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Bro they only decided to call it given that there was a fire incident and some votes weren’t counted. Otherwise the roys haven’t done anything to change the circumstances of the election
@@aitothechamp7263 exactly, the daughter is so fucking entitled to think that she will get the president she wants because her dad is the CEO of a new organisation.
It’s because no one sees him as a threat. He’s always been an afterthought but has shown the most professional growth in the show. He just might come out on top at the end. I do hope so
@@yashsinha1236 I don’t he will be the one succeeding but I do recognize his character growth and how far away he got. Yesterday was a testament of how good he is. Fantastic character
Romans last words while he was on top to Mencken were "Over the road and into the bar". The ending of the following episode is when he hit rock bottom and decided to go into the road of protesters and get himself hurt by the physical manifestation of his backfired decision. This all led Roman to the conclusion he wasn't meant for any of this and in the finale the final shot of Roman is him sitting alone at the bar. Brilliant stuff
@@KK-pm7ud “Shiv thinks she’s smarter than she is. Roman could actually be good but nowhere near right now” “Kendall, I don’t know, it’s like you put him in a big-kid diaper and he can shit himself whenever he likes. He has all the shots but he doesn’t know when to play them.”
@@Sig509 Yeah that was definitely dead on. What about Greg though? Two episodes left he can still do it. From the bottom to the top? The only one who knows how much a gallon of milk costs. From barfing in a costume at a theme park to executive at a billion dollar company? Maybe Gregs our #1 boy.
When Shiv was criticizing Mencken in S3, I thought they might spin him as a Trump-like figure. But what makes Mencken worse is that he comes accross as an actually _competent_ and _capable_ facist politician. Incredible move by the writers.
@@mattellsworth5153 Trump is a malignant narcissist with an extremely fragile ego who is utterly incapable of grasping anything outside of his own narrow worldview. He is not a fascist, but he enables fascists because they are the ones who lick his boots and give him power. I honestly don't think he has any sound political convictions other than 'worship me or fuck off'.
Greg going from parks to firing high level staff and being the person to report on the projected winner of a presidential race. On top of, being buddies with a potential Waystar buyer. He definitely coming out on top at the end.
I never understood why Logan kept Greg around. Greg's a joke. Logan didn't really like him. The only reason I could come up with was to piss his brother, Ewan, off. And Greg getting any kind of power just to childishly piss off a sibling is a very stupid reason for Greg to keep failing up
@@TheKrazysexykool I think the show subtly hints Logan saw something in him. Remember when he told him he "really likes" him and incited him to stay at Waystar by telling him his grandfather wouldn't disown him and that "in the end, it's up to you, kiddo", or when he gently reminded him he had "a bit of leverage", and invited him to take the time to think about what he wants in exchange of his cooperation with Waystar counsels, while he could have simply and easily bullied him into signing (which Logan knew or couldn't ignore, as he noted Greg was "shaking like a fucking leaf") ? Also, there's the mention in the will. No one knows how Logan was in his young age ; maybe he was a bit like Greg early on, before he went through whatever made him the ruthless, successful CEO he became, and therefore sees a little bit of himself in Greg. In season 4, Greg himself seems to become more and more ruthless, like Logan was, slowly but surely, and is playing his cards well. Greg could surprise you.
Fun fact: Justin Kirk was recovering from COVID while filming Mencken's speech, he'd even lost his voice. He nailed his performance here, the speech was both chillingly eloquent and riddled with dog whistles about his beliefs. "Haggling between cunning men", "welfare kings and queens", "a leader willed into being", "something clean in this polluted land", "proud and pure", and so on.
At first I thought Shiv was overreacting about how bad he was, I thought he would be a Donald Trump type, like says some unbelievable and harmful shit but at the end of the day governs like a standard republican, but that speech sent shivers down my spine it was laying the groundwork for fascism with a modern culture war twist, I can’t wait to see what happens.
@@rv2167let's be real, the nazis were dissapointed in him cause he was pretty tame compared to their expectation. USA is already a cruel and racist system anyway, able to be seen in every ruler
@@rv2167 He was more moderate than some around him and was actually a calming influence on some of the more radical members of his administration. The key difference was in how he positioned himself as an outsider, and how his power base was a cobbled-together mish-mash of various smaller groups within the right. Not to mention his almost medieval style of leadership, in appointing immediate family to important positions. He's a bizarre combination of Andrew Jackson, Chester Arthur and Rodrigo Borgia. Unique in American politics, certainly, but fairly orthodox in his actual governing.
Romans line “we just made a night of good TV” was most chilling to me bc he is so outside of his sense of humanity and empathy. He’s a child with the god-like power of his dads company who doesn’t realize his choice just impacted the lives of 300 million people (and the rest of the world). Not to mention the idea and model of democracy. You can’t even call Roman evil he’s too fucking dumb to be conniving
And shiv is a typical corporate democrat. Cares about her own self interests and then has the nerve to talk about worrying about the future of the country. This is about saving the republic. No it’s about screwing your brothers and your bitter rivalry.
@@mschell8022 yeah except, on a human level, shiv as an individual hides behind “saving the country” or “saving America”, meanwhile she cares a whole hell of a lot more about her own ends and interests. Sure she can say that voting for this man is wrong, but it’s just a cover for her wanting to screw her brothers. Tired of people using the word fascist in America. There may be crooked politicians or even relatively clean politicians who you don’t like, but they are a far cry from an actual fascist. The only fascist behavior that I’ve seen in this modern era comes from extremist groups on the left using fear tactics And some on the far right too.
Well, what do you expect? They are not serious people. The Roys children treating the company as their playground. They think they can become the CEO when none of them has responsibility. They just want the company just because their Daddy had it, their Daddy built it but they don't know how to manage it.
I love how everyone at the chain of command washes their hands off the decision. Rome says nothing will happen, Tom states it's not his call, Greg says he's just following orders and the tech guy just calls someone else to put the add. Tom even complains when other networks begin to point fingers at him in particular.
I quite agree. This is monstrously good writing. The line from Tom, asking to find a "brain" that will reassure people that this has all happened before and everything will be fine, is haunting. I wonder how often news organisations wheel out an "expert" to lull people into complacency.
@@user-tu4zb6ec9y She thinks she can physically threaten Greg as if she was bullying Roman when they were kids. GTFO already, Greg is like 6'7'' and could litterally kick her fat ass to Alabama if push would come to shove.
I think this move could backfire horribly. “The president is elected by the electoral college after a legal fight which is not over at the end of this episode” said Jesse Armstrong in the post-show podcast. Even here they allude to the fact that the legal contest on this could keep going for the next three moths. Imagine the ballots are found, the results are contested and the Roys are left with a flaming, crashing-to-the-ground, monster of a firm that loses all its credibility and stock value over this.
I think you are right but Shiv is such a big hypocrite, she thinks she is a very good person but at the end when it comes to future of the country and her power, she does not hesitate for a moment to choose POWER. She does not understand what people around her want. Her threats to Greg are empty and so comical. Kendall even tries to think about how bad of a parent he is but Shiv is just cannot overcome her own of image of self righteousness. If I was Matsson, I would just betray her and everything gets finalised.
I think this will play out the way it actually played out with Fox and the last election. But instead of alluding to **ump winning they've stated that Menken won which could result in them being screwed once the electoral college is counted. It will be interesting to see them point fingers and tear each other apart over this. Especially since all the kids are powder kegs that are about to blow
I mean the trump presidency was great for the ratings of cable news organizations: fox, CNN, and MSNBC. I'm saying this apolitically. For the show, it's more realistic that ATN stock value skyrockets like Kendall wanted
I think Shiv is done. She's been playing puppetmaster the whole season and now Ken and Rome know. Her influence at waystair is done. Madson is an idiot who's India problem is going to tank him and now the Roy boys have a powerful ally in Mencken. I think Mencken will be a wild card though and turn out to be bad for them all. Who knows maybe he's what the show has been leading up to.
I remember laughing when he said we overestimated as if there’s “ two indias “ and I was like dude that’s straight up fraud when you add another billion to what’s already like 15% of the world population 😂
@@SS-up5sc Exactly. Up until now he was a in a clearly superior position. New tech taking over the old dinosaur. All that being said, after Kendall inflated the Living+ projections they're basically doing the same thing.
Jeremy's acting is so on point here. The nervous excuses and justifications in calling in an election TOO early just so the company can survive. That dead behind the eyes look. The growing feeling of regret and fear in knowing they've just handed power to a dangerous demagogue whose beliefs are already impacting on his own family, all for the sake of spiting his sister. He is flat out one Tony Soprano away from having the worst panic attack.
He wasn’t spiting his sister. Shiv betrayed them to their face, lied and got called out. Rava and their daughter can’t just expect daddy to get them the President they want either. That’s not a measure of how good a father he is
@@aitothechamp7263 I think what I was saying was that Kendall's actions were impulsive knee-jerking. He's been on the fence about whether to endorse Mencken, the only thing stopping him is his concern for how it'll impact his family. But with Shiv's betrayal, rather than wait for the election to be over so he can plot his own revenge, he instead decides to play with fire with the American democracy system, recklessly (as Kendall always does), with horrific consequences for both the company and the nation.
@@aitothechamp7263 What Shiv did or didn't do is irrelevant. And saying his family expects to "get the president they want" from Kendall is really dumb. Waystar and the Roy family weren't neutral observers, they literally played a major role getting Mencken elected through propaganda and lying about the results. They directly chose him as well. Also, a measure of how good of a father he is is obviously his actions regarding his family. An absent father who rarely talks to or sees his kids as well as playing a big role in subverting the country's democratic process and playing an active role in making the country worse for almost everyone isn't being a good father. He's insanely narcissistic.
She could have played that so much smarter. She lost herself any plausible deniability when she faked a phone call. The best lies are ones where there's just enough truth so that people can't distinguish the truth from the lie.
It's also irony that Shiv who was a political consultant somehow is a total moron on her family's company. Everyone tells her many times that she is inexperience on the company but noo... she's delusional, she thinks she's great because she's the CEO's daughter.
i feel like it wasn’t even confident honestly…he knew he just made a very bad move and was trying to justify it out loud but you can still see the regret behind his eyes
@@saulhernnadez9203 business tends to function better in a status quo liberal democracy than under a fascist upheaval. It's just that fascism is viewed as better than a leftist government for business interests.
@@mr_sognr1297Larghetto - Piano, Celesta, Strings from the season two sound track. I can’t check right now, but the track in this video is at the very least a version of that track.
What people don’t realize is this was the last shrivel of humanity Kendall had left. But with him calling it, it’s gone. He wrestled back and forth but he has decided he’s “not a good guy” and “not a good father” but he’s a killer. Full Logan mode at the end of the funeral is my bet.
He is still limping between being a family guy and Logan worthy successor. He is just a pushover being so indecisive, he needs to man up already, pick a side and not change his mind every 15 minutes.
People are so confident making claims like this without even understanding how the show works. The last "last straw" was in episode 4 where everyone claimed Kendall had lost his last shred of humanity and became a 'killer', but now it's this episode? And maybe it'll be in next episode actually next week lmao. And these "final stroke" claims have been made way back since the s2 finale. Maybe try to see the whole picture first before arriving at premature conclusions and pretending that you know something the other people watching the show don't...
@@Joel-ik3sz exactly, it's season 4 and Kendall is still insecure about what kind of man he wants to be. He is undecisive and passive and is going through the motions based on how he feels at the moment. He supports Mencken right after he finds out Shiv played behind his back but after talking to his ex wife and what a future of Mencken as president would represent for the country his kids are growing in, he is unsure it was the right move. Even at the end when he says that they can do business with Mencken, who is he really trying to convince here? Himself by the looks of it and deep down he probably knows he is wrong. I think Mencken is going to stab them in the back and allow the GoJo deal to remove control of ATN from the Roys, as he feels indebted to them right now and doesn't want them breathing down his neck for the next 4 years. It also make more sense politically for him as a libertarian to let the free market speak for itself. As Logan said, his children are not serious people, they just don't see the bigger picture nor have the foresight to be capable leaders.
or a real democracy with a real people's leader besides puppets of corporations! the character is obviously evil but in his criticism of liberal democracy is more than logical
@@judehutchinson8355 the fact that he is a fascist does not mean that he is absolutely wrong! it is the problem of the influence of the rich on politics that leads to the disappointment of voters and they find the answer in a dictator who promises to restore order ! this path is wrong, but it repeats over and over again, which means the problem is real
@@nicholasleclerc1583 Well, this is still a democratically elected president and it would be stupid for him to behave like an outright fascist! He is not a fascist, in fact, rather sympathetic to right-wing ideas
Kendall had a look of post-nut clarity for this entire scene. The "he's a guy we can do business with" sounded like he was justifying his actions to himself more than anything.
I liked how they did their research on elections and had consultants, it’s hard to immerse yourself in a shows election when the results are so utterly batshit but this is entirely realistic and plausible
“We’ll go far” “Over the road and into the bar” Feels like fascist signaling (it was said twice this episode?) - and when you rewatch the other interactions between Mencken and Roman, it becomes clear. Roman’s a rich spoiled billionaire kid who’s at least open and honest about where his class interests lie: in democracy, nobody has more to lose than the rich. Because of the evils of colonialism and the nightmare system that arose from its poisonous soil: most of the oligarchy is white. So fascism is the cleanest and clearest system to maintain the dominance of the rich over us all. Roman is at least transparent about that. I think Shiv represents the mainstream neoliberal Democratic Party: complicit & connected to the system at every turn, but tries to act like they’re different: nothing but empty platitudes, and no real resistance until it’s too late. The “we can do business with him” line from Kendall is just so bone chilling. I think he represents the big business & elite writ large: when push comes to shove, the money and power is what matters - at any cost to us all. So the fascists are fascists. The Democrats act like they’re not complicit but water down any real meaningful changes because they feed from the same trough. When the time came, Waystar had more to gain from a fascist regime so Kendall made the business choice (because corporations are inherently sociopathic). I think this show is brilliant - what a big warning sign for our democracy. This is all just my take but yeah. “Some people just can’t cut a deal Fikret” - the power this tiny cadre of people in these broken sociopathic institutions yield over us is dangerous.
@@laytoable Sometimes, you need a Franco to keep the reds at bay. There are worse fates than a few baton-bruised leftist privileged college rogues who dress in black. But I'll admit, there should be more subtle ways of eliminating the socialist affliction. Infiltrating their little groups and controlling the opposition are great tactics. The introduction of hard drugs within their ranks and create addiction clusters in those groups is another good way to render them useless and untrustworthy to the general public.
Found it so striking how the “old guard” of Frank and co were shown to be mere observers of it all - can do nothing else but watch as the reckless next gen unleashes their carnage with no one longer there to stand in their way!
@@lordofthebuckets2676 i think it’s the idea of who will come after Trump. Someone who is actually well spoken, seemingly educated, young and vindictive enough to actually push the US into a disorderly and somewhat authoritative state. Scary stuff indeed
By far one of the most chilling scenes in the entirety of this show. The "tradition" Mencken comes from will destroy the country, and it was the Roy family who brought him to power. To them, it's just fun and games. It's monopoly money. But Mencken is the rational conclusion to the empire the Roys are trying to run, and everything he'll do is on them.
Mencken's speech is insane. Perfectly captures the powerful rhetoric of fascism. Make everyone feel like they can be awesome at the cost of everyone else. The Roy's have made a grave mistake
If Roman and Kendall were smart, they would listen to that speech very carefully, particularly the part about how Mencken is not “grubby and transactional”, despite all the people who “think that’s how things work.” They’d think about who is more likely to appeal to Mencken as someone he can rely on to be effective, and get things done for him: the Roy brothers, or Matsson, who will undoubtedly be reaching out to Mencken that very evening to make his pitch. Sure, the Roy kids got you through the door, Mr. President, but who do you think can take your media dominance to the next level? It was the whole logic for the original GoJo deal in the first place. If Roman ad Kendall we’re smart, they would have thought about that. But Roman and Kendall are not smart.
Depends sometimes it’s about creating relationships Roman did create a good relationship with him and he immediately called Roman after the speech I mean they got who they wanted gojo is the next step you can’t really predict what happens next episode succession has always been like that this episode Roman did well they got what they wanted
all these comments missing her point, mencken doesn't have to block the gojo deal he doesn't even need them anymore, he won (assuming there's no brooks brothers/supreme court plotline)
This is one of those times where you can see the influence of hip hop. This speech was practically on string beat. Everything from the first moment of "ah well" is so musical and the whole speech is incredibly lyrical and rhythmic.
The speech is an ode to the fascist rhetoric of the mid 20th century. Armstrong (show runner) is a big history buff and the narrative of the speech is almost word for word what hitler said in his early 1930 addresses about his destiny to lead. Rising through the rubble of society’s underbelly to usher in a new time. Great speech no doubt, but dangerous
What does that mean exactly? I interpreted it as smart men that know how to play the insider DC political games subtly influence the government to do what's best for the people/organizations they represent. How is that a dog whistle? Obviously Mencken is full of them, but this didn't strike me as one.
Imagine the reactions of other news companies talking about Tom for calling the election and trying to find everything about him to pull him apart only to have him be made CEO of waystar Royco 72 hours later
Shiv critiquing menkyn is the funniest thing I think. She’s sitting on her high horse like she cares about people and social justice when she truly just wants her bag. Great writing in this show to demonstrate how in politics there is no morals, only greed.
Thats why screenwriting is so hard. That line was just a set-up to what the writers really wanted to say but the actor delivered it so perfectly it became a message in and of itself. In lesser hands it would've just been "ah, well...here we are!" and not nearly as menacing.
what's interesting is that that line isn't even in the script. justin kirk usually tends to follow the script but this was one of the few times he improvised. goes to show how great he portrayed mencken
Whoever wrote Mencken’s speech is a genius “… and I find the responsibility awesome” on one hand… And “… leader emerged from the people, wield almost into being…” And all the rest. Pure articulation and accuracy.
Kendal too, he wanted to see Jimenez win the election, for the good of the country and his own family, yet at the end, he put all of that aside to get a fatal blow in the game against Mattson's Gojo.
Kendall sinking the country into fascism and betraying her daughter for power is EXACTLY what Logan wanted for him, he finally turned into the killer and Kendall hates it lmao
The first section of this scene plays This is Not for Tears, but an extended version I don’t think we’ve heard beginning at :45. Could be a splice from a different composition, I would really like someone’s help here. This has been killing me trying to find this OST!
It's funny how all these fascist on TV shows like Succession or Peaky Blinders are way more believable and subtle vs the actual fascists in real life. The writers obviously put so much work went into this speech, it's on the level of "Tomorrow belongs to me" from Cabaret.
No, Menken has Trump's charisma and demagoguery. But unlike Trump, Menken has a conscious ideology. Trump is just an amoralist who doesn't have any actual ideas or principles. He's much more dangerous than Trump.
Y saber que así es como se han puesto presidentes, ellos protegidos en su burbuja de privilegios mientras todo un pueblo lo padece. Excelente manera de mostrar la perversidad de los Roy.
Absolutely Chilling speech from Mencken which is reflected in the character reactions to what they've just done except Roman who dismisses it as Good TV.The writing is so on point for demagogue/fascist about 'emerging from the people' and 'Cunning men haggle' this is where Succession is at its best and also Justin Kirk deserves some kind of Emmy recognition for this
The show has had so many terrible things slip by without affecting the main cast for a while, but here… I really think they did something so horrible that even they might see some sort of consequences. That like from Shiv “things do happen… Rome” is so foreboding. The person they just helped into power isn’t just some useful idiot they can control. He’s a fascist. Pure and simple. The FBI raid happened in the show to demonstrate that the family isn’t nearly as untouchable as they think they are when it comes to the president. The only check they had on the power of the president was that they could help him win elections. The thing about fascists… they aren’t worried about the next election. Meaning, they have no real power over him.
Damn it, now I want a version of house of cards where he will be the main character! this actor has just incredible charisma and he is great for portraying the nationalist people 's leader
for some reason i was hoping that Connor would become menckens running mate so he could secure his 1% on top of his votes to secure the win and he becomes the VP.
JM already has a running mate by virtue of being the nominee of the Republican Party. That individual is now (apparently) going to be the new Vice-President of the United States.
I love how u can see a moment of humanity in Shiv when she says “things do happen, Rome” Because of her background in politics, I do think she genuinely hated Mencken and knew the harm he would cause. the one time she has a moral backbone she still shot herself in the foot due to her other schemes
This show knew how to do political satire without it feeling heavy-handed or leaving people complaining that it is “too woke.” I think it can be enjoyed by people on any point in the political spectrum.
I LOVE how his speech is subtly racist against multiple races. It is written so well that it plays like it’s not but clearly it is. it’s an incredibly written script for Mencken just wow.
As a non American whose country already has our own toxic political environment - I gotta say it is pretty refreshing to not get affected by a (relatively fake) political climate of a tv show 😅
This is actually holding a mirror to the events in real life. It shows how the Murdochs manipulated the narrative through Fox to endorsing candidates like Trump and Desantis for personal gain and self promoting their network.
