In this video I share 7 reasons why I believe the 2023 Dodge Challenger Demon 170 values will continue to fall. Follow me on instagram, tiktok, and facebook at OCMotivator
I am not in the business of flipping cars, nor do I have the money to be dropping 100k+ for them even on the bank's dime, but almost all your videos seem to be common sense to me. Thank you Brad.
A lot of the old muscle cars that are really stupid expensive today is because they are very low production cars. Hemi Cuda Convertibles (21 cars built between 70 and 71), 1967 L88 Corvettes (20 built), 1969 COPO Camaro 427 (69 built), 1970 Plymouth Superbird Hemi (135 made), 1969 Dodge Daytona Hemi (70 made), 1969-1970 Boss 429 Mustang (about 1350 built during both years) etc... And back then no one thought these were going to be collector cars so the attrition rate is very high, few of them survive today, back then they were considered used gas guzzling cars that no one wanted. Not until the mid/late 80's and well into the 90's did they start appreciating in value. The Demons were made in comparatively HUGE numbers 3,300 in both 2018 and 2023 and right from the get go they were instant collectible cars. These were never rare cars and the survival rate will be huge compared to the muscle cars of the classic era. Tons of these cars are in bubbles stored in garages with less than 100 miles on them. 25 years in the future these Demons will not be rare cars and you will see a bunch of them at all the auctions in pristine or near pristine condition.
Very well said 👍. The one thing nobody talks abt is the cost of storage. Ins and annual costs could theoretically run around 2-3K per year so holding on to a 100k car for 30 years could cost upwards to a 100k just to own during that time. morons!
@@JM1540X , another point is, these new "classics" will not be winter driven and/or in accidents to speak of. The theft rate is about all that will take a few out.
They will be repoed or sold long before that. Back in old days ppl didn’t spend 100,000 over sticker as car market crashes and won’t return anything like what we just witnessed with used cars selling for more than they were brand new. But you’re right-ppl saying there’s only 3300 don’t realize that’s a lot. If it was 300 then that’s low but many car companies only sell 3000 of models they have but would’ve made 20,000 if ppl wanted them.
@@meatball6930 , yeah I never realized how complicated the argument gets on old vs new cars! You have a good point about cost - the old luxury and or muscle cars were expensive in the day but you didn't pay "mark-ups". In fact some of the rarest cars like Superbirds were actually slow to sell and discounted!
If I were to buy a car for racing, I would get a stock Challenger R/T and have an engine builder build it to race spec. Then take it to the track and run the hell out of it. If you blow the engine, dump in another. 🤷🏻 The worst thing to collect for investment, is something made to collect.
People getting burned by paying hundreds of thousands of dollars for a Dodge? What? How? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤡🤡🤡🤡. I love your honesty…you’ve been saying it since the beginning…do not pay over sticker but fools did.
1. Its a Dodge. 2. Its a Chrysler 3. Its a sports car. 4. Its American. 5. Paying over MSRP is always dumb 6. Mustangs are better. 7. FJB Did I get them right?
In 03 & 04 owners were doing the same thing with their Mercury Marauders, Everyone thought I was nuts doing 16 - 6,000 + mile road trips with mine going to the US & touring & club meets from Canada, & have met many great friends & saw a lot of the US if not for that car.😀👍
I love your Channel Brad. You are very informative and a asset to the Muscle Car Brotherhood. I would like to see content on your Demon and see if you are having the same problems Racer X has been having. Thanks for the information and being on top of all the things we should look out for when buying a Challenger.
TK stated in his latest video that he believes the price of the 2018 Demons will go up because they do not have the same problems as the 170. All this is interesting info. Thank you Brad for another great video.
Don’t take financial advice from TK. He’s old and broke. Ur better off listening to Brad as hes showing his life as he learns how to make money & be smart with money-he puts it out there for you to see even when he goofs up. TK is just watching everyone else and copying them and is making nothing. There’s nothing to take from TK and make something from it and you can see he obviously hasn’t. He’s a parrot of others material who’s obviously bad with money.
You got me on a rant. Here’s my other issue with manufactures. Since you talking about car problems…remember when the manufacture would run and engine on the assembly like for ten years with making tweaks every year making it better? Look at Chevy now. They have made a completely different engine every model of the corvette c8. And we wonder why so many cars have failures. They don’t even work out the bugs in the engines they spend millions of dollars to design and produce. Every manufacture is doing this. How many new broncos had issues. I bought a brand new f250 and the lifters started leaving metal shavings in the oil with their new 7.3. I also wish someone would build work trucks without the 2000 chips and just gone AC and radio with crank window to be sold for 30K again. I also hate that all new tricks went to turbo V6 engines. I can tell you from experience how many engines I’ve blown pulling weight in a turbo gas engine. They are all crap. I’m done bit(hing.
If nothing else it makes it important not to buy a vehicle in the 1st year or 2 of production of a new engine. Another example is the recent Mustang GT350s with the flat plane crank engines.
I feel the demon 2018 was a better deal. OCM is on point. These latest call models, the redeye wide body, are by far the best. People got caught up in the 1025 hp, and now the quality control issues is unsatisfactory. Glad I didn't drink the coolaid hype. OCM outstanding video and information. Dodge is done.
I know people with like a 2006 Corvette /w only 8k miles on it. I never believed in buying a car to as an investment. My '13 Z06 has almost 125,000 miles. I keep telling people who have such low milage, and they hate me for mentioning it, to just sell it! They're obviously NOT enjoying it! I would NEVER pay over MSRP for anything. And I think people who buy a car like this just to bubble wrap it are a good reason why a lot of these people will probably always be poor.
Watching my friend who got a hellcat and bragged to me it was better than my V6 mustang now getting his hellcat repo'd without a backup car meanwhile my lil mustang still gives me good take home pay
I think the original demon is going to be the more valuable one. When it comes to specialty cars that first one for the most part always is the one you want to have.
Great point about the prices not coming back especially for people who've got them for an investment while the warranty is being chewed up. Like you said, if you don't know if you got a lemon or not, that will GREATLY suppress the values. Like Wide body nation said, offer them sticker and it's a 50/50 chance you'll get it.
I cannot believe I'm saying this.. I would rather have a Tesla Plaid then 170... Reliable. Drives itself, kinda.. Half the price. Faster, and more importantly, easily driveable anywhere anytime with consistency... Unreal.... Great job Dodge...
A 2018 Demon which is about 6 years old is still over 6 figures... But that is a different animal. The 2018 demon was tested with over 5000 passes on a strip for durability. It also came with a cool vin matched crate. It also was the first to break many barriers. Some actually sold their 2018 Demons to buy the 170 which I think was nuts! The 2018 will hold their value. Will it be millions of dollars years from now? In my opinion..no.
How can any dodge be worth anything in the future when they come out with a new model every 90 days. They have more limited editions than topps baseball cards. Back in the days. SVT, saleen, Shelby etc. come out with one edition each years model making them sought after. The car industry just became anothe pump and dump industry.
Anyone who's been around for a while could see the artificial bubble being blown up....and bubbles always pop. I don't blame dealers for trying to get the money the flippers were getting as it's only right that they should make the profit and not some guy who walks in, pays MSRP then turns right around and sells it for $30K more than they paid. And all the 'engine problems' don't surprise me at all....I can't believe they made the car and sold them with a warranty in the first place. You cannot build a machine that cannot be broken...and most of the 'problem' video's I've seen were taken to the track and beat on unmercifully. Yes they were advertised as a 'drag car'...but it's a 'street car' that can occasionally be taken to the strip. Just like the Shelby GT350's that were 'track ready'...and after multiple track days would break because the owners weren't treating them like a race car....no fluid changes after track days like you should means they're going to blow up. Treat your car with some common sense and most will live a happy life...beat it without mercy and anything will break.
The problem though is that they are breaking far too easy. If you advertise something for what it's supposed to be then it should be able to do it. No where did they state is a once in a while drag car. You cant even drive it on the street so what is the purpose. It cant be used as a daily driver and it can only drag once in a blue moon? Its a brick.
I purchased a new 2023 Challenger ScatPack last month and worked on a deal where the dealer took over $10K from MSRP, removed the ridiculous $3K addendum sticker and negotiated down the doc/dealer prep fees to under $200. I did have to drive 4 hours to the dealership, deals are out there if you’re willing to do the legwork. Anyone paying over MSRP for any model 2023 Challenger/Charger needs to have their brain examined.
I don't get how you can do so many Demon 170 videos without sharing what you did with yours? We want the scoop! I know you purchased at MSRP... did you flip it?
Modern cars will not be able to be kept roadworthy for more than 20-30 years because all the tech on them will not be supported or servicable. Cars over 30 years old are much simpler and as long as gas is still available, they can probably still be maintained and driven for decades to come.
I love your videos I agree with you I question the dodge super stock 807 hp that were made from 2020-2023 do you think they will go up in value please let me know
No. It’s a dodge. Unless you keep it under 100 miles and lock it away for 20-30 years you may get your money back. Even my old 20 year old hand built V10 Lamborghini didn’t go up in value. We have to remember that these cars were built as cheaply as possible and if you want something to invest in then buy real estate or blue chips.
Great video and yes you’ll need to probably do another 3 videos over next 6-9 months on the Demon 170. The car market is crashing on everything. We have gotten so spoiled with the insanity of the car market-i traded in my 2016 Tundra with 48,000 miles -2016s didn’t come with Apple car play BTW. But they gave me $6000 more than i paid for it when i traded it on a 2022 TRX. Think about that-6yrs old ,48,000 miles,no car play or navigation,6000 more than i paid brand new. Guys we got spoiled with the fake supply chain crap and car shortage. It has never happened in the car world like the housing market did. All this stuff is actually rigged by the government for investors like BlackRock. The 2008 housing crash and this car thing was all designed for that. It will never happen in car world again-it’s over. It is going to plummet fast & especially if gas cars are given the green light to build like crazy. But then you watch the govt come in and make laws on horsepower. There is no way these 170s stay around 130,000-with the crash coming they will be repoed or will be dumped for 100,000 or a lot less. A new administration opening up the fake supply chain issue will make new cars drop in price as ppl get their cars repoed. Just look how Dodge just priced that new Rhino Truck with 600hp at $59,000. That’s a sign they know what’s coming -you gotta look around. Look what Ford did with new mustang you could buy for $50,000 & they showed video that you could buy a whipped for it for 10,000 then pay $2000 for install and you have 850-900hp mustang for $62,000 that beats a lot of cars. This is what’s going to happen, they can set these cars up to be modified easily at a cheap price and tell you thru RU-vidrs how to make it a monster because they know that’s the market is ppl wanting to add to their cars and why the new corvettes and EVs are so boring even tho they’re fast-ppl like to do stuff to it. Dodge should be build the 5.7 and 6.4s stronger so superchargers could be added easily. But get ready people it’s going to crash hard and here’s a problem with 170s-if someone only has 100 miles on it you don’t know if it’s a bad motor yet. So ppl will sit on them not knowing if it’s a POS and then you the buyer is screw’s if warranty is gone. This 170 thing is going to be a mess and then watch the government will ban them from selling the engines and then ppl are screwd. I’ve been waiting on the C7 ZR1 s to come down as they sit at 180,000. Those will plummet too. The car market is going to go thru a major change and a car that sells used for 100,000 isn’t going to be a dodge or corvette or mustang. We got spoiled and it hasn’t hit ppl yet because they think it’s like the housing market-not a chance. Demon 170s will only be worth 100,000 again maybe in 30 yrs when a new 25yr old has money when he’s 55yrs old and going thru mid life crisis and always wanted one-so investors will have to sit on it for 30yrs to not even get money back. I almost got one and so glad i didn’t and same with first Demon and there are a million redeye out there with a couple cheap mids killing these cars with the right drivers. Hang on tight ppl this crash is coming for all cars and the point of crash is to reset the market and get cars way below 100,000 dollars. Once the smart ones who cut their loses because they know trends start dumping these investment cars fast and cheap the whole thing will collapse overnight. Guys who paid cash and have 20 investment cars sitting will dump them because it costs money every month to store these things. So hang in it’s coming and fast -if you want money for your car better do it tomorrow-no joke. It will be overnight cars drop 30,000 50,000 80,000. Corvette is in for surprise with new ZR1 prices. I believe it’s why they are rushing to get it out very fast but banks already aren’t financing that much money-you’ll need 100,000 deposit at least,banks won’t loan more than 100,000 then that will be 75,000 in a yr-huge down payments will be back on cars and homes.
I still don’t understand why people paid thousands of dollars over sticker. A car is a terrible investment. 50k over msrp could have been a nice down payment on a house
Thats why I chose to go with and ordered a 6 speed manual Widebody when the 6 Speed manuals became available last June--ordered a stripper with cloth, rear seat delete, no sunroof and love it for the $77K I Paid, A LOT more Demons out there than a 6 speed widebody Hellcat--I don't have a Demon--just something more rare with only 314 Widebody 6 Speed cars being built--safer investment and more fun to drive rowing thru the Gears!
I just watched a Demon 170 beat my dream car (S550 GT500) in a drag race and the Mustang had a head start! That Demon 170 is for real. What happened to your necktie 👔?
In 1971 when Chrysler made the 426 HEMI for the last time I don’t think any of this horse s**t went on. It really wasn’t till about 1980 that values started going up, you had the 1973 oil embargo and a second on in 1979. In the late 70’s some 426 cars changed hands for under 1k dollars. After 1980 the values started coming up. With all the drama over last call, mark-ups, some quality issues no wonder they are discontinuing the Challenger. I would LOVE a blue Dodge Challenger Scat Pack narrow body, but I think imo all this is tarnishing this a bit. Everyone have a safe 2024 car 🚙 season 🙋🏻♂️
I keep hearing dealers saying this car is an investment. I agree with you, that's a real crap shoot. I'm glad you pointed out the history behind this, it makes a lot of sense.
One of the moderators in the Demon 170 FB group im in just posted they will be deleting people who speak negatively about the 170. The cars aren't the only thing living in a bubble, the owners want to live in a bubble and avoid the reality that these cars are depreciating.
Peugeot/Fiat apparently put their usual lousy build-quality into the Demon 170s. There's a reason that neither company ever had any lasting success in the US. I'll keep my 2015 Challenger SRT 392 for as long as possible. I don't know what my next car will be ..... but it won't be a Peugeot/Fiat/Dodge.
You said it all Brad! Drive your 170 & enjoy! Otherwise you F-ed up buying an overpriced drag racing car that ONLY 1% will ever drag race. The flipping game was over a year ago now, anyone still trying is wasting their time and money!
If I bought a 90 Grand Wagoneer in 90 for 30k sticker & kept it in a bubble like someone did who years ago sold it to Wagonmaster for 100k+. Wagonmaster then sold it for a decent profit because it had only 300 miles on it. Now 30k in 90 is like 100k+ today 34 years later. So what will 200k be like in 34 years from now. Rolls Royces sold for 20k in early 70s now are 500k. I am not waiting 20 30 years for a kinda rare car to appreciate because #1 what a waste & #2 I could die tommorrow. Live for today & enjoy your ride.💯🎉
I am now selling my 8 unit apartment building that I bought 20 years ago. THAT will fund my retirement, not a Challenger…no matter how badass it was meant to be.
I agree with you on everything but the drive abilities of the Demon-170. The car comes from the factory with all the amenities to be driven everyday, it's not Copo Camaro (one trick pony). RU-vidr "Speedy's Garage" is setting his up with street tires to be driven daily. Change the tires and drive it everyday like any other muscle car.
when I get a job, I am going to save up for a good down payment for either the 2018 demon or the demon 170 whatever is price is cheaper and when I get either of those models it is not going to be a bubble car
Also, 9's are not considered that fast anymore. Buying and building is a much better go fast option, than trusting a financially depleted factory warranty.
Things that were made and bought to be used havexthe potential to be collectibles. With the exception of, perhaps, Star Wars stuff... Anything that is made with the label "collectible" on it, isn't. And for just this reason. Thanks for explaining it. My '22 Scat Pack, Shaker will be more collectible because not *that* many were made and they weren't marketed as collectibles, just cool cars. But I didn't buy it to be sold in a few years as a collectible/flipper, I bought it as a treat for myself and to end up going to my kid. So, the rest of it doesn't matter, it's when I'm out on the street with it and it's so different from the other Challengers running around and it get looks and comments everytime, even from owners of brand new, Mustang formula 1s who "ooh and aah" at the thing. That's my reward. 😊
I’m almost 46, the amount of time it would take for a modern car to turn into a classic, makes no sense for me. If I’m lucky to live another 30+ yrs, what am I going to do with that little extra money at that age? Like you said OC, enjoy your cars, you’ll be mad when you didn’t. One life to live, so live it. 🤷♂️
Where are all those ppl that claimed to buy ScatPacks and Hellcats as investments? If the 170 was bad than those cars are REALLY bad. Plenty of ppl argued with me about it when the writing was on the wall.
It will take 30 years for break even if it is pristine. The way the motors are blowing up there will be few left. I have never paid sticker for any car much less over sticker. For $200,000. I am buying a 70-71 hemi cuda or 68-70 hemi roadrunner that are restored like new.
If you got this car thinking value would go up after 1 year then you don’t understand muscle cars. You wanna make money? Put it in the garage and triple your money in 20 years
The value on the 170 was WRECKED once peeps found out about the 150mph top speed. Not because of the top speed, but because Dodge sold it as a 215 mph car. Until they didn't. Everything since then has been nothing but bad for those cars. It's actually pretty sad.
The biggest issue i have with this is this, you buy a racecar and expect it to be perfect? This car is a rolling compromise, power over efficiency, limited speed because of a special driveshaft, and raw power over durability. The best engine builder in the US in my opinion (Steve Morris) has been trying to build the perfect engines for years and hasn't figured it out yet. he's gotten close, but he's an indy with sometimes unlimited budgets. If you're going to buy an under 400 cube engine with over 1k HP and drive it like it was intended, why are you expecting it to not fall apart? I knew when these came out, they were going to be trouble for Dodge. There is a reason why nobody builds 1k hp cars everyday
