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”But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.“ John 1:12-13 Born not of blood, nor flesh nor the will of man, but of God 🙌🏼 it’s is thru His grace. Amen
Hello, are there any churches in Las Vegas that share the same point of view as Apologia? I have recently been saved and I’m struggling to find some direction. I truly respect and appreciate the work that Pastor Durbin and Dr. White have done in terms of their debates and sermons and explaining the Gospel as it has helped me understand and accept the Reformed position. If there are any recommendations for a church that shares the same beliefs I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you for all that you do Apologia, your organization is doing miracles and is truly a blessing from God! Thank you and may God bless you all.
Have you tried the founders ministries church search? That would be a good place to start. Or you can simply do a google search for Reformed Baptist Churches in your area. Good luck, I hope you find a good church to get connected with!
I wish I could find one out here in New Hampshire as well. Wish they had a listing of solid churches and pastors we could log onto👍. Oh, WELCOME TO THE FAMILY! 🤗😉
Hey guys, you have mentioned Leighton Flowers in several of the videos in this series... or maybe all of them? I can't remember. But, why don't you offer to have him on your show for a discussion about these things? I know he'd love to come on or to have you on his show.
John 6:37 [37] “All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.”John 6:44 [44] “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.” John 6:45 [45] “It is written in the Prophets, ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me-“John 6:65 [65] And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” ❤️
Adding to babies lives being saved*** it is happening in Va too! Babies are being born at this time that were headed to the mill just a few months ago! Praise God!!! And for all the live's He is saving! This study of docturines of grace has been helpful. I dont struggle believing it, but God keeps grounding me in my belief in His work of salvation. Zac's bringing the genisis account of creation into Gods salvistic work--eye opening. Thanks all you guys for sharing with us where God has taught you about His great gift of salvation!
The Father picks you, Yeshua woes you, shows you what true love is, through the Holy Spirit, now you know what true love is and you have no excuse, no desire to resist Him. 🙏
Glad to hear you’re coming to Georgia! We are praying for you! If we can help in anyway please let me know. We love about 45 minutes from Savannah and we’d love to help anyway we can!
I've said this for a long time, and I think it makes sense: We evangelize because we do not know who the elect are. God does, and He may be using me to be the instrument by which He changes their heart and grants them repentance.
That makes God a monster, choosing to let people burn in hell for an eternity when he could of saved them, that's worse than a life guard who sits on his chair and lets certain people drown.
@@benjy288that analogy is contrary to the bibles description of the unregenerate man. It's more like a man having people who hate him break into his home, kill his son, and burn the house down on top of themselves, then he chooses to pull some of them from the flames of their own doing and not others.
@@hookoffthejab1 No its not, because calvanists believe God chooses who to save and who not to save, which is exactly like a lifeguard choosing who to save and who not to save.
@@benjy288 "none is righteous, no not one. No one understands, no one seeks after God; all have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good not even one. Their throat is an open grave; they use their tongues to deceive. The venom of asps is under their lips. Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness. Their feet are swift to shed blood; in their paths are ruin and misery and the way of peace they have not known. There is no fear of God before their eyes." Romans 3:10-18 Does this sound like poor innocent people who are drowning but the mean lifeguard won't save them? Of course not. The natural man hates God, and God is under no obligation to save them.
@@hookoffthejab1 I never said they were innocent, no one is innocent, but the lifeguard still chooses to save some and let others drown, that's not a good lifeguard, I'm pretty sure he would at least be fired, possible even convicted of a crime, but calvanists think its fine when God does it, despite God saying he wishes that no one should perish.
All i know is if was totally up to me to say "yes", i wouldn't do it because i couldn't do it if it was by the exersise of my "free will" to do it...a dead man can't exersize "free will" ..." Therefore Christ"...
Yes, I agree. Having been a false convert I know that my salvation is all in God's hands bc I couldn't of ever changed myself from inside out, I was going on sinning bc that was my nature, even though I did the alter call, I felt the feelings, I thought I was saved bc I did what I thought I had to do but I was still dead in my sin, my heart needed revival, my mind needed renewing, but I was blind, my heart was stone. Praise God for making me born again!!
@@TKK0812 The text says to consider yourself dead to sin. There is still remaining corruption within us as Romans 7 indicates. That doesn't disprove our understanding of dead nor does the misuse of the prodigal son parable. I figured I would say that before you pulled a Flowers on me lol
@@TwitchyTheologian *The text says to consider yourself dead to sin* I assume you are trying to rest your argument on the word "consider"? Few problems with this: 1. The verse goes on to say "but alive to God in Christ Jesus". Are regenerated believers indwelled by the Holy Spirit to simply "consider" themselves alive to God in Christ? 2. Romans 6:18 Paul says, without using the word "consider", that we are slaves to righteousness. 3. The word for consider is "logizomai" and it means to reason to a logical conclusion. Paul didn't speak English, so he's not saying "Just pretend like you're dead to sin. Just consider you are, even though you are not". Romans 3:28 / For we maintain (logizometha) that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. Should we just kind of consider we are justified by faith apart from works, or are we actually?
I love these podcasts. Been a listener for a pretty long time..and I so enjoy the way you all discuss these topics in a direct and honest way using the Bible as the ultimate authority. The thing that astounds me (as all of you alluded to as well) is just how crystal clear it is in the Bible…the basic concept of “God initiates …we cannot start anything”. We are spiritually dead to begin with…and dead people can do …nothing. lol. MacArthur has an excellent message on this exact topic too. But I guess as believers it’s just so blatantly obvious that it seems silly. To the spiritually confused (to put it nicely) it seems like it must be a prideful thing or something? They just can’t stand the thought of having no part in starting it…have to get some credit. Sorry ..nope. lol. We don’t seek God. God seeks us. And he will save those whom he has chosen from before universe was even created. I love this topic so much because it just blows my mind to think about the enormous power and sovereignty of our God. God bless this ministry. Keep it up! :)
He who calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved. Romans 10: 9,11 Monogizm and senergizm man made terms..Christ draws all men to Himself when He was lifted on the cross John 12:32, our own freewill to choose Him has invited the Holy Spirit to make us a new creation, by grace you have been saved through faith not by works that any man should boast, it is the gift of God, you receive the gift because of your repentance. Acts 2:38 God does not force this "gift" on you, you receive it with gladness. The "free" gift came to ALL men, Romans 5:18...you can reisist, reject or you can receive God is not going to force Himself on you..
Absolutely EVERY critique of so called ‘Calvinism’ on RU-vid is actually a critique of a caricature of Calvinism…to a person, not a single critic has the least bit of understanding of Calvinistic aka Biblical doctrine…
@@andrewbrowne5557 " not a single critic has the least bit of understanding" ==> only as decreed before the foundation of the world. You are criticising God. "Absolutely EVERY critique" ===> checkout BeyondtheFundamentals
Calvinists are good as long as they stick to the Nicene Creed, which they do. No salvation drama here. Speaking as a former Calvinist, now a Classical Arminian.
I come from a strong fundamental Baptist background and I believe one of the bigger factors that keeps many in my camp from evangelizing effectively has been the belief that it's our responsibility to win souls, and this resulting in a performance mindset that ultimately proves self-defeating. There are many points of Calvinism that I still disagree, but the one point where I do agree is that we have no more power to save others than we have to save ourselves. It's God who saves, and so when it's no longer my responsibility to seal the deal and instead to just be faithful and give the gospel wherever He has me go, I'm no longer burdened with the anxiety that comes with the expectation to perform and what comes out instead is a greater desire to share my faith and challenge many of the lies much of the world is bound in. I think this is why the reformed church had been so effective in past revivals, because many of them had a greater recognition of God's sovereignty, and therefore were able to better communicate verses like Ephesians 2:8, that it's only by God's grace that we're saved.
Hi Brother, I feel you left out a crucial part of the passage.. “…through faith” “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:“ Ephesians 2:8 KJV The prerequisite in the bible is always believing.. and from belief comes faith. AND TO WHOM SWARE HE THAT THEY SHOULD NOT ENTER INTO HIS REST, BUT TO THEM THAT BELIEVED NOT? SO WE SEE THAT THEY COULD NOT ENTER IN BECAUSE OF UNBELIEF. HEBREWS 3:18-19 I definitely don’t know it all, and this comes from a place of love and not trying to stir up arguments . I came from the reformed Church and now It’s so frustrating to see people argue in circles and against straw-man arguments. The opposite of Calvinism is not Arminianism, Arminianism is another form of Calvinism. I believe it’s rather Calvinism / any other doctrine vs. what the bible teaches. If you’re interested in truth rather than blindly following a doctrine, check out channels such as beyond the fundamentals. A person can only judge two viewpoints once they fully understand other possible viewpoint, otherwise it remains just a defense of their doctrine and possible unintentional / intentional eisegesis. Just asking to test your doctrine, nothing to loose if searching for truth is the goal. Now the response to my post can be, what an ignorant person, that clearly doesn’t understand Calvinism… or maybe I do and this is a call for you to test your doctrine for truth against the bible.
How can the Father draw you if you're dead? Is Jeff saying prior to the drawing God enlightens you? You can't be led into Christ in a Calvanist system.
Is the effectual grace of God insufficient by itself to withstand criticism of the unreformed? If it is in need of human defense from other believers, then perhaps it is not what you think it is.
My understanding is that the prodigal son is the picture of someone who has already been saved, but has strayed and needs to return to the Father. (Only those who are saved are sons of God and the prodigal is a SON of his father.)
*Jeff (**18:50**) instead of attacking Dr Flowers, behind his back, Why don't you do the honorable thing and invite him on your show. We would All like to see you crush him with your superior intellect and knowledge of scriptures.. He, unlike you, has a standing invitation for you to come on his show*
Were people saved from their sins and reconciled to God before John Calvin? If so, how were they saved if they didn't know the precepts of Calvinism. Obviously, Calvinism isn't necessary to be reconciled to God by having your sins forgiven. "These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. In vain to they worship me, teaching as doctrine the commandments of men." Jesus (Matthew 15:8-9), quoting Isaiah.
I’m not in total disagreement to what is being said, it is biblical. My only struggle is that if we were all dead and God chose an elect to be saved, then my would God choose me over my brother? If we are saved only on because I was dead, well we are all dead so why doesn’t he save everyone? I’m no different to my brother or the rest of mankind why did he save me and not him, Why?
Exactly, calvanism turns God into a monster, the bible clearly tells that God doesn't want anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance, calvanists have to reinterpret certain words and phrases that don't fit their theology, like everyone doesn't actually mean everyone, I mean would you think that a lifeguard is a good person if he lets certain people drown? and then says I didn't owe that person anything so I just let him drown, but then decides to save certain people despite not owing them anything either? there's no one who would say that's a loving and gracious lifeguard.
@@benjy288that analogy falls apart though, a life guard’s duty is to rescue those who are drowning- who for a period of time could help themselves. But God does not owes us a thing. What right does the pot have to the potter to scrutinize how it’s made or for what purpose? And if you think the Calvinist view makes God a monster, may I submit to you that your view of God is lower than it ought to be. Calvinism does not puff up a man but brings one to his knees, for it is evident how sinful man is and how good God is.
Can a Calvinist assist me with this question? Can a person enter heaven if he does not go to a reformed church or believe reformed doctrine? Thank you in advance and please make your answer short and to the point.
Anybody who repents and trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, by His perfect sacrifice on the cross and that He died and rose from the dead on the 3rd day, is saved and will go to heaven. Ephesians 2:8-9- For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
(taste death for every man)--" But we see Jesus ,who was made alittle lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour, that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man." Hebrews 2:9 (every man)
Something I have never heard a Calvinist explain is why it can't be within the will of God to allow choice to his creatures. They frequently say "So you think God wants to save some people but can't? You think people can thwart his will?" But why would we assume it isn't God's will to allow choice? He certainly and undeniably allowed choice to Adam and Eve.
He allowed choice but not full autonomous choice. He set a standard of where they could choose. There was already a limit to men’s choice even in the beginning. They were not allowed to choose from one tree.
@@SquishyyyBeaner Except they DID choose to eat from that tree, because God, in his wisdom, valued their ability to choose. That does not denigrate his sovereignty.
@@joelpierce1453 you misunderstood what I said. I know they chose. However they did not have the right to choose that did they? There is a limit to your free will.
@@SquishyyyBeaner If they chose then that means there wasn't a limit to their free will, people don't have the right to speed in their cars, but they choose to do it anyway.
If you assume that God intended for Judas to be one of Jesus's disciples who would not believe and would betray him leading to Christ's crucifixion then how could God ensure that that would happen if he allowed everyone throughout time leading up to that event to make autonomous choices outside of God's decreetive will?Judas might not have even been born.
This argument might apply to semi-Pelagianism but not necessarily to classical Arminianism. We afirm total depravity. "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep." (John 10:26) This doesn't directly imply predetermined sheep; rather, these are individuals foreseen to freely continue in obedient faith. "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them" (John 6:44). God utilizes prevenient grace to draw everyone before faith. When individuals are finally face-to-face with God's grace, they must inwardly turn away from faith to reject His offer. Those who reject it are not His "true sheep" because they freely choose not to persist in obedient faith. More proof text that shows God draws all people: 1. John 12:32 (NKJV) - "And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself." 2. 1 Timothy 2:3-4 (NKJV) - "For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth." 3. 2 Peter 3:9 (NKJV) - "The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." 4. Titus 2:11 (NKJV) - "For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men." 5. Romans 11:32 (NKJV) - "For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all."
Thank you, that's a good question! There are several ways to understand this verse. I think the following is the most likely: John wanted to emphasise the worldwide application of Christ's work. Since "atonement" is a Jewish term and for the Jews it evokes the idea of the atonement on the Day of Atonement in the temple, John means something like: Jesus made atonement for our sins, and not just for us Jews (which would be obvious, since atonement is a Jewish concept), but for all the peoples of the world. In this sense, he is a "worldwide" Saviour. This interpretation also makes sense because Revelation 5:9 says that Christ has bought people "from every tribe and language and people and nation" through his blood. The following is also important with regard to the term "world": This term has about 10 different meanings in John. Only in the very fewest cases does it mean "all people who have ever lived". In the vast majority of cases it clearly means something else, e.g. in 1 John 2:15 (13 verses later, context is important). If "world" always had the same meaning, then we would demonstrably have many serious contradictions in the Bible. I recommend sermons by Steven Lawson on the subject of effective atonement. God bless you!
John is not speaking to Jews in this letter he is clearly speaking to believers. We cannot pick and choose what we think how the word is being used. The Word of God is very clear Jesus bled and died for all people and whosoever believes will have eternal life.
Can a Calvinist assist me with this question? Can a person enter heaven if he does not go to a reformed church or believe reformed doctrine? Thank you in advance and please make your answer short and to the point.
Yes. It’s not important to believe in secondary issues. It’s the core doctrine of the gospel that saves, so if there’s repentance & faith in Christs work on the cross, one can be saved; Calvinist or not
No one can come to me unless the father draws them. God draws people by the gospel. (Romans 1) how does God draw under the Calvinist view? My understanding would be under Calvinism God regenerates you, to hear and understand the gospel.
Arminianism does not leave room for cause and effect and Calvinism does not leave room for faith. It’s like the trinity, it doesn’t make sense but you just have to accept both. Theology doesn’t matter in the end anyway. We just need to love each other.
You guys seem to be doing a lot of defending of calvanism lately, and I struggle to understand why, it has nothing to do with salvation, and it's a horrible image of God to portray to atheists and agnostics, that God may not love them enough to save them.
“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! Seems to me like they had a choice and chose wrong so they suffered for that choice. How can you guys say god forced them to make that choice when it brings our lord to tears? Why would a potter weep for vessels he made for the garbage? None of this theology makes sense…. Its why theres only around 450 reformed baptist churches around the world, its just not convincing anyone. Did satan have free will to fall or did god make him? Did adam have free will to resist the fruit or did god make him sin? Peter warns us of not twisting Paul’s writings. Without Paul, this theology crumbles. Leighton flowers, scott hahn, jay dyer all left calvinism along with a great deal of other pastors, theologians, apologists, and scholars.
I used to say the same thing. Let scripture determine your philosophy and thoughts of God! If you disagree from scripture that is your prerogative and I respect you, but be a Berean and test it out.
God predetmined that whoever believed in Him would be saved and whoever rejected Him would perish. God does not predetmine who would believe. Yes, man is totally depraved and unable to save himself. But God endured the cross to redeem us. God offers the gift of salvation to all people. Timothy 2:3-6 - *all* John 3:16 - *whoever* Titus 2:11 - *all* 2 Peter 3:9 - *all* God draws us *all* to Him! John 12:32- And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw *all* peoples to Myself God offers the gift of salvation to those who believe in Him! John 6:47 - he who believes in Me has everlasting life. No one perishes because God rejected them or witheld some necessary grace needed to compel them to come to Jesus. They perish for refusing to believe in God and accept His gift of salvation. 2 Thessalonians 2:10 - they perish because they refuse to love the truth and so be saved. God gives us free will to accept or reject His gift of salvation. Yes, man is totally depraved and unable to save himself, but man is able to respond to the gospel/Holy Spirit and put their faith in Jesus Christ. Read Ephesians 2, faith is not a work.
John 6:29 it is the work of God that you believe in him whom he has sent. You clearly don't believe this. It's incredibly adolescent to form your theology on the basis of a single word "all", devoid of any context. For instance 2 Peter 3:9 God is patient towards YOU, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. Any of who? All of who? Well if you follow the pronouns it's abundantly clear it's any of you and all of you. 2 Peter 2:9 God knows how to keep the unrighteous under punishment til the day of judgement. Again this is something you clearly don't believe God does.
Obviously, God does not draw all individual people to Himself. Even common-sense combats this thought process. Not every single person has had a chance to hear the gospel before death. Even the world-wide flood of Noah disproves this point. Noah obviously didn't go around the earth and warn everyone of the coming judgement. 2. Jesus didn't die for the possibility to be saved, but to actually save a people for himself. If Jesus died only for the possibility to be saved, then much of His blood was shed in vain. This also means Jesus would be a liar when he said in John 6 that 'all the father has promised to give to me will come to me..." The 'all' Jesus references here is all that will believe, who are the ones the Father promised to give. God doesn't fail to change hearts/save, nor does God place faith in people to do the right thing. Apart from Gods grace, nobody desires Holiness and purity, and all people can desire is evil. Even the rejecting sinner does good, can get married, can raise kids, etc because of Gods grace. Without the grace of God acting upon wicked humans, every single person would be worse than Hitler in an incomparable sense, and in Hell, people are worse than HItler but are unable to act upon their godless desires. 3. Jesus is the perfect evangelist in that He loses none the Father has promised to give him. Jesus goes after the lost sheep, He never says he will go after the goats. He says he leaves the 99 to find the lost sheep. Most people are not lost, they are just rebellious sinners that hate the mercy, grace, righteousness, justice, holiness, etc of God. They will for eternity hate these attributes of God because they are dead in trespasses and sin and that's all they desire. The sheep are the ones that are lost who are heavy-laden and weary over their sin, and God will regenerate their hearts and get them. Lastly, God desiring 'all' to be saved is the same 'all' that Jesus mentioned in saying, "all the father has promised to give me will come to me....." Of course ,many other examples could be included.
@@ReformedRabbit That's incorrect. God draws us all. Read John 12:32. John 12:32 - And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself.” God reveals Himself to all men. Romans 1:19-20 - For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse The calvanist view makes God responsible for unbelief and wickedness. That contradicts the Bible. We are responsible for our own unbelief and evil actions.
@@danielomitted1867 In 2 Peter 3:9 it says God wants *all* to come to repentance! He is speaking to an individual. He is speaking to a crowd about God's love for mankind. What does John 3:16 say? It says God to loved the world (mankind). It says *whoever* Titus 2:11 says that God brings salvation to *all* men. Timothy 2:3-6 - Jesus gave Himself a ransom for *all* John 12:32- And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw *all* peoples to Myself *All* is an important word. That's why I emphasize it. The Bible doesn't say that God offers salvation to a select few. The Bible does not say that God holds people accountable for things that are out of their control. The Bible does not say that God makes people do evil.
@@daltonnelson94 all meaning all of what? All individuals or all types of men? Well in the context of John 12 there were some Greeks who wanted to follow Jesus but were turned away because he had not yet been raised up. So it's not all as in all individuals, it's all as in all types like Jews and Greeks. You miss details like that when you hyper-fixate on a singular word. Edit: I already laid out the context of 2 Peter 3:9 but still you only seem to be able to fixate on the single word "all" without any consideration of what the all is about. So since in your mind God wants everyone to come to repentance, why is he keeping the unrighteous under punishment til the day of judgement 2 Peter 2:9
*Jeff (**19:07**) for your information. God uses his spirit to draw everyone to the father, if they come to him, they will be given to Jesus* You should get out of your Calvinistic echo chamber and believe what the Bible says of Jesus.... "He became Sin" Cor 5:21, He is the Serpent on the Pole and if anyone looks to him in faith will be saved
@@BibleStudywithVernon That is the very point I'm making. Everyone who looked to serpent was healed. He was NOT compelled to look, and it was conditional. He HAD TO look otherwise he would die.. Jesus, himself, pointed to this.
@@biagiomaffettone1497 This is only a shadow that points to Christ. Jesus said, no one can come, unless the Father draws. He also said, those who came He won’t cast out. I believe those words. I don’t think the story of the bronze serpent is sufficient to disprove the Calvinist position. Remember, the people were being punished but only a few were saved.
@@BibleStudywithVernon My friend, The Father draws people by the Holy Spirit, and he does this from the time everyone is born, either through the conscience or through the natural world. The more that person responds to God the more light they are given. But if they, in the end resist, the call of the Spirit, then the Father will not give them to the Son. So everyone has the opportunity to come to the Father, but not all do. This is like the Israelis in the wilderness, They all had the opportunity to look to the serpent on the pole, but not all did. This is a beautiful picture of the Gospel, my friend.. They were not compelled, there were no limitation placed on them and their salvation was conditional... They HAD TO look to Serpent on the Pole in Faith. *This is the Gospel*
@@biagiomaffettone1497 Oh my, someone needs to read John 6 again. Jesus said, “ all that the Fathers draws WILL Come to me.” There’s no opportunity for God to fail. However, I do agree the gospel message is for All, but effective for those who believe.
Jeff, I'm glad you go to the hard places and preach the gospel, so do I. But if you didn't, according to you, God would have chosen another method to reach those same people. You have a Calvanist position on a few verses but a non Calvanistic approach to evangelism. That's why you commented on my comment in the live feed. I called you out on an obvious inconsistency concerning God's sovereignty that you can't explain and your bugged by that. You know it and I know you know it.Btw, I'm glad you are non Calvanistic in your approach to evangelism. And I will read the book you suggested.
@@sethevans1506 Seth, perhaps its the other way around. I grew up with a Dutch Christian Reformed education back in the 60's. I was a Baptist in a Christian Reformed environment. I was one of the few in that environment that actually believed in Calvanism. Yeah you read it right. My Calvanistic school mates rejected their own belief system, in large numbers. Why? There is something intuitively evil in a belief system who's God programs people to believe or disbelieve for its own benefit then rewards and punishes them accordingly. Even a child can see it. You might think, THAT'S NOT WHAT CALVANISM BELIEVES! You need to hear it in a new perspective! But I can tell you, any such perspectives are only word games, trying to avoid the obvious. I believed in Calvanism because my father was becoming a Reformed baptist minister and I, despite my apprehensions, trusted dad. I know the positive and negative results of that movement. In my own life, initially, I experienced the negative. It was destroying my faith in God Himself. It naturally will, for those who genuinely embrace it. Jeff does not genuinely embrace it, very few Calvanists do. But that's why I'm a Jeff Durban fan and a John Macarthur fan and a RC. fan and a Steve Lawson, and John Piper fan...I could go on and on. They, in a practical sense don't believe the Calvanism they espouse. I don't know how many times throughout a Macarthur sermon I've said to myself, "Yon can't say that John!" Not as a dyed in the wool Calvanist. ( I've even been to one of his conferences. A book he wrote back in 1978 on an unrelated matter changed the direction of my whole life.) "Calvanists" have a high regard for scripture. And that is a positive and why I follow many of them. But if you'll notice in Jeff's comments on my remark in the live feed (go to the 41:30 mark and following) his attack against me is ad hominen. Then he switches to a non-calvanistic approach and continues to bash me from a NON Calvanistic way of advancing the truth of God's kingdom. Things that I could all say amen to. Yet he fails to realize in his own belief system God would choose other means to get His predestined work done if Jeff didn't do it. But Jeff does Hiscwork because like this Jeff (me) you have a desire to do it. The message of Christ is locked up in your bones and you've got to get it out! Things will be well for Jeff Durban and his ministry (and I applaud that ministry) provided one thing: He never truly believes the Calvanism he preaches.
@@jeffengstrom8657 This was a long anecdote. I read the entire comment. You haven’t dealt with Calvinism vs Arminianism. To evangelize or evangelism in the manner that Durbin espouses is not inherently “non-Calvinistic”. Do you believe that the evangelism he engages in (which is why you originally commented) could be the good works God prepared for him to do in advance (Ephesians 2:10)? If this is even a possibility, then your argument fails.
@@sethevans1506 Thank you for reading my long response. And for the record I'm not an Armenian, whatever that is. I can prove eternal security along with the best of them (and have more stories to prove it). I take a similar position to that of Leighton Flowers on these issues. A position I believed in before Leighton was even in kindergarten. Concerning your question, it would be helpful if you answered a question for me first in determining the angle I would persue in my answer to you. The question to you is this: Do you believe my response to Jeff in the live feed and my responses to you are part of the pre-ordained good works, from the beginning, that God pre-ordained for me to walk in?
