term "father figure" is that the role isn't that of caregiver. There's a reason why nice and caring dads sometimes end up failing their kids anyway, and why some abusive or oddly horrible parents somehow still end up as father figures. The role is not a positive one like people think, nor is it exactly negative. It simply is a character in a person's life, especially male, who teaches that person what it's like to live as a man, while also serving as someone you are constantly seeking approval from. Askeladd might not have been Thorfinn's dad or father, but he definitely held the role of father figure as time went on, being the person who taught (through direct action or as a consequence of his existence) Thorfinn everything he needed to survive in that era as a warrior on the battlefield, while being the person Thorfinn unknowingly seeks approval from, as he is the only character in all of Vinland Saga that never saw Thorfinn as a threat, to him he was always just a screaming thrashing child.
He’s a viking who kills with no remorse, care only for money at first, however loves his late mother and his homeland. And yet he stood like a father figure to Thorfinn despite of vengeance against him for survival and reminds him to become a true warrior like Thors did.
No dad or son moment, he just taught thorfinn to be a better warrior and always laughed and joked about thorfinn because he didn't see him as a threat to him
Going through the 400-odd comments, this is the only one that understands the actual narrative occurring between the 2 characters. You win sir. 🏆 Everyone else is hur dur new daddy killed old daddy, Askeladd is a villain, or shit posting about what they don't know and/or didn't watch XD
If u like the anime, u should read the manga too. Some dialogue/page in manga is different/missing like when thorfinn grab askeladd after got stab by canute, he said to thorfinn "come closer so that i can talk to u".
This makes a surprising amount of sense Askeladd I guess deep down felt really bad that he took Thorfinns dad away and in his own way tried filling the role of father
This boiled every emotions in me. I could cry by watching this. Vinland Saga is a masterpiece and I can rewatch and will never get bored of it. How can an anime be this beautiful? Its like watching a “Life Lesson” but in an anime form
08:12 Askeladd: "Kill me. We're enemies after all, are we not?" To Thorfinn's development and him saying Thorfinn:" I have no enemies." Is fu*king Phenomenal 😮
Actually, I don't think Askeladd considers Thorfinn as a son, BUT I think that Thorfinn do considers him as a dad, and that's why he couldn't let him go all the time, and couldn't run away from him either way...
I feel like askeladd always admired thorfins hate and drive and as he grew started viewing him as a son and successor. And thorfinn unknowingly started to value him too and it only became apparent after his death. Such beautiful characters. Wish askeladd got redemption tho
I think the entire point of askeladd's character is that he could not be redeemed. This was the meaning of the speech right before he died. Askeladd devoted his entire life to vengeance. He did horrible things, among them literally killing thorfinns dad, a living legend. And even though he took thorfinn in and raised him up, it does not erase all of the horrible things he's done. He recognized the potential in thorfinn though, and set him on the path to becoming something far greater. Askeladd wasn't intended to be the villain of the story, he was a foil. Someone that highlights our main characters best and most admirable qualities; and of course their worst as well.
Askellad killed: -His own biological father, Olaf -Canute's father figure, Ragnar -Canute's biological father, Sweyn -Thorfinn's biological father, Thors -And Thorfinn's father figure, himself. God I love Vinland Saga...
Askeladd groomed and manipulated Thorfinn to be his dog a savage who he but needs to dangle one incentive in front of and Thorfinn will sacrifice everything for.
Askeladd knows that he’s worthless, because all he’s good at is deceiving and killing people. That’s what Vikings are. True warriors and kings don’t fight with swords, which is why Askeladd respected Thors and Canute. He could never be a true warrior nor a king while he was alive, but he came pretty close to becoming one when he died. Askeladd chose to free Thorfinn from revenge to help him become like his father, and gave Canute the chance to show the world what a true king is.
