When in NBA history did it become not ok to like whom ever you choose? Fun facts: Who's gona be considered the goat in the next 25 years? wait who was considered the goats before jordan ?
@@3carmichaels Show me where I stated people aren't allowed to be a fan of whatever player they choose. I'm talking about this growing trend of players and fans spewing venom and damn near having a heart attack whenever someone states they feel Jordan is the GOAT. Fans of older players can tell you what made the players they were fans of their GOAT. Fans of current players don't do that. They just make up reasons they believe other players weren't/aren't better. Let's not feign ignorance.
None of these young bucks want to realize Jordan changed the game, the rules, took the game global, and even changed the fashion. And I'm not just talking about the shoes; if not for Jordan, players would still be wearing short-shorts. How has LeBron exactly elevated or changed the game?
6 final titles, 6 finals MVP’s, and two 3peats, then had 38points when he was sick in a finals game and won the game, and they renamed the MVP award The Michael Jordan Award!! MJ the 🐐 no question.
Facts! AND what nobody brings up is the first round was only 5 GAMES BACK THEN!! Very easy to lose in the first round when you had 60+ win teams, the eastern conference was the dominant conference, and your teammates were drunks and crackheads…
If mj fans think his career started in 91, why do we always bring up his 63 point game against Boston, his slam dunk contest, mvp in 1988 and his defensive player of the year award plus his scoring titles. All of that stuff happened in the 80s. LBJ fans are dumb and can only repeat the crap nick wrong and leshannon Sharpe says
@@julianrojas4792 Don't forget how they love to overrate the hell out of Scottie Pippen by making him sound like the 2nd best player in the 90's when he wasn't even anywhere close to that. They also love to downplay all of the All Stars that Bron has played with throughout his career while trying to elevate career bench player Steve Kerr to make it look like he was some sort of superstar in the 90's.
@@highlanderc I remember people saying he was the GOAT after 1993. This still wasn't the general consensus back then as it is now because there were still a good number of fans who had Kareem as the GOAT. 1998 was when his status was solidified.
I agree, but a over emotional brain overwhelms these idiots, I would respect lebron fans more if they would just say... I don't care what the facts represent, lebron is still my goat
@@simonhowell4486 bullshit , his accomplishments are overwhelming , especially on the highest stage, me personally loved his pre championship playing ability better
Sadly..yeah they believe it. Just say it loud enough and long enough and don't allow anyone else to talk...And what you say has to be true! Seems to be their logic.
@@ryanthomas2843 also if anything that is another thing to praise Jordan for…he was patient and endured the rough years while the bulls built pieces around him. He didn’t just jump ship to another team when times were rough.
@@Goldenboy48 WHY HE DIDNT MAX KWAME THEN U LIAR. JORDAN IS NOBODY. PIPPEN BORN TO BE GREAT. JORDAN NEVER WON 1 SINGLE GAME IN LIFE VS BIRD. WILT AND OLAJUWON ARE GOATS I DUNNO WHO JORDAN IS. CAN HE WIN 1 PLAYOFF IN CAREER ??
yet this other channel did this ridiculous puff piece about Lebron's 2007 finals loss where he avg 22 points, on 35% shooting from the field, 67% from the line and had 23 turnovers. lmfao: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-LWrlNcm7DIg.html&lc=UgxI193ZxhGJs1ckdyd4AaABAg.9dKTUvmb4Ke9jYRlBes5vf&ab_channel=NonstopSports
When a player's bad game or a bad series is averaging 30 points then he is on another level that no other NBA player was or ever will be judged and this is a compliment...
I was lucky enough to have an opportunity to watch both of them and I have to say it's not even close. You did a great analysis and I'm very happy there are people like you, doing their homework before they actually say anything. You could also mention the differences in rules, especially hand-checking and the fact that Jordan had to be physically beaten in order to keep him below 30 a game (looking at you, Pistons). So there's no real comparison here, but some people are just doing it for the online exposure. God bless, I'm looking forward to your videos in the future.
The problem for Jordan is that he is not the G.O.A.T. He doesn't have the most championships; he wasn't the most dominate player in history and he couldn't get mediocre teams to the finals. Three other players have done just that. Russell, Chamberlain and LeBron.
@@roww10 He was undoubtedly the best player in the league ever since he stepped on the court (listen to other top players and what they said about him), he carried a mediocre team of Chicago to the 1991 finals, everyone was afraid of him, had 2 tree peats (who did that since Boston long time ago?) and single-handedly raised the league's reputation, allowing everyone else to get incredible amounts of money (listen to what Wilt had to say about that), his finals games are among the most watched etc... Do your homework.
@@urosjovanovic3142 Do my homework? When Jordan retired to play baseball, the team lost 2 more games than the year before. In case you haven't notice Pippen is a HOFer and Jackson is a HOF coach. LeBron had none of that his 1st trip to the finals. If you want to go lets go, I'm your huckleberry. I'm over sixty and have seen them all play. Do my home work , LOL.
@@SweetNWater I saw those games too and I don't know if a lot of calls were favorable against the early 90's Knicks. There were usually no open layups. Oakley, Ewing & the X Man made sure of that.
True...what most people don't remember is MJ saying he tried to emulate Bird and Magic in the fact that if they were having a bad game, still finding a way to win. That's the key. If your shot isn't working, you have to get to the line. Players now just don't seem to get that.
@@jtremaine23 why is that people will try to treat today’s athletes like they are so far removed the past,I can’t believe the amount of disrespect I hear from some of these old heads about todays NBA ,these youngsters are ballin and got crazy skills, I’m 55 and I remember teams having 1 or 2 pure shooters,1 person that was known for attacking the basket but the teams now are full of them and all I hear is what sounds like disdain
Jordan came into the league, and established himself as a superstar immediately. Jordan led the league in total points(2,313) his rookie season. Name the last rookie that led the league in a category. Jordan would also finish 3rd in points per game(28.2), 2nd in free throws made(630), 4th in field goals made(837), 4th in steals per game(2.4), 2nd in PER(25.8), 2nd in win shares (14.0), 2nd in offensive win shares (11.9), 2nd in box plus minus(7.3), 4th in offensive box plus minus(5.8), and 2nd in value over replacement(7.4). In Jordan's second season he injured himself, and was only able to play 18 games. When he came back in the season the Bulls put him on a minutes restriction. While only averaging 25.1 mpg and coming off an injury he averaged 22.7ppg, 2.1 spg, 1.2 bpg. Per 36 minutes that comes out to be 32.6 points, 3.0 steals, 1.7 blocks. To put that into context LeBron's career highs in any seasons for per 36 minutes are 29.3 points, 1.9 steals, 1.1 blocks. Jordan would be swept by the 67-15 Celtics. Who some believe you be the best team in NBA history. But Jordan still left his mark on the series. The Bulls lifted the minutes restriction on Jordan and he exploded for 49 points in the first game, and a NBA record for a playoff game 63 the second game. For the whole series he averaged a NBA record 43.7ppg. Both NBA records still stand today. Bird later said Jordan was God on the court. Jordan in his third season would put up averages of 37.1ppg. 3,041 points (both career highs, and only Wilt has accomplished this before. For context LeBron's career high for a season in points per game is 31.4 and his career high for points in a season is 2,478.) 5.2 rpg 4.6 apg 2.9 spg(2nd in the league) 236 steals(2nd in the league) 1.5 bpg(17th in the league) 125 blocks(16th in the league) Becoming first player with 200 steals and 100 blocks in a season. After Jordan had this historic season the competition committee got together to figure out how to make it harder for Jordan to dominate. They came up with a new rule called illegal offense. The league even came out and admitted it was to stop Jordan from from dominating. Did it work? In the next season Jordan would put up averages of 35.0 ppg 5.5 rpg 5.9 apg 3.2 spg 259 steals (led the league in both and both are career highs. For context LeBron's career highs for a season are 2.2 spg and 177 steals) 1.6 bpg 131 blocks( both career highs. For context LeBron's career highs for a season are 1.1 bpg and 93 blocks.) Also by doing this Jordan becomes the only player to ever have two seasons with 200+ steals and 100+ blocks. Jordan would lead his team to 50 wins and win his first playoff series averaging in that series 45.2 ppg ( most in a five game series) 5.4 rpg 4.8 apg 2.8 spg 1.6 bpg The next season Jordan would put up averages of 32.5 ppg 2633 points 8.0 rpg 652 rebounds 8.0 apg 650 assists 2.9 spg 0.8 bpg Becoming the only player to ever record 2600 points, 650 rebounds, and 650 assists in a season.
And he passes the eye test by his court presence. He was always more involved at both ends of the court, compared to LeFlop. Pippen & Jordan were a tandem, like Malone/Stockton or Bryant & Shaq. They complimented each other & scored easily with triangle offense. In defense situations, they were relentless together! Again, were a tandem. The team practiced hard, so the games were easier then practice. That's higher bb IQ then LeChoke ever had.
You definitely know your ish when it comes to stats but damn, I feel like I just read a statistics magazine. You either need a publisher or are already a stats analyst. Good job period.
I was just thinking that same thing. Not like he’s a 25 yr old screaming about this nonsense. Pretty embarassing. Dude must be getting paid to talk such crap. Only explanation to me. Delusion is another reason. That could be the best case🤣💀
@@Runforestrun exactly so we can argue bron took a shorter time to go into a finals than jordan while he lebron took longer to win a chip..so going to the finals faster dont make you better if jordan had went to the finals that many times I mean jordan would have 12 to 15 chips
@@Runforestrun plus his loss to the MIGHTY Mavs, truly the scariest team in NBA history. Showtime Lakers? Celtics Dynasty? Prime Bulls? Hell nah that Mavs team was a nightmare (aside from Dirk) had a washed up Jason Kidd, the man, the myth, the legend Shawn Marion and the intimidating Jason Terry, lol D Wade, Chris Bosh and Lebron couldn't do shit while all of them being in their prime
A thing that is often overlooked in the 93 series against the knick, Jordan had a wrist injury in his shooting hand which played a role in his slow start in that series
MJ had 16 points, to Pip 13 at half time game 3, vs 93 Knicks. MJ 7 more assists, 4 more rebounds, 2 more steals, 1 more blocked shot, 1 less turnover, only 7 less points.
But the kicker, Pippen scored 16 points in 2nd half, of game bulls lead by 19 points at the halftime mark, & a game the bulls won by 20 points. So without Pippen’s 16 points in 2nd half, bulls still win by 4 points. Game 3, 1993, Knicks vs Bulls. Bulls were trailing 0-2.
The hate MJ gets from older players is absolutely amazing at the same time baffling. You would think as guys that played with and against MJ they’d give him his just due. The jealousy is real man.
MJ is the GOAT! Considering the physicality during the 80's and 90's,he had to be creative to score. He's the one who revolutionize basketball and made NBA popular worldwide and we talking about an era where very few have access to internet.
Magic said Jordan was the best in the league before the start of the 1986/87 season. The footage is on youtube in a video of the preview for that season.
No never said that , he said kobe not the greatest laker !! Said magic is I mean magic was great career got cut short !! But Kobe is the face of the lakers
I absolutely love this channel! By far the best basketball stats channel. On another note, how can anyone take that guy seriously ever again after all that misinformation?
I'm a scottie pippen fan and I know that's BS. Jordan is the Goat and without Jordan to help develop Scottie, Pip would have been out of the league within 5 years
@@private-nobody6667 right.. This is all speculation. Just take the eye factor... Everyone in the world has seen what an impact MJ had on everything around him. MJ made the players around him that way. No one would be talking about Longley, Wellington, Kerr or Pippen today if Jordan hadn't led that gang. Of course, making the right management decisions to make a team better is out of the question. But to claim today that Jordan would have achieved the successes only thanks to his team or Pippen is one of the most wrong things you can claim. Or would you say that Tiger Woods only got his talent because of better golf clubs? Of course it is a team sport, but Jordan was not from this world. Before, during and even after his prime time he was the GOAT! I'm lucky enough to have been able to follow both Eras. And I always followed Lebron because after Jordan there was always this discussion who will be the next MJ.... First Kobe, then Lebron... I always saw Lebron as just a spectacular dunker and point scorer. He has ALWAYS lacked that winning mentality that both MJ and later Kobe had... When it came to the hot phase of a game, both MJ and Kobe were from another world. With Lebron, that never came across. Lebron to me is more comparable to a Malone or Wilkinks or Shawn Kemp.... An animal that can dominate games. MJ carried games and made his team better. No matter if before or during the championship. When it mattered, MJ was there. I mean, if it was all about stats right now, Lebron is already beaten by miles. If you add success and the eye factor, WHY IN GOD'S NAME ARE WE STILL DISCUSSING?
@@Tacheles09Because everyone does not see things as you do, and they are entitled to their opinions, right??? My guy is Wilt; he was beyond words as an athlete, and his talent would translate to today's game; I take points off of MJ because he was not a good guy; the league changed rules to help him win (Jordan Rules, a point Wilt brought to MJ's attention, and he had no rebuttal); if they didn't change the rules, he would not have gotten past the Bad Boys until they got older; MJ came through at the right time; he would not have gotten 6 chips in the '80s during the Magic, Bird, Dr. J, Thomas era; he didn't get one until they retired or were old. I have seen a lot from the old school (I'm an old man), and there were dogs back then, but the one i know for sure would have been a star today is Wilt; he was out of this world as an athlete, and no one could handle him, not even Shaq; i don't know of any basketball player to play over 48 minutes a game (overtime included) for a whole season, and keep in mind they ran more back then than now--faster game; he would simply outrun all big men, yesteryear and today. I respect your opinion, but i do not agree with it, and that's OK; it's all about "what if" speculation.
@@private-nobody6667 Unfortunately, at the age of 41, I have not been able to see Wilt live. Therefore, I do not want to make a final judgment based on a handful of RU-vid recordings. But nevertheless, it strikes me that Wil comes primarily through his size and his wingspan. The rest of the players look more like hobby players in most of the videos, which doesn't mean that their general quality is completely out of the question. But if you compare at least the highlight videos, I would never in my life think that Wilt would dominate in the 90s, let alone today. But that is as you have already said just MY own opinion. And everyone should have his opinion. But I don't see how Wilt should have had a chance against a Prime Shaq. Shaq had everything that Wilt had only with more mass! You realize, I'm a 90s boy! ;) I just can't understand how people who have never seen Jordan play live can claim that Lebron can even begin to hold a candle to him! But then you will certainly think the same about me and Wilt. But hey, I'll just say that Wilt is also above Lebron, so we should both be happy ;)
as if ppg was the only meaningful stat for a chip contender i also think jordans the GOAT but dont diss on pippen like that 😂he was an elite defender and he didnt have as much shots per game as jordan because that wasnt his role, his job was to be a point forward, defending and involving his teammates while MJ's job was to score and also defend but he didn't have to pass the ball as much as Pippen because he was better creating his own shot and scoring overall
While Scottie did lead Jordan in some stats over the years and in the playoffs, it’s so overblown at this point. Jordan oftentimes was only an assist or rebound behind him. People act like Jordan only scored and it’s so annoying.
@@alfonsolopez192 not dissing scottie, but there is some revisionist history regarding how good mikes teammates really were. Wasn't it his job to score when mj retired the first time? Kinda weird how his ppg went up only 3 points. Dude is an alltime defender but i literally have lebronstan buddies telling me he was better than dwade 🙄
This LeBron fan is presenting what’s called a “Straw Man” argument. Nobody has ever said Jordan never had a bad game. And really these bad games (or “duds” as he called him) were just poor shooting performances against historically great defensive teams (Pistons, Knicks). Jordan always played hard and contributed in other ways even on those rare occasions where he had a really bad shooting performance.
Well they actually played defense back in the 80s and 90s, plus he had to overcome actual great teams and players. I seen Mike go 6 for 6 in the finals and in Finals MVPs. The best argument against him being the goat actually came from Wilt cause Wilt accurately said "They changed the rules so I couldn't dominate and they changed the rules so you could". That's actually accurate.
Wilt just being salty, they didn't change one rule in the NBA instead they made unofficial rules to constantly give flagrants to MJ like Pistons and Knicks used that strategy and Pistons only won when MJ had no help but when they got Pippen (arguably not a very great player at first and only developed from 90-91 season otherwise he was barely averaging good stats) they destroyed those teams. Like just compare what teams did to stop Lebron and MJ. For Lebron they made strategies in the finals to force him to shoot more jump shots and make him go left or similar to hack a shaq coz he was not good at shooting FT's. Meanwhile their main strategy to stop MJ was to just constantly foul him and injure him but it still didn't affect his game and he averaged well over 30 during those years
@@aaryasharma4940 Well they made the three second rule and changed the size of the lane after Wilt joined the league so you don't know what you are talking about. "During his career, his dominance precipitated many rules changes. These rules changed included widening the lane, instituting offensive goaltending and revising rules governing inbounding the ball and shooting free throws (Chamberlain would leap with the ball from behind the foul line to deposit the ball in the basket)." The Bad Boy Pistons were mostly retired by the time Jordan took over in the early 90s so I wouldn't say destroyed. He beat a solid Laker Team a solid Portland team and a really good suns team the first three peat. The next one had a good Sonics team and then the two with Utah. they changed the rules to allow more freedom of movement and Jordan did benefit from that. The best strategy against Lebron in the Finals is to be the opposing team as he is 4 out of 10 in those situations. Jordan is 6 out of 6 with 6 MVPs in the finals and would have probably been 8 out of 8 if he didn't almost become a professional baseball player also.
@@blurplebear8573 I mean the rule changes for Wilt were necessary since many of the rules such as goaltending etc were important coz like that small players would never be able to play basketball properly if they weren't very athletic or fast and the free throw rule was important as well coz like you could just dunk on everyone of your free throw but then there would be no point of shooting a free throw and you also have to say that Wilt was having very limited guys of his size and skills other than maybe Bill Russell and one or two more guys there were probably no skilled 7 ft guys so Wilt had it easier playing shorter and less athletic guys than him but Jordan was doing good without any rule changes as well, he just couldn't get past the 1st round in the playoffs otherwise individually each of Jordan's season was just on a different level like Jordan was enlisted as about 6'4 in the olympics so it makes it even crazier that he played in the era dominated by centers and forwards who were much taller than him even Draxler, Magic etc were much bigger than him and he still guarded them and decreased their good stats
@@aaryasharma4940 He actually played against stronger competition because the league was only like 12 teams which meant that on average every player was better than they would have been if there were 30 teams like there are now. There were also plenty of guys who were tall back then also. And no Jordans statistical prowess does not come close to Chamberlains either as the only thing he has him on is scoring average for a career by about a tenth of a point. Chamberlain was a better rebounder a better overall scorer, more durable, etc. etc. And making the illegal defense rule actually really benefited Jordan because the lane could no longer be clogged permanently. Also Jordan was 6'6" and he never guarded Magic as magiic was the PG not the 2 guard. He also played him in the finals when the Lakers were on the down trend which isn't a shot but should be noted. Drexler was 1 inch taller so that is neglible. I'm not saying Jordan was not dominant I am saying that the rules were changed to allow him to do so just like they changed them so Wilt couldn't.
@@blurplebear8573 I mean cmon now MJ literally played in a much more competitive era than Wilt, what top 10-20 big men did Wilt face aside from George Mikan, Bill and Kareem? MJ played against some of the best big men of all time like Hakeem, Pat Ewing, David Robinson and he never let them win a ring until he retired. MJ's height was enlisted as 6'6 in the NBA which at that time was false information because Hakeem was listed as 7 feet but he was about 6'9 to 6'10 bare foot same for MJ he was 6'4 and 3/4 bare foot meanwhile Wilt was 7'0 bare foot and Drexler was 6'7 bare foot so technically Drexler was about 3 inches taller than him so it is a decent difference also MJ as a PG played about 30-40 games and he almost averaged a 30 ppg triple double and I'm damn sure MJ could lock down Magic and stop him even if he was closer and tbh Wilt was not even that dominant coz he never faced a top 5 big man like Shaq, Kareem, Hakeem etc in his prime he just faced Bill and I'm pretty sure Bill destroyed him with numerous blocks and steals. And your logic is incorrect since there were barely any actual players coz about 60-70% of them were just playing basketball as a part time job or did not know how to properly play basketball and just 12 teams let's say each big man per team was about 12 big men and even if we assume like many of them were good players but most of them either came into the league when Wilt was older (from 60s to 70s) or maybe some exceptions. So technically Wilt was VERY dominant in a lesser competitive era meanwhile MJ was dominant in a much more competitive era so both are great in their respective places but if we're talking dominant wise then prolly Wilt is the most dominant but skill wise I don't think Wilt would come up to level of guys like MJ, Lebron etc since he was mostly known for his athleticism and defensive skills (well partly coz he was 7 feet and had great athleticism so blocking must've been fairly easier for Wilt unlike for smaller guys), like why do we always mention Wilt as a dominant player but we never accept that he and 50s era was lacking skill wise and we rather assume Wilt would be able to do everything in today's era when he shot underarm free throws so how can we assume he'd be able to shoot contested shots from mid range or 3?
23 averaged 30ppg against the Pistons during the 40-minute beatdown, 33 ppg against the rough brutal Knicks, Jordan had the highest playoffs ppg of any player in league history at 33 ppg, and scored the most points at 5,987 Nuff said
@@malikanderson9999 yeah coz he played more seasons in the playoffs, who averages more in playoffs? MJ ofc, who has the highest scoring game of playoff history? MJ ofc, who put up the best numbers in a finals and most finals consistently? That's Elgin Baylor but MJ has like just 2 points less than him (almost tying with Elgin Baylor's record) and he averaged 41 POINTS PER GAME IN THE FINALS Lebron's highest is 35.8 way behind MJ (that's the same as MJ's 2nd best). Also Lebron played almost 100 more games than MJ and just scored like 1500 more pts than him that's just an average of 15 ppg for MJ to pass up Lebron even Kareem played around 60 more games than MJ but still scored less points than him while also attempting just the same FG's as Kareem and attempted and scored 600 FG's less than Lebron, as an overall scorer in playoffs anyone will pick MJ over Lebron all day, Lebron just has more points coz of his longevity otherwise it's not even a GOAT debate
@@aaryasharma4940 excuses excuses MJ avg 25 shots PER GAME in the playoffs!!! lebron avgs 20 shots per game in the playoffs "oh but who avgs more per game in the playoffs" why tf wouldn't the guy who takes 5 additional shots per game avg more points ??? Lebron avg 3 less points on 5 less shots do the math lebron is scoring more efficient and he's getting more assist nd rebounds whiles he's at it imagine if lebron only responsibility was to shoot the ball he would avg significantly more points but with all the additional stuff he does compared to MJ he only avg 2 less points on better shooting %
That's what you learn as a father of children. If you want someone to believe your bullshit, make it sound as tough and convincing as possible.... Then the kids will believe you somehow... That's exactly how brainwashing is sold. See Tony Robbins... Tell something convincing enough, and everyone follows you! You can also take Trump as an example... The louder you talk, the more right it seems!!!
One other thing they dont mention about that 93 series against the Knicks. MJ had injured his shooting hand against the cavs in the semifinals that is why his shooting percentage was sporadic
@@tellitlikeitisfresh6541 which lebron tried to imitate fraudulently with the soft cast when he got swept lol....He keeps trying to imitate MJ in so many areas but comes up short, like the eyes closed free throw attempt lolol...Lebron cant even make em consistently with his eyes open and he going to try it with them closed??? The worst thing Lebron and the shill media ever did was try to put him on MJ's level. All it did was thoroughly expose him as a wannabe goat. Great player no doubt and probably top 3-4, but he aint goat. You are seeing what relentless media hype can create. Convincing many in the masses this guy is even on MJ level much less in the convo.
How you gonna just throw out wrong stats that are readily available to literally anyone 😂 being loud doesn’t make you right. This guy is that guy at the barber shop everyone rolls there eyes at when he walks through the door 🤡
Mj in the 80s won rookie of the year, has 3 scoring titles, defensive player of the year, led the league in steals and have a mvp.....done more in the 80s than what James harden, Dame, Embiid, cp3, Devin Booker, Russell Westbrook did in their whole careers
Lebron fans forgetting that he played against the bad boy pistons and the Larry bird Celtics, while he played trash teams in the east for over a decade
Jordan’s story is one of progression, his journey didn’t regress. Every year or every other year or so he kept going further. Eliminated first 3 years, eliminated in the second round 4th year, then eliminated for 2 years in the ECF, then reaches the Finals and won, and then he kept winning.
That brother is on some crazy stuff. MJ was the team in the 80s. He had little help from his teammates. The 90s?🤔. Cmon bro. The times he said Mike “choked”, the Bulls won the championship! What is he talking about??!!😲🙄
As an MJ fan, I can tell you all, THAT WE LOVE HIM MORE, BECAUSE HE LOST FIRST, MJ IS THE APPITTIMY OF WHEN HARDWORK MEETS TALENT, THE SAME AS CR7, GREATNESS ISN'T GIVEN, ITS EARNT.
The fact that his ppg went down and then they started winning has always spoke to me. Had to learn how to trust his team. My dad always told me it’s amazing how much you can accomplish when you’re not worried about who gets the credit.
The ONLY thing I didn't like about this video, is you forgot to add the fact that he dropped those 63 points in the playoffs, AGAINST 5 HOF ON ONE TEAM: Larry Bird's celtics. Please don't forget to emphasize this, because for some reason people overlook this, AND he did all this at age 23 nonetheless. That's gotta be one of the best performances a player could ever have. Most points in a single playoff game against 5 HOF at 23?? That's insane
And that Boston team is largely considered one of the top 5 teams in nba history. For some odd reason Lebron fans try to downplay how great that Celtics team was. And Jordan losing to them was a huge blemish on his career.
@@Runforestrun yeah and I never agree with that "no matter what your stats are if you lose" argument coz it just disrespects so much what the player did just coz he didn't win and actually that goes both ways for Lebron and MJ but Lebron fans just use that argument for Lebron since he played against Spurs and GSW but they never accept it when MJ played Celtics and Pistons and those teams were smacked especially Bad Boys they were probably the most underrated dynasty of the 80s and arguably of all time
I’m so glad you made this video. Spot on. Lebron fans always lie about Jordan’s worst game as well as lie about Lebron’s best game to make it sound and appear in Lebron’s favor. Not even a close comparison. Well done video.
He must have been a lover of team that Jordan crushed back in the days. (I understand that part being a Knicks fan) However I couldn't deny or disrespect the talent and skills of MJ.
@@amdude1015 stat padded is not a terminology used to describe Mike Jordan. It's just not knucklehead. Now if you said he played hero ball and was super efficient and prolific then I would agree. Cause that's what it was. And many many players tried to imitate that for many years unsuccessfully mind you. But nobody trying to play like LeBron. They play like the current best player Steph. Nobody nowhere ever been trying to play like LeBron. Or wear a number 6. Y'all so easy. Y'all better hope Steph don't run another ring. I'm not ever gone let y'all forget it, on every channel for a whole year.
Its funny because 91 is when MJs career started for me and when I seen how good he was and how much I missed from the '80s I seen him as even greater even though he didn't win championships those years shaped him to be the GOAT. What still amazes me is the fact that in all the 6 championship seasons along with the 6 MVPs he only missed 6 regular season games TOTAL.
The only thing I can put LeBron ahead of MJ is being consistently great for a long time, but MJ before his first championship is already considered an all-time great at his position. I don't believe we can say the same about LeBron before he won his. Also, the way he shrunk against Dallas in 2011 is a huge blow to his overall individual legacy. Especially after he went on national television and promised not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4 championships...
So, his longevity is mainly in part of the money he spends towards his body with the advanced medicine and metrics that’s used in today’s game! Give MJ that same technology and medicine and he easily plays 20 plus seasons…which would have made him number 1 in every major statistical category ever! Not to mention that MJ drank alcohol and smoked cigars throughout his whole career and still managed to be considered the G.O.A.T! That longevity stat that people give Bron doesn’t fly with me!
@@mikelowrey__ You're posing a big "what if?" scenario. I don't think MJ ever wanted to play as long as LeBron has. If we add up the season he lost because of a broken foot, the one and 3/4 he missed during his first retirement and the 2 seasons after he retired in '98 there's a legitimate chance he would be the #1 all-time leading scorer, but that's not reality.
@ATL-FALCON-ATL that's consistency on a team level, individually nobody has ever been this good still at Lebron's age. Even Kareem was more like the Lakers 3rd offensive option the last few seasons of his career.
@@NickPR87 it’s not a “what if”! Bron does put millions of dollars in his body for preservation and if he didn’t then he wouldn’t last as long as he has! It’s facts! Mike did what he did smoking and drinking so why couldn’t he do yhe same thing Bron did with his body and last just as long?
@FALCON no lmao he won with the exact same team with the greatest coach of all time arguably lebron went to 9 straight finals with 3 different teams win or lose nobody else will ever do that
A man who averaged 17,5,5 for his career? A guy who couldn't even average at least 20ppg in his finals career carried a guy who averaged basically the same except average the most points in both regular season and the playoffs? Ridiculous.
That's like saying LeBron (26.9 PPG from 2010-14) was carried by Wade (22.2 PPG from 2010-14). However, at least Wade was still in the same area code with LeBron in terms of scoring. MJ (31.4 PPG from 1987-98) was in a completely different state than Pippen (18.0 PPG from 1987-98).
@Jeremy Tucker I also find it hilarious that a guy who didn't make *ANY* All-Rookie team selection somehow balled-out and carried MJ when he couldn't even carry himself. That's also ridiculous.
@@chuckyjamesamartin1968 also let's not forget that without MJ Bulls couldn't even beat the Knicks whom they were destroying with MJ but D Wade was already winning a ring without Lebron in 05 and in 11 finals Lebron was literally behind Chris Bosh in pts like Bosh averaged around 17 to 18 and D Wade was carrying their offense at that time while averaging 27 ppg so Lebron wasn't even 2nd best as a scorer in a finals against the 2nd oldest team to win a ring being carried mostly by Dirk
Let me put some perspective on this. LBJ has played with 6 other top 75 players and none of them were drafted by the team he was on. He didn't guide these teammates to becoming top 75. On the other hand Jordan played with 2. Rodman was picked up late in his career. Pippen drafted and molded into a top 75 player. Jordan didn't require nearly as much help.
@@thesdog7905 still lottery pick mj didn't mold him into anything scottie would have developed faster without mj shooting the air out the ball every game
I've said this time and time again: Not only is Lebron not #1 all time, he's not #2 either. Now it looks like he's going to take over stats-wise because of the length of his career, but greatest ever is about much more than longevity, and it always has been. Lebron is good, maybe even great. But he's not on Jordan's level.
Exactly and most players who have played against both Kobe and Lebron pick Kobe! Lebron being number 2 has been manipulated by the media to keep this fake debate going!
@@CMXR no he's not. Lebron has had so much help throughout his career, it's ridiculous. And he still has a losing record in the Finals. A person has to be delusional to think that somebody who has done all that losing can be on the level with MJ. Lebron really hasn't passed Kobe if we're gonna be all the way honest. At the end of the day, the argument that ya'll have for Lebron is longevity. And that's not enough.
@@TheRealMusic4Life huh? okay? who do you have above him? kobe? the dude that played with SHAQ? THE MOST DOMINANT PLAYER EVER? shaq is literally better than any player bron has played with and got kobe 3 out of his 5 championships keep in mind i dont hate non of these players but to say lebron hasn’t passed kobe is crazy and your absolutely biased and hate lebron i can tell lmao lebron literally beats kobe in every category except for 1 ring at the end of the day the argument yall have for bron is that he had help when literally everyone else in the top 10 has as well.
200 steals and at least 100 blocks in a season has been accomplished four times in NBA history. Scottie Pippen and Hakeem Olajuwon did it once. Michael Jordan did it twice.
Jordan having 22pts 11rebs a game is considered a *dud* performance, man that was what a prime mvp season Lebron would give on his best nights, ...him saying that the Pistons "clamped" Jordan probably never heard Isiah Thomas admitting that they doubled team Jordan the whole game, and that very same Pistons team that beat Jordan would go on to win back-to-back and even sweep Magic and his Lakers team in the Finals....
First off...Jordan is greater than LeBron...with that being said, dropping 22 points can still be a dud if you took 35 shots to score 22. Ultimately, stats can be manipulated. You need to rely on the eye test and what was done when the game is on the line. This is what makes Jordan better than Lebron.
@@jtremaine23 LBJ won playoffs series b4 his trip to the finals in 2007... Let talk about what MJ accomplish b4 Phil, Pippen, Grant joined the Bulls... Other than making the playoffs his 1st 3 seasons with losing record... And getting swept 2x and getting beat by the Pistons... MJ went 1-9 only won 1 game never got out of the 1st round of the playoffs b4 he got help... MJ never made the playoffs with the Wizards... Oh I'll tell U MJ score 63 points against Boston while getting swept in the 1st round of the playoffs... A dunk contest that the league rigged in 1988 in Chicago for MJ because the all-star game took place there... And MJ was their cash cow... Now if MJ did anything else talk about it...
@@gregorylawrence9729 To be honest, who cares if you win some playoff series if you don't win the whole thing. The player takes an L in the end. I could care less about MJ scoring 63 points since they lost the game and the series. Winning comes first. But if you want to keep going, MJ played the Celtics in the playoffs in the 1st round early on and they were better than the 2007 Spurs that swept LeBron so those Celtics would have swept LBJ in the 1st round too. You don't think MJ's 80's Bulls could have beaten the Wizards with and without Arenas in 2006 & 2007? Come on now. And I guess you forgot LBJ missed the playoffs his 1st 2 years. FYI: Pippen and Grant as rookies both averaged 7pts in the regular season and 10pts in the playoffs so how much did they actually contribute?!? And Phil wasn't the coach then.
@@jtremaine23 Pippen & Grant were drafted in 1987... MJ didn't start winning until 1991... We're they rookies then... Bro who do U think U R debating with... I'm the same age as MJ... I remember his whole career going back to his college career... Ppl lie a about MJ college career also he made a good shoot to help win a chip on a loaded team with Worthy, Perkins, MJ... Just like in the NBA after those players left MJ stay 2 more seasons never made it back to the elite 8... Just like in the NBA never won without a grt8 team
Pippen developed into an elite player because of MJ and yeah MJ didn't win championships without Pippen but Scottie didn't win any titles without MJ either
MJ had 16 to Pip 13 at half time game 3, vs 93 Knicks. MJ 7 more assists, 4 more rebounds, 2 more steals, 1 more blocked shot, 1 less turnover, only 7 less points. But the kicker, Pippen scored 16 points in 2nd half, of game bulls lead by 19 points at the halftime mark, & a game the bulls won by 20 points. So without Pippen’s 16 points in 2nd half, bulls still win by 4 points. Game 3, 1993, Knicks vs Bulls. Bulls were trailing 0-2.
The Lebron fan argument is Jordan wasnt perfect so he isn't the GOAT. That in itself is almost proof he is the GOAT because that is the only argument against. Before he figured out to win and became almost perfect, he wasn't perfect.
I would love these LeBron evangelists to go head to head with people who actually will show them real analysis. Often shows are echo chambers... would love to see an actual debate where the measure that these LeBron-GOAT people are using against MJ will be used on LeBron... just to show that LeBron is much much much worse. Pippen carried MJ for 1 game? And they're just 7 points apart versus LeBron being carried for entire series. No one can accuse MJ of being carried for an entire series where he literally is a non-factor.... LeBron on the other hand has been non-factors a couple of times and even was a liability, especially on defense. What will these LeBron evangelists say when faced with those facts? They'd likely try and change the topic, and it'll be great that someone forces them to not change the topic and have them react to reality.
This is by far and away the easiest debate to win! 6-0 in the finals with 6 finals MVPs vs 4-6, 10 scoring titles to 1, 9 all defensive teams to 5, a DPOY, vs 0, 2 dunk championships to LBJ ducking the competition, 0 defeats in international competition (all of them blowouts), to LeBron being called LeBronze after the 04 and 06 debacle, and needing Kobe to bail team USA out! Not even close!
Ouweee you destroyed em with this I forgot how bad bron played in them series lol his turnovers were horrendous but they say he have the highest IQ all time 😂!
@@BULSHYTT turnover the ball over isn’t just dribbling most his turnovers are off his passing 😭& oh ik his iq high but y’all be making seem like it’s on some crazy stuff like pistol Pete, magic etc he up there possibly but all time turnovers nba history say otherwise I’m just being honest
Pippen scored 16 points in 2nd half, of his 29 points, but bulls lead by 19 points at the halftime mark, & a game the bulls won by 20 points. So without Pippen’s 16 points in 2nd half, bulls still win by 4 points. Game 3, 1993, Knicks vs Bulls. Bulls were trailing 0-2. MJ had 16 points at halftime to Pippen 13 points at half time, MJ had much more assists, rebounds, etc. Pippen also got into foul trouble in the 1st quarter. I just watched this game a few days ago and took notes.
@@cyber6sapien yeah coz Magic's best part was his playmaking, MJ did THAT many times and averaged like 41 ppg in NBA finals and is 2nd for most points in playoffs just a tad bit behind Lebron who has played 100 more games than him and still is ahead just by about 1500 points that's just about an average of 15 ppg like even if MJ played one more season averaging just 25 ppg he'd be ahead of Lebron in all time points for playoffs
Dude was acting like he was making the ultimate points against MJ being the Goat when in reality he was destroying his argument for Lebron being the Goat. Pippen taking 4 years to become a legit Allstar proves that MJ made him better. Lebron never did that he had to go build Superteams just to go 4-6 in the finals!
To even buffer this argument man. - Lebron played with more teammates that have been selected to the Allstar game - Lebron played with another top 5 player in the league in Wade - Lebron changed teams regularly leaving the Cavs when he could not carry them anymore and going to Miami to have 3 top 10 players on his team and 1 top 5 then left Miami when Wade was hurt and went back to the cavs to join Kyrie who was a top 15 player and Kevin Love a top 30 player in the league prior to joining the Cavs Then left the Cavs when Kyrie left to go to the Lakers and get a top 5 talent in AD on the team. Where Jordan when they didn't want to keep the good players around him just retired. MJ's advanced stats are better MJ has more accolades The list goes on and on Lebrons list is he has the counting stats. That is it.
So I am 40 now, I grew up a massive Jordan fan, first starting to watch basketball when I was 5 or so. When LeBron came into the league I was so excited for him. I grew up about an hour outside Akron and we used to get his high school games on tv. I was never a team fan just enjoyed watching different players over the years. I thought for sure this kid from Akron was going to live up to and exceed the hype so I followed everything he did to see him surpass the Jordan mantle. He never has. And it is not close. They teased the GOAT debate a decade ago and asked if LeBron could catch him cause we knew Kobe wouldn't by that point. But it is a media narrative. It has never been close. I was a certified LeBron stan until about 2018 when it got out of control and people like Nick Wright spouted their BS every day. Lebron played in the two weakest conferences ever in the 00s and 10s eastern conference. Also the game got easier as LeBron got older making it a lot easier for him to continue getting great numbers. Jordan got older into the slower paced 90s and was still throwing up ungodly numbers. Also Jordan almost drug the lowly wizards to a playoff spot at 38 before getting injured. An old man and a bunch of scrubs. ALso look at Jordan's perfomance against one of the greatest teams ever in the 86 Celtics. Single handedly took a gleague team to ot dropping 63 in the process. LeBron should have been the runaway GOAT and the fact he isn't shows that while he achieved great things and may have exceeded his hype coming into the league he is still probably the most overrated player of all time. Everyone has him at either 1 or 2 and he is actually probably 4 or 5 all time. He needed an ungodly amount of help from multiple all star/all-nba talent to achieve anything. Jordan had Pippen yes which is not a bad Number 2, his first 3 peat he had Grant and good role players, and second he had Rodman, Harper and Kukoc and they broke the damn league. Steph Curry achieved as much if not more than LeBron has and revolutionized the game not seen since Jordan did it. Everyone says Jordan never beat good times like Showtime Lakers or Bird Celtics, or Dr. J/Moses 76ers. He beat the Pistons after they dethroned the first two and they were s top 2 team in the league when they lost. They were in line for a 3peat they would have completed if not for the Bulls. And yeah the Bulls were the juggernaut of the 90s not the team that had to beat the Juggernaut. How many people did he keep from getting rings through the 90s. meanwhile everybody be eating while LeBron was the best player in the NBA.
Some players/ former players are Jealous as f#ck of MJ'S career, also any notice how its players that got ABSOLUTELY torched by MJ that come out with this shit, that's why they keep trying to put LBJ above MJ, because if they do that, it stops the highlight reels MJ put them on .🤣🤣🤣
I think at the end of the day, we all forget it's a team sport. Yes, Pippen held it down for Mike. But when they collaborated they made the best 1,2 punch the league ever seen. Jordan made all defense teams and so did Pip. All NBA teams all that shit. And both never won anything without each other.
Pippen had a 3peat team, Hakeem and Barkley plus a stacked Portland team without Jordan. Jordan played on provety franchises without Pippen, and Pippen took yrs to developed into a great player under Jordan. Context
Michael Jordan is the only player in NBA history to win a championship with one teammate putting up double digits- Pippen with 18 ppg .420 from the field. Next best was Kukoc with 8 ppg. Meanwhile, lebron has teammates averaging nearly 30 to win. Get out of here, people who act like Jordan didn’t carry the Bulls. He absolutely carried them, and if not for the Bulls shooting .200 aside from Mike in 90’ against Detroit, Pippen even worse, Jordan wins yet another ring. Of course no one wants to talk about that.
Using the Bad Boys as an example of shutting anyone down is the stupidest thing ever... They beat the hell out of MJ, that was closer to the NFL than modern day basketball... and Jordan still managed to end their dynasty the next year.
The most damaging thing against Bron’s GOAT argument is that ‘11 loss to the Mavs…everyone on the Heat was pulling their weight, except Bron…had they won the Finals that year, that could’ve been the start to a possible 3 peat, seeing as they beat KD, Russ, Harden OKC team and followed it up with Duncan, Parker and Ginobili Spurs team. Beating all those guys in succession along with Dirk would’ve had this debate a lot closer. MJ is still #1 but Brons argument would’ve had credible teeth.
In the 9 seasons Jordan played WITHOUT Pippen, he NEVER won a title, IN FACT, he NEVER EVEN advanced to the second round. and he was 1-9 in the post-season. Whereas Pippen almost won championships without Jordan, and especially he carried a handicapped Bulls team in 94'.
